Don't make me laugh. I preordered RotU for DDO and it was worth every penny. The bundles weren't ridiculously priced, and that was for the expansion itself, not Beta access. Riders of Rohan for LOTRO... Launching without instances wasn't the best thing for the players but I viewed it was a good choice, in a way...
Either way, the bundles for those two things were actually worth it, unlike here.
Couldn't agree more. Eveyone knows I'm a DDO hater but I did buy MotU (not RotU), the collectors edition in fact, and it WAS indeed worth every penny. People knew upfront what they were getting and the value, here we are left in the dark as usual and are asked to give money on blind faith. Cryptic needs to provide details... a lot of details especially with their cash shop before they put these founder packs up.
And Truth... since when has Turbine EVER produced a non exploitable bug free content update? Their competence when it comes to their product is not the most stellar of quality. People always dread when Turbine goes in and fixes something as they always break more stuff than they fix.
You don't really have to read what is inside the quotes. Though all I said there has been said before by mods and stuff...
...except the fact that my foundry quests (whenever I am allowed make them) will be more awesome than game itself and would be a sandbox experience.
Hmm... that has not been said before. I guess it was a vision of future which I received being an oracle. Now cryptic put that "those who got beta keys from official contest on forums" in the first beta to make my vision come true ... {at least I can try}
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kingaultMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 22Arc User
Couldn't agree more. Eveyone knows I'm a DDO hater but I did buy MotU (not RotU), the collectors edition in fact, and it WAS indeed worth every penny. People knew upfront what they were getting and the value, here we are left in the dark as usual and are asked to give money on blind faith. Cryptic needs to provide details... a lot of details especially with their cash shop before they put these founder packs up.
And Truth... since when has Turbine EVER produced a non exploitable bug free content update? Their competence when it comes to their product is not the most stellar of quality. People always dread when Turbine goes in and fixes something as they always break more stuff than they fix.
Especially true now, as people are farming daily quest instances for recipes for the best jewelry/armor pieces for most class in the game, and there was the whole Durchest farming incident... Bah... DDO is more of a grind, with those Epic Red/etc scales... Oh well.
Hopefully this game won't have so much of a grind... I'll just wait till I get chosen for a regular Beta key...
I'm really interested in the Foundry system, to be honest.
Pffftttt.... DDO.... its like comparing a old CRT TV set with new flat very large plasma 3d screen. Not fair to DDO, not fair at all.
Hey, DDO is still unique. For example, unlike Neverwinter, you get to customize points for all of your skills, not just combat ones. (There's also those points you get, 1 per rank, that you spend on enhancements/action boosts/etc)
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if this game has less customization than DDO. Well, this game will probably have more cosmetic customization, but still.
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kalizaarMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited January 2013
Being a repeat offender of buying lifetime subs for other games in the $200 range I'm very hesitant to get this simply because there's no way to know the "value" of the items included.
I'd just like to point out to visionstorm01 that there is more to the $200 package than the race, mount, and companion. In-game items listed are (in different locations, so it'd be nice to see a finalized, official list):
1. "Founder's" title (valued at $???)
2. Access to Moonstone Mask's VIP Lounge (valued at $???)
3. Small bag of holding per character (valued at $???)
4. 750,000 Astral Diamonds (valued at $???)
5. 3 extra character slots (valued at $???)
6. Special Drow race (valued at $???)
7. Mount (valued at $???)
8. Companion (valued at $???)
I also wonder if you get what's included in the previous two tiers like the Adventurer's Pack with 6 items in it, the amulet of protection, and the head piece.
Still no clue if those in-game items are really worth $549, or what any individual item is worth. What if I only am interested in the 3 character slots, the mount, the bag of holding, and the companion? Will I ever be able to spend 750k Astral Diamonds, or will that only be enough to last me a couple days?
Just not enough information.
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kingaultMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 22Arc User
Being a repeat offender of buying lifetime subs for other games in the $200 range I'm very hesitant to get this simply because there's no way to know the "value" of the items included.
I'd just like to point out to visionstorm01 that there is more to the $200 package than the race, mount, and companion. In-game items listed are (in different locations, so it'd be nice to see a finalized, official list):
1. "Founder's" title (valued at $???)
2. Access to Moonstone Mask's VIP Lounge (valued at $???)
3. Small bag of holding per character (valued at $???)
4. 750,000 Astral Diamonds (valued at $???)
5. 3 extra character slots (valued at $???)
6. Special Drow race (valued at $???)
7. Mount (valued at $???)
8. Companion (valued at $???)
I also wonder if you get what's included in the previous two tiers like the Adventurer's Pack with 6 items in it, the amulet of protection, and the head piece.
Still no clue if those in-game items are really worth $549, or what any individual item is worth. What if I only am interested in the 3 character slots, the mount, the bag of holding, and the companion? Will I ever be able to spend 750k Astral Diamonds, or will that only be enough to last me a couple days?
Just not enough information.
There's also access to the Foundry from the start, instead of only gaining access to it at level 15.
I'd just like to point out to visionstorm01 that there is more to the $200 package than the race, mount, and companion. In-game items listed are (in different locations, so it'd be nice to see a finalized, official list):
1. "Founder's" title (Eye of the Beholder...)
2. Access to Moonstone Mask's VIP Lounge (CO costuming, though this is less than that, would be 475 or $5)
3. Small bag of holding per character (Bags in CO tend to be based in-game money rather than Zen or even "Astral Diamonds")
4. 750,000 Astral Diamonds (current exchange rate of "Astral Diamonds" to Zen is around 185 per Zen, making this worth 3750 to 4250 zen or around $43 max)
5. 3 extra character slots (Even the most expensive character slot on CO is 5000 Zen, and that's for the special Freeform character. 2 slots are 1400 for regular characters. So I'm going to split the difference: 3000 Zen or $30)
6. Special Drow race (Just a different look and maybe power like the "Joined Trill" on STO, 600 Zen or $6)
7. Mount (Most expensive vehicle on CO is 1800 Zen or $18)
8. Companion (Bridge officers in STO is the closest example: 500 Zen or $5)
So let's add this up: 5+43+30+6+18+5=$107. Previously I was guestimating $120. And either way that's stll below $200 and nowhere near $549.
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zanarkheneldMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited January 2013
So... We're supposed to be able to buy today. I cannot find where to do that. *waves money*
There's also access to the Foundry from the start, instead of only gaining access to it at level 15.
Irrelevant as devs have already said everyone can get access to NW foundry at any level - without even playing the game, and for free. So if I never want to play the game, I am free not to and just use foundry.
---- For free!
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kingaultMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 22Arc User
Irrelevant as devs have already said everyone can get access to NW foundry at any level - without even playing the game, and for free. So if I never want to play the game, I am free not to and just use foundry.
Hey, DDO is still unique. For example, unlike Neverwinter, you get to customize points for all of your skills, not just combat ones. (There's also those points you get, 1 per rank, that you spend on enhancements/action boosts/etc)
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if this game has less customization than DDO. Well, this game will probably have more cosmetic customization, but still.
Yeah old CRT is simple enough that you can open it up and replace its parts. The new one hide all those things, and all tinkering is handled differently. Foundry for the Win!!! ^^
However, the list they say is only a speculation. Those may not be all the things the pack gives - just important ones. Besides the title of Founder can very much be priceless
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kalizaarMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Let me fill in based on Cryptic's other two games at least a few of these things:
1. "Founder's" title (Eye of the Beholder...)
2. Access to Moonstone Mask's VIP Lounge (CO costuming, though this is less than that, would be 475 or $5)
3. Small bag of holding per character (Bags in CO tend to be based in-game money rather than Zen or even "Astral Diamonds")
4. 750,000 Astral Diamonds (current exchange rate of "Astral Diamonds" to Zen is around 185 per Zen, making this worth 3750 to 4250 zen or around $43 max)
5. 3 extra character slots (Even the most expensive character slot on CO is 5000 Zen, and that's for the special Freeform character. 2 slots are 1400 for regular characters. So I'm going to split the difference: 3000 Zen or $30)
6. Special Drow race (Just a different look and maybe power like the "Joined Trill" on STO, 600 Zen or $6)
7. Mount (Most expensive vehicle on CO is 1800 Zen or $18)
8. Companion (Bridge officers in STO is the closest example: 500 Zen or $5)
So let's add this up: 5+43+30+6+18+5=$107. Previously I was guestimating $120. And either way that's stll below $200 and nowhere near $549.
Awesome, thanks for providing what you think their approximate value is. Of course things might be different in this game compared to CO and STO, but $450 different? What the heck are they valuing so differently? Or is there even more that will be included but we just haven't seen the finalized list yet?
Does anyone else with experience in CO/STO have a differing estimation on these items?
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lanessar13Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, SilverstarsPosts: 8Arc User
edited January 2013
Actually, I was doing this mental total and came up with about the same figure for the "top end" stuff. I could place the bag value at about 6g (or about .75) based on CO translation. Still well short of the $549.
Access to the Moonstone Mask is sort of access to the VIP lounge in CO's Club Caprice. Again, an item with value in the eye of the beholder. But we could place it on the value of a CO Hideout (restricted in-game hangout spot), again 500 zen.
So, even boosting the amount paid (say the skin is unique and will never be offered on the Z store), we're still at about $120-$150.
Even the "Guardian of the North" is worth maaaybe $30, not the $60 being charged for it. Again titles are in the EOB.
If I were a guessing man, I'd say the remainder is for beta and head-start. Which means for 11 days (or 9 days), you're seeing that as "worth $300". Guardians pay $60, get approximately $20 in stuff, but get 2 days less on the head start.
Whatever floats your boat, I suppose, I'm sure some will pay that. Again, it's all about what value people see in something like this. Heck, people pay $300 for a piece of french toast with Jesus's face on it...
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kalizaarMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited January 2013
Thanks you two, that really helps a lot. I'm all for helping a game company out but I don't know that I'm willing to fork over $200 when there's maybe around $70 worth of stuff for me. Yeah getting in early would be nice I guess, but there are so many great F2P games around now-a-days that can easily soak up my time that it gets harder and harder to justify paying for "early" days in releases.
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gentacleMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 6Arc User
edited January 2013
If I were to go in on this by buying the $60 pack, and then found myself blown away by the first beta weekend to the point where I could not exist without an armored spider mount, would I be able to upgrade to the $200 pack?
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lanessar13Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, SilverstarsPosts: 8Arc User
If I were to go in on this by buying the $60 pack, and then found myself blown away by the first beta weekend to the point where I could not exist without an armored spider mount, would I be able to upgrade to the $200 pack?
That's a question for the magic eight-ball. No one can answer that question except for Cryptic.
I'd like to point out the specifics of why I'm hammering on this "it looks like a Lifetime Member" thing. Here I'll point out the similarities:
1. "Founder's" title - A special title is given to any STO or CO lifetime member.
2. Access to Moonstone Mask's VIP Lounge - A special lounge is available for the life of the account to any lifetime member.
5. 3 extra character slots - Lifetime members of both STO and CO are given extra character slots as well as...
6. Special Drow race - ...either a special race (STO) and/or a special costume (STO and CO)
Then there's the small bags of holding. Paying members of STO and CO have larger inventories and banks. The priority access. I notice they did not mention whether or not it continues outside of Beta, for for paying and lifetime members on STO and CO it does and was advertised as such. There are just too many similarties to completely ignore. On top of that, it explains why these packages are so expensive and "worth" so much according to the "press release".
I'd like to point out the specifics of why I'm hammering on this "it looks like a Lifetime Member" thing. Here I'll point out the similarities:
1. "Founder's" title - A special title is given to any STO or CO lifetime member.
2. Access to Moonstone Mask's VIP Lounge - A special lounge is available for the life of the account to any lifetime member.
5. 3 extra character slots - Lifetime members of both STO and CO are given extra character slots as well as...
6. Special Drow race - ...either a special race (STO) and/or a special costume (STO and CO)
Then there's the small bags of holding. Paying members of STO and CO have larger inventories and banks. The priority access. I notice they did not mention whether or not it continues outside of Beta, for for paying and lifetime members on STO and CO it does and was advertised as such. There are just too many similarties to completely ignore. On top of that, it explains why these packages are so expensive and "worth" so much according to the "press release".
yes but Lifetome members of STO get a "free" monthly amount of Dilithium Crystals, while this says 1 time only
yes but Lifetome members of STO get a "free" monthly amount of Dilithium Crystals, while this says 1 time only
Actually it's free monthly stipend of Zen (500 in both CO and STO). Which, again, brings me back to my argument that this sounds more like Lifetime in many ways. And 750,000 diamonds is no lifetime of 500 Zen a month. Just a drop in the bucket, really.
EDIT: To be mathematically accurate, by the current Exchange rates on STO and CO, it would be around 3750 to 4250 Zen total in comparison to 6000 Zen in just the first year with a Lifetime membership to STO or CO.
Why weekends? When people are paying $200 you don't really need to worry that they'll get bored of it before release and never buy anything; they've already spent the money that could buy several games. There's a chance people won't be able to make these dates and be put off the exorbitant prices.
Run the beta from February 8 though to launch. More people testing the beta will make for a more polished final product. I understand modern betas are more of a demo but players will find bugs you miss and will make suggestions early, that will ultimately be added anyway, though community correspondence.
Personally, I won't be spending a penny until I get to play the game. Some of the decisions, removing things such as Armor Class, saving throws, etc. I really won't understand until I get to experience.
Why weekends? When people are paying $200 you don't really need to worry that they'll get bored of it before release and never buy anything; they've already spent the money that could buy several games. There's a chance people won't be able to make these dates and be put off the exorbitant prices.
Run the beta from February 8 though to launch. More people testing the beta will make for a more polished final product. I understand modern betas are more of a demo but players will find bugs you miss and will make suggestions early, that will ultimately be added anyway, though community correspondence.
Personally, I won't be spending a penny until I get to play the game. Some of the decisions, removing things such as Armor Class, saving throws, etc. I really won't understand until I get to experience.
Neverwinter has yet to prove itself.
Beta weekends give an opportunity for the developers to stress test and provide more focused testing as well. Also, I imagine that in the downtime between beta weekends, they're using the hardware for other things (internal/(pre-)alpha testing, regular builds, etc). During beta weekends, the builds have to be somewhat stable, in between, they could be crashing the server regularly and have expensive debugging code enabled.
Plus it gives them time to try and replicate bugs that players found during the test. What you're talking about (longer term testing) will come around during open-beta / first few weeks after launch.
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dequixoticMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Plus it gives them time to try and replicate bugs that players found during the test. What you're talking about (longer term testing) will come around during open-beta / first few weeks after launch.
I would rather they delay the game than have a buggy or unpolished launch. WoW players (and others) will tear this game down if launch is anything but perfect.
dequixotic is almost right, but not just the wow players but the hardcore gamers as well, look at swtor, bioware stated oh we arent worried bout all that end game content as people will take a long time leveling and such, meanwhile the hardcore gamers ripped through the game like it was nothing and found hardly anything for end game and also discovered mass high level area bugs and exploits and these people are the most vocal and critical speaking people out there, well maybe not always but in general which drove people aways in droves. Personally this is frustrating to the casual gamer like myself, because all i want is a fun smooth gaming experience and enjoy myself, like many people i work hard in life and i personally would rather not stress about a game being i come to mmo's and such to play and enjoy myself with friends both new and old.
As for beta weekends ive been very disappointed with them i know what mrsnakeg is saying above but generally most these do their tests like this, beta weekend 1 2 and 3, open beta usually only a weekend as well and less not forget these new famous 3 hour stress tests, and these things are great if you only want to test for low level area's. look at AoC, that was fun til bout level 20, then the game was empty and lame for the next 60 levels full of bugs and no end content, thats what happens when you only have weekend beta tests only.
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tiima1Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited January 2013
Where are you getting the exchange rate of 750,000 diamonds for $43?
[SIGPIC]Between two evils, I always pick the one I never tried before.[/SIGPIC]
200$ for all that <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> ???? i Felling i gonna puke cryptic, i was waiting other thing from you.... is totally dissapointing
I like to also add if Cryptic is afraid that there isn't enough content in the game, that people will do everything in under two months, then a clever idea would be to get the Foundry tools out there and have some quality user content available for launch day.
You can even charge people $200 to make you content, that way! What a glorious scam that is. Should register Neverwinter as a religion and go for tax exempt status then let people make you content instead of paying cash for auditing. :P
Comments
Couldn't agree more. Eveyone knows I'm a DDO hater but I did buy MotU (not RotU), the collectors edition in fact, and it WAS indeed worth every penny. People knew upfront what they were getting and the value, here we are left in the dark as usual and are asked to give money on blind faith. Cryptic needs to provide details... a lot of details especially with their cash shop before they put these founder packs up.
And Truth... since when has Turbine EVER produced a non exploitable bug free content update? Their competence when it comes to their product is not the most stellar of quality. People always dread when Turbine goes in and fixes something as they always break more stuff than they fix.
You don't really have to read what is inside the quotes. Though all I said there has been said before by mods and stuff...
...except the fact that my foundry quests (whenever I am allowed make them) will be more awesome than game itself and would be a sandbox experience.
Hmm... that has not been said before. I guess it was a vision of future which I received being an oracle. Now cryptic put that "those who got beta keys from official contest on forums" in the first beta to make my vision come true ...
Especially true now, as people are farming daily quest instances for recipes for the best jewelry/armor pieces for most class in the game, and there was the whole Durchest farming incident... Bah... DDO is more of a grind, with those Epic Red/etc scales... Oh well.
Hopefully this game won't have so much of a grind... I'll just wait till I get chosen for a regular Beta key...
I'm really interested in the Foundry system, to be honest.
Pffftttt.... DDO.... its like comparing a old CRT TV set with new flat very large plasma 3d screen. Not fair to DDO, not fair at all.
Hey, DDO is still unique. For example, unlike Neverwinter, you get to customize points for all of your skills, not just combat ones. (There's also those points you get, 1 per rank, that you spend on enhancements/action boosts/etc)
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if this game has less customization than DDO. Well, this game will probably have more cosmetic customization, but still.
I'd just like to point out to visionstorm01 that there is more to the $200 package than the race, mount, and companion. In-game items listed are (in different locations, so it'd be nice to see a finalized, official list):
1. "Founder's" title (valued at $???)
2. Access to Moonstone Mask's VIP Lounge (valued at $???)
3. Small bag of holding per character (valued at $???)
4. 750,000 Astral Diamonds (valued at $???)
5. 3 extra character slots (valued at $???)
6. Special Drow race (valued at $???)
7. Mount (valued at $???)
8. Companion (valued at $???)
I also wonder if you get what's included in the previous two tiers like the Adventurer's Pack with 6 items in it, the amulet of protection, and the head piece.
Still no clue if those in-game items are really worth $549, or what any individual item is worth. What if I only am interested in the 3 character slots, the mount, the bag of holding, and the companion? Will I ever be able to spend 750k Astral Diamonds, or will that only be enough to last me a couple days?
Just not enough information.
There's also access to the Foundry from the start, instead of only gaining access to it at level 15.
So let's add this up: 5+43+30+6+18+5=$107. Previously I was guestimating $120. And either way that's stll below $200 and nowhere near $549.
Irrelevant as devs have already said everyone can get access to NW foundry at any level - without even playing the game, and for free. So if I never want to play the game, I am free not to and just use foundry.
---- For free!
But of course.
Yeah old CRT is simple enough that you can open it up and replace its parts. The new one hide all those things, and all tinkering is handled differently. Foundry for the Win!!! ^^
yep, so that part does not contributes to $
However, the list they say is only a speculation. Those may not be all the things the pack gives - just important ones. Besides the title of Founder can very much be priceless
Awesome, thanks for providing what you think their approximate value is. Of course things might be different in this game compared to CO and STO, but $450 different? What the heck are they valuing so differently? Or is there even more that will be included but we just haven't seen the finalized list yet?
Does anyone else with experience in CO/STO have a differing estimation on these items?
Access to the Moonstone Mask is sort of access to the VIP lounge in CO's Club Caprice. Again, an item with value in the eye of the beholder. But we could place it on the value of a CO Hideout (restricted in-game hangout spot), again 500 zen.
So, even boosting the amount paid (say the skin is unique and will never be offered on the Z store), we're still at about $120-$150.
Even the "Guardian of the North" is worth maaaybe $30, not the $60 being charged for it. Again titles are in the EOB.
If I were a guessing man, I'd say the remainder is for beta and head-start. Which means for 11 days (or 9 days), you're seeing that as "worth $300". Guardians pay $60, get approximately $20 in stuff, but get 2 days less on the head start.
Whatever floats your boat, I suppose, I'm sure some will pay that. Again, it's all about what value people see in something like this. Heck, people pay $300 for a piece of french toast with Jesus's face on it...
That's a question for the magic eight-ball. No one can answer that question except for Cryptic.
1. "Founder's" title - A special title is given to any STO or CO lifetime member.
2. Access to Moonstone Mask's VIP Lounge - A special lounge is available for the life of the account to any lifetime member.
5. 3 extra character slots - Lifetime members of both STO and CO are given extra character slots as well as...
6. Special Drow race - ...either a special race (STO) and/or a special costume (STO and CO)
Then there's the small bags of holding. Paying members of STO and CO have larger inventories and banks. The priority access. I notice they did not mention whether or not it continues outside of Beta, for for paying and lifetime members on STO and CO it does and was advertised as such. There are just too many similarties to completely ignore. On top of that, it explains why these packages are so expensive and "worth" so much according to the "press release".
Well you know they are always very cryptic in info like that(pun intended)
Anyone still searching for guilds you can check out HCG Hardcore Christian Gamers.
NW FAQ | HCG NW Host Site
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
One can hope they'll answer it then
Anyone still searching for guilds you can check out HCG Hardcore Christian Gamers.
NW FAQ | HCG NW Host Site
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Actually it's free monthly stipend of Zen (500 in both CO and STO). Which, again, brings me back to my argument that this sounds more like Lifetime in many ways. And 750,000 diamonds is no lifetime of 500 Zen a month. Just a drop in the bucket, really.
EDIT: To be mathematically accurate, by the current Exchange rates on STO and CO, it would be around 3750 to 4250 Zen total in comparison to 6000 Zen in just the first year with a Lifetime membership to STO or CO.
Run the beta from February 8 though to launch. More people testing the beta will make for a more polished final product. I understand modern betas are more of a demo but players will find bugs you miss and will make suggestions early, that will ultimately be added anyway, though community correspondence.
Personally, I won't be spending a penny until I get to play the game. Some of the decisions, removing things such as Armor Class, saving throws, etc. I really won't understand until I get to experience.
Neverwinter has yet to prove itself.
Beta weekends give an opportunity for the developers to stress test and provide more focused testing as well. Also, I imagine that in the downtime between beta weekends, they're using the hardware for other things (internal/(pre-)alpha testing, regular builds, etc). During beta weekends, the builds have to be somewhat stable, in between, they could be crashing the server regularly and have expensive debugging code enabled.
Plus it gives them time to try and replicate bugs that players found during the test. What you're talking about (longer term testing) will come around during open-beta / first few weeks after launch.
I would rather they delay the game than have a buggy or unpolished launch. WoW players (and others) will tear this game down if launch is anything but perfect.
As for beta weekends ive been very disappointed with them i know what mrsnakeg is saying above but generally most these do their tests like this, beta weekend 1 2 and 3, open beta usually only a weekend as well and less not forget these new famous 3 hour stress tests, and these things are great if you only want to test for low level area's. look at AoC, that was fun til bout level 20, then the game was empty and lame for the next 60 levels full of bugs and no end content, thats what happens when you only have weekend beta tests only.
You can even charge people $200 to make you content, that way! What a glorious scam that is. Should register Neverwinter as a religion and go for tax exempt status then let people make you content instead of paying cash for auditing. :P