That about matches my findings in reaching level 11 again with the Dex/Int favored array.
Voltomey I've seen you mention Forest Meditation favorably a couple of times now and to be honest I just don't get the power, it seems utterly useless; you go out of combat, do not go into stealth and heal. What is the point? In 1 or 2 clicks I can heal much faster with a pot, why burn precious power points on a power that is essentially dead. Yeah you can get 100% deflection but with 50% severity that's irrelevant. So what's so good about this power that I'm missing?
Feedback: General Play Level 1-10 There seems to have been a slight tweak up in DPS, not enough to be too strong but enough that I could readily get through the opening section without too much trouble. At this stage I would consider the first 10 levels to be sound and in line with the experience of other classes.
Feedback: Grasping Roots Again I must emphasize the need for these to be stronger imo. Strong Grasping Roots should root targets and Grasping Roots should otherwise do what the current Strong Grasping Roots does. As it is Hindering Shot, when you get it, appears to do absolutely nothing as many of the enemies you can use it on are either in spaces that are so small weak grasping roots stretch too far or the enemy moves so fast that they just break the roots. Making this feature more robust would go a long way to the long term viability of the class.
Bug: Rain of Blows The melee version of Rain of Arrows does not activate while you hold a mouse button down for either at-will to be repeated while in Melee Stance.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
That about matches my findings in reaching level 11 again with the Dex/Int favored array.
Voltomey I've seen you mention Forest Meditation favorably a couple of times now and to be honest I just don't get the power, it seems utterly useless; you go out of combat, do not go into stealth and heal. What is the point? In 1 or 2 clicks I can heal much faster with a pot, why burn precious power points on a power that is essentially dead. Yeah you can get 100% deflection but with 50% severity that's irrelevant. So what's so good about this power that I'm missing?
Feedback: General Play Level 1-10 There seems to have been a slight tweak up in DPS, not enough to be too strong but enough that I could readily get through the opening section without too much trouble. At this stage I would consider the first 10 levels to be sound and in line with the experience of other classes.
Feedback: Grasping Roots Again I must emphasize the need for these to be stronger imo. Strong Grasping Roots should root targets and Grasping Roots should otherwise do what the current Strong Grasping Roots does. As it is Hindering Shot, when you get it, appears to do absolutely nothing as many of the enemies you can use it on are either in spaces that are so small weak grasping roots stretch too far or the enemy moves so fast that they just break the roots. Making this feature more robust would go a long way to the long term viability of the class.
Bug: Rain of Blows The melee version of Rain of Arrows does not activate while you hold a mouse button down for either at-will to be repeated while in Melee Stance.
I Have a personal like of that skill for my AoE build i also couple it with natures blessing it def needs a buff for the time you spend casting it if only it reflected dmg as well a nice situational self heal. Its also good at preventing dmg from big solo instane boss attacks kinda like my oh **** skill for when i mess up and don't have cunning up on CD
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Please do not let this ability require a target. The ability to line up shots on the fly and hit multiple targets is a fun mechanic but having its center be determined by a moving target means frustrating targeting and missed enemies especially as targets move about. Make the skill not require a target so that a skilled player can actually have fun and a consistent aoe damage choice without switching to melee.
Please do not let this ability require a target. The ability to line up shots on the fly and hit multiple targets is a fun mechanic but having its center be determined by a moving target means frustrating targeting and missed enemies especially as targets move about. Make the skill not require a target so that a skilled player can actually have fun and a consistent aoe damage choice without switching to melee.
Please do not let this ability require a target. The ability to line up shots on the fly and hit multiple targets is a fun mechanic but having its center be determined by a moving target means frustrating targeting and missed enemies especially as targets move about. Make the skill not require a target so that a skilled player can actually have fun and a consistent aoe damage choice without switching to melee.
In PvP you can home in on a CW and stop it from casting **** like singularity Ice Knife if you lock on it with split shot and use Disrupting arrow daily.
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
0
draventakMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 16Arc User
edited November 2013
Correct on this. there could be a shop for just Transmutation equip and gear. dont make it outragous amounts of AD like 1mil or that but maybe around 300 to 500k depending on the item or gear. These items would not have any kind of stats on them but for Transmutation only. That way the real gear is still dropping correctly in the dungeons and going to the right class. the only place to get the transmutation gear and items is in the Transmutation store that could be in the store by the Salvage guy.
I originally posted this in the "HR Ranged" discussion thread, but feel it needs to be here too.
My problems include: (Tests done versus target dummies)
Ranged skills are to slow:
My level 17 HR gets about 7 shots vs 10 melee hits in 5 seconds.
My level 12 TR does 8 hits (only gets 8 shots at a time) in 3 seconds with Cloud of Steel, and 7 hits in 3 seconds with Sly Flourish.
My level 17 CW's Magic Missle does 10 hits in 5 seconds.
Damage levels are very low:
My level 17 HR's Rapid Shot does around 58 per hit/ the melee version about 55 per hit.
My level 17 CW's Magic Missle does around 77 damage per hit.
My level 12 TR does 70 damage per hit with Cloud of Steel, and 100 per hit with Sly Flourish.
My level 4 DC's Lance of Faith and Astral seal each do 30 damage per hit. (just for comparison)
Critical hit data not included, because it is random, and would make the HR look much, much worse.
The HR crits maybe once or twice every 5 seconds, the TR crits five or six+ times in 3 seconds, and CW crits three or four time in 5 seconds.
That comes to:
Level 17 HR's Rapid Shot ranged damage is 406/5 sec - melee damage is 355/5 sec
Level 17 CW's Magic Missile damage is 770/5 sec
Level 12 TR's Cloud of Steel ranged damage is 560/3 sec - Sly Flourish melee damage is 700/3 sec
The CW's damage output, at the same level as the HR's is 190% times that of the HR.
The level 17 HR's ranged damage in 5 seconds is 72.5% of a level 12 TR's ranged damage in 3 seconds.
The level 17 HR's melee damage in 5 seconds is 50.1% of a level 12 TR's melee damage in 3 seconds.
Against single targets and lesser mobs, the HR is fair to middling. Against boss' and/or their mobs, it's tediously slow, and hard to do any damage, uses far to many pots, and you have to dodge twice at a time to stay alive while getting out of the range of red areas.
(The other classes can stay in most of the red areas, dealing enough interrupts and damage to kill the boss' and to survive on just a couple pots per battle.)
While I love the class, it's to slow, and does to little damage, imo, atm.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
I originally posted this in the "HR Ranged" discussion thread, but feel it needs to be here too.
My problems include: (Tests done versus target dummies)
Ranged skills are to slow:
My level 17 HR gets about 7 shots vs 10 melee hits in 5 seconds.
My level 12 TR does 8 hits (only gets 8 shots at a time) in 3 seconds with Cloud of Steel, and 7 hits in 3 seconds with Sly Flourish.
My level 17 CW's Magic Missle does 10 hits in 5 seconds.
Damage levels are very low:
My level 17 HR's Rapid Shot does around 58 per hit/ the melee version about 55 per hit.
My level 17 CW's Magic Missle does around 77 damage per hit.
My level 12 TR does 70 damage per hit with Cloud of Steel, and 100 per hit with Sly Flourish.
My level 4 DC's Lance of Faith and Astral seal each do 30 damage per hit. (just for comparison)
Critical hit data not included, because it is random, and would make the HR look much, much worse.
The HR crits maybe once or twice every 5 seconds, the TR crits five or six+ times in 3 seconds, and CW crits three or four time in 5 seconds.
That comes to:
Level 17 HR's Rapid Shot ranged damage is 406/5 sec - melee damage is 355/5 sec
Level 17 CW's Magic Missile damage is 770/5 sec
Level 12 TR's Cloud of Steel ranged damage is 560/3 sec - Sly Flourish melee damage is 700/3 sec
The CW's damage output, at the same level as the HR's is 190% times that of the HR.
The level 17 HR's ranged damage in 5 seconds is 72.5% of a level 12 TR's ranged damage in 3 seconds.
The level 17 HR's melee damage in 5 seconds is 50.1% of a level 12 TR's melee damage in 3 seconds.
Against single targets and lesser mobs, the HR is fair to middling. Against boss' and/or their mobs, it's tediously slow, and hard to do any damage, uses far to many pots, and you have to dodge twice at a time to stay alive while getting out of the range of red areas.
(The other classes can stay in most of the red areas, dealing enough interrupts and damage to kill the boss' and to survive on just a couple pots per battle.)
While I love the class, it's to slow, and does to little damage, imo, atm.
TBH Rapid Fire and Rapid Strike are only used to stack buffs like aspect of the serpent and Fire is used if your just dpsing a single target. More the time you just spam split shot its faster imho and more reliable then rapid shot. Also whats you highest lvl HR cause one you hit 60 things are vastly different imho.
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I originally posted this in the "HR Ranged" discussion thread, but feel it needs to be here too.
~SNIP~
While I love the class, it's to slow, and does to little damage, imo, atm.
I had a feeling I like my Control wizard (and even my Cleric) better than the Hunter Ranger as a general rule of thumb, though I LOVE the way Hunter Ranger plays in general.
You've just conformed to me WHY I love my CW and DC better than Ranger. The Ranger is fun to play because it's shiny, it's a new toy. But man-o-man that shine sure wears-off pretty quick. Thanks for showing me WHY.
It was nerfed just a tad too much. Needs a though-up buff. Not necessarily to previous levels of course, but definitely a need.
TBH Rapid Fire and Rapid Strike are only used to stack buffs like aspect of the serpent and Fire is used if your just dpsing a single target. More the time you just spam split shot its faster imho and more reliable then rapid shot. Also whats you highest lvl HR cause one you hit 60 things are vastly different imho.
I wasn't trying to show/say which skills were the best or worst, I was using skills which anyone, of any level, can use to do their own comparison, if they so desired.
The TR and CW don't have a skill similar to Split Shot.
The CW's Magic Missile, and the TR's Cloud of Steel, while not touted as being fast, are faster than the HR's RAPID Shot.
Which is one of the two points I was trying to make.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
I wasn't trying to show/say which skills were the best or worst, I was using skills which anyone, of any level, can use to do their own comparison, if they so desired.
The TR and CW don't have a skill similar to Split Shot.
The CW's Magic Missile, and the TR's Cloud of Steel, while not touted as being fast, are faster than the HR's RAPID Shot.
Which is one of the two points I was trying to make.
I would happily vote to increase the speed slightly for rapid shot (which would overall increase it's dps), as well as allowing it to be shot while moving (which would increase it's applicable DPS).
While your comparing, Warzog, what is the gear (main and offhand), level and base listed damage for the weapon in each of these three characters hands?
Want to see how base weapon damage is comparing, is all.
"Every adventurer has two things in common: they don't like dying, and they love getting paid. The rest is just semantics." Brecken, famed mercenary of Baldur's Gate
hr encounters trigger to slow
hr at wills shoot to slow
hr feats to many bad ones like stam with amount stam it takes to dodge you don't need the feats and many other feats have 0 to low use
TBH Rapid Fire and Rapid Strike are only used to stack buffs like aspect of the serpent and Fire is used if your just dpsing a single target. More the time you just spam split shot its faster imho and more reliable then rapid shot. Also whats you highest lvl HR cause one you hit 60 things are vastly different imho.
Go ahead and spam split shot, enjoy argoing other mobs around you as you do that. Stop saying it is vastly different as you have not posted any comparisons, you just say it is. Others are posting comparisons.
I started a topic over on the forums for the guild I am with, and Zeb can confirm this. We have talked about builds and what skills they are using. I am not as high as they are but I can get by with just using ranged skills for now. I still feel dps needs a slight increase but not much, maybe 10 to 15%
Go ahead and spam split shot, enjoy argoing other mobs around you as you do that. Stop saying it is vastly different as you have not posted any comparisons, you just say it is. Others are posting comparisons.
I started a topic over on the forums for the guild I am with, and Zeb can confirm this. We have talked about builds and what skills they are using. I am not as high as they are but I can get by with just using ranged skills for now. I still feel dps needs a slight increase but not much, maybe 10 to 15%
The two of us play the class totally def i can handle a group of mobs i would imagine its mode difficult to handle more then 3 mobs on a purely ranged HR. I run odd builds with this class and atm its working out for me.
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I would happily vote to increase the speed slightly for rapid shot (which would overall increase it's dps), as well as allowing it to be shot while moving (which would increase it's applicable DPS).
While your comparing, Warzog, what is the gear (main and offhand), level and base listed damage for the weapon in each of these three characters hands?
Want to see how base weapon damage is comparing, is all.
Edit 1:
The HR's +1 Smiting Scout's Blades are the only weapons hitting within their range, the CW's weapons, and the HR's bow are well below, while the TR's are way high. (I wonder if the TR's high 18 Strength is affecting it that much?)
Rechecked damage on the TR-lowest hit-first-was 68, then averages 84-124 per hit with Sly Flourish, not counting crits.
With Cloud of Steel, lowest hit-first-was 44, then averages 58-77.
Edit 2:
I think I figured it out. The HR and CW are only using one weapon to do damage, which corresponds to the weapon's stated damage. The TR, on the other hand, has two weapons, and their combined damage counts as one hit, and explains the higher damage output.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
Edit:
The HR's +1 Smiting Scout's Blades are the only weapons hitting within their range, the CW's weapons, and the HR's bow are well below, while the TR's are way high. (I wonder if the TR's high 18 Strength is affecting it that much?)
pretty sure u wont gain much from strengh at that lvl.
Anyways ty for ur testings!
Also remember u combare the worst at-wills of each of those classes, imagin u could compare rapid shot with duelist furry and magic missles with eye of the storm and stormspell!
That clearing shows that HR dmg isnt even a bit weak, its terrible, since we dont even have encounters to make up for that!
And pls no one tell me we are hybrid ect... even the fact that we have more encounters doesnt justify such a low dps, also we dont get anything from ur tab since tr gets also stealth and Combat advantage and adds bonuses to his encounters! So in terms of that they are pretty equal!
I'm just hoping we see some decent buffs next week, since we gave them so many GOOD suggestions!
And for the love of god make our passives working!
it would be nice to be able to Transmute other class gear to use for a look for example
TR and HR
GF and GWF
CW and DC
each of these could transmute for each other only in looks, not the stats. if that could be possiable. that way you could have a new look to each class but keep their own stats.
reason i would like this is that I like to create Book Characters as close as i can make them from the books. here is one of my toons i have made. yes it is Drizzt. and i know ill get alot of <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> over it but its fun for me. each to their own enjoyments. here is a couple of pics of him enjoy
The only way i would be able to be okay with this is by only making like material armors transmutable and right now i believe the HR and TR are the only classes that have the same material....
CW (cloth)
TRand HR(leather)
DC (chain)
GWF (Scale)
GF(plate)
warzog did you do this comparison after the latest patch?
If not can you run the HR again please?
Also can you give your attack stats for the HR (Attack/Heal, Crit Chance, Crit Severity, Recharge %, AP Gain %)?
Want to be able to generate my own data and compare it to yours.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
The only way i would be able to be okay with this is by only making like material armors transmutable and right now i believe the HR and TR are the only classes that have the same material....
CW (cloth)
TRand HR(leather)
DC (chain)
GWF (Scale)
GF(plate)
Technically, GWF and GF should be able to interchange their armor types between each other.
"Every adventurer has two things in common: they don't like dying, and they love getting paid. The rest is just semantics." Brecken, famed mercenary of Baldur's Gate
Technically, GWF and GF should be able to interchange their armor types between each other.
I suppose since they are both technically fighter classes I'd be fine with that, but in Neverwinter they do technically wear two different types of armor, Scale and Plate, (barring the class specificity) so even if Cryptic did allow same-material armor transmutation I doubt they would let them transmute to each others. Although they did have the Fighter classes share paragon paths (IMO a good thing even if it's not ideal for them) so i can't count them out on it.
warzog did you do this comparison after the latest patch?
If not can you run the HR again please?
Also can you give your attack stats for the HR (Attack/Heal, Crit Chance, Crit Severity, Recharge %, AP Gain %)?
Want to be able to generate my own data and compare it to yours.
I did the testing this morning well after the last patch.
Stats:
My current HR is a Drow, at level 17.
(My previous HR's were set up the same way.)
Stats (no campfire): Strength-14 / Constitution-10 / Dexterity-20 / Intelligence-10 / Wisdom-17 / Charisma-10.
I place points into Dexterity and Wisdom every time.
I have a Cleric companion w/R5 Profane RuneStone summoned, a Dog, and a Wayward Wizard active.
Except for my rings, all gear is level 16. No enchantments. (No enchantment slots)
Gear score:846 Power:244 Critical:240 AP:95 Defense:112 Deflect:156 Regeneration:25-from companion.
Yeah this helps a lot.
Your crit chance strikes me as very low; which explains the randomness of your crits. I'll get my Dex/Int focussed Wood Elf up to 17 and do the same experiment. I'll also level up a TR and CW on live to 17 and transfer them over to test.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Yeah this helps a lot.
Your crit chance strikes me as very low; which explains the randomness of your crits. I'll get my Dex/Int focussed Wood Elf up to 17 and do the same experiment. I'll also level up a TR and CW on live to 17 and transfer them over to test.
My TR is at 21.8% critical strikes.
My CW is at 13.5% critical strikes.
I decided to recheck my HR, even though it's now level 18, but has the same gear-and this is really weird!
My HR is at level 18 now, but Critical chance is now at 19.4%, Damage resitance is at 7.4%, Deflection Chance is at 8.1%, and AP is now 0%, with the same gear. It's kinda weird.
Retested HR-rates remain the same, but damage is all over the place.
Rapid Strike is now hitting for 70-157, average is now 107/hit. It had 0 criticals in 5 seconds.
Rapid Shot is now hitting for 104-176, average is now 114/hit. Only 2 criticals in 5 seconds.
Note 1:
My first tests were done with no one else in the area, these tests had all kinds of people testing, so some of the extra damage could be from combat advantage?
Note 2:
I patched it last night, tested it this morning, gave you the stats you asked for, invoked the gods several times today, which gave me enough points to hit level 18, went to recheck everything, and now everything is different. Any ideas? Did the patch not take effect until now?
Note 3:
The first tests were done with the campfire buff, and several invocation buffs. The last test was without any buffs.
Note 4:
Data taken using the "Combat (self)" channel of chat.
Edit 1:
My TR and CW were tested on live, not the preview shard.
Edit 2:
The last patch updated the graphics, not the damage. WTF?
Edit 3:
Just noticed that when I gave you the stats earlier, Critical Strikes was +8.5%, and so was Damage Resistance. I may have given the wrong number for Critical Strikes the 1st time. Ooops! I thought I had double checked everything.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
Ok so rather than wait I decided to do a quick comparison between Rapid Shot and Rapid Strike, just to see how it goes.
At time of test Str 13, Dex 20, Wis 13, Int 14
Weapons: Longbow of Accuracy 62-76 dmg and Scavenger's Blades 21-26 Damage
Attack Values
Attack 150
Crit Chance 11% Severity 75%
Recharge Increase +4%
AP Gain 0%
Rapid Shot Results Summary from 45 trials (3 crits not included in calculations) -
Minimum 58
Maximum 110
Median 66
Mode 63
Mean 75
Std. Dev: 19
-1 Std Dev: 56
+1 Std Dev: 94
Actual Crit %: 7%
Rapid Strike Results Summary from 47 trials (7 crits not included in calculations);
Minimum: 27
Maximum: 63
Median: 29
Mode: 27
Mean: 38
Std. Dev: 15
-1 Std Dev: 23
+1 Std Dev: 52
Actual Crit %: 15%
As you can see melee is way worse than ranged and both are swingy though fortunately the outliers are on the high end not the low one.
This just makes melee a loosing proposition.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
That's pretty much what I got earlier today, but you got more crits than I did, and more damage.
But, I only did 3 five second runs, so your's is much more accurate than mine were.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
Ok so rather than wait I decided to do a quick comparison between Rapid Shot and Rapid Strike, just to see how it goes.
At time of test Str 13, Dex 20, Wis 13, Int 14
Weapons: Longbow of Accuracy 62-76 dmg and Scavenger's Blades 21-26 Damage
Attack Values
Attack 150
Crit Chance 11% Severity 75%
Recharge Increase +4%
AP Gain 0%
Rapid Shot Results Summary from 45 trials (3 crits not included in calculations) -
Minimum 58
Maximum 110
Median 66
Mode 63
Mean 75
Std. Dev: 19
-1 Std Dev: 56
+1 Std Dev: 94
Actual Crit %: 7%
Rapid Strike Results Summary from 47 trials (7 crits not included in calculations);
Minimum: 27
Maximum: 63
Median: 29
Mode: 27
Mean: 38
Std. Dev: 15
-1 Std Dev: 23
+1 Std Dev: 52
Actual Crit %: 15%
As you can see melee is way worse than ranged and both are swingy though fortunately the outliers are on the high end not the low one.
This just makes melee a loosing proposition.
This is a nice test. I'll be looking forward to seeing the TR and CW.
There are a couple of points to consider.
First, blades generally have roughly half the weapon damage as bows at the same level and quality. Your test indicates your blades were of a lower level or quality than your bow. It would be interesting to have all the tests using a same level and quality weapon, as it is the greatest contributor to damage at that level.
Second, according to Warzog, melee has a slightly quicker attack than ranged. Taking that into account and the lower level blades, the damage difference is not as huge as the results seem to indicate. That said, it is still lower for melee than ranged, and I think if anything it should be higher given the time one loses to get into melee and the greater risks involved. Perhaps a dps calculation (just for the mean) would be an interesting addition to your results.
0
sevonyMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 4Arc User
edited November 2013
Just wanted to say that, despite a few bugs, I really like the Hunter. And that's what we are here for after all, to find the bugs so they can get fixed before the official release.
Comments
Voltomey I've seen you mention Forest Meditation favorably a couple of times now and to be honest I just don't get the power, it seems utterly useless; you go out of combat, do not go into stealth and heal. What is the point? In 1 or 2 clicks I can heal much faster with a pot, why burn precious power points on a power that is essentially dead. Yeah you can get 100% deflection but with 50% severity that's irrelevant. So what's so good about this power that I'm missing?
Feedback: General Play Level 1-10
There seems to have been a slight tweak up in DPS, not enough to be too strong but enough that I could readily get through the opening section without too much trouble. At this stage I would consider the first 10 levels to be sound and in line with the experience of other classes.
Feedback: Grasping Roots
Again I must emphasize the need for these to be stronger imo. Strong Grasping Roots should root targets and Grasping Roots should otherwise do what the current Strong Grasping Roots does. As it is Hindering Shot, when you get it, appears to do absolutely nothing as many of the enemies you can use it on are either in spaces that are so small weak grasping roots stretch too far or the enemy moves so fast that they just break the roots. Making this feature more robust would go a long way to the long term viability of the class.
Bug: Rain of Blows
The melee version of Rain of Arrows does not activate while you hold a mouse button down for either at-will to be repeated while in Melee Stance.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
I Have a personal like of that skill for my AoE build i also couple it with natures blessing it def needs a buff for the time you spend casting it if only it reflected dmg as well a nice situational self heal. Its also good at preventing dmg from big solo instane boss attacks kinda like my oh **** skill for when i mess up and don't have cunning up on CD
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Please do not let this ability require a target. The ability to line up shots on the fly and hit multiple targets is a fun mechanic but having its center be determined by a moving target means frustrating targeting and missed enemies especially as targets move about. Make the skill not require a target so that a skilled player can actually have fun and a consistent aoe damage choice without switching to melee.
Please do not let this ability require a target. The ability to line up shots on the fly and hit multiple targets is a fun mechanic but having its center be determined by a moving target means frustrating targeting and missed enemies especially as targets move about. Make the skill not require a target so that a skilled player can actually have fun and a consistent aoe damage choice without switching to melee.
In PvP you can home in on a CW and stop it from casting **** like singularity Ice Knife if you lock on it with split shot and use Disrupting arrow daily.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
this would be a very nice new touch to the game.
My problems include: (Tests done versus target dummies)
Ranged skills are to slow:
My level 17 HR gets about 7 shots vs 10 melee hits in 5 seconds.
My level 12 TR does 8 hits (only gets 8 shots at a time) in 3 seconds with Cloud of Steel, and 7 hits in 3 seconds with Sly Flourish.
My level 17 CW's Magic Missle does 10 hits in 5 seconds.
Damage levels are very low:
My level 17 HR's Rapid Shot does around 58 per hit/ the melee version about 55 per hit.
My level 17 CW's Magic Missle does around 77 damage per hit.
My level 12 TR does 70 damage per hit with Cloud of Steel, and 100 per hit with Sly Flourish.
My level 4 DC's Lance of Faith and Astral seal each do 30 damage per hit. (just for comparison)
Critical hit data not included, because it is random, and would make the HR look much, much worse.
The HR crits maybe once or twice every 5 seconds, the TR crits five or six+ times in 3 seconds, and CW crits three or four time in 5 seconds.
That comes to:
Level 17 HR's Rapid Shot ranged damage is 406/5 sec - melee damage is 355/5 sec
Level 17 CW's Magic Missile damage is 770/5 sec
Level 12 TR's Cloud of Steel ranged damage is 560/3 sec - Sly Flourish melee damage is 700/3 sec
The CW's damage output, at the same level as the HR's is 190% times that of the HR.
The level 17 HR's ranged damage in 5 seconds is 72.5% of a level 12 TR's ranged damage in 3 seconds.
The level 17 HR's melee damage in 5 seconds is 50.1% of a level 12 TR's melee damage in 3 seconds.
Against single targets and lesser mobs, the HR is fair to middling. Against boss' and/or their mobs, it's tediously slow, and hard to do any damage, uses far to many pots, and you have to dodge twice at a time to stay alive while getting out of the range of red areas.
(The other classes can stay in most of the red areas, dealing enough interrupts and damage to kill the boss' and to survive on just a couple pots per battle.)
While I love the class, it's to slow, and does to little damage, imo, atm.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
TBH Rapid Fire and Rapid Strike are only used to stack buffs like aspect of the serpent and Fire is used if your just dpsing a single target. More the time you just spam split shot its faster imho and more reliable then rapid shot. Also whats you highest lvl HR cause one you hit 60 things are vastly different imho.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I had a feeling I like my Control wizard (and even my Cleric) better than the Hunter Ranger as a general rule of thumb, though I LOVE the way Hunter Ranger plays in general.
You've just conformed to me WHY I love my CW and DC better than Ranger. The Ranger is fun to play because it's shiny, it's a new toy. But man-o-man that shine sure wears-off pretty quick. Thanks for showing me WHY.
It was nerfed just a tad too much. Needs a though-up buff. Not necessarily to previous levels of course, but definitely a need.
I wasn't trying to show/say which skills were the best or worst, I was using skills which anyone, of any level, can use to do their own comparison, if they so desired.
The TR and CW don't have a skill similar to Split Shot.
The CW's Magic Missile, and the TR's Cloud of Steel, while not touted as being fast, are faster than the HR's RAPID Shot.
Which is one of the two points I was trying to make.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
I would happily vote to increase the speed slightly for rapid shot (which would overall increase it's dps), as well as allowing it to be shot while moving (which would increase it's applicable DPS).
While your comparing, Warzog, what is the gear (main and offhand), level and base listed damage for the weapon in each of these three characters hands?
Want to see how base weapon damage is comparing, is all.
"D*mn wizards," said Morik the Rogue.
Learn what a GWF and GF really are: The History of Fighters
hr at wills shoot to slow
hr feats to many bad ones like stam with amount stam it takes to dodge you don't need the feats and many other feats have 0 to low use
Go ahead and spam split shot, enjoy argoing other mobs around you as you do that. Stop saying it is vastly different as you have not posted any comparisons, you just say it is. Others are posting comparisons.
I started a topic over on the forums for the guild I am with, and Zeb can confirm this. We have talked about builds and what skills they are using. I am not as high as they are but I can get by with just using ranged skills for now. I still feel dps needs a slight increase but not much, maybe 10 to 15%
The two of us play the class totally def i can handle a group of mobs i would imagine its mode difficult to handle more then 3 mobs on a purely ranged HR. I run odd builds with this class and atm its working out for me.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
HR: +2 Tempered Scout's Longbow / 89-109 damage lvl 16 | +1 Smiting Scout's Blades 53-69 damage lvl 16
TR: Dagger of Swiftness / 37-45 damage lvl 10 | +1 Smiting Evader's Dagger 34-42 damage lvl 10
CW: +2 Caster's Orb of Respite / 89-109 damage lvl 16 | Smiting Caster's Talisman lvl 16
Edit 1:
The HR's +1 Smiting Scout's Blades are the only weapons hitting within their range, the CW's weapons, and the HR's bow are well below, while the TR's are way high. (I wonder if the TR's high 18 Strength is affecting it that much?)
Rechecked damage on the TR-lowest hit-first-was 68, then averages 84-124 per hit with Sly Flourish, not counting crits.
With Cloud of Steel, lowest hit-first-was 44, then averages 58-77.
Edit 2:
I think I figured it out. The HR and CW are only using one weapon to do damage, which corresponds to the weapon's stated damage. The TR, on the other hand, has two weapons, and their combined damage counts as one hit, and explains the higher damage output.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
pretty sure u wont gain much from strengh at that lvl.
Anyways ty for ur testings!
Also remember u combare the worst at-wills of each of those classes, imagin u could compare rapid shot with duelist furry and magic missles with eye of the storm and stormspell!
That clearing shows that HR dmg isnt even a bit weak, its terrible, since we dont even have encounters to make up for that!
And pls no one tell me we are hybrid ect... even the fact that we have more encounters doesnt justify such a low dps, also we dont get anything from ur tab since tr gets also stealth and Combat advantage and adds bonuses to his encounters! So in terms of that they are pretty equal!
I'm just hoping we see some decent buffs next week, since we gave them so many GOOD suggestions!
And for the love of god make our passives working!
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
The only way i would be able to be okay with this is by only making like material armors transmutable and right now i believe the HR and TR are the only classes that have the same material....
CW (cloth)
TRand HR(leather)
DC (chain)
GWF (Scale)
GF(plate)
If not can you run the HR again please?
Also can you give your attack stats for the HR (Attack/Heal, Crit Chance, Crit Severity, Recharge %, AP Gain %)?
Want to be able to generate my own data and compare it to yours.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Technically, GWF and GF should be able to interchange their armor types between each other.
"D*mn wizards," said Morik the Rogue.
Learn what a GWF and GF really are: The History of Fighters
I suppose since they are both technically fighter classes I'd be fine with that, but in Neverwinter they do technically wear two different types of armor, Scale and Plate, (barring the class specificity) so even if Cryptic did allow same-material armor transmutation I doubt they would let them transmute to each others. Although they did have the Fighter classes share paragon paths (IMO a good thing even if it's not ideal for them) so i can't count them out on it.
I did the testing this morning well after the last patch.
Stats:
My current HR is a Drow, at level 17.
(My previous HR's were set up the same way.)
Stats (no campfire): Strength-14 / Constitution-10 / Dexterity-20 / Intelligence-10 / Wisdom-17 / Charisma-10.
I place points into Dexterity and Wisdom every time.
I have a Cleric companion w/R5 Profane RuneStone summoned, a Dog, and a Wayward Wizard active.
Except for my rings, all gear is level 16. No enchantments. (No enchantment slots)
Gear score:846 Power:244 Critical:240 AP:95 Defense:112 Deflect:156 Regeneration:25-from companion.
Attack/Heal: 553 - Critical: +8.5% - Crit Severity:+75% - Recharge increase: 1.2% - Action Point gain:+0.2%
Protection:293 - Damage Resistance:+8.5% - Deflection Chance:9.3% - Deflection Severity:50% - Regen:0%
Damage Gained as Action Points:0.4%
Hope that helps.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
Your crit chance strikes me as very low; which explains the randomness of your crits. I'll get my Dex/Int focussed Wood Elf up to 17 and do the same experiment. I'll also level up a TR and CW on live to 17 and transfer them over to test.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
My TR is at 21.8% critical strikes.
My CW is at 13.5% critical strikes.
I decided to recheck my HR, even though it's now level 18, but has the same gear-and this is really weird!
My HR is at level 18 now, but Critical chance is now at 19.4%, Damage resitance is at 7.4%, Deflection Chance is at 8.1%, and AP is now 0%, with the same gear. It's kinda weird.
Retested HR-rates remain the same, but damage is all over the place.
Rapid Strike is now hitting for 70-157, average is now 107/hit. It had 0 criticals in 5 seconds.
Rapid Shot is now hitting for 104-176, average is now 114/hit. Only 2 criticals in 5 seconds.
Note 1:
My first tests were done with no one else in the area, these tests had all kinds of people testing, so some of the extra damage could be from combat advantage?
Note 2:
I patched it last night, tested it this morning, gave you the stats you asked for, invoked the gods several times today, which gave me enough points to hit level 18, went to recheck everything, and now everything is different. Any ideas? Did the patch not take effect until now?
Note 3:
The first tests were done with the campfire buff, and several invocation buffs. The last test was without any buffs.
Note 4:
Data taken using the "Combat (self)" channel of chat.
Edit 1:
My TR and CW were tested on live, not the preview shard.
Edit 2:
The last patch updated the graphics, not the damage. WTF?
Edit 3:
Just noticed that when I gave you the stats earlier, Critical Strikes was +8.5%, and so was Damage Resistance. I may have given the wrong number for Critical Strikes the 1st time. Ooops! I thought I had double checked everything.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
At time of test Str 13, Dex 20, Wis 13, Int 14
Weapons: Longbow of Accuracy 62-76 dmg and Scavenger's Blades 21-26 Damage
Attack Values
Attack 150
Crit Chance 11% Severity 75%
Recharge Increase +4%
AP Gain 0%
Rapid Shot Results Summary from 45 trials (3 crits not included in calculations) -
Minimum 58
Maximum 110
Median 66
Mode 63
Mean 75
Std. Dev: 19
-1 Std Dev: 56
+1 Std Dev: 94
Actual Crit %: 7%
Rapid Strike Results Summary from 47 trials (7 crits not included in calculations);
Minimum: 27
Maximum: 63
Median: 29
Mode: 27
Mean: 38
Std. Dev: 15
-1 Std Dev: 23
+1 Std Dev: 52
Actual Crit %: 15%
As you can see melee is way worse than ranged and both are swingy though fortunately the outliers are on the high end not the low one.
This just makes melee a loosing proposition.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
But, I only did 3 five second runs, so your's is much more accurate than mine were.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
Boar Hide recovers AP outside of battle. Have not tried the other buffs yet.
This is a nice test. I'll be looking forward to seeing the TR and CW.
There are a couple of points to consider.
First, blades generally have roughly half the weapon damage as bows at the same level and quality. Your test indicates your blades were of a lower level or quality than your bow. It would be interesting to have all the tests using a same level and quality weapon, as it is the greatest contributor to damage at that level.
Second, according to Warzog, melee has a slightly quicker attack than ranged. Taking that into account and the lower level blades, the damage difference is not as huge as the results seem to indicate. That said, it is still lower for melee than ranged, and I think if anything it should be higher given the time one loses to get into melee and the greater risks involved. Perhaps a dps calculation (just for the mean) would be an interesting addition to your results.