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What I was expecting of the Dyson Sphere missions and maps
doubleohnine
Member Posts: 818 Arc User
So, I guess the gallery shots we are seeing are for ground maps. Ok, since we never saw that on the episode, thats completely open to interpretation.
But I thought we were getting SPACE MAPS to fight INSIDE the Sphere? We all know Cryptic loves to TRIBBLE up scale in this game. Well for these missions, I EXPECT Cryptic to FIX the scale mistakes in the TNG episode.
For starters, the exterior shot of the Enterprise outside of the Sphere. In reality you wouldnt see ANY curvature of the Sphere with the Enterprise that close to the exterior walls. The orbit of the Sphere is so ridiculously huge, the Enterprise next to the walls would make the walls look flat, as if it were us standing next to a wall in a building.
For the actual map, since STO doesnt give us full starship movement, the ONLY way to pull this off for STO is to orient the entry door as if its on the BOTTOM of the space map floor. So if our ships are right side up, the space map bottom layer is actually the floor of the surface of the interior. At proper scale, our ships flying around in a space map that looks like a ground map, there should be only an ever so slight, if at all, bowl curve to the bottom surface of the map. The outer walls of the space map should be canvased paintings of the distance. The bottom part of the wall would show an ever so slight upward curvature of the inhabitable surface, and the upper 8/10 of the walls would be painted a hazy gray because you WOULDNT SEE the remaining globe of the sphere out that far from where you were standing on the surface or parked a few thousand feet above it. The roof of the space map is a hazy gray yellow, not a blue sky, and the star should appear dead center of the roof, like its a light fixture in the center of the bedroom.
The mission has us fighting with other ships and maybe some surface anti air assets get activated that we have to fly around and shoot.
But I fully expect Cryptic's art team to TRIBBLE up the proper look of the space map design because they likely wont think in the proper dimensions that I just described and what it would really look like around you if your starship was only a few thousand feet above the inhabitable interior surface of the sphere. Any ground maps, the sky SHOULD be hazy grayish yellow. Could there have been any breathable atmosphere to the Sphere? The art of the episode didnt imply there was an atmosphere canopy over the city structures you could make out. I guess you COULD say there was an invisible shield canopy holding in breathable atmosphere for the inhabitants, if they even needed it.
Im detail oriented. And Im expecting Cryptic to goof up a ton of details when trying to use the Dyson Sphere as the spotlight TNG element to bring in players and make us happy. Ive always wanted Cryptic to be better than the show writers, but they usually fall well short of that.
What are you guys expecting of how the Dyson Sphere is dealt with?
But I thought we were getting SPACE MAPS to fight INSIDE the Sphere? We all know Cryptic loves to TRIBBLE up scale in this game. Well for these missions, I EXPECT Cryptic to FIX the scale mistakes in the TNG episode.
For starters, the exterior shot of the Enterprise outside of the Sphere. In reality you wouldnt see ANY curvature of the Sphere with the Enterprise that close to the exterior walls. The orbit of the Sphere is so ridiculously huge, the Enterprise next to the walls would make the walls look flat, as if it were us standing next to a wall in a building.
For the actual map, since STO doesnt give us full starship movement, the ONLY way to pull this off for STO is to orient the entry door as if its on the BOTTOM of the space map floor. So if our ships are right side up, the space map bottom layer is actually the floor of the surface of the interior. At proper scale, our ships flying around in a space map that looks like a ground map, there should be only an ever so slight, if at all, bowl curve to the bottom surface of the map. The outer walls of the space map should be canvased paintings of the distance. The bottom part of the wall would show an ever so slight upward curvature of the inhabitable surface, and the upper 8/10 of the walls would be painted a hazy gray because you WOULDNT SEE the remaining globe of the sphere out that far from where you were standing on the surface or parked a few thousand feet above it. The roof of the space map is a hazy gray yellow, not a blue sky, and the star should appear dead center of the roof, like its a light fixture in the center of the bedroom.
The mission has us fighting with other ships and maybe some surface anti air assets get activated that we have to fly around and shoot.
But I fully expect Cryptic's art team to TRIBBLE up the proper look of the space map design because they likely wont think in the proper dimensions that I just described and what it would really look like around you if your starship was only a few thousand feet above the inhabitable interior surface of the sphere. Any ground maps, the sky SHOULD be hazy grayish yellow. Could there have been any breathable atmosphere to the Sphere? The art of the episode didnt imply there was an atmosphere canopy over the city structures you could make out. I guess you COULD say there was an invisible shield canopy holding in breathable atmosphere for the inhabitants, if they even needed it.
Im detail oriented. And Im expecting Cryptic to goof up a ton of details when trying to use the Dyson Sphere as the spotlight TNG element to bring in players and make us happy. Ive always wanted Cryptic to be better than the show writers, but they usually fall well short of that.
What are you guys expecting of how the Dyson Sphere is dealt with?
Post edited by doubleohnine on
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Comments
We are. Big ones.
Indeed. The Dysoon Sphere isn't a sector space map, it's a giant system map.
Kirk's Protege.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
but I do love how we have barley any information at all and already people are jumping on Cryptic case, let them show something more than a concept art, then you can rip them to shreds.
Thats what i thought I heard. And if so, they better remember that any space map dressed as a ground map is still one TINY block against the interior wall of a HUUUUUUUUGE volume of space. And you arent going to see ANYTHING of that volume of space but the ground below your ship and the star in the distance.
Capt. Will Conquest of the U.S.S. Crusader
I am pretty sure the developers are more aware of these kinds of things than you, being that they are the ones tasked with rendering it.
I guess Cryptic is going to say the Voth built it. Since the Sphere and the Voth next up cant be an unrelated coincidence. I guess I could buy that. I always ask myself, if the people abandoned it, where are they now? Well, we know the Voth have no problems leaving and abandoning things. Maybe they think they have discovered some new tech they can shoot into the star to restabilize it, and are going to return to reclaim the Sphere as one of their Alpha Quadrant homeworlds once they fix the star inside it?
Capt. Will Conquest of the U.S.S. Crusader
Have you seen how they effed up the scale of many things in this game? Im fairly certain I just put more thought into it then they already have.
Capt. Will Conquest of the U.S.S. Crusader
well now ... aren't you the pompous confrontationalist we've all been waiting for.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
Personally, I think the devs are going to handle the Dyson Sphere space adventure zone perfectly.
We'll see. Rarely do we see them get all the little details just right. Their company motto is "Just Good Enough" remember?
Capt. Will Conquest of the U.S.S. Crusader
Ive been here for years doe. If Cryptic had a reputation of putting out a product above reproach, people like me wouldnt have anything to nitpick about.
Capt. Will Conquest of the U.S.S. Crusader
There is no game that has been made by any developer ever that doesn't attract some degree of whining regarding some useless or superficial topic. This is no different
Do me a favor...
Go to the nearest ocean and take a look over the horizon... You can easily see earths curve, and you a 0 meters from the surface...
The Enterprise was well above the exterior, and the curvature was comparatively small, but still visible.
Flying in a plane at several thousands of feet you can barely notice a curve. Not until you get up near space can you notice a curve. And this is the DYSON SPHERE. Its surface curve is going to be millions of times less subtle from any point you are looking at it from because millions of Earths can fit into the Sphere. So if we as humans or our cameras can barely notice Earths curvature at several thousands of feet above the surface, if the Sphere existed in reality, you wouldnt notice a curve at all. You arent fully thinking through just how BIG the Sphere is and how ridiculously small you are and your eyes are when viewing your surroundings inside one. Get back to me when you are thinking on my level.
As I said in the OP, the Relics episode got the scale wrong too, so dont judge things based on what you saw in that episode.
Capt. Will Conquest of the U.S.S. Crusader
lol More Playschool level realism.
I'd go as far as saying thousands or millions of 'billions' of earths (trillions perhaps ?)....because you can fit more than a million earths in the area of our sun alone.
and you're right..... that scale is far beyond spacial comprehension.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
So if the diameter is 2 AU then that would make the circumference of the sphere 2 au x 3.14 = 939,474,629.88km (583,762,469.844mi). Earths circumference is 40,075 km (24,901 mi).
That is if my calculations and Google's information are correct.
edit: my calculation were off the first time.
I'm also not sure if it should be Cryptic's task to "correct" things from the series. It's equally valid to depict things as closely as possible to what was seen in the episode.
Ringworld Meteor Defense System.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meteor_Defence_System_%28Ringworld%29
There are two options for the atmosphere. One is hold in an Earth-amount of atmosphere with artificial gravity fields that go up miles, much like our own gravity does. This would create a backscatter-filled sky, potentially blue like our own. The far surface's albedo would result in a not-insignificant amount of light being reflected from every direction. How visible this would actually be would be a more technical question. My guess is it could be anywhere from as clear as the moon in the day, to a faint glow obscured by the scattering of more direct light. The 'horizon' would absorb a lot more light than even our own, meaning the upturning edges would be shifted in color like a sunset. But that would only be where the atmosphere fills most of the space in-between, and even then, it might not be as obvious as when a setting sun's light is being blasted through it. At higher angles, the effect would diminish.
The other option is to limit the artificial gravity field, much like it is on starships. This would require a sort of force field to hold in the atmosphere and maintain air pressure. It would result in a thinner area of atmosphere and less backscatter, and so a clearer view of the opposite surface.
Conjoined, Re-emergence, and . . .
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
But they don't even do that!
Not sorry. Scaling is my biggest issue with this game period.
As for the Dyson Sphere concept art, I don't like it. In the episode, the Dyson Sphere was really gritty and blocky with lots of squares and greebles. It was really cool for something so ungodly advanced to be so low tech and basic in appearance. Plus, the juxtaposition of the blocky Sphere up against the very curvaceous Enterprise D made for some nice visuals.
The concept art they're showing is far too.... organic looking? Is that the word I'm looking for?
Either way, there's far too many curves and glowy bits, which basically describes this games visuals in a nutshell. It looks less like a Dyson Sphere, and more like every other area in the game.
Voth dude looks cool though.
In regards to the OP's issues of the original TNG Dysons Sphere and its curvature. Lets remember, it's a television show. And I don't mean that in a demeaning way to the OP or TNG. I mean that in a practical way. I'm in the film and television industry and we cheat things. Cheat things a lot, so they "look right" to the average person. That may mean it's not technically correct. Its what looks good as a final result.
Obviously the curve (or lack there of) when the Enterprise is orbiting is mainly based on the distance of her orbit. But no matter what, it would need a little curve so it "looked right" to the average person watching it. It had to have less curve than a planet to help convey the scale of the thing, but it still needed a little bit to remind you it was still a sphere.
I can see a conversation with the effects and art departments figuring this it out. I don't see they where lazy on the details or inept on how to do it properly. It was probably well thought out. And I'm sure Cryptic will (or have had) similar discussions to figure out what will work out best for the game to the average person.
Obviously scale has been an issue for STO in the past, I agree. But I've never once thought it was out of laziness. They had their reasons, whether technical or creative to do what they did. Same with the TNG sphere.
At any rate, I look forward to the Dyson Sphere and Voth content in STO. I'm excited what I've seen and read so far. Can't wait! See you all in the Final Frontier!
Captain Knight
Commanding Officer, U.S.S. Endeavour NCC-74724
My character Tsin'xing
yup. ^this
billions of miles is a good start.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----