So by your logic every news station in the world should just lie down, or every news paper - since "anyone with half a brain and not completely new to the world..." ? (extreme example to make a point)
There are people asking about Cryptic/PWE every day, about if its worth it to buy Founder Packs or investing into this game etc - showing them this truth (among many) is important, in my opinion, aswell as showing the companies that they can't get away with everything.
We're not journalists. We're just players, fans, and/or ticked off customers.
I'm not telling you to stop posting your opinions on this matter or that you complaining about this is wrong. I'm just saying what do you expect out of such a grimey, greedy, unethical publisher like PWE and such an incompetent developer such as Cryptic? They're going to keep doing what they've been doing as long as it works and people keep buying their garbage virtual goods.
Like I said in my earlier posts in this thread, hundreds of people have already alerted the general public to their immoral business practices back when the game first launched. Droves of people either ignored those warnings and/or wasn't aware of the 50+ page threads that was locked and thrown into the "Lower Depths" by their shill mods. This thread will also eventually be locked, moved, and/or forgotten and new players will still be tricked into buying their overpriced garbage packs.
We're not journalists. We're just players, fans, and/or ticked off customers.
I'm not telling you to stop posting your opinions on this matter or that you complaining about this is wrong. I'm just saying what do you expect out of such a grimey, greedy, unethical publisher like PWE and such an incompetent developer such as Cryptic? They're going to keep doing what they've been doing as long as it works and people keep buying their garbage virtual goods.
Like I said in my earlier posts in this thread, hundreds of people have already alerted the general public to their immoral business practices back when the game first launched. Droves of people either ignored those warnings and/or wasn't aware of the 50+ page threads that was locked and thrown into the "Lower Depths" by their shill mods. This thread will also eventually be locked, moved, and/or forgotten and new players will still be tricked into buying their overpriced garbage packs.
I never said we were journalists. Note the "Extreme example to make a point" in my text. It was an example, and thus apply.
I'm saying its pointless for you to simply say "well, what do you expect?". That sentence contributes nothing. Your later criticism on the other hand, sure.
I have requested a refund. They can take back all the items I purchased and the 600k AD. I am not expecting to get my money back, but at least I stood up for myself.
I can honestly think of few companies as nefarious as PWE.
I have requested a refund. They can take back all the items I purchased and the 600k AD. I am not expecting to get my money back, but at least I stood up for myself.
I can honestly think of few companies as nefarious as PWE.
Good for you, hope you get everything back. "Vote with your wallet" is all we are allowed to do.
Same here, and a friend posted. Incl on Twitter.
Its the offhand way they dismissed us on Twitter that really fascinates me. Brilliant move, dismiss and wave off customers you could easily please in this, and should for the game's sake, get their money.... but no. Quick cash grab and angry customers instead.
All you can do is tell people or warn them, but to honest.....since I was in some of those threads...there are a couple of rabid fanbois/paid defenders...such as stormdragon...that insisted we were wrong, or....poor....or jealous instead of what we actually were....knowledgeable on the subject.
So now you know, just remember it and learn from it. Years ago, gaming was done by gamers...then it became profitable and the suits took over. Now it is strictly profit driven and as I have said many times before, PWE/Cryptic is the Payday loan, Rent to own, used car sales man of the gaming world.
Wow this seems really shady I was under the impression that the items in these packs were exclusive.
"We removed items from the original Founder's Pack so only original Founders have them now." This seems completely false, I can't see how a title could be considered an item.
Did some searching this is direct from their press release on Jan. 30, 2013. "...early access to the upcoming Open Beta, VIP perks, and exclusive permanent in-game items"
Also from the same release "... features the following exclusive items that are only available through the Founders' Pack program:"
Looks bad from here.
0
lavatoryloadMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 13Arc User
edited June 2013
I requested a refund too and also contacted Wizards of the Coast. I'm really upset about this and I'll never buy another product from this company or their affiliates -- Wizards of the Coast should be embarrassed. I'm a long time D&D fan and to see the potential and all the garbage that continues to be released/happen/bugs/bots/etc... breaks my heart. I mean just look at the FB page, real D&D fans, real people, ANGRY. Here is the contact page for Wizards if you want it: http://company.wizards.com/contactus
Wow this seems really shady I was under the impression that the items in these packs were exclusive.
"We removed items from the original Founder's Pack so only original Founders have them now." This seems completely false, I can't see how a title could be considered an item.
Did some searching this is direct from their press release on Jan. 30, 2013. "...early access to the upcoming Open Beta, VIP perks, and exclusive permanent in-game items"
Also from the same release "... features the following exclusive items that are only available through the Founders' Pack program:"
Looks bad from here.
It is bad, and they won't even give us the courtesy of a reach-around via an official, serious response - not here, FB or Twitter. I smell prison.
0
goldentulipMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
They are not exclusive permanent in-game items anymore....
I can promise you if I do not receive my full refund I will be reporting them, once again, to the Better Business Bureau (http://www.bbb.org/) and trying to get a full refund through their complaint system.
The items are exactly the same as the Founder's Packs, so PWE has participated in false advertising, deceptive marketing practices, and obtaining money under false pretenses. They clearly stated and implied many times over that the Founder's Packs would only be available for a limited time (the date repeatedly changed throughout 2013) and not they are selling the exact same items with the word 'Founder' removed.
I would not have paid $60 for the title 'Founder'. I bought the pack on May 6th, 2013 because I wanted the Dire Wolf, and this forum had a banner text statement stating that the Founder's Packs would be gone on May 9th, 2013. If I had known that these packs and their items would have been available for all eternity, I would have played the game a whole lot more than before dropping $60 one week into a free to play games 'Open Beta' fiasco.
Honestly, there might be enough here for a class action lawsuit against PWE.
I can promise you if I do not receive my full refund I will be reporting them, once again, to the Better Business Bureau (http://www.bbb.org/) and trying to get a full refund through their complaint system.
The items are exactly the same as the Founder's Packs, so PWE has participated in false advertising, deceptive marketing practices, and obtaining money under false pretenses. They clearly stated and implied many times over that the Founder's Packs would only be available for a limited time (the date repeatedly changed throughout 2013) and not they are selling the exact same items with the word 'Founder' removed.
I would not have paid $60 for the title 'Founder'. I bought the pack on May 6th, 2013 because I wanted the Dire Wolf, and this forum had a banner text statement stating that the Founder's Packs would be gone on May 9th, 2013. If I had known that these packs and their items would have been available for all eternity, I would have played the game a whole lot more than before dropping $60 one week into a free to play games 'Open Beta' fiasco.
Honestly, there might be enough here for a class action lawsuit against PWE.
I comepletely agree with you, just silently sigh over the fact that they've no doubt left loop holes and via certain phrasing (and deleted older posts if needed) can get out of it. Just by saying "Well, its not -exactly- the same pack, since this one doesn't offer an impressive and cool title, and this pack has a different name!"
But I'll seriously chant your name if you go to war, man. Dislike companies getting away with these sort of things, and even more so; people who let them without even voicing a word against it.
0
overclockMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 9Arc User
edited June 2013
Wow, what a bunch of whiny people. I wasn't aware that the founders pack was ever exclusive? I don't remember reading that when I purchased it and I am happy with my purchase. I thought it was a bunch a free stuff, millions of AD and exclusive access to a race etc before anyone else?
It would be pretty idiotic to think they created all this extra content (Race, mount, items etc.) to get 2% of people to pay some money while the other 98% would never have access to it? That doesn't really make any sense.
Wow, what a bunch of whiny people. I wasn't aware that the founders pack was ever exclusive? I don't remember reading that when I purchased it and I am happy with my purchase. I thought it was a bunch a free stuff, millions of AD and exclusive access to a race etc before anyone else?
It would be pretty idiotic to think they created all this extra content (Race, mount, items etc.) to get 2% of people to pay some money while the other 98% would never have access to it? That doesn't really make any sense.
Wow, what a cool and jaded person you are. And clueless; most were aware that the Founders Packs were exclusive, I dont know maybe from the repeated, blatantly obivious statements on the Founders pages and around?
Im glad youre happy with your purchase, as Im sure Cryptic and PW are. Really, good for you.
It would pretty idiotic to even try to argue this with you, judging from your last two sentences.
0
cipher9nemoMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
*sigh*
Year after year, forum after forum, game after game. Why do the haters and the fans have to get into flamewars all the time?
Year after year, forum after forum, game after game. Why do the haters and the fans have to get into flamewars all the time?
Seriously.
I'm iffed at this but I know I would've bought it anyway. It just makes me trust Cryptic even less. I wish they would at LEAST make an announcement that they are permanent and thanking the founders.
Some hate it and some love it, others just LOL. But no one will ever change anyone else's mind in a forum. Its the circle of forum life.
It isnt just forums....it's humans.
There are studies that show that humans will become more entrenched with their opinion when presented with evidence to the contrary. We're a combative little species.
Year after year, forum after forum, game after game. Why do the haters and the fans have to get into flamewars all the time?
And there will always people "whining about the whiners" or talking about haters and flame wars and upsetting people, wich really contributes nothing of value in itself either. (Not disagreeing with you tho.)
I dont know who you're referring to but personally I have yet to see a proper flame war (of notable proportions) in this forum, but haters (and blind lovers/fanbois) will always exist. So?
Only thing to beat it with is arguments and rising above it and debate by example; I urge you to. Lead us!
*back on topic, wich is the Founders Pack scam*
0
dsolzMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
The curious thing about this is how hard would it have been for them to put together a genuinely different Neverwinter pack for $200? That would have a) saved them from all this hate and b) even given them a chance to sell the new pack to people who already had the founder's pack.
Not only is their present strategy morally dubious at best and illegal at worst, it also indicates a completely lazy and incompetent approach to running their business.
Interesting to see that Perfect World's shares have been on the rise lately after the beta of Neverwinter started. I wonder whether that trend will continue when this snippet of news reaches the stock speculators?
These packs were supposed to be unique and now they resell them under different name?!?! Too lazy to make something new?
Good bye Cryptic, good bye Perfect World, I will advise everyone NOT to play your games after this!
It is actually a good thing they did. Selling unique things before the game launches only encourages collector types to not play your game at all if they did not play during the beta. Nothing should ever stop being available in an MMO. No one should ever come to an MMO and say to themselves, "Looks like I arrived too late to get the item I want. I guess I should not bother playing this game." That is what happens when you make things available for a short time and then never make them available again.
You got your founder's title. That is what makes you unique. The rest of the items other players should be able to enjoy too no matter what their start date.
0
cichardMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
its like the electronics store always going out of buisness sale!
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darkstarmjpMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Don't know a single hero of the north pack owner who doesn't feel ripped off. We ever get made fun of in game for being stupid enough to pay $199.99 for a spider mount.
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mrspumaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
So I've been to the website page. Am I the only one who noticed that the Hero of the North package "buy" button is greyed out? I don't think you can actually still buy it. It also has some mouseover text saying "thanks for your interest/support, can still buy the Starter pack and Guardian."
But it seems Hero of the North isn't actually available. At the moment.
It is actually a good thing they did. Selling unique things before the game launches only encourages collector types to not play your game at all if they did not play during the beta. Nothing should ever stop being available in an MMO. No one should ever come to an MMO and say to themselves, "Looks like I arrived too late to get the item I want. I guess I should not bother playing this game." That is what happens when you make things available for a short time and then never make them available again.
You got your founder's title. That is what makes you unique. The rest of the items other players should be able to enjoy too no matter what their start date.
I disagree with basically everything you just wrote, and every argument you tried to make has been met, and countered, before you even wrote them.
Your way of thinking, to me, is really bad for games, MMOs in particular - something that's been evident in MMOs for years and years.
Don't know a single hero of the north pack owner who doesn't feel ripped off. We ever get made fun of in game for being stupid enough to pay $199.99 for a spider mount.
Yeah, while someone like me, who've easily poured the same amount, but into Zen, gets a pass, appearently. People are strange like that.
Imo Founders or VIPs in games (Im often one, but in this I simply waited for once, sensed the reputation etc) help make the game during the first critical stages - as do those who spend in the IRL Cash stores ingame.
You have every right to feel ripped off here, and I feel its only getting worse by the day that Cryptic/PW dont adress this with simple, open communication, instead of vague or veiled ambigous short answers.
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
Well, if that's how it works, that would explain it. But I thought one could purchase them more than once for some reason (even if it's redundant to do so). I guess I misread a forum post a while back, or something.
Thanks for the correction/clearing that up for me, then!
Edit: oh...and in that case, I can understand the ire, if one wanted one of the Packs for exclusivity of the items. Myself, I just wanted the Panther. I'm a huge cat fan/nut ... with too much time and spare change.
Comments
We're not journalists. We're just players, fans, and/or ticked off customers.
I'm not telling you to stop posting your opinions on this matter or that you complaining about this is wrong. I'm just saying what do you expect out of such a grimey, greedy, unethical publisher like PWE and such an incompetent developer such as Cryptic? They're going to keep doing what they've been doing as long as it works and people keep buying their garbage virtual goods.
Like I said in my earlier posts in this thread, hundreds of people have already alerted the general public to their immoral business practices back when the game first launched. Droves of people either ignored those warnings and/or wasn't aware of the 50+ page threads that was locked and thrown into the "Lower Depths" by their shill mods. This thread will also eventually be locked, moved, and/or forgotten and new players will still be tricked into buying their overpriced garbage packs.
I never said we were journalists. Note the "Extreme example to make a point" in my text. It was an example, and thus apply.
I'm saying its pointless for you to simply say "well, what do you expect?". That sentence contributes nothing. Your later criticism on the other hand, sure.
I can honestly think of few companies as nefarious as PWE.
Good for you, hope you get everything back. "Vote with your wallet" is all we are allowed to do.
Its the offhand way they dismissed us on Twitter that really fascinates me. Brilliant move, dismiss and wave off customers you could easily please in this, and should for the game's sake, get their money.... but no. Quick cash grab and angry customers instead.
All you can do is tell people or warn them, but to honest.....since I was in some of those threads...there are a couple of rabid fanbois/paid defenders...such as stormdragon...that insisted we were wrong, or....poor....or jealous instead of what we actually were....knowledgeable on the subject.
So now you know, just remember it and learn from it. Years ago, gaming was done by gamers...then it became profitable and the suits took over. Now it is strictly profit driven and as I have said many times before, PWE/Cryptic is the Payday loan, Rent to own, used car sales man of the gaming world.
"We removed items from the original Founder's Pack so only original Founders have them now." This seems completely false, I can't see how a title could be considered an item.
Did some searching this is direct from their press release on Jan. 30, 2013. "...early access to the upcoming Open Beta, VIP perks, and exclusive permanent in-game items"
Also from the same release "... features the following exclusive items that are only available through the Founders' Pack program:"
Looks bad from here.
It is bad, and they won't even give us the courtesy of a reach-around via an official, serious response - not here, FB or Twitter. I smell prison.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The items are exactly the same as the Founder's Packs, so PWE has participated in false advertising, deceptive marketing practices, and obtaining money under false pretenses. They clearly stated and implied many times over that the Founder's Packs would only be available for a limited time (the date repeatedly changed throughout 2013) and not they are selling the exact same items with the word 'Founder' removed.
I would not have paid $60 for the title 'Founder'. I bought the pack on May 6th, 2013 because I wanted the Dire Wolf, and this forum had a banner text statement stating that the Founder's Packs would be gone on May 9th, 2013. If I had known that these packs and their items would have been available for all eternity, I would have played the game a whole lot more than before dropping $60 one week into a free to play games 'Open Beta' fiasco.
Honestly, there might be enough here for a class action lawsuit against PWE.
I comepletely agree with you, just silently sigh over the fact that they've no doubt left loop holes and via certain phrasing (and deleted older posts if needed) can get out of it. Just by saying "Well, its not -exactly- the same pack, since this one doesn't offer an impressive and cool title, and this pack has a different name!"
But I'll seriously chant your name if you go to war, man. Dislike companies getting away with these sort of things, and even more so; people who let them without even voicing a word against it.
It would be pretty idiotic to think they created all this extra content (Race, mount, items etc.) to get 2% of people to pay some money while the other 98% would never have access to it? That doesn't really make any sense.
Wow, what a cool and jaded person you are. And clueless; most were aware that the Founders Packs were exclusive, I dont know maybe from the repeated, blatantly obivious statements on the Founders pages and around?
Im glad youre happy with your purchase, as Im sure Cryptic and PW are. Really, good for you.
It would pretty idiotic to even try to argue this with you, judging from your last two sentences.
Year after year, forum after forum, game after game. Why do the haters and the fans have to get into flamewars all the time?
Hammerfist Clan. Jump into the Night: NW-DMXWRYTAD
I'm iffed at this but I know I would've bought it anyway. It just makes me trust Cryptic even less. I wish they would at LEAST make an announcement that they are permanent and thanking the founders.
Some hate it and some love it, others just LOL. But no one will ever change anyone else's mind in a forum. Its the circle of forum life.
It isnt just forums....it's humans.
There are studies that show that humans will become more entrenched with their opinion when presented with evidence to the contrary. We're a combative little species.
And there will always people "whining about the whiners" or talking about haters and flame wars and upsetting people, wich really contributes nothing of value in itself either. (Not disagreeing with you tho.)
I dont know who you're referring to but personally I have yet to see a proper flame war (of notable proportions) in this forum, but haters (and blind lovers/fanbois) will always exist. So?
Only thing to beat it with is arguments and rising above it and debate by example; I urge you to. Lead us!
*back on topic, wich is the Founders Pack scam*
Done that a few days ago. I am not getting any response.
Not only is their present strategy morally dubious at best and illegal at worst, it also indicates a completely lazy and incompetent approach to running their business.
Interesting to see that Perfect World's shares have been on the rise lately after the beta of Neverwinter started. I wonder whether that trend will continue when this snippet of news reaches the stock speculators?
It is actually a good thing they did. Selling unique things before the game launches only encourages collector types to not play your game at all if they did not play during the beta. Nothing should ever stop being available in an MMO. No one should ever come to an MMO and say to themselves, "Looks like I arrived too late to get the item I want. I guess I should not bother playing this game." That is what happens when you make things available for a short time and then never make them available again.
You got your founder's title. That is what makes you unique. The rest of the items other players should be able to enjoy too no matter what their start date.
But it seems Hero of the North isn't actually available. At the moment.
Edit: Here's a screenshot of what I see there:
I disagree with basically everything you just wrote, and every argument you tried to make has been met, and countered, before you even wrote them.
Your way of thinking, to me, is really bad for games, MMOs in particular - something that's been evident in MMOs for years and years.
Yeah, while someone like me, who've easily poured the same amount, but into Zen, gets a pass, appearently. People are strange like that.
Imo Founders or VIPs in games (Im often one, but in this I simply waited for once, sensed the reputation etc) help make the game during the first critical stages - as do those who spend in the IRL Cash stores ingame.
You have every right to feel ripped off here, and I feel its only getting worse by the day that Cryptic/PW dont adress this with simple, open communication, instead of vague or veiled ambigous short answers.
This is because you already bought one.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
Thanks for the correction/clearing that up for me, then!
Edit: oh...and in that case, I can understand the ire, if one wanted one of the Packs for exclusivity of the items. Myself, I just wanted the Panther. I'm a huge cat fan/nut ... with too much time and spare change.