Hey I know this is under known issues, but what if instead it is kept like this and you can still only spend it once a day. This way it is still a time earned currency like dilthium and the other reputation marks, but in the end it we can still only spend 1 per day keeping the system to take a certain time. I find this would be nice because I know there are some days were I can play for hours on end, but others I cannot play for a couple days straight.
I am concerned like schneemannn83. While I am usually able to log on daily, I can't always spend a lot of time playing every day. Often my log-ins are just long enough to kick-off rep projects, DOff jobs, and similar maintenance. Maybe 10-15mins per character. I can often play longer cycling one or two characters most days for running missions, and on my days off I often spend more time with each character running many missions repeatedly so I have enough Resources (Marks, etc.) to fill out my weekly needs.
Forcing me to play a Joint-Command-Commendation-Awarding mission every day on every character to keep up Rep pace does not sound like something to make me happy.
I can see some potential for getting ahead with the ability to get 200 Rep XP/hr (potentially 4,800 XP extra per day if one were uh... determined), but I'm leery that this is actually more work/grind.
I reserve judgment until I can actually get in and test/try it out.
I have to agree. I can't log in more than an hour or so a day during the work week (and certainly not every hour). I use the weekends to build up marks and queue up the rep projects during the week.
It sounds like I won't be able to complete this rep in less than 6 months.
Unless that changes, or the equipment is vastly superior to omega, it looks like I'll have to skip this one. Especially since I haven't finished all the reps on my other chars yet either.
The rest of this dyson sphere thing looked great, until I read that. Disappointed.
Why give this commendatipn thing only once per day if the rep projects are also time consuming? And probably it will be as bad as with the ce thing where you never know if you are past the 20h mark or not
My feeling is that if rep is not account wide, there ought to be a stacking bonus for each character you finish a rep on that is account wide.
So for example:
10% bonus rep to projects for each tier on each alt.
So... If I complete a rep on one character first, a 300 rep project becomes 450 rep. If I have it complete on two characters, it comes 675 on the third. If I complete it on three, it becomes 1013 on the fourth.
Or if I'm playing 6 characters at once and they all hit Tier 1 together, then a 300 rep project grants them 531 rep at Tier 2 because they're sharing a 10% bonus. That does mean folks who devote time and play with alts progress faster.
instead of reputation projects why not introduce reputation EXP e.g.
Omega reputation(similarly to Nukara, Romulan, Voth etc) - xxxx Omega EXP for each tier earned by:
-killing borg space/ground units (stronger unit, more Omega exp)
-finishing borg involved story missions (more Omega exp for elite difficulty)
-red alert, deep space encounter
-complete STF (even more Omega exp for elite)
-automatically unlocked items with each tier
and the current omega marks nad bnp as a means of payment for those items
Ive lost alot of friends who dont play anymore as the game stopped being fun for them, Cryptic you really need to start listening to your playerbase.
We've been saying this for ages, they will and never listen to us, just enjoy the ride
They just want to statisfy their Board that they have so many players playing at any given time, when you look between the lines, it's old players grinding and not really doing any old content. Shame really
Now found frequenting MWO short term and then Star Citizen long term. Raged Quit PVP long ago
- Gohan (House of Beautiful /Sad Pandas)
Could be shorter now, depending on how often you play and how often you start your rep projects Existing reps have a 2000 Rep XP and a 800 Rep XP project that take 20 hours to complete. The 2K Dyson rep project is 20 hours, but the 200 Rep XP (not a typo, it's 200 instead of 800) only takes one hour to complete.
Of course the inverse is also true - if you don't have the time to log in at least four times a day at hour+ intervals it'll take you longer to complete the new rep system than it currently does the old one. That, I think, is going to make this change far less popular than you and the rest of Cryptic is hoping Brandon.
Only once a day to earn a commendation is taking stupidity to a new level, even for Cryptic. It's the same mechanics as the Special Events have, and that's a royal pain. Yes I'm doing the CC event on every one of my 16 alts but only because I really need the Fleet marks and Dilithuim. The 20 hours cooldown is a pain, but since it's supposed to be a Special Event you just get used to it, but for a normal reputation project it just seems really stupid. You should be free to play the game how you like, not how Cryptic want you to play it, and certainly not controlled by a dam timer. If I can't play when I want to I will just find some other game to play. This is supposed to reduce grind and help people with alts? As plans go, this is a classic. Stupid, stupid, stupid. :mad::mad::mad::mad:
I wonder if this is another case of them misunderstanding their own metrics.
When they run events like the current Crystalline Entity their numbers shoot threw the roof. Tons of players log on every day (mostly) and play the event like crazy even on their alts! When these events are not running their 'average log in' metrics likely tank.
So we must like it when we are supposed to log in once a day and run an event they think. And they expand it. They fail to realize the numbers tank afterward because of 'player fatigue' and the only reason we do it is the extremely high reward and it is 'limited time'. Twenty one days, not fifty days to complete and we can even miss a third of them if we want.
In the end Cryptic it is 'ok' to reward players for logging in daily, infact you should do this! However you must not mistake avoiding the stick for a carrot. Penalizing my ability to progress if I play several hours in one day instead of twenty minutes every day will cause player fatigue and loose players.
I wonder if this is another case of them misunderstanding their own metrics.
When they run events like the current Crystalline Entity their numbers shoot threw the roof. Tons of players log on every day (mostly) and play the event like crazy even on their alts! When these events are not running their 'average log in' metrics likely tank.
So we must like it when we are supposed to log in once a day and run an event they think. And they expand it. They fail to realize the numbers tank afterward because of 'player fatigue' and the only reason we do it is the extremely high reward and it is 'limited time'. Twenty one days, not fifty days to complete and we can even miss a third of them if we want.
In the end Cryptic it is 'ok' to reward players for logging in daily, infact you should do this! However you must not mistake avoiding the stick for a carrot. Penalizing my ability to progress if I play several hours in one day instead of twenty minutes every day will cause player fatigue and loose players.
The problem is Cryptic seems to have an either or mentality instead of having a mixture of the various options / choices and let us select what works for us and our play style.
Are you saying that now I have to grind three different kinds of dailies to get the same stuff I get in the other reputations? (i.e. the equivalent of not being able to run ISE ad nauseam and unlock everything in the Omega Store)
STOP TRYING TO FORCE US TO PLAY CERTAIN THINGS :mad: I strongly resent you trying to force me into stuff I don't want to play and penalizing me for not doing so.
Everything endgame in every queue should give ALL of the following, point blank and period:
Marks and Special Tokens for completing it (i.e. Omega grants omarks and BNPs, etc.)
Dilithium based on level (480 = easy, 720 = medium, 960 = hard)
Expertise
This lets players decide what they want to spend their time doing and removes these needlessly complex and arbitrary overly restrictive rules you have in place for Reputation.
Also projects for unlocking the stores AND projects for unlocking reputation tiers needs to go.
Are you saying that now I have to grind three different kinds of dailies to get the same stuff I get in the other reputations? (i.e. the equivalent of not being able to run ISE ad nauseam and unlock everything in the Omega Store)
STOP TRYING TO FORCE US TO PLAY CERTAIN THINGS :mad: I strongly resent you trying to force me into stuff I don't want to play and penalizing me for not doing so.
Everything endgame in every queue should give ALL of the following, point blank and period:
Marks and Special Tokens for completing it (i.e. Omega grants omarks and BNPs, etc.)
Dilithium based on level (480 = easy, 720 = medium, 960 = hard)
Expertise
This lets players decide what they want to spend their time doing and removes these needlessly complex and arbitrary overly restrictive rules you have in place for Reputation.
Also projects for unlocking the stores AND projects for unlocking reputation tiers needs to go.
So... we should be able to fill up our Omega Rep by farming Epohhs? We should be able to dump what we earn from endlessly spamming ISE into our Starbases?
Then we ask the Devs to make new and interesting content, complain that the game is boring, grindy, etc.
And we wonder why they don't seem to be listening?
"So my fun is wrong?"
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
So... we should be able to fill up our Omega Rep by farming Epohhs? We should be able to dump what we earn from endlessly spamming ISE into our Starbases?
Then we ask the Devs to make new and interesting content, complain that the game is boring, grindy, etc.
And we wonder why they don't seem to be listening?
I don't think that is what he is saying. You earn a generic "end game marks" and all end game missions reward those "end game marks". That way you can play the content you like and get the rewards you like, seems more like a game than a job because the choice is ours.
At the very least this system allows us to avoid boring game play that we are herded into now, but does not discourage originality later for the devs because we can truly choose if the new content is better than the old by our playing hours. And still requires it because at some point 5 rep systems down the road we will hate the same thing we liked a couple years earlier if we keep having to repeat it.
PvE Jem'Hadar motto:Participation Ribbonsare life.
wait so i paid for the friggin veteran ship. and now i cant even get the fleet version without a new grind?
really? if it would be starbase shipyard... okay... but this???
also why is the atrox on lvl 3 ? this ship needs more love.
the ship getting via the spire is a totally frigged up idea. sry.
it makes no sense at all.
hell we are a small fleet and we are happy when we hit starbase shipyard level that is higher. and now you tell us that all was... useless? and that we have to grind another 3 levels of some other holding? to finally get the atrox in a decent version?
Just gonna add on- if the one rep project that we can do with marks is the 'lower 200 xp' one, that is, in every rep system, the one that requires NON-REPLICATABLE devices, that we have to hunt down a vendor to buy.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE instead make it the one that requires more marks but grants more XP and uses commodities.
I haven't had the chance to test the Spire holding on Tribble. How much do the Fleet variants of the Veteran starships cost? It better be only one Fleet Ship Module. Anyone who has it had to dump a minimum of $199.99 just to get the ship. Requiring four Fleet Ship Modules per character on top of that is nothing short of criminal price gouging.
Any word on the number of Fleet Modules required to get one of these ships? I'm already pissed that they've repeatedly failed to do the necessary work to turn the Galaxy's abundance of Engineering powers and console slots into something worth having. If they try to charge me $20 per character to use the Fleet variant of the Chimera after I paid $250 for a beta-era lifetime subscription, then I'm officially done.
LA LA LA LA LA......smurfs are in charge of cryptic studios fyi
Making me pay for a veteran ship I already own but is more or less ineffective due to massive power creep this past year has done to ships in general...mmhmm
Why in the name of all that's good and holy can you (the development team) just produce off proper feedback...were getting even more inventory space used up by silly reputation needs?
as ive mentioned a few times already...thank god star citizen is right around the corner
LA LA LA LA LA......smurfs are in charge of cryptic studios fyi
Making me pay for a veteran ship I already own but is more or less ineffective due to massive power creep this past year has done to ships in general...mmhmm
Why in the name of all that's good and holy can you (the development team) just produce off proper feedback...were getting even more inventory space used up by silly reputation needs?
as ive mentioned a few times already...thank god star citizen is right around the corner
/ISURRENDER
Competition will ultimately be the vehicle of improvement for STO or its demise. Right now I am not sure there is an appropriate F2P space based game in the same category as STO.
Now i believe STO could pick up its game and be ok, but I think proper motivation has not been available yet.
PvE Jem'Hadar motto:Participation Ribbonsare life.
Just gonna add on- if the one rep project that we can do with marks is the 'lower 200 xp' one, that is, in every rep system, the one that requires NON-REPLICATABLE devices, that we have to hunt down a vendor to buy.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE instead make it the one that requires more marks but grants more XP and uses commodities.
I know its a long thread and the post I posted this in is also fairly long (although its at the start) but there are 2 projects. 1 requires just a token and grants 2k rep xp after 20hours. The other requires 10 marks, 1k expertise and 2,000 EC (For tier 1). No commodities or other items, just straight EC.
Their math fails for the number of marks/xp though. In order to get 800 xp you have to do the project 4 times for a total of 40 marks required, compared to the other reputations where you only need 26 marks at tier 1. (This is assuming you want 2800xp and includes the 2k from the free project).
Bah I'll just break it down:
Omega Rep: (Being used as an example)
2800xp every 20 hours, requiring: (Tier 1)
26 Marks
8250 expertise
19700 EC worth of commodities/devices (can be lowered using a Ferengi and buying from Cargo ships)
Dyson Rep:
2800xp (2k from token, 4x 200xp project [Must log in at least 4 times daily])
10 x4 = 40 marks
1000 x4 = 4000 expertise
2000 x4 = 8000 EC
The Expertise and EC cost and inconvience associated with filling the projects is down but the mark cost went way up. Expertise and EC can be acquired in other ways but the marks can only be gotten in the new content. One run of the Spire mission netted me between low to high 20s per time. I'm sure this will get better as people grow used to the mission but its low compared to what we need. This is also just at tier ONE I'll be able to check the mark costs at tier 2 in 20 hours, but if it goes up much at all we will end up needing way more then the 1526 marks currently required for the old reputations. Unless we get most of the rep exp from the 20h 1 token project, which will increase the time required by a lot.
If you are doing both projects on live you can be done in around 30 days, if you do just the 2000 xp project you will finish in 50 days. Instead of this set up shortening the time required to max the reputation it will increase it to 40 or so days, depending on how often you can log in. The weight of getting the marks required to fill that 200xp project over and over is going to just be too high and it will NOT be done more then a couple of times a day by most players.
Oh and for the one that talked about the 200xp project getting you 4800xp if you are determined, you will also need 240 marks for that so around 12 runs of Spire. Sure you can do it in that time, if you can find a group.
[bah it got long again...]
EDIT: Amusing fact, when you fill a project you are given a box with a random item from the rep store from that tier, this can be a console or a ground weapon (so far those are what I've gotten). The weapon has a value of 3930ec and the console has a value of 18728ec. If you get one of each and just dump them in the replicator for ec you will get 9062ec. You end up with an ec profit doing the projects at tier 1.
The Omega rep also grants 480 dilithum ore every 20h. Dyson rep grants 340 ore for the 20h project and 140 ore for the 1h project.
Totals:
Omega rep- 480 dilithum ore gained with that 2800 rep xp (340+140=480)
Dyson rep- 900 dilithum ore gained with that 2800 rep xp (340+140x4=900)
dispite the thing with the ships being in a new holding there is another reason i dont like it.. only MK xi??
small fleet rely on mk x fleet gear as it is available tier 1... NOW i guess the mk xi consoles will be T2 so.. another frig up for small fleet to get anything there
with the spire fleet projects set with a 20hr instead like it was before the last patch it will take months to get max. by time you hit the higher tiers it be on holodeck. nice so much for testing any of the fleet spire stuff.
Still relatively new (5th month), but I have to agree with this general consensus. The rep grinds are daunting and demoralizing. I'm all for earning my way up, but I hope the devs remember this is a GAME.
I'm an adult with a full time job sitting at a PC all day. It?s sometimes challenging to come home and sit at a PC for another 2-4 hours, even if it is for fun ? which often involves 45 minutes of Doff-assignment duties followed by grinding. Literally a lot like my job, actually.
Make it fun devs. Make the gear gain easier. Make the content more varied and interesting I know, these objectives are harder than upping the power of the enemies and upping the strength of gear. But I think it will be more rewarding for the game in the long run.
Please reconsider ARC. Please make it optional, at the least. PLEASE.
It seems the vast majority of your most active players (forum regulars) hate the idea... and while that's a small subset of the playerbase, I think it's an important constituency.
THE PLAYERS DO NOT WANT THIS.
One thing the devs could do to make it easier for ppl with multiple toons to work in the reputation system, would be the ability to work through the gateway on your char on the system.
A possible use would then be ... stack up the marks & credits needed in the weekend, or when u are able to play .... then activate the rep projects through the gateway when u are unable to play the game, but are able to use the gateway.
This would "solve" alot of the complaints that are being made with the current system, and with that i mean the current system, and the latest addition to it.
I also think that straight-up systems, requiring only marks, expertise & credits seems much easier to use by players & devs alike....
It would avoid all the "useless" commodity-buying and sliding of bars ... and all the backend actions those hit to the games servers, and at the same time relieve some Repetetive Strain Injury because all the annoying slider actions ....
I do think that commodities hunting would be something that fits into the gear projects, for all the reputation items .... it makes sense u need shield-generators when making a shield, along with other items .... but for the basic reputation grind, it seems a very convoluted system.....
YAY another reputation to grind. Please oh please now that you added another fleet holding, please do not waste your time creating crappy fleet projects that do nothing and do not contribute to the actual holding. visual upgrades are the dumbest thing ever for fleet holings, no one spends there time inside or outside their holdings.
question: So you are still leaving reputations separate per character, any chance this is going to change???? Also are there any plans to allow expertise to be joint across all characters??? the fact that I have 8 million expertise on my fed but im always starved on my rommy is really annoying.
I played around with Tribble a bit over the weekend and did some math (along the lines of what ikuruyo posted above), and I have the following thoughts on the new Rep:
Earning only one Commendation per day is awful. You're already time-gating us with the 20hr project, there's no need to also time-gate us on getting the resource needed to run the project. If you feel double-time-gating really is necessary, at least allow us to earn a Commendation once per hour or two. That way weekend warriors have the possibility to stock up for the coming week's Rep inputs.
Earning only 200 Rep XP on the "small project" is bad. Sure it completes in an hour, but it overall will take more Marks and more time in-game to get 800 Rep XP. Meaning, most players, myself included, are only going to be able to earn 2200 Rep XP per day.
Most players are highly unlikely to get ahead. Having the "small project" finish in 1hr offers the possible advantage of earning more than 800 Rep XP per day (if we play for 5+hrs), but for most players like myself, that's unlikely to happen but maybe once or twice a week, and even then it's not going to be enough to offset the loss of 800-per day Rep, much less actually get ahead.
There is far less "Slider-Grind" in this Rep. Having fewer inputs and taking EC directly (instead of having to shop for commodities and ground consumables) really reduced a lot of the mindless clicky/slider button-pushing. This is great! Thanks for this. I really can't wait for this to be retro-fitted back to the other Reps.
Getting a reward box at the start of the Rep is groovy. I'm not sure how useable these items will be, honestly, but it's interesting. That's for sure. And I kind of like the "lottery" feeling of opening a box and maybe there's something good inside. So far all I've got is vendor trash, but it helps pay the EC needed for the Rep, so even that's not bad. I always like free. It would be good if there were some really good chase-prizes in those boxes (maybe you could post a list of possible prizes?).
Others have brought this up, and I wonder the answer... How many (if any) Fleet Modules are going to be required to get the Fleet Veteran ships? For all the money paid into the game to unlock the standard Vet Ships, I honestly think the cost should be restricted to just Fleet EC (even if it's 200k). Maybe add 1 Fleet Module as well... I'd be ok with that, but I'm against the cost being 4-5 Fleet modules.
I'd also like to weigh-in that I'm unhappy with Fleet ships being locked behind another holding. They should be in the Fleet Starbase. T5 is fine, but keep them in the existing Shipyards.
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
Comments
I have to agree. I can't log in more than an hour or so a day during the work week (and certainly not every hour). I use the weekends to build up marks and queue up the rep projects during the week.
It sounds like I won't be able to complete this rep in less than 6 months.
Unless that changes, or the equipment is vastly superior to omega, it looks like I'll have to skip this one. Especially since I haven't finished all the reps on my other chars yet either.
The rest of this dyson sphere thing looked great, until I read that. Disappointed.
Nice try but fail
So for example:
10% bonus rep to projects for each tier on each alt.
So... If I complete a rep on one character first, a 300 rep project becomes 450 rep. If I have it complete on two characters, it comes 675 on the third. If I complete it on three, it becomes 1013 on the fourth.
Or if I'm playing 6 characters at once and they all hit Tier 1 together, then a 300 rep project grants them 531 rep at Tier 2 because they're sharing a 10% bonus. That does mean folks who devote time and play with alts progress faster.
Omega reputation(similarly to Nukara, Romulan, Voth etc) - xxxx Omega EXP for each tier earned by:
-killing borg space/ground units (stronger unit, more Omega exp)
-finishing borg involved story missions (more Omega exp for elite difficulty)
-red alert, deep space encounter
-complete STF (even more Omega exp for elite)
-automatically unlocked items with each tier
and the current omega marks nad bnp as a means of payment for those items
Ive lost alot of friends who dont play anymore as the game stopped being fun for them, Cryptic you really need to start listening to your playerbase.
We've been saying this for ages, they will and never listen to us, just enjoy the ride
They just want to statisfy their Board that they have so many players playing at any given time, when you look between the lines, it's old players grinding and not really doing any old content. Shame really
- Gohan (House of Beautiful /Sad Pandas)
It is just about time I got to be able to get mark XII tac consoles without paying enough EC for a unicorn's soul in exchange.
Of course the inverse is also true - if you don't have the time to log in at least four times a day at hour+ intervals it'll take you longer to complete the new rep system than it currently does the old one. That, I think, is going to make this change far less popular than you and the rest of Cryptic is hoping Brandon.
When they run events like the current Crystalline Entity their numbers shoot threw the roof. Tons of players log on every day (mostly) and play the event like crazy even on their alts! When these events are not running their 'average log in' metrics likely tank.
So we must like it when we are supposed to log in once a day and run an event they think. And they expand it. They fail to realize the numbers tank afterward because of 'player fatigue' and the only reason we do it is the extremely high reward and it is 'limited time'. Twenty one days, not fifty days to complete and we can even miss a third of them if we want.
In the end Cryptic it is 'ok' to reward players for logging in daily, infact you should do this! However you must not mistake avoiding the stick for a carrot. Penalizing my ability to progress if I play several hours in one day instead of twenty minutes every day will cause player fatigue and loose players.
The problem is Cryptic seems to have an either or mentality instead of having a mixture of the various options / choices and let us select what works for us and our play style.
U.S.S. Maelstrom, NCC-71417 (Constitution III-class/flagship) --- Fleet Admiral Hauk' --|-- Dahar Master Hauk --- I.K.S. qu'In 'an bortaS (D7-class / flagship)
Pretty much this.
So... we should be able to fill up our Omega Rep by farming Epohhs? We should be able to dump what we earn from endlessly spamming ISE into our Starbases?
Then we ask the Devs to make new and interesting content, complain that the game is boring, grindy, etc.
And we wonder why they don't seem to be listening?
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
I don't think that is what he is saying. You earn a generic "end game marks" and all end game missions reward those "end game marks". That way you can play the content you like and get the rewards you like, seems more like a game than a job because the choice is ours.
At the very least this system allows us to avoid boring game play that we are herded into now, but does not discourage originality later for the devs because we can truly choose if the new content is better than the old by our playing hours. And still requires it because at some point 5 rep systems down the road we will hate the same thing we liked a couple years earlier if we keep having to repeat it.
really? if it would be starbase shipyard... okay... but this???
also why is the atrox on lvl 3 ? this ship needs more love.
the ship getting via the spire is a totally frigged up idea. sry.
it makes no sense at all.
hell we are a small fleet and we are happy when we hit starbase shipyard level that is higher. and now you tell us that all was... useless? and that we have to grind another 3 levels of some other holding? to finally get the atrox in a decent version?
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE instead make it the one that requires more marks but grants more XP and uses commodities.
Any word on the number of Fleet Modules required to get one of these ships? I'm already pissed that they've repeatedly failed to do the necessary work to turn the Galaxy's abundance of Engineering powers and console slots into something worth having. If they try to charge me $20 per character to use the Fleet variant of the Chimera after I paid $250 for a beta-era lifetime subscription, then I'm officially done.
Making me pay for a veteran ship I already own but is more or less ineffective due to massive power creep this past year has done to ships in general...mmhmm
Why in the name of all that's good and holy can you (the development team) just produce off proper feedback...were getting even more inventory space used up by silly reputation needs?
as ive mentioned a few times already...thank god star citizen is right around the corner
/ISURRENDER
Competition will ultimately be the vehicle of improvement for STO or its demise. Right now I am not sure there is an appropriate F2P space based game in the same category as STO.
Now i believe STO could pick up its game and be ok, but I think proper motivation has not been available yet.
I know its a long thread and the post I posted this in is also fairly long (although its at the start) but there are 2 projects. 1 requires just a token and grants 2k rep xp after 20hours. The other requires 10 marks, 1k expertise and 2,000 EC (For tier 1). No commodities or other items, just straight EC.
Their math fails for the number of marks/xp though. In order to get 800 xp you have to do the project 4 times for a total of 40 marks required, compared to the other reputations where you only need 26 marks at tier 1. (This is assuming you want 2800xp and includes the 2k from the free project).
Bah I'll just break it down:
Omega Rep: (Being used as an example)
2800xp every 20 hours, requiring: (Tier 1)
26 Marks
8250 expertise
19700 EC worth of commodities/devices (can be lowered using a Ferengi and buying from Cargo ships)
Dyson Rep:
2800xp (2k from token, 4x 200xp project [Must log in at least 4 times daily])
10 x4 = 40 marks
1000 x4 = 4000 expertise
2000 x4 = 8000 EC
The Expertise and EC cost and inconvience associated with filling the projects is down but the mark cost went way up. Expertise and EC can be acquired in other ways but the marks can only be gotten in the new content. One run of the Spire mission netted me between low to high 20s per time. I'm sure this will get better as people grow used to the mission but its low compared to what we need. This is also just at tier ONE I'll be able to check the mark costs at tier 2 in 20 hours, but if it goes up much at all we will end up needing way more then the 1526 marks currently required for the old reputations. Unless we get most of the rep exp from the 20h 1 token project, which will increase the time required by a lot.
If you are doing both projects on live you can be done in around 30 days, if you do just the 2000 xp project you will finish in 50 days. Instead of this set up shortening the time required to max the reputation it will increase it to 40 or so days, depending on how often you can log in. The weight of getting the marks required to fill that 200xp project over and over is going to just be too high and it will NOT be done more then a couple of times a day by most players.
Oh and for the one that talked about the 200xp project getting you 4800xp if you are determined, you will also need 240 marks for that so around 12 runs of Spire. Sure you can do it in that time, if you can find a group.
[bah it got long again...]
EDIT: Amusing fact, when you fill a project you are given a box with a random item from the rep store from that tier, this can be a console or a ground weapon (so far those are what I've gotten). The weapon has a value of 3930ec and the console has a value of 18728ec. If you get one of each and just dump them in the replicator for ec you will get 9062ec. You end up with an ec profit doing the projects at tier 1.
The Omega rep also grants 480 dilithum ore every 20h. Dyson rep grants 340 ore for the 20h project and 140 ore for the 1h project.
Totals:
Omega rep- 480 dilithum ore gained with that 2800 rep xp (340+140=480)
Dyson rep- 900 dilithum ore gained with that 2800 rep xp (340+140x4=900)
I think its better to say drag than friction imho.
small fleet rely on mk x fleet gear as it is available tier 1... NOW i guess the mk xi consoles will be T2 so.. another frig up for small fleet to get anything there
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I'm an adult with a full time job sitting at a PC all day. It?s sometimes challenging to come home and sit at a PC for another 2-4 hours, even if it is for fun ? which often involves 45 minutes of Doff-assignment duties followed by grinding. Literally a lot like my job, actually.
Make it fun devs. Make the gear gain easier. Make the content more varied and interesting I know, these objectives are harder than upping the power of the enemies and upping the strength of gear. But I think it will be more rewarding for the game in the long run.
It seems the vast majority of your most active players (forum regulars) hate the idea... and while that's a small subset of the playerbase, I think it's an important constituency.
THE PLAYERS DO NOT WANT THIS.
A possible use would then be ... stack up the marks & credits needed in the weekend, or when u are able to play .... then activate the rep projects through the gateway when u are unable to play the game, but are able to use the gateway.
This would "solve" alot of the complaints that are being made with the current system, and with that i mean the current system, and the latest addition to it.
I also think that straight-up systems, requiring only marks, expertise & credits seems much easier to use by players & devs alike....
It would avoid all the "useless" commodity-buying and sliding of bars ... and all the backend actions those hit to the games servers, and at the same time relieve some Repetetive Strain Injury because all the annoying slider actions ....
I do think that commodities hunting would be something that fits into the gear projects, for all the reputation items .... it makes sense u need shield-generators when making a shield, along with other items .... but for the basic reputation grind, it seems a very convoluted system.....
question: So you are still leaving reputations separate per character, any chance this is going to change???? Also are there any plans to allow expertise to be joint across all characters??? the fact that I have 8 million expertise on my fed but im always starved on my rommy is really annoying.
Earning only 200 Rep XP on the "small project" is bad. Sure it completes in an hour, but it overall will take more Marks and more time in-game to get 800 Rep XP. Meaning, most players, myself included, are only going to be able to earn 2200 Rep XP per day.
Most players are highly unlikely to get ahead. Having the "small project" finish in 1hr offers the possible advantage of earning more than 800 Rep XP per day (if we play for 5+hrs), but for most players like myself, that's unlikely to happen but maybe once or twice a week, and even then it's not going to be enough to offset the loss of 800-per day Rep, much less actually get ahead.
There is far less "Slider-Grind" in this Rep. Having fewer inputs and taking EC directly (instead of having to shop for commodities and ground consumables) really reduced a lot of the mindless clicky/slider button-pushing. This is great! Thanks for this. I really can't wait for this to be retro-fitted back to the other Reps.
Getting a reward box at the start of the Rep is groovy. I'm not sure how useable these items will be, honestly, but it's interesting. That's for sure. And I kind of like the "lottery" feeling of opening a box and maybe there's something good inside. So far all I've got is vendor trash, but it helps pay the EC needed for the Rep, so even that's not bad. I always like free. It would be good if there were some really good chase-prizes in those boxes (maybe you could post a list of possible prizes?).
Others have brought this up, and I wonder the answer... How many (if any) Fleet Modules are going to be required to get the Fleet Veteran ships? For all the money paid into the game to unlock the standard Vet Ships, I honestly think the cost should be restricted to just Fleet EC (even if it's 200k). Maybe add 1 Fleet Module as well... I'd be ok with that, but I'm against the cost being 4-5 Fleet modules.
I'd also like to weigh-in that I'm unhappy with Fleet ships being locked behind another holding. They should be in the Fleet Starbase. T5 is fine, but keep them in the existing Shipyards.
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.