12k gwfs never killed tanks in 4 seconds, and never got godmode in both pve and pvp.
Gwfs in mod 1 and were op in pvp but on par with perma trs, useless in pve, where cws dominate since per-mod1. In mod 2 same stuff, but deep gash bug allowed them to be second in pve and invited by cws. In mod3 hrs pvp were stronger, but useless in pve.
Cws have been way op in pve since launch, now godmode in both pve and pvp. And still complain.
Where are you getting your data?
HRs are outdpsing Cws now during Cn runs...
Sw will be the next dps class! Once they are all geared noone will reach them!
You can come here wishing further nerf to CW it won't help on GWfs!
Ive heard many say "Ive earned my dues" in support of the current OP-ness.
Honestly its just stupid the amount of control AND damage they do.... I do feel its "akin" to GWFs mod 3 having both "tankiness and damage" and they nerfed BOTH!
Unfortunately CWs would rather enjoy the faceroll ROFL wins now while they can, and ruin the future of their class than post saying what should be changed.
I know there are some that do, but for every 10 people saying
"its OP" or "heres what should change" you have someone saying "its fine" or "LOL no more HR/GWF OP - your tears are sweet" and dont even acknowledge its OP...
They are why we have what we have.... DEVs listen to wrong feeback. Period.
I think SOMETHING in the direction of that solo DPS feat "increases damage by 10/20/30 but decreases AOE by 30/20/10"
THis is what things like Assailing force should have for CWs,
The capstone could increase damage by 10/20/30% however decrease control duration bu 10/20/30% as well... More damage, more control. They have both right now - which is why its broken.
Their damage is fine IF they had control -like they did when tenacity first hit live (it was HAMSTER)
OR
Their control is fine, but damage is too much. I say CHOOSE!
So says the guy who never played a Cw,i've read one of your posts, at preview feedback for Control Wizards, and you admitted as much.
Yes,well you see the fact that you don't know the class you are criticizing is more than relevant. So your arguments are inaccurate at best. Argumentum ad hominem doesn't apply when the person presenting a claim has no knowledge of the claims object itself. Can you criticize a surgery with no knowledge of medicine and without having performed an operation yourself? I think not. So roll a Cw,play for a month or two and then come back with some firsthand experience and constructive feedback . I've been playing as a Cw since beta and because i have no experience with other classes i never post any opinions about them. I limit my criticism to my class alone and to those who cry for nerfs like it's a Litany. You won't see my postings on any other class thread but the Library. Vade in pace et temet nosce
Yes,well you see the fact that you don't know the class you are criticizing is more than relevant. So your arguments are inaccurate at best. Argumentum ad hominem doesn't apply when the person presenting a claim has no knowledge of the claims object itself. Can you criticize a surgery with no knowledge of medicine and without having performed an operation yourself? I think not. So roll a Cw,play for a month or two and then come back with some firsthand experience and constructive feedback . I've been playing as a Cw since beta and because i have no experience with other classes i never post any opinions about them. I limit my criticism to my class alone and to those who cry for nerfs like it's a Litany. You won't see my postings on any other class thread but the Library.
If my arguments are inaccurate, then show that, not just say "your opinion doesnt matter because you dont play a CW"
In fact, if youve read my posts MOST of what I even post here (CW thread) doesnt come from me but a friend of mine (who as of this morning was #2 on the leaderboards) who IS a CW....
I also played his CW for about 3-4 weeks at a competitive level in pvp back in module 2. Just because I dont know the ins and outs of the class, doesnt mean I dont know how it operates in PVP. Ive played it, seen it, partied with it, and ASKED people playing it. For a player who doesnt own a lvl 60 CW, I know quite a bit in how they work. The biggest area I lack, is PVE CWs. However, based on ALL the cumulative feedback (and the status of the pvp leaderboards) AND several's experiences....
Conclusion: Its OP and needs a tone down in the single target damage area.
Your analogy is false, to put it to a better analogy it would be a shoulder surgeon who has done a few hand surgeries, talking to a hand surgeon making a suggestion.
Now you could say, "well, your just a shoulder surgeon, come back when youve specialized in hands!" or you could say "I see what your saying, but heres why your wrong"
But I think its pretty clear that SOMETHING needs a fix.
If my arguments are inaccurate, then show that, not just say "your opinion doesnt matter because you dont play a CW"
In fact, if youve read my posts MOST of what I even post here (CW thread) doesnt come from me but a friend of mine (who as of this morning was #2 on the leaderboards) who IS a CW....
I also played his CW for about 3-4 weeks at a competitive level in pvp back in module 2. Just because I dont know the ins and outs of the class, doesnt mean I dont know how it operates in PVP. Ive played it, seen it, partied with it, and ASKED people playing it. For a player who doesnt own a lvl 60 CW, I know quite a bit in how they work. The biggest area I lack, is PVE CWs. However, based on ALL the cumulative feedback (and the status of the pvp leaderboards) AND several's experiences....
Conclusion: Its OP and needs a tone down in the single target damage area.
Your analogy is false, to put it to a better analogy it would be a shoulder surgeon who has done a few hand surgeries, talking to a hand surgeon making a suggestion.
Now you could say, "well, your just a shoulder surgeon, come back when youve specialized in hands!" or you could say "I see what your saying, but heres why your wrong"
But I think its pretty clear that SOMETHING needs a fix.
Cws had their powers nerfed from a range of 10 to 60% (Magic Missile to Sudden Storm to Shard of Avalance),Assailing force does half damage to players,7K damage (800% of my 800 Damage points orb / Half for players) on one enemy every 5secs which is pretty lame PvE wise and Storm Spell chill stacks bug which double procced it was fixed. Now since the proc rate was reduced from 35% to 20%, as well, combined with the bug fix , makes for a final proc rate more or less the same with Mod 3. The 200% increase in damage was to balance the damage nerfs,which is reasonable and in no way OP. Eye of the storm gives 6 secs of critical but believe it or not i didn't find it usefull in pve so don't use it,since it's hard to time right with the ICD. Some Control was increased but Cws can't be the masters of control without CC resistance, CC immunity penetration and tenacity penetration.Also all other classes Control powers should be nerfed so they can't outcontrol a control wizard.Then i can accept even an 80% nerf to damage output,but not before.If you think that this will cause Cws to have too much control then i'll tell you that they are the MASTERS of CONTROL.
It's BUGS bunny i tell you.
0
kempo23Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
The changes you are referring to were implemented on live and you can verify this on Devs Tracker Thread and Patch notes.There is a very notable difference between Preview Spell Storm and Live Spell Storm. Eots is unpredictable and that's why i don't use it. I have to guess when the ICD will end and time my attacks ,which is hard to do. That makes it usefull only at the very start and you have to go from combat to combat after the 20 secs cooldown,or you don't get a proc in time.
Cws had their powers nerfed from a range of 10 to 60% (Magic Missile to Sudden Storm to Shard of Avalance),Assailing force does half damage to players,7K damage (800% of my 800 Damage points orb / Half for players) on one enemy every 5secs which is pretty lame PvE wise and Storm Spell chill stacks bug which double procced it was fixed. Now since the proc rate was reduced from 35% to 20%, as well, combined with the bug fix , makes for a final proc rate more or less the same with Mod 3. The 200% increase in damage was to balance the damage nerfs,which is reasonable and in no way OP. Eye of the storm gives 6 secs of critical but believe it or not i didn't find it usefull in pve so don't use it,since it's hard to time right with the ICD. Some Control was increased but Cws can't be the masters of control without CC resistance, CC immunity penetration and tenacity penetration.Also all other classes Control powers should be nerfed so they can't outcontrol a control wizard.Then i can accept even an 80% nerf to damage output,but not before.If you think that this will cause Cws to have too much control then i'll tell you that they are the MASTERS of CONTROL.
Is this why more than half of page 1 is CWs on the leader boards right now?
But let me guess.... CWs are just "pro" and others need to "L2P"....
No ,that's because assailing force procs on enchant,like plaguefire or flaming, and spell dots,. That means if i cast a spell on a player i don't have to renew assailing since it will proc even after the spell ends due to enchant and other dots,which last beyond the 5secs cooldown. I had made a report on that in preview and suggested that Assailing shouldn't proc on enchant dots or at-wills(no more Icy Ray spamming) and that it should have its damage reduced. They fixed the damage by 50% but not the dots.Also it should have a 75% of proccing in PvP,instead of 100% which has now. No nerfs other than that are needed and lets not forget that this game has PvE as well where assailing is mediocre. Also i'm in favor of having Storm Spell with the initial 35% chance of procing but with 50% less damage output.That makes it more usefull as an Aoe in PvE and more balanced ,as single power,in PvP. If these changes were implemented Cws would have been one of the most balanced classes in the game.
But let me guess.... CWs are just "pro" and others need to "L2P"....
nobody cares about the leaderboard except for one guild xD
when they are losing, they leave at a specific point to avoid having losses and multiple deaths in their records.
hue hue hue hue
nobody cares about the leaderboard except for one guild xD
when they are losing, they leave at a specific point to avoid having losses and multiple deaths in their records.
hue hue hue hue
Leaderboard>>>>>>>>>>>>life, kids, famine, world poverty, wars. And se...............HAMSTER too. Leaderboard>>>all.
0
matii1509Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
1) StormSpell needs an ICD IMO. - Ideally it just wouldnt proc off enchants and ALL damage output just the "base" attack, however they claim its too hard to code... So the only other option is to just give an ICD.
2) A.F. needs to respect DR. - This wont affect it in PVE at all, but nerf the PVP crazy solo damage.
I think they need to move some of the damage from assailing to our single target damage and the shard.
yeah just what we need even more op cws all they need to do is to change eots to give 50% crtic and reduce damage of storm spell by 50% and cws should be fine i dont see why would they ned to nerf solid capstone because of 2 op class skills
Overall DPS must be lowered in pvp. Tenacity was introduced to avoid 4 seconds kills and too much cc. Tone down DPS avere needed and fix bugs causing huge DPS not wai
We have a fix for Assailing Force going to preview today as we currently believe it is one of the leading causes of extra Control Wizard damaging effects currently.
Here is the upcoming patch note:
Assailing Force: This feat may now be resisted and deflected in PVP.
We have a fix for Assailing Force going to preview today as we currently believe it is one of the leading causes of extra Control Wizard damaging effects currently.
Here is the upcoming patch note:
Assailing Force: This feat may now be resisted and deflected in PVP.
This feat is already 2 times less effective on players...
Chaotic neutral - so i can do whatever the hell i want
We have a fix for Assailing Force going to preview today as we currently believe it is one of the leading causes of extra Control Wizard damaging effects currently.
Here is the upcoming patch note:
Assailing Force: This feat may now be resisted and deflected in PVP.
Honestly, Storm Spell is worse than Assailing Force in PvP from what I could see.
We have a fix for Assailing Force going to preview today as we currently believe it is one of the leading causes of extra Control Wizard damaging effects currently.
Here is the upcoming patch note:
Assailing Force: This feat may now be resisted and deflected in PVP.
Panderus, if you are going to allow this to be affected by Damage resistance and Deflection in PVP then the True amount needs to be reverted back, it will need to be 100% effective on players and in PVE. Why?
Some clases can already achieve close to 50% Deflect - Add their DR in on top of that and the feat as it currently stands will get relegated to uselessness for PVP.
Guardian Fighters blocking the feat for 80% Mitigation, and then having their actual mitigation and Deflect effect the damage as well. GWFS with their High amount of DR and Deflect. TRS with high Deflect. HRs with High Deflect.
Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that Assailing does not need a change, but going down this route will negatively effect the entire passive. I woul rather you do away with Assailing and give the capstone an ability to Buff Shards Damage. Give Renes the ability to Play around with Crits and Crit Sev, I don't know.
Please consider PvP balance as a whole. Look at the numbers. My Assailing hits for a max of 6K - 7k at the moment on top end geared players. Allow that to be effected by DR and Deflect and that number will drastically drop. The issue is not so much with Assailiong Force as it is with Storm Spell receiving a buff to both Proc chance and Damage. It is currently proccing a bucketload more than 40%. And with the damage it is able to put out, it is ridiculous.
Please give my Encounters back the damage. I DO NOT want to have to rely on skill less procs to do my damage for me.
Desidus@Xtraordinary91
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
We have a fix for Assailing Force going to preview today as we currently believe it is one of the leading causes of extra Control Wizard damaging effects currently.
Here is the upcoming patch note:
Assailing Force: This feat may now be resisted and deflected in PVP.
The problems with CW damage started after the buff to Storm Spell, not the addition of Assailing Force. I think you may be aiming at the wrong target for this fix.
Panderus, if you are going to allow this to be affected by Damage resistance and Deflection in PVP then the True amount needs to be reverted back, it will need to be 100% effective on players and in PVE. Why?
Some clases can already achieve close to 50% Deflect - Add their DR in on top of that and the feat as it currently stands will get relegated to uselessness for PVP.
Guardian Fighters blocking the feat for 80% Mitigation, and then having their actual mitigation and Deflect effect the damage as well. GWFS with their High amount of DR and Deflect. TRS with high Deflect. HRs with High Deflect.
Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that Assailing does not need a change, but going down this route will negatively effect the entire passive. I woul rather you do away with Assailing and give the capstone an ability to Buff Shards Damage. Give Renes the ability to Play around with Crits and Crit Sev, I don't know.
Please consider PvP balance as a whole. Look at the numbers. My Assailing hits for a max of 6K - 7k at the moment on top end geared players. Allow that to be effected by DR and Deflect and that number will drastically drop. The issue is not so much with Assailiong Force as it is with Storm Spell receiving a buff to both Proc chance and Damage. It is currently proccing a bucketload more than 40%. And with the damage it is able to put out, it is ridiculous.
Please give my Encounters back the damage. I DO NOT want to have to rely on skill less procs to do my damage for me.
So YOU whine, that tanks(high deflection + %DR) can't be damaged by 100%???
What's that for a HAMSTER opinion? Piercing a tank - especially sentinel GWFs as they had no defense at all? That they just waste 7k+ GS for stats, that doesn't work? How borderline can a humanthinking be?
It's the same on HR/TR with SE that totally IGNORE defense at all, which just kill the complete defensive part of GF/GWFs. But yeah... YOU MUST BE DO 100k damage. And giving back damage is NOT wanted. CW are a control class, NOT A DPS class! Go play TR if you want DPS.
Comments
Where are you getting your data?
HRs are outdpsing Cws now during Cn runs...
Sw will be the next dps class! Once they are all geared noone will reach them!
You can come here wishing further nerf to CW it won't help on GWfs!
Mod4 is all about HRs and SWs now...
So says the guy who never played a Cw,i've read one of your posts, at preview feedback for Control Wizards, and you admitted as much.
Familiar with "ad hominem"?
Go look it up.
Yes,well you see the fact that you don't know the class you are criticizing is more than relevant. So your arguments are inaccurate at best. Argumentum ad hominem doesn't apply when the person presenting a claim has no knowledge of the claims object itself. Can you criticize a surgery with no knowledge of medicine and without having performed an operation yourself? I think not. So roll a Cw,play for a month or two and then come back with some firsthand experience and constructive feedback . I've been playing as a Cw since beta and because i have no experience with other classes i never post any opinions about them. I limit my criticism to my class alone and to those who cry for nerfs like it's a Litany. You won't see my postings on any other class thread but the Library. Vade in pace et temet nosce
If my arguments are inaccurate, then show that, not just say "your opinion doesnt matter because you dont play a CW"
In fact, if youve read my posts MOST of what I even post here (CW thread) doesnt come from me but a friend of mine (who as of this morning was #2 on the leaderboards) who IS a CW....
I also played his CW for about 3-4 weeks at a competitive level in pvp back in module 2. Just because I dont know the ins and outs of the class, doesnt mean I dont know how it operates in PVP. Ive played it, seen it, partied with it, and ASKED people playing it. For a player who doesnt own a lvl 60 CW, I know quite a bit in how they work. The biggest area I lack, is PVE CWs. However, based on ALL the cumulative feedback (and the status of the pvp leaderboards) AND several's experiences....
Conclusion: Its OP and needs a tone down in the single target damage area.
Your analogy is false, to put it to a better analogy it would be a shoulder surgeon who has done a few hand surgeries, talking to a hand surgeon making a suggestion.
Now you could say, "well, your just a shoulder surgeon, come back when youve specialized in hands!" or you could say "I see what your saying, but heres why your wrong"
But I think its pretty clear that SOMETHING needs a fix.
Cws had their powers nerfed from a range of 10 to 60% (Magic Missile to Sudden Storm to Shard of Avalance),Assailing force does half damage to players,7K damage (800% of my 800 Damage points orb / Half for players) on one enemy every 5secs which is pretty lame PvE wise and Storm Spell chill stacks bug which double procced it was fixed. Now since the proc rate was reduced from 35% to 20%, as well, combined with the bug fix , makes for a final proc rate more or less the same with Mod 3. The 200% increase in damage was to balance the damage nerfs,which is reasonable and in no way OP. Eye of the storm gives 6 secs of critical but believe it or not i didn't find it usefull in pve so don't use it,since it's hard to time right with the ICD. Some Control was increased but Cws can't be the masters of control without CC resistance, CC immunity penetration and tenacity penetration.Also all other classes Control powers should be nerfed so they can't outcontrol a control wizard.Then i can accept even an 80% nerf to damage output,but not before.If you think that this will cause Cws to have too much control then i'll tell you that they are the MASTERS of CONTROL.
Is this why more than half of page 1 is CWs on the leader boards right now?
Page 1:
11 CWs
2 GWFs
1 DC
4 TR
2 HR
0 GF
0 Warlocks
But let me guess.... CWs are just "pro" and others need to "L2P"....
No ,that's because assailing force procs on enchant,like plaguefire or flaming, and spell dots,. That means if i cast a spell on a player i don't have to renew assailing since it will proc even after the spell ends due to enchant and other dots,which last beyond the 5secs cooldown. I had made a report on that in preview and suggested that Assailing shouldn't proc on enchant dots or at-wills(no more Icy Ray spamming) and that it should have its damage reduced. They fixed the damage by 50% but not the dots.Also it should have a 75% of proccing in PvP,instead of 100% which has now. No nerfs other than that are needed and lets not forget that this game has PvE as well where assailing is mediocre. Also i'm in favor of having Storm Spell with the initial 35% chance of procing but with 50% less damage output.That makes it more usefull as an Aoe in PvE and more balanced ,as single power,in PvP. If these changes were implemented Cws would have been one of the most balanced classes in the game.
nobody cares about the leaderboard except for one guild xD
when they are losing, they leave at a specific point to avoid having losses and multiple deaths in their records.
hue hue hue hue
Leaderboard>>>>>>>>>>>>life, kids, famine, world poverty, wars. And se...............HAMSTER too. Leaderboard>>>all.
and no need to say anything more...
2) A.F. needs to respect DR. - This wont affect it in PVE at all, but nerf the PVP crazy solo damage.
yeah just what we need even more op cws all they need to do is to change eots to give 50% crtic and reduce damage of storm spell by 50% and cws should be fine i dont see why would they ned to nerf solid capstone because of 2 op class skills
Here is the upcoming patch note:
Assailing Force: This feat may now be resisted and deflected in PVP.
This feat is already 2 times less effective on players...
so sad...
Honestly, Storm Spell is worse than Assailing Force in PvP from what I could see.
Panderus, if you are going to allow this to be affected by Damage resistance and Deflection in PVP then the True amount needs to be reverted back, it will need to be 100% effective on players and in PVE. Why?
Some clases can already achieve close to 50% Deflect - Add their DR in on top of that and the feat as it currently stands will get relegated to uselessness for PVP.
Guardian Fighters blocking the feat for 80% Mitigation, and then having their actual mitigation and Deflect effect the damage as well. GWFS with their High amount of DR and Deflect. TRS with high Deflect. HRs with High Deflect.
Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that Assailing does not need a change, but going down this route will negatively effect the entire passive. I woul rather you do away with Assailing and give the capstone an ability to Buff Shards Damage. Give Renes the ability to Play around with Crits and Crit Sev, I don't know.
Please consider PvP balance as a whole. Look at the numbers. My Assailing hits for a max of 6K - 7k at the moment on top end geared players. Allow that to be effected by DR and Deflect and that number will drastically drop. The issue is not so much with Assailiong Force as it is with Storm Spell receiving a buff to both Proc chance and Damage. It is currently proccing a bucketload more than 40%. And with the damage it is able to put out, it is ridiculous.
Please give my Encounters back the damage. I DO NOT want to have to rely on skill less procs to do my damage for me.
19.9k PvP Control Wizard
<Complaints Department>
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
So YOU whine, that tanks(high deflection + %DR) can't be damaged by 100%???
What's that for a HAMSTER opinion? Piercing a tank - especially sentinel GWFs as they had no defense at all? That they just waste 7k+ GS for stats, that doesn't work? How borderline can a humanthinking be?
It's the same on HR/TR with SE that totally IGNORE defense at all, which just kill the complete defensive part of GF/GWFs. But yeah... YOU MUST BE DO 100k damage. And giving back damage is NOT wanted. CW are a control class, NOT A DPS class! Go play TR if you want DPS.
Oh yes! A special class coming to my mind whose are expert in this...
Any words about phantasmal destruction (renegade)?
It doesnt proc since mod 4, I checked with act and even checked the txt file of the log, 0% proc
This should be high priority, renegades are underpowered but with this bug.... even more!
Caturday Survivor
Elemental Evil Survivor
Undermontain Survivor
Mod20 Combat rework Survivor
Mod22 Refinement rework Survivor