I certainly appreciate a improvement in lockbox value (and perceived value), but what would really grab my interest is if, instead of a random number (usually very few) of Lobi crystals in a lockbox, if we could instead get a (transferable) Lobi Crystal Crate with 10 Lobi inside every time, kinda like Drifter Salvage crates in CO. I'd like to have the opportunity to go on the exchange and just purchase some Lobi crates if I want to buy something, rather than needing to buy keys, open lockboxes, hope for the best, open more lockboxes when the best fails to show up, then deal with a bunch of stuff that I have to figure out how to sort/transfer/sell/etc that may or (more likely) may not be the hot new item on the exchange.
All higher-tier prizes become slightly more common
Our hope with these changes is that we’ve managed to further reinforce the sense of value that players feel each time they use a Master Key to open a Lock Box. While these changes will be restricted to the Year of Hell Lock Box for the time being, we are considering updating older boxes with similar changes if they receive a positive reception.
I might be reading too much into this, but does this mean that you are considering removing the duty officer mini-packs (Gamma Quadrant, Reinforcements, and Fleet Support) and introducing new ways of obtaining those doffs?
Additionally, the Weapons Pack that will be found in this Lock Box will offer players that open the pack a choice of the type of weapon they would like to receive – Cannons or Beams. No Ground Weapons will be offered this time around, but they will likely return in future weapon packs.
What does this mean exactly? There are two classes of weapons that count as beams (DBBs and beam arrays), and four classes that count as cannons (DHCs, DCs, single cannons, and turrets).
Also, I actually like some of the ground weapons that come from lockboxes, such as nanite disruptors and Vaadwaur polaron weapons. I hope that these won't be phased out.
All higher-tier prizes become slightly more common
Our hope with these changes is that we’ve managed to further reinforce the sense of value that players feel each time they use a Master Key to open a Lock Box. While these changes will be restricted to the Year of Hell Lock Box for the time being, we are considering updating older boxes with similar changes if they receive a positive reception.
I might be reading too much into this, but does this mean that you are considering removing the duty officer mini-packs (Gamma Quadrant, Reinforcements, and Fleet Support) and introducing new ways of obtaining those doffs?
Additionally, the Weapons Pack that will be found in this Lock Box will offer players that open the pack a choice of the type of weapon they would like to receive – Cannons or Beams. No Ground Weapons will be offered this time around, but they will likely return in future weapon packs.
What does this mean exactly? There are two classes of weapons that count as beams (DBBs and beam arrays), and four classes that count as cannons (DHCs, DCs, single cannons, and turrets).
Also, I actually like some of the ground weapons that come from lockboxes, such as nanite disruptors and Vaadwaur polaron weapons. I hope that these won't be phased out.
They are not getting rid of doff packs as prizes, just Mini-packs.
Thank you I am looking forward to a lockbox for a change.
Rock
Staff Officer Access Denied
Commander of Fleet Dysfunction & Disinfection
Other people are bright;
I alone am dark.
Other people are sharp;
I alone am dull.
Other people have purpose;
I alone don't know.
I drift like a wave on the ocean,
I blow as aimless as the wind
-Lao Tsu
I haven't read the whole thread, but, due to the down time, it's a good time to make a post heh
Okay so the key thing above, the person who explained odds per key are always the same is accurate.
The person who also explained buying keys to sell them to get the money to buy the ship on the exchange was also just as accurate.
So what is exposed? That per key the odds do not change, and that the pricing on the exchange isn't overinflated or elitist control ad infinitim blah blah horse pucky etc., but is, instead, the way of a market, and naturally the more veteran players who look at the entire market and all commodities in it, instead of being entirely focused on a ship and what they can or cannot afford.
So here's a suggestion of a fix that would work for both considered "camps":
* Make the key use have an RNG that isn't static.
Players who know a particular static value and/or method will either avoid buying the keys to open boxes because it's just a bad deal, or will just sell em on the exchange for money, which will happen anyway so long as there are boxes and keys and the items go on the exchange, which, in a way Perfect World banks on to sell Zen.
So, Perfect World, as an example of the change I suggest, let's say when I use a key, it has a one in 6 chance of the following for the most valuable item rewarded by that lockbox:
- 4 sided die with 1 chance to win (25% chance to win)
- 8 sided die with 1 chance to win (12.5% chance to win)
- 16 sided die with 1 chance to win (6% chance to win)
- 32 sided die with 1 chance to win (3% chance to win)
- 128 sided die with 2 chances to win (1.5% chance to win)
- 256 sided die with 3 chances to win (less than 1% chance to win)
So, I use the key, it picks one of these methods, equal potential to pick every single one of them a (16% chance) and the one chosen is displayed along with the roll picked for me (so of a 4 sided die, it picks 2 for me) and the roll that comes up, (say 3) and explains that I won or lost of course, the item given or not etc.
However, when the 128 or 256 sided die is picked and I win, it is broadcast that I am lucky, there can also be an achievement for being lucky 1, 10, 50, 100 times, earned if you win that often of these top 2 tiers of the rolls (the 128 version and 256 versions), while additionally only with the 256 version the player also gets a choice of faction to earn 50 marks as well.
Now, if PWE you are feeling creative, then I suggest 3 versions of a ship:
- 7 day use
- 30 day use
- Permanent use
And that the potential "win" on one of the rolls above includes an equal 33% chance to pick one of these. as well.
I'd also suggest you make ship upgrades an item drop or winnable in a lockbox, and do away with the 700 zen cost, for many of us worked very hard and very long to get a fleet version of a ship that now needs an upgrade, and since we had no way of stopping the upgrade from happening, make it convenient to get done so we can enjoy leveling from 50 to 60 without resenting that our ship isn't leveling due to the new cost we didn't expect when returning to the game....But I digress.
So, back to the RNG, sure there will be times you give away more permanent ships than you wanted to, and sure there will be times players get mad at winning 10 of the 7 day ships in a row, or lesser rewards....
BUT the point of the exercise, the point of a system that you want us to be attracted to purchase from is for PWE to sell keys, to be able to have key pack discounts as a promotion to grow the game not merely keep the player base STO has. And of course this would mean it would be a good idea to make ship slot prices lower as well, and also a droppable item.
The RNG suggestion above is to add a GREATER RANDOM CHANCE in one manner, a LESSER RANDOM CHANCE in another, and make the keys more valuable on the exchange for those who wish to sell them due to a higher demand. A solution that helps a much larger group of players feel better buying keys, both to use and to sell and that makes every new lockbox and ship design promotion that much better for building goodwill and building a larger, more actively purchasing from the c-store player base.
The question is whether Perfect World can wrap their minds around volumetric methods versus looking for large single purchase transactions from a smaller base when the cost of servers and keeping up with technology is upon them, where the market knows a server merger is not a sign of a growing game. Without sugar coating this: Perfect World you will not thrive merely trying to keep the existing player base, but must grow the game base, must appeal to more player playstyles, and please put back exploration of nebulas, this is Star Trek, "....to seek out new life and new civilizations..." after all....But again I digress.
Spent 12k zen no Krenim Ship must of opened over 80boxes
"My life spans millennia. Legions have risen to test me… My ascendance is inevitable. A day, a year, a millennium—it matters not. I hold the patience of stone and the will of stars. Your striving is insignificant. Let your death be the same."
So, Perfect World, as an example of the change I suggest, let's say when I use a key, it has a one in 6 chance of the following for the most valuable item rewarded by that lockbox:
- 4 sided die with 1 chance to win (25% chance to win)
- 8 sided die with 1 chance to win (12.5% chance to win)
- 16 sided die with 1 chance to win (6% chance to win)
- 32 sided die with 1 chance to win (3% chance to win)
- 128 sided die with 2 chances to win (1.5% chance to win)
- 256 sided die with 3 chances to win (less than 1% chance to win)
So, I use the key, it picks one of these methods, equal potential to pick every single one of them a (16% chance) and the one chosen is displayed along with the roll picked for me (so of a 4 sided die, it picks 2 for me) and the roll that comes up, (say 3) and explains that I won or lost of course, the item given or not etc.
So you're saying that Cryptic should change the probability of winning a lockbox ship from ~0.005 to
Oh joy more lockbox ships that will be snapped up and then posted for 100 Million or more EC. Sorry Cryptic I played your lockbox game dropped more cash then I care to think about and in all that time got one count them one ship and it was the Cardasian ship. The others I have I spent WAY to much EC for them. As it stands right now IMHO the lockbox ship thing is broken. Either up the drop rate or bind them to charecter with no selling them on exchange just like the event ships! I wish I could sell event ships but for some reason I get punished by them being bound yet lockbox ones can be freely sold on exchange. Oh well a couple of those new lockbox ships looked interesting but to bad they are lockbox and like I said will be sold for insane numbers.
So you would rather no one be able to buy one of these ships that they want with credits because... You didn't get the result you wanted from a lockbox?
People open more boxes because they can sell these things that they get, including the ships.
They can't sell? They open fewer boxes. They open fewer boxes? Game makes less money. Game makes less money? They find more ways to try and make money. If those ways fail? The game fails.
Save up some credits and you will get whatever ship that you want from any lockbox. It's really simple.
I'm guessing that the lower left is Snoop, but without opening the game and comparing descriptions I don't know about any of the others, and even then I couldn't be 100% sure.
When i decide on which beagle I want I want to be absolutely sure that I am getting what I think I am getting.
While I applaud the effort to improve the perceived value in the lockboxes, whatever that improvement was evaporated quickly as I gained +25 Crafting Skill Catalysts. Those *never* should have been put in a lockbox to begin with, and would have been the first thing I yanked out to improve the perceived value of the lockbox.
So I consolidated a bunch of resources to get my hands on the ships.
And... They're fun little ships. This is my first time playing with a Pilot BOff. I like Lock Trajectory but it seems like a waste as a BO power and more like something I'd expect from a trait. Maybe it's good in a build where you have slots to spare. I just threw together builds for grinding the traits.
I find I miss my Mobius, honestly. I'm dreading the idea of having to re-earn it via chance box and still hope against hope there's a better and cheaper way to upgrade it. I'd really just like it with a pilot hybrid station. Maybe Pilot and command, with Science and Command for the Wells.
I really enjoy the Invicible starship trait and in retrospect the traits seem almost specifically tailored to things I've said about game balance before. I think Invincible + Blaze of Glory plus my new warp core immunity and some of my regen options in my Mobius make for a nice regen scrapper build. Nothing was ever on cooldown on my Mobius and I have a feeling Invincible will prove very very nasty on that ship once I also get potentiality, which should make silencing my ship also dangerous for enemies.
Why isn't there an explanation on the Trait "Overwhelming Force" in the Blog ?
And before you all come down on me for being lazy , it has no entry in the STOWiki either (link) , nor does anything come up when entering the term into the forums search engine .
Hate to tell you this but small boosts are still showing up.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
All higher-tier prizes become slightly more common
Our hope with these changes is that we’ve managed to further reinforce the sense of value that players feel each time they use a Master Key to open a Lock Box. While these changes will be restricted to the Year of Hell Lock Box for the time being, we are considering updating older boxes with similar changes if they receive a positive reception.
I might be reading too much into this, but does this mean that you are considering removing the duty officer mini-packs (Gamma Quadrant, Reinforcements, and Fleet Support) and introducing new ways of obtaining those doffs?
Additionally, the Weapons Pack that will be found in this Lock Box will offer players that open the pack a choice of the type of weapon they would like to receive – Cannons or Beams. No Ground Weapons will be offered this time around, but they will likely return in future weapon packs.
What does this mean exactly? There are two classes of weapons that count as beams (DBBs and beam arrays), and four classes that count as cannons (DHCs, DCs, single cannons, and turrets).
Also, I actually like some of the ground weapons that come from lockboxes, such as nanite disruptors and Vaadwaur polaron weapons. I hope that these won't be phased out.
I believe it means that only the larger version of the packs can be obtained. I opened around 20 boxes and got 2 large R&D packs. This means you get only the packs that give you more doffs/items. Strangely I didn't get a single common quality doff pack of any kind. The very first box I opened gave me an ultra rare doff pack for that new Krenim doff and that was the only doff pack I got.
As for the weapons: I double clicked a weapon pack and there were only 2 options: beams or cannons. I didn't open it but I'm guessing that the cannon option gives you a random cannon type item and the beam option gives you either a dual beam bank or beam array. In other words you can't choose exactly what type of weapon you want, just the category.
Trendy, please, where is the announcement for new ship slots??! I ran out. Only ones left are either lockboxes or T5-U C-Store ships (which can't be reclaimed as T5-U). Please, please, urgently increase the ship-cap limit!
When you upgrade a c-store ship to T5-U it gives that ship a free upgrade at account level for all other characters. That also means if you delete and reclaim that same ship on your character at a later date you can upgrade it again for free.
Trendy, please, where is the announcement for new ship slots??! I ran out. Only ones left are either lockboxes or T5-U C-Store ships (which can't be reclaimed as T5-U). Please, please, urgently increase the ship-cap limit!
When you upgrade a c-store ship to T5-U it gives that ship a free upgrade at account level for all other characters. That also means if you delete and reclaim that same ship on your character at a later date you can upgrade it again for free.
Too bad fleet ships don't work that way...
Well the upgrade applies the same way to fleet ships, also C-Store variants of fleet ships. But if you're talking about reclaiming them, then yes that badly needs addressed.
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
I read so much joy and angst; and honestly my only comment since I just got back after a severe illness is I hope the beagles mean there's some foreshadowing of "Enterprise" tie-ins.
Comments
I guess they couldnt find a negative on that to comment on
@Liath | My PRIMUS Page | Altaholics | New Vehicle Models | New Emblems | Flag Tights
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*Updated to work on Embedded/Non embedded forums post August 2015 Changes
What does this mean exactly? There are two classes of weapons that count as beams (DBBs and beam arrays), and four classes that count as cannons (DHCs, DCs, single cannons, and turrets).
Also, I actually like some of the ground weapons that come from lockboxes, such as nanite disruptors and Vaadwaur polaron weapons. I hope that these won't be phased out.
Consisting of a shuttle for the grand prize and +5 xp boosts, ec's , dilithium, and lobi are an additional cost to opening them with Master Keys.
My character Tsin'xing
Staff Officer Access Denied
Commander of Fleet Dysfunction & Disinfection
Other people are bright;
I alone am dark.
Other people are sharp;
I alone am dull.
Other people have purpose;
I alone don't know.
I drift like a wave on the ocean,
I blow as aimless as the wind
-Lao Tsu
Okay so the key thing above, the person who explained odds per key are always the same is accurate.
The person who also explained buying keys to sell them to get the money to buy the ship on the exchange was also just as accurate.
So what is exposed? That per key the odds do not change, and that the pricing on the exchange isn't overinflated or elitist control ad infinitim blah blah horse pucky etc., but is, instead, the way of a market, and naturally the more veteran players who look at the entire market and all commodities in it, instead of being entirely focused on a ship and what they can or cannot afford.
So here's a suggestion of a fix that would work for both considered "camps":
* Make the key use have an RNG that isn't static.
Players who know a particular static value and/or method will either avoid buying the keys to open boxes because it's just a bad deal, or will just sell em on the exchange for money, which will happen anyway so long as there are boxes and keys and the items go on the exchange, which, in a way Perfect World banks on to sell Zen.
So, Perfect World, as an example of the change I suggest, let's say when I use a key, it has a one in 6 chance of the following for the most valuable item rewarded by that lockbox:
- 4 sided die with 1 chance to win (25% chance to win)
- 8 sided die with 1 chance to win (12.5% chance to win)
- 16 sided die with 1 chance to win (6% chance to win)
- 32 sided die with 1 chance to win (3% chance to win)
- 128 sided die with 2 chances to win (1.5% chance to win)
- 256 sided die with 3 chances to win (less than 1% chance to win)
So, I use the key, it picks one of these methods, equal potential to pick every single one of them a (16% chance) and the one chosen is displayed along with the roll picked for me (so of a 4 sided die, it picks 2 for me) and the roll that comes up, (say 3) and explains that I won or lost of course, the item given or not etc.
However, when the 128 or 256 sided die is picked and I win, it is broadcast that I am lucky, there can also be an achievement for being lucky 1, 10, 50, 100 times, earned if you win that often of these top 2 tiers of the rolls (the 128 version and 256 versions), while additionally only with the 256 version the player also gets a choice of faction to earn 50 marks as well.
Now, if PWE you are feeling creative, then I suggest 3 versions of a ship:
- 7 day use
- 30 day use
- Permanent use
And that the potential "win" on one of the rolls above includes an equal 33% chance to pick one of these. as well.
I'd also suggest you make ship upgrades an item drop or winnable in a lockbox, and do away with the 700 zen cost, for many of us worked very hard and very long to get a fleet version of a ship that now needs an upgrade, and since we had no way of stopping the upgrade from happening, make it convenient to get done so we can enjoy leveling from 50 to 60 without resenting that our ship isn't leveling due to the new cost we didn't expect when returning to the game....But I digress.
So, back to the RNG, sure there will be times you give away more permanent ships than you wanted to, and sure there will be times players get mad at winning 10 of the 7 day ships in a row, or lesser rewards....
BUT the point of the exercise, the point of a system that you want us to be attracted to purchase from is for PWE to sell keys, to be able to have key pack discounts as a promotion to grow the game not merely keep the player base STO has. And of course this would mean it would be a good idea to make ship slot prices lower as well, and also a droppable item.
The RNG suggestion above is to add a GREATER RANDOM CHANCE in one manner, a LESSER RANDOM CHANCE in another, and make the keys more valuable on the exchange for those who wish to sell them due to a higher demand. A solution that helps a much larger group of players feel better buying keys, both to use and to sell and that makes every new lockbox and ship design promotion that much better for building goodwill and building a larger, more actively purchasing from the c-store player base.
The question is whether Perfect World can wrap their minds around volumetric methods versus looking for large single purchase transactions from a smaller base when the cost of servers and keeping up with technology is upon them, where the market knows a server merger is not a sign of a growing game. Without sugar coating this: Perfect World you will not thrive merely trying to keep the existing player base, but must grow the game base, must appeal to more player playstyles, and please put back exploration of nebulas, this is Star Trek, "....to seek out new life and new civilizations..." after all....But again I digress.
McG
So you're saying that Cryptic should change the probability of winning a lockbox ship from ~0.005 to
(1/6)*(1/4 + 1/8 + 1/16 + 1/32 + 2/128 + 3/256) = 0.082682291666667
I'm sure many players would love that idea. It will make lockbox ships cheaper for everybody.
So you would rather no one be able to buy one of these ships that they want with credits because... You didn't get the result you wanted from a lockbox?
People open more boxes because they can sell these things that they get, including the ships.
They can't sell? They open fewer boxes. They open fewer boxes? Game makes less money. Game makes less money? They find more ways to try and make money. If those ways fail? The game fails.
Save up some credits and you will get whatever ship that you want from any lockbox. It's really simple.
=============
Can someone positively identify which beagle is which in the picture at the bottom of this page?
I'm guessing that the lower left is Snoop, but without opening the game and comparing descriptions I don't know about any of the others, and even then I couldn't be 100% sure.
When i decide on which beagle I want I want to be absolutely sure that I am getting what I think I am getting.
And... They're fun little ships. This is my first time playing with a Pilot BOff. I like Lock Trajectory but it seems like a waste as a BO power and more like something I'd expect from a trait. Maybe it's good in a build where you have slots to spare. I just threw together builds for grinding the traits.
I find I miss my Mobius, honestly. I'm dreading the idea of having to re-earn it via chance box and still hope against hope there's a better and cheaper way to upgrade it. I'd really just like it with a pilot hybrid station. Maybe Pilot and command, with Science and Command for the Wells.
I really enjoy the Invicible starship trait and in retrospect the traits seem almost specifically tailored to things I've said about game balance before. I think Invincible + Blaze of Glory plus my new warp core immunity and some of my regen options in my Mobius make for a nice regen scrapper build. Nothing was ever on cooldown on my Mobius and I have a feeling Invincible will prove very very nasty on that ship once I also get potentiality, which should make silencing my ship also dangerous for enemies.
And before you all come down on me for being lazy , it has no entry in the STOWiki either (link) , nor does anything come up when entering the term into the forums search engine .
hounding players to get the lockboxes.
and the one thing I liked out of the boxes is removed.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I believe it means that only the larger version of the packs can be obtained. I opened around 20 boxes and got 2 large R&D packs. This means you get only the packs that give you more doffs/items. Strangely I didn't get a single common quality doff pack of any kind. The very first box I opened gave me an ultra rare doff pack for that new Krenim doff and that was the only doff pack I got.
As for the weapons: I double clicked a weapon pack and there were only 2 options: beams or cannons. I didn't open it but I'm guessing that the cannon option gives you a random cannon type item and the beam option gives you either a dual beam bank or beam array. In other words you can't choose exactly what type of weapon you want, just the category.
Too bad fleet ships don't work that way...
Well the upgrade applies the same way to fleet ships, also C-Store variants of fleet ships. But if you're talking about reclaiming them, then yes that badly needs addressed.
I'm not sure if I want to open a box that's tilted "Year Of Hell".
My character Tsin'xing
Epic last words!