If, as it appears, the Hunter Ranger is supposed to function differently from other classes with its quasi-hybrid nature, then...
Consider balancing based on the specialization/paragon feat trees working differently. This might also make up for the fact that we have one paragon path. Instead of all feats having just bonuses, consider granting the Archer path more bonuses to ranged options //and nerfing melee options in return//. For example: You take a feat that grants 1/2/3/4/5% ranged damage, but that same feat gives you -1/2/3/4/5% melee damage. Allow those who wish to specialize to specialize, instead of being forced to nerf down both aspects of a power to bring about balance for the class, which leaves no one terribly happy.
That whole archer line benefits both ranged and melee but that line is also heavily ranged crit based
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If, as it appears, the Hunter Ranger is supposed to function differently from other classes with its quasi-hybrid nature, then...
Consider balancing based on the specialization/paragon feat trees working differently. This might also make up for the fact that we have one paragon path. Instead of all feats having just bonuses, consider granting the Archer path more bonuses to ranged options //and nerfing melee options in return//. For example: You take a feat that grants 1/2/3/4/5% ranged damage, but that same feat gives you -1/2/3/4/5% melee damage. Allow those who wish to specialize to specialize, instead of being forced to nerf down both aspects of a power to bring about balance for the class, which leaves no one terribly happy.
U dont need a feat that reduces our melee or range dmg when we specced x, that wouldnt make any sense.
U're talking like we are over the top and we need tome teaks....
Sadly it's the other way around and we need way more dmg on our encounters and some reliable burst abilities!
U dont need a feat that reduces our melee or range dmg when we specced x, that wouldnt make any sense.
U're talking like we are over the top and we need tome teaks....
Sadly it's the other way around and we need way more dmg on our encounters and some reliable burst abilities!
I second third forth and fifth this thats the only thing wrong with this class atm that and i think con should be one of our secondary attributes instead of strength i dont think theres any thing strength can give us that we cant reliably get from are feats alone or a racial feature.
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
0
sadistMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Hands up for ur work of making a video +1 for that!
Sadly u were fighting like the easiest mobs in the game and also with some kind of tank? pet.
Also ur gear was pretty good but apart from that, it mostly shows how long it takes u to kill a single elite mob.
Every other class with like 11k+gs would just fly trough that foundry and u even have to kite a bit.
Dont get me wrong, im not saying u do something wrong but this shows me again, that ur dps is very very weak.
I tested it today in the foundry solo grind against single elite mobs with my ranger who is even better geared than urs, with perf.vorpal and full r10s and the killspeed was embarrassing!
Even when opening with aimedshot and using every encounter setup it took me ~ 5 times as long as on my cw!! to kill a single mob.
I dont even want to compare it to my tr, who kills these mobs with 2.5 duellist furrys!
Even my sent gwf with only t1 weapon kills these mobs master....
Thanks for checking out the vid! The pet I was using is a level 15 panther(striker) from the founders pack. The dungeon I was running is from the new Dread Ring zone - Death Forge. I have found the Ranger capable of producing high DPS numbers but as you mentioned, and I agree 100% with you that it's takes much longer to burn down enemies. I believe the early feedback from players that certain skills where producing DPS numbers that where to high along with the response was a bit of a knee jerk reaction.
Thanks for checking out the vid! The pet I was using is a level 15 panther(striker) from the founders pack. The dungeon I was running is from the new Dread Ring zone - Death Forge. I have found the Ranger capable of producing high DPS numbers but as you mentioned, and I agree 100% with you that it's takes much longer to burn down enemies. I believe the early feedback from players that certain skills where producing DPS numbers that where to high along with the response was a bit of a knee jerk reaction.
The early comments on the ranger dps weren't even false cuz they only saw the ~20ish gameplay!
I already said that ranger in the early lvlst was insanly good, but when u reached around lvl 38+ u slowly realized that nothing is going to change but that ur dps is going from very high to only medicore and that was even BEFOR the nerf!
Feedback: gameplay
I was sceptic with the high cd on all our encounter but that works perfectly well when u have a decent critrating and specced into prime critical. Nevertheless our encounterdmg and SAME for our atwill dmg is embarrasing when u compare it to other classes that even have hard hitting encounters. I see no reason, even so we have a bit more utility than other classes, why our encounters do such less dmg and why we dont have an reliable hardhitting encounter!
I cant believe it, even when i looked at it like 20 times now...
I rly want a justification for an encounter doing such less dmg on close range on an lvl 60 char!
if they truely mean for this class to be hybrid... they should have the ranged attacks make the melee damage do more by default without the feat and the melee damage should all slow the movement speed and do knockback so that you can return to ranged attacks otherwise your range is only there as an opening pull and to keep players from running in pvp just like the knife toss is for a rogue.
Ok figured it out I think. Now how do I gain the "Class Mechanic Power" of "grass roots"?
The melee powers tell me I have to learn the "mechanic" first.
I'm gonna rip your head off and make it my puppet! (NwN2)
Ok figured it out I think. Now how do I gain the "Class Mechanic Power" of "grass roots"?
The melee powers tell me I have to learn the "mechanic" first.
Grasping Roots is a default class mechanic, just use Hindering in Melee then switch to Ranged and Maruaders away; you'll be able to see the roots doing their thing.
Best to do on something alone, so its easier to see and not have to worry about everything while you are looking at the screen to see the VFX
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Thanks for checking out the vid! The pet I was using is a level 15 panther(striker) from the founders pack. The dungeon I was running is from the new Dread Ring zone - Death Forge. I have found the Ranger capable of producing high DPS numbers but as you mentioned, and I agree 100% with you that it's takes much longer to burn down enemies. I believe the early feedback from players that certain skills where producing DPS numbers that where to high along with the response was a bit of a knee jerk reaction.
I think the problem is there was not enough testing between iterations.
For me it went like this;
1) Everything does heaps of damage.
2) At-wills that are as potent than other class buffed encounters
3) Everything is now nerfed too much <- current state.
The problem is between 2 & 3 they didn't put the Encounter damage back where it was at the start to see if things are balanced out better now. Instead we have nerfed encounters and nerfed at-wills. Put the Encounters back to their initial damage and things should be fine. (Ok maybe 90% of their original damage as a start point.)
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Gameplay video I posted for those struggling with the class or curious about how the class handles at level 60. http://youtu.be/HZPGFry_CiQ
Nice video. I just hope this isn't used as proof that ranged dominant play is universally viable seeing it's in a relatively controlled environment, I've had little trouble with that so far. Where I see a bigger disadvantage is when you can't jump all around the map because of groups respawning with tough foes, as in Icespire Peak against the frost giants with winterwolves and trolls milling around and respawning before you're able to take the giant down. Agreed here you can get added support from other players happening by but that's not guaranteed. And although I can swap out my bar even between fights, I can't respec my character from range dominant to melee dominant as easily or as often. Doing it once would be to high a price for most players already to pay.
I've got that part figured out now that I've hit level 10+ but I can't figure out how to get the "Class Mechanic Power". It tells me I have to learn it in order to gain more melee powers.
I'm gonna rip your head off and make it my puppet! (NwN2)
Dilettante The half elf bonus dose not seem to work on this class yet
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
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I've got that part figured out now that I've hit level 10+ but I can't figure out how to get the "Class Mechanic Power". It tells me I have to learn it in order to gain more melee powers.
There is nothing to do, at level 10 you can access the melee versions of all the powers you have.
Note: Forest Ghost only has a melee attack & seismic shot only has ranged (Seismic works regardless of your stance, Ghost only does attacks in Melee stance.)
The only other power with no Melee version before the Paragon Path is constricting shot, which is ranged only (but you can use it in melee stance like Seismic).
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Feedback: Forest Ghost This power needs to work in Ranged Stance as well (ie attack), it need not do it to full range but giving it a short ranged attack would make it better.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
0
sadistMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Nice video. I just hope this isn't used as proof that ranged dominant play is universally viable seeing it's in a relatively controlled environment, I've had little trouble with that so far. Where I see a bigger disadvantage is when you can't jump all around the map because of groups respawning with tough foes, as in Icespire Peak against the frost giants with winterwolves and trolls milling around and respawning before you're able to take the giant down. Agreed here you can get added support from other players happening by but that's not guaranteed. And although I can swap out my bar even between fights, I can't respec my character from range dominant to melee dominant as easily or as often. Doing it once would be to high a price for most players already to pay.
Thanks! The idea was to identify a flexible ranged build that would work primarily in solo dungeon play and still be viable in group play. Completely agree with you on the respect aspect as appropriate builds seem very situational. Versatility in the class becomes severely limited in selecting complementary powers once spec'ed into a specific path.
Feedback: Powers: Throw Caution This power often misfires. I don't know if it is due to lag on the preview server or if it interacts funnily with other skills that are firing, but frequently I press the button only to realize a few seconds later it did not activate. Given the ranger's intense play style, I suggest it be made instant and able to fire during animations, like the TR's stealth.
ok i hit 60 a few hours ago and got the full t1 pvp set all i can say is this class is a crit machine its like every other attack is a crit your non crit boost you crit chance and the keystone skill in achery is beast also. The class makes up for what it lacks in its low skill dmg for its crits.
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Problem is if you are hitting for 200 and criting for another 200 you are still 1000 behind everyone else, a lot of crits on its own isn't a solution, and it needs everything to crit if it is going to be a solution.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
I respecced ranged to double check on all the complaints. I honestly have no idea what the complainers are talking about. In blues and rank 5s, a panther, and no armor or weapon enchants, I cleared all the dread ring dailies and phantasmal fortress without drinking a single potion. I even played a call to arms with another 4 rangers who were below level 30 (I am 60) and we cleared it with a few deaths. Mind you I have no ranged play experience. The damage is pretty impressive, still needs a minor buff, but not much at all. Regular mobs die in 2 split shots, so never get to me. Mid range elites usually require a forest ghost just to reset the distance, and bosses cannot touch me with all the shifts. I switched to melee stance mainly for the throw caution buff and used a marauder's rush for good measure, but often did not even bother. I could have easily stayed in ranged stance all the time.
I have to say ranged stance is vastly more powerful than melee stance. The damage is quite superior and without the hindrance of low survivability. I cannot imagine playing a melee build without ranged encounters, but can easily see a ranged build ignoring melee altogether.
I just wanted to chime in, and while at it, request a significant boost to melee survivability.
Bug: Seismic Shot VFX
Please fix this, it was reported on the first day of playtest. Just remove the VFX if you have to, but fix it some how.
Going to Tower District and not being able to move because there are too many of this vfx bug in the zone makes it impossible to fairly test the ranger. This is not the only zone that suffers from it, but it is one of the least forgiving as you have ranged attacks only and can move from 1 encounter mob into another easily by accident creating even more of these bugs as people try to win fights that suddenly doubled in difficulty.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
The damage is pretty impressive, still needs a minor buff, but not much at all. Regular mobs die in 2 split shots, so never get to me. Mid range elites usually require a forest ghost just to reset the distance, and bosses cannot touch me with all the shifts.
I just wanted to chime in, and while at it, request a significant boost to melee survivability.
U say the dmg is impressive but needs a buff? That's nonsense.
U need a daily to kill elite mobs? -> just shows that our dmg is to low.
U want a survivabilty buff? -> wouldnt need that if we would have enough range dmg.
And yes SINGLE Elites can not touch u, if u spam the **** out of ur dodges...like every other class!
In terms of singletarget dps we are even behind sent gwf, and sent gwf have around 10 times our survivability, more cc!! if specced for frontline, more burst and even more utility due to unstoppable.
I respecced ranged to double check on all the complaints. I honestly have no idea what the complainers are talking about.
You stated that you are at level 60, I presume, and apologize if I do so incorrectly, that you've only made one HR, and are basing your information on that?
I have made about 20-30 HR's, several were to test which races, attributes, etc were best. Several were done to completely retest the HR after each patch. And still others, were to test builds so that I can learn to play the HR when it goes live.
While the end game content needs to be tested with the HR, might I suggest, if you have an available slot, retest the HR in lower content with a new one?
Edit:
Speaking of which, my new HR just got access to the Rain of Arrows encounter. I hadn't been using it because the targets usually dodged it so fast. It appears that that has been fixed, and it's much more enjoyable to use now.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
You stated that you are at level 60, I presume, and apologize if I do so incorrectly, that you've only made one HR, and are basing your information on that?
I have made about 20-30 HR's, several were to test which races, attributes, etc were best. Several were done to completely retest the HR after each patch. And still others, were to test builds so that I can learn to play the HR when it goes live.
While the end game content needs to be tested with the HR, might I suggest, if you have an available slot, retest the HR in lower content with a new one?
I made about 10 Hr's i think Half elf Half Orc Human Drow Elf Hafling and Dwarf and tiefling are good race choices it depends on what you building. I then focused and mad a haf elf to test out a con build for HR and i couldn't be more happier strength is kinda lackluster for a secondary stat even though i ended up having 15 Strength 20 con 20 dex 20 wisdom add 1 to each at campfire. to bad the half elf racial doesn't work with them atm
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I may be wrong, but I believe that Strength, along with the HR's Dexterity, aid in the class' deflection buff.
I've heard several complaint's about the half-elf's racial, and I presume that that, and the lack of HR specific quests will be addressed by the time it's released. I believe that they're trying to tweek the HR, itself before addressing those issues.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
I may be wrong, but I believe that Strength, along with the HR's Dexterity, aid in the class' deflection buff.
I've heard several complaint's about the half-elf's racial, and I presume that that, and the lack of HR specific quests will be addressed by the time it's released. I believe that they're trying to tweek the HR, itself before addressing those issues.
So far from testing wisdom and dex are by far the best two stats for the HR they offer the best buffs Dex adds the dmg buff and deflection and wisdom the crit chance, There wasn't any thing from strength that i could not get from a racial feature regards to CC so i didn't invest a single point into it outside the 2 that auto go to all attributes. So i put 6 points into con if the half elf racial gives con i can put 1 last point into dex for 21 dex or 21 con or Wis
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
So far from testing wisdom and dex are by far the best two stats for the HR they offer the best buffs Dex adds the dmg buff and deflection and wisdom the crit chance, There wasn't any thing from strength that i could not get from a racial feature regards to CC so i didn't invest a single point into it outside the 2 that auto go to all attributes. So i put 6 points into con if the half elf racial gives con i can put 1 last point into dex for 21 dex or 21 con or Wis
so you never put any points into dex after creation, except those 2 levels of 6 points?
Comments
That whole archer line benefits both ranged and melee but that line is also heavily ranged crit based
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
U dont need a feat that reduces our melee or range dmg when we specced x, that wouldnt make any sense.
U're talking like we are over the top and we need tome teaks....
Sadly it's the other way around and we need way more dmg on our encounters and some reliable burst abilities!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The early comments on the ranger dps weren't even false cuz they only saw the ~20ish gameplay!
I already said that ranger in the early lvlst was insanly good, but when u reached around lvl 38+ u slowly realized that nothing is going to change but that ur dps is going from very high to only medicore and that was even BEFOR the nerf!
Feedback: gameplay
I was sceptic with the high cd on all our encounter but that works perfectly well when u have a decent critrating and specced into prime critical. Nevertheless our encounterdmg and SAME for our atwill dmg is embarrasing when u compare it to other classes that even have hard hitting encounters. I see no reason, even so we have a bit more utility than other classes, why our encounters do such less dmg and why we dont have an reliable hardhitting encounter!
I cant believe it, even when i looked at it like 20 times now...
I rly want a justification for an encounter doing such less dmg on close range on an lvl 60 char!
What Class Are You?
The melee powers tell me I have to learn the "mechanic" first.
What Class Are You?
The "melee only" powers are higher level, but all the low level powers you can access have melee variants; just press TAB and viola melee time.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Grasping Roots is a default class mechanic, just use Hindering in Melee then switch to Ranged and Maruaders away; you'll be able to see the roots doing their thing.
Best to do on something alone, so its easier to see and not have to worry about everything while you are looking at the screen to see the VFX
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
I think the problem is there was not enough testing between iterations.
For me it went like this;
1) Everything does heaps of damage.
2) At-wills that are as potent than other class buffed encounters
3) Everything is now nerfed too much <- current state.
The problem is between 2 & 3 they didn't put the Encounter damage back where it was at the start to see if things are balanced out better now. Instead we have nerfed encounters and nerfed at-wills. Put the Encounters back to their initial damage and things should be fine. (Ok maybe 90% of their original damage as a start point.)
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Nice video. I just hope this isn't used as proof that ranged dominant play is universally viable seeing it's in a relatively controlled environment, I've had little trouble with that so far. Where I see a bigger disadvantage is when you can't jump all around the map because of groups respawning with tough foes, as in Icespire Peak against the frost giants with winterwolves and trolls milling around and respawning before you're able to take the giant down. Agreed here you can get added support from other players happening by but that's not guaranteed. And although I can swap out my bar even between fights, I can't respec my character from range dominant to melee dominant as easily or as often. Doing it once would be to high a price for most players already to pay.
What Class Are You?
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
There is nothing to do, at level 10 you can access the melee versions of all the powers you have.
Note: Forest Ghost only has a melee attack & seismic shot only has ranged (Seismic works regardless of your stance, Ghost only does attacks in Melee stance.)
The only other power with no Melee version before the Paragon Path is constricting shot, which is ranged only (but you can use it in melee stance like Seismic).
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
This power needs to work in Ranged Stance as well (ie attack), it need not do it to full range but giving it a short ranged attack would make it better.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
This power often misfires. I don't know if it is due to lag on the preview server or if it interacts funnily with other skills that are firing, but frequently I press the button only to realize a few seconds later it did not activate. Given the ranger's intense play style, I suggest it be made instant and able to fire during animations, like the TR's stealth.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
I have to say ranged stance is vastly more powerful than melee stance. The damage is quite superior and without the hindrance of low survivability. I cannot imagine playing a melee build without ranged encounters, but can easily see a ranged build ignoring melee altogether.
I just wanted to chime in, and while at it, request a significant boost to melee survivability.
Please fix this, it was reported on the first day of playtest. Just remove the VFX if you have to, but fix it some how.
Going to Tower District and not being able to move because there are too many of this vfx bug in the zone makes it impossible to fairly test the ranger. This is not the only zone that suffers from it, but it is one of the least forgiving as you have ranged attacks only and can move from 1 encounter mob into another easily by accident creating even more of these bugs as people try to win fights that suddenly doubled in difficulty.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
U say the dmg is impressive but needs a buff? That's nonsense.
U need a daily to kill elite mobs? -> just shows that our dmg is to low.
U want a survivabilty buff? -> wouldnt need that if we would have enough range dmg.
And yes SINGLE Elites can not touch u, if u spam the **** out of ur dodges...like every other class!
In terms of singletarget dps we are even behind sent gwf, and sent gwf have around 10 times our survivability, more cc!! if specced for frontline, more burst and even more utility due to unstoppable.
You stated that you are at level 60, I presume, and apologize if I do so incorrectly, that you've only made one HR, and are basing your information on that?
I have made about 20-30 HR's, several were to test which races, attributes, etc were best. Several were done to completely retest the HR after each patch. And still others, were to test builds so that I can learn to play the HR when it goes live.
While the end game content needs to be tested with the HR, might I suggest, if you have an available slot, retest the HR in lower content with a new one?
Edit:
Speaking of which, my new HR just got access to the Rain of Arrows encounter. I hadn't been using it because the targets usually dodged it so fast. It appears that that has been fixed, and it's much more enjoyable to use now.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
I made about 10 Hr's i think Half elf Half Orc Human Drow Elf Hafling and Dwarf and tiefling are good race choices it depends on what you building. I then focused and mad a haf elf to test out a con build for HR and i couldn't be more happier strength is kinda lackluster for a secondary stat even though i ended up having 15 Strength 20 con 20 dex 20 wisdom add 1 to each at campfire. to bad the half elf racial doesn't work with them atm
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I've heard several complaint's about the half-elf's racial, and I presume that that, and the lack of HR specific quests will be addressed by the time it's released. I believe that they're trying to tweek the HR, itself before addressing those issues.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
So far from testing wisdom and dex are by far the best two stats for the HR they offer the best buffs Dex adds the dmg buff and deflection and wisdom the crit chance, There wasn't any thing from strength that i could not get from a racial feature regards to CC so i didn't invest a single point into it outside the 2 that auto go to all attributes. So i put 6 points into con if the half elf racial gives con i can put 1 last point into dex for 21 dex or 21 con or Wis
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
My mistake, it does work.
It appears the server has become intermittent.
Now it's locked up.
The server is down.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
so you never put any points into dex after creation, except those 2 levels of 6 points?