Yes, i am killing them almost as quickly, but with better defenses. Thorn Ward and Split the Sky were over nerfed, as was Split Shot, but saying that the nerfs "ruined" the class is fallacious.
And that's the problem. Ranger output on mobs should be much higher as their defenses are lower, ie.no bubble, shorter dash, etc... They sacrifice control for raw damage. At least that's my take of the NW version of the StormWarden. IMO, I believe the class should be closer to the 4E definition and be on par with the Rogue in regards to melee damage relying on evasion rather than stealth for self preservation.
While my level 60 Ranger has been fun to play, there is no reason to take one over the existing classes as they bring less damage and survivability to the group when running dungeons.
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
sadistMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited November 2013
If the Rangers ranged damage output on mobs is equivalent to or less than a CW while lacking their crowd control abilities. And the Rangers single target melee damage fall far short of a Rogue. To the devs, producers, etc...
Why would anyone take a Ranger over or in substitute to any of the existing classes when running dungeons?
If the Rangers ranged damage output on mobs is equivalent to or less than a CW while lacking their crowd control abilities. And the Rangers single target melee damage fall far short of a Rogue. To the devs, producers, etc...
Why would anyone take a Ranger over or in substitute to any of the existing classes when running dungeons?
I presume you are speaking of groups taking a Ranger to join in a dungeon group.
I, however, would ask, why would anyone chose the Ranger over one of the other class' in the first place?
"Ready" in the respect that it was ready to let a small army of volunteer testers take a crack at it and collect feedback for balancing and bugfixing.
If that is so, then why didn't they get community input into which D&D Ranger we would like? The rumor has been, and the preference has been, the Archer Ranger. I've never heard anyone say that they were hoping for the Hunter Ranger.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
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sadistMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I presume you are speaking of groups taking a Ranger to join in a dungeon group.
I, however, would ask, why would anyone chose the Ranger over one of the other class' in the first place?
Where asking the same question only phrased differently.
mod note: please focus on providing your feedback and not on each other's opinions. and let me also remind everyone that what you see on the preview shard is subject to change. there's no need for a heated discussion in this thread.
Hunter Ranger Ranged powers: (I don't use the melee versions)
At-Wills:
(01)-Rapid Strike-A slight increase in speed would be nice.
(02)-Split Shot-Great power, but an increase in speed that it takes to narrow the beam would help.
(20)-Aimed Strike-The timed delay is annoying, but the interruptability is even more so.
(35)-Electric Shot-(P)-A shorter animation, and a slight increase in damage would be nice.
Encounters:
(03)-Marauder's Escape-While it has it's uses, I find that equiping it is only for special occassions . (killed myself by accident to often with it.)
(05)-Hindering Shot-One of my favorite HR encounters, speed is right, damage is good, recharge is great.
(05)-Rain of Arrows-I don't like having to target the ground, and targets often evade it long before it strikes.
(15)-Thorn Ward-A nice skill as is, but gets replaced once Constricting Arrow becomes available. (The weak grasping roots is far to weak.)
(20)-Constricting Arrow-One of my favorite skills, would be nice if it lasted a second or so longer.
(30)-Split the Sky-(P)-One of the better HR powers.
(35)-Hawk Shot-Great damage, put it takes forever to recharge. I use Hindering Shot instead.
Dailies:
(04)-Seismic Shot-A great daily! Makes getting action points worth it. (Not that crazy about the aiming animation, or having to left click to get it to fire.)
(10)-Forest Ghost-Helpful in getting past the bad guys that the last nerf now keeps us from handling solo.
(10)-Forest Meditation-Not a very good skill, I still took damage while regenerating.
Class Features:
(04)-Aspect of the Falcon-Almost a must for Range focused HR's. I love it!
(15)-Aspect of the Lone Wolf-Kind of hard to get any benefit from this against boss mobs, otherwise it's useful.
(15)-Aspect of the Pack-Companions normally stay 15'+ from you, so maxing this is a must to get any use from it. (A wider range would be better, especially during combat.)
(20)-Aspect of the Serpent-This one is only for those who switch stances a lot! To me, it's useless.
(30)-Blade Storm-(P)-This one is for melee stance only, of no use to me as a ranged stance player.
(##) = level it's available at.
(P) = paragon power.
Edit 1:
I almost forgot, my HR is currently level 37.
Edit 2:
My original post of all of the HR's Ranged powers, with their descriptions is on page 22.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
I am definitely in the group of those who wanted the Hunter Ranger and not the Archer Ranger (as I mentioned early in this thread). As a newbie, my HR is now my highest level character at 23, so I have no concept of what things play like at higher levels. However, at the lower levels the melee still feels weak compared to range. I don't want to melee just for stylistic reasons knowing that I would actually be better off in nearly every situation just staying with a bow in melee range. I would like to feel like there are more noticeable advantages.
Maybe survivability? What if the skill that gave you damage reduction based on a lack of people around you did that with bow but did the opposite with swords, giving you more reduction the more were around you? Or what if some melee skills gave back some health so that they gave you health benefits for staying in close? Just some thoughts. I love the HR, and I am considering coming back to NWO just for it, but I'd like to see clearer differentiation in the benefits between bow and sword. It might be there and I'm just too inexperienced to see it - but that is a problem in and of itself. One is a function issue, the other is a communication issue.
More testing is obviously very necessary. I want to see HR and module 2 and the new content soon, but I'd hate to see HR go through with this much hanging in the air.
"Every adventurer has two things in common: they don't like dying, and they love getting paid. The rest is just semantics." Brecken, famed mercenary of Baldur's Gate
Either the description (Every hit ... increases damage) is wrong or the power is. You get stacks from buffs ("Boar Skin" is a great skill to get +5 melee stacks). It also affects forest meditation since it's a melee skill apparently. The melee feats affect it as well (to me it would make more sense if "Forest Ghost" was a melee skill).
Ok first things first. I have been quiet the last day or so (Mainly due to the trolltasm direction the thread was going in) but also due to the fact that I wanted to get on test and do some testing myself before I actually jump back on and gave more thoughts.
So without Further Ado:
Feedback Split Shot: You guys hit this really hard, I 100% agree that it needed a Damage reduction bu 30% is definitely too much. I would suggest bringing this back to around 15% from what it was originally, I understand the reasoning behind the damage reduction, especially with no Target cap. But as it stands at the moment, it is pretty low comparative.
Rapid shot: I am not sure why this needed a damage reduction. At level 38 with 3 spec points it is really underwhelming as an At will, No where near as bad as Electric Shot but it is nearly there.
Electric Shot: Very cool Animation on this one, tip my hat to who ever designed that, but the damage on it is also very low. I understand that it is an AoE at will, but it hits for 50% of Split shot as it is now. There is no reason to ever slot this unless it gets a damage buff.
Thorn Ward: The Damage reduction did hurt a little bit, but it is still inline. Too date I have not seen it crit. May be a Bug so I will report that in any case. The original reason to take this in the first place is the stacking debuff though. Lets not forget that people.
Split the Sky: A 60% nerf is quite harsh. Bringing it back down to the 40% mark would be alot more tolerable, especially at the lower levels, where out defence is already quite low. Not having a character at 60 with this ability I cannot honestly give you my opinion at end game, but it seems rather weak as it is right now.
Non Blue Thoughts:
The Following AoE Rotation is rather nice:
Split the Sky, Thorn Ward, Rain of Arrows, Tab, Thorn Strike, Rain of Swords, spam split strike as needed.
You can push some half decent AoE dps with that set up.
Feedback Devs, if you were worried about the Rangers AoE capability with the damage reductions to Thorn ward, Split the Sky and Split shot, may I remind you that a similar level Cw (at 36) Can burst down a back of Zombies in Ebon Downs with Just Chill strike and Conduit of Ice? I found it much easier to handle group packs with the Cws base AoE damage than it is with the Ranger who takes much longer to get through those groups than a Cw. Both from Ranged.
Bug: Split the Sky / Thorn Ward
Neither seem to be able to critically hit. Is this Working as intended - I,e Crit chance is calculated at time of casting the ability rather than per individual hit? Either way, I have yet to see either critically hit.
Desidus@Xtraordinary91
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
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sadistMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
As a level 60 Ranger with level 8 and 9 enchants in my full set of Wardens gear (blues with better stats than the base purples you get from dread ring), I can say their damage is quite underwhelming. Fun class to play, but if I have to choose between running or selecting a Ranger or any other of the existing DPS classes, Ranger loses.
Yep and just imagine those that don't even have that type of gear and enchants. The highest enchant I have ever had was a R5. And the best gear I have had was blues. I did a lvl for my HR in Ebons Downs tonight and was hard pressed to take down 2 battle wights.
As a level 60 Ranger with level 8 and 9 enchants in my full set of Wardens gear (blues with better stats than the base purples you get from dread ring), I can say their damage is quite underwhelming. Fun class to play, but if I have to choose between running or selecting a Ranger or any other of the existing DPS classes, Ranger loses.
Hence why I stated that I didn't know how it scaled at level 60. If it is underwhelming. Give the Devs that sort of feedback. I like the fact that they are attempting to balance the class, but I also dont want to be relegated into just a pure support role for 60 PvE whilst I farm my gear.
Being level 60, How do you find Binding Shot and Commanding Shot?
Desidus@Xtraordinary91
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
With its current build the class is to ineffective in PvE let alone in PvP. I will just stick with my current toons. Kind of funny that a healing class, the DC, has more dmg output then the ranger.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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l3g10nna1reMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 372Arc User
edited November 2013
Taken from MMO Interview
MMORPG: And lastly, can you give us any information on the Ranger
Taken from MMO Interview
MMORPG: And lastly, can you give us any information on the Ranger’s two paths?
The Ranger will initially be launching with the Storm Warder Path, which is a very area effect driven move set with a wind and lightning motif. One of the cooler spells is the Split the Sky ranged encounter, which creates a large storm cloud that zaps enemies when they attack.
@ the Combat developers: Why are we (i say we if we make a HR) only getting access to one Path, you have mentioned yourself you have been working on this class for some time is there any reason why this isnt launching with 2 paths ?
please explain
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commanderkahlainMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited November 2013
Warzog -- Thanks for that -- I'll keep it in my for the future. Right now, I Cannot Spend ANY Power Points...
Sadly our best class features still dont work like Aspect of the Lone Wolf and Twin-Blade Storm.
I would suggest fixing our passives first befor making anymore changes, so we can actually see how the class works.
Atm we only have half our potential.
Feedback:It'd be cool whether the ranger falls under control or striker. But as it is right now, it's neither. The class has absurdly low DPS and sub-par control. It's more of a leader class right now because of the variety of buffs they can give. Like a watered down cleric, not as good since they can't heal and the buffs they give aren't really all that impressive. Would be great if the devs could choose what the ranger's role really is. It USED to be a striker, partly a controller, but not anymore. This squishy class just got its DPS gimped pretty hard with the damage reductions to Thorn Ward and Split the Sky.
Not to mention the melee portion of the HR is still requiring some more attention. Right now it's the least most viable path to take. HR's aren't as tanky as GWF's and GF's, nor are they as elusive and mobile as TR's. I'm speaking from a PVE standpoint, and I can confirm that the feat setups of the HR are very well thought of. But the current state of the HR's melee DPS is just plain horrible that most people who are testing it are just opting to go for ranged setups, since you get to hit people with huge numbers from a 93' range. I find it strange that melee combat, which is a whole lot more riskier for a non-defender class, nets less rewards compared to fighting from range.
If it's possible, maybe the HR's roles should be more apparent in their stances. Ranged for more DPS, melee for more control. Make it so that one skill doesn't have both DPS and control. Give melees the ability to interrupt their foes or something. They're just plain vanilla right now. Boar Charge is the best melee skill right now because of its ability to control opponents well despite it being a single target spell. If it's possible to add some minor control effects to the melee spells of the HR, that'd be just awesome.
Like giving Thorn Strike the ability to apply Strong Grasping Roots to targets hit with it. Would be a good way to root enemies in place. Rain of Swords would not only apply Bleed to enemies but also a minor Snare effect which slows them down because they just got pummeled by swords.
Playing as a melee HR with the combat feat tree can be fun, I can tell. But right now the rewards you can get for spec-ing into that path isn't quite up to par to what you can get from playing support or ranged.
My thoughts on the Ranged and Melee stances:
For me, the Ranged stance should be the primary source of DPS, interrupts, and crowd control for the Hunter Ranger.
The melee stance, due to our mid to low armor, should have high spike DPS, speed of attacks, and a lot of interrupts.
Of the limited gear that we have, Deflection appears to be the intended primary buff of the Hunter Ranger, but with so few pieces, it's really hard to test.
As I see it, the intended purpose(s) of the Hunter Ranger is to start out in ranged stance, acting like a Control Wizard, until the battle deteriates into hand-to-hand combat, at which time it becomes a spike damage dealer like the Trickster Rogue.
Unfortunately, the ranged stance powers don't have enough oomph to control anything for any length of time, increasing the power and duration of the grasping roots skills like Constricting Shot, and adding a crippling affect to Hindering Shot, could do just that. The melee stance, which, in my opinion, should be AoE, spike or burst damage, needs to be drastically increased. Granted, it should never reach the levels of the other melee classes, but it needs to be viable when the Hunter Ranger gets swarmed. I would suggest, more AoE damage, interrupts, and a really powerful spike encounter, or daily. Preferrably, a spike AoE Daily.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited November 2013
I don't know if this is specifically feedback, but I finally had a chance to actually play a ranger, so I do have something to contribute to the discussion regarding how they play in their current form.
First, I didn't have any fancy weapons or companions, so I had no unusual advantages beyond a gift of skill kits. I didn't even send over a stack of healing potions.
I used the bow I received on first talking to Knox up until I was level 10, which meant my base weapon damage was substantially underpowered for the quest levels I was on. The reworking of Blacklake (plus no skirmishing) meant I came out of there at level 8 instead of the level 10-11 I'd normally expect to be at, so without heading into a Foundry quest, everything available for me to do was 2-3 levels above me, with my crummy bow, trying to level up to be able to equip all the level 10 stuff I was carrying.
For all that, I only died once, mostly from stupidity (failing to jump over a trap and then letting myself get into a fight without healing first). I had lots of close calls, drank many potions, and kited like crazy, but survived everything, including horrible pulls from aggroing adjacent mobs by shooting towards them, and one surprise! ogre. Potions used were only ones from drops and the level-up boxes; none purchased.
I haven't tried any of the melee abilities yet, and found myself doing a lot of point-blank archery while kiting. Maybe it's that I'm already used to tight positional work from playing other classes, but what was very effective for me was keeping enemies penned in to the rain of arrows while I circled around them to avoid the big hits. Marauder's escape could usually be relied on if I was out of dodges and really needed to move away, but sometimes it's better to not dodge and simply circle or sidestep. The fact that it hides you from enemies was valuable though. I can see how you could send yourself flying right off a platform if careless.
Opening with a fully charged split shot seems very effective for weakening a mob. I wonder if some of the complaint is that this skill no longer one-shots the entire group before they even see you.
Further testing should be interesting now that I've been able to actually gear up slightly.
My thoughts on the Ranged and Melee stances:
For me, the Ranged stance should be the primary source of DPS, interrupts, and crowd control for the Hunter Ranger.
The melee stance, due to our mid to low armor, should have high spike DPS, speed of attacks, and a lot of interrupts.
Of the limited gear that we have, Deflection appears to be the intended primary buff of the Hunter Ranger, but with so few pieces, it's really hard to test.
As I see it, the intended purpose(s) of the Hunter Ranger is to start out in ranged stance, acting like a Control Wizard, until the battle deteriates into hand-to-hand combat, at which time it becomes a spike damage dealer like the Trickster Rogue.
Unfortunately, the ranged stance powers don't have enough oomph to control anything for any length of time, increasing the power and duration of the grasping roots skills like Constricting Shot, and adding a crippling affect to Hindering Shot, could do just that. The melee stance, which, in my opinion, should be AoE, spike or burst damage, needs to be drastically increased. Granted, it should never reach the levels of the other melee classes, but it needs to be viable when the Hunter Ranger gets swarmed. I would suggest, more AoE damage, interrupts, and a really powerful spike encounter, or daily. Preferrably, a spike AoE Daily.
It is not that simple I think. There is a whole tree dedicated to melee, mostly damage and one defensive feat. That leads me to believe melee is meant to be a viable primary source of damage. Of course the ranger is supposed to switch stances to maximize output, but where a ranged build will want to spend more time in ranged stance, a melee build will want to spend more time in melee stance.
Having leveled a ranger in the melee tree, my feeling is quite different from yours. There are a ton of aoe options, but it lacks a little in hard hitting single target encounters. Aimed strike would be perfect with its DoT, but there is no place to fit it on the bar.
Feedback: As it currently stands, it would seem to me that the HR I am playing is less effective overall than my level 60 CW. Either more control or evasion needs to be added, or damage needs to be increased, or a combination of both.
Commentary:
I'm level 37 now, and I've found:
Up til about 35, the best companion has been the Man-at-Arms. With my preference for an archer ranger, his ability to keep threat has made the game exactly the experience that I've wanted to have. Two problems, though: he doesn't get beyond level 15 without a lot more AD than I have, and I haven't tried out the other taunting companions to see if any of them are better (I want to see Wild Hunt Rider with my HR!)
Another thing to consider companion-wise: The Hunting Hawk upcoming companion's Active Benefit is:
"On at-will use, damage bonus increases as the range increases, with a maximum of +10% bonus damage at 100'"
Now so far as I know there's no (current) way to increase HR at-will range to 100' (80+3+5+5=93), but this is a (future) damage bump that most HRs who want to focus on range will be picking up as an active companion.
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fistiganMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 15Arc User
Type: Bug Split shot - when at rank 2 shows damage 2-2.
Type: Feedback Hunter Ranger feels very OP right now. It could just be a lower levels, but I have hardly had to use any health potions so far. Currently level 8.
ITs very Op for the first few levels but that drops off DRASTICALLY as they level in some instances it is very very difficult to solo end of zone bosses. although some on test might disagree but then again i have seen the coiners running around with blue to purple gear at the earliest possible opportunity and running 6,7 0r 8's in their enchant slots as early as level 10 or 11 so they are not getting a true read on the class
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fistiganMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 15Arc User
It is not that simple I think. There is a whole tree dedicated to melee, mostly damage and one defensive feat. That leads me to believe melee is meant to be a viable primary source of damage. Of course the ranger is supposed to switch stances to maximize output, but where a ranged build will want to spend more time in ranged stance, a melee build will want to spend more time in melee stance.
Having leveled a ranger in the melee tree, my feeling is quite different from yours. There are a ton of aoe options, but it lacks a little in hard hitting single target encounters. Aimed strike would be perfect with its DoT, but there is no place to fit it on the bar.
But the fact is most want to play the ranger from range. especially after viewing the lackluster melee, either or you should be able to run either. problem is with aggro the way it is and lack of CC's on the Ranger they are almost forcing your hand and making you slot for Melee. Range needs control otherwise after one or two shots you are hitting melee and trying to shuffle back to range for damage but you cannot get ahead of the npc's long enough to play range effectively. I have dealt with it but it's not preferable and it is disappointing especially since I along with others have patiently waited its arrival. Range was my preferred class in the pen/paper version would like for it to be my main in this game but outlook not likely at this rate.
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fistiganMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 15Arc User
Feedback:It'd be cool whether the ranger falls under control or striker. But as it is right now, it's neither. The class has absurdly low DPS and sub-par control. It's more of a leader class right now because of the variety of buffs they can give. Like a watered down cleric, not as good since they can't heal and the buffs they give aren't really all that impressive. Would be great if the devs could choose what the ranger's role really is. It USED to be a striker, partly a controller, but not anymore. This squishy class just got its DPS gimped pretty hard with the damage reductions to Thorn Ward and Split the Sky.
Not to mention the melee portion of the HR is still requiring some more attention. Right now it's the least most viable path to take. HR's aren't as tanky as GWF's and GF's, nor are they as elusive and mobile as TR's. I'm speaking from a PVE standpoint, and I can confirm that the feat setups of the HR are very well thought of. But the current state of the HR's melee DPS is just plain horrible that most people who are testing it are just opting to go for ranged setups, since you get to hit people with huge numbers from a 93' range. I find it strange that melee combat, which is a whole lot more riskier for a non-defender class, nets less rewards compared to fighting from range.
If it's possible, maybe the HR's roles should be more apparent in their stances. Ranged for more DPS, melee for more control. Make it so that one skill doesn't have both DPS and control. Give melees the ability to interrupt their foes or something. They're just plain vanilla right now. Boar Charge is the best melee skill right now because of its ability to control opponents well despite it being a single target spell. If it's possible to add some minor control effects to the melee spells of the HR, that'd be just awesome.
Like giving Thorn Strike the ability to apply Strong Grasping Roots to targets hit with it. Would be a good way to root enemies in place. Rain of Swords would not only apply Bleed to enemies but also a minor Snare effect which slows them down because they just got pummeled by swords.
Playing as a melee HR with the combat feat tree can be fun, I can tell. But right now the rewards you can get for spec-ing into that path isn't quite up to par to what you can get from playing support or ranged.
I have to agree with this Range needs DPS and somewhere there has to be a control factor have any of you Devs actually leveled on sol from 0-60 with no special equipment. I think this needs to happen. Then it will be plain as the nose on your faces. Changes are in order. Not griping it's just a fact.
My level 37 HR is trying to do the level 37 "Barrow Lords" quests in Ebon Downs. Using either stance is ineffectual, and even trying to kite targets, I die 2-3 times per barrow. Between not doing enough damage because of the recent nerfs, and only having level 28 armor, with the rest of my gear at levels 30-35, it's becoming nigh on to impossible to proceed much further.
Portable Altars do not provide the atribute buff that campfires do.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
But the fact is most want to play the ranger from range. especially after viewing the lackluster melee, either or you should be able to run either. problem is with aggro the way it is and lack of CC's on the Ranger they are almost forcing your hand and making you slot for Melee. Range needs control otherwise after one or two shots you are hitting melee and trying to shuffle back to range for damage but you cannot get ahead of the npc's long enough to play range effectively. I have dealt with it but it's not preferable and it is disappointing especially since I along with others have patiently waited its arrival. Range was my preferred class in the pen/paper version would like for it to be my main in this game but outlook not likely at this rate.
I agree that at some points leveling was tricky. Melee damage in general lacks more than ranged, but you can afford moving a little less, thus making up for it. I can see how solo play can get complicaded for ranged builds. My melee build at times ran around like a chicken waiting for the potion CD. I think there are mechanisms built in fot that though: the many shifts, forest ghost, roots, etc... Not that it can't be improved of course.
In a dungeon the situation is very different. You have someone tanking and other classes competing for aggro or doing CC. In that environment I think the ranged ranger far outshines the melee one, unfortunately for melee builds. In any case the class still needs work, no doubt about that. It sure is a fun class though, so much so that I plan of leveling a melee one and a ranged one, something I didn't even do for my beloved gwf. That said, at 60 and in blues the class plays quite well with ony ranks 4 and 5, and no weapon enchant. It has, in my view, many more outs than any other class.
Line of Sight is blocked by almost everything, my companion, rocks, and boxes I can see over, making it impossible to shoot at targets.
If a target is right next to you, you have to point the camera almost straight down in order to hit them.
I was just doing a quest, was looking straight at the target, and 20' or so, but couldn't fire. It took a while to notice that there was a stick in the ground between us, which I had to side step to be able to fire.
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
Right now HR feels very weak compared to other classes not only cuz the slightly rapid shot nerf is more like a 25% nerf.
Furthermore we dont have any burst abilitys, but aimedshot which is terrible to use.
Suggesstion: give hawk shot the aimedshot dmg but decrease it's dmg by 5% each time u take dmg while casting it but dont make it shut down when taking dmg.
Comments
While my level 60 Ranger has been fun to play, there is no reason to take one over the existing classes as they bring less damage and survivability to the group when running dungeons.
Currently, it's two preview test servers, one for Module 2 and one for the current build+weekly patches.
"Ready" in the respect that it was ready to let a small army of volunteer testers take a crack at it and collect feedback for balancing and bugfixing.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
Why would anyone take a Ranger over or in substitute to any of the existing classes when running dungeons?
I presume you are speaking of groups taking a Ranger to join in a dungeon group.
I, however, would ask, why would anyone chose the Ranger over one of the other class' in the first place?
If that is so, then why didn't they get community input into which D&D Ranger we would like? The rumor has been, and the preference has been, the Archer Ranger. I've never heard anyone say that they were hoping for the Hunter Ranger.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
thanks.
At-Wills:
(01)-Rapid Strike-A slight increase in speed would be nice.
(02)-Split Shot-Great power, but an increase in speed that it takes to narrow the beam would help.
(20)-Aimed Strike-The timed delay is annoying, but the interruptability is even more so.
(35)-Electric Shot-(P)-A shorter animation, and a slight increase in damage would be nice.
Encounters:
(03)-Marauder's Escape-While it has it's uses, I find that equiping it is only for special occassions . (killed myself by accident to often with it.)
(05)-Hindering Shot-One of my favorite HR encounters, speed is right, damage is good, recharge is great.
(05)-Rain of Arrows-I don't like having to target the ground, and targets often evade it long before it strikes.
(15)-Thorn Ward-A nice skill as is, but gets replaced once Constricting Arrow becomes available. (The weak grasping roots is far to weak.)
(20)-Constricting Arrow-One of my favorite skills, would be nice if it lasted a second or so longer.
(30)-Split the Sky-(P)-One of the better HR powers.
(35)-Hawk Shot-Great damage, put it takes forever to recharge. I use Hindering Shot instead.
Dailies:
(04)-Seismic Shot-A great daily! Makes getting action points worth it. (Not that crazy about the aiming animation, or having to left click to get it to fire.)
(10)-Forest Ghost-Helpful in getting past the bad guys that the last nerf now keeps us from handling solo.
(10)-Forest Meditation-Not a very good skill, I still took damage while regenerating.
Class Features:
(04)-Aspect of the Falcon-Almost a must for Range focused HR's. I love it!
(15)-Aspect of the Lone Wolf-Kind of hard to get any benefit from this against boss mobs, otherwise it's useful.
(15)-Aspect of the Pack-Companions normally stay 15'+ from you, so maxing this is a must to get any use from it. (A wider range would be better, especially during combat.)
(20)-Aspect of the Serpent-This one is only for those who switch stances a lot! To me, it's useless.
(30)-Blade Storm-(P)-This one is for melee stance only, of no use to me as a ranged stance player.
(##) = level it's available at.
(P) = paragon power.
Edit 1:
I almost forgot, my HR is currently level 37.
Edit 2:
My original post of all of the HR's Ranged powers, with their descriptions is on page 22.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
Maybe survivability? What if the skill that gave you damage reduction based on a lack of people around you did that with bow but did the opposite with swords, giving you more reduction the more were around you? Or what if some melee skills gave back some health so that they gave you health benefits for staying in close? Just some thoughts. I love the HR, and I am considering coming back to NWO just for it, but I'd like to see clearer differentiation in the benefits between bow and sword. It might be there and I'm just too inexperienced to see it - but that is a problem in and of itself. One is a function issue, the other is a communication issue.
"D*mn wizards," said Morik the Rogue.
Learn what a GWF and GF really are: The History of Fighters
Either the description (Every hit ... increases damage) is wrong or the power is. You get stacks from buffs ("Boar Skin" is a great skill to get +5 melee stacks). It also affects forest meditation since it's a melee skill apparently. The melee feats affect it as well (to me it would make more sense if "Forest Ghost" was a melee skill).
So without Further Ado:
Feedback
Split Shot: You guys hit this really hard, I 100% agree that it needed a Damage reduction bu 30% is definitely too much. I would suggest bringing this back to around 15% from what it was originally, I understand the reasoning behind the damage reduction, especially with no Target cap. But as it stands at the moment, it is pretty low comparative.
Rapid shot: I am not sure why this needed a damage reduction. At level 38 with 3 spec points it is really underwhelming as an At will, No where near as bad as Electric Shot but it is nearly there.
Electric Shot: Very cool Animation on this one, tip my hat to who ever designed that, but the damage on it is also very low. I understand that it is an AoE at will, but it hits for 50% of Split shot as it is now. There is no reason to ever slot this unless it gets a damage buff.
Thorn Ward: The Damage reduction did hurt a little bit, but it is still inline. Too date I have not seen it crit. May be a Bug so I will report that in any case. The original reason to take this in the first place is the stacking debuff though. Lets not forget that people.
Split the Sky: A 60% nerf is quite harsh. Bringing it back down to the 40% mark would be alot more tolerable, especially at the lower levels, where out defence is already quite low. Not having a character at 60 with this ability I cannot honestly give you my opinion at end game, but it seems rather weak as it is right now.
Non Blue Thoughts:
The Following AoE Rotation is rather nice:
Split the Sky, Thorn Ward, Rain of Arrows, Tab, Thorn Strike, Rain of Swords, spam split strike as needed.
You can push some half decent AoE dps with that set up.
Feedback
Devs, if you were worried about the Rangers AoE capability with the damage reductions to Thorn ward, Split the Sky and Split shot, may I remind you that a similar level Cw (at 36) Can burst down a back of Zombies in Ebon Downs with Just Chill strike and Conduit of Ice? I found it much easier to handle group packs with the Cws base AoE damage than it is with the Ranger who takes much longer to get through those groups than a Cw. Both from Ranged.
Bug: Split the Sky / Thorn Ward
Neither seem to be able to critically hit. Is this Working as intended - I,e Crit chance is calculated at time of casting the ability rather than per individual hit? Either way, I have yet to see either critically hit.
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
As a level 60 Ranger with level 8 and 9 enchants in my full set of Wardens gear (blues with better stats than the base purples you get from dread ring), I can say their damage is quite underwhelming. Fun class to play, but if I have to choose between running or selecting a Ranger or any other of the existing DPS classes, Ranger loses.
Hence why I stated that I didn't know how it scaled at level 60. If it is underwhelming. Give the Devs that sort of feedback. I like the fact that they are attempting to balance the class, but I also dont want to be relegated into just a pure support role for 60 PvE whilst I farm my gear.
Being level 60, How do you find Binding Shot and Commanding Shot?
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
MMORPG: And lastly, can you give us any information on the Ranger
Taken from MMO Interview
MMORPG: And lastly, can you give us any information on the Ranger’s two paths?
The Ranger will initially be launching with the Storm Warder Path, which is a very area effect driven move set with a wind and lightning motif. One of the cooler spells is the Split the Sky ranged encounter, which creates a large storm cloud that zaps enemies when they attack.
@ the Combat developers: Why are we (i say we if we make a HR) only getting access to one Path, you have mentioned yourself you have been working on this class for some time is there any reason why this isnt launching with 2 paths ?
please explain
I would suggest fixing our passives first befor making anymore changes, so we can actually see how the class works.
Atm we only have half our potential.
I already made a post about it: http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?526581-How-to-make-Hunter-Ranger-more-enjoyable&p=6500501#post6500501
Maybe u guys have a different or the same opinion.
Not to mention the melee portion of the HR is still requiring some more attention. Right now it's the least most viable path to take. HR's aren't as tanky as GWF's and GF's, nor are they as elusive and mobile as TR's. I'm speaking from a PVE standpoint, and I can confirm that the feat setups of the HR are very well thought of. But the current state of the HR's melee DPS is just plain horrible that most people who are testing it are just opting to go for ranged setups, since you get to hit people with huge numbers from a 93' range. I find it strange that melee combat, which is a whole lot more riskier for a non-defender class, nets less rewards compared to fighting from range.
If it's possible, maybe the HR's roles should be more apparent in their stances. Ranged for more DPS, melee for more control. Make it so that one skill doesn't have both DPS and control. Give melees the ability to interrupt their foes or something. They're just plain vanilla right now. Boar Charge is the best melee skill right now because of its ability to control opponents well despite it being a single target spell. If it's possible to add some minor control effects to the melee spells of the HR, that'd be just awesome.
Like giving Thorn Strike the ability to apply Strong Grasping Roots to targets hit with it. Would be a good way to root enemies in place. Rain of Swords would not only apply Bleed to enemies but also a minor Snare effect which slows them down because they just got pummeled by swords.
Playing as a melee HR with the combat feat tree can be fun, I can tell. But right now the rewards you can get for spec-ing into that path isn't quite up to par to what you can get from playing support or ranged.
For me, the Ranged stance should be the primary source of DPS, interrupts, and crowd control for the Hunter Ranger.
The melee stance, due to our mid to low armor, should have high spike DPS, speed of attacks, and a lot of interrupts.
Of the limited gear that we have, Deflection appears to be the intended primary buff of the Hunter Ranger, but with so few pieces, it's really hard to test.
As I see it, the intended purpose(s) of the Hunter Ranger is to start out in ranged stance, acting like a Control Wizard, until the battle deteriates into hand-to-hand combat, at which time it becomes a spike damage dealer like the Trickster Rogue.
Unfortunately, the ranged stance powers don't have enough oomph to control anything for any length of time, increasing the power and duration of the grasping roots skills like Constricting Shot, and adding a crippling affect to Hindering Shot, could do just that. The melee stance, which, in my opinion, should be AoE, spike or burst damage, needs to be drastically increased. Granted, it should never reach the levels of the other melee classes, but it needs to be viable when the Hunter Ranger gets swarmed. I would suggest, more AoE damage, interrupts, and a really powerful spike encounter, or daily. Preferrably, a spike AoE Daily.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
First, I didn't have any fancy weapons or companions, so I had no unusual advantages beyond a gift of skill kits. I didn't even send over a stack of healing potions.
I used the bow I received on first talking to Knox up until I was level 10, which meant my base weapon damage was substantially underpowered for the quest levels I was on. The reworking of Blacklake (plus no skirmishing) meant I came out of there at level 8 instead of the level 10-11 I'd normally expect to be at, so without heading into a Foundry quest, everything available for me to do was 2-3 levels above me, with my crummy bow, trying to level up to be able to equip all the level 10 stuff I was carrying.
For all that, I only died once, mostly from stupidity (failing to jump over a trap and then letting myself get into a fight without healing first). I had lots of close calls, drank many potions, and kited like crazy, but survived everything, including horrible pulls from aggroing adjacent mobs by shooting towards them, and one surprise! ogre. Potions used were only ones from drops and the level-up boxes; none purchased.
I haven't tried any of the melee abilities yet, and found myself doing a lot of point-blank archery while kiting. Maybe it's that I'm already used to tight positional work from playing other classes, but what was very effective for me was keeping enemies penned in to the rain of arrows while I circled around them to avoid the big hits. Marauder's escape could usually be relied on if I was out of dodges and really needed to move away, but sometimes it's better to not dodge and simply circle or sidestep. The fact that it hides you from enemies was valuable though. I can see how you could send yourself flying right off a platform if careless.
Opening with a fully charged split shot seems very effective for weakening a mob. I wonder if some of the complaint is that this skill no longer one-shots the entire group before they even see you.
Further testing should be interesting now that I've been able to actually gear up slightly.
Neverwinter Census 2017
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It is not that simple I think. There is a whole tree dedicated to melee, mostly damage and one defensive feat. That leads me to believe melee is meant to be a viable primary source of damage. Of course the ranger is supposed to switch stances to maximize output, but where a ranged build will want to spend more time in ranged stance, a melee build will want to spend more time in melee stance.
Having leveled a ranger in the melee tree, my feeling is quite different from yours. There are a ton of aoe options, but it lacks a little in hard hitting single target encounters. Aimed strike would be perfect with its DoT, but there is no place to fit it on the bar.
As it currently stands, it would seem to me that the HR I am playing is less effective overall than my level 60 CW. Either more control or evasion needs to be added, or damage needs to be increased, or a combination of both.
Commentary:
I'm level 37 now, and I've found:
Up til about 35, the best companion has been the Man-at-Arms. With my preference for an archer ranger, his ability to keep threat has made the game exactly the experience that I've wanted to have. Two problems, though: he doesn't get beyond level 15 without a lot more AD than I have, and I haven't tried out the other taunting companions to see if any of them are better (I want to see Wild Hunt Rider with my HR!)
Another thing to consider companion-wise: The Hunting Hawk upcoming companion's Active Benefit is:
"On at-will use, damage bonus increases as the range increases, with a maximum of +10% bonus damage at 100'"
Now so far as I know there's no (current) way to increase HR at-will range to 100' (80+3+5+5=93), but this is a (future) damage bump that most HRs who want to focus on range will be picking up as an active companion.
ITs very Op for the first few levels but that drops off DRASTICALLY as they level in some instances it is very very difficult to solo end of zone bosses. although some on test might disagree but then again i have seen the coiners running around with blue to purple gear at the earliest possible opportunity and running 6,7 0r 8's in their enchant slots as early as level 10 or 11 so they are not getting a true read on the class
But the fact is most want to play the ranger from range. especially after viewing the lackluster melee, either or you should be able to run either. problem is with aggro the way it is and lack of CC's on the Ranger they are almost forcing your hand and making you slot for Melee. Range needs control otherwise after one or two shots you are hitting melee and trying to shuffle back to range for damage but you cannot get ahead of the npc's long enough to play range effectively. I have dealt with it but it's not preferable and it is disappointing especially since I along with others have patiently waited its arrival. Range was my preferred class in the pen/paper version would like for it to be my main in this game but outlook not likely at this rate.
I have to agree with this Range needs DPS and somewhere there has to be a control factor have any of you Devs actually leveled on sol from 0-60 with no special equipment. I think this needs to happen. Then it will be plain as the nose on your faces. Changes are in order. Not griping it's just a fact.
Portable Altars do not provide the atribute buff that campfires do.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
I agree that at some points leveling was tricky. Melee damage in general lacks more than ranged, but you can afford moving a little less, thus making up for it. I can see how solo play can get complicaded for ranged builds. My melee build at times ran around like a chicken waiting for the potion CD. I think there are mechanisms built in fot that though: the many shifts, forest ghost, roots, etc... Not that it can't be improved of course.
In a dungeon the situation is very different. You have someone tanking and other classes competing for aggro or doing CC. In that environment I think the ranged ranger far outshines the melee one, unfortunately for melee builds. In any case the class still needs work, no doubt about that. It sure is a fun class though, so much so that I plan of leveling a melee one and a ranged one, something I didn't even do for my beloved gwf. That said, at 60 and in blues the class plays quite well with ony ranks 4 and 5, and no weapon enchant. It has, in my view, many more outs than any other class.
If a target is right next to you, you have to point the camera almost straight down in order to hit them.
I was just doing a quest, was looking straight at the target, and 20' or so, but couldn't fire. It took a while to notice that there was a stick in the ground between us, which I had to side step to be able to fire.
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
Right now HR feels very weak compared to other classes not only cuz the slightly rapid shot nerf is more like a 25% nerf.
Furthermore we dont have any burst abilitys, but aimedshot which is terrible to use.
Suggesstion: give hawk shot the aimedshot dmg but decrease it's dmg by 5% each time u take dmg while casting it but dont make it shut down when taking dmg.
Bug:
Aspect of the Lone Wolf
Twin-Blade Storm
Both doesnt work.