It's a game, not a simulator. It's supposed to have some "fun" elements too.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
1: Where have you been hiding for the past 2 months...? This is old news.
2: Read the dev blogs... It actually makes sense if you do.
So the copyright holders can't agree to allowing players more freedom with ships, as an example... but when "all I want is dinosaurs with frickin laser beams on their heads!? then it becomes, "a game. Let's have some fun!"
I just don't understand.
On one hand there seems to be strict logic behind making design choices in the game, by the copyright holders, on the other hand there are dinosaurs with lasers on their heads.
On one hand, this is a copyrighted franchise that must maintain canon rigidity, on the other hand, it seems, "Let's have some fun!"
I hope you can understand my argument and how I am confused regarding the logic of the copyright holders.
And please, I laid out some very specific criticisms. I would very much like some reasoning based on those criticisms that I laid out in the OP.
Why would the Voth engineer creatures that are EXACTLY the species that link them to Earth?
So the copyright holders can't agree to allowing players more freedom with ships, as an example... but when "all I want is dinosaurs with frickin laser beams on their heads!? then it becomes, "a game. Let's have some fun!"
I just don't understand.
Trek foes have always been odd. They range from 2 entirely different cosmic entities: Q and Trelane to super-heated spiders whose ships shoot energy webs, to evolved dinosaurs roaming the Delta Quadrant in vast ships.
CBS doesn't care all that much about the foes because they're foes: you use them for an episode or two and then move on to the next absurd foe. That's entirely different then caring about their golden IP points: ships, playable species, etc.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
I accept that argument. I am still wondering if someone has a better answer considering what is known about the Voth from Star Trek: Voyager.
As has been pointed out a couple of times now, did you read the Blogs? They give you an understanding as to why the Voth use dinosaurs.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Actually he does respond to it... You just don't want to see it.
Yeh, you must be right, I'm asking for explanations that I don't want to see. /sarcasm
Please, offer something, or don't bother replying. Or, keep doing what you're doing and amuse only yourself.
If the Voth are as rigid in their philosophy of superiority as they were in Star Trek: Voyager, then the easiest way for the Federation to stop their incursion in to the Dyson Sphere would be to show the Voth society the links between mecha-T-Rex and an extinct T-Rex. The genetic markers would also be a stark indication of the origins of the Voth. This would cause a civil war in their society and stop their incursion.
How could this have been a well thought out design decision? I don't think that it was.
Does it make the Voth fun to fight? Sure. Does it make sense for canon? Not in my opinion. Does it make the Voth unqiue? Yup.
I have read the blogs and the only understanding that I come out with is that they use dinosaurs because they use dinosaurs.
They have mechs, but they use dinosaurs too.
There is no information related to my criticisms, unfortunately, aside from, ?all I want is dinosaurs with frickin? laser beams on their heads!?
Well, all I can say is good luck with your rant! It won't get you anything as the content is already done and in testing on Tribble - I fought some dinosaurs myself - but if it makes you feel better to rage against the machine, so be it.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
I accept that argument. I am still wondering if someone has a better answer considering what is known about the Voth from Star Trek: Voyager.
this is the thing we dont know much about them only what we saw of them on one i repeat one EP sorry but you not going to know every thing about a race from one EP only what that EP calls for other than that got to use that thing that gave us star trek
for all we know there are 100's of city ships all over the universe doing gods knows what
this is the thing we dont know much about them only what we saw of them on one i repeat one EP sorry but you not going to know every thing about a race from one EP only what that EP calls for other than that got to use that thing that gave us star trek
for all we know there are 100's of city ships all over the universe doing gods knows what
AFAIK the City Ship housed the entirety of the Voth civilization.
With my criticisms I am drawing from that one episode, the sole appearance of the Voth in the history of all Star Trek iterations.
In that appearance, the Voth held strictly to their doctrine and any deviation from it was disavowed in order to prevent a societal collapse. The information that was disavowed and nearly caused that collapse was the revelation that the Voth originated from Earth in the Alpha quadrant. The link was derived from genetic research of the Voth DNA.
Now, the Voth have taken their DNA and manipulated it to create less evolved creatures that are identical, and would without a doubt reveal their origin on Earth in the Alpha quadrant... does not compute.
The reason you want an explanation is you just found out about the dino's, we that have read the blogs and, come to terms that this is it an we can't change it, just except it now. Come back to the forums in a couple of months, you should of excepted it by then.
The first thing that comes to my mind is evolution. The Voth have evolved to become humanoid, why would they weaponize their less evolved cousins?
Humans would NEVER use trained dolphins or dogs or anything in warfare!
Secondly, why would arming a T-Rex with a laser be any more effective than say, just using a laser? The T-Rex is not even capable of the intelligence required to use said laser with any sort of tactic. Hell, it can't even see!
Yeah, if humans took thousands of years to apply even basic technologies to our society, we wouldn't still be using horses and such!
Why the hell, then, would the Voth necro up some ACTUAL species that existed on Earth? Their skeletal structures would be clearly recognizable and provide inalienable proof that the Voth shared ancestry with species from Earth, not the Delta quadrant.
They aren't, though I can see how such a thing would strain your pitiful mammalian brain. They're actual species that evolved on the Voth homeworld that just happen to resemble some creature's from Earth's geological past, just like how all you mammals happen to look exactly alike. You're free to disagree, of course, except if you go against the Doctrine you /will/ be severely punished.
There's some videos on YouTube where you can see the capture battleground for those who can't get into Tribble.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
AFAIK the City Ship housed the entirety of the Voth civilization.
This was never even remotely suggested in the episode. How the Voth would enforce what they described as an extensive territorial claim with tiers of rights for native and non-native aliens with their entire civilization existing in such a small ship is difficult to imagine.
So of all the things that the copyright holders say, "Ok," to, they approve dinosaurs with head lasers?
Here's my logic on why this is an absurd design decision:
The first thing that comes to my mind is evolution. The Voth have evolved to become humanoid, why would they weaponize their less evolved cousins? The equivalent would be for the Federation to make cyborg chimps and gorillas for their soldiers. This is obviously absurd and unnecessary given the state of human evolution in Star Trek. I feel the same for the Voth.
Secondly, why would arming a T-Rex with a laser be any more effective than say, just using a laser? The T-Rex is not even capable of the intelligence required to use said laser with any sort of tactic. Hell, it can't even see!
Lastly, I feel like this is an extremely uncreative and poorly thought out addition to the Voth because the Voth hold strictly to their belief in superiority through Evolution. They believe that they are the first species to become highly evolved in the Delta quadrant. When the crew of Voyager deciphered that the Voth shared ancestry with species from Earth, it nearly caused a civil war in the Voth society. In order to prevent a collapse of order, the information discovered by the Voyager crew was hidden and disavowed.
Why the hell, then, would the Voth necro up some ACTUAL species that existed on Earth? Their skeletal structures would be clearly recognizable and provide inalienable proof that the Voth shared ancestry with species from Earth, not the Delta quadrant.
Am I missing something here or is this just a really lousy design choice, given my opinion?
You bring up interesting points. Unfortunately if you're looking for a logical explanation about this, you will probably find none. It was another simple, illogical, for-fun design decision by Cryptic. Love it or hate it.
Perhaps Season 8 will shed some light about the Voth and give an explanation as to why. But I doubt it will give a good one. :rolleyes:
The reason you want an explanation is you just found out about the dino's, we that have read the blogs and, come to terms that this is it an we can't change it, just except it now. Come back to the forums in a couple of months, you should of excepted it by then.
The reason that I'm curious about other people's opinions is due to the apparent contradiction between what the Voth held as their Doctrine in Star Trek: Voyager, and the apparent lack of regard for it in engineering species that would link them directly to the Alpha quadrant.
So of all the things that the copyright holders say, "Ok," to, they approve dinosaurs with head lasers?
Here's my logic on why this is an absurd design decision:
The first thing that comes to my mind is evolution. The Voth have evolved to become humanoid, why would they weaponize their less evolved cousins? The equivalent would be for the Federation to make cyborg chimps and gorillas for their soldiers. This is obviously absurd and unnecessary given the state of human evolution in Star Trek. I feel the same for the Voth.
Secondly, why would arming a T-Rex with a laser be any more effective than say, just using a laser? The T-Rex is not even capable of the intelligence required to use said laser with any sort of tactic. Hell, it can't even see!
Lastly, I feel like this is an extremely uncreative and poorly thought out addition to the Voth because the Voth hold strictly to their belief in superiority through Evolution. They believe that they are the first species to become highly evolved in the Delta quadrant. When the crew of Voyager deciphered that the Voth shared ancestry with species from Earth, it nearly caused a civil war in the Voth society. In order to prevent a collapse of order, the information discovered by the Voyager crew was hidden and disavowed.
Why the hell, then, would the Voth necro up some ACTUAL species that existed on Earth? Their skeletal structures would be clearly recognizable and provide inalienable proof that the Voth shared ancestry with species from Earth, not the Delta quadrant.
Am I missing something here or is this just a really lousy design choice, given my opinion?
Perhaps you fail to understand why evolution is used so much in Science Fiction.
I am bringing up a specific criticism and wondering what the community thinks about it based on what is revealed about the Voth in Star Trek: Voyager.
Much like the Preservers in TOS and the Ancient Humanoids in TNG, Cryptic just tries to make something moderately fun out of a mish-mash of canon and ideas from dozens of writers stretching over 40 years. Sometimes you love it, sometimes you hate it - but no one is going to universally love everything so you just try to shoot for fun.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Much like the Preservers in TOS and the Ancient Humanoids in TNG, Cryptic just tries to make something moderately fun out of a mish-mash of canon and ideas from dozens of writers stretching over 40 years. Sometimes you love it, sometimes you hate it - but no one is going to universally love everything so you just try to shoot for fun.
this always been my thing about trek you cant take the good with out the bad in every series ppl who only try and take nothing but the good well we end up with dinos in space thread!!!!!
Much like the Preservers in TOS and the Ancient Humanoids in TNG, Cryptic just tries to make something moderately fun out of a mish-mash of canon and ideas from dozens of writers stretching over 40 years. Sometimes you love it, sometimes you hate it - but no one is going to universally love everything so you just try to shoot for fun.
To be clear, I neither love nor hate this idea as I haven't gone and tested the gameplay of it. I am simply pointing out a lack of parity between the Voth doctrine and so clearly creating a link between themselves and their ancestry in the Alpha quadrant while then using that creation, which is a link, on the very species of the Alpha quadrant that made the connection in the first place.
Comments
ps in before it gets assimilated
system Lord Baal is dead
So the copyright holders can't agree to allowing players more freedom with ships, as an example... but when "all I want is dinosaurs with frickin laser beams on their heads!? then it becomes, "a game. Let's have some fun!"
I just don't understand.
On one hand there seems to be strict logic behind making design choices in the game, by the copyright holders, on the other hand there are dinosaurs with lasers on their heads.
On one hand, this is a copyrighted franchise that must maintain canon rigidity, on the other hand, it seems, "Let's have some fun!"
I hope you can understand my argument and how I am confused regarding the logic of the copyright holders.
And please, I laid out some very specific criticisms. I would very much like some reasoning based on those criticisms that I laid out in the OP.
Why would the Voth engineer creatures that are EXACTLY the species that link them to Earth?
CBS doesn't care all that much about the foes because they're foes: you use them for an episode or two and then move on to the next absurd foe. That's entirely different then caring about their golden IP points: ships, playable species, etc.
That's really great but offers nothing to the topic on hand. Your post also doesn't respond to any of the criticisms in the OP.
I accept that argument. I am still wondering if someone has a better answer considering what is known about the Voth from Star Trek: Voyager.
the same logic that gave us space bunnys disco balls the same logic that lets a captain pick there ship should i go on?
system Lord Baal is dead
I have read the blogs and the only understanding that I come out with is that they use dinosaurs because they use dinosaurs.
They have mechs, but they use dinosaurs too.
There is no information related to my criticisms, unfortunately, aside from, ?all I want is dinosaurs with frickin? laser beams on their heads!?
Actually he does respond to it... You just don't want to see it.
Yeh, you must be right, I'm asking for explanations that I don't want to see. /sarcasm
Please, offer something, or don't bother replying. Or, keep doing what you're doing and amuse only yourself.
If the Voth are as rigid in their philosophy of superiority as they were in Star Trek: Voyager, then the easiest way for the Federation to stop their incursion in to the Dyson Sphere would be to show the Voth society the links between mecha-T-Rex and an extinct T-Rex. The genetic markers would also be a stark indication of the origins of the Voth. This would cause a civil war in their society and stop their incursion.
How could this have been a well thought out design decision? I don't think that it was.
Does it make the Voth fun to fight? Sure. Does it make sense for canon? Not in my opinion. Does it make the Voth unqiue? Yup.
Or is it the usual preseason hysterics, and assumed ideas of whats to come.:rolleyes:
this is the thing we dont know much about them only what we saw of them on one i repeat one EP sorry but you not going to know every thing about a race from one EP only what that EP calls for other than that got to use that thing that gave us star trek
for all we know there are 100's of city ships all over the universe doing gods knows what
system Lord Baal is dead
AFAIK the City Ship housed the entirety of the Voth civilization.
With my criticisms I am drawing from that one episode, the sole appearance of the Voth in the history of all Star Trek iterations.
In that appearance, the Voth held strictly to their doctrine and any deviation from it was disavowed in order to prevent a societal collapse. The information that was disavowed and nearly caused that collapse was the revelation that the Voth originated from Earth in the Alpha quadrant. The link was derived from genetic research of the Voth DNA.
Now, the Voth have taken their DNA and manipulated it to create less evolved creatures that are identical, and would without a doubt reveal their origin on Earth in the Alpha quadrant... does not compute.
Humans would NEVER use trained dolphins or dogs or anything in warfare!
Yeah, if humans took thousands of years to apply even basic technologies to our society, we wouldn't still be using horses and such!
They aren't, though I can see how such a thing would strain your pitiful mammalian brain. They're actual species that evolved on the Voth homeworld that just happen to resemble some creature's from Earth's geological past, just like how all you mammals happen to look exactly alike. You're free to disagree, of course, except if you go against the Doctrine you /will/ be severely punished.
Actually I wouldn't be surprised if this thread was merged into that one, since that's the main dino discussion thread.
Mine Trap Supporter
This was never even remotely suggested in the episode. How the Voth would enforce what they described as an extensive territorial claim with tiers of rights for native and non-native aliens with their entire civilization existing in such a small ship is difficult to imagine.
Ok... I will try to convert it into lines, understandable to you:
T5 Connie makes people angry
Dinos do not make people angry, just confused.
CBS can make money, and they don't care about your opinion.
You bring up interesting points. Unfortunately if you're looking for a logical explanation about this, you will probably find none. It was another simple, illogical, for-fun design decision by Cryptic. Love it or hate it.
Perhaps Season 8 will shed some light about the Voth and give an explanation as to why. But I doubt it will give a good one. :rolleyes:
This thread is distinctly different from that other thread.
I am bringing up a specific criticism and wondering what the community thinks about it based on what is revealed about the Voth in Star Trek: Voyager.
There are no wrong answers here and I am just curious what others think.
The reason that I'm curious about other people's opinions is due to the apparent contradiction between what the Voth held as their Doctrine in Star Trek: Voyager, and the apparent lack of regard for it in engineering species that would link them directly to the Alpha quadrant.
Perhaps you fail to understand why evolution is used so much in Science Fiction.
this has my vote!!!!
system Lord Baal is dead
this always been my thing about trek you cant take the good with out the bad in every series ppl who only try and take nothing but the good well we end up with dinos in space thread!!!!!
system Lord Baal is dead
To be clear, I neither love nor hate this idea as I haven't gone and tested the gameplay of it. I am simply pointing out a lack of parity between the Voth doctrine and so clearly creating a link between themselves and their ancestry in the Alpha quadrant while then using that creation, which is a link, on the very species of the Alpha quadrant that made the connection in the first place.