I disagree. It neuters the afk leeches, and let's you bail on incompetent teams without suffering a penalty timer.
What's the downside? That griefers will make a sport of bailing in the middle of an STF so you can't complete it?
Unless you are a leecher, griefer, or one of those bumbling clowns who refuses to learn the strategy or follow instructions from teammates, the downside seems minimal.
Why is it a bad idea? You just answered your own question. Emphasis mine.
Then it is completely a matter of opinion. I would love the ability to bail on TRIBBLE teams without a penalty. I don't have the time or the patience to deal with "Remedial STFs 101." If that sounds like elitism, so be it. They are called ELITE STFs for a reason. If you can't spend five minutes reading a walkthrough, and can't be bothered to read instructions in the chat window, you do not belong in there.
There is an important distinction to make with this. Standing around AFK on your ship or in sector space or other social zone is not against the TOS. I highly doubt Cryptic/PWE considers people AFK leeching in queued events as acceptable. It's damaging to the game and serves to drive customers away.
I challenge you to provide a link to a post where any Cryptic Dev states that AFK leeching in a queued event is acceptable behavior and that they won't do anything about it.
I don't need to provide such a link. Their inaction in the matter is all I need. Actions speak louder than words. Like I said before, I have a friend who has been reported over a hundred times for leeching Mine Trap, and he is still going strong, and leeching every day, and loving it. In fact, I am having a Skype convo with him, at this very moment, and he is leeching Mine Trap.
(FYI...he is laughing his a** off at all you whiners and complainers. He thinks you guys are just babies. He wants you all to grow up.)
There will never be a ban for AFK/Leeching. It will never happen because AFK/Leeching does not hurt anyone. It is neither a direct attack on someone's character, nor is it intentionally malicious in any way. If you have an AFK/Leecher...then consider it a challenge...the game just got a little harder, prepare to step up your game. Deal with it. Suck it up. Take it like a man.
AFK/Leeching is such a small issue compared to the problems that will be introduced with "solutions". Vote to Kick will be abused for sure, just like it is in SWTOR. Rep systems can be abused as well, as anyone can tarnish a reputation. Serverside autokicks would cause an unacceptable overhead on the server by being forced to constantly check EVERY player on the server every minute or so for inactivity. Trying to fix AFK/Leeching will only cause bigger problems.
If you don't wanna see a leecher...STOP PUGGING! THis is not a difficult concept.
Let sleeping dogs sleep and let leeching players leech.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If you oppose the Reputation nerf, feel free to use my signature
Nor is it remotely adequate, no matter how many times it is smugly parroted.
For a lot of people, "stop pugging" means "stop playing," or at least "stop queueing for PvE".
Did you know that if you team up with 4 other people, like friends or fleetmates, you can avoid leechers 100% of the time. What's wrong with this solution? Why is this so hard?
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If you oppose the Reputation nerf, feel free to use my signature
Did you know that if you team up with 4 other people, like friends or fleetmates, you can avoid leechers 100% of the time.
Yes. Obviously. :rolleyes:
Did you know that not everyone always has four friends or fleet mates online at the same time?
What's wrong with this solution?
Well, it makes me dependent on other people to access content in a game I pay for, for one thing. It also basically abandons open PvE queues to griefers, leechers, and clods, because we can't think of a better way to combat them.
Well, it makes me dependent on other people to access content in a game I pay for, for one thing. It also basically abandons open PvE queues to griefers, leechers, and clods, because we can't think of a better way to combat them.
So in an MMO team game...you don't like the fact that you are dependent on other people?
I'm sorry...are you not also dependent on other people while pugging?
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If you oppose the Reputation nerf, feel free to use my signature
So in an MMO team game...you don't like the fact that you are dependent on other people?
No, I don't. Shouldn't be necessary.
I'm sorry...are you not also dependent on other people while pugging?
The fact that I'm dependent on them is my whole point. They are handed the ability to ruin my gameplay without facing any consequences of it or giving me any VIABLE* way of working around them.
*No, for the umpteenth time, "Don't PUG" is not viable, it is a mindless copout. Repeating it won't make it true. Not everyone can put a private team together.
There are plenty of FPS games out there. MMOs aren't for you if you don't want to play with others.
I'm willing to play with others, under the strict condition that they don't negate my efforts through action or inaction. I expect them to actually play, in other words, and I don't think that's unreasonable.
There are plenty of FPS games out there. MMOs aren't for you if you don't want to play with others.
there are plenty of things to do socially in MMO's that arent gameplay related,...and you can even do these things while you are solo'ing missions ( if you prefer to level that way over 'having' to do missions with others for XP or items ).
what a concept huh ? you can have social interactions 'while' you are physically doing something else !!!
cool huh !!!???
try it, it works ..... :rolleyes:
_______________________
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
Then it is completely a matter of opinion. I would love the ability to bail on TRIBBLE teams without a penalty. I don't have the time or the patience to deal with "Remedial STFs 101." If that sounds like elitism, so be it. They are called ELITE STFs for a reason. If you can't spend five minutes reading a walkthrough, and can't be bothered to read instructions in the chat window, you do not belong in there.
Exactly. I still leave when some noob in an andorian escort decides to go straight for the generator. If you join Elite STF without knowing a thing, at least have the decency to have low dps and be nothing, instead of be less than nothing.
There's the penalty timer, but hey, that's what alts are for. Tough luck for everyone else.:D
What game have you been playing? It certainly hasn't been STO if you think people NEED to queue to PvE. I've been playing since closed beta and I have never once needed to get in a queue to PvE.
You see, if a game mechanic is broken, the right answer is not to fix it, but to ignore it. Thus, you will have a superior game. :rolleyes:
Incorrect. One is a sound analogy while the other doesn't make sense.
Oh you mean like the second post in the thread.
And who was the handsome devil that made that post? :rolleyes: Oh it was me.
look at what you find when you stop to read.
And if you bothered to use the search tool you'll find dozens of threads where we have been making suggestions to Cryptic and begging for them to do something about this, but the most positive response we've gotten back from them is a vague wishy-washy "we're looking into solutions".
So in the mean time, while we wait for the devs to do something, we are advising people what they can do on their own to minimize/eliminate this problem using existing in game tools.
Truth hurts and people are responsible for their own actions.
Whenever you knowingly participate in something where there is a risk something negative will happen to you, you have no one to blame but yourself when that risk happens to you.
I guess we have a different opinion on what is stupid then.
Their are still people that leech from such things. Like I said I have even been in games with friends and have seen 1 of them leech before. Don't pug will only reduce chances of not having a leecher in games it won't completely eliminate it by kicking out a leecher or give leecher zero rewards.
So now instead of quickly getting games going from pugging someone should spend time trying to get private games going only to reduce the chances not completely eliminate the chances of seeing a leecher not really a good thing IMO because some people don't have enough time to waste trying to get private games going. Those such people only have time to quickly start a single game and play it.
Yes their are people that report leechers and it is bad that so far nothing has been done to solve this problem and the only solution is to not play any team aspects of the game if you never ever want to have a leecher with you.
Truth is their are jerks telling people its your fault. How about blaming the ones causing the problem and dealing with such people? But no instead don't put yourself in situations that bad things can happen well I don't want to just keep repeating story mission and anything else that are completely solo so that I will have a 100% leech free playing experience.
It is sad that so many AFK threads go up and Cryptic has no real comment about the ongoing problem that is clearly turning this game into one of grief and frustration and yet there is nothing on the TOS to eliminate the problem.
I like the fact that trolling a player in game can result in disciplinary action and yet 1 or more players going AFK and causing other players grief and frustration and ruining the whole game enjoyment is totally allowed.
This game is way out of whack in this regard.
As a player you have 2 choices, ether quit and suffer the 1 hour penalty or suffer through the anger and frustration and try to finish the mission without the other player(s)
Here is the most awesome part about the penalty; it never affects the AFK player because they are always the last to leave. In fact they love the penalty because that ensures that the Non-AFK players stay and finish the mission.
And you know what the beauty of it is. The TOS is there to protect the AFKers
Because it is against TOS to troll players, so isn?t that a slap in the face for those players that have to run the mission shorthanded.
What do you think would happen if we took the leaver penalty away?
Everyone would beam out and re-queue and the poor AFKer would be left all alone.
result = run STF with zero 'totally avoidable' nerd-rage.
-or-
.....2 step process for those not in an 'active' fleet:
Zone chat: any active fleets recruiting?
(invite comes in)
repeat process listed in 'fleet chat' above.
.you're welcome :cool:
You know, I never saw the part on the box where it said you had to join a flock to play the game...
"Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
result = run STF with zero 'totally avoidable' nerd-rage.
-or-
.....2 step process for those not in an 'active' fleet:
Zone chat: any active fleets recruiting?
(invite comes in)
repeat process listed in 'fleet chat' above.
.you're welcome :cool:
Not everyone in fleet/friend online same time. Not everyone who is online wants to do what you want to do when you want to do it each and every time you want to do it. If you are able to get a game going quickly their is still chance someone will leech and I have actually experienced it happen.
result = run STF with zero 'totally avoidable' nerd-rage.
-or-
.....2 step process for those not in an 'active' fleet:
Zone chat: any active fleets recruiting?
(invite comes in)
repeat process listed in 'fleet chat' above.
.you're welcome :cool:
you are dreaming.. here is how it really works..
fleet chat: anyone want to run a STF?
fleet chat: me me me me me me me me..
fleet chat: damn i cant take all of you what stf you want to run.
fleet chat: i can do ise, i cant im on CD buti can do KSE, i cant do either im on CD for both.. i want to run colony.. i hate ground, lets do CSE.. no i hate that one lets wait for ise..
fleet chat: come on guys i want to run something..
fleet chat: i gotta go eat, ill be back in a hour..
if you think im in a small fleet think again. there are almost always over 10 poeple online at a time.
sometimes you gotta pug it..
and if you think those elite stf channels are better then pugs you might not get a AFKer but you will almost surely pick up someone that has never done a STF before and went straight to elites.
[12:35] Vessel Two of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 225232 (271723) Plasma Damage to you with Plasma Lance.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
no....not dreaming at all, I gave you a quick, easy and working solution for a problem ...
you are just unwilling to take responsibility for the positions you put yourself into given the current game mechanics. ( let me repeat: "given the current game mechanics" )
it's not my fault if you get poked in the eye by a floating finger while going for a prize....then walk back into the finger over and over again.... you could walk around it, and get the same intended destination.
think about it.
.
_______________________
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
Comments
I disagree. It neuters the afk leeches, and let's you bail on incompetent teams without suffering a penalty timer.
What's the downside? That griefers will make a sport of bailing in the middle of an STF so you can't complete it?
Unless you are a leecher, griefer, or one of those bumbling clowns who refuses to learn the strategy or follow instructions from teammates, the downside seems minimal.
Then it is completely a matter of opinion. I would love the ability to bail on TRIBBLE teams without a penalty. I don't have the time or the patience to deal with "Remedial STFs 101." If that sounds like elitism, so be it. They are called ELITE STFs for a reason. If you can't spend five minutes reading a walkthrough, and can't be bothered to read instructions in the chat window, you do not belong in there.
Why should they be able to negatively impact me with their refusal to follow any game plan?
If you're free to blunder in and make it 10 times as hard as it needs to be, I should be free to bail on you for wasting my time.
I don't need to provide such a link. Their inaction in the matter is all I need. Actions speak louder than words. Like I said before, I have a friend who has been reported over a hundred times for leeching Mine Trap, and he is still going strong, and leeching every day, and loving it. In fact, I am having a Skype convo with him, at this very moment, and he is leeching Mine Trap.
(FYI...he is laughing his a** off at all you whiners and complainers. He thinks you guys are just babies. He wants you all to grow up.)
There will never be a ban for AFK/Leeching. It will never happen because AFK/Leeching does not hurt anyone. It is neither a direct attack on someone's character, nor is it intentionally malicious in any way. If you have an AFK/Leecher...then consider it a challenge...the game just got a little harder, prepare to step up your game. Deal with it. Suck it up. Take it like a man.
AFK/Leeching is such a small issue compared to the problems that will be introduced with "solutions". Vote to Kick will be abused for sure, just like it is in SWTOR. Rep systems can be abused as well, as anyone can tarnish a reputation. Serverside autokicks would cause an unacceptable overhead on the server by being forced to constantly check EVERY player on the server every minute or so for inactivity. Trying to fix AFK/Leeching will only cause bigger problems.
If you don't wanna see a leecher...STOP PUGGING! THis is not a difficult concept.
Let sleeping dogs sleep and let leeching players leech.
Nor is it remotely adequate, no matter how many times it is smugly parroted.
For a lot of people, "stop pugging" means "stop playing," or at least "stop queueing for PvE".
Did you know that if you team up with 4 other people, like friends or fleetmates, you can avoid leechers 100% of the time. What's wrong with this solution? Why is this so hard?
Yes. Obviously. :rolleyes:
Did you know that not everyone always has four friends or fleet mates online at the same time?
Well, it makes me dependent on other people to access content in a game I pay for, for one thing. It also basically abandons open PvE queues to griefers, leechers, and clods, because we can't think of a better way to combat them.
So in an MMO team game...you don't like the fact that you are dependent on other people?
I'm sorry...are you not also dependent on other people while pugging?
Now 2 leechers can be a problem.
Officially Nerfed In Early 2410
No, I don't. Shouldn't be necessary.
The fact that I'm dependent on them is my whole point. They are handed the ability to ruin my gameplay without facing any consequences of it or giving me any VIABLE* way of working around them.
*No, for the umpteenth time, "Don't PUG" is not viable, it is a mindless copout. Repeating it won't make it true. Not everyone can put a private team together.
I'm willing to play with others, under the strict condition that they don't negate my efforts through action or inaction. I expect them to actually play, in other words, and I don't think that's unreasonable.
there are plenty of things to do socially in MMO's that arent gameplay related,...and you can even do these things while you are solo'ing missions ( if you prefer to level that way over 'having' to do missions with others for XP or items ).
what a concept huh ? you can have social interactions 'while' you are physically doing something else !!!
cool huh !!!???
try it, it works ..... :rolleyes:
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
Exactly. I still leave when some noob in an andorian escort decides to go straight for the generator. If you join Elite STF without knowing a thing, at least have the decency to have low dps and be nothing, instead of be less than nothing.
There's the penalty timer, but hey, that's what alts are for. Tough luck for everyone else.:D
You see, if a game mechanic is broken, the right answer is not to fix it, but to ignore it. Thus, you will have a superior game. :rolleyes:
I guess we have a different opinion on what is stupid then.
Their are still people that leech from such things. Like I said I have even been in games with friends and have seen 1 of them leech before. Don't pug will only reduce chances of not having a leecher in games it won't completely eliminate it by kicking out a leecher or give leecher zero rewards.
So now instead of quickly getting games going from pugging someone should spend time trying to get private games going only to reduce the chances not completely eliminate the chances of seeing a leecher not really a good thing IMO because some people don't have enough time to waste trying to get private games going. Those such people only have time to quickly start a single game and play it.
Yes their are people that report leechers and it is bad that so far nothing has been done to solve this problem and the only solution is to not play any team aspects of the game if you never ever want to have a leecher with you.
Truth is their are jerks telling people its your fault. How about blaming the ones causing the problem and dealing with such people? But no instead don't put yourself in situations that bad things can happen well I don't want to just keep repeating story mission and anything else that are completely solo so that I will have a 100% leech free playing experience.
It is sad that so many AFK threads go up and Cryptic has no real comment about the ongoing problem that is clearly turning this game into one of grief and frustration and yet there is nothing on the TOS to eliminate the problem.
I like the fact that trolling a player in game can result in disciplinary action and yet 1 or more players going AFK and causing other players grief and frustration and ruining the whole game enjoyment is totally allowed.
This game is way out of whack in this regard.
As a player you have 2 choices, ether quit and suffer the 1 hour penalty or suffer through the anger and frustration and try to finish the mission without the other player(s)
Here is the most awesome part about the penalty; it never affects the AFK player because they are always the last to leave. In fact they love the penalty because that ensures that the Non-AFK players stay and finish the mission.
And you know what the beauty of it is. The TOS is there to protect the AFKers
Because it is against TOS to troll players, so isn?t that a slap in the face for those players that have to run the mission shorthanded.
What do you think would happen if we took the leaver penalty away?
Everyone would beam out and re-queue and the poor AFKer would be left all alone.
You think we should go back to that?
Fleet chat: me !, me !, me ! me !
Fleet chat: OK then...lets go !
result = run STF with zero 'totally avoidable' nerd-rage.
-or-
.....2 step process for those not in an 'active' fleet:
Zone chat: any active fleets recruiting?
(invite comes in)
repeat process listed in 'fleet chat' above.
.you're welcome :cool:
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
You know, I never saw the part on the box where it said you had to join a flock to play the game...
Not everyone in fleet/friend online same time. Not everyone who is online wants to do what you want to do when you want to do it each and every time you want to do it. If you are able to get a game going quickly their is still chance someone will leech and I have actually experienced it happen.
you are joining a flock for an STF.......so what's the difference?
might as well make it so the problem this thread is raging about is degraded to 0% eh ?
unless your the personality type that 'likes' to rage about it..... I suppose that could be the case.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----
If it's broken, don't fix it.:D
you are dreaming.. here is how it really works..
fleet chat: anyone want to run a STF?
fleet chat: me me me me me me me me..
fleet chat: damn i cant take all of you what stf you want to run.
fleet chat: i can do ise, i cant im on CD buti can do KSE, i cant do either im on CD for both.. i want to run colony.. i hate ground, lets do CSE.. no i hate that one lets wait for ise..
fleet chat: come on guys i want to run something..
fleet chat: i gotta go eat, ill be back in a hour..
if you think im in a small fleet think again. there are almost always over 10 poeple online at a time.
sometimes you gotta pug it..
and if you think those elite stf channels are better then pugs you might not get a AFKer but you will almost surely pick up someone that has never done a STF before and went straight to elites.
[12:44] Vessel One of Two Unimatrix 01 deals 1019527 (1157678) Kinetic Damage to you with Plasma Energy Bolt Explosion.
you are just unwilling to take responsibility for the positions you put yourself into given the current game mechanics. ( let me repeat: "given the current game mechanics" )
it's not my fault if you get poked in the eye by a floating finger while going for a prize....then walk back into the finger over and over again.... you could walk around it, and get the same intended destination.
think about it.
.
---- FIRE EVERYTHING ! ----