It has nothing to do with the community being okay with it. We've made our complaints and Cryptic has said AFKing isn't breaking any rules and they aren't going to punish people that do it.
That leaves us with the options that have been mentioned above. Use them or not, it's your choice.
Not being expressly against the TOS doesn't necessarily mean you can't be punished for something, the wording is liberal enough. Devs do talk about AFKers and say they're working internally to introduce solutions - it's a lot of PR waffle and no action, but things might change at some point.
not really asking you to, or am I even remotely interested either way....just pointing out that it is a two sided argument with nothing to gain but speculation if either side isnt willing to just look it up for themselves if it means that much to them.
.
_______________________
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
I know someone who AFKs at least 10 times a day in Mine Trap. He has kept count of how many reports he has been told about (people saying "I reported ___") and he is well into the 100s now.
He has yet to be punished or even messaged about it.
This is proof enough to me that going AFK in a match is not breaking any rules or against the TOS. You people need to REALLY STOP complaining about this matter, and simply play the game. Some people like to AFK...get over it. They are not hurting anyone. If you don't like it...stop pugging.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If you oppose the Reputation nerf, feel free to use my signature
I know someone who AFKs at least 10 times a day in Mine Trap. He has kept count of how many reports he has been told about (people saying "I reported ___") and he is well into the 100s now.
He has yet to be punished or even messaged about it.
This is proof enough to me that going AFK in a match is not breaking any rules or against the TOS. You people need to REALLY STOP complaining about this matter, and simply play the game. Some people like to AFK...get over it. They are not hurting anyone. If you don't like it...stop pugging.
Scrub...soo many things to say to you and your bud. Gonna say your a troll for condoning leeching and your "aquintaince" needs a slap in the face
We need a vote kick feature, the decent players can kick the afk pos. i feel the majority of the community wont abuse this
In all honesty, I find it stupid that the TOS allows such bad behavior. You queued up for an event, which in a way is like a contract, saying "I'm participating", then you don't and just sit there, expecting others do the work for you or you not carrying your weight?
How is that not griefing?
These AFK issues have been growing worse and worse since they know Perfect World doesn't care and they get a free ticket just sitting there, mocking the honest players. I've seen it happen over and over since 1999, where the griefer population isn't kept in check and it eventually drives off the honest players who love the game. The good players left the game, leaving the "Trash", which drives off more and more customers to the point the game starts getting really bad publicity.
Honestly, STO's community effectively handled the griefers, before they added the "lazy system" (PvE Queues). If there was a troublemaker, people learned who they were and avoided them. But with the PvE Queues, you have no choice but to group up with people who you wanted to avoid.
This is really getting so bad now, I'm really starting to lose my enthusiasm to even log in now. The AFKers, the Griefer fleets camping on Defera, the trashy Zone chats at the Hubs. STO is effectively a lawless town where the sheriff is out partying and not caring, as long as the bank isn't robbed.
As for handling these bums, there been dozens of threads that tried to think of a system. All I can say is that there is no easy answer unless people have the power to boot out these people and black list them from future events.
Recently, I thought maybe if there was like a performance system (sort of like a charge meter). The more you stand still, the less overall points you get. And the longer you stand still, the harsher the penalty, where it gets to the point you get no reward. And the more you participate, the more you will get the usual reward. (Also the overall reward depends on the teams performance, like completing the objectives. Like saving the Diplomats in Colony Invasion or killing the Boss Saboteur in Incursion).
join a fleet or get some friends and run it with them if it means so much to you that you get so bent out of shape you are ready to rage quit over it....problem solved.
IMO you guys whining over someone afk in an open mission pug are the ones with the problem ....
.
_______________________
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
join a fleet or get some friends and run it with them if it means so much to you that you get so bent out of shape you are ready to rage quit over it....problem solved.
IMO you guys whining over someone afk in an open mission pug are the ones with the problem ....
.
Someone commiting a murder half way around the world from where you live is wrong...doesn't matter if you are not involved, it is still wrong. You may be not experincing leeching but it is happening and it is unfair to those dealing with it
Someone commiting a murder half way around the world from where you live is wrong...doesn't matter if you are not involved, it is still wrong. You may be not experincing leeching but it is happening and it is unfair to those dealing with it
this isnt about murder.....drrrrr :rolleyes:
heh...love the dramatic analogies that are posted in these forums....lol.
_______________________
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
not sure if you know what botting is....but that's besides the point here... they are just afk by choice, uncool ? perhaps....., but it's their prerogative..
and yeah....PUG at your own risk.
You say you feel like quitting ?...but yet you are putting yourself into the position where this behavior is enabled....in all reality there is no-one to blame for your disposition but yourself.
take another route...or stew in your anger.... it's your choice.
Private channels. is there a list somewhere or is it invite only?
sounds like someone does not want their afk farming to go away....
Its not hard to off these people. Do nothing productive in the zone no reward. if everyone does 200k damage and you do 0-50k no reward simple as that. this will also weed out the trolls that bring a shuttle or are worthless and die all the time because they bring TRIBBLE in to a elite stf.
And before you go waa waa the poor people that are not all that good wont get rewards ... this is why they have normal stfs SO PEOPLE CAN LEARN TO DO THEM.
Now quit afking and ruining others game play because you want to ride off the work of others.
This is the new generation here i guess lazy trash people!
sounds like someone does not want their afk farming to go away....
Its not hard to off these people. Do nothing productive in the zone no reward. if everyone does 200k damage and you do 0-50k no reward simple as that. this will also weed out the trolls that bring a shuttle or are worthless and die all the time because they bring TRIBBLE in to a elite stf.
And before you go waa waa the poor people that are not all that good wont get rewards ... this is why they have normal stfs SO PEOPLE CAN LEARN TO DO THEM.
Now quit afking and ruining others game play because you want to ride off the work of others.
This is the new generation here i guess lazy trash people!
good luck with that.......
_______________________
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
PUGging content in STO is like having unprotected sex. You never know what sort of teammates you're going to get but it will probably make you tired, angry and upset.
Take responsibility for YOUR game play by choosing who YOU want to play with.
Scrub...soo many things to say to you and your bud. Gonna say your a troll for condoning leeching and your "aquintaince" needs a slap in the face
We need a vote kick feature, the decent players can kick the afk pos. i feel the majority of the community wont abuse this
No trolling intended. The fact is...players are allowed to AFK. If people want to stand around and do nothing, that is their right to do so. You don't have to stay in the game, you don't have to pug, and you don't have to pay any attention to it. Live and let live. Do what all left-wing socially liberal societies do and TOLERATE IT!
I have always thought of AFKing as a protest to the repetitive game play and grinding. It is why I have no problem with people who do it. In fact, I applaud those people for AFKing because they are actually doing something to bring about change (as opposed to the legions of keyboard warriors on this so-called FORUM). The more people who do it, the more Cryptic will realize that their end game is getting BORING!
If you intro the Vote to Kick (V2K) feature, people will abuse it. In fact, I think the same number of people who leech will be the exact same number of people who abuse V2K. You are replacing one problem with another...except your new problem can be directly used to attack legit players...and that is WORSE than AFKing. I would rather have an AFKer, silent and invisible, than a power-tripping a**hole voting to kick someone cause their DPS isn't Godly.
Face it kids...AFKing is a small issue (I won't even call it a problem, cause that implies it is bad) and it can be easily avoided by not pugging. Go and make some friends, make a fleet, party up, and reduce or eliminate the chances of being paired with an AFKer. There are so many options available to you to avoid AFKers.
And...for all you AFKers out there - you know who you are - I have one thing to say to you people: What you are doing is not against the TOS...so don't worry about it. Play the game the way you feel comfortable. Don't let anyone call you a leech (because that is name calling and THAT IS against the TOS). If anyone calls you a leecher, or any other bad name, report them ASAP for name calling. Sooner or later...the name calling will stop.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If you oppose the Reputation nerf, feel free to use my signature
to everyone that says its OPs fault for pugging.. you guys are very mean..
being AFK during a match should be fixed this asap.
they need to remove the leaver penalty on every mission.. some missions you can already leave.. but not every one.
not everyone can make private matches.. or dont want to..
pugging is part of the game.. if you get an afker, you should be able to leave and restart with no penalty.
there is no reason to be forced to put up with these guys..
i do under stand why they do it tho.. its from being forced to grind the same missions over and over..
once you play the one you like, you have 30 to 60 minutes to go do something else.
also, only a few missions give certain rewards.. like CC.. i hate to admit it, while i dont afk.. every time i play that mission i just hang back and shoot the thoilans. one time i got first place doing that.
mission CDs, and repetition make this game very boring.
they should add the choice of marks loot to every mission.. and remove CDs and leaver penalties..
then no more AFKers and you do what you want to have fun..
[12:35] Vessel Two of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 225232 (271723) Plasma Damage to you with Plasma Lance.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
PUGging content in STO is like having unprotected sex. You never know what sort of teammates you're going to get but it will probably make you tired, angry and upset.
Take responsibility for YOUR game play by choosing who YOU want to play with.
And leave the AFKers to group with themselves.
It's that easy to do. :rolleyes:
yeah but when you pug you should be able to leave if you dont like the team..
simple fix.
[12:35] Vessel Two of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 225232 (271723) Plasma Damage to you with Plasma Lance.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
We need a vote kick feature, the decent players can kick the afk pos. i feel the majority of the community wont abuse this
No, we don't. I've seen "vote to kick" abused in SWTOR to no end. The worst thing they ever put into the game. It turns it into and elitest fest. Pugs end up dieing because no one wants to be kicked for not having the right torpedo, or the right engine, or the proper rifle. Better yet, I watched my own guild using it simply to laugh at the rage remarks from those they kicked. PVE que's go from a minute or to now, to hours. And I mean hours. Why would anyone Que up just to be kicked by some 14 year old elitest that thinks you didn't blow up the cube fast enough, or you let a probe through the gate, or he didn't see borg gear on your ship.
No, Vote to kick is not the answer to any pug problem.
PUGs are the only option for some people. Saying "Don't PUG" is exactly the same as saying "I have no solution, but still feel the need to say something snide."
This is actually very true. Without PUG's AFKer's and all the other various types of griefers would never find anyone to team with. They thrive on the people who aren't willing to use the pre-existing tools that make avoiding griefers possible and easy.
The pre-existing tools depend on knowing enough people who log on at the same time. Otherwise, you're teaming up with strangers and possibly end up right back where you started.
"Don't PUG" is a mindless non-answer. It's not a solution. It's a copout.
Not being expressly against the TOS doesn't necessarily mean you can't be punished for something, the wording is liberal enough. Devs do talk about AFKers and say they're working internally to introduce solutions - it's a lot of PR waffle and no action, but things might change at some point.
The above sums up my own evaluation quite well.
Recall that in February the Executive Producer came onto these boards and told us that Cryptic were 'actively working on solutions to AFK'ing'. That they were 'still gathering information on STFs' but that they will be acting on the AFK issues soon.
To his credit, he even acknowledged Cryptic's responsibility in resolving such issues.
Half a year, and nothing substantial. But they are ACTIVELY WORKING ON IT!
Mr Stahl, I hope you see fit to give this the actual priority it deserves, some day.
Yeah, and if you don't know enough people to form a team, if you don't PUG, you don't play. So yeah, in the sense that not playing avoids all problems in the game, that's a great "solution."
For those of us who want to be able to play the game we pay for without depending on the participation of others to block out the bad behavior of a few, it's utterly and completely useless. You're basically saying everyone who can't put together a 5-person team should just avoid STFs. :rolleyes:
but did you guy noitice too that the damage and damage resistance are much too high right now then 1/2 months ago ?
or it just me
so i say make the borg how it was.
and please bring the borg space weapons back
Yeah, and if you don't know enough people to form a team, if you don't PUG, you don't play. So yeah, in the sense that not playing avoids all problems in the game, that's a great "solution."
For those of us who want to be able to play the game we pay for without depending on the participation of others to block out the bad behavior of a few, it's utterly and completely useless. You're basically saying everyone who can't put together a 5-person team should just avoid STFs. :rolleyes:
you make it sound like every single PUG has an afk'er a leecher and a griefer in it all just waiting to ruin some poor helpless gamers life.
.
_______________________
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
the last couple where we had the AFK'ers we all as a team just parked our ships next to them and just waited lol ya we lost the optional but after about 5 mins of us talking about the person and not doing anything they left lol,
the other time was in infected I just dragged the tac to where he was hidding so the tac would kill me then turn on him he left before I could get the tac to him I was sad lol.
the one thing I have been noticing in infected with the AFKer's is the will on purpose lose the optional. IE blow up a gen on other side of team die then afk
the last couple where we had the AFK'ers we all as a team just parked our ships next to them and just waited lol ya we lost the optional but after about 5 mins of us talking about the person and not doing anything they left lol,
the other time was in infected I just dragged the tac to where he was hidding so the tac would kill me then turn on him he left before I could get the tac to him I was sad lol.
the one thing I have been noticing in infected with the AFKer's is the will on purpose lose the optional. IE blow up a gen on other side of team die then afk
so? did this make you win? no..
they more then likely just re queued up a new match and YOU were the ones that didnt get anything..
losing out on some loot being afk doesnt hurt the afker.. they can run another mission afk.. it doesnt even matter what mission they pick, cause they dont intend to play it.
[12:35] Vessel Two of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 225232 (271723) Plasma Damage to you with Plasma Lance.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
join a fleet or get some friends and run it with them if it means so much to you that you get so bent out of shape you are ready to rage quit over it....problem solved.
IMO you guys whining over someone afk in an open mission pug are the ones with the problem ....
.
You're a jackass! Reach back and unplug your computer, stupid!
Actually, that goes for everyone that says we shouldn't pug. I play at odd hours when most of my fleet mates are offline. And I don't usually play elite STF's. It isn't our fault and it isn't our problem. This is Cryptic and PWE not giving a holy flying $#!+! Pure and simple.
Comments
that argument can go both ways.... "prove afk'ing is against the rules or it didnt happen"
....got any examples of anyone ever getting punished for it ?.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
Not being expressly against the TOS doesn't necessarily mean you can't be punished for something, the wording is liberal enough. Devs do talk about AFKers and say they're working internally to introduce solutions - it's a lot of PR waffle and no action, but things might change at some point.
Kirk's Protege.
I don't have to prove anything because I wasn't the one making the claim the devs had stated something.
.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
He has yet to be punished or even messaged about it.
This is proof enough to me that going AFK in a match is not breaking any rules or against the TOS. You people need to REALLY STOP complaining about this matter, and simply play the game. Some people like to AFK...get over it. They are not hurting anyone. If you don't like it...stop pugging.
Scrub...soo many things to say to you and your bud. Gonna say your a troll for condoning leeching and your "aquintaince" needs a slap in the face
We need a vote kick feature, the decent players can kick the afk pos. i feel the majority of the community wont abuse this
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
How is that not griefing?
These AFK issues have been growing worse and worse since they know Perfect World doesn't care and they get a free ticket just sitting there, mocking the honest players. I've seen it happen over and over since 1999, where the griefer population isn't kept in check and it eventually drives off the honest players who love the game. The good players left the game, leaving the "Trash", which drives off more and more customers to the point the game starts getting really bad publicity.
Honestly, STO's community effectively handled the griefers, before they added the "lazy system" (PvE Queues). If there was a troublemaker, people learned who they were and avoided them. But with the PvE Queues, you have no choice but to group up with people who you wanted to avoid.
This is really getting so bad now, I'm really starting to lose my enthusiasm to even log in now. The AFKers, the Griefer fleets camping on Defera, the trashy Zone chats at the Hubs. STO is effectively a lawless town where the sheriff is out partying and not caring, as long as the bank isn't robbed.
As for handling these bums, there been dozens of threads that tried to think of a system. All I can say is that there is no easy answer unless people have the power to boot out these people and black list them from future events.
Recently, I thought maybe if there was like a performance system (sort of like a charge meter). The more you stand still, the less overall points you get. And the longer you stand still, the harsher the penalty, where it gets to the point you get no reward. And the more you participate, the more you will get the usual reward. (Also the overall reward depends on the teams performance, like completing the objectives. Like saving the Diplomats in Colony Invasion or killing the Boss Saboteur in Incursion).
join a fleet or get some friends and run it with them if it means so much to you that you get so bent out of shape you are ready to rage quit over it....problem solved.
IMO you guys whining over someone afk in an open mission pug are the ones with the problem ....
.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
Someone commiting a murder half way around the world from where you live is wrong...doesn't matter if you are not involved, it is still wrong. You may be not experincing leeching but it is happening and it is unfair to those dealing with it
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
this isnt about murder.....drrrrr :rolleyes:
heh...love the dramatic analogies that are posted in these forums....lol.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
Private channels. is there a list somewhere or is it invite only?
Its not hard to off these people. Do nothing productive in the zone no reward. if everyone does 200k damage and you do 0-50k no reward simple as that. this will also weed out the trolls that bring a shuttle or are worthless and die all the time because they bring TRIBBLE in to a elite stf.
And before you go waa waa the poor people that are not all that good wont get rewards ... this is why they have normal stfs SO PEOPLE CAN LEARN TO DO THEM.
Now quit afking and ruining others game play because you want to ride off the work of others.
This is the new generation here i guess lazy trash people!
good luck with that.......
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
PUGging content in STO is like having unprotected sex. You never know what sort of teammates you're going to get but it will probably make you tired, angry and upset.
Take responsibility for YOUR game play by choosing who YOU want to play with.
And leave the AFKers to group with themselves.
It's that easy to do. :rolleyes:
No trolling intended. The fact is...players are allowed to AFK. If people want to stand around and do nothing, that is their right to do so. You don't have to stay in the game, you don't have to pug, and you don't have to pay any attention to it. Live and let live. Do what all left-wing socially liberal societies do and TOLERATE IT!
I have always thought of AFKing as a protest to the repetitive game play and grinding. It is why I have no problem with people who do it. In fact, I applaud those people for AFKing because they are actually doing something to bring about change (as opposed to the legions of keyboard warriors on this so-called FORUM). The more people who do it, the more Cryptic will realize that their end game is getting BORING!
If you intro the Vote to Kick (V2K) feature, people will abuse it. In fact, I think the same number of people who leech will be the exact same number of people who abuse V2K. You are replacing one problem with another...except your new problem can be directly used to attack legit players...and that is WORSE than AFKing. I would rather have an AFKer, silent and invisible, than a power-tripping a**hole voting to kick someone cause their DPS isn't Godly.
Face it kids...AFKing is a small issue (I won't even call it a problem, cause that implies it is bad) and it can be easily avoided by not pugging. Go and make some friends, make a fleet, party up, and reduce or eliminate the chances of being paired with an AFKer. There are so many options available to you to avoid AFKers.
And...for all you AFKers out there - you know who you are - I have one thing to say to you people: What you are doing is not against the TOS...so don't worry about it. Play the game the way you feel comfortable. Don't let anyone call you a leech (because that is name calling and THAT IS against the TOS). If anyone calls you a leecher, or any other bad name, report them ASAP for name calling. Sooner or later...the name calling will stop.
being AFK during a match should be fixed this asap.
they need to remove the leaver penalty on every mission.. some missions you can already leave.. but not every one.
not everyone can make private matches.. or dont want to..
pugging is part of the game.. if you get an afker, you should be able to leave and restart with no penalty.
there is no reason to be forced to put up with these guys..
i do under stand why they do it tho.. its from being forced to grind the same missions over and over..
once you play the one you like, you have 30 to 60 minutes to go do something else.
also, only a few missions give certain rewards.. like CC.. i hate to admit it, while i dont afk.. every time i play that mission i just hang back and shoot the thoilans. one time i got first place doing that.
mission CDs, and repetition make this game very boring.
they should add the choice of marks loot to every mission.. and remove CDs and leaver penalties..
then no more AFKers and you do what you want to have fun..
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
yeah but when you pug you should be able to leave if you dont like the team..
simple fix.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
No, we don't. I've seen "vote to kick" abused in SWTOR to no end. The worst thing they ever put into the game. It turns it into and elitest fest. Pugs end up dieing because no one wants to be kicked for not having the right torpedo, or the right engine, or the proper rifle. Better yet, I watched my own guild using it simply to laugh at the rage remarks from those they kicked. PVE que's go from a minute or to now, to hours. And I mean hours. Why would anyone Que up just to be kicked by some 14 year old elitest that thinks you didn't blow up the cube fast enough, or you let a probe through the gate, or he didn't see borg gear on your ship.
No, Vote to kick is not the answer to any pug problem.
Elite STFs should be an elitist fest. I expect everyone to have a solid build, know the strategy, and pull your weight.
The pre-existing tools depend on knowing enough people who log on at the same time. Otherwise, you're teaming up with strangers and possibly end up right back where you started.
"Don't PUG" is a mindless non-answer. It's not a solution. It's a copout.
The above sums up my own evaluation quite well.
Recall that in February the Executive Producer came onto these boards and told us that Cryptic were 'actively working on solutions to AFK'ing'. That they were 'still gathering information on STFs' but that they will be acting on the AFK issues soon.
To his credit, he even acknowledged Cryptic's responsibility in resolving such issues.
Half a year, and nothing substantial. But they are ACTIVELY WORKING ON IT!
Mr Stahl, I hope you see fit to give this the actual priority it deserves, some day.
Source.
oh, its a great solution for avoiding afk'ers.
if you don't pug...you don't have the problem.
seems pretty mindful and simple to me.
( does it feel like this thread is just going round and round in a vortex of ya-huh and nuh-uh ? )
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
Yeah, and if you don't know enough people to form a team, if you don't PUG, you don't play. So yeah, in the sense that not playing avoids all problems in the game, that's a great "solution."
For those of us who want to be able to play the game we pay for without depending on the participation of others to block out the bad behavior of a few, it's utterly and completely useless. You're basically saying everyone who can't put together a 5-person team should just avoid STFs. :rolleyes:
or it just me
so i say make the borg how it was.
and please bring the borg space weapons back
you make it sound like every single PUG has an afk'er a leecher and a griefer in it all just waiting to ruin some poor helpless gamers life.
.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
the other time was in infected I just dragged the tac to where he was hidding so the tac would kill me then turn on him he left before I could get the tac to him I was sad lol.
the one thing I have been noticing in infected with the AFKer's is the will on purpose lose the optional. IE blow up a gen on other side of team die then afk
so? did this make you win? no..
they more then likely just re queued up a new match and YOU were the ones that didnt get anything..
losing out on some loot being afk doesnt hurt the afker.. they can run another mission afk.. it doesnt even matter what mission they pick, cause they dont intend to play it.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
You're a jackass! Reach back and unplug your computer, stupid!
Actually, that goes for everyone that says we shouldn't pug. I play at odd hours when most of my fleet mates are offline. And I don't usually play elite STF's. It isn't our fault and it isn't our problem. This is Cryptic and PWE not giving a holy flying $#!+! Pure and simple.