Why weekends? When people are paying $200 you don't really need to worry that they'll get bored of it before release and never buy anything; they've already spent the money that could buy several games. There's a chance people won't be able to make these dates and be put off the exorbitant prices.
Run the beta from February 8 though to launch. More people testing the beta will make for a more polished final product. I understand modern betas are more of a demo but players will find bugs you miss and will make suggestions early, that will ultimately be added anyway, though community correspondence.
Personally, I won't be spending a penny until I get to play the game. Some of the decisions, removing things such as Armor Class, saving throws, etc. I really won't understand until I get to experience.
Neverwinter has yet to prove itself.
Completely agree with your post.
When you've shelved out 200 dollars, in my opinion, you should be able to test untill open-beta/release. This way more people would maybe consider it, as it is right now i think the 200 dollars just doesn't get you enough in terms of it being a pre-release pack.
Especially if the items/mount etc included can just be purchased later.
This would even more so be the case if the devs are super confident about their game.
I think people now just want to test (and yes, i do mean test) OR try the game before committing to these prices, and that's mainly because there just hasn't been a lot of info/actualy gameplay released yet. I really don't have any problem with purchasing games pre-launch or committing to things beforehand, but some more videos of people playing and additional information about the game would have been nice.
60 or 200$ is just a lot of money if you have no clue whatsoever if something is going to be cool to play, and there's not really any other sort of information you can base an opinion on.
Now of course you don't have to buy anything, but what's the harm in releasing some more gameplay videos/information if you clearly want people to invest in you?
That said, I think i'll buy the 60$ pack to try it out though i guess.
Where are you getting the exchange rate of 750,000 diamonds for $43?
Based on STO and CO's average exchange rates. Even one of the moderators said it's not much different on the other PWE games, though different since each game has its own exchange rate.
I would rather they delay the game than have a buggy or unpolished launch. WoW players (and others) will tear this game down if launch is anything but perfect.
Someone will always tear it down, even if it is perfect.
It is difficult to have a sustained beta at this point. Even SWTOR started with multiple beta weekends before moving to a sustained closed, then open, beta. Even when they were in a sustained closed beta, some players only got to play on weekends, while others got to play with regular patches and server restarts.
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kalizaarMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
1. "Founder's" title (Eye of the Beholder...)
2. Access to Moonstone Mask's VIP Lounge (CO costuming, though this is less than that, would be 475 or $5)
3. Small bag of holding per character (Bags in CO tend to be based in-game money rather than Zen or even "Astral Diamonds")
4. 750,000 Astral Diamonds (current exchange rate of "Astral Diamonds" to Zen is around 185 per Zen, making this worth 3750 to 4250 zen or around $43 max)
5. 3 extra character slots (Even the most expensive character slot on CO is 5000 Zen, and that's for the special Freeform character. 2 slots are 1400 for regular characters. So I'm going to split the difference: 3000 Zen or $30)
6. Special Drow race (Just a different look and maybe power like the "Joined Trill" on STO, 600 Zen or $6)
7. Mount (Most expensive vehicle on CO is 1800 Zen or $18)
8. Companion (Bridge officers in STO is the closest example: 500 Zen or $5)
So let's add this up: 5+43+30+6+18+5=$107. Previously I was guestimating $120. And either way that's stll below $200 and nowhere near $549.
Ok, so they've now released the official list for the Founder's Packs.
In addition to the list I made previously (with estimated values courtesy of markfalcone) the $200 pack comes with:
9. Founder's Armor Aura "Unique enchantment with visual FX that can be slotted into your armor." (valued at $??)
10. Access to the Foundry before level 15 (Eye of the beholder...)
11. Delzoun Treasure Box "This level 60 chest is guaranteed to contain a rare weapon or implement with a unique enchantment and special visual effect. (one per character)" (valued at $??)
12. Adventurer's Helper Pack "Contains six different types of helpful items (potions, scrolls, and a 10k XP booster) to start your adventure (one per account)" (valued at $??)
13. 1 respec token (valued at $??)
14. Greycloak's Legacy "Start your quest with a mastercrafted weapon or implement. Comes equipped with a unique enchantment that can be unslotted and used in other items. (one per character)" (valued at $??)
15. Robe of Useless Items "Drops a piece of useless junk on the ground when activated. (one robe per character)" (valued at $??)
16. Gold Moonstone Mask Regalia Set "This unique costume is available only to Hero of the North purchasers!" (valued at $??)
Ok, so with these added items to our previous list it's starting to feel like more of a value. I'm still not sure I feel it's worth $199 to me though. It does make me consider it a bit more however.
I'm sure there are some that find the exclusive items well worth spending extra money for. I admit the idea is appealing. I'm just not sure it's $199 appealing.. lol. You know over time there will be all sorts of other mounts, costumes, races, etc. so it's not like everyone that doesn't buy this pack will be stuck with horses and only people that buy the pack will have a mount that's not a horse.
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lanessar13Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, SilverstarsPosts: 8Arc User
Couldn't agree more. Eveyone knows I'm a DDO hater but I did buy MotU (not RotU), the collectors edition in fact, and it WAS indeed worth every penny. People knew upfront what they were getting and the value, here we are left in the dark as usual and are asked to give money on blind faith. Cryptic needs to provide details... a lot of details especially with their cash shop before they put these founder packs up.
And Truth... since when has Turbine EVER produced a non exploitable bug free content update? Their competence when it comes to their product is not the most stellar of quality. People always dread when Turbine goes in and fixes something as they always break more stuff than they fix.
Even for Turbine, even for DDO, this expansion was worse than their "usual." But Aandre, you're the expert on this, could I get a breakdown from a hardcore user?
If I were to go in on this by buying the $60 pack, and then found myself blown away by the first beta weekend to the point where I could not exist without an armored spider mount, would I be able to upgrade to the $200 pack?
Yes, but you'd be paying 60 then 200 not the difference And While you can buy as many $20 packs as you wish, you can only buy one 60 and one 200 dollar pack per account.
Why weekends? When people are paying $200 you don't really need to worry that they'll get bored of it before release and never buy anything; they've already spent the money that could buy several games. There's a chance people won't be able to make these dates and be put off the exorbitant prices.
Run the beta from February 8 though to launch. More people testing the beta will make for a more polished final product. I understand modern betas are more of a demo but players will find bugs you miss and will make suggestions early, that will ultimately be added anyway, though community correspondence.
Personally, I won't be spending a penny until I get to play the game. Some of the decisions, removing things such as Armor Class, saving throws, etc. I really won't understand until I get to experience.
Neverwinter has yet to prove itself.
Again, this is a preview not a full open beta. It's not at a state to HAVE full closed beta or we'd be reading the closed beta START not the WEEKENDS. Thus why I fight oh so hard not to pull my hair out at the beta stress test big marketing PR ony and not testing ready for launch comments. If it were at that state, NDA would have dropped a long time back.
I would rather they delay the game than have a buggy or unpolished launch. WoW players (and others) will tear this game down if launch is anything but perfect.
We have a bullseye! Thank you for pointing out a very solid point. Nothing can be perfect, but it better be damn good if it's D&D.
dequixotic is almost right, but not just the wow players but the hardcore gamers as well, look at swtor, bioware stated oh we arent worried bout all that end game content as people will take a long time leveling and such, meanwhile the hardcore gamers ripped through the game like it was nothing and found hardly anything for end game and also discovered mass high level area bugs and exploits and these people are the most vocal and critical speaking people out there, well maybe not always but in general which drove people aways in droves. Personally this is frustrating to the casual gamer like myself, because all i want is a fun smooth gaming experience and enjoy myself, like many people i work hard in life and i personally would rather not stress about a game being i come to mmo's and such to play and enjoy myself with friends both new and old.
As for beta weekends ive been very disappointed with them i know what mrsnakeg is saying above but generally most these do their tests like this, beta weekend 1 2 and 3, open beta usually only a weekend as well and less not forget these new famous 3 hour stress tests, and these things are great if you only want to test for low level area's. look at AoC, that was fun til bout level 20, then the game was empty and lame for the next 60 levels full of bugs and no end content, thats what happens when you only have weekend beta tests only.
Oh brother, QFT!
Yes, this isn't a low level rush job high level messup. This is just the first leg on the beta phase, and this game isn't planned on launching rushed.
I like to also add if Cryptic is afraid that there isn't enough content in the game, that people will do everything in under two months, then a clever idea would be to get the Foundry tools out there and have some quality user content available for launch day.
You can even charge people $200 to make you content, that way! What a glorious scam that is. Should register Neverwinter as a religion and go for tax exempt status then let people make you content instead of paying cash for auditing. :P
Now who said some of those who can't be mentioned aren't also Foundry authors....
We'll get back to you on the cul...religious setup of my Cryptic gods of Light.
Someone will always tear it down, even if it is perfect.
It is difficult to have a sustained beta at this point. Even SWTOR started with multiple beta weekends before moving to a sustained closed, then open, beta. Even when they were in a sustained closed beta, some players only got to play on weekends, while others got to play with regular patches and server restarts.
QFT. Folks, this is how it's done. I know nostalgia makes it seem longer or better with older games tested, but this is the process.
Based on STO and CO's average exchange rates. Even one of the moderators said it's not much different on the other PWE games, though different since each game has its own exchange rate.
I never said based on the average of those games I said based on the in game exchange which have their highs and lows capped. It could be the top tier or the bottom tier of that or an ENTIRELY NEW NUMBER. Or none of the above It's not mentioned and under NDA. It's your speculation and opinion that came up with that value, not mine. I just explained why I CAN'T say what the "real value"of AD are. If I post a value, you'll be clearly seeing a number, or a range, or me saying "in my opinion" or "Cryptic's range for this game will be..."
If people want to estimate, nobody will stop them, but don't justify it unless it's confirmed by Cryptic/PWE explaining an actual momentary value breakdown.
Honestly, if you're not using the existing game exchange rate as to value, your head is in the sand. It's a pretty good bet that it'll be similar.
And do you know the existing NWO exchange rate?
And for everyone:
These are the full features for the Hero of the North. If it's worth or why it's worth 540 dollars US and being sold for 199.99, I'll let people debate.
Honestly, if you're not using the existing game exchange rate as to value, your head is in the sand. It's a pretty good bet that it'll be similar.
Why are you launching insults at me when I pointed out a simple fact? It is written in RoC which you are supposed to read if you have invested enough points in Read skill.
Instead of launching personal attacks at others you should get your facts straight first. It is speculation at this point.
You normally will get access at level 15. A Hero of the North Founder's Pack purchase grants access immediately when you log in. I'll get back to you about the Astral Diamonds - I don't know off the top of my head.
*Double facepalm over a bald head*
Seriously? Create a barrier for foundry authors???
EDIT:
And its a change from your previous stand(of foundry will be completely free and you will not even have to play the content to start with foundry). You should have announced that change.
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lanessar13Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, SilverstarsPosts: 8Arc User
Why are you launching insults at me when I pointed out a simple fact? It is written in RoC which you are supposed to read if you have invested enough points in Read skill.
Instead of launching personal attacks at others you should get your facts straight first. It is speculation at this point.
Apologies. You are correct that saying "head in the sand" may be construed as a personal attack, and if it was taken so, then I do regret said statement, and retract it formally.
There is an established system within Cryptic's games which they are adhering to. Jack Emmert was pretty clear in an interview about that. Making an educated guess based on values of two similarly-balanced games (which are well-balanced) seems like a good, safe bet rather than speculating that it's "possibly worth more". There are no "cash shop values". All of it is speculation. Character slots and the rest could be four times the cost in this game as others - but I highly doubt it.
But it's no less valid (and actually is more valid) than basing it off of current cash shop costs for character slots, customization, vehicles, races, etc. from sister games. We're talking the same engine, same (essentially) UI, and many of the same basic "value adds" that exist in the other Cryptic games.
That being said, I'm not against the Founder's package as it stands now. There are plenty of items that cannot be valued. Those items may be useful for 5 levels; there may be better options available by level 15. That requires playing the game in order to determine, and thus, I feel the $200 package possibly may be worth the value that the marketing guys placed on it.
As to the availability of the renegade drow/panther/spider, based on CO, I can reasonably predict that there will be a similar (if not the same) option as a package. As a company, PWE and Cryptic wish to make money. Based on the number of fans who wish to play "Ano'ther Do'Urden", sticking a $20 price tag on it and selling it would be a sound business decision. I can't see them passing that income source up, at least at some point. I certainly wouldn't. This may be the only "armored spider", but there will be a "black widow spider" or a "blue panther" re-skin available at some point, and this I'd be willing to bet money on. And I'm all for them making money.
Have to admit, the new stuff has me slightly stumped, but not totally.
9. Founder's Armor Aura "Unique enchantment with visual FX that can be slotted into your armor." (More like a costume thing, so treat as such: $5 on the high end)
10. Access to the Foundry before level 15 (Eye of the beholder...)
11. Delzoun Treasure Box "This level 60 chest is guaranteed to contain a rare weapon or implement with a unique enchantment and special visual effect. (one per character)" (Per character is interesting, randomness is interesting. Still, maybe $5 a character is my guess since neither STO nor CO do much with Zen purchased "weapons or implements")
12. Adventurer's Helper Pack "Contains six different types of helpful items (potions, scrolls, and a 10k XP booster) to start your adventure (one per account)" (Relative pennies... or copper in this case. In game the potions and scrolls start off at 50 copper per)
13. 1 respec token (On the high side I'll say $12 based on STO and CO; CO is higher than STO as I recall)
14. Greycloak's Legacy "Start your quest with a mastercrafted weapon or implement. Comes equipped with a unique enchantment that can be unslotted and used in other items. (one per character)" (The "unique enchantment" is the catch. Guestimate of $5 in Zen since there really isn't anything to go by (which I think is the point of most of this))
15. Robe of Useless Items "Drops a piece of useless junk on the ground when activated. (one robe per character)" (More of a fun item not unlike would be given away in a Cryptic event. Eye of the Beholder.)
16. Gold Moonstone Mask Regalia Set "This unique costume is available only to Hero of the North purchasers!" (This was actually already in there as the access to Moonstone to begin with, just a costume. Same price, $5)
As I've said before, bottom line is that it's still not $200, but it's a heck of a lot closer than the previously advertised stuff. Would have been closer to the $549 "value" if it had been 750,000 Astral Diamonds per character, but that never occured to me to ask until this morning, and the answer is that it is per account, not per character. Think about it. 750,000 per character for 5 characters would have been about $215 after Zen conversion, making the rest of it cake for a total of around $300. Still not $549, but definitely more than $200.
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kalizaarMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited January 2013
Yeah, I think the newly released list is bringing the $199 closer to justifiable.
Really the only benefit is getting a number of "exclusive" things. Exclusive in an MMO with a cash shop just means "this exact shade of color, but there will be 20 others that look identical besides coloring differences". But, to some people the fact that they're one of a few that have that exact shade of color for an item lots of people have is important.
Ditto on titles. There will be a bajillion titles as time goes on. Missing 1 title (Founder) out of 1000 titles in a few months won't mean anything to me, but it might to some people. Same thing with exclusive equipment items. So you might be one of a few people with a great sword that's green with some green blotchy smoke effect, whereas everyone else has access to the same great sword with a wide range of other colors and smoke effects (just not that green one!).
Having said all that, that armored spider does look pretty dang cool though... lol.
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ehsradMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 25Arc User
edited January 2013
This is going to sound crazy but as someone with an acute fear of spiders (even digital ones) as much as i want to buy the top pack i cant. Think ill go for the one with the horse, its a pity you cant switch items around as i wanted the Panther and Dark Elf abilities but thats how these things go lol
What do you mean I'm not kind? Just not your kind!
Yeah, I think the newly released list is bringing the $199 closer to justifiable.
Really the only benefit is getting a number of "exclusive" things. Exclusive in an MMO with a cash shop just means "this exact shade of color, but there will be 20 others that look identical besides coloring differences". But, to some people the fact that they're one of a few that have that exact shade of color for an item lots of people have is important.
Actually yes and no on that. Cryptic's been not bad with "exclusives". The Borg character race for STO, for example, is exclusive to Lifetime members. Has never been changed from that. CO, on the other hand, only has an exclusive costume. No big deal. They've also had "exclusives" in the past that have ended up in the Zen store, all but about half of the exclusive "if bought here" things from opening of STO and the Red Matter thingy from the collector's edition tin, for example. So is the Menz. Ren. going to be truly exclusive? Time will tell, but I would guess yes. Will the Spider Mount? Maybe. Panther and Dire Wolf? Maybe those particular looks, as you've said, but beyond that not likely.
Still, as you point out, an exclusive race is an exclusive race. Can't get it anywhere else, will probably never be heard from again. That does raise the value a little. It also begs the question: Will upgrades such as new races, new classes, etc. be Zen Store items? Is that how they will pay for the game? Because, after all, they need to make their living from somewhere.
This is going to sound crazy but as someone with an acute fear of spiders (even digital ones) as much as i want to buy the top pack i cant. Think ill go for the one with the horse, its a pity you cant switch items around as i wanted the Panther and Dark Elf abilities but thats how these things go lol
You don't HAVE to use the spider. Buy both and just use the horse instead.
I'd much rather have the horse than the spider, canon or not. Kinda bummed paying $200.00 doesn't give me a choice between mounts. As others have stated, it would also have been a smart idea to offer packages for all races at each tier. Kind of a shame because I believe the limited options are going to negatively affect sales.
Actually yes and no on that. Cryptic's been not bad with "exclusives". The Borg character race for STO, for example, is exclusive to Lifetime members. Has never been changed from that. CO, on the other hand, only has an exclusive costume. No big deal. They've also had "exclusives" in the past that have ended up in the Zen store, all but about half of the exclusive "if bought here" things from opening of STO and the Red Matter thingy from the collector's edition tin, for example. So is the Menz. Ren. going to be truly exclusive? Time will tell, but I would guess yes. Will the Spider Mount? Maybe. Panther and Dire Wolf? Maybe those particular looks, as you've said, but beyond that not likely.
Still, as you point out, an exclusive race is an exclusive race. Can't get it anywhere else, will probably never be heard from again. That does raise the value a little. It also begs the question: Will upgrades such as new races, new classes, etc. be Zen Store items? Is that how they will pay for the game? Because, after all, they need to make their living from somewhere.
This generally seems correct. However, I'd guess that instead of "drow renegade", they'll offer "Free drow" or "Topside drow". Just from what I can see of the CO packages, etc. I'm going to expect a Drizzt package available. This isn't a negative statement; it's just good business. If you can sell Drizzt packs to people for $20 a pop, I honestly don't see them passing up on that cash cow. Same with an "elderly wizard" pack, etc.
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mangionenMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 1Arc User
Just ordered the Guardian of Neverwinter pack. I feel the price of the Hero of the North pack is a bit too steep and I agree with a previous poster to this thread that the horse is cooler transport than the spider. What I will miss however is the access to the VIP lounge in the Moonstone Mask (I have access to the VIP lounge in SWTOR with only a mid-range pack). Here's hoping it will become available later as an unlock.
I would like to add that being based in the UK, I'm a bit miffed that I was forced to pay for this pack in euros (the pound is weaker against the euro than it is against the dollar). As a result I've had to fork out 10 quid more than I would if I could've paid in dollars. :mad:
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bitterwinterMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited January 2013
leematon if you are cutting and pasting from something that sometimes causes the post to not fully materialize.
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kingaultMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 22Arc User
edited January 2013
Since someone asked...
MoTU, the only expansion for DDO, was actually pretty good, even if there were some kinks to work on
Riders of Rohan had good quests and areas and Epic Story and such, but Mounted Combat was buggy and instances weren't released until... December? Even then, that was only the first half of the cluster. Much worse than Rise of Isengard... Every expansion in LOTRO seems to have less instances than the previous one... even when you add the instances from the post-expansion update area...
Oh, and MoTU had that sweet Epic Destiny feature. Although fully using its potential required grinding, it added more customization to your character. So, you have race, attribute points at start + per 4 levels, skill points, feats, and class points from ranking up, and Epic Destiny points from ranking up at level 20+. Pretty awesome, really. Hope Neverwinter has a level of customization somewhere close to this.
I'm willing to pay that being a hardcore gamer the thing I am strung up on tho is the fact that there is VERY little gameplay footage , no real interviews / discussions I can find on core game mechanics / pvp / questing etc. Not even a single character customization video which leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Until I see what I'm paying for a few class videos and a few dungeon videos does nothing for me. Also , I take that back 200$ is too much plain and simple I deffinently would consider 120$ tho if I had some content of what im getting.
Blue, green, grey, white, or black; smooth, ruffled, or mountainous; that ocean is not silent.
H. P. Lovecraft
leematon if you are cutting and pasting from something that sometimes causes the post to not fully materialize.
I spotted what caused the problem. For some bizarre reason these forums don't appear to recognise the pound sign. Every time I type a pound sign all text that appears after it is omitted. Maybe this needs to be ironed out by the Tech Support guys.
By the way, when will the 'Guardian' label appear above my avatar?
I spotted what caused the problem. For some bizarre reason these forums don't appear to recognise the pound sign. Every time I type a pound sign all text that appears after it is omitted. Maybe this needs to be ironed out by the Tech Support guys.
They do not recognise any ASCII character not alpha numeric (i.e. not on US keyboard)
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johnnyquantumMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 6Arc User
edited February 2013
Will these founders pack only be available before launch?
Will any elements be available for purchase after launch?
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lanessar13Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, SilverstarsPosts: 8Arc User
Will these founders pack only be available before launch?
Will any elements be available for purchase after launch?
Elements like them will be available after launch, for example, character slots, bag slots, mounts (maybe not these exact mounts, but some similar), companions, and most likely outfit and background packages should be for sale in the cash shop or in-game for in-game currency. The packages themselves will not be as a whole.
I'm fairly certain some sort of "drow renegade" package will be sold to capitalize on the Drizzt love. However, it may or may not be containing all the elements of the package, or the panther might be a blue panther instead of a black one, or the background will be a different background. There will be enough elements of the founder's package not sold which will make it unique, but other stuff will be similar enough for people to get their Drizzt on.
I spotted what caused the problem. For some bizarre reason these forums don't appear to recognise the pound sign. Every time I type a pound sign all text that appears after it is omitted. Maybe this needs to be ironed out by the Tech Support guys.
By the way, when will the 'Guardian' label appear above my avatar?
Comments
Completely agree with your post.
When you've shelved out 200 dollars, in my opinion, you should be able to test untill open-beta/release. This way more people would maybe consider it, as it is right now i think the 200 dollars just doesn't get you enough in terms of it being a pre-release pack.
Especially if the items/mount etc included can just be purchased later.
This would even more so be the case if the devs are super confident about their game.
I think people now just want to test (and yes, i do mean test) OR try the game before committing to these prices, and that's mainly because there just hasn't been a lot of info/actualy gameplay released yet. I really don't have any problem with purchasing games pre-launch or committing to things beforehand, but some more videos of people playing and additional information about the game would have been nice.
60 or 200$ is just a lot of money if you have no clue whatsoever if something is going to be cool to play, and there's not really any other sort of information you can base an opinion on.
Now of course you don't have to buy anything, but what's the harm in releasing some more gameplay videos/information if you clearly want people to invest in you?
That said, I think i'll buy the 60$ pack to try it out though i guess.
Based on STO and CO's average exchange rates. Even one of the moderators said it's not much different on the other PWE games, though different since each game has its own exchange rate.
Thats speculation. Mods views are their own, unless Mel said it.
Someone will always tear it down, even if it is perfect.
It is difficult to have a sustained beta at this point. Even SWTOR started with multiple beta weekends before moving to a sustained closed, then open, beta. Even when they were in a sustained closed beta, some players only got to play on weekends, while others got to play with regular patches and server restarts.
Ok, so they've now released the official list for the Founder's Packs.
In addition to the list I made previously (with estimated values courtesy of markfalcone) the $200 pack comes with:
9. Founder's Armor Aura "Unique enchantment with visual FX that can be slotted into your armor." (valued at $??)
10. Access to the Foundry before level 15 (Eye of the beholder...)
11. Delzoun Treasure Box "This level 60 chest is guaranteed to contain a rare weapon or implement with a unique enchantment and special visual effect. (one per character)" (valued at $??)
12. Adventurer's Helper Pack "Contains six different types of helpful items (potions, scrolls, and a 10k XP booster) to start your adventure (one per account)" (valued at $??)
13. 1 respec token (valued at $??)
14. Greycloak's Legacy "Start your quest with a mastercrafted weapon or implement. Comes equipped with a unique enchantment that can be unslotted and used in other items. (one per character)" (valued at $??)
15. Robe of Useless Items "Drops a piece of useless junk on the ground when activated. (one robe per character)" (valued at $??)
16. Gold Moonstone Mask Regalia Set "This unique costume is available only to Hero of the North purchasers!" (valued at $??)
Ok, so with these added items to our previous list it's starting to feel like more of a value. I'm still not sure I feel it's worth $199 to me though. It does make me consider it a bit more however.
I'm sure there are some that find the exclusive items well worth spending extra money for. I admit the idea is appealing. I'm just not sure it's $199 appealing.. lol. You know over time there will be all sorts of other mounts, costumes, races, etc. so it's not like everyone that doesn't buy this pack will be stuck with horses and only people that buy the pack will have a mount that's not a horse.
Honestly, using the existing sister game exchange rate as to value is a pretty good bet.
Individual purchases aren't released yet. Personally, I'd be interested in this as an option too
Even for Turbine, even for DDO, this expansion was worse than their "usual." But Aandre, you're the expert on this, could I get a breakdown from a hardcore user?
Yes, but you'd be paying 60 then 200 not the difference And While you can buy as many $20 packs as you wish, you can only buy one 60 and one 200 dollar pack per account.
Again, this is a preview not a full open beta. It's not at a state to HAVE full closed beta or we'd be reading the closed beta START not the WEEKENDS. Thus why I fight oh so hard not to pull my hair out at the beta stress test big marketing PR ony and not testing ready for launch comments. If it were at that state, NDA would have dropped a long time back.
We have a bullseye! Thank you for pointing out a very solid point. Nothing can be perfect, but it better be damn good if it's D&D.
Oh brother, QFT!
Yes, this isn't a low level rush job high level messup. This is just the first leg on the beta phase, and this game isn't planned on launching rushed.
Now who said some of those who can't be mentioned aren't also Foundry authors....
We'll get back to you on the cul...religious setup of my Cryptic gods of Light.
*monotone* have the pancakes....
QFT. Folks, this is how it's done. I know nostalgia makes it seem longer or better with older games tested, but this is the process.
I never said based on the average of those games I said based on the in game exchange which have their highs and lows capped. It could be the top tier or the bottom tier of that or an ENTIRELY NEW NUMBER. Or none of the above It's not mentioned and under NDA. It's your speculation and opinion that came up with that value, not mine. I just explained why I CAN'T say what the "real value"of AD are. If I post a value, you'll be clearly seeing a number, or a range, or me saying "in my opinion" or "Cryptic's range for this game will be..."
If people want to estimate, nobody will stop them, but don't justify it unless it's confirmed by Cryptic/PWE explaining an actual momentary value breakdown.
And do you know the existing NWO exchange rate?
And for everyone:
These are the full features for the Hero of the North. If it's worth or why it's worth 540 dollars US and being sold for 199.99, I'll let people debate.
Why are you launching insults at me when I pointed out a simple fact? It is written in RoC which you are supposed to read if you have invested enough points in Read skill.
Instead of launching personal attacks at others you should get your facts straight first. It is speculation at this point.
*Double facepalm over a bald head*
Seriously? Create a barrier for foundry authors???
EDIT:
And its a change from your previous stand(of foundry will be completely free and you will not even have to play the content to start with foundry). You should have announced that change.
Apologies. You are correct that saying "head in the sand" may be construed as a personal attack, and if it was taken so, then I do regret said statement, and retract it formally.
There is an established system within Cryptic's games which they are adhering to. Jack Emmert was pretty clear in an interview about that. Making an educated guess based on values of two similarly-balanced games (which are well-balanced) seems like a good, safe bet rather than speculating that it's "possibly worth more". There are no "cash shop values". All of it is speculation. Character slots and the rest could be four times the cost in this game as others - but I highly doubt it.
But it's no less valid (and actually is more valid) than basing it off of current cash shop costs for character slots, customization, vehicles, races, etc. from sister games. We're talking the same engine, same (essentially) UI, and many of the same basic "value adds" that exist in the other Cryptic games.
That being said, I'm not against the Founder's package as it stands now. There are plenty of items that cannot be valued. Those items may be useful for 5 levels; there may be better options available by level 15. That requires playing the game in order to determine, and thus, I feel the $200 package possibly may be worth the value that the marketing guys placed on it.
As to the availability of the renegade drow/panther/spider, based on CO, I can reasonably predict that there will be a similar (if not the same) option as a package. As a company, PWE and Cryptic wish to make money. Based on the number of fans who wish to play "Ano'ther Do'Urden", sticking a $20 price tag on it and selling it would be a sound business decision. I can't see them passing that income source up, at least at some point. I certainly wouldn't. This may be the only "armored spider", but there will be a "black widow spider" or a "blue panther" re-skin available at some point, and this I'd be willing to bet money on. And I'm all for them making money.
9. Founder's Armor Aura "Unique enchantment with visual FX that can be slotted into your armor." (More like a costume thing, so treat as such: $5 on the high end)
10. Access to the Foundry before level 15 (Eye of the beholder...)
11. Delzoun Treasure Box "This level 60 chest is guaranteed to contain a rare weapon or implement with a unique enchantment and special visual effect. (one per character)" (Per character is interesting, randomness is interesting. Still, maybe $5 a character is my guess since neither STO nor CO do much with Zen purchased "weapons or implements")
12. Adventurer's Helper Pack "Contains six different types of helpful items (potions, scrolls, and a 10k XP booster) to start your adventure (one per account)" (Relative pennies... or copper in this case. In game the potions and scrolls start off at 50 copper per)
13. 1 respec token (On the high side I'll say $12 based on STO and CO; CO is higher than STO as I recall)
14. Greycloak's Legacy "Start your quest with a mastercrafted weapon or implement. Comes equipped with a unique enchantment that can be unslotted and used in other items. (one per character)" (The "unique enchantment" is the catch. Guestimate of $5 in Zen since there really isn't anything to go by (which I think is the point of most of this))
15. Robe of Useless Items "Drops a piece of useless junk on the ground when activated. (one robe per character)" (More of a fun item not unlike would be given away in a Cryptic event. Eye of the Beholder.)
16. Gold Moonstone Mask Regalia Set "This unique costume is available only to Hero of the North purchasers!" (This was actually already in there as the access to Moonstone to begin with, just a costume. Same price, $5)
As I've said before, bottom line is that it's still not $200, but it's a heck of a lot closer than the previously advertised stuff. Would have been closer to the $549 "value" if it had been 750,000 Astral Diamonds per character, but that never occured to me to ask until this morning, and the answer is that it is per account, not per character. Think about it. 750,000 per character for 5 characters would have been about $215 after Zen conversion, making the rest of it cake for a total of around $300. Still not $549, but definitely more than $200.
Really the only benefit is getting a number of "exclusive" things. Exclusive in an MMO with a cash shop just means "this exact shade of color, but there will be 20 others that look identical besides coloring differences". But, to some people the fact that they're one of a few that have that exact shade of color for an item lots of people have is important.
Ditto on titles. There will be a bajillion titles as time goes on. Missing 1 title (Founder) out of 1000 titles in a few months won't mean anything to me, but it might to some people. Same thing with exclusive equipment items. So you might be one of a few people with a great sword that's green with some green blotchy smoke effect, whereas everyone else has access to the same great sword with a wide range of other colors and smoke effects (just not that green one!).
Having said all that, that armored spider does look pretty dang cool though... lol.
Actually yes and no on that. Cryptic's been not bad with "exclusives". The Borg character race for STO, for example, is exclusive to Lifetime members. Has never been changed from that. CO, on the other hand, only has an exclusive costume. No big deal. They've also had "exclusives" in the past that have ended up in the Zen store, all but about half of the exclusive "if bought here" things from opening of STO and the Red Matter thingy from the collector's edition tin, for example. So is the Menz. Ren. going to be truly exclusive? Time will tell, but I would guess yes. Will the Spider Mount? Maybe. Panther and Dire Wolf? Maybe those particular looks, as you've said, but beyond that not likely.
Still, as you point out, an exclusive race is an exclusive race. Can't get it anywhere else, will probably never be heard from again. That does raise the value a little. It also begs the question: Will upgrades such as new races, new classes, etc. be Zen Store items? Is that how they will pay for the game? Because, after all, they need to make their living from somewhere.
You don't HAVE to use the spider. Buy both and just use the horse instead.
A multi-gaming Guild
This generally seems correct. However, I'd guess that instead of "drow renegade", they'll offer "Free drow" or "Topside drow". Just from what I can see of the CO packages, etc. I'm going to expect a Drizzt package available. This isn't a negative statement; it's just good business. If you can sell Drizzt packs to people for $20 a pop, I honestly don't see them passing up on that cash cow. Same with an "elderly wizard" pack, etc.
I would like to add that being based in the UK, I'm a bit miffed that I was forced to pay for this pack in euros (the pound is weaker against the euro than it is against the dollar). As a result I've had to fork out 10 quid more than I would if I could've paid in dollars. :mad:
MoTU, the only expansion for DDO, was actually pretty good, even if there were some kinks to work on
Riders of Rohan had good quests and areas and Epic Story and such, but Mounted Combat was buggy and instances weren't released until... December? Even then, that was only the first half of the cluster. Much worse than Rise of Isengard... Every expansion in LOTRO seems to have less instances than the previous one... even when you add the instances from the post-expansion update area...
Oh, and MoTU had that sweet Epic Destiny feature. Although fully using its potential required grinding, it added more customization to your character. So, you have race, attribute points at start + per 4 levels, skill points, feats, and class points from ranking up, and Epic Destiny points from ranking up at level 20+. Pretty awesome, really. Hope Neverwinter has a level of customization somewhere close to this.
H. P. Lovecraft
I spotted what caused the problem. For some bizarre reason these forums don't appear to recognise the pound sign. Every time I type a pound sign all text that appears after it is omitted. Maybe this needs to be ironed out by the Tech Support guys.
By the way, when will the 'Guardian' label appear above my avatar?
They do not recognise any ASCII character not alpha numeric (i.e. not on US keyboard)
Will any elements be available for purchase after launch?
Elements like them will be available after launch, for example, character slots, bag slots, mounts (maybe not these exact mounts, but some similar), companions, and most likely outfit and background packages should be for sale in the cash shop or in-game for in-game currency. The packages themselves will not be as a whole.
I'm fairly certain some sort of "drow renegade" package will be sold to capitalize on the Drizzt love. However, it may or may not be containing all the elements of the package, or the panther might be a blue panther instead of a black one, or the background will be a different background. There will be enough elements of the founder's package not sold which will make it unique, but other stuff will be similar enough for people to get their Drizzt on.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?32121-How-To-Neverwinter-Founder-s-Pack-Titles
Closed beta test weekend starts Friday and they have not yet stated when we can download the client.