There ya go folks...exactly what you've been asking for... a reply.
So what do we rage about now?
Well that depends on the community and whether they're willing to let Dan get away with a throwaway comment like that.
The EP of Star Trek Online has responded to over 2000 posts asking for more information on how and when the Fleet Marks are going to be restored with a 'I'm not telling you - you'll just have to wait'.
How you react to this is your own individual choice.
Me? I'll continue to post in this and others threads when I have something to say or in response to others and I'll continue to be happy in the knowledge that not a single penny of my money is going towards paying this man's salary.
*Edit* Oh! And congratulations everyone!! This in now the 7th most commented news post since the game was in beta in 2010
He told you that Thursday will be the day some FM's will be added to the game...
The day and a half to 'rage on', is also included free of charge.
This is the reply we just received (as you may already know)
Originally Posted by dastahl
As I stated 100s of threads before, additional Fleet Marks are coming.
Will Fleet Marks be added back to Foundry missions? Nope.
Will Fleet Marks be increased on other missions? Yes.
How soon?
Margaret Thatcher (Former PM of the UK) pulled a rather similar stunt with the coal miners of South Wales iirc. Pulled out the rug from an iffy system without replacing.
Guess what? She is STILL reviled but pretty much the entire population of the UK.
As I hinted at last week, you will see changes over the next several month, but the first change will be this Thursday.
Did He? I don't recall that. Then again, I don't recall finding out about the lack of IOR until it actually hit. Before you ask, yes I do read and digest patch notes.
We are not detailing that change until the patch notes hit.
The pettiness you bring to this issue is neither helpful nor wanted.
Anyway...Power to the People! Keep fighting The Good Fight!
Ummm... I believe "the pettiness" was well established in this thread long before I came along.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Should have been done with the removal of the IOR, not later. had you done so, you'd not have a 2000 post thread on your forum.
Agreed, this wasn't well-planned or well-executed. I am actually not severely opposed to the removal of fleet marks from the Foundry. What I was very bothered by was the failure to shift those marks elsewhere simultaneously--to foresee the objections that were going to come up, and have a plan already in place to deal with them.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-) Proudly F2P.Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
We absolutely do listen to feedback. But there is another issue, some people like to exploit.
I take full responsibility and freely admit that we have been heavy handed with closing exploits and that in the future we will strive to be more considerate about how we close loopholes. Providing clear alternatives for players NOT exploiting while we close down the holes.
If you go back in time to when Foundry missions HAD NO REWARDS, these issues were not around. It is only when we started adding "tangible" rewards to the Foundry that the issues surrounding the Foundry became more in depth.
We want to reward Foundry missions. We want players to be recognized for making great missions (where great is determined by the player base - not us).
However, as soon as we started attaching real rewards to the Foundry, exploits started.
Whether it was the click a contact missions or the recent AFK farming of Foundry missions, having rewards on Foundry missions is problematic.
We take responsibility for putting the rewards there in the first place, but it is out of our desire to credit those who make missions in the Foundry that achieve status in the community.
So recently, we pulled Fleet Marks from the Foundry because there were too many people AFK completing missions, or in other words logging into the mission, letting the client sit there for 30 minutes and then collecting rewards, and Fleet Marks to boot.
Should we have upped the Fleet Marks on other missions before we pulled the FMs from the Foundry? Well I think the answer is obviously yes.
But to think that we are pulling Fleet Marks without an intention to add them back is false. We really do monitor Fleet Marks daily and we know how last week's changes impacted overall Fleet Mark earning. We will be compensating in this week's update to Holodeck.
Will it make everyone happy? no. But it will add Fleet Marks back into the economy.
We do plan to continue updating the Fleet Mark economies as the game progresses and as stated in posts several days ago, we will be reclassifying what are Events and what are Fleet Actions with a goal of making Fleet Marks the reward for "Group" gameplay.
Fleet Projects are only a small percentage Fleet Mark based so if you do not like to "group" then you'll have to contribute in other ways. We DO expect Fleet Holdings to require "group" gameplay for the most part. This is why we will continue to tune Fleet Holdings up through the May update.
As I stated 100s of threads before, additional Fleet Marks are coming.
Will Fleet Marks be added back to Foundry missions? Nope.
Will Fleet Marks be increased on other missions? Yes.
How soon?
As I hinted at last week, you will see changes over the next several month, but the first change will be this Thursday.
We are not detailing that change until the patch notes hit.
The thing is,no where did you mention anything about the coming patch. We were told within the next few months. One of the complaints was there was no transfer of those lost FMs prior to removing them from the foundry missions, which quite frankly should not have been difficult to achieve,nor anticipate the backlash from, the decisions made before the previous patch.
As I stated about 30 posts back, "Sorry, not good enough." This isn't just about fleet marks anymore, but an issue that runs deeper. Fleet events are not fun. Hunting for rabbits on new romulus isn't fun. Spending hours a day grinding out marks and dilithium to advance a starbase that won't see completion for years down the road is not fun.
To sum, you are correct. If it isn't fun,then why bother? Why indeed. I, personally, am done. I see clearly now the road ahead. To my fellow gamers, I wish you luck. To Mr. Stahl and crew, believe it or not I wish you luck as well. To the suits at PWE who haven't a clue what this game is to the fans and players, b!te me.
As I stated 100s of threads before, additional Fleet Marks are coming.
Such disconnect with the playerbase. This has gone far beyond Fleet Marks in the Foundry. Of course if your team really were reading this thread you would know that.
We are not detailing that change until the patch notes hit.
And we may or may not send a ferry to help you out. You'll have to wait and see. :rolleyes:
How the Devs see Star Trek, apparently:
Star Trek: The Original Grind
Star Trek: The Next Grind
Star Trek: Deep Space Grind
Star Trek: Voyage to the Grind
Ummm... I believe "the pettiness" was well established in this thread long before I came along.
This just shows your sheer ignorance of the true heart of the matter. Some were petty. SOME. The vast majority here are sick and tired of the grind of this game, the lack of QA, and the forced playstyle. If you actually took the time to read AND understand, you will see this for yourself.
Anyway...Power to the People! Keep fighting The Good Fight!
As I stated 100s of threads before, additional Fleet Marks are coming.
Will Fleet Marks be added back to Foundry missions? Nope.
Will Fleet Marks be increased on other missions? Yes.
How soon?
As I hinted at last week, you will see changes over the next several month, but the first change will be this Thursday.
We are not detailing that change until the patch notes hit.
We have been told repeatedly that you, dStahl and others, have been reading this thread.
Clearly that particular cake was a lie.
One of the most repeated criticisms of the recent change was based on the apparent non-desire to listen to feedback.
The change was released to tribble, generated 75 pages odd of feedback, absolutely none of which was acted on when it was sent live to holodeck.
Virtually all of the problems were found by the tribble testers, the boff slot problem, the 2 minute cooldown, the clear damage the FM decision would do to small fleets.
Absolutely none of it listened to, let alone acted on.
As other posters have said, this has moved beyond the attack on small fleets with the removal of the IOR/FM wrapper.
All of this released before a 3 day weekend.
Do you really have such a tin ear?
The tone of your response is comtemptuous of us, the player base.
The continuing secrecy you seem so attached to is not the solution, it is the problem.
And nowhere, absolutely nowhere, in your reply is any sense of apology.
Even your loyal community moderators are telling you that the secrecy is not helpful.
While your post was, undeniably, a reply. It is not an answer, not even close.
Aside from the fact that it skips by all of the other concerns in this thread, it is at least a decent post and not a bunch of unsubstantiated points.
It however doesn't deal with the fundamental problems facing fleet holdings, namely the complete lack of anything resembling fun in the fleet mark acquisition process, and the absolute disdain shown from the highest levels at even the suggestion that small and medium sized fleets be viable when it comes to finishing a starbase sometime this decade.
As I hinted at last week, you will see changes over the next several month, but the first change will be this Thursday.
We are not detailing that change until the patch notes hit.
Wouldnt it be better to put these changes up on to a test server first and at least have a weeks worth of solid testing? Just in case the new addition of fleet marks might cause ships to explode in sector space whenever someone types in zone chat.
Too busy trying to get fleets to take time away from their grind to do the Harlem Shake.
At least he seemed to have learned from that ill-timed post.
How the Devs see Star Trek, apparently:
Star Trek: The Original Grind
Star Trek: The Next Grind
Star Trek: Deep Space Grind
Star Trek: Voyage to the Grind
How about just for the great stories some of the foundry authors make? You shouldn't need a reward incentive just to play a foundry mission.
Thank you for proving my point. Remove all rewards from the foundry, all of them, loot, experience, EC. The reward is the story. Thats all you should need. That is all the foundry authors should need.
As for me, my experience with a set group of them, has soured the whole thing for me. My choice is to not reward them by playing anything from it, I don't want to condone the use of the foundry, at all.
I find it amazing after 200 pages and 2200 posts that all he got out of it was we're mad about Fleet Marks.
Oh Dan, you really need to start looking at the big picture...
On top of that, we get another patch in 2 days that's not on the Tribble server being tested AT THIS MOMENT. Want to bet more things get broken??
Do not let this man placate you with false hope. None of our major concerns were addressed, and in actuality, were glossed over with this hope that MAYBE the 'changes' being made on Thursday will fix the game. The smart people know they will not.
Do not be a machine programmed to grind. Do not let them tell you how long you should play their game every day/week like they have been. You are people who log onto Star Trek Online to have fun, Not grinding machines to be told by Cryptic you need to grind an average amount of hours per night/day/week to make what they deem necessary to advance yourself and your fleet. Their content is bug ridden. Workarounds have to be discovered by their players. They do not fix their bugs.
Maybe you should all read back over the 200 pages in this thread, read the opening remarks made by D.Stahl and remember why we're here in the first place...
Its not just about Fleet Marks...
Its about what this game is supposed to represent...
Wouldnt it be better to put these changes up on to a test server first and at least have a weeks worth of solid testing? Just in case the new addition of fleet marks might cause ships to explode in sector space whenever someone types in zone chat.
As noted several times in great detail, one of the biggest issues, and the reason it's suggested that TPTB don't listen to feedback, is that these problems are usually reported in detail by players on Tribble, then pushed to Holodeck without any fixes. I really don't know why they bother with Tribble at this point.
My fed sci has been flying around without boffs since the last patch. Even if I wanted to play the boring FM events, I couldn't.
This just shows your sheer ignorance of the true heart of the matter. Some were petty. SOME. The vast majority here are sick and tired of the grind of this game, the lack of QA, and the forced playstyle. If you actually took the time to read AND understand, you will see this for yourself.
Anyway...Power to the People! Keep fighting The Good Fight!
I've read the whole thread actually...
Have been keeping up since it first opened.
I just don't see any reason to get so worked up over an Online Computer Game.
Things have changed drastically many times since this games inception (including the company who owns it), this is just another change that has come along that has many players in a snit cause it isn't something they like.
A month or two from now there will be another change that causes an uproar and this one will slide to a back burner.
I've been around long enough to know that what I can't change or control, means I have to adapt or go find something else to do.
A game, is not something that I let get the best of my emotions...
Especially when that's one of the driving forces behind companies attempting to get my money.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Next time you remove something without an immediate replacement, consider the following;
How would you feel if you turned up for work in the morning and got told "Today we're going to stop paying you, don't worry though in the next few months we'll start paying you again at an increased rate. We're not going to tell you what that rate is, or what you'll have to do to get it, but just trust me."
I think you'd tell them where to shove it, just as hundreds of your player base have done in this thread. Thursday marked the first time in 7 months I haven't logged into the game every day, I have no intention of returning until you make this right.
Stop looking at 'metrics', like that's what's important, and start listening to the people, who really are important.
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
Let's be honest, this is about far more then just the IOR. Tensions have been high since about halfway S6 when it became clear that bugs weren't getting fixed, requirements wouldn't be lowered etc. What we see here is what happens when you have a community that's on edge. The smallest additional affront just make thing's boil over. Or maybe a flash over would be a better analogy. This is just like when they took out the STF rewards. By this change they didn't just take away an easy source of fleetmarks, they effectively force us to get them elsewhere. In other words, we are being forced to do things we don't want to do and they take longer then the IOR did too. Our fun just got diminished, and because it takes longer we have less time for things we *do* enjoy. Look at the STF rewards, things stayed unruly untill the item drops where restored. Simply because getting an item, or having the chance to get one, is fun . I never understood why the reputation system had to replace the old system. Those unlucky few who didn't get their tech drops would have had the guarantee of being able to get them, and the rest of us could enjoy looking forward to the lootbag at the end. The dev's keep thinking all we care about is dilithium and fleetmarks, etc. but we don't. If they ever introduce new drop-only gear that can be collected by doing missions with an STF structure, I would play them all day long regardless of them rewarding marks of any kind or dilithium. There no longer are real achievements in this game, it's all about endurance and perseverence now. It isn't rewarding to play this game anymore. All the stuff is either buyable for zen/dilithium, or EC(which effectively is also buyable by zen or dilithium). Sure, you need some marks, running some elites will get you those quick enough. Or I guess grinding down eppohs if you need RM's.
This game as it stands now, has become a grindfest. Now, that in itself isn't that big of a deal. The problem is that a lot of us are not mmo fans or whatever, we are here because of Star Trek. That means that this game has incredible potential, with loyal fans. However, it also means they can't treat us like mmo fans who like to grind all day. Most of us love the IP to much to just walk away, so we will put up with it for a while....But sooner or later, we will reach a breaking point, where even the most loyal Star Trek fan refuses to put up with this any longer. That would mean the end of this game, because aside from the IP this game has nothing to offer. There are several mmo's out there, that from a gameplay perspective are far better developed, there are several that are more fun, etc.
Basicly they have the goose laying golden egg's here, only they keep pushing the goose for more egg's. Hell, they are close to taking a chokehold on the goose and shake it for more golden egg's. At the short term that might work, and the goose will lay some additional golden egg's, but then it will die. Keeping the goose happy and entertained might produce a few daily egg's less, but the goose will lay those egg's for years and years to come.
Stop trying to force the community to spend money, if you present us with enjoyable content, gameplay, bugfixes, fun items, etc. we will gladly give it to you!!!
^I'm bumping this so that perhaps it won't get lost in the shuffle. it quite nicely outlines many of the issues this thread is about beyond just fleet marks
I probably won't be popular for saying this, but I do want to say it since the thread it was posted in has now been closed. (This came from the closure post for the Harlem Shake thread.)
Mr. Stahl, I'm sorry to hear your daughter is sick. I mean that. I hope your job allows telecommuting so you can be there now as well as last night.
In regards to the Harlem Shake thing...I am indeed dismayed by the way the PR and communications have been handled, but there is no personal animus from me. In all seriousness, I truly hoped my post in the first few minutes after yours would get your attention and help you avoid this. I was trying to be gentle. And just the same in my second post, I was still trying to warn you off from something that I could only see hurting instead of helping. :-/
Perhaps you would consider letting Branflakes handle projects like that, since as I understand it, community games are part of his job description. It's "normal," for lack of better words, to have him in that sort of role. Granted I don't know his workload, but I'm sure he'd do a good job, if he has time.
I don't want this community to blow up when it is IMHO completely avoidable. It's both a game and a community for me--and indeed, this community has nearly replaced a sick one that I used to post in a lot more than I do now, because here I feel I can speak and play without constantly getting attacked by other posters. My fleet is that way for me too, and I wouldn't have met them without STO--the only MMO I've ever played (or probably ever will play).
What I am trying to say is this. I want STO to succeed. I want to see things fixed, and I want to see things thought through so that when changes are made, they are the right changes or at least are implemented in a way that helps, not hurts...because I do not want to lose what I've found here. You have the potential here. You have something that can be great. If/when things are fixed, and I am confident things will run more smoothly going forward...heck, I'd like to financially support the game again because even as an F2P player I realize that you have server bills and salaries to pay.
When I am angry or dismayed at what happens here, it's because I do not want to lose this game or its community. Help us to help you.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-) Proudly F2P.Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
Do not let this man placate you with false hope. None of our major concerns were addressed, and in actuality, were glossed over with this hope that MAYBE the 'changes' being made on Thursday with fix the game. The smart people know they will not.
Until he addresses his own statement and what is now my sig for this forum. I won't let him do anything of the sort, he's already proven himself untrustable.
Thank you for proving my point. Remove all rewards from the foundry, all of them, loot, experience, EC. The reward is the story. Thats all you should need. That is all the foundry authors should need.
If that were to happen, it would likely kill off the foundry completely. Some of the missions are fun, some are fantastically written, but it is the rewards that draws people in to play these things.
When there were no rewards, I never touched the foundry. There simply was no point whatsoever in wasting time with that as everything else had some kind of reward attached to them.
Besides, if the rewards were eliminated entirely not only would the foundry die off but we would have a group of brassed off foundry 'super' authors barging around, mouthing off about how butt-hurt they are. I don't know which is worse!
Sure the foundry in it's recent form was exploitable and flawed, but at least it existed AND had people playing it. If I were in charge of the foundry at cryptic, I would fix the bugs, make the odd adjustment to rewards and leave it at that.
As I stated 100s of threads before, additional Fleet Marks are coming.
Will Fleet Marks be added back to Foundry missions? Nope.
Will Fleet Marks be increased on other missions? Yes.
How soon?
As I hinted at last week, you will see changes over the next several month, but the first change will be this Thursday.
We are not detailing that change until the patch notes hit.
One thing has become clear with this reply of yours. You can not do your current job. We have no apology only a vague promise. Well your promises don't mean much anymore. We've all but bang your head with issues and ideas and you just ignore us and do what ever and the sheer arrogance in your last statement is insulting. Even a forum moderator has blasted you on your handling of this issue. So step down Stahl and fine something you can actual do for it is clear you can not do what your currently doing. I wish you the best of luck in any future endeavours....as long as it isn't with STO
I just don't see any reason to get so worked up over an Online Computer Game.
Things have changed drastically many times since this games inception (including the company who owns it), this is just another change that has come along that has many players in a snit cause it isn't something they like.
A month or two from now there will be another change that causes an uproar and this one will slide to a back burner.
I've been around long enough to know that what I can't change or control, means I have to adapt or go find something else to do.
A game, is not something that I let get the best of my emotions...
Especially when that's one of the driving forces behind companies attempting to get my money.
And this is partly why this game is in the current state. I have said this many times;
Far too many people too willing to accept and even pay for mediocrity and failing to hold developers accountible.
How the Devs see Star Trek, apparently:
Star Trek: The Original Grind
Star Trek: The Next Grind
Star Trek: Deep Space Grind
Star Trek: Voyage to the Grind
Comments
Well that depends on the community and whether they're willing to let Dan get away with a throwaway comment like that.
The EP of Star Trek Online has responded to over 2000 posts asking for more information on how and when the Fleet Marks are going to be restored with a 'I'm not telling you - you'll just have to wait'.
How you react to this is your own individual choice.
Me? I'll continue to post in this and others threads when I have something to say or in response to others and I'll continue to be happy in the knowledge that not a single penny of my money is going towards paying this man's salary.
*Edit* Oh! And congratulations everyone!! This in now the 7th most commented news post since the game was in beta in 2010
This is the reply we just received (as you may already know)
Margaret Thatcher (Former PM of the UK) pulled a rather similar stunt with the coal miners of South Wales iirc. Pulled out the rug from an iffy system without replacing.
Guess what? She is STILL reviled but pretty much the entire population of the UK.
Did He? I don't recall that. Then again, I don't recall finding out about the lack of IOR until it actually hit. Before you ask, yes I do read and digest patch notes.
^ THIS is a big problem. TRUST.
Ummm... I believe "the pettiness" was well established in this thread long before I came along.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Agreed, this wasn't well-planned or well-executed. I am actually not severely opposed to the removal of fleet marks from the Foundry. What I was very bothered by was the failure to shift those marks elsewhere simultaneously--to foresee the objections that were going to come up, and have a plan already in place to deal with them.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-)
Proudly F2P. Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The thing is,no where did you mention anything about the coming patch. We were told within the next few months. One of the complaints was there was no transfer of those lost FMs prior to removing them from the foundry missions, which quite frankly should not have been difficult to achieve,nor anticipate the backlash from, the decisions made before the previous patch.
As I stated about 30 posts back, "Sorry, not good enough." This isn't just about fleet marks anymore, but an issue that runs deeper. Fleet events are not fun. Hunting for rabbits on new romulus isn't fun. Spending hours a day grinding out marks and dilithium to advance a starbase that won't see completion for years down the road is not fun.
To sum, you are correct. If it isn't fun,then why bother? Why indeed. I, personally, am done. I see clearly now the road ahead. To my fellow gamers, I wish you luck. To Mr. Stahl and crew, believe it or not I wish you luck as well. To the suits at PWE who haven't a clue what this game is to the fans and players, b!te me.
Such disconnect with the playerbase. This has gone far beyond Fleet Marks in the Foundry. Of course if your team really were reading this thread you would know that.
In escense you've torn down the old bridge before erecting the new one, stranding the motorists on either side
And we may or may not send a ferry to help you out. You'll have to wait and see. :rolleyes:
Star Trek: The Original Grind
Star Trek: The Next Grind
Star Trek: Deep Space Grind
Star Trek: Voyage to the Grind
This just shows your sheer ignorance of the true heart of the matter. Some were petty. SOME. The vast majority here are sick and tired of the grind of this game, the lack of QA, and the forced playstyle. If you actually took the time to read AND understand, you will see this for yourself.
Anyway...Power to the People! Keep fighting The Good Fight!
God, why didn't he repost that *here*...
Aside from the fact that it skips by all of the other concerns in this thread, it is at least a decent post and not a bunch of unsubstantiated points.
Apparently some forum posters have diplomatic immunity nowadays, where can I get mine? [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I just asked the same question there.
We have been told repeatedly that you, dStahl and others, have been reading this thread.
Clearly that particular cake was a lie.
One of the most repeated criticisms of the recent change was based on the apparent non-desire to listen to feedback.
The change was released to tribble, generated 75 pages odd of feedback, absolutely none of which was acted on when it was sent live to holodeck.
Virtually all of the problems were found by the tribble testers, the boff slot problem, the 2 minute cooldown, the clear damage the FM decision would do to small fleets.
Absolutely none of it listened to, let alone acted on.
As other posters have said, this has moved beyond the attack on small fleets with the removal of the IOR/FM wrapper.
All of this released before a 3 day weekend.
Do you really have such a tin ear?
The tone of your response is comtemptuous of us, the player base.
The continuing secrecy you seem so attached to is not the solution, it is the problem.
And nowhere, absolutely nowhere, in your reply is any sense of apology.
Even your loyal community moderators are telling you that the secrecy is not helpful.
While your post was, undeniably, a reply. It is not an answer, not even close.
I am truely disgusted with this response.
Posters on this thread have spent hundreds of hours trying to express their concerns and ideas.
We all deserve better treatment.
Dan, if you can't be bothered, can you ask someone else please?
Shocking.
It however doesn't deal with the fundamental problems facing fleet holdings, namely the complete lack of anything resembling fun in the fleet mark acquisition process, and the absolute disdain shown from the highest levels at even the suggestion that small and medium sized fleets be viable when it comes to finishing a starbase sometime this decade.
Wouldnt it be better to put these changes up on to a test server first and at least have a weeks worth of solid testing? Just in case the new addition of fleet marks might cause ships to explode in sector space whenever someone types in zone chat.
Too busy trying to get fleets to take time away from their grind to do the Harlem Shake.
At least he seemed to have learned from that ill-timed post.
Star Trek: The Original Grind
Star Trek: The Next Grind
Star Trek: Deep Space Grind
Star Trek: Voyage to the Grind
As for me, my experience with a set group of them, has soured the whole thing for me. My choice is to not reward them by playing anything from it, I don't want to condone the use of the foundry, at all.
Oh Dan, you really need to start looking at the big picture...
On top of that, we get another patch in 2 days that's not on the Tribble server being tested AT THIS MOMENT. Want to bet more things get broken??
Do not let this man placate you with false hope. None of our major concerns were addressed, and in actuality, were glossed over with this hope that MAYBE the 'changes' being made on Thursday will fix the game. The smart people know they will not.
Do not be a machine programmed to grind. Do not let them tell you how long you should play their game every day/week like they have been. You are people who log onto Star Trek Online to have fun, Not grinding machines to be told by Cryptic you need to grind an average amount of hours per night/day/week to make what they deem necessary to advance yourself and your fleet. Their content is bug ridden. Workarounds have to be discovered by their players. They do not fix their bugs.
Maybe you should all read back over the 200 pages in this thread, read the opening remarks made by D.Stahl and remember why we're here in the first place...
Its not just about Fleet Marks...
Its about what this game is supposed to represent...
As noted several times in great detail, one of the biggest issues, and the reason it's suggested that TPTB don't listen to feedback, is that these problems are usually reported in detail by players on Tribble, then pushed to Holodeck without any fixes. I really don't know why they bother with Tribble at this point.
My fed sci has been flying around without boffs since the last patch. Even if I wanted to play the boring FM events, I couldn't.
I've read the whole thread actually...
Have been keeping up since it first opened.
I just don't see any reason to get so worked up over an Online Computer Game.
Things have changed drastically many times since this games inception (including the company who owns it), this is just another change that has come along that has many players in a snit cause it isn't something they like.
A month or two from now there will be another change that causes an uproar and this one will slide to a back burner.
I've been around long enough to know that what I can't change or control, means I have to adapt or go find something else to do.
A game, is not something that I let get the best of my emotions...
Especially when that's one of the driving forces behind companies attempting to get my money.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
How would you feel if you turned up for work in the morning and got told "Today we're going to stop paying you, don't worry though in the next few months we'll start paying you again at an increased rate. We're not going to tell you what that rate is, or what you'll have to do to get it, but just trust me."
I think you'd tell them where to shove it, just as hundreds of your player base have done in this thread. Thursday marked the first time in 7 months I haven't logged into the game every day, I have no intention of returning until you make this right.
Stop looking at 'metrics', like that's what's important, and start listening to the people, who really are important.
^I'm bumping this so that perhaps it won't get lost in the shuffle. it quite nicely outlines many of the issues this thread is about beyond just fleet marks
lol, wheneveryou guys dothat, its NEVER a positive change.
thankthe goddess guildwars 2 re-enchanted me this weekend. Their patchnotes don't make me ill.
Quoted, screen-grabbed and photo-bucketed for reference after Thursday.
I will now adopt a wait and see position... but what has happened I expect there to be a serious improvement.
Both in the QUALITY of the code that is released live... and an equal change to the QUALITY of the "grind experience."
Because really, Dan. No one wants to grind rabbits in the slums. You said so your self.
Mr. Stahl, I'm sorry to hear your daughter is sick. I mean that. I hope your job allows telecommuting so you can be there now as well as last night.
In regards to the Harlem Shake thing...I am indeed dismayed by the way the PR and communications have been handled, but there is no personal animus from me. In all seriousness, I truly hoped my post in the first few minutes after yours would get your attention and help you avoid this. I was trying to be gentle. And just the same in my second post, I was still trying to warn you off from something that I could only see hurting instead of helping. :-/
Perhaps you would consider letting Branflakes handle projects like that, since as I understand it, community games are part of his job description. It's "normal," for lack of better words, to have him in that sort of role. Granted I don't know his workload, but I'm sure he'd do a good job, if he has time.
I don't want this community to blow up when it is IMHO completely avoidable. It's both a game and a community for me--and indeed, this community has nearly replaced a sick one that I used to post in a lot more than I do now, because here I feel I can speak and play without constantly getting attacked by other posters. My fleet is that way for me too, and I wouldn't have met them without STO--the only MMO I've ever played (or probably ever will play).
What I am trying to say is this. I want STO to succeed. I want to see things fixed, and I want to see things thought through so that when changes are made, they are the right changes or at least are implemented in a way that helps, not hurts...because I do not want to lose what I've found here. You have the potential here. You have something that can be great. If/when things are fixed, and I am confident things will run more smoothly going forward...heck, I'd like to financially support the game again because even as an F2P player I realize that you have server bills and salaries to pay.
When I am angry or dismayed at what happens here, it's because I do not want to lose this game or its community. Help us to help you.
Christian Gaming Community Fleets--Faith, Fun, and Fellowship! See the website and PM for more. :-)
Proudly F2P. Signature image by gulberat. Avatar image by balsavor.deviantart.com.
Forrest for the tree. All they see is the tree on fire, not the rest of the Forrest, ablaze.
If that were to happen, it would likely kill off the foundry completely. Some of the missions are fun, some are fantastically written, but it is the rewards that draws people in to play these things.
When there were no rewards, I never touched the foundry. There simply was no point whatsoever in wasting time with that as everything else had some kind of reward attached to them.
Besides, if the rewards were eliminated entirely not only would the foundry die off but we would have a group of brassed off foundry 'super' authors barging around, mouthing off about how butt-hurt they are. I don't know which is worse!
Sure the foundry in it's recent form was exploitable and flawed, but at least it existed AND had people playing it. If I were in charge of the foundry at cryptic, I would fix the bugs, make the odd adjustment to rewards and leave it at that.
One thing has become clear with this reply of yours. You can not do your current job. We have no apology only a vague promise. Well your promises don't mean much anymore. We've all but bang your head with issues and ideas and you just ignore us and do what ever and the sheer arrogance in your last statement is insulting. Even a forum moderator has blasted you on your handling of this issue. So step down Stahl and fine something you can actual do for it is clear you can not do what your currently doing. I wish you the best of luck in any future endeavours....as long as it isn't with STO
And this is partly why this game is in the current state. I have said this many times;
Far too many people too willing to accept and even pay for mediocrity and failing to hold developers accountible.
Star Trek: The Original Grind
Star Trek: The Next Grind
Star Trek: Deep Space Grind
Star Trek: Voyage to the Grind