Startrek timlines has 3 versions of a tos constitution (1701, mirror 1701 and a standard connie) avaible to players. All have better stats than the starting ship and its ships arnt tiered like sto.
Startrek timlines has 3 versions of a tos constitution (1701, mirror 1701 and a standard connie) avaible to players. All have better stats than the starting ship and its ships arnt tiered like sto.
So what, its a browser/mobile game, trash by definition.
There are some people who call this game "trash", and they are no more right or wrong than you calling that game trash. Like the old saying goes, one person's trash is another person's treasure.
Startrek timlines has 3 versions of a tos constitution (1701, mirror 1701 and a standard connie) avaible to players. All have better stats than the starting ship and its ships arnt tiered like sto.
So what, its a browser/mobile game, trash by definition.
No, it is "trash" by *your* definition, which is just your opinion. There are some people who call this game "trash", and they are no more right or wrong than you calling a browser or mobile game trash. Like the old saying goes, one person's trash is another person's treasure.
Yes and the people who call this game trash do not care about anyone else's opinion so why should I care about theirs?
Because, hypothetically, you could be more mature than they are.
IMO, the Excalibur class is one of the coolest ship designs Cryptic has made to date:
So cool, in fact, that they made it the most prominent ship on the game's box art:
Unfortunately, this awesome ship design has essentially been wasted. Why? Because CBS said they cannot make an end game version of the constitution class, and Cryptic(not CBS) decided to make the Excalibur a variant of the constitution in game. Regardless of the CBS decision about the actual constitution class itself, I say it is time to stop wasting the awesome Excalibur design on a low level ship.
Long story short:
1) Make a T6 Excalibur.
2) Lock out the Constitution parts to remain obedient to CBS.
3) Make money.
***edit***
*IF* CBS has in fact told Cryptic that they cannot make end game versions of the connie variants, such as the Excalibur, then I am perfectly willing to accept that. However, *no* dev has *ever* told us CBS said that. All of their comments to date have *only* mentioned the connie itself.
Its ugly.
Thanks for the bump! And yes, there are some people who think *your* favorite ship is ugly too. There is no "right" or "wrong" when it comes to subjective taste.
My only point is that timelines doesn't have a tier system. so the TOS connie is available to be used during all the missions. Sometime I wonder if STO would be better with a tier less system
My only point is that timelines doesn't have a tier system. so the TOS connie is available to be used during all the missions. Sometime I wonder if STO would be better with a tier less system
Trust me, I would prefer it that way. But it would also means the can't sell those ships again whenever a new tier is introduced.
I agree with TGN on this whole thing. The modernized ships inspired by the connie make perfect sense in the context of the game's timeline and could definitely be upgraded to T6 without breaking canon. And goddammit, the Exeter is the prettiest thing in this game. 2409 paint scheme, awesome nacelles, gorgeous saucer....Gods I love that ship.
There's no compelling reason why the modern constitution-inspired ships shouldn't be retrofit to endgame use when my romulan captain's T'varo/Maven is rocking around the Delta Quadrant with impunity, yet not only do some people come in here to argue against it, but they come in with a vitriol that seems almost comical. I have never understood the absolute contempt some people have towards any suggestion that challenges the status quo in this game. The posts in this thread that crack me up are the ones that come in, rage about how a T6 connie doesn't make sense (ignoring that that isn't the point of the thread) and then immediately speak wistfully about a T6 Miranda.
I think the original "NO" quote has been a bit distorted over time.
When Cryptic/ATARI picked up the IP from Perpetual way-back-when (2008), it was assumed that all the ship assets (TV and Movie) would be readily available for use in the game.
Unfortunately, the CBS Licensing Lawyer at the time (who's name I can't remember at the moment) was also in the middle of the dispute with JJ (Bad Robot) and Paramount over the pulling of all previous CBS TOS licensed products off the market in order to more fully push the Nu-Trek movie products to market.
It was this person who in his not-so-divine wisdom, decided that the TOS Connie would not be allowed in the game in any fashion, in order to appease and hopefully adjudicate the ongoing dispute with Bad Robot.
In the mean time, somebody at Cryptic had already designed and fully developed the TOS Connie as a playable asset for the game.
The story goes on that Cryptic, had also made a deal with the founder of GameStop (James McCurry) to release the Connie as an exclusive for their box version of the game during this same time.
When it was discovered that the CBS Licensing Lawyer was not going to let the Connie asset be used in the game, it became a bit of a problem...
McCurry threatened to pull the game from his stores shelves if his agreement with Cryptic for the Connie Exclusive wasn't validated and approved.
At the time, that would have been a very big deal as GameStop was one of the largest PC game sellers in the USA.
Anyway, this became the raison d'être for Cryptic (Dan Stahl) to suggest (say NO) in the forums back then that the Connie would not be enabled as an 'end game' playable ship.
<shrug>
That's interesting, although it doesn't really change anything as far as I can see. Regardless of the backstory, CBS said they can't make an end game connie. That's that. But no dev has ever told us CBS will not allow them to make an end game Excalibur, and that is the question this thread is asking.
Fur Sure... but I thought it might help to alleviate the endless bickering over the topic at hand and also give new light to the possibility of something happening for the 50th Anniversary in this area.
As that particular lawyer is no longer the "Answer Guy" at CBS Licensing, it could possibly be that you and I may both get our wish.
BTW, where did you get that backstory to the Connie issue you posted earlier? As someone who has been on these forums since beta, I have never read that. A link would be great, thanks.
Unfortunately, a direct link to most of the info no longer exists.
But it's all mingled together from various discussions we had back then in the old Cryptic forums and from my memory of those times.
Dan himself, posted about the trouble with getting the Connie in the game at all, back in the original hey-day of this discussion.
The GameStop connection is from an interview with McCurry that I read. (back in 2011)
The Lawyer in charge of the licensing at the time, became a thread all his own when another poster managed to find out who it was.
And the part about the licensing flap is pulled from internet articles posted at the time of the 2009 movie.
The guy who was, and I think still is, in charge of the licencing is John Van Citters since 2005. Unless something has changed, but I haven't heard that it has.
I thought I read somewhere during the summer that a Lady had taken over, but I can't seem to find that article now.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Lots of the ships they have released at t6 atm like the pathfinder, adromina, martok and kayless are varients of there classes anyway with access to there 'family' of skins
Has any one played ST: Timelines? Their ships have a 'star' system and they have placed a TOS Constitution (i.s.s Enterprise) as a 5 star ship (top tier( better stats than the galaxy and 1701D)) So y can they have a tos connie at top tier and we cant have a exeter at top?
Has any one played ST: Timelines? Their ships have a 'star' system and they have placed a TOS Constitution (i.s.s Enterprise) as a 5 star ship (top tier( better stats than the galaxy and 1701D)) So y can they have a tos connie at top tier and we cant have a exeter at top?
Because at the time this game was being created, there was supposedly a conflict between Paramount and CBS as to which merchandise should be top-dog... The Original Series or the JJ-Movies.
So the person in charge of CBS licensing, felt it was better to not have the Classic Enterprise be prominent in the game, since there was a new version (the 2009 Movie version) that it could possibly be in competition with.
Then CBS supposedly told Paramount that They were not going to pull their current Trek Licenses and the matter became moot.
But it was too late for STO to get Their licensing contract altered.
Now with the 50th Anniversary just around the corner and the licensing thing pretty much settled, it might have been possible for STO to get permission to incorporate more of TOS into the game, but we won't know for sure till September rolls around. (or maybe around the time "Star Trek: Beyond" hits the theater screens)
Post edited by daveyny on
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Has any one played ST: Timelines? Their ships have a 'star' system and they have placed a TOS Constitution (i.s.s Enterprise) as a 5 star ship (top tier( better stats than the galaxy and 1701D)) So y can they have a tos connie at top tier and we cant have a exeter at top?
Timelines's story involves a mishmash of histories and alternate histories that would make the Doctor sob uncontrollably over his TARDIS console. And for $ome rea$on they decided to make mid 23rd century starships the equal or better of mid-to-late 24th century ones.
Taste is subjective. The Exeter is cool, but has nothing to do with my request of an Excalibur class. If you want to ask for an Exeter, feel free to post that thread.
This subject comes up so often, they should just make a T6 destroyer with vague visual hommages to the Conny and Exeter and Vesper and be done with it.
Sure, new ships are cool. But once again, that has nothing to do with this thread requesting an Excalibur.
Did they even do the modeling for the Excalibur ? I mean, sure, its wasted if they have a 3D model laying around and are not using it (even at low tier status, it would easily sell for 500-1000zen). Wasted Dev time. No return on investment.
Otherwise I think the artwork itself serves its advertisment purposes. Its a solid visual that screams Trek.
The marketing department really knocked it out of the park on that one.
[img][/img]
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,677Community Moderator
Considering the Excalibur is a T2 cruiser variant and parts can be used on the T2 Cruiser in kitbashing... it does get used. Along with the Connie Refit, Vesper (shudders), and C-Store Exeter.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
I still don't understand how people get the "oh it's a T5/6 Connie" out of this ships design.....
look at the Rhode Island Class.... That diminutive science vessel(if nobody really understands how small it is) could be seen as a triangle-shaped connie... or a non-quad nacelle'd Prometheus.... Hell there are some who've compared it to having Aspects of Voyager.
Looking at the Excalibur class.... Sure there's a connie(refit) aspect in the form of the deflector/hull... Nacelles scream Sovereign... saucer... that's just straight-up Cryptic.
so... what's the argument here? Size? Crew Compliment? Cause i'm pretty sure there's no reason why they can't up-scale the thing and make it a whale-cruiser.
Just like they could up-scale a BoP, lock it's wings, and call it a K'vort Class Battlecruiser....
We don't want what the Feds have. We want the equivalent. We want fairer treatment. Concern, desire, greed to some extent, and passionate belief that the enough people would buy KDF items to make it worth Cryptic's while.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,677Community Moderator
I still don't understand how people get the "oh it's a T5/6 Connie" out of this ships design...
The Excalibur can share parts with the other T2 Cruiser variants, including the Connie. Gameplay purposes, a T2 Excalibur is the same ship as a T2 Connie Refit. Just a different costume.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
I still don't understand how people get the "oh it's a T5/6 Connie" out of this ships design...
The Excalibur can share parts with the other T2 Cruiser variants, including the Connie. Gameplay purposes, a T2 Excalibur is the same ship as a T2 Connie Refit. Just a different costume.
Right. But(and here is the key point), that is all completely within Cryptic's ability to change. If you will refer to the OP, I specifically asked them to lock out the connie parts for a end game Excalibur. So while the T2 Excalibur may "effectively" be the same ship as the Connie, an end game Excalibur would not. It would have completely different stats, and *not* have the connie parts as costume options.
I still don't understand how people get the "oh it's a T5/6 Connie" out of this ships design...
The Excalibur can share parts with the other T2 Cruiser variants, including the Connie. Gameplay purposes, a T2 Excalibur is the same ship as a T2 Connie Refit. Just a different costume.
Sure but that's for people who KNOW what it is... i'm saying look at it from a completely "i've never played this game before" and/or "I don't understand the in's and out's of these ship classes" perspective...
That ship could be ANYTHING. Although it maintains it's cruiser-like aspect it /COULD/ be any scale... any size.
Just like looking at the Rhode Island class carries a Prometheus/Voyager vibe and COULD be mistaken as a cruiser too.
We don't want what the Feds have. We want the equivalent. We want fairer treatment. Concern, desire, greed to some extent, and passionate belief that the enough people would buy KDF items to make it worth Cryptic's while.
Right. So, yes, the ship was obviously used for advertising. Obvious statement is obvious. But unfortunately, it is virtually useless at end game. So what has been "wasted", IMO, is the potential the ship had for any meaningful long term gameplay use. The good news is that Cryptic can change that...unless CBS has specifically said otherwise. And if they have, all they need to do is say so. But *NO* dev has *EVER* told us CBS said they couldn't make an end game excalibur. The *ONLY* thing any actual dev(no, smirk wasn't a dev) has told us about the CBS 'ruling' was about the actual constitution class, which is *not* what I'm asking for.
Tbh ive allways took the constitution class referanced to be the T1. Allways thought the constutution refit was a class of her own. So technically theyve not said they cant do the refit, excaliber, exeter or vesper at a higher tier
Tbh ive allways took the constitution class referanced to be the T1. Allways thought the constutution refit was a class of her own. So technically theyve not said they cant do the refit, excaliber, exeter or vesper at a higher tier
The Connie Refit counts as the Constitution class for the purposes of the restriction.
Tbh ive allways took the constitution class referanced to be the T1. Allways thought the constutution refit was a class of her own. So technically theyve not said they cant do the refit, excaliber, exeter or vesper at a higher tier
Tbh ive allways took the constitution class referanced to be the T1. Allways thought the constutution refit was a class of her own. So technically theyve not said they cant do the refit, excaliber, exeter or vesper at a higher tier
The Connie Refit counts as the Constitution class for the purposes of the restriction.
I would have to agree. However, this thread is *not* about the connie, so I have to ask that anyone who wants to discuss that topic post a separate thread. This thread is only asking for an end game Excalibur, not a connie.
Comments
There are some people who call this game "trash", and they are no more right or wrong than you calling that game trash. Like the old saying goes, one person's trash is another person's treasure.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Because, hypothetically, you could be more mature than they are.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Thanks for the bump! And yes, there are some people who think *your* favorite ship is ugly too. There is no "right" or "wrong" when it comes to subjective taste.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Trust me, I would prefer it that way. But it would also means the can't sell those ships again whenever a new tier is introduced.
"Let them eat static!"
There's no compelling reason why the modern constitution-inspired ships shouldn't be retrofit to endgame use when my romulan captain's T'varo/Maven is rocking around the Delta Quadrant with impunity, yet not only do some people come in here to argue against it, but they come in with a vitriol that seems almost comical. I have never understood the absolute contempt some people have towards any suggestion that challenges the status quo in this game. The posts in this thread that crack me up are the ones that come in, rage about how a T6 connie doesn't make sense (ignoring that that isn't the point of the thread) and then immediately speak wistfully about a T6 Miranda.
I thought I read somewhere during the summer that a Lady had taken over, but I can't seem to find that article now.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Because at the time this game was being created, there was supposedly a conflict between Paramount and CBS as to which merchandise should be top-dog... The Original Series or the JJ-Movies.
So the person in charge of CBS licensing, felt it was better to not have the Classic Enterprise be prominent in the game, since there was a new version (the 2009 Movie version) that it could possibly be in competition with.
Then CBS supposedly told Paramount that They were not going to pull their current Trek Licenses and the matter became moot.
But it was too late for STO to get Their licensing contract altered.
Now with the 50th Anniversary just around the corner and the licensing thing pretty much settled, it might have been possible for STO to get permission to incorporate more of TOS into the game, but we won't know for sure till September rolls around. (or maybe around the time "Star Trek: Beyond" hits the theater screens)
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Timelines's story involves a mishmash of histories and alternate histories that would make the Doctor sob uncontrollably over his TARDIS console. And for $ome rea$on they decided to make mid 23rd century starships the equal or better of mid-to-late 24th century ones.
Taste is subjective. The Exeter is cool, but has nothing to do with my request of an Excalibur class. If you want to ask for an Exeter, feel free to post that thread.
I agree, that would be interesting. However, again, that has nothing to do with this thread requesting an Excalibur.
Sure, new ships are cool. But once again, that has nothing to do with this thread requesting an Excalibur.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I mean, sure, its wasted if they have a 3D model laying around and are not using it (even at low tier status, it would easily sell for 500-1000zen). Wasted Dev time. No return on investment.
Otherwise I think the artwork itself serves its advertisment purposes.
Its a solid visual that screams Trek.
The marketing department really knocked it out of the park on that one.
Considering the Excalibur is a T2 cruiser variant and parts can be used on the T2 Cruiser in kitbashing... it does get used. Along with the Connie Refit, Vesper (shudders), and C-Store Exeter.
Probably became the Nobel class variant of the Assault Cruiser.
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
look at the Rhode Island Class.... That diminutive science vessel(if nobody really understands how small it is) could be seen as a triangle-shaped connie... or a non-quad nacelle'd Prometheus.... Hell there are some who've compared it to having Aspects of Voyager.
Looking at the Excalibur class.... Sure there's a connie(refit) aspect in the form of the deflector/hull... Nacelles scream Sovereign... saucer... that's just straight-up Cryptic.
so... what's the argument here? Size? Crew Compliment? Cause i'm pretty sure there's no reason why they can't up-scale the thing and make it a whale-cruiser.
Just like they could up-scale a BoP, lock it's wings, and call it a K'vort Class Battlecruiser....
The Excalibur can share parts with the other T2 Cruiser variants, including the Connie. Gameplay purposes, a T2 Excalibur is the same ship as a T2 Connie Refit. Just a different costume.
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
Right. But(and here is the key point), that is all completely within Cryptic's ability to change. If you will refer to the OP, I specifically asked them to lock out the connie parts for a end game Excalibur. So while the T2 Excalibur may "effectively" be the same ship as the Connie, an end game Excalibur would not. It would have completely different stats, and *not* have the connie parts as costume options.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Sure but that's for people who KNOW what it is... i'm saying look at it from a completely "i've never played this game before" and/or "I don't understand the in's and out's of these ship classes" perspective...
That ship could be ANYTHING. Although it maintains it's cruiser-like aspect it /COULD/ be any scale... any size.
Just like looking at the Rhode Island class carries a Prometheus/Voyager vibe and COULD be mistaken as a cruiser too.
Your probably right, and it did well for that purpose.
I wouldn't call it wasted either, but it would be nice for it to be further utilized.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
The Connie Refit counts as the Constitution class for the purposes of the restriction.
I would have to agree. However, this thread is *not* about the connie, so I have to ask that anyone who wants to discuss that topic post a separate thread. This thread is only asking for an end game Excalibur, not a connie.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008