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"We are looking into the data for making lock box and phoenix stuff account wide, but..."

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  • equinox976equinox976 Member Posts: 2,197 Arc User
    ltminns wrote: »
    Sweat has been pouring off their brows as they furiously contemplate the issue. Many a sleepless night, tossing and turning as they ponder. ;)


    They have thought about it... and decided...........

    giphy.gif
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  • ucgsquawk#5883 ucgsquawk Member Posts: 229 Arc User
    Furiously pondering "how do we make money off of the goodwill this could generate?"
    Then curling their mustaches and giving a hearty evil laugh!
  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 13,923 Arc User
    Furiously pondering "how do we make money off of the goodwill this could generate?"
    Then curling their mustaches and giving a hearty evil laugh!

    To be fair, as I mentioned in an earlier post, I'd be willing to pay a set Zen price for a 'Accountwide Ship Unlock Token'


  • mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,872 Arc User
    OOH! a statue of another player that you beat in PvP! :D
    But how would Cryptic gets 3D scans of the player?
    Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
  • equinox976equinox976 Member Posts: 2,197 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    OOH! a statue of another player that you beat in PvP! :D
    But how would Cryptic gets 3D scans of the player?

    Oh, that's easy. ARC already has a wide database of players faces, captured over their webcams :)

    Speaking of which...
    picture-from-mars-picture-fromany-bank-surveillance-44465676.png


  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 5,415 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    I think a fair way of doing something like this would be to do things similar to how SWTOR handles account unlocks, so that rather than a straight account unlock you instead unlock the ability to purchase account-wide access, possibly with different price tiers as well. Would look something like this:

    Phoenix ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 3000 Zen

    Lockbox + Lobi ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 6000 Zen

    Promobox Ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 9000 Zen

    They could also apply a discount for those with multiple copies of the ship across different characters, reducing the cost by 10-30% per copy.
    Post edited by evilmark444 on
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  • shadowfang240shadowfang240 Member Posts: 35,368 Arc User
    you really think that stops alphabet soup?

    and yes, multimillion dollar equipment has far better resolution and pixel count than a 5 dollar CCTV camera - who knew?​​
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  • phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 2,203 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    I think a fair way of doing something like this would be to do things similar to how SWTOR handles account unlocks, so that rather than a straight account unlock you instead unlock the ability to purchase account-wide access, possibly with different price tiers as well. Would look something like this:

    Phoenix ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 3000 Zen

    Lockbox + Lobi ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 6000 Zen

    Promobox Ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 9000 Zen

    They could also apply a discount for those with multiple copies of the ship across different characters, reducing the cost by 10-30% per copy.

    Considering the abysmal drop rate the ships are already expensive enough without that kind of "pay again for what you already have" double-dip nonsense.
  • asha#5521 asha Member Posts: 53 Arc User
    dark4blood wrote: »
    I am all good for making Phoenix boxes account wide as almost all that stuff was originally account wide in the first place and people who came later just missed the opportunity. The regular lockboxes...no, it would basically punish all those who spent billions of EC and sometimes hundreds of dollars to get a ship on a particular character, thus almost be insulting.

    Here here! But also, it may infringe on the goals of cryptic in terms of prosperity....
    Would it be in the best interests of the Players AND cryptic to make this kind of move?
    The character binds and such are there for a reason...
    HOWEVER....
    Making certain ITEMS in the P[hoenix event ACCOUNT WIDE, I feel, would be in the best interests of all parties involved.
    Such as the Phoenix Upgrades and Emotes....
    Cryptic desires for more PvP and also to awaken the Club scene....
    If people had greater access to the Emotes, then i couyld see more folks "dancing' and being more interested in the Club Uniform and such.... (which can be purchased amongst other things related....)
    And if the little guy could access these phoenix upgrades by sending them to other toons via their SHARED ACCOUNT slots? Then it may promote purchasing the Elite Account slots, etc....

    At the end of the day?
    Everyone would be more happy....and prosperous.
    The phoenix upgrades could be taken by one toon (whom is ur main or whatever) and used as much as possible
    or as desired with said toon,; then account bank sent to another character who is holding equip[ment wqhich is character bound etc, etc, etc....
  • echattyechatty Member Posts: 5,389 Arc User
    Phoenix upgrades are account-wide. You can store them in your account bank.
    Now a LTS and loving it.

    Just because you spend money on this game, it does not entitle you to be a jerk if things don't go your way.

    xp8s7wd.jpg
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,230 Arc User
    I think a fair way of doing something like this would be to do things similar to how SWTOR handles account unlocks, so that rather than a straight account unlock you instead unlock the ability to purchase account-wide access, possibly with different price tiers as well. Would look something like this:

    Phoenix ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 3000 Zen

    Lockbox + Lobi ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 6000 Zen

    Promobox Ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 9000 Zen

    They could also apply a discount for those with multiple copies of the ship across different characters, reducing the cost by 10-30% per copy.
    Considering the abysmal drop rate the ships are already expensive enough without that kind of "pay again for what you already have" double-dip nonsense.
    Also "account wide" access still has to respect factionality rules. So if they go the paid toke unlock route it'd presumably have a variable cost based on that.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
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  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 5,415 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    I think a fair way of doing something like this would be to do things similar to how SWTOR handles account unlocks, so that rather than a straight account unlock you instead unlock the ability to purchase account-wide access, possibly with different price tiers as well. Would look something like this:

    Phoenix ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 3000 Zen

    Lockbox + Lobi ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 6000 Zen

    Promobox Ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 9000 Zen

    They could also apply a discount for those with multiple copies of the ship across different characters, reducing the cost by 10-30% per copy.

    Considering the abysmal drop rate the ships are already expensive enough without that kind of "pay again for what you already have" double-dip nonsense.

    It would still be an improvement over what we have now, and I think it's very unlikely to happen any other way
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  • rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 52,165 Arc User

    Phoenix ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 3000 Zen

    Lockbox + Lobi ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 6000 Zen

    Promobox Ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 9000 Zen

    Bit steep honestly. I'd say cut that by half at least. You also have to consider ship tiers as well as we have T5 and T6 ones. Oh and we do have some shuttles too like the Aeon. 6000 for an Aeon is stupid.
    Yes... there was once a time when we got new shuttles for Lobi. I remember those days long gone...
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    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
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  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,230 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »

    Phoenix ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 3000 Zen

    Lockbox + Lobi ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 6000 Zen

    Promobox Ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 9000 Zen

    Bit steep honestly. I'd say cut that by half at least. You also have to consider ship tiers as well as we have T5 and T6 ones. Oh and we do have some shuttles too like the Aeon. 6000 for an Aeon is stupid.
    Yes... there was once a time when we got new shuttles for Lobi. I remember those days long gone...
    Yeah those numbers are amazingly pessimistic. I doubt that Cryptic would use them.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 5,415 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »

    Phoenix ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 3000 Zen

    Lockbox + Lobi ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 6000 Zen

    Promobox Ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 9000 Zen

    Bit steep honestly. I'd say cut that by half at least. You also have to consider ship tiers as well as we have T5 and T6 ones. Oh and we do have some shuttles too like the Aeon. 6000 for an Aeon is stupid.
    Yes... there was once a time when we got new shuttles for Lobi. I remember those days long gone...
    Yeah those numbers are amazingly pessimistic. I doubt that Cryptic would use them.

    Was mostly just an example of the concept using the standard cstore price as a guide, but it wouldn't surprise me either if they did price them that high.
    Lifetime Subscriber since Beta
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  • phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 2,203 Arc User
    I could see some fee for activating a copy of a lockbox ship on another character in some circumstances (maybe), but doing it with phoenix box ships is more likely to simply discourage people from using them on other characters instead of paying it.

    Sure, paying for account unlock level for phoenix box ships may be nice for whales who just buy ships for admiralty cards but the ships themselves tend to be novelty ones from past events rather than ones that make sense for a wide assortment of character concepts so many FtP players simply would not have much incentive to buy that "upgrade" and just use it on one character that it does have pseudo-rp value on.

    And sure, there are halfway decent traits or consoles on some of those phoenix box ships, but nothing to write home about so there still would not be a huge demand for account-wide unlock tokens for them unless those tokens were practically free anyway, and that assumes that the player even gets a ship token from the boxes in the first place. The profit from charging for account wide access tokens would be microscopic at best.

  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,230 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »
    Phoenix ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 3000 Zen

    Lockbox + Lobi ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 6000 Zen

    Promobox Ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 9000 Zen
    Bit steep honestly. I'd say cut that by half at least. You also have to consider ship tiers as well as we have T5 and T6 ones. Oh and we do have some shuttles too like the Aeon. 6000 for an Aeon is stupid.
    Yes... there was once a time when we got new shuttles for Lobi. I remember those days long gone...
    Yeah those numbers are amazingly pessimistic. I doubt that Cryptic would use them.
    Was mostly just an example of the concept using the standard cstore price as a guide, but it wouldn't surprise me either if they did price them that high.
    9000 for a single ship that might be Federation only? I dunno about that. Especially given that you need the ship itself first. I agree with you conceptually, I just think your numbers are too high.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • equinox976equinox976 Member Posts: 2,197 Arc User
    azrael605 wrote: »
    > @equinox976 said:
    > (Quote)
    >
    > Oh, that's easy. ARC already has a wide database of players faces, captured over their webcams :)
    >
    > Speaking of which...
    > (Image)

    That is illegal.
    you really think that stops alphabet soup?

    and yes, multimillion dollar equipment has far better resolution and pixel count than a 5 dollar CCTV camera - who knew?​​


    Wow, you guys are very literal!

    I guess my dry sense of humor doesn't translate very well across the interwebs :)


  • jennycolvinjennycolvin Member Posts: 569 Arc User
    I could see some fee for activating a copy of a lockbox ship on another character in some circumstances (maybe), but doing it with phoenix box ships is more likely to simply discourage people from using them on other characters instead of paying it.
    I think it would be quite the contrary, actually. Also, having the possibility of unlocking a phonix box ship for the entire account would encourage to open more boxes in the hope of getting the token(s) needed for them
    Sure, paying for account unlock level for phoenix box ships may be nice for whales who just buy ships for admiralty cards but the ships themselves tend to be novelty ones from past events rather than ones that make sense for a wide assortment of character concepts so many FtP players simply would not have much incentive to buy that "upgrade" and just use it on one character that it does have pseudo-rp value on.
    I'm not a whale and I'd buy it, if I ever was so lucky as to get a token that could allow me to buy at least one of the ships I wanted from the phoenix store.
    And as far as "character concepts" and "pseudo-rp" values goes... I understand that there are many who likes to rp with their characters, but there are just as many that don't care (and many that don't go past lore stuff - something like "I made a Cardassian toon, so I need a Cardassian ship armed with spiral-wave/disruptor") and of all the rp-players that I know? Pretty much all of them spent a ton of Zen/resources to get the perfect ship for their toon(s).
    And sure, there are halfway decent traits or consoles on some of those phoenix box ships, but nothing to write home about so there still would not be a huge demand for account-wide unlock tokens for them unless those tokens were practically free anyway, and that assumes that the player even gets a ship token from the boxes in the first place. The profit from charging for account wide access tokens would be microscopic at best.
    Debatable. There are good consoles and good traits that are, indeed, something "to write home about". It all depends on what you - personally - consider "worthy" of buying.
    I agree that the chances of getting the ships are not that high, but that's that.
    Without numbers to support neither the "it would sell well" side nor the "it would not sell well" one, it's really hard to say how that would go.
    I'd very much like to have the option to unlock phoenix ships, even though I don't posses any at the moment, but I won't go as far as saying that it would be sell well.
    And really, what harm can it come from this? That they create something and it doesn't go as well as they planned? As if that never happened before.
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  • phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 2,203 Arc User
    I could see some fee for activating a copy of a lockbox ship on another character in some circumstances (maybe), but doing it with phoenix box ships is more likely to simply discourage people from using them on other characters instead of paying it.
    I think it would be quite the contrary, actually. Also, having the possibility of unlocking a phonix box ship for the entire account would encourage to open more boxes in the hope of getting the token(s) needed for them
    Sure, paying for account unlock level for phoenix box ships may be nice for whales who just buy ships for admiralty cards but the ships themselves tend to be novelty ones from past events rather than ones that make sense for a wide assortment of character concepts so many FtP players simply would not have much incentive to buy that "upgrade" and just use it on one character that it does have pseudo-rp value on.
    I'm not a whale and I'd buy it, if I ever was so lucky as to get a token that could allow me to buy at least one of the ships I wanted from the phoenix store.
    And as far as "character concepts" and "pseudo-rp" values goes... I understand that there are many who likes to rp with their characters, but there are just as many that don't care (and many that don't go past lore stuff - something like "I made a Cardassian toon, so I need a Cardassian ship armed with spiral-wave/disruptor") and of all the rp-players that I know? Pretty much all of them spent a ton of Zen/resources to get the perfect ship for their toon(s).
    And sure, there are halfway decent traits or consoles on some of those phoenix box ships, but nothing to write home about so there still would not be a huge demand for account-wide unlock tokens for them unless those tokens were practically free anyway, and that assumes that the player even gets a ship token from the boxes in the first place. The profit from charging for account wide access tokens would be microscopic at best.
    Debatable. There are good consoles and good traits that are, indeed, something "to write home about". It all depends on what you - personally - consider "worthy" of buying.
    I agree that the chances of getting the ships are not that high, but that's that.
    Without numbers to support neither the "it would sell well" side nor the "it would not sell well" one, it's really hard to say how that would go.
    I'd very much like to have the option to unlock phoenix ships, even though I don't posses any at the moment, but I won't go as far as saying that it would be sell well.
    And really, what harm can it come from this? That they create something and it doesn't go as well as they planned? As if that never happened before.

    I am not against the idea of opening phoenix box ships up to account wide use (the opposite in fact), I just do not think the way to go about it is to lock it behind a paywall on top of the extreme rarity.

    Out of hundreds of phoenix boxes I have only ever gotten one UR token, and I have been holding onto it since I have several possible uses for it (like for instance getting the Risan cruiser for the console that goes with the one from the latest summer event ship) but I have yet to decide which single character could use it best.

    If I had one epic instead that would have been easy, before I found out just how rotten the odds are of getting the T6 level the fact that both the Samsar and the Kobali uniforms are phoenix box items inspired me to make a Kobali character (who flies a Chronos at the moment) so the Samsar is a shoo-in if I ever happen to get an epic token. I spent a lot of dil on the boxes so far, but the low odds are not conducive to spending any more on them than is strictly necessary for upgrades (and a ship card or doff now and then) so I have cut back quite a bit.
  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,112 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    You have better odds getting a Lockbox or Promotion Ship out of the box (not Exchange,), than you do of getting a formerly 'free' Event Ship from the Phoenix Store.
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!
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  • sci321sci321 Member Posts: 101 Arc User
    ltminns wrote: »
    You have better odds getting a Lockbox or Promotion Ship out of the box (not Exchange,), than you do of getting a formerly 'free' Event Ship from the Phoenix Store.

    Yeah. That's one of the reasons people want the Phoenix box ships to be account wide unlocks. The drop rate of epic tokens is just too damn low to justify making the ships purchased with it single character unlocks.
  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 9,427 Arc User
    ltminns wrote: »
    You have better odds getting a Lockbox or Promotion Ship out of the box (not Exchange,), than you do of getting a formerly 'free' Event Ship from the Phoenix Store.
    Perhaps.

    Then again, at current dilex rate you can buy 12+ phoenix packs for the price of one lockbox key, so it evens out. ;)
  • phoenixc#0738 phoenixc Member Posts: 2,203 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    warpangel wrote: »
    ltminns wrote: »
    You have better odds getting a Lockbox or Promotion Ship out of the box (not Exchange,), than you do of getting a formerly 'free' Event Ship from the Phoenix Store.
    Perhaps.

    Then again, at current dilex rate you can buy 12+ phoenix packs for the price of one lockbox key, so it evens out. ;)

    Actually, Warpangel's statement is literally true according to tests people have run. The average for lockbox ships is apparently about 1 ship in 250 tries, whereas the phoenix ones run around twice that or so for the T5u tokens and about 1 in 1200 to 1500 boxes for the T6s. Of course, those are the statistical averages, in theory you could get a T6 in the very first phoenix box you ever open or you could never get one ever depending on random chance.
  • asha#5521 asha Member Posts: 53 Arc User
    > @echatty said:
    > Phoenix upgrades are account-wide. You can store them in your account bank.


    Havana okay. Because last year when there was 2 Phoenix events, I couldn't do it myself.
    I guess it was a bug....
  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 13,923 Arc User
    I think a fair way of doing something like this would be to do things similar to how SWTOR handles account unlocks, so that rather than a straight account unlock you instead unlock the ability to purchase account-wide access, possibly with different price tiers as well. Would look something like this:

    Phoenix ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 3000 Zen

    Lockbox + Lobi ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 6000 Zen

    Promobox Ships: once you have one you may purchase an account unlock for 9000 Zen

    They could also apply a discount for those with multiple copies of the ship across different characters, reducing the cost by 10-30% per copy.

    Considering the abysmal drop rate the ships are already expensive enough without that kind of "pay again for what you already have" double-dip nonsense.

    I'd pay it. It STILL works out less expensive than outright purchasing the desired ship again.

    I mean, put it into context; if I were THAT desperate to have a second DSC Constitution on my account I have two options at present:
    - Try to win another one
    - Sell Promo boxes

    Obviously, it's stupid to think that I could win another. Not impossible, but still a pointless mindset. And selling promo boxes involves spending £100's. For a ship I already have on another character.
    So yeah, if the option to unlock said ship for a fixed Zen price was made available, it'd be a hell of a lot better than the aforementioned alternatives.


  • borg0vermindborg0vermind Member Posts: 448 Arc User
    What need to be account wide are lobi items. seriously, at the costs involved in getting them via lobi, it's an insult that they are character bound.
  • baddmoonrizinbaddmoonrizin Member Posts: 7,036 Community Moderator
    "Insult?" The hyperbole is strong with this one. That, or you're overly sensitive to be actually insulted. But I do agree that Lobi items should be account unlocks.
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