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Forums > Home› Class Forums› The Temple

GCTRL's "Sentinel" Cleric Tank for PvP - 25% Deflect/1k Regen/2kDef

gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
edited May 2015 in The Temple
GCTRL's "Sentinel" Cleric Tank V3 (PvP)

UPDATE 4:

- I've been getting a lot of requests on this so starting today I'll be recording and uploading Premade vs. Premade matches until I get my ISP changed and can resume streaming. Keep a look out here as I will be adding links to every match from my YouTube channel.

UPDATE 3:

- Daily/Power changes (Screenshot Update)
- New Feat loadout (Screenshot Update)
- Added additional Armor/Weapon Enhancement Enchant choices

UPDATE 2:

- Now at 36% Damage Resistance and 26% Deflect Chance from first two defensive Boons

UPDATE 1:

- Added 5 new gameplay videos
- Made slight Feat changes
INTRODUCTION

The idea behind this build is simple: Be as tanky as possible and still provide considerable team support with light healing and damage mitigation.

Typically what you see most clerics doing when trying to increase their survivability is to stack a significant amount of Defense or Regeneration (usually in the 1000-1400 range) <- This is extremely beneficial as even a small amount of Regen can provide a good boost for recovering quickly after losing large amounts of health.

However, when it comes to burst damage, Regen and Defense can only do so much, this is where Deflect comes in. Normally Clerics do not even consider building up Deflect because it's presumed that you can never get enough of it to make a significant impact. So the rule of thumb going around now is focus on Defense and Regeneration to boost your survivability.

IMHO, this is wrong and cuts your defenses short. Through different gear combinations, enchants and ability score allocation, I've managed to get 26% chance to Deflect - while still having 2430 Defense (36% Damage Resistance) and 1078 Regeneration.

This, in combination with certain defense boosting abilities and weapon/armor enchants, gives your Cleric states of near invulnerability, even in the most dire pvp scenarios imaginable where you are getting focused by multiple targets.

It also allows you to hold/contest points by yourself (similar to the infamous Sentinel GWF, who 99% of the time require more than 2-3 average players to kill).


HOW THIS BUILD PLAYS - VIDEOS

V3 Build:

Lemonade Stand vs. Essence of Aggression - Game 1
Lemonade Stand vs. Essence of Aggression - Game 2
Lemonade Stand vs. Essence of Aggression - Game 3
Lemonade Stand vs. Enemy Team - Game 1
Lemonade Stand vs. Enemy Team - Game 2 <- Lag/Disconnecting starts at 30mins, but we still manage to pull off the win.
Lemonade Stand vs. Enemy Team - Game 3

V1/V2 Build:

1 v 4 - Tanking burst damage <- See 5 for full video
Stalemating a BIS GF with GTenes <- Using Divine Armor in this for fun
Stalemating a BiS Sent GWF w/ GTenes
More stalemating a BiS Sent GWF w/ GTenes <- Other miscellaneous fights including 1v2's
4 v Premade - Deathless Cleric Tanking
1 v 3 - Holding point until backup arrives
1 v 2 - Holding point until backup arrives
RACE & ABILITY SCORE

To get the most deflect possible, and also to help with CC immunity, I picked Halfling. I put points into CON and DEX as I level. DEX for Deflect and CON for HP. Simple.

bB7RXNa.png

POWERS

At-Wills: Sacred Flame, Astral Seal
Encounters: Sun Burst, Healing Word, Astral Shield
Dailies: Divine Armor, Guardian of Faith
Class Features: Foresight, Divine Fortune

YcVbxQN.png

FEATS
3Kf9RlC.png

MY GEAR
t5YGMK7.png

ENCHANTS
Offense Enchants: Silvery for Recovery (Rank 5 minimum)
Defensive Enchants: Silvery for Deflect (Rank 7 minimum)
Utility Enchants: Dark for Movement Speed
Armor Enhancement: Barkshield (Greater/Perfect) or Negation (Perfect)
Weapon Enhancement: Feytouched or Holy Avenger (Greater/Perfect) or Tranquility (Although I do not think Tranquility is working as intended right now, the proc rate seems to be abysmal)


Please leave any questions, comments or suggestions you might have and I will do my best to address them. Also check out my TWITCH and YOUTUBE for more PvP content and godly tanking.
Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
* TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
Post edited by gctrl on
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Comments

  • fondlezfondlez Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Interesting!

    My next character was going to be a Halfing too, lol.

    Thanks for your efforts. But how do you level so fast?!
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    fondlez wrote: »
    Interesting!

    My next character was going to be a Halfing too, lol.

    Thanks for your efforts. But how do you level so fast?!

    Np, its really easy to lvl in this game.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • fordfalcofordfalco Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    I have done this build already, but Con is gratuitously better than Dex. I found dexterity actually kinda sucks balls XD. You should have maxed Con. Also, going full hp with miracle healer is much better, or if you want more regen, go lebel 60 blues which give alot of regen with a mix of boots of sovereignty and sturdy troll helm. But if you max hp, and go miracle healer, you heal alot every encounter you do. Currently, with <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> slots because I gave up on this build because its not really that great XD, i heal 1600 per encounter I use with miracle healer when no allies are around me
  • tyrtallowtyrtallow Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 747 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    It's interesting that when a build that can tackle the "problem" a lot of people in this thread who clearly lack the ability to progress skill-wise with their class finally shows, then people are either outright ignoring it or saying "it's not that great" and now are off somewhere crying about something else.

    @post above
    I don't see you posting a vid about your build.
    You there. New to the game? Feeling overwhelmed? Maybe you think getting to end-game is impossible for a casual player like yourself, or maybe you just need to be around a community that helps each other stay sane and competitive with the latest news, current trends, random chitchat and most of all LEGIT (that is, we try to keep things fair) gameplay. If you don't mind being around quirky people and the rare occasional drama (one of our prominent TR members is apparently a mafia godfather) join nw_legit_community at http://www.nwlegitcommunity.shivtr.com/forum_threads/2330542.
  • danielztdanielzt Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 105 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    Please do make a reference to the original post that pointed out the regeneration build. As your idea clearly comes from his (don't tell me you haven't read his thread xD)
    http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?427911-The-PvP-itemization-that-worked-for-me
  • fondlezfondlez Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    danielzt wrote: »
    Please do make a reference to the original post that pointed out the regeneration build. As your idea clearly comes from his (don't tell me you haven't read his thread xD)
    http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?427911-The-PvP-itemization-that-worked-for-me

    Rubbish. Absolute rubbish!

    1. Regen builds have been around since at least mid-beta. Unspecifiederror is the most famous for espousing them and has had multiple complete build specs stickied by moderators. So, there goes your attribution for Regen on DC.

    2. This is NOT a Regen build in the least. It is a Deflect build. And as far as I can tell, the very first one I have ever seen for DCs. GTRL/HCTRL even goes out of his way to point out that Deflect is normally dismissed by Regen builders, which is very true, just like in the link that you showed:

    "- had a feeling that regen had to do more with the survivability than deflect, since my DC has a lot of heals and damage reductions to fill the shoes of 50% deflect chance."
  • danielztdanielzt Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 105 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    fondlez wrote: »
    Rubbish. Absolute rubbish!

    1. Regen builds have been around since at least mid-beta. Unspecifiederror is the most famous for espousing them and has had multiple complete build specs stickied by moderators. So, there goes your attribution for Regen on DC.

    2. This is NOT a Regen build in the least. It is a Deflect build. And as far as I can tell, the very first one I have ever seen for DCs. GTRL/HCTRL even goes out of his way to point out that Deflect is normally dismissed by Regen builders, which is very true, just like in the link that you showed:

    "- had a feeling that regen had to do more with the survivability than deflect, since my DC has a lot of heals and damage reductions to fill the shoes of 50% deflect chance."

    I think going from Defense+Regen to +Deflect is quite straightforward, I myself went to balance defense/deflect myself the moment i reached reasonable defense (since you can't socket regen even if you want)...
  • fondlezfondlez Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    I have a feeling max CON and max DEX builds will become a lot more important given the combination of painful upcoming changes to DC and CW's. I suspect we will sudden influx of Halflings everywhere! :)
    danielzt wrote: »
    I think going from Defense+Regen to +Deflect is quite straightforward, I myself went to balance defense/deflect myself the moment i reached reasonable defense (since you can't socket regen even if you want)...

    You say that and yet there has never been a build posted explicitly for Deflect which includes committing fully to DEX, so again, there goes your "common sense"-I-knew-it-all-beforehand theory...
  • maahkremuirsongmaahkremuirsong Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    am glad someone can invest his resources on such experiments.

    Never been a fan of regen. I'm more a lifesteal and defense kind of cleric. Yes i love lifesteal!
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    fordfalco wrote: »
    I have done this build already, but Con is gratuitously better than Dex. I found dexterity actually kinda sucks balls XD. You should have maxed Con. Also, going full hp with miracle healer is much better, or if you want more regen, go lebel 60 blues which give alot of regen with a mix of boots of sovereignty and sturdy troll helm. But if you max hp, and go miracle healer, you heal alot every encounter you do. Currently, with <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> slots because I gave up on this build because its not really that great XD, i heal 1600 per encounter I use with miracle healer when no allies are around me

    The point of this build is to get as much deflect as possible while still having a decent amount of hp, regen and defense. There is nothing tankier than this build in the game currently. 25% deflect allows me to tank ridiculous amounts of damage in PvP, having a larger hp pool and more regen is not going to help you against true burst damage, especially when you are proned. I'll be putting up some videos that demonstrate this soon. Remember this is a tank build before it is a healing build.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    danielzt wrote: »
    Please do make a reference to the original post that pointed out the regeneration build. As your idea clearly comes from his (don't tell me you haven't read his thread xD)
    http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?427911-The-PvP-itemization-that-worked-for-me

    That build is solely focused on regen, this build is heavily focused on Deflect while still having a significant amount of regen and defense. This makes it way more tankier than any pure regen build, which lacks the strength to deal with true burst damage.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Streaming now for anyone interested in seeing the build
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • mdor65mdor65 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Change Sun Burst for FF and Divine Fortune for Terrifying Insight and go Rigtheous tree to get healing step . Also change astral seal for brand of the sun and use divine armour with healing boost when target is affected by temp hit points. U will be able to survive longer ,get more divine,and get enough dps to kill someone using ff,brand,and punishing light with 16% more dmg.
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    mdor65 wrote: »
    Change Sun Burst for FF and Divine Fortune for Terrifying Insight and go Rigtheous tree to get healing step . Also change astral seal for brand of the sun and use divine armour with healing boost when target is affected by temp hit points. U will be able to survive longer ,get more divine,and get enough dps to kill someone using ff,brand,and punishing light with 16% more dmg.

    Interesting, but this spec is for purely tanking, holding points, and mitigating damage, I'll let my teammates get the kills. Sunburst is a must, for knocking people away from me/knocking them off the point/interrupting, etc... So its not only good for mitigating damage but its useful for building up extra points in Domination.

    Healing step is the only thing that I've considered trying out, but I really like the extra healing I can give to myself and my team from Invigorated Healing and Moon Touched.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • mdor65mdor65 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    The biggest problem on pvp with dc imo is divinty gain and healing myself with 40%reduction and ff is around 2,5k heal per tick so it it must for my build. Very usefull to heal whole team,do some cool damage,support slow. Healing step is the most powerfull pvp feat giving many dodges and chances to survive. Invigorated healing is not giving as much as needed for pvp heal and hallowed ground will not help your teammates when they will die from one shot.
  • battlestationvbattlestationv Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    i feel the upcoming nerf to sunburst might have an effect on how often you can throw down hollowed ground with this build.
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    battlestationv wrote: »
    i feel the upcoming nerf to sunburst might have an effect on how often you can throw down hollowed ground with this build.

    I didn't notice that much of a difference on the test server, but yeah it will probably be somewhat of a hindrance.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • xiphenonxiphenon Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    gctrl wrote: »
    That build is solely focused on regen, this build is heavily focused on Deflect while still having a significant amount of regen and defense. This makes it way more tankier than any pure regen build, which lacks the strength to deal with true burst damage.

    If I understand deflection mechanism correctly, these around 25% deflect with 50% value gives you efficently around 12.5% damage reduction on average.

    I assume that deflection is calculated before damage reduction by defense. This mean these 12.5% doesn't even "stack" fully with defense.

    Example: if you receive 50,000 damage within a fight, 12.5% are deflected, that are 6250 damage, leaving 43,750 damage. This value is reduced again by defense by 35%. So 28,437,5 damage have been done effectivly to you. However, a real stack of 47,5% (12,5% + 35%) would have reduced the damage to 26,250.

    So, the total effectiviness of deflect to the total defense is more around 8,125%. That's not that great deal.

    Going instead with the full miracle set bonus in combination with HP and regeneration should give similar results.

    Of course, a deflection build might provide the "luck" bonus. If just the "right" attacks are deflected, it can be much more effective in short fights. However, there is also a chance, that instead of the 20k lashing blade only the 500 damage shadow strike is deflected.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • fondlezfondlez Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    xiphenon wrote: »
    If I understand deflection mechanism correctly...
    <snip>

    This is where practice trumps theorycrafting easily. You forget or are not aware of several critical aspects, for example:

    1. Defense and Armor Class are subject to Resistance Ignored effects, including Armor Penetration. Deflection is not.
    2. In PvP, unlike PvE, almost every strike is an attempt at burst damage. This further increases the value of Deflection.
  • xiphenonxiphenon Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    fondlez wrote: »
    This is where practice trumps theorycrafting easily. You forget or are not aware of several critical aspects, for example:

    1. Defense and Armor Class are subject to Resistance Ignored effects, including Armor Penetration. Deflection is not.
    2. In PvP, unlike PvE, almost every strike is an attempt at burst damage. This further increases the value of Deflection.

    Yeah and 25% deflection means that there is a 1/4 chance that a strike got deflected. Now, if you are lucky, e.g. the lashing blade of a rogue gets deflected preventing high burst damage. If you are unlucky, only some at will or low damage encounter power gets deflected while the actual burst encounter is not.

    So, I find this quite unreliable.

    Another question would be if it is possible to deflect when dazed? From the point of logic, it wouldn't.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • topguidestopguides Member Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Hi GCTRL, can I add your guide and videos to http://mmominds.com?
    Thanks
    Neverwinter Best Guides
  • tyrtallowtyrtallow Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 747 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    It practice there are other things to consider beyond just deflection like mitigation from powers/feats and actual dodging. That Lashing Blade could just as easily have done minimal to no damage thanks to mitigation or dodge. Deflect, like defense and HP, is merely part of a "last line of defense". The interplay between all these defensive factors combined with the fact that deflect is "always up" is only part of what makes deflection good. Deflection is always up (there's no reason why deflect wouldn't work if you're dazed) and deflection works first before defense/AC (somebody in the GF forums already figured this out).

    Also, note that given your calculations then the higher damage, the more useful deflect is. Feel free to check gctrl's vid and calculate just how much damage that GWF in full teneb was doing to him in 3 mins. How is the miracle healer set supposed to compete with that? Especially considering that to actually get the most of out of the miracle healer set, you -must- use your encounter powers. What happens when, inevitably, you get caught with all your encounter powers on CD? Surely that's going to happen at some point in 3 minutes, possibly within the first 30 seconds.
    You there. New to the game? Feeling overwhelmed? Maybe you think getting to end-game is impossible for a casual player like yourself, or maybe you just need to be around a community that helps each other stay sane and competitive with the latest news, current trends, random chitchat and most of all LEGIT (that is, we try to keep things fair) gameplay. If you don't mind being around quirky people and the rare occasional drama (one of our prominent TR members is apparently a mafia godfather) join nw_legit_community at http://www.nwlegitcommunity.shivtr.com/forum_threads/2330542.
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    topguides wrote: »
    Hi GCTRL, can I add your guide and videos to http://mmominds.com?
    Thanks

    Of course :) just credit me and put a link to this thread somewhere on it.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    xiphenon wrote: »
    Yeah and 25% deflection means that there is a 1/4 chance that a strike got deflected. Now, if you are lucky, e.g. the lashing blade of a rogue gets deflected preventing high burst damage. If you are unlucky, only some at will or low damage encounter power gets deflected while the actual burst encounter is not.

    So, I find this quite unreliable.

    Another question would be if it is possible to deflect when dazed? From the point of logic, it wouldn't.

    You won't have any idea of how effective it is until you actually try it, and get at least somewhere close to my percentage.

    I've added 5 more video clips to the main post that demonstrate the effectiveness, here are a few:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Nx6p4GC1uU
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSfWNNw4pdI
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • irked01irked01 Banned Users Posts: 91
    edited August 2013
    Yet you are nearly undeafable, but you cant kill anyone as well so...........
  • vorphiedvorphied Member Posts: 1,870 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Not killing anyone as DC is fine.

    That's what your summoned minions-...er party members are there for.
    Sacrilege - Warlock
    Contagion - Cleric
    Testament - Wizard
    Pestilence - Ranger
    Dominion - Paladin

    NIGHTSWATCH

  • swingchildswingchild Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 8 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    irked01 wrote: »
    Yet you are nearly undeafable, but you cant kill anyone as well so...........

    Yeah let's think about this... a cleric that can't die and doesn't kill anything. Sounds like someone EVERYONE would love to have on their team.
  • tancred300tancred300 Member Posts: 58
    edited August 2013
    Interesting indeed. My opinion on it:

    For solo pvp it might be fun to really be immortal, but you cant really do damage so its limited.
    For premade pvp though (which is what matters for me) your build is a bad idea.
    Im already so tanky on my dc that groups tend to switch targets a lot and focus someone else, so that you have to heal them and keep them alife, which your build just cant - not enough healing no crits.

    Also you are using pve feats mostly, just saying.
  • dkcandydkcandy Member Posts: 1,555 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    gctrl - Great to see the concept can be applied to other classes. Soon no one will be able to 1v1 a class in PvP. :D
  • topguidestopguides Member Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    gctrl wrote: »
    Of course :) just credit me and put a link to this thread somewhere on it.

    Thank you, I will post it tomorrow :)
    Neverwinter Best Guides
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