As for toxic players, that one we'd have to trust the community on. When they're pushed off to the side because no one wants to be around them, that should help there. Then with the influx of more players to PvP, well, that means more reports against them. While I'd prefer they straighten themselves out. If getting the banned is what has to happen, it's what has to happen.
Yeah, "toxic players exist" isn't a very good reason for well... anything, except getting rid of them.
As for toxic players, that one we'd have to trust the community on. When they're pushed off to the side because no one wants to be around them, that should help there. Then with the influx of more players to PvP, well, that means more reports against them. While I'd prefer they straighten themselves out. If getting the banned is what has to happen, it's what has to happen.
Yeah, "toxic players exist" isn't a very good reason for well... anything, except getting rid of them.
I know. But the PvP community is small. So not a lot of people reporting them. Which is not helping the situation there. This is compounded by the fact there isn't an ingame means of reporting it. Instead you're best bet is to screenshot or record a video of it, and put a ticket to PWE and wait. That's what we do in the RP community.
Unfortunately the screenshot/video reporting thing can be abused too so it is not always a good thing to have an easy way to do it unless customer service goes into the zone chat logs to confirm it and see what the situation really was. And I know from experience that checking logs like that if you have a lot of complaints can be a real slog, especially if you do not have enough people to handle the avalanche.
Even though this example is not from toxic PvP chat (I haven't actually run into that in STO yet) it does illustrate gaming the complaint system: professional political trolls have been doing the report manipulation trick lately in a lot of games (including STO it turns out), doing things like timing the shots to catch the other side making rebuttals without getting their comrades (or at least only getting their most mild) comments in the shot. It is a good way to silence the hoax busters.
Not too long ago I got suckered into a debate where a pair of trolls started up a political chat furball using standard influence campaign techniques. Along with a few other people I pointed out enough of their inconsistencies that it shut them up for a while (without my using any toxic or offensive language unlike the trolls).
The next day when I logged in I had a ToS complaint notice in my mailbox which showed a few of the statements I used to debunk the trolls, artfully timed to show only myself and few others who were trying to counter their arguments or shut them up, and a 24 hour chat ban for discussing real world politics. The two instigators from the previous day obviously were not censured and were at it again just like the day before, which makes me think that the people investigating the ToS complaints are too inundated to do more than look at the screenshots to make their determination.
What is really needed is a way to call in someone on the spot to take a look at things and trace back the trouble to the start (a few games used to do that, with live GMs), but that would not be very cost effective anymore the way the market is tightening up. There are some AI solutions starting to come into use on the major social platforms that would probably help (it could point out problems to a live person and sift through logs for instance), but implementing them and training them to recognize toxic chat behavior in game chat could take a while.
Fix the bugs would be the first. Punish rage quitters second.
So...your plan to fix the PvP system is to ask for something literally impossible (there will ALWAYS be bugs) followed by punish the few people who dare to dip their toes into PvP and find it overwhelming...typical PvPer attitude.
Do you even bother to play PvP? Or did you just gave it up and wrote it off after a few defeats?
Fix the bugs would be the first. Punish rage quitters second.
So...your plan to fix the PvP system is to ask for something literally impossible (there will ALWAYS be bugs) followed by punish the few people who dare to dip their toes into PvP and find it overwhelming...typical PvPer attitude.
Do you even bother to play PvP? Or did you just gave it up and wrote it off after a few defeats?
Once again...I had to explain zipcorts to YOU. I know way more about PvP than you do. Hell I even posted a very budget friendly PvP build in this thread. So...might wanna check who you are talking to before you think you can pull the I am mighty because I PvP bullcrap.
He could apply that to me, since I've admitted I don't touch PvP in it's current state. Since it's in a state of "pay the most, win the most", or as others would call it, "pay to win". Which I've watched this style harm more games than it has ever helped. Archeage and Revelation Online come to mind here. Terra is another good example of it.
But, as I've also alluded to, if PvP was more fair and balanced I would play it far more than the easy and boring PvE of the game. I'm also sure there are quite a few players that would agree with this as well. So it's not the PvP itself that's keeping players from doing it. It's the unbalanced system that makes it not worth the effort.
And that's the main thing keeping people away from PvP. They don't feel it's worth paying real money in order to be able to compete in PvP in it's current state. But that's also why I try to find a good fairly balanced system they could use for it.
Not really, how to help PvP threads tend to go for a good long while. Right now, I'm surprised it's just on page 10. Some of the usual ones that would normally pitch in with ideas are quiet. Maybe avoiding the forums trolls.
(redacted material quote) - darkbladejk
Ummmm, Pot calling Kettle black?
As a former PvPer Taris, I am honesty sickened by how you are representing yourself as a "member" of the PvP community.
I am sure there are other PvPers who can speak for themselves (and some have). But the way you are trying to go about getting more players into PvP is just shooting yourself, and the community in the foot.
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My character Tsin'xing
I know. But the PvP community is small. So not a lot of people reporting them. Which is not helping the situation there. This is compounded by the fact there isn't an ingame means of reporting it. Instead you're best bet is to screenshot or record a video of it, and put a ticket to PWE and wait. That's what we do in the RP community.
Even though this example is not from toxic PvP chat (I haven't actually run into that in STO yet) it does illustrate gaming the complaint system: professional political trolls have been doing the report manipulation trick lately in a lot of games (including STO it turns out), doing things like timing the shots to catch the other side making rebuttals without getting their comrades (or at least only getting their most mild) comments in the shot. It is a good way to silence the hoax busters.
Not too long ago I got suckered into a debate where a pair of trolls started up a political chat furball using standard influence campaign techniques. Along with a few other people I pointed out enough of their inconsistencies that it shut them up for a while (without my using any toxic or offensive language unlike the trolls).
The next day when I logged in I had a ToS complaint notice in my mailbox which showed a few of the statements I used to debunk the trolls, artfully timed to show only myself and few others who were trying to counter their arguments or shut them up, and a 24 hour chat ban for discussing real world politics. The two instigators from the previous day obviously were not censured and were at it again just like the day before, which makes me think that the people investigating the ToS complaints are too inundated to do more than look at the screenshots to make their determination.
What is really needed is a way to call in someone on the spot to take a look at things and trace back the trouble to the start (a few games used to do that, with live GMs), but that would not be very cost effective anymore the way the market is tightening up. There are some AI solutions starting to come into use on the major social platforms that would probably help (it could point out problems to a live person and sift through logs for instance), but implementing them and training them to recognize toxic chat behavior in game chat could take a while.
Do you even bother to play PvP? Or did you just gave it up and wrote it off after a few defeats?
He could apply that to me, since I've admitted I don't touch PvP in it's current state. Since it's in a state of "pay the most, win the most", or as others would call it, "pay to win". Which I've watched this style harm more games than it has ever helped. Archeage and Revelation Online come to mind here. Terra is another good example of it.
But, as I've also alluded to, if PvP was more fair and balanced I would play it far more than the easy and boring PvE of the game. I'm also sure there are quite a few players that would agree with this as well. So it's not the PvP itself that's keeping players from doing it. It's the unbalanced system that makes it not worth the effort.
And that's the main thing keeping people away from PvP. They don't feel it's worth paying real money in order to be able to compete in PvP in it's current state. But that's also why I try to find a good fairly balanced system they could use for it.
Not really, how to help PvP threads tend to go for a good long while. Right now, I'm surprised it's just on page 10. Some of the usual ones that would normally pitch in with ideas are quiet. Maybe avoiding the forums trolls.
Ummmm, Pot calling Kettle black?
As a former PvPer Taris, I am honesty sickened by how you are representing yourself as a "member" of the PvP community.
I am sure there are other PvPers who can speak for themselves (and some have). But the way you are trying to go about getting more players into PvP is just shooting yourself, and the community in the foot.
Please just drop your aggressive attitude