A healing DC who was pulling tons of aggro because we didn't have a GF any my heal threat was higher than the DPSers' threat. If you loose your aggro, you won't be ganked, so if you think about it, your worry is flawed.
You won't swap companions to loose thread because you keep getting too much thread to swap to companions that reduce threat. That's just strange.
They only work till the tank has one as well. now I have less DPS AND AGAIN all the aggro. I'm not just getting chased like a cleric. I'm getting beat down with little means to heal. Something you've obviously never experienced.
Try a soloing a heroic on a DPS character. Until then you won't understand.
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
They only work till the tank has one as well. now I have less DPS AND AGAIN all the aggro. I'm not just getting chased like a cleric. I'm getting beat down. Something you've obviously never experienced
Not true. I have aggro issues on my main CW. However, I manage it. If I get aggro, I stop attacking until it's taken off me. Please do not assume what I do and do not do. I have almost 20 level 60 characters and have been here since Alpha. I've experienced a lot.
I suggest to stop trying to be the "Top DPS" and instead focus on doing plenty of damage while managing your threat. If you're doing so much damage that you cannot handle the backlash, you need to tone it down and find a happy medium.
Ever do the giant helmets quest in IWD and get jumped by the undead giant and/or the deathlock wight and all their buddies?
If you unintentionally pull more mobs that you intended, that should kill you. I'm sorry but that's been a frustration to me that such things don't kill you in the current game.
GWF need their real unstoppable and determination gain back. I won't argue that.
or else just buff unstoppable recovery feat to heal 5/10/15/20/25% total hp over 10 seconds this way we can actualy stay alive while being able to use our class ability....
If you unintentionally pull more mobs that you intended, that should kill you. I'm sorry but that's been a frustration to me that such things don't kill you in the current game.
Not what I mean. Go to IWD and go after the giants. Every once in a while, the undead will go on search-and-destroy and make a beeline for you even though they were nowhere near. They'll even do it when you're on the path by one of the beacons minding your own business. Do any of the HE's west of the path. It happens all the time.
Harper Chronicles: Cap Snatchers (RELEASED) - NW-DPUTABC6X Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
That works for me, I'd rather not be in a suicidal CW's party.
Seriously though, take my advice or not, but you really should look at why you're drawing so much threat and focus on that.
However, just cause I stop attacking doesn't mean it affects my dps that much, for threat is usually taken quite quickly and in those few seconds, I can do something like chug a pot, teleport, steal time, etc. I'm just not going to keep wailing on a group of mobs I aggro'd while the tank or someone else is trying to pull it off me. I'd rather not be a detriment to the party by pulling all the aggro and dying. I think losing 2-3 seconds of DPS in order to not be mobbed to death is a worthy sacrifice. Not only for myself, but the party as a whole.
That works for me, I'd rather not be in a suicidal CW's party.
Do you understand how hard it is to lose threat when you do 10's to 100's of thousands of damage then require a teammate to do that much plus 10% in order to pull aggro
Even when I stop attacking all together. Another party member has to do %10 more damage then me to the same enemy in order to draw aggro from me(Why do I have to tell you this). By then I'm dead. It's easy to out DPS a cleric and pull the aggro from them (you). So again. You haven't experienced it so you don't know.
Not what I mean. Go to IWD and go after the giants. Every once in a while, the undead will go on search-and-destroy and make a beeline for you even though they were nowhere near. They'll even do it when you're on the path by one of the beacons minding your own business. Do any of the HE's west of the path. It happens all the time.
It adds a sense of danger in the zone, to get hit up by some roving bandits or undead in this case. If you can't survive it, then run away (live to fight another day).
My Combat HR can solo anything in IWD, without any real threat of dying, doing an ample amount of DPS and I don't stack regen. I have what comes with gear but everything else, I have lifesteal to a comfortable amount, endless consumption and incoming heal bonuses being a dragonborn. I'm wearing full corrupt black ice using a complete lathander set and DC artifact. It all depends on your build and what stats to stack. In group play, if the party gets in trouble, I am usually the last to go down and most of the time I'm the one doing the tanking.
tonyvincentMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 123Arc User
edited January 2015
For anyone who have answers:
Artifact gear, artifacts, and enchantments get increased level cap. There are not many people (at all) who have i.e. lvl 9 or 10 enchantments, nor legendary artifact gear and artifacts. It is already tedious to add RP to the different things, but what really worries me is the way people would be able to farm RP in a good way. The RP from the Leadership Profession is tiny, not even worth collecting, as you mostly get rank 1 or 2 enchantments from the chests and barrels (maybe lvl 25 Leadership will give higher ranks?). Most people already know this, but if the level cap on the different things increases, without an improvement to how to get hold of RP (in a fun way, i.e. from T2 Dungeons), then I am afraid the gap between the elite players and the rest will become even bigger. Increasing the level cap on characters to lvl 70 will not help lessening this gap, as leveling to 70 only requires time (fun time too actually), but increasing the level of the artifacts, artifact gear, and enchantments is rather difficult. This will also bring issues to the PvP, if everything surrounding PvP stays the same (more or less, without major changes).
So, the question is: Will we see a great improvement to how one may get hold of Refinement Points? Maybe in a fun way too?
Thanks in advance!
|Aizu Wallenstein|
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
Do you understand how hard it is to lose threat when you do 10's to 100's of thousands of damage then require a teammate to do that much plus 10% in order to pull aggro
Even when I stop attacking all together. Another party member has to do %10 more damage then me to the same enemy in order to draw aggro from me(Why do I have to tell you this). By then I'm dead. It's easy to out DPS a cleric and pull the aggro from them (you). So again. You haven't experienced it so you don't know.
Yes, I do understand. You're answering your own issue. You're doing far too much damage for what you can handle. Stop trying to do the most DPS and perhaps pop in a -threat companion or take the feat. If you die, your DPS drops to 0. I think not doing as much damage in order to stay alive is the better trade-off. Yes?
Yes, I do understand. You're answering your own issue. You're doing far too much damage for what you can handle. Stop trying to do the most DPS and perhaps pop in a -threat companion or take the feat. If you die, your DPS drops to 0. I think not doing as much damage in order to stay alive is the better trade-off. Yes?
Or do enough damage to kill it. Dead mobs do no damage to you.
It adds a sense of danger in the zone, to get hit up by some roving bandits or undead in this case. If you can't survive it, then run away (live to fight another day).
My Combat HR can solo anything in IWD, without any real threat of dying, doing an ample amount of DPS and I don't stack regen. I have what comes with gear but everything else, I have lifesteal to a comfortable amount, endless consumption and incoming heal bonuses being a dragonborn. I'm wearing full corrupt black ice using a complete lathander set and DC artifact. It all depends on your build and what stats to stack. In group play, if the party gets in trouble, I am usually the last to go down and most of the time I'm the one doing the tanking.
I can survive it just fine today. So why is my regen being taken away?
Harper Chronicles: Cap Snatchers (RELEASED) - NW-DPUTABC6X Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
Or do enough damage to kill it. Dead mobs do no damage to you.
Well, he's saying he does so much damage that they kill him instead of him killing them first, which seems weird in itself. He also does the most damage in his parties. I'm just confused at it all.
Artifact gear, artifacts, and enchantments get increased level cap. There are not many people (at all) who have i.e. lvl 9 or 10 enchantments, nor legendary artifact gear and artifacts. It is already tedious to add RP to the different things, but what really worries me is the way people would be able to farm RP in a good way. The RP from the Leadership Profession is tiny, not even worth collecting, as you mostly get rank 1 or 2 enchantments from the chests and barrels (maybe lvl 25 Leadership will give higher ranks?). Most people already know this, but if the level cap on the different things increases, without an improvement to how to get hold of RP (in a fun way, i.e. from T2 Dungeons), then I am afraid the gap between the elite players and the rest will become even bigger. Increasing the level cap on characters to lvl 70 will not help lessening this gap, as leveling to 70 only requires time (fun time too actually), but increasing the level of the artifacts, artifact gear, and enchantments is rather difficult. This will also bring issues to the PvP, if everything surrounding PvP stays the same (more or less, without major changes).
So, the question is: Will we see a great improvement to how one may get hold of Refinement Points? Maybe in a fun way too?
Thanks in advance!
I really hope so too. The whole refinement system, including but not limited to RP drops, needs to be re-evaluated and adjusted accordingly.
I can survive it just fine today. So why is my regen being taken away?
No one will know the underlying reason besides the development team. My speculation was that it was under utilized in PvE besides by GF's and they want GF's to need to use a healer as a crutch. I personally don't PvP but I have a feeling it plays a huge role in their 'tuning' of PvP as well.
Did you fight anyone that was an actual threat? I did all my mission as a cakewalk. I just held down Ray of frost and killed em all that way for fun. It really is ridiculously easy. Even for a cleric.
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
Did you fight anyone that was an actual threat? I did all my mission as a cakewalk. I just held down Ray of frost and killed em all that way for fun. It really is ridiculously easy. Even for a cleric.
I'm done trying to give you advice here. It's just overwhelming actual feedback.
No one will know the underlying reason besides the development team. My speculation was that it was under utilized in PvE besides by GF's and they want GF's to need to use a healer as a crutch. I personally don't PvP but I have a feeling it plays a huge role in their 'tuning' of PvP as well.
I hope that's not the case, because that would be a pretty lousy way to do it -- give the shaft to those few who actually *do* utilize regen the way it was intended in PvE just for the purpose of tuning PvP and making life harder for GF's (of which I am not one). I still maintain that the real answer is then to change the regen curves, maybe tweaked on a per-class basis.
Harper Chronicles: Cap Snatchers (RELEASED) - NW-DPUTABC6X Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
Never did I think I would NEED a damage nerf just to stay alive. Way to go Cryptic. Zeb. I'm not talking to you anymore. You are not at my level and as such can not seem to understand what it is like. I am done with this thread.
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beatannierMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 692Arc User
Do you understand how hard it is to lose threat when you do 10's to 100's of thousands of damage then require a teammate to do that much plus 10% in order to pull aggro
Even when I stop attacking all together. Another party member has to do %10 more damage then me to the same enemy in order to draw aggro from me(Why do I have to tell you this). By then I'm dead. It's easy to out DPS a cleric and pull the aggro from them (you). So again. You haven't experienced it so you don't know.
+1 at all.
I have never saw such behaviour to… stop fighting in the middle of fight because of… too high aggro.
Especially on CW who are supposed to control adds and make damage.
I`ve never had any issues of too much aggro, so it must be too low control instead.
No other option. And yeah, since you get aggro, it`s really hard to loose it.
Especially for CW.
Can`t imagine how low must be the control to have aggro issue and how low must be the damage to loose aggro.
And I hope I will never see it, especially in my party.
Final advice: If you have aggro issues as CW, you should really consider changing your playstyle or your build.
Best if you will find your own way to achieve it. Follow the tips, but always check them yourself.
Don`t trust anybody. Just rock!
zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
edited January 2015
I didn't mean "stop attacking forever," but rather cast or do something else for a second or two while the GF remarks or the GWF does a ton of DPS (for examples). I really didn't think that would be taken so literally as in stop doing anything productive to the battle. Those I usually play with have awesome DPS, so losing aggro for a second or two while I steal time, teleport, chug a pot, is not that much DPS loss in the grand scheme of things or hard to do.
Heck, I have the same issues with threat on Old Zeb that I got advice about on my build. Yet, I'm adjusting to overcome that.
I didn't mean "stop attacking forever," but rather cast or do something else for a second or two while the GF remarks or the GWF (for examples) does a ton of DPS. I really didn't think that would be taken so literally as in stop doing anything productive to the battle. Those I usually play with have awesome DPS, so losing aggro for a second or two while I steal time, teleport, chug a pot, is not that much DPS loss in the grand scheme of things or hard to do.
Heck, I have the same issues with threat on Old Zeb that I got advice about on my build. Yet, I'm adjusting to overcome that.
GWF and dps wut?where? u know that CW does way more dps than GWF with passive procs right?not talking abput SW tho lol
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
edited January 2015
They were examples, and no.. I know several GWFs that put most CW's dps to shame. I cannot fathom attaining their greatness, but keep trying and my GWFs just keep getting better. I just don't care that much for melee classes to invest that much into my GWFs.
Ever do the giant helmets quest in IWD and get jumped by the undead giant and/or the deathlock wight and all their buddies?
I don't mind getting jumped -- that *should* happen from time to time. I *do* mind having my survivability taken away for no good reason.
Fair enough, I'm not familiar with that exact scenario but surely such examples aren't so common that they would be considered representitive of solo play. Especially to the extent that it's going to make soloing with the new regen so problematic.
It's entirely up to you how you choose to build your character of course but as someone that plays predominantly solo with many characters having little or no regen I'm not seeing a problem. At least not yet as I got very little play in before preview went down.
Comments
They only work till the tank has one as well. now I have less DPS AND AGAIN all the aggro. I'm not just getting chased like a cleric. I'm getting beat down with little means to heal. Something you've obviously never experienced.
Try a soloing a heroic on a DPS character. Until then you won't understand.
I suggest to stop trying to be the "Top DPS" and instead focus on doing plenty of damage while managing your threat. If you're doing so much damage that you cannot handle the backlash, you need to tone it down and find a happy medium.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
If you unintentionally pull more mobs that you intended, that should kill you. I'm sorry but that's been a frustration to me that such things don't kill you in the current game.
or else just buff unstoppable recovery feat to heal 5/10/15/20/25% total hp over 10 seconds this way we can actualy stay alive while being able to use our class ability....
Let me remember not you invite you to the party.
Not what I mean. Go to IWD and go after the giants. Every once in a while, the undead will go on search-and-destroy and make a beeline for you even though they were nowhere near. They'll even do it when you're on the path by one of the beacons minding your own business. Do any of the HE's west of the path. It happens all the time.
Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO
Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF
Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP
The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
Seriously though, take my advice or not, but you really should look at why you're drawing so much threat and focus on that.
However, just cause I stop attacking doesn't mean it affects my dps that much, for threat is usually taken quite quickly and in those few seconds, I can do something like chug a pot, teleport, steal time, etc. I'm just not going to keep wailing on a group of mobs I aggro'd while the tank or someone else is trying to pull it off me. I'd rather not be a detriment to the party by pulling all the aggro and dying. I think losing 2-3 seconds of DPS in order to not be mobbed to death is a worthy sacrifice. Not only for myself, but the party as a whole.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
Do you understand how hard it is to lose threat when you do 10's to 100's of thousands of damage then require a teammate to do that much plus 10% in order to pull aggro
Even when I stop attacking all together. Another party member has to do %10 more damage then me to the same enemy in order to draw aggro from me(Why do I have to tell you this). By then I'm dead. It's easy to out DPS a cleric and pull the aggro from them (you). So again. You haven't experienced it so you don't know.
It adds a sense of danger in the zone, to get hit up by some roving bandits or undead in this case. If you can't survive it, then run away (live to fight another day).
My Combat HR can solo anything in IWD, without any real threat of dying, doing an ample amount of DPS and I don't stack regen. I have what comes with gear but everything else, I have lifesteal to a comfortable amount, endless consumption and incoming heal bonuses being a dragonborn. I'm wearing full corrupt black ice using a complete lathander set and DC artifact. It all depends on your build and what stats to stack. In group play, if the party gets in trouble, I am usually the last to go down and most of the time I'm the one doing the tanking.
Artifact gear, artifacts, and enchantments get increased level cap. There are not many people (at all) who have i.e. lvl 9 or 10 enchantments, nor legendary artifact gear and artifacts. It is already tedious to add RP to the different things, but what really worries me is the way people would be able to farm RP in a good way. The RP from the Leadership Profession is tiny, not even worth collecting, as you mostly get rank 1 or 2 enchantments from the chests and barrels (maybe lvl 25 Leadership will give higher ranks?). Most people already know this, but if the level cap on the different things increases, without an improvement to how to get hold of RP (in a fun way, i.e. from T2 Dungeons), then I am afraid the gap between the elite players and the rest will become even bigger. Increasing the level cap on characters to lvl 70 will not help lessening this gap, as leveling to 70 only requires time (fun time too actually), but increasing the level of the artifacts, artifact gear, and enchantments is rather difficult. This will also bring issues to the PvP, if everything surrounding PvP stays the same (more or less, without major changes).
So, the question is: Will we see a great improvement to how one may get hold of Refinement Points? Maybe in a fun way too?
Thanks in advance!
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
I guess I need defense stones in my offense slots
Or do enough damage to kill it. Dead mobs do no damage to you.
I can survive it just fine today. So why is my regen being taken away?
Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO
Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF
Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP
The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
No one will know the underlying reason besides the development team. My speculation was that it was under utilized in PvE besides by GF's and they want GF's to need to use a healer as a crutch. I personally don't PvP but I have a feeling it plays a huge role in their 'tuning' of PvP as well.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
I hope that's not the case, because that would be a pretty lousy way to do it -- give the shaft to those few who actually *do* utilize regen the way it was intended in PvE just for the purpose of tuning PvP and making life harder for GF's (of which I am not one). I still maintain that the real answer is then to change the regen curves, maybe tweaked on a per-class basis.
Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO
Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF
Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP
The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
My Foundry playthrough channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/Ruskaga/featured
+1 at all.
I have never saw such behaviour to… stop fighting in the middle of fight because of… too high aggro.
Especially on CW who are supposed to control adds and make damage.
I`ve never had any issues of too much aggro, so it must be too low control instead.
No other option. And yeah, since you get aggro, it`s really hard to loose it.
Especially for CW.
Can`t imagine how low must be the control to have aggro issue and how low must be the damage to loose aggro.
And I hope I will never see it, especially in my party.
Final advice: If you have aggro issues as CW, you should really consider changing your playstyle or your build.
Best if you will find your own way to achieve it. Follow the tips, but always check them yourself.
Don`t trust anybody. Just rock!
At least you got "Cornered by Crabs" :rolleyes:
I love the name of that HE, saw it pop up on the map but didn't get to play it since it was far off on the map in the new zone.
Heck, I have the same issues with threat on Old Zeb that I got advice about on my build. Yet, I'm adjusting to overcome that.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
GWF and dps wut?where? u know that CW does way more dps than GWF with passive procs right?not talking abput SW tho lol
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
Fair enough, I'm not familiar with that exact scenario but surely such examples aren't so common that they would be considered representitive of solo play. Especially to the extent that it's going to make soloing with the new regen so problematic.
It's entirely up to you how you choose to build your character of course but as someone that plays predominantly solo with many characters having little or no regen I'm not seeing a problem. At least not yet as I got very little play in before preview went down.