If some others would frequent the thread would like to chime in on this that would be great. That way the devs get the feedback from the community as a whole rather than 2 -4 players who prefer a specific idea.
Keep in mind I'm not asking for full movement speed, just enough to move out of the small AoEs from PvE mobs. not being able to out run another player while spamming it off.
Keep in mind I'm not asking for full movement speed, just enough to move out of the small AoEs from PvE mobs. not being able to out run another player while spamming it off.
IMO if you decide to start charging up an Aimed Shot while you're in range for something like an AoE, you deserve to get hurt because you're taking an ungodly amount of risk. You forget when comparing Reaping Strike to Aimed Shot that while a GWF needs to get into the face of the enemy to do this when he has absolutely no dodges, a Ranger can potentially do this kind of damage from 90 feet away (and can still cancel his animation with a dodge if he sees fit), certainly a big enough distance to avoid any AoE from most anything.
Additionally, I have not tested the numbers myself but from previous posters that have been talking about Aimed Shot in this thread, Vorpal enchantments at level 60 can net you damage numbers from 16-18k, even higher than a boosted Reaping Strike.
IMO if you decide to start charging up an Aimed Shot while you're in range for something like an AoE, you deserve to get hurt because you're taking an ungodly amount of risk. You forget when comparing Reaping Strike to Aimed Shot that while a GWF needs to get into the face of the enemy to do this when he has absolutely no dodges, a Ranger can potentially do this kind of damage from 90 feet away (and can still cancel his animation with a dodge if he sees fit), certainly a big enough distance to avoid any AoE from most anything.
Additionally, I have not tested the numbers myself but from previous posters that have been talking about Aimed Shot in this thread, Vorpal enchantments at level 60 can net you damage numbers from 16-18k, even higher than a boosted Reaping Strike.
100% agree with this. If you are in melee range and getting AoEd while trying to use Aimed shot you are doing it wrong. In order to get the maxium benefit from Rapid shot you are still going to need to stand still and hold your mouse button down. Sure you will get some damage straight away, but nowhere near the same amount as an Aimed Shot.
Here is the Damge from Aimed shot and Hawk shot reported from someone who had a Perfect Vorpal.
The hawkshot buff does nothing, i dont see any difference in dmg. It's not a % buff to ur next attack, it adds like 200dmg.
Hawk shot itself does like 8k noncrit and 17k-25k critical on max range, so around the same as aimed shot.
But for some reason Hawk shot isnt a single attack it hits twice at the same time for 10k-13k each.
[Combat (Self)] Critical Hit! Your Hawk Shot deals 11506 Physical to Target Dummy.
[Combat (Self)] Critical Hit! Your Hawk Shot deals 13772 Physical to Target Dummy.
[Combat (Self)] Your Hawkeye deals 220 Physical to Target Dummy.
So Hawkeye looks terrible, it's not even worth switching to melee to get the buff for 200dmg.
Also the buff does nothing when u cast aimed shot with it, it doesnt even procc.
Noncrits and crits on Hawk shot are kinda strange i get numbers like these:
[Combat (Self)] Your Hawk Shot deals 2939 Physical to Target Dummy.
[Combat (Self)] Your Hawk Shot deals 970 Physical to Target Dummy.
Again this is 1 hawkshot so 3909 dmg.
[Combat (Self)] Your Hawk Shot deals 3081 Physical to Target Dummy.
[Combat (Self)] Your Hawk Shot deals 4255 Physical to Target Dummy
This one is at the same range as befor but the numbers seem to change a lot, no clue why.
Hawk shot with Commanding shot:
[Combat (Self)] Critical Hit! Your Commanding Shot deals 3980 (3461) Physical to Target Dummy.
[Combat (Self)] Critical Hit! Your Hawk Shot deals 14241 (12383) Physical to Target Dummy.
[Combat (Self)] Critical Hit! Your Hawk Shot deals 13981 (12157) Physical to Target Dummy.
After re-reading that I realise that it doesnt really state the damage for Just Aimed shot. But thats Damage on Hawk shot which has a lower Base and maximium damage than Aimed Shot.
Desidus@Xtraordinary91
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
How are you finding the cooldown reduction capability of this? Is it a large noticible difference? What is your crit chance?
I have about 37-38% crit chance, but my gear is no where near optimal. I also have the +5% stacking crit chance feat (Correcting Aim?) which helps a lot, I also have Master of Archery which also helps out with the crits. My recovery is (to put it mildly) pathetic. But I can frequently get 15 second powers to recharge in about 5 seconds.
Assume I start off with 3 rapid shots. The first hits normally, the second shot now has about a 43% chance to crit and it does (-1 sec to cooldowns), next shot is auto crit (-1 sec to cooldowns). Then I stance switch and charge in with Marauder's Charge, which also reduces my cooldowns (- 1 second), follow up with Constricting Strike (-1 second) and Fox Strike (-1 second), stance switch and Marauder Escape, Disruptive Shot (-3 seconds to cooldowns). For a total of -8 seconds. If I crit with any of the attacks (other than the 2 I already figured in) then my cooldowns are even shorter.
Since hitting 60 it has been a very rare time that I did not have a power ready to fire when I needed it, and spamming Fox dodge is a great defensive tool to have up all the time.
Another thing to think about: I also have the powers (Aspect of Serpent, +15% damage to melee after ranged use and +3% after stance switch) that boost my damage every time I stance switch, none of them are that huge when looked at alone, but when stacked together they make a difference.
I have about 37-38% crit chance, but my gear is no where near optimal. I also have the +5% stacking crit chance feat (Correcting Aim?) which helps a lot, I also have Master of Archery which also helps out with the crits. My recovery is (to put it mildly) pathetic. But I can frequently get 15 second powers to recharge in about 5 seconds.
Assume I start off with 3 rapid shots. The first hits normally, the second shot now has about a 43% chance to crit and it does (-1 sec to cooldowns), next shot is auto crit (-1 sec to cooldowns). Then I stance switch and charge in with Marauder's Charge, which also reduces my cooldowns (- 1 second), follow up with Constricting Strike (-1 second) and Fox Strike (-1 second), stance switch and Marauder Escape, Disruptive Shot (-3 seconds to cooldowns). For a total of -8 seconds. If I crit with any of the attacks (other than the 2 I already figured in) then my cooldowns are even shorter.
Since hitting 60 it has been a very rare time that I did not have a power ready to fire when I needed it, and spamming Fox dodge is a great defensive tool to have up all the time.
Another thing to think about: I also have the powers (Aspect of Serpent, +15% damage to melee after ranged use and +3% after stance switch) that boost my damage every time I stance switch, none of them are that huge when looked at alone, but when stacked together they make a difference.
How are you pushing so high on your crit chance? What race are you rolling with? My theory crafting so far has pushed me to 36% but that extra 2% would make a difference.
There is alot of synergy available in the ranged tree and I look forward to exploring more options when / if my HR hits 60 on test / When the patch goes live.
Two things though: Aspect of the serpent. I thought from reading it, that everytime you use a ranged attack you gain a buff (Stacks 5 times) that increase damage by 3% per stack (when in ranged buffs melee, when in melee buffs range)- However, the difference being in order to gain the benefit for the ranged you then need to use 10 Melee attacks (5 to remove the stacks and then 5 to add the stacks for ranged). Honestly I think Stormstep Action and Path of the Eagle(? The increasing range passive - memory is hazy whilst I am at work) are better. Stormstep becomes more attractive if you use Disruptive shot a bucketload. Thereby allowing you to place those points you specced into the melee tree to go into Nature to pick up the run speed buff and strong grasping on Hawkeye for pvp.
Desidus@Xtraordinary91
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
IMO if you decide to start charging up an Aimed Shot while you're in range for something like an AoE, you deserve to get hurt because you're taking an ungodly amount of risk.
Ok so I start charging Aimed Shot, I'm out of range, the mob moves and plops an AoE on me because of the actions of my pet or another player. Oh well, guess I'm an idiot for trying to use my at-will. Wait that's the situation that is the problem.
However the bigger problem is actually the melee version of the power, which also has a casting time and is interrupted by damage. I can handle the ranged version having the flaws it does; use it 1x as a big opener, then if you stay at range blast with another at-will. However when you enter melee (either on purpose or because the mobs are fast moving) loosing an at-will melee attack because it has a long casting time and is interrupted by damage is a much, much bigger issue and that's not even starting on its completly inaccurate damage.
Feedback: Play Up To Level 30 It is hard to judge this entirely accurately as the more I play NWO the better at it I get, so my success rate is increasing. However I am becoming concerned now that I've played through the 20's that the HR is too strong in many regards. With the HR I can generate the same impact from an at-will (killing an entire weak mob) that takes a Tabbed Encounter or Divine Encounter from a DC or CW. I'm a long way from a "top player" yet I typically go through several encounters only using 1 pot or I have completed quest boss encounters with 0 damage.
At level 30 I'm looking at;
Power 724
Crit 151
ArP 362 (-3.7% DR)
Recovery 155
Defense 457
Deflect 395
Regen 200
Life Steal 0
Movement 210 (all from Artifact)
Attack 1392
Crit Chance 16.8% Severity 75%
Recharge +3.2%
AP Gain 1.2%
Protection 1232
DR 16.5%
Deflection 13.8% Severity 50%
I'm running (all 3/3);
Passive: Aspect of the Lone Wolf and Aspect of the Pack
At-Will: Rapid Shot and Split Shot
Encounter: Thorn Ward, Constricting Arrow, Hindering Shot (mostly for the melee to hold targets while I move back to range)
Daily: Seismic Shot (barely ever used might retrain to Forest Meditation just for the extra healing) and Forest Walk
Now its time to start killing stuff in Helms Hold seriously.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
As a point of reference here's the Hunter Ranger's ranged powers:
At-Wills:
(01)-Rapid Strike-"Fire a flurry of arrows at your Enemy."
(02)-Split Shot-"Shoot a spray of arrows at your enemy, dealing more damage the longer you focus."
(20)-Aimed Strike-"Take precise aim, firing an incredibly deadly shot into your enemy."
(35)-Electric Shot-(P)-"Fire a storm imbued arrow at your target, causing a deadly gust of damage around them."
Encounters:
(03)-Marauder's Escape-"Dash back 50' escaping your enemies."
(05)-Hindering Shot-"Fire two arrows into your enemy's shins, applying Weak Graspin Roots."
(05)-Rain of Arrows-"Fire several arrows into the air, which rain down on ememies in a small area."
(15)-Thorn Ward-"Summon a thorn ward to attack your enemies. Each attack reduces your enemy's defenses by a slight amount."
(20)-Constricting Arrow-"Fire an arrow at your opponent, causing vines to constrict around them every few seconds."
(30)-Boar Hide-"Channeling the thick skin of a boar, grant yourself and one nearby ally, 5 stacks of 2% mitigation. Every attack against you removes one stack."
(30)-Split the Sky-(P)-"Lacerate the sky, opening a storm in a large area. Enemies who attack you or your allies in this area will be struck, dealing damage and snaring them."
(35)-Hawk Shot-"Fire an arrow at your enemy, dealing extra damage based on their distance from you."
(45)-Binding Arrow-"Fire an arrow at your opponent binding them with a strong Grasping Roots. If a foe is behind them, the vines will bind them as well."
(45)-Commanding Shot-"With the powerful buggle of the Stag, your shot lowers your enemy's defenses and damage for a short time."
(50)-Fox's Cunning-"With the precise time of the Fox, you and one nearby ally dodge the next incoming attack."
Dailies:
(04)-Seismic Shot-"Fire a concussive blast into the ground, causing a shockwave that pulls enemies in and damages them."
(10)-Forest Ghost-"Slip into the forest where you remain unseen for a short duration. While hidden, you automatically strike each enemy you come across. (Foes will not be attacked more than once.)"
(10)-Forest Meditation-"Become one with the forest, regenerating hit points for several seconds."
(40)-Disruptive Shot-"Quickly fire an arrow at your target's head, dealing damage and interrupting them."
(50)-Cold Steel Hurricane-(P)-"Call forth a mighty electrical storm in front of you, damaging foes that come in contact with it."
Class Features:
(04)-Aspect of the Falcon-"Increase the range of your ranged powers by 3'."
(15)-Aspect of the Lone Wolf-"Gain 25% bonus mitigation while no ememies are within 25' of you. Each enemy within 25' reduces the mitigation bonus by 5%. Minimum bonus is 0%."
(15)-Aspect of the Pack-"If you are within 10' of an ally, you and your ally gain Combat Advantage."
(20)-Aspect of the Serpent-"Add a stacking buff on every hit which increases your damage. (Buffs from ranged affect melee, and visa versa. Only one type in affect at a time)
(30)-Blade Storm-(P)-"When dealing melee damage, gain a 25% chance to deal an additional 5% of your attack's damage in an area around you."
(40)-Stormstep Action-(P)-"When activating a Daily power, reduce the cooldown on all of your Encounters by 1 second."
(50)-Twin-Blade Storm-(P)-"Any time you hit more than 2 enemies, deal an extra 4% damage."
(##) = level it's available at.
(P) = paragon power.
Melee isn't my forte, so, I didn't include the melee versions.
(Please excuse any typos I missed.)
Go for the eyes, Boo!GO FOR THE EYES!!! (Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
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werealchemistMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
IMO if you decide to start charging up an Aimed Shot while you're in range for something like an AoE, you deserve to get hurt because you're taking an ungodly amount of risk. You forget when comparing Reaping Strike to Aimed Shot that while a GWF needs to get into the face of the enemy to do this when he has absolutely no dodges, a Ranger can potentially do this kind of damage from 90 feet away (and can still cancel his animation with a dodge if he sees fit), certainly a big enough distance to avoid any AoE from most anything.
So what you're saying is that if a person is stupid enough to have this slotted they deserve to be handicapped to having 1 usable At-will ability for the rest of the encounter because it can only be used once per fight? I don't know if you noticed but once you engage any enemy they move themselves into attacking range.
It's called SKILL. And as I have said it before, I will say it again. This is an advanced class and takes skill to play. Skilled players will be able to get more than one shot off, if they do things right.
So what you're saying is that if a person is stupid enough to have this slotted they deserve to be handicapped to having 1 usable At-will ability for the rest of the encounter because it can only be used once per fight? I don't know if you noticed but once you engage any enemy they move themselves into attacking range.
I think the vast majority of the PvE HRs are more concerned with the Viability of the At-will in epic level dungeons. Where you need to deal with Heightened red circles. However, depending on the role you will be playing - If your taking down Adds, Thorn Ward, Split the sky and spamming Split shot would serve better. If your on Boss Dps, then Slotting Hawk Shot, Split the Sky and Commanding Shot would be better.
Then it just depends if you have the time to shoot off an Aimed shot, or sit there and plink away with Rapid shot. Its either or for our at wills. Rapid shot just gives you some damage straight away, compared to a timed delay burst.
@warzog: Thanks for that layout. That will assist anyone who does not know what skills are fully ranged.
@Rhoric: Regardless of how Cryptic designed the class, anyone who picks it up should be able to garner some enjoyment from it. It is not so much about the entire class requiring skill but more that a skilled play may find it possible to squeeze alot more out of the class than someone who may not necessarily be as skilled.
Desidus@Xtraordinary91
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
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werealchemistMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited November 2013
Don't get me wrong, I won't be upset if they don't change it, I just wont use it.
After all this is a feedback thread and this is just my opinion, At-will abilities should not really be quite this conditional. Yes all at wills are semi-conditional but those conditions are based on skill where as Aimed Shot simply can not be used if
A) there is any ranged enemy in the group targeting you any enemy can sprint (E.G. berzerkers)
C) you randomly get aggro while in a party
D) you are close enough to melee range that anything may feasibly make it to you before you finish casting
E) are you going to be interrupted by a poison tick
F) you are in ANY danger of possibly being in an area that may get targeted by an AoE
There is (to my knowledge) no other At-Will ability that can ever NOT be used.
I haven't tested this yet but with Aimed shot. How about this for a rotation.
Aimed shot => Marauder's Escape => Aimed shot.
As when using Marauder's escape the mobs lose track of you allowing you to set up again. Maybe even throwing in a Hindering shot.
This is for PvE as I don't PvP.
That was how i was trying to use it Aimed Shot > Constricting Arrow > Marauders Escape > Aimed Shot
I also tried several other combinations but it's not enough against Nothic brutes and plague gazers unless they get a mass grasping roots ability from a range this ability is not usable if there is more than 2 ranged or fast moving enemy's in a group.
(perhaps unless you can line up binding arrow just right.)
I am working on a full critique for my melee build, but let me chime in on aimed shot since the discussion is ongoing.
I find it a great skill. To me the problem is neither cast time nor interrupt, but the fact that we only have 2 at-will slots. Using aimed shot would either remove aoe at-wills or a reliable single target one. I would love to have it on my bar, but cannot afford to give up a slot for it given its use is highly situational. A very simple yet different solution would be to allow it to be slotted in an encounter slot. I would gladly give up an encounter to have access to this at-will.
Also, to clarify since there seems to be some confusion. Aimed Strike (melee) is not interruptible by damage. It is, however, purely a bleed effect with no upfront damage. Since it does not stack, it cannot be used to replace a single target melee at-will. Being a melee build I would love to be able to use this with rapid strike to boost single target dps, but again, I cannot afford to lose my aoe at-will to do so.
Good thing this is on preview. It gives time to come up with a rotation that works. In other MMOs it is also thru trial and error when setting up a new class by players.
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werealchemistMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I would love to have it on my bar, but cannot afford to give up a slot for it given its use is highly situational.
This is exactly why I am pushing for a change. I don't believe anybody would honestly choose the highly conditional single target Aimed Shot over the AoE Split Shot or the Reliable Rapid Shot.
It seems like it needs to do something that makes people want to use it. other wise it feels like one of those abilities that's just there to fluff the ability tree.
Split the sky: Essentially a Pbaoe - Targetted are, Around the same size as a Singularity pull area. Any opponent who attacks you or an ally gets jolted by the storm. Deals around 200 damage or so, but also applies a snare effect.
Throw Caution: I don't have any actual % numbers here and someone who is mathematically inclined should probably do some testing in regards to this one. But it does increase your Damage on the next attack by a noticable amount.
Hey, Des. Much thanks! Been wondering about these skills for quite some time now. Throw Caution seems nice but based on what I've been reading about Split the Sky it seems pretty sub-par. Unless the snare's effects are pretty significant. But I can never say for sure until I get to test it myself.
By the way, has anyone tested if the range of Marauder's Escape is affected by the Class Feature, Aspect of the Falcon? Marauder's Escape is technically a ranged skill, so it'd be awesome if it were the case.
Hey, Des. Much thanks! Been wondering about these skills for quite some time now. Throw Caution seems nice but based on what I've been reading about Split the Sky it seems pretty sub-par. Unless the snare's effects are pretty significant. But I can never say for sure until I get to test it myself.
By the way, has anyone tested if the range of Marauder's Escape is affected by the Class Feature, Aspect of the Falcon? Marauder's Escape is technically a ranged skill, so it'd be awesome if it were the case.
Hey man,
No stress! Split the sky is really nice! Combine it with Thorn Ward and Rain of Arrows and mobs will just drop. Even Split the Sky and Thorn ward and you can stack some nice AoE damage.
I will jump in test Throw Caution for you with Aspect of the falcon. However, the way the passive is worded leads me to believe that it just increases the maximum range. Marauders Escape states it just throws you back 50 feet. I don't think it would increase it.
An interesting fact though, the melee version of Marauders Escape has quite a long range. Not sure on the exact feet, but it is definitely over half our range. Opens up a whole bucketload of possibilities.
Just tested and it definitely does not affect the distance you travel with Marauders Escape.
Desidus@Xtraordinary91
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
No stress! Split the sky is really nice! Combine it with Thorn Ward and Rain of Arrows and mobs will just drop. Even Split the Sky and Thorn ward and you can stack some nice AoE damage.
I will jump in test Throw Caution for you with Aspect of the falcon. However, the way the passive is worded leads me to believe that it just increases the maximum range. Marauders Escape states it just throws you back 50 feet. I don't think it would increase it.
An interesting fact though, the melee version of Marauders Escape has quite a long range. Not sure on the exact feet, but it is definitely over half our range. Opens up a whole bucketload of possibilities.
Just tested and it definitely does not affect the distance you travel with Marauders Escape.
Ah, I though as much. Would be too good if Aspect of the Falcon affected the range of Marauder's Escape but if the devs are reading our posts, maybe it'll be a good addition to the mechanic of this encounter power. And I'd love to hear results of any further testing, Des. Will check this thread much more often now.
So far I've been theorycrafting myself and came up with various HR builds. 2 for Archery, 1 for Combat, and 2 for Nature. Not sure which ones will be effective, since I don't have a 60 HR with me on the test shard due to the sheer unplayability of the low level areas. But if anyone's interested in testing, I would be more than happy to post some ideas in here just in case people wish to see which can be efficient and which ones should be thrown down the bin. This way we'd have a better grasp of how the HR will size up with the current archetypes and its roles. HR has more utility than DPS it seems, and it's currently unlike any of the other archetypes we have right now. It'll be interesting to observe how people will incorporate the ambiguity of HR's.
One thing's for sure, a lot of people will be spec-ing for Archery. Melee seems pretty nice for PVE in terms of clearing mobs though.
And just to chime in a bit for the topic of Aimed Shot being buffed, I don't think that'll be wise. I agree with the people who have been saying that it's fine the way it is. Given how the Archery Paragon Feat Path is modeled, it's not that hard to imagine how easily this'll break PVP if any more changes come to this skill. I'm pretty sure we'll be seeing people slotting this skill in PVP because it's relatively easy to find the opportunity to pull one shot of these things off with a range of 93'. Much more so since the Archery path ensures us that we will hit crits a lot. So it'll be easy to set up a critical and buffed Aimed Shots that can take down squishies with the use of Perfect Vorpal.
Ah, I though as much. Would be too good if Aspect of the Falcon affected the range of Marauder's Escape but if the devs are reading our posts, maybe it'll be a good addition to the mechanic of this encounter power. And I'd love to hear results of any further testing, Des. Will check this thread much more often now.
So far I've been theorycrafting myself and came up with various HR builds. 2 for Archery, 1 for Combat, and 2 for Nature. Not sure which ones will be effective, since I don't have a 60 HR with me on the test shard due to the sheer unplayability of the low level areas. But if anyone's interested in testing, I would be more than happy to post some ideas in here just in case people wish to see which can be efficient and which ones should be thrown down the bin. This way we'd have a better grasp of how the HR will size up with the current archetypes and its roles. HR has more utility than DPS it seems, and it's currently unlike any of the other archetypes we have right now. It'll be interesting to observe how people will incorporate the ambiguity of HR's.
One thing's for sure, a lot of people will be spec-ing for Archery. Melee seems pretty nice for PVE in terms of clearing mobs though.
And just to chime in a bit for the topic of Aimed Shot being buffed, I don't think that'll be wise. I agree with the people who have been saying that it's fine the way it is. Given how the Archery Paragon Feat Path is modeled, it's not that hard to imagine how easily this'll break PVP if any more changes come to this skill. I'm pretty sure we'll be seeing people slotting this skill in PVP because it's relatively easy to find the opportunity to pull one shot of these things off with a range of 93'. Much more so since the Archery path ensures us that we will hit crits a lot. So it'll be easy to set up a critical and buffed Aimed Shots that can take down squishies with the use of Perfect Vorpal.
No stress man. I am happy to test things as needed. However my Test HR is still only level 36. Running into some Net issues atm, hence why I am posting and playing from my #g phone connection (In Australia. Im fearing my next bill ).
You are not far wrong in regards to the utility. I think that HR's will definitely have a place in PvE groups due to the sheer amount of utility they can bring to the group.
I agree with you on the PvP perspective of Aimed Shot. And I have a few ideas inregards to firing this off more effectively, Especially from a 1v1 point of view. I will let on a quick hit. Marauders Rush, Boar Charge, Marauders Escape. Aimed Shot. - Boar charge is similar to the GF charge and knockback, in the sense that it knocks someone prone and back. Combine that with Marauders Escape and Aimed Shot. You should be able to get in at least one before they get into melee range / Dagger throwing range if a Rogue. You saw it here first. Also, Lets not forget the additional 10% critical severity available in the Archery Tree as well as the added scaling bonus damage % depending on the distance the target is available. People are going to need to learn that running away from a Ranger is a very very bad idea.
Edit @ Banelorne, would love to jump on test with you at some stage and have a chat through vent / Ts after details go live and we both have level 60 Rangers to discuss a few ideas. I have my Gear layout and spec pretty much set in stone for my PvP toon, but will be rolling a few more rangers to play around with other different specs.
FEEDBACK: Hawkeye The buff that your party gains is very underwhelming. At level 60 being reported as only adding 200 damage to the next attack. IMO you can keep it in this function, but buff the damage slightly, and make it last for a period of time, or alternatively, give it a flat % increase for the next attack.
Desidus@Xtraordinary91
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
I think you should re-read both tooltips. Hawkeye adds a buff to you and your party members adding damage on the next attack. This is a Proc based damage. I.e Adds 50 damage to the next attack.
Throw Caution adds a Flat % increase in damage. As I stated I am not mathematically inclined or skilled. So someone with those skills, should do some testing and come out with the % that Throw Caution increases our damage by.
Hawkeye: With the precision of a hawk ... deal bonus damage to the next attack.
Throw Caution: Risk lowering defense ... increased damage for a short period.
And as it is now, Hawkeye doesn't do much at all. Throw Caution does approximately 10-20% more dmg for 8-10-ish seconds (without Warden's Courage).
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indolo238Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 51
edited November 2013
My HR is level 44 so far.
Feedback: Powers: Aimed Shot I like the current aimed shot. I use it multiple times per fight against tougher enemies. Open with aimed shot and hindering shot on a big baddie, split shot down adds, maybe a thorn ward in there somewhere, marauder's rush, hindering strike, maurauder's escape, aimed shot. The strong grasping from hindering strike gives you time to do another aimed shot. I can't use it whenever I want, but it's not hard to control a fight to be able to get some use from it besides being an opener. Generally it's an opener and then later a finisher for me.
Haven't been able to do any group content, but I still find it useful doing bosses in the quest instances. Marauder's Escape and the dodges seem to have a stealth component that lets the enemies lose me frequently and turn on my companion, so it seems the same would hold true in group content, but that's just guessing. Having done dungeons on my other characters, I can see opportunity to use aimed shot in group content, potentially lots more opportunity if others are in party to draw aggro.
If they don't intend grasping roots to work on CC immune enemies, that'll make it less useful against them, but an ability doesn't have to be useful all the time.
Feedback: Powers: Aimed Strike I like dropping an aimed strike on enemies before rushing back out. I haven't had it interrupted by damage, meaning I've taken damage while in animation and still landed the hit. Maybe there's a bug with a certain rank of it since I'm using rank 3?
I leveled a Combat ranger (melee) to 60 and have been testing it since. These are my thoughts on a melee ranger; keeping in mind I understand even a melee ranger should make constant use of ranged abilities. I will make a couple of general points and then address individual skills.
The number one problem is survivability. Our defenses are minimal, and it is very hard to consistently put out damage when our life goes down so quickly. Even with 2 strong defensive feats, a defensive feature, and constant shifting a group of 6 trash adds will take our life down in no time. In a red area fest, forget about it. There is much less trouble with a single opponent.
The second issue is damage. On those few occasions where I can measure it over more than 3 or 4 swipes, it is decent, but still too low given I have 30 points in the melee tree. As is, I probably do 20% more damage than my unfeated ranged attacks. Given I have to be close, it is not nearly enough of a payoff.
Feedback: Powers: Split Shot I hate to say this, but this power might do a little too much damage for a ranged aoe at-will. As a full melee spec, this ranged at-will still outdamages my melee aoe at-wills.
Feedback: Powers: Marauder’s Rush I find the damage a little underwhelming considering the long cooldown on the skill. At 3500 power, it lists ~1700-1900 for me.
Bug: Powers: Rain of Swords This skill is currently delivering around half the listed damage. At this damage output I get more damage from 2 Split Strikes and in the same amount of time.
Feedback: Powers: Aimed Strike I really like this skill but it cannot replace Rapid Strike. Any chance we’d be allowed to slot it in an encounter slot? I think it complements the ranger’s limited single target melee dps very well. The class sorely need single target melee damage options, and a bleed would be perfect.
Feedback: Features: Aspect of the Lone Wolf I relied heavily on this with my melee build. Unfortunately it seems to favor ranged play. The melee ranger has vastly more problems with multiple opponents than single opponents, yet this feature becomes null when meleeing multiple opponents.
Feedback: Powers: Boar Hide I used this and Boar Charge extensively while leveling. Perhaps due to my vulnerability I wished it would function more effectively to protect me, however as a party buff it is quite effective. It does not expire until you are hit, and that is wonderful.
Feedback: Powers: Split the Sky This is an ability that greatly complements the melee ranger. I wish it’s feated version could be more accessible to melee builds. Because the melee feats are so powerful to make the class melee viable, one cannot really afford more than 5 points outside the tree, and even that at a loss of run speed.
Feedback: Powers: Electric Shot and Clear the Ground This would be my aoe at-will if the damage was not so very much lower than Split Shot and Strike. It is easier to use, but it needs at least 85-90% of the damage of Split Shot and Strike to be an acceptable exchange.
Bug: Features: Twin-Blade Storm This feat currently removes all of the powers’ inherent damage, leaving just the added 12% from the feature.
Feedback: Feats: Nature’s Enhancement This feat ends up benefitting ranged builds more than melee builds, since ranged builds minimize the time they spend in melee. This is a sorely needed enhancement for a melee build, but the 5 second duration is a killer. I am not even sure I understand the reason for it to have a duration at all, except perhaps to promote stance switching. To select the feat one has to forego either deflect chance or power damage, a hefty price. Ranged builds will switch out of melee ASAP anyways, and melee builds are forced to switch out of melee…
How are you pushing so high on your crit chance? What race are you rolling with? My theory crafting so far has pushed me to 36% but that extra 2% would make a difference.
There is alot of synergy available in the ranged tree and I look forward to exploring more options when / if my HR hits 60 on test / When the patch goes live.
Two things though: Aspect of the serpent. I thought from reading it, that everytime you use a ranged attack you gain a buff (Stacks 5 times) that increase damage by 3% per stack (when in ranged buffs melee, when in melee buffs range)- However, the difference being in order to gain the benefit for the ranged you then need to use 10 Melee attacks (5 to remove the stacks and then 5 to add the stacks for ranged). Honestly I think Stormstep Action and Path of the Eagle(? The increasing range passive - memory is hazy whilst I am at work) are better. Stormstep becomes more attractive if you use Disruptive shot a bucketload. Thereby allowing you to place those points you specced into the melee tree to go into Nature to pick up the run speed buff and strong grasping on Hawkeye for pvp.
I rolled a Moon Ef HR, but when we go to live I will be rolling a Human, the 3 extra Heroic Feats will make a big difference for me.
I transferred over quite a few items to test, including 2 Pyro rings, lots of Azure enchants (upgraded to rank 9s on test), a nice necklace (power+crit+AP, dont remember the name right now) and a blue belt with +243 crit. Also have a Ioun Stone with lots of +crit slotted. But I do not have any gear from the epic dungeons (yet) as it has been too difficult to get a group to run them.
Aspect of the Serpent is not dependent on the number of ATTACKS that you use, it is the number of MOBS THAT YOU HIT. 1 good split shot can give you the 5 melee buff points, then charge in and use an AOE like Steel Breeze (Constricting shot melee version) and a couple regular melee attacks and you have 5 ranged buffs, assuming you were attacking a group.
The range distance buff is also quite good, I just prefer the buff to my damage since I enjoy the rapid stance switching that I am doing. I will often switch stances to fire off 1 power then switch back to continue my assault, whether ranged or melee. I love that many of the powers are a buff in one stance and an attack in another.
While it may not be the "best" build available, I find that it works better for me than any of the others that I have tried. However, the HR is the one class that (IMO) is heavily dependent on the way you want to play it as opposed to the "flavor of the month build" That many other classes have. I can easily see a full ranged build being superior in some situations, and I would not be surprised to see a primary melee build excell in some missions as well. My build is an attempt to "Have my cake and eat it too", a balanced build that makes the best use of both melee and ranged in conjunction rahter than focusing more heavily on one stance.
The gear and feats seem to be pushing rangers to high deflect builds. I know the TR has good success with about 25 damage reduction and around 40 deflect with regen and life steal this makes them pretty tough.
The feat that gives 25 deflect severity when switching to melee for a few seconds. I think this should just be a straight buff to deflect severity. TRs have 75 its not game breaking.
Also the hunters dodge is 8 feet. It should be 10 feet. Currently the dodge doesnt get you out of red circles or out of the reach of most players abilities. 10 feet would take you just out of range. You have to dodge twice to get clear currently, kinda defeats the purpose.
No stress man. I am happy to test things as needed. However my Test HR is still only level 36. Running into some Net issues atm, hence why I am posting and playing from my #g phone connection (In Australia. Im fearing my next bill ).
You are not far wrong in regards to the utility. I think that HR's will definitely have a place in PvE groups due to the sheer amount of utility they can bring to the group.
I agree with you on the PvP perspective of Aimed Shot. And I have a few ideas inregards to firing this off more effectively, Especially from a 1v1 point of view. I will let on a quick hit. Marauders Rush, Boar Charge, Marauders Escape. Aimed Shot. - Boar charge is similar to the GF charge and knockback, in the sense that it knocks someone prone and back. Combine that with Marauders Escape and Aimed Shot. You should be able to get in at least one before they get into melee range / Dagger throwing range if a Rogue. You saw it here first. Also, Lets not forget the additional 10% critical severity available in the Archery Tree as well as the added scaling bonus damage % depending on the distance the target is available. People are going to need to learn that running away from a Ranger is a very very bad idea.
Edit @ Banelorne, would love to jump on test with you at some stage and have a chat through vent / Ts after details go live and we both have level 60 Rangers to discuss a few ideas. I have my Gear layout and spec pretty much set in stone for my PvP toon, but will be rolling a few more rangers to play around with other different specs.
FEEDBACK: Hawkeye The buff that your party gains is very underwhelming. At level 60 being reported as only adding 200 damage to the next attack. IMO you can keep it in this function, but buff the damage slightly, and make it last for a period of time, or alternatively, give it a flat % increase for the next attack.
That net issue is tough indeed. At the very least it's great that you're still able to test from time to time. And I agree, perhaps we'll see people asking for Nature-based rangers in the LFG channels. It's a solid tree for party setups. Archery has decent DPS for both single target and AoE so far too so they will get a spot in parties for sure. Not yet sure about melee, though. Hopefully things can still change even after the HR goes live.
And I love that HR rotation! Maybe you could weave in Binding Arrow or Constricting after using the last Aimed Shot to be able to fire another Aimed Shot. It incorporates good melee and ranged in one setup which will make it versatile no matter what situation your HR is pitted against The ranged build I had in mind was a Hunter Ranger based on pure ranged attacks when it comes to DPS, firing off CC while maintaining range with Marauder's Escape and Dodge just in case people get to close. The plan is to have 33% RSI (INT + Recovery) to take down the CD of Marauder's Escape to 12 seconds flat, and taking Prime Critical + Master of Archery to turn Rapid Shot into something that rapidly reduces CD for Encounters. The other Encounters I'm planning for this type of build is Binding Arrow and Constricting Arrow with CD's of 16.6 and 13.6 respectively. And to help further reduce the CD's of the encounters to be able to fire them off faster, I'm also opting to take Stormstep Action in combination with Disruptive Shot. Fits perfectly with this type of build.
And I'd be more than happy to test with you once the HR goes live, Des! I'll need to find a decent headset before that happens though. But I'm down for more build testing for sure.
That net issue is tough indeed. At the very least it's great that you're still able to test from time to time. And I agree, perhaps we'll see people asking for Nature-based rangers in the LFG channels. It's a solid tree for party setups. Archery has decent DPS for both single target and AoE so far too so they will get a spot in parties for sure. Not yet sure about melee, though. Hopefully things can still change even after the HR goes live.
And I love that HR rotation! Maybe you could weave in Binding Arrow or Constricting after using the last Aimed Shot to be able to fire another Aimed Shot. It incorporates good melee and ranged in one setup which will make it versatile no matter what situation your HR is pitted against The ranged build I had in mind was a Hunter Ranger based on pure ranged attacks when it comes to DPS, firing off CC while maintaining range with Marauder's Escape and Dodge just in case people get to close. The plan is to have 33% RSI (INT + Recovery) to take down the CD of Marauder's Escape to 12 seconds flat, and taking Prime Critical + Master of Archery to turn Rapid Shot into something that rapidly reduces CD for Encounters. The other Encounters I'm planning for this type of build is Binding Arrow and Constricting Arrow with CD's of 16.6 and 13.6 respectively. And to help further reduce the CD's of the encounters to be able to fire them off faster, I'm also opting to take Stormstep Action in combination with Disruptive Shot. Fits perfectly with this type of build.
And I'd be more than happy to test with you once the HR goes live, Des! I'll need to find a decent headset before that happens though. But I'm down for more build testing for sure.
Count me in for any additional testing as well. Either on Test or the Live server. Might be interesting to see the results of our similar, but still different set ups in a group.
The gear and feats seem to be pushing rangers to high deflect builds. I know the TR has good success with about 25 damage reduction and around 40 deflect with regen and life steal this makes them pretty tough.
The feat that gives 25 deflect severity when switching to melee for a few seconds. I think this should just be a straight buff to deflect severity. TRs have 75 its not game breaking.
Also the hunters dodge is 8 feet. It should be 10 feet. Currently the dodge doesnt get you out of red circles or out of the reach of most players abilities. 10 feet would take you just out of range. You have to dodge twice to get clear currently, kinda defeats the purpose.
The HR dodge is less than others. They made it that way on purpose. You are able to dodge more with the short distance dodge compared to other classes that can dodge like that.
Comments
I realize I've already put in my 2 cents but I believe that Making it have movement like Reaping Strike would be on par.
Refer to this video of a single Reaping Strike doing 15,590 or This one of a Reaping Strike (hit alone) doing 13k to several targets at once (+ bleed damage) so the damage isn't that far off (aside from the fact that Reaping Strike has the ability to do this to several targets at once).
Keep in mind I'm not asking for full movement speed, just enough to move out of the small AoEs from PvE mobs. not being able to out run another player while spamming it off.
IMO if you decide to start charging up an Aimed Shot while you're in range for something like an AoE, you deserve to get hurt because you're taking an ungodly amount of risk. You forget when comparing Reaping Strike to Aimed Shot that while a GWF needs to get into the face of the enemy to do this when he has absolutely no dodges, a Ranger can potentially do this kind of damage from 90 feet away (and can still cancel his animation with a dodge if he sees fit), certainly a big enough distance to avoid any AoE from most anything.
Additionally, I have not tested the numbers myself but from previous posters that have been talking about Aimed Shot in this thread, Vorpal enchantments at level 60 can net you damage numbers from 16-18k, even higher than a boosted Reaping Strike.
100% agree with this. If you are in melee range and getting AoEd while trying to use Aimed shot you are doing it wrong. In order to get the maxium benefit from Rapid shot you are still going to need to stand still and hold your mouse button down. Sure you will get some damage straight away, but nowhere near the same amount as an Aimed Shot.
Here is the Damge from Aimed shot and Hawk shot reported from someone who had a Perfect Vorpal.
After re-reading that I realise that it doesnt really state the damage for Just Aimed shot. But thats Damage on Hawk shot which has a lower Base and maximium damage than Aimed Shot.
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
I have about 37-38% crit chance, but my gear is no where near optimal. I also have the +5% stacking crit chance feat (Correcting Aim?) which helps a lot, I also have Master of Archery which also helps out with the crits. My recovery is (to put it mildly) pathetic. But I can frequently get 15 second powers to recharge in about 5 seconds.
Assume I start off with 3 rapid shots. The first hits normally, the second shot now has about a 43% chance to crit and it does (-1 sec to cooldowns), next shot is auto crit (-1 sec to cooldowns). Then I stance switch and charge in with Marauder's Charge, which also reduces my cooldowns (- 1 second), follow up with Constricting Strike (-1 second) and Fox Strike (-1 second), stance switch and Marauder Escape, Disruptive Shot (-3 seconds to cooldowns). For a total of -8 seconds. If I crit with any of the attacks (other than the 2 I already figured in) then my cooldowns are even shorter.
Since hitting 60 it has been a very rare time that I did not have a power ready to fire when I needed it, and spamming Fox dodge is a great defensive tool to have up all the time.
Another thing to think about: I also have the powers (Aspect of Serpent, +15% damage to melee after ranged use and +3% after stance switch) that boost my damage every time I stance switch, none of them are that huge when looked at alone, but when stacked together they make a difference.
How are you pushing so high on your crit chance? What race are you rolling with? My theory crafting so far has pushed me to 36% but that extra 2% would make a difference.
There is alot of synergy available in the ranged tree and I look forward to exploring more options when / if my HR hits 60 on test / When the patch goes live.
Two things though: Aspect of the serpent. I thought from reading it, that everytime you use a ranged attack you gain a buff (Stacks 5 times) that increase damage by 3% per stack (when in ranged buffs melee, when in melee buffs range)- However, the difference being in order to gain the benefit for the ranged you then need to use 10 Melee attacks (5 to remove the stacks and then 5 to add the stacks for ranged). Honestly I think Stormstep Action and Path of the Eagle(? The increasing range passive - memory is hazy whilst I am at work) are better. Stormstep becomes more attractive if you use Disruptive shot a bucketload. Thereby allowing you to place those points you specced into the melee tree to go into Nature to pick up the run speed buff and strong grasping on Hawkeye for pvp.
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
Ok so I start charging Aimed Shot, I'm out of range, the mob moves and plops an AoE on me because of the actions of my pet or another player. Oh well, guess I'm an idiot for trying to use my at-will. Wait that's the situation that is the problem.
However the bigger problem is actually the melee version of the power, which also has a casting time and is interrupted by damage. I can handle the ranged version having the flaws it does; use it 1x as a big opener, then if you stay at range blast with another at-will. However when you enter melee (either on purpose or because the mobs are fast moving) loosing an at-will melee attack because it has a long casting time and is interrupted by damage is a much, much bigger issue and that's not even starting on its completly inaccurate damage.
Feedback: Play Up To Level 30
It is hard to judge this entirely accurately as the more I play NWO the better at it I get, so my success rate is increasing. However I am becoming concerned now that I've played through the 20's that the HR is too strong in many regards. With the HR I can generate the same impact from an at-will (killing an entire weak mob) that takes a Tabbed Encounter or Divine Encounter from a DC or CW. I'm a long way from a "top player" yet I typically go through several encounters only using 1 pot or I have completed quest boss encounters with 0 damage.
At level 30 I'm looking at;
Power 724
Crit 151
ArP 362 (-3.7% DR)
Recovery 155
Defense 457
Deflect 395
Regen 200
Life Steal 0
Movement 210 (all from Artifact)
Attack 1392
Crit Chance 16.8% Severity 75%
Recharge +3.2%
AP Gain 1.2%
Protection 1232
DR 16.5%
Deflection 13.8% Severity 50%
I'm running (all 3/3);
Passive: Aspect of the Lone Wolf and Aspect of the Pack
At-Will: Rapid Shot and Split Shot
Encounter: Thorn Ward, Constricting Arrow, Hindering Shot (mostly for the melee to hold targets while I move back to range)
Daily: Seismic Shot (barely ever used might retrain to Forest Meditation just for the extra healing) and Forest Walk
Now its time to start killing stuff in Helms Hold seriously.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
At-Wills:
(01)-Rapid Strike-"Fire a flurry of arrows at your Enemy."
(02)-Split Shot-"Shoot a spray of arrows at your enemy, dealing more damage the longer you focus."
(20)-Aimed Strike-"Take precise aim, firing an incredibly deadly shot into your enemy."
(35)-Electric Shot-(P)-"Fire a storm imbued arrow at your target, causing a deadly gust of damage around them."
Encounters:
(03)-Marauder's Escape-"Dash back 50' escaping your enemies."
(05)-Hindering Shot-"Fire two arrows into your enemy's shins, applying Weak Graspin Roots."
(05)-Rain of Arrows-"Fire several arrows into the air, which rain down on ememies in a small area."
(15)-Thorn Ward-"Summon a thorn ward to attack your enemies. Each attack reduces your enemy's defenses by a slight amount."
(20)-Constricting Arrow-"Fire an arrow at your opponent, causing vines to constrict around them every few seconds."
(30)-Boar Hide-"Channeling the thick skin of a boar, grant yourself and one nearby ally, 5 stacks of 2% mitigation. Every attack against you removes one stack."
(30)-Split the Sky-(P)-"Lacerate the sky, opening a storm in a large area. Enemies who attack you or your allies in this area will be struck, dealing damage and snaring them."
(35)-Hawk Shot-"Fire an arrow at your enemy, dealing extra damage based on their distance from you."
(45)-Binding Arrow-"Fire an arrow at your opponent binding them with a strong Grasping Roots. If a foe is behind them, the vines will bind them as well."
(45)-Commanding Shot-"With the powerful buggle of the Stag, your shot lowers your enemy's defenses and damage for a short time."
(50)-Fox's Cunning-"With the precise time of the Fox, you and one nearby ally dodge the next incoming attack."
Dailies:
(04)-Seismic Shot-"Fire a concussive blast into the ground, causing a shockwave that pulls enemies in and damages them."
(10)-Forest Ghost-"Slip into the forest where you remain unseen for a short duration. While hidden, you automatically strike each enemy you come across. (Foes will not be attacked more than once.)"
(10)-Forest Meditation-"Become one with the forest, regenerating hit points for several seconds."
(40)-Disruptive Shot-"Quickly fire an arrow at your target's head, dealing damage and interrupting them."
(50)-Cold Steel Hurricane-(P)-"Call forth a mighty electrical storm in front of you, damaging foes that come in contact with it."
Class Features:
(04)-Aspect of the Falcon-"Increase the range of your ranged powers by 3'."
(15)-Aspect of the Lone Wolf-"Gain 25% bonus mitigation while no ememies are within 25' of you. Each enemy within 25' reduces the mitigation bonus by 5%. Minimum bonus is 0%."
(15)-Aspect of the Pack-"If you are within 10' of an ally, you and your ally gain Combat Advantage."
(20)-Aspect of the Serpent-"Add a stacking buff on every hit which increases your damage. (Buffs from ranged affect melee, and visa versa. Only one type in affect at a time)
(30)-Blade Storm-(P)-"When dealing melee damage, gain a 25% chance to deal an additional 5% of your attack's damage in an area around you."
(40)-Stormstep Action-(P)-"When activating a Daily power, reduce the cooldown on all of your Encounters by 1 second."
(50)-Twin-Blade Storm-(P)-"Any time you hit more than 2 enemies, deal an extra 4% damage."
(##) = level it's available at.
(P) = paragon power.
Melee isn't my forte, so, I didn't include the melee versions.
(Please excuse any typos I missed.)
(Where's a Miniature Giant Space Hamster when you need one?)
So what you're saying is that if a person is stupid enough to have this slotted they deserve to be handicapped to having 1 usable At-will ability for the rest of the encounter because it can only be used once per fight? I don't know if you noticed but once you engage any enemy they move themselves into attacking range.
I think the vast majority of the PvE HRs are more concerned with the Viability of the At-will in epic level dungeons. Where you need to deal with Heightened red circles. However, depending on the role you will be playing - If your taking down Adds, Thorn Ward, Split the sky and spamming Split shot would serve better. If your on Boss Dps, then Slotting Hawk Shot, Split the Sky and Commanding Shot would be better.
Then it just depends if you have the time to shoot off an Aimed shot, or sit there and plink away with Rapid shot. Its either or for our at wills. Rapid shot just gives you some damage straight away, compared to a timed delay burst.
@warzog: Thanks for that layout. That will assist anyone who does not know what skills are fully ranged.
@Rhoric: Regardless of how Cryptic designed the class, anyone who picks it up should be able to garner some enjoyment from it. It is not so much about the entire class requiring skill but more that a skilled play may find it possible to squeeze alot more out of the class than someone who may not necessarily be as skilled.
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
After all this is a feedback thread and this is just my opinion, At-will abilities should not really be quite this conditional. Yes all at wills are semi-conditional but those conditions are based on skill where as Aimed Shot simply can not be used if
A) there is any ranged enemy in the group targeting you
C) you randomly get aggro while in a party
D) you are close enough to melee range that anything may feasibly make it to you before you finish casting
E) are you going to be interrupted by a poison tick
F) you are in ANY danger of possibly being in an area that may get targeted by an AoE
There is (to my knowledge) no other At-Will ability that can ever NOT be used.
Aimed shot => Marauder's Escape => Aimed shot.
As when using Marauder's escape the mobs lose track of you allowing you to set up again. Maybe even throwing in a Hindering shot.
This is for PvE as I don't PvP.
That was how i was trying to use it Aimed Shot > Constricting Arrow > Marauders Escape > Aimed Shot
I also tried several other combinations but it's not enough against Nothic brutes and plague gazers unless they get a mass grasping roots ability from a range this ability is not usable if there is more than 2 ranged or fast moving enemy's in a group.
(perhaps unless you can line up binding arrow just right.)
I find it a great skill. To me the problem is neither cast time nor interrupt, but the fact that we only have 2 at-will slots. Using aimed shot would either remove aoe at-wills or a reliable single target one. I would love to have it on my bar, but cannot afford to give up a slot for it given its use is highly situational. A very simple yet different solution would be to allow it to be slotted in an encounter slot. I would gladly give up an encounter to have access to this at-will.
Also, to clarify since there seems to be some confusion. Aimed Strike (melee) is not interruptible by damage. It is, however, purely a bleed effect with no upfront damage. Since it does not stack, it cannot be used to replace a single target melee at-will. Being a melee build I would love to be able to use this with rapid strike to boost single target dps, but again, I cannot afford to lose my aoe at-will to do so.
This is exactly why I am pushing for a change. I don't believe anybody would honestly choose the highly conditional single target Aimed Shot over the AoE Split Shot or the Reliable Rapid Shot.
It seems like it needs to do something that makes people want to use it. other wise it feels like one of those abilities that's just there to fluff the ability tree.
Hey, Des. Much thanks! Been wondering about these skills for quite some time now. Throw Caution seems nice but based on what I've been reading about Split the Sky it seems pretty sub-par. Unless the snare's effects are pretty significant. But I can never say for sure until I get to test it myself.
By the way, has anyone tested if the range of Marauder's Escape is affected by the Class Feature, Aspect of the Falcon? Marauder's Escape is technically a ranged skill, so it'd be awesome if it were the case.
Hey man,
No stress! Split the sky is really nice! Combine it with Thorn Ward and Rain of Arrows and mobs will just drop. Even Split the Sky and Thorn ward and you can stack some nice AoE damage.
I will jump in test Throw Caution for you with Aspect of the falcon. However, the way the passive is worded leads me to believe that it just increases the maximum range. Marauders Escape states it just throws you back 50 feet. I don't think it would increase it.
An interesting fact though, the melee version of Marauders Escape has quite a long range. Not sure on the exact feet, but it is definitely over half our range. Opens up a whole bucketload of possibilities.
Just tested and it definitely does not affect the distance you travel with Marauders Escape.
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
Ah, I though as much. Would be too good if Aspect of the Falcon affected the range of Marauder's Escape but if the devs are reading our posts, maybe it'll be a good addition to the mechanic of this encounter power. And I'd love to hear results of any further testing, Des. Will check this thread much more often now.
So far I've been theorycrafting myself and came up with various HR builds. 2 for Archery, 1 for Combat, and 2 for Nature. Not sure which ones will be effective, since I don't have a 60 HR with me on the test shard due to the sheer unplayability of the low level areas. But if anyone's interested in testing, I would be more than happy to post some ideas in here just in case people wish to see which can be efficient and which ones should be thrown down the bin. This way we'd have a better grasp of how the HR will size up with the current archetypes and its roles. HR has more utility than DPS it seems, and it's currently unlike any of the other archetypes we have right now. It'll be interesting to observe how people will incorporate the ambiguity of HR's.
One thing's for sure, a lot of people will be spec-ing for Archery. Melee seems pretty nice for PVE in terms of clearing mobs though.
And just to chime in a bit for the topic of Aimed Shot being buffed, I don't think that'll be wise. I agree with the people who have been saying that it's fine the way it is. Given how the Archery Paragon Feat Path is modeled, it's not that hard to imagine how easily this'll break PVP if any more changes come to this skill. I'm pretty sure we'll be seeing people slotting this skill in PVP because it's relatively easy to find the opportunity to pull one shot of these things off with a range of 93'. Much more so since the Archery path ensures us that we will hit crits a lot. So it'll be easy to set up a critical and buffed Aimed Shots that can take down squishies with the use of Perfect Vorpal.
No stress man. I am happy to test things as needed. However my Test HR is still only level 36. Running into some Net issues atm, hence why I am posting and playing from my #g phone connection (In Australia. Im fearing my next bill
You are not far wrong in regards to the utility. I think that HR's will definitely have a place in PvE groups due to the sheer amount of utility they can bring to the group.
I agree with you on the PvP perspective of Aimed Shot. And I have a few ideas inregards to firing this off more effectively, Especially from a 1v1 point of view. I will let on a quick hit. Marauders Rush, Boar Charge, Marauders Escape. Aimed Shot. - Boar charge is similar to the GF charge and knockback, in the sense that it knocks someone prone and back. Combine that with Marauders Escape and Aimed Shot. You should be able to get in at least one before they get into melee range / Dagger throwing range if a Rogue. You saw it here first. Also, Lets not forget the additional 10% critical severity available in the Archery Tree as well as the added scaling bonus damage % depending on the distance the target is available. People are going to need to learn that running away from a Ranger is a very very bad idea.
Edit @ Banelorne, would love to jump on test with you at some stage and have a chat through vent / Ts after details go live and we both have level 60 Rangers to discuss a few ideas. I have my Gear layout and spec pretty much set in stone for my PvP toon, but will be rolling a few more rangers to play around with other different specs.
FEEDBACK: Hawkeye
The buff that your party gains is very underwhelming. At level 60 being reported as only adding 200 damage to the next attack. IMO you can keep it in this function, but buff the damage slightly, and make it last for a period of time, or alternatively, give it a flat % increase for the next attack.
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
Hawkeye: With the precision of a hawk ... deal bonus damage to the next attack.
Throw Caution: Risk lowering defense ... increased damage for a short period.
And as it is now, Hawkeye doesn't do much at all. Throw Caution does approximately 10-20% more dmg for 8-10-ish seconds (without Warden's Courage).
Feedback: Powers: Aimed Shot
I like the current aimed shot. I use it multiple times per fight against tougher enemies. Open with aimed shot and hindering shot on a big baddie, split shot down adds, maybe a thorn ward in there somewhere, marauder's rush, hindering strike, maurauder's escape, aimed shot. The strong grasping from hindering strike gives you time to do another aimed shot. I can't use it whenever I want, but it's not hard to control a fight to be able to get some use from it besides being an opener. Generally it's an opener and then later a finisher for me.
Haven't been able to do any group content, but I still find it useful doing bosses in the quest instances. Marauder's Escape and the dodges seem to have a stealth component that lets the enemies lose me frequently and turn on my companion, so it seems the same would hold true in group content, but that's just guessing. Having done dungeons on my other characters, I can see opportunity to use aimed shot in group content, potentially lots more opportunity if others are in party to draw aggro.
If they don't intend grasping roots to work on CC immune enemies, that'll make it less useful against them, but an ability doesn't have to be useful all the time.
Feedback: Powers: Aimed Strike
I like dropping an aimed strike on enemies before rushing back out. I haven't had it interrupted by damage, meaning I've taken damage while in animation and still landed the hit. Maybe there's a bug with a certain rank of it since I'm using rank 3?
The number one problem is survivability. Our defenses are minimal, and it is very hard to consistently put out damage when our life goes down so quickly. Even with 2 strong defensive feats, a defensive feature, and constant shifting a group of 6 trash adds will take our life down in no time. In a red area fest, forget about it. There is much less trouble with a single opponent.
The second issue is damage. On those few occasions where I can measure it over more than 3 or 4 swipes, it is decent, but still too low given I have 30 points in the melee tree. As is, I probably do 20% more damage than my unfeated ranged attacks. Given I have to be close, it is not nearly enough of a payoff.
Feedback: Powers: Split Shot
I hate to say this, but this power might do a little too much damage for a ranged aoe at-will. As a full melee spec, this ranged at-will still outdamages my melee aoe at-wills.
Feedback: Powers: Marauder’s Rush
I find the damage a little underwhelming considering the long cooldown on the skill. At 3500 power, it lists ~1700-1900 for me.
Bug: Powers: Rain of Swords
This skill is currently delivering around half the listed damage. At this damage output I get more damage from 2 Split Strikes and in the same amount of time.
Feedback: Powers: Aimed Strike
I really like this skill but it cannot replace Rapid Strike. Any chance we’d be allowed to slot it in an encounter slot? I think it complements the ranger’s limited single target melee dps very well. The class sorely need single target melee damage options, and a bleed would be perfect.
Feedback: Features: Aspect of the Lone Wolf
I relied heavily on this with my melee build. Unfortunately it seems to favor ranged play. The melee ranger has vastly more problems with multiple opponents than single opponents, yet this feature becomes null when meleeing multiple opponents.
Feedback: Powers: Boar Hide
I used this and Boar Charge extensively while leveling. Perhaps due to my vulnerability I wished it would function more effectively to protect me, however as a party buff it is quite effective. It does not expire until you are hit, and that is wonderful.
Feedback: Powers: Split the Sky
This is an ability that greatly complements the melee ranger. I wish it’s feated version could be more accessible to melee builds. Because the melee feats are so powerful to make the class melee viable, one cannot really afford more than 5 points outside the tree, and even that at a loss of run speed.
Feedback: Powers: Electric Shot and Clear the Ground
This would be my aoe at-will if the damage was not so very much lower than Split Shot and Strike. It is easier to use, but it needs at least 85-90% of the damage of Split Shot and Strike to be an acceptable exchange.
Bug: Features: Twin-Blade Storm
This feat currently removes all of the powers’ inherent damage, leaving just the added 12% from the feature.
Feedback: Feats: Nature’s Enhancement
This feat ends up benefitting ranged builds more than melee builds, since ranged builds minimize the time they spend in melee. This is a sorely needed enhancement for a melee build, but the 5 second duration is a killer. I am not even sure I understand the reason for it to have a duration at all, except perhaps to promote stance switching. To select the feat one has to forego either deflect chance or power damage, a hefty price. Ranged builds will switch out of melee ASAP anyways, and melee builds are forced to switch out of melee…
I rolled a Moon Ef HR, but when we go to live I will be rolling a Human, the 3 extra Heroic Feats will make a big difference for me.
I transferred over quite a few items to test, including 2 Pyro rings, lots of Azure enchants (upgraded to rank 9s on test), a nice necklace (power+crit+AP, dont remember the name right now) and a blue belt with +243 crit. Also have a Ioun Stone with lots of +crit slotted. But I do not have any gear from the epic dungeons (yet) as it has been too difficult to get a group to run them.
Aspect of the Serpent is not dependent on the number of ATTACKS that you use, it is the number of MOBS THAT YOU HIT. 1 good split shot can give you the 5 melee buff points, then charge in and use an AOE like Steel Breeze (Constricting shot melee version) and a couple regular melee attacks and you have 5 ranged buffs, assuming you were attacking a group.
The range distance buff is also quite good, I just prefer the buff to my damage since I enjoy the rapid stance switching that I am doing. I will often switch stances to fire off 1 power then switch back to continue my assault, whether ranged or melee. I love that many of the powers are a buff in one stance and an attack in another.
While it may not be the "best" build available, I find that it works better for me than any of the others that I have tried. However, the HR is the one class that (IMO) is heavily dependent on the way you want to play it as opposed to the "flavor of the month build" That many other classes have. I can easily see a full ranged build being superior in some situations, and I would not be surprised to see a primary melee build excell in some missions as well. My build is an attempt to "Have my cake and eat it too", a balanced build that makes the best use of both melee and ranged in conjunction rahter than focusing more heavily on one stance.
The feat that gives 25 deflect severity when switching to melee for a few seconds. I think this should just be a straight buff to deflect severity. TRs have 75 its not game breaking.
Also the hunters dodge is 8 feet. It should be 10 feet. Currently the dodge doesnt get you out of red circles or out of the reach of most players abilities. 10 feet would take you just out of range. You have to dodge twice to get clear currently, kinda defeats the purpose.
That net issue is tough indeed. At the very least it's great that you're still able to test from time to time. And I agree, perhaps we'll see people asking for Nature-based rangers in the LFG channels. It's a solid tree for party setups. Archery has decent DPS for both single target and AoE so far too so they will get a spot in parties for sure. Not yet sure about melee, though. Hopefully things can still change even after the HR goes live.
And I love that HR rotation! Maybe you could weave in Binding Arrow or Constricting after using the last Aimed Shot to be able to fire another Aimed Shot. It incorporates good melee and ranged in one setup which will make it versatile no matter what situation your HR is pitted against The ranged build I had in mind was a Hunter Ranger based on pure ranged attacks when it comes to DPS, firing off CC while maintaining range with Marauder's Escape and Dodge just in case people get to close. The plan is to have 33% RSI (INT + Recovery) to take down the CD of Marauder's Escape to 12 seconds flat, and taking Prime Critical + Master of Archery to turn Rapid Shot into something that rapidly reduces CD for Encounters. The other Encounters I'm planning for this type of build is Binding Arrow and Constricting Arrow with CD's of 16.6 and 13.6 respectively. And to help further reduce the CD's of the encounters to be able to fire them off faster, I'm also opting to take Stormstep Action in combination with Disruptive Shot. Fits perfectly with this type of build.
And I'd be more than happy to test with you once the HR goes live, Des! I'll need to find a decent headset before that happens though. But I'm down for more build testing for sure.
Count me in for any additional testing as well. Either on Test or the Live server. Might be interesting to see the results of our similar, but still different set ups in a group.
The HR dodge is less than others. They made it that way on purpose. You are able to dodge more with the short distance dodge compared to other classes that can dodge like that.