Your analogy is off my friend. It's more a factor of if I'm given the chance to help test drive a new vehicle, and putting my own money and time on the line, I help to smooth out the kinks and make it ready for the population as a whole. However when it is released, it's released at a up to 25% less cost then what I paid to help them.
As for supporting the game, I notice PWE user next to your name and not guardian or founder. So thanks, but why don't you let those of us who actually have spent money talk about how we feel wronged, k?
Just because he don't have a title does not mean he is not a guardian or has supported the game, for you to say that is wrong in its self, but I do agree with him you went out and spent your zen as quick as you could so you could have it before the next guy and now the price is dropping and now you want a refund of the zen that you could have saved, no way not going to happen.
As for supporting the game, I notice PWE user next to your name and not guardian or founder. So thanks, but why don't you let those of us who actually have spent money talk about how we feel wronged, k?
Well I just never was that concerned about making myself feel good with a title, but I changed it for you. I've bought the guardian pack, plus zen a few times while in game. I guess it comes down to people feeling that the game is in beta and therefore thinking they should get a refund based that it was in beta and the price changed. Anyhow good luck getting any zen back. Next time I'd suggest waiting till a game goes really live and not I beta before spending money on it, if you are concerned about getting a refund if the price changes.
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ranncoreMember, Moderators, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 2,508
edited June 2013
Really glad you guys did this, I'm not one for spending money on "beta" versions of games, so I've been holding out besides the occasional box here and there. I'm about to mount up.
I don't really care if they reimburse any Zen or not, but I feel they should. The people that bought these things at the higher prices are the people that supported this game the most, like it or not. Who pays $40 for a mount??? The guy that makes this game free to play for most of the other people playing it.
I don't really care if they reimburse any Zen or not, but I feel they should. The people that bought these things at the higher prices are the people that supported this game the most, like it or not. Who pays $40 for a mount??? The guy that makes this game free to play for most of the other people playing it.
Thank you for stating far more eloquently the bottom line.
The people who have invested the most heavily in beta have essentially secured the next content improvements as well as made possible the price breaks, if you think about it.
I understand why some people are annoyed, prices were ridiculously high and even though there's some big drops on some of the items, they're still pretty high so they feel like they've been left out. But it is a good thing to do and direction to take. I'm considering buying one just because it's on sale even though otherwise I wouldn't think twice since it's still pretty high in cost. You can get a lot more for your money in practically any other game even whole games for a t3 mount or expensive (overpriced) epic tier (for those who want to pay for the best and are committed) skins for a t2 sale price mount. I feel like the ones that support the game don't get their value for money. However I do have to say that I do appreciate this as well as the bonus zen and it's great that you're doing so. I hope for further reductions in the future as I'm sure there's a massive amount of people avoiding supporting this game due to extremely high costs. Prices needed to come down and even though people who bought stuff don't benefit yet, they may benefit if there's something they want in future. Although if you do get compensated a little that'd be nice too. Something else in particular that should be reduced is inventory space I think.
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ussultimatumMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
You should consider giving some kind of a bonus zen or coupon to your beta testers that have spent money.
I am a pwe user but have spent around 40k zen on this game and one thing i know, for all you saying that we paid to play early, is that when a new console or new idea comes out they give it to the beta testers for free or a discounted price to test it and charge regular price on release date, not the other way around. I personally feel like they are giving us alpha and beta testers the big free bird by saying we are going to lower the prices of all these items, which i have bought the majority, for the live game people instead of the people who actually helped them fix the exploits, caturday anyone, and glitches in the game. I feel cheated out of that zen and can only hope they relies this and at least give us beta testers who have spent money on this something back.
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just so you know why im am mad
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ghestapwMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I don't expect reimbursement for a sale -- them's the breaks with sales.
But if PWE determines that the 'right' price is 500 less... I won't quit over $5, but I'll be very cool on spending more.
And I might not be a founder, but I've spent $80 on this game so far.
Campaign: The Fenwick Cycle NWS-DKR9GB7KH
Wicks and Things: NW-DI4FMZRR4 : The Fenwick merchant family has lost a caravan! Can you help?
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Into the Fen Wood: NW-DL89DRG7B : Enter the heart of the forest. Can you discover the secret of the Fen Wood?
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zentucknorMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
First these price cuts are a solid move in the right direction. Now just tier the Zen purchasing system and I would be happy.
Ever ask a halfling to watch over your stuff while you visit the privy? Was it there when you returned?
Friar Kalien of Torm
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jnaathraMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Saw this coming a mile away. -cashes in a bunch of AD before price spikes to high- Have not bought anything for the store, it was obviously too damned high. Sorry some of you got suckered.
Scout Tragold - "I haven't lived this long by being brave... it's just another word for stupid."
As a way to thank your customers who have already spent thousands and thousands of dollars / euros / etc on zen, you're going to thank them for their purchases by saying "Hey, everyone ELSE is going to get a discount now, not you." How does this show that you value your customers?
I've spent thousands and thousands of zen on these items already, but I get no rebate? As an open beta player I've tested and bug reported and lost AD and zen to items that were bugged and helped you to fix it. But now, after everything that I've put in, you're going to discount the items I've already purchased? Does this seem backwards to you? Or is it supposed to be a big EFF you to the players that have helped make this game what it is already?
Yes its bad for the short term good for the long term. This is similar to if you buy a new game at 60 dollars then your friend buys the same dame 3 months later for 30$ its the cost of getting stuff early. Prices were probably high to get the founders to empty the free zen purses. people who saved their money to boycott prices are probably feeling smug.
But over all this is a good move for the log run as it will lower some of the sticker shock that new players will have also it will probably get them more money by volume. and a healthy game by far is much more important than a few AD that I COULD have saved but didn't cause I really wanted to be color coordinated.
I don't expect reimbursement for a sale -- them's the breaks with sales.
This is the whole issue I think most people are having. A sale, I get it, should have waited, shame on me. But, a permanent reduction for a digital item with an arbitrary currency amount attached to it? PWE, at least give back to the people that gave to you in the first place.
Again - I don't honestly care... but I know a lot of people do, and it would go a long way to keeping those paying customer to keep paying.
No way, if Cryptic wants to lower the prices, ok great. But don't offer the same items. People paid $40, one week later it’s $30. In a game like this you can’t lower prices on existing items. You can however discontinue the items. Then reset prices with new items. --These game items have real and perceived value, and the perceived value is what gives the items value! It really is a slap in the face to those who paid early.
And to the people who compare these items to bread and cars. It's not even close. These game items do not exist. They cannot lose value over time. They cannot erode or depreciate. They are in a fake world, made up. Cryptic makes up the value and we trust that value. If they continue to do things like this they will lose that trust.
People said prices were too high so they changed it. Beta is for changes. I play a rogue. . Its not all sale change either. Its a pricing policy change. I am sorry people feel bad. I spent a little myself.
Yeah so every time that prices drop in the ZEN store in future they have to pay back the difference to anybody who already bought the item at a higher price , great incentive that will give them to ever lower prices .
Sheesh they can't do right for doing wrong , one minute the prices are too high and people complain , they lower prices and guess what... people still complain and demand refunds , really? that's how things work in the real world , I imagine that you don't go to the local supermarket and demand cash back when they have a sale on items you paid full price for do you? .
I also fail to see how the game being in beta has any relevance , you bought the item at the going rate , you used the item and you benefited (or didn't) from the stuff you bought , get over it .
Pretty sure this isn't what PW wants to leave customers feeling. I can't read their minds. But...pretty darn sure.
Exactly. I'm not going to rage and demand a refund, or scream "I quit". But the truth is when I heard the prices went down, my reaction was not "Good, things are cheaper now." It was "Gee, I wish I hadn't spent any money here." Which I'm sure is not the reaction PWE is looking for from a customer service standpoint.
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rew1ndrMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 8Arc User
edited June 2013
Here's how it goes.
Most people participated in the beta to play the game early - not for the sole reason of reporting bugs. No one was forced to report every single bug they encountered, and if you chose to do so, I applaud you because you did the right thing. Now, whether you spent money during the time you played or not was even MORE of a personal decision than a commitment to contribute to the development of the game. You wanted the mount - now, rather than later. You wanted to retrain - now, rather than later.
I purposely didn't spend a single dime until a) I was 100% sure I would continue to play the game and b) wait for release. Everyone has to understand that they PW is running a game AND a business. You can play the game - COMPLETELY - FOR FREE.
Should I repeat that? You can play - THE WHOLE GAME - FOR FREE.
PW has to reach all of it's audiences. The people who have a ton of money, the people who have little cash, the people who think the prices are good, the people who think the prices are bad. I understanding feeling a little cheated, but this is not the first time you've bought something and the price has changed.
Just enjoy what you've bought!
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Yet another reason why I have not spent any money on this game.
If they don't want to HAMSTER people off, then add new items (with regard to mounts/fashion) to the zen shop at discounted prices leaving the original content at the original price. Drop the prices on consumables. Folks who spent money already on permanent items aren't hurt (too badly I would hope) and prices are more in line with what new and existing players are willing to pay. With how this is being handled though? I just will wait 3-4 months after content is added to buy anything so I can just get it at the discounted price later. If I decide to make any more purchases at this point. This kind of bassackward handling of the situation isn't gonna hurt me at all, it may however hurt their wallet in the long run.
If you can't be constructive in your criticism, go back to world-of-whiners.
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randomone777Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 28Arc User
Exactly. I'm not going to rage and demand a refund, or scream "I quit". But the truth is when I heard the prices went down, my reaction was not "Good, things are cheaper now." It was "Gee, I wish I hadn't spent any money here." Which I'm sure is not the reaction PWE is looking for from a customer service standpoint.
I have to admit, this was my thought as well. I'm glad the prices are dropping (they really were ridiculous) but I sure wish I'd known sooner or it had happened sooner. Heck, I'd likely have spent more over time (even if in smaller chunks).
Ah well, at least new players and those were weren't as "gung ho" as me will benefit. That's a good thing.
Maniacal mage making magical messes; mercifully, made mostly of menaces.
bellaralodunMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Seriously. F this game. I spent weeks and weeks waiting to get wedding attire. I just got it today (and the new dye pack), I was so happy and proud. ONLY to find out your discounting it. (mere hours after buying it) You know how I felt when I saw this sale, I was PO'd. Thanks. Talk about 1,500 zen thrown into the gutter. I really wished I had known... I just finally caved and got it.
Isabella@Bellaralodun (im such a sad wizard atm)
FYI I earned the the money playing the game, not RL money.. so it just hurt a little more.
Your kidding? Right? I mean say you buy a new car as soon as it comes out. You just HAVE to have it first, and drive it before everyone else, so you pay top dollar with no discounts. After a few months they start discounting the price with special offers. Do you really think the dealership is ping to call you up and say "hey the price dropped, we want to send you some money back!"? No way. You spent money to buy stuff as soon as you could. Thanks for supporting the game, but why don't you take your sense of entitlement and move along.
LOL Actually: yes. It's called Price Protection and usually goes 90 days - even for cars.
@Cryptic: the first comment is a fair one, and I'm sure you'll find a way to make it "right" with all previous purchasers, though the answer to the question should have been prepared when the news post was made.
I see that companions are not part of this, so that part is moot. I have a HotN Pack, but a spider doesn't quite fit my Human Cleric or Half-Elf Guardian Fighter, so I picked-up the tier 3 "Sword Coast Armored Horse" - which I see is no longer available (renamed to "Storm Raider Clydesdale" and I suppose changed to a tier 2?) in the Zen Store, which makes it even more rare than either Nightmare now, I guess. So no complaints on the price I paid for that one.
However, I did also buy a Heavy Howler for 4000Z. I wouldn't mind getting back 500Z on that (The difference from the sale price would be even better, but I'm THAT selfish).
It was beta. People where constantly giving feedback that prices where too high, especially on the things that are now at more appropriate prices.
If you've got buyers remorse because you wish you'd paid the lower price, you should have been giving feedback, not only in-game and on forum, but with your wallet--personally I bought the 60$ founder pack that I felt was a decent purchase and nothing else yet. If you paid a price that you agreed to for goods or services that you expected to get, frankly you should just be happy that your future purchase will cost you less.
If you'd held off on your purchases and given this feedback instead, you probably could have gotten a more appropriate price sooner. It's awfully hard to tell that you've overpriced your goods when people are actually buying them!
Dyes are now down to where a reasonable zen exchange can make them worthwhile, or tossing twenty bucks into zen. Respecs are now at a price that respeccing, instead of finding a new game when you goof up your spec, are worthwhile. This is a good thing.
We all were aware the game was in BETA. We all made our purchases voluntarily. It is a good sign that Cryptic and PWE noticed our complaints on Zen Store pricing and addresed a few. Luxury mounts will get a nice cut, and dye packs, which are addictive, are becoming more accesible. On top of it, Respec Tokens will be quite cheap, and those will be needed in the near and far future, as our level 60 characters face the waves of new paragon and epic paths.
No one put a gun on your foreheads to invest your money in the game. Stop the whining. PWE has an excellent RP politics. You should see how those HAMSTER at Wizards of the Coast are treating D&D 4E players, who spent hundres and thousands of dollars on a fine edition that went wrong because of bad management.
Comments
Just because he don't have a title does not mean he is not a guardian or has supported the game, for you to say that is wrong in its self, but I do agree with him you went out and spent your zen as quick as you could so you could have it before the next guy and now the price is dropping and now you want a refund of the zen that you could have saved, no way not going to happen.
Well I just never was that concerned about making myself feel good with a title, but I changed it for you. I've bought the guardian pack, plus zen a few times while in game. I guess it comes down to people feeling that the game is in beta and therefore thinking they should get a refund based that it was in beta and the price changed. Anyhow good luck getting any zen back. Next time I'd suggest waiting till a game goes really live and not I beta before spending money on it, if you are concerned about getting a refund if the price changes.
Thank you for stating far more eloquently the bottom line.
The people who have invested the most heavily in beta have essentially secured the next content improvements as well as made possible the price breaks, if you think about it.
However, we seem to be in the decline phase already since they are lowering the prices.
It might also be good for you guys to read about virtual equity, eroding it and the issues it causes.
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just so you know why im am mad
^^^
This.
This would be a free for PW solution that I know I'd be perfectly happy with!
Try out my first foundry mission - The Missing Youth - NW-DGX79EG65
But if PWE determines that the 'right' price is 500 less... I won't quit over $5, but I'll be very cool on spending more.
And I might not be a founder, but I've spent $80 on this game so far.
Wicks and Things: NW-DI4FMZRR4 : The Fenwick merchant family has lost a caravan! Can you help?
Beggar's Hollow: NW-DR6YG4J2L : Someone, or something, has stolen away many of the Fenwicks' children! Can you find out what happened to them?
Into the Fen Wood: NW-DL89DRG7B : Enter the heart of the forest. Can you discover the secret of the Fen Wood?
u shud have never spent real money then
But over all this is a good move for the log run as it will lower some of the sticker shock that new players will have also it will probably get them more money by volume. and a healthy game by far is much more important than a few AD that I COULD have saved but didn't cause I really wanted to be color coordinated.
This is the whole issue I think most people are having. A sale, I get it, should have waited, shame on me. But, a permanent reduction for a digital item with an arbitrary currency amount attached to it? PWE, at least give back to the people that gave to you in the first place.
Again - I don't honestly care... but I know a lot of people do, and it would go a long way to keeping those paying customer to keep paying.
And to the people who compare these items to bread and cars. It's not even close. These game items do not exist. They cannot lose value over time. They cannot erode or depreciate. They are in a fake world, made up. Cryptic makes up the value and we trust that value. If they continue to do things like this they will lose that trust.
Sheesh they can't do right for doing wrong , one minute the prices are too high and people complain , they lower prices and guess what... people still complain and demand refunds , really? that's how things work in the real world , I imagine that you don't go to the local supermarket and demand cash back when they have a sale on items you paid full price for do you? .
I also fail to see how the game being in beta has any relevance , you bought the item at the going rate , you used the item and you benefited (or didn't) from the stuff you bought , get over it .
Pretty sure this isn't what PW wants to leave customers feeling. I can't read their minds. But...pretty darn sure.
Exactly. I'm not going to rage and demand a refund, or scream "I quit". But the truth is when I heard the prices went down, my reaction was not "Good, things are cheaper now." It was "Gee, I wish I hadn't spent any money here." Which I'm sure is not the reaction PWE is looking for from a customer service standpoint.
Most people participated in the beta to play the game early - not for the sole reason of reporting bugs. No one was forced to report every single bug they encountered, and if you chose to do so, I applaud you because you did the right thing. Now, whether you spent money during the time you played or not was even MORE of a personal decision than a commitment to contribute to the development of the game. You wanted the mount - now, rather than later. You wanted to retrain - now, rather than later.
I purposely didn't spend a single dime until a) I was 100% sure I would continue to play the game and b) wait for release. Everyone has to understand that they PW is running a game AND a business. You can play the game - COMPLETELY - FOR FREE.
Should I repeat that? You can play - THE WHOLE GAME - FOR FREE.
PW has to reach all of it's audiences. The people who have a ton of money, the people who have little cash, the people who think the prices are good, the people who think the prices are bad. I understanding feeling a little cheated, but this is not the first time you've bought something and the price has changed.
Just enjoy what you've bought!
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
I have to admit, this was my thought as well. I'm glad the prices are dropping (they really were ridiculous) but I sure wish I'd known sooner or it had happened sooner. Heck, I'd likely have spent more over time (even if in smaller chunks).
Ah well, at least new players and those were weren't as "gung ho" as me will benefit. That's a good thing.
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Isabella@Bellaralodun (im such a sad wizard atm)
FYI I earned the the money playing the game, not RL money.. so it just hurt a little more.
LOL Actually: yes. It's called Price Protection and usually goes 90 days - even for cars.
@Cryptic: the first comment is a fair one, and I'm sure you'll find a way to make it "right" with all previous purchasers, though the answer to the question should have been prepared when the news post was made.
I see that companions are not part of this, so that part is moot. I have a HotN Pack, but a spider doesn't quite fit my Human Cleric or Half-Elf Guardian Fighter, so I picked-up the tier 3 "Sword Coast Armored Horse" - which I see is no longer available (renamed to "Storm Raider Clydesdale" and I suppose changed to a tier 2?) in the Zen Store, which makes it even more rare than either Nightmare now, I guess. So no complaints on the price I paid for that one.
However, I did also buy a Heavy Howler for 4000Z. I wouldn't mind getting back 500Z on that (The difference from the sale price would be even better, but I'm THAT selfish).
Any word on this?
If you've got buyers remorse because you wish you'd paid the lower price, you should have been giving feedback, not only in-game and on forum, but with your wallet--personally I bought the 60$ founder pack that I felt was a decent purchase and nothing else yet. If you paid a price that you agreed to for goods or services that you expected to get, frankly you should just be happy that your future purchase will cost you less.
If you'd held off on your purchases and given this feedback instead, you probably could have gotten a more appropriate price sooner. It's awfully hard to tell that you've overpriced your goods when people are actually buying them!
Dyes are now down to where a reasonable zen exchange can make them worthwhile, or tossing twenty bucks into zen. Respecs are now at a price that respeccing, instead of finding a new game when you goof up your spec, are worthwhile. This is a good thing.
No one put a gun on your foreheads to invest your money in the game. Stop the whining. PWE has an excellent RP politics. You should see how those HAMSTER at Wizards of the Coast are treating D&D 4E players, who spent hundres and thousands of dollars on a fine edition that went wrong because of bad management.