I just learned that DStahl was requesting Harlem Shake videos on another thread. We I saw this, the image that came into my mind was Emperor Nero in a party while Rome burned. I guess they have other priorities than addressing this issue.
This thread just proves one important thing: People HATE the fleet mark que events. We might be fine with not going through foundry if there was far more options to farm fleet marks. We can only take so much farming the same thing over and over before we become, frankly, ****ing crazy.
So we did it with STFs. So what? STFs aren't fleet marks. So, I don't ask for those pathetic 50 FM back for foundry. I ask that you create MORE ways to get it, or increase the payouts for ques. I also ask that you lower the blasted cxp price tag for marks. 10k even for a 100 crit is seriously pushing it.
Why shouldn't every mission reward e.c., dilithium, and marks (and there should only be one type of mark)?
Then we'd be free to go do whatever missions we enjoy - i.e. to have fun and not have to grind.
^^^
This is the main reason I posted a Rewards Revamp proposal (see link below).
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator and Resident She-Wolf
Community Moderators are Unpaid Volunteers and NOT Employees of Gearbox/Cryptic
Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
Wow,the irony that just keeps flying over his head amazes me. I'm sorry Mr.Stahl, but please don't forget one thing, you are getting PAID to not have fun,THAT'S THE POINT.
I wonder if fleets alternatively submitted videos voicing thoughtful objections to the recent changes, suggestions to fix them, and suggestions to make the grind more fun and less repetitive; would those be played at the meeting?
I'm wondering if DStahl's request for videos is just an excuse to tell top executives that everybody in STO is happy. "See everybody is making fun videos". No problems on STO.... And BTW that thread that has more than 2K posting, just ingnore......
It is now Tuesday. I am still here. I am still pissed, and I am still not playing your game. Time is wearing on, as is my patience. Your call. What ya gonna do?
Well considering we are constantly being told by Dan and by the CDFers, that these forums only represent a small minority of players and the rest are blissfully enjoying the game (see the metrics", then why are we expecting a response???
Don't fall for this statement. You can hear the players complain about the changes to the foundary missions in the ESD zone, well we can, I don't know if Cryptic are listening to their players in-game.
Metrics won't show up players who are disappointed and hoping that things will change relatively soon - posters on these forums are being relied upon by the silent ones to help those changes happen.
Given the scale of discontent that's being expressed here, I do find it staggering that Dan's first post on this forum today was on what should be considered 'canon' in STO??
Well you know, he has to make all those people who had their super story line missions ignored for the mean and evil "exploit" missions. Just taking care of his "supporters"
It seems that the longer this thread goes, the more new posters we get. The same has happened on the now notorious "Harlem Shake" thread.
Keep fighting the good fight.
How the Devs see Star Trek, apparently:
Star Trek: The Original Grind
Star Trek: The Next Grind
Star Trek: Deep Space Grind
Star Trek: Voyage to the Grind
Dan Stahl is right in that asking for videos is fine (even though this is the first request I'd seen him do for such) -- but the timing is, to put it very diplomatically, insensitive. Don't get me wrong, I think Dan is a good EP but it's important to learn from missteps.
As others have pointed out, there's some irony in saying it should all be about fun and if it bothers you to ignore it. We want to have fun -- making our starbase goals that much harder to get by taking the FM out of IOR and having no added alternatives, either from boosting current FM rewards, reducing project costs, or new content is extremely frustrating to people. Instead of leaving the game because of this move, there have been scores of suggestions in this thread on viable solutions that can be enacted anywhere from this week to over the next few months -- all before May.
There's a major communication disconnect between the devs and the players since this change came out of the blue with no prior discussion, was posted to Tribble less than a day before it went live (ignoring some 75 pages of comments?), and has now amassed over 2000 comments since Thursday -- making it the most commented thread in this subforum in ages.
I honestly do not understand some of the logic that is going through the developer's heads:
1) Starbase progression is already time-gated. No one is going to finish faster than it's possible (~7 months was supposed to be this time, de facto not a single of the 16,500 fleets in the game will finish before 10-11 months).
2) You want us to get more Dilithium? Then increase or remove the refinement cap! This would reward people for playing once they get over 8000 in a day and help out smaller fleets who only have a few people to share the costs. And since it's a time currency, give at least a nominal amount for playing any content in the game -- it's annoying that the fleet mark events don't reward any dilithium.
3) You know Fleet Marks are bottlenecking fleets. Do something about it now -- as I said above, increase rewards, lower costs, or something else.
4) Fleet Marks for group activity? The Foundry IOR, Temporal Ambassador (solo only mission), and doffing do not fit the bill. But these were put in the game due to issue #3.
about the cap as a test i played all the dailies, the breen ones, and the ones in eta eridoni, and the explore 3 worlds in a cluster. and did each space STF on elite
after refining i got 1,000 raw ore that is before i even did any foundry. i mean it's so easy to bounce off the cap and i was not even playing that long
Did Stahl's account get TRIBBLE? He can't be *that* out of touch with the community right? He can't be serious with that request, right? RIGHT?!
Nothing is beyond the realm of possibility. The fact that the thread hasn't been closed yet is at least a small plus. After a certain point though, silence becomes its own answer and we are rapidly approaching that point. I know what my intentions are.
STILL no response?! I don't know why this surprises me, honestly, but I was hopeful that since the U.S. holiday has ended, SOMEONE would say something...of value. (Sorry, Bran, you do a lot for us, but in this instance your reply didn't really say anything, well, at all, but certainly nothing addressing the issues in this thread. Thanks for reading every post, if you are, but - no offense intended - it's directed a bit upward.)
At this point, my entire Fleet have decided to boycott further play and, moreover, you'll not be getting any more money out of any of us. I think one lad, who had just gotten his "Gold" will also be canceling it this month. Not a huge number, but that's 18 of us no longer buying Zen or any new "oooh shineys."
I'm sure there'll be others to take our places, and that you couldn't likely care less, since your "metrics bear out that players are happy," but, our lot are not.
Keep up the fight, mates! Cheers to you!
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge (...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
the lack of replies from any of the devs/branflakes says it all tbh , the only thing holding my fleet back is fleetmarks and not dilithium . we need more ways of getting them and NOT less while still being fun dan
This thread has certainly proved that Cryptic has learned masterfully, how to achieve an emotional tie with their STO players.
And also how to manipulate a part of the player base with the ease and skill of Fagin.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I have a low spec machine Mister Stahl..for now its what I can afford... a dual core 2 gig e-machine is actually a better comp. (512k intel video in most of them)
Since the wrapper went away I no longer can get fleet marks to contribute to my fleets starbase. My machine is of such piddling quality that running with other players in a mission is pretty much a slide show... and an execise in frustration and dieing alot. (you do not do fleet missions AFK unlike a PUG STF...not that I would anyway, but perhapes you get the idea...?)
So I want to thank you for your well thought out and considered decision, and your consideration of all of your player base, ncluding myself. I especially want to thank you for the small fleets out there thaqt cannot put together the "average" 25 PLAYERS (not characters, players. There must be some utterly huge fleets out there. Tell me, do your demograhics account for INACTIVE accounts? I know my fleet doesn't have over 8 active players. The rest on the roster haven't played in over 2 years now)
I assume that we'll be able to purchase Fleet Marks directly for ZEN shortly?
*shakes head at the utter short sidedness of this particular executive decision*
I would just like to point out again, this is your JOB, you get PAID for it. I don't get to have fun at my job either sir. THAT IS THE POINT
And again, to me this points out some very serious issues within the walls of cryptic. Asking this question, when you have this much anger and resentment on the forums, is just a way to make it worse, and I think its done so.
Will Fleet Marks be increased on other missions? Yes.
Oh PLEASE increase the fleet mark rewarded in No Win Scenario! Pretty please with a Q on top:D? It will be added incentive for people to play such a fun and challenging mission.
@Stahl:
Will fun be included in the patch? Assuming you have kept a close eye on this thread and the previous you know this is about far more then Fleetmarks
Lost and Delirious... and Disenchanted too Apparently some forum posters have diplomatic immunity nowadays, where can I get mine?
Comments
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Two very important things here. First our point of view, the game isn't fun. Second his point of view. "If [it] bothers you then just ignore it."
Just thought I'd point out the second part people skipped.
Anyway...Power to the People! Keep fighting The Good Fight!
So we did it with STFs. So what? STFs aren't fleet marks. So, I don't ask for those pathetic 50 FM back for foundry. I ask that you create MORE ways to get it, or increase the payouts for ques. I also ask that you lower the blasted cxp price tag for marks. 10k even for a 100 crit is seriously pushing it.
^^^
This is the main reason I posted a Rewards Revamp proposal (see link below).
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Stahl is looking for Harlem Shake videos.
Just start it out normal then when the crazy part happens cut to characters protesting, then insert message screens of what you want to say.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
It is now Tuesday. I am still here. I am still pissed, and I am still not playing your game. Time is wearing on, as is my patience. Your call. What ya gonna do?
Don't fall for this statement. You can hear the players complain about the changes to the foundary missions in the ESD zone, well we can, I don't know if Cryptic are listening to their players in-game.
Metrics won't show up players who are disappointed and hoping that things will change relatively soon - posters on these forums are being relied upon by the silent ones to help those changes happen.
Well you know, he has to make all those people who had their super story line missions ignored for the mean and evil "exploit" missions. Just taking care of his "supporters"
/sarcasm:mad:
Keep fighting the good fight.
Star Trek: The Original Grind
Star Trek: The Next Grind
Star Trek: Deep Space Grind
Star Trek: Voyage to the Grind
As others have pointed out, there's some irony in saying it should all be about fun and if it bothers you to ignore it. We want to have fun -- making our starbase goals that much harder to get by taking the FM out of IOR and having no added alternatives, either from boosting current FM rewards, reducing project costs, or new content is extremely frustrating to people. Instead of leaving the game because of this move, there have been scores of suggestions in this thread on viable solutions that can be enacted anywhere from this week to over the next few months -- all before May.
There's a major communication disconnect between the devs and the players since this change came out of the blue with no prior discussion, was posted to Tribble less than a day before it went live (ignoring some 75 pages of comments?), and has now amassed over 2000 comments since Thursday -- making it the most commented thread in this subforum in ages.
I honestly do not understand some of the logic that is going through the developer's heads:
1) Starbase progression is already time-gated. No one is going to finish faster than it's possible (~7 months was supposed to be this time, de facto not a single of the 16,500 fleets in the game will finish before 10-11 months).
2) You want us to get more Dilithium? Then increase or remove the refinement cap! This would reward people for playing once they get over 8000 in a day and help out smaller fleets who only have a few people to share the costs. And since it's a time currency, give at least a nominal amount for playing any content in the game -- it's annoying that the fleet mark events don't reward any dilithium.
3) You know Fleet Marks are bottlenecking fleets. Do something about it now -- as I said above, increase rewards, lower costs, or something else.
4) Fleet Marks for group activity? The Foundry IOR, Temporal Ambassador (solo only mission), and doffing do not fit the bill. But these were put in the game due to issue #3.
My STOwiki page | Reachable in-game @PhyrexianHero
Fed Armada: Section 31 (level 730, 2700+ members)
KDF Armada: Klingon Intelligence (level 699, 2100+ members)
after refining i got 1,000 raw ore that is before i even did any foundry. i mean it's so easy to bounce off the cap and i was not even playing that long
Apparently some forum posters have diplomatic immunity nowadays, where can I get mine? [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Provided by the man himself!
Next time you log in, ask yourself this.
Nothing is beyond the realm of possibility. The fact that the thread hasn't been closed yet is at least a small plus. After a certain point though, silence becomes its own answer and we are rapidly approaching that point. I know what my intentions are.
At this point, my entire Fleet have decided to boycott further play and, moreover, you'll not be getting any more money out of any of us. I think one lad, who had just gotten his "Gold" will also be canceling it this month. Not a huge number, but that's 18 of us no longer buying Zen or any new "oooh shineys."
I'm sure there'll be others to take our places, and that you couldn't likely care less, since your "metrics bear out that players are happy," but, our lot are not.
Keep up the fight, mates! Cheers to you!
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge
(...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
oooh, this was my favorite part:
It seems he's asking us the same question we're asking him
DELTA PRICE RISING
This thread has certainly proved that Cryptic has learned masterfully, how to achieve an emotional tie with their STO players.
And also how to manipulate a part of the player base with the ease and skill of Fagin.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I would just like to point out again, this is your JOB, you get PAID for it. I don't get to have fun at my job either sir. THAT IS THE POINT
Since the wrapper went away I no longer can get fleet marks to contribute to my fleets starbase. My machine is of such piddling quality that running with other players in a mission is pretty much a slide show... and an execise in frustration and dieing alot. (you do not do fleet missions AFK unlike a PUG STF...not that I would anyway, but perhapes you get the idea...?)
So I want to thank you for your well thought out and considered decision, and your consideration of all of your player base, ncluding myself. I especially want to thank you for the small fleets out there thaqt cannot put together the "average" 25 PLAYERS (not characters, players. There must be some utterly huge fleets out there. Tell me, do your demograhics account for INACTIVE accounts? I know my fleet doesn't have over 8 active players. The rest on the roster haven't played in over 2 years now)
I assume that we'll be able to purchase Fleet Marks directly for ZEN shortly?
*shakes head at the utter short sidedness of this particular executive decision*
Khemaraa sends.
And again, to me this points out some very serious issues within the walls of cryptic. Asking this question, when you have this much anger and resentment on the forums, is just a way to make it worse, and I think its done so.
Will Fleet Marks be added back to Foundry missions? Nope.
Will Fleet Marks be increased on other missions? Yes.
How soon?
As I hinted at last week, you will see changes over the next several month, but the first change will be this Thursday.
We are not detailing that change until the patch notes hit.
Oh PLEASE increase the fleet mark rewarded in No Win Scenario! Pretty please with a Q on top:D? It will be added incentive for people to play such a fun and challenging mission.
*Steals some of that popcorn*
@Stahl:
Will fun be included in the patch? Assuming you have kept a close eye on this thread and the previous you know this is about far more then Fleetmarks
Apparently some forum posters have diplomatic immunity nowadays, where can I get mine? [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]