Well, I'm not as upset about this as I thought I'd be. I'll still play foundry because I mainly play it when I'm bored of doing everything else, and not for rewards. (which are still nice I guess... :P)
I can see how this will hurt small fleets though, which sucks.
This is a very good idea - many folks have capped their Rep Tiers in these areas.
By adding this ability and increasing the current FM rewards given in Fleet Events (plus adding FM rewards to the Fleet missions that don't currently have them) would be a great optional/alternate way to make up for the FM loss of the IOR wrapper.
Heck, I'll go one further:
Allow 1:1 conversion to FMs all the time.
Add a daily to allow 70 RMs and 70 OMs combined into 200 FM, to encourage playing diverse aspects of the game.
I'd also like, longterm, to see an option to queue multiplayer mission replay for FMs. That would effectively require identifying and tagging individual missions that are team appropriate for the queue system.
Add a Foundry option to create multiplayer Foundry missions. These might have extra requirements/limitations on the Foundry author such as enhanced enemies and minimum combat quotas. Maybe dialogue tree length limitations.
As these get spotlighted, make them queueable and award Fleet Marks.
Thing about what leviathan suggested about omega/rom marks to convert to fm, if they did do that you better put down some money that theyll lower the earnings where those are gotten :P.
You know what would be nice? The ability to convert Romulan/Omega marks into Fleet Marks. I'd be happy with that.
This is a good idea, it should be available at all times IMO.
Also it would be nice if we could use GPL to buy 'Fleet Mark boxes' or 'Fleet Mark bonus' boxes since all we have now is the Holo-TRIBBLE nobody wants anyways....then I could have a reason to geek out on Dabo.
Add a Foundry option to create multiplayer Foundry missions. These might have extra requirements/limitations on the Foundry author such as enhanced enemies and minimum combat quotas. Maybe dialogue tree length limitations.
As these get spotlighted, make them queueable and award Fleet Marks.
User-generated Fleet Missions would be a logical extension of the Foundry. The category just doesn't exist yet. Having its own Spotlight makes sense.
(/\) Exploring Star Trek Online Since July 2008 (/\)
Well so much for the 5 members of my fleet getting together and running a mission, BRR was fun in a 5 man group, Dreads were fun!. Key word, Were. Well its going to slow us down again, but thats fine, we're at T3 so we're ok. Get the Embassy to T2 and call that done too.
All cryptic is doing is giving me, less reasons to play more parts of the game. Now, its doffs, the occasional STF, Colony invasion for the grins, and that, is all. I've already got one T5 rep, and almost done on the other so I've got less to do by the day. Since they don't want to give me a reason to play the foundry, I won't. I'm not interested in your stories, how much work you put into them, or whatever, I'm interested in getting something I need from it. Since it no longer has what I need, i have no need for it. I get my Dilithium, and EC from Doffs, its all I need to get them. I need Fleet marks, So, I played BRR or whatever struck me at the moment.
I'll be interested to see how the sliding scale rewards work, but losing the Fleet Marks entirely will be a big loss to me. IOR basically bankrolled my starbase (since I'm basically building it single handed at this point). Now I guess once I finally get to the tier I'm working on I will have to stop, because otherwise it's going to take the best part of the rest of the year to get up to the next one. The FM missions give such a low reward that it's almost not worth putting in the effort, especially compared to IOR.
I would seriously hope that the FMs being taken away will either be put into increasing rewards that already exist in other parts of the game, or will be added to other areas.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
This character is why I don't play my Romulan any more. Tovan Khev is NOT my BFF! Get him off my bridge!
- KDF Ambassador Syon vocalizing her objection to the discussions of possible peace talks with the UFP due to recent Borg and Undine activities.Hegh'bat, Stardate 66588.8
It's weird that you can earn a lot of FM's by soloing foundry missions. I agree with cryptic removing them. BUT, the amount of FM's you earn with fleet events is way to low. You should earn fleet marks by doing large events, but getting ~20 fm's for 30-45 minutes of playing is way to low. First fix all the fleet missions so they give a proper amount of marks and then remove it from the foundry missions.
Honestly, there are more people playing the foundry for fleet marks rather than Dil. taking the fleet marks out of the foundry is going to be like shooting your self in the foot here Cryptic, if you want to scale the amount back a litte fine, but honesly i can que fleet events for an hr and make maybe 75 marks.. this is a bad move and it hurts the progress of the projects for smaller fleets... I mean damn just when you guys get on a roll of making people happy you have to go and TRIBBLE us off again... oh and while im at it REMOVE THE LOCK BOXES... some of us are to space poor to be opening boxes all the time in the hopes you might be one of the lucky few to get a ship
Thanks to the grinders we now have all lost the daily FM's. Thanks. I knew that they would TRIBBLE it for the rest of us.
drkfrontiers said;
"Thanks to the grinders we now have all lost the daily FM's. Thanks. I knew that they would TRIBBLE it for the rest of us."
Fleet/Reps progression IS grinding.
Not to mention the severe lack of worthwhile sources for Fleet Marks guarantees some content gets more attention than others.
The WORST decision by Cryptic (casting the Season 7 STF fun-killing in it's shadow) in STO and it's only month 2 into 2013...
NO to ARC RIP KDF and PvP 2014-07-17 Season 9.5 - Death by Dev
I really have a hard time understanding how Cryptic can be this terrible at community interaction.
Now, I can completely understand why they want to remove this. It was too abusive and went against the original purpose of the foundry.
BUT!
They have to realize they'll have to buff other means of obtaining FMs in the same vein. And I think they plan on doing that. But that they don't wait until that part is worked out and they can nerf and compensate AT THE SAME TIME, is what baffles me. They do this over and over again and never learn. It makes me wonder if there are really human beings on the other end or just robots. Reminds me of a scene in Simpsons were Homer touches a hot stove plate over and over again, screaming each time. He just can't stop burning himself.
They don't even earn money with FMs, there is no way slowing those down increases their revenue in any shape or form. It just does not make sense unless you are the Cryptic staff in charge I guess.
Problem: People aren't playing fleet events because the foundry is more rewarding.
Solution A: Increase the rewards for the fleet events to make them competitive again.
Solution B: Whack the foundry with the nerf-bat.
One of the above solutions would please the players. The other would not. Which solution do we get?...
There is nothing wrong with the Fleet Events with rewards, especially if you get up to Wave 10 in No Win Scenario which yields well over 200 Fleet Marks for doing 30 minutes of work (providing you are a skilled team).
And there are some who farm it doing the Fleet Mark Bonus events and literally get over 1000 Fleet Marks this way. So a fleet of these teams can bring in 5000 fleet marks per day (1000 per teammate).
Though personally, given the nerfs to Nukara and the Foundry, I wouldn't be surprised this gets "adjusted" as well. :P
There is nothing wrong with the Fleet Events with rewards, especially if you get up to Wave 10 in No Win Scenario which yields well over 200 Fleet Marks for doing 30 minutes of work (providing you are a skilled team).
Eh yeah, that is one fleet event that 99% of the players will never see that far. The rest who are stuck to pugs or casual fleeties get awesome stuff like 20 minutes for 17 marks base defense (even fails a ton in pugs) or 20 marks for 15 minutes of transporter babysitting. Only event at least FUN is Incursion IMO, but even that only leads you mid-thirty marks in a good group and is then on cooldown so you can get back to the TRIBBLE events.
I don't mind the removal of FM from the foundry Daily if and only if Cryptic reduces the requirement or removes fleet marks entirely from the starbase projects or the game itself.
If
They are to remove the Fleet Marks reward from the Daily, then they need to:
A) Beef up the Fleet Mark rewards from the Fleet Events to about 50 to 100 FM's per event
Include FM rewards for episode missions completion + events.
As of right now, the only event worth playing for FM, besides the obvious Foundry Daily, are the Ground starbase incursion missions.
Simply the space one gives you next to nothing - but the ground gives you a measely 24 to 25 FM <--- That is waaaaay too low of a FM rewards for the time that it takes to complete those ground fleet events.
Fleet Marks Fleet event need a serious boost, and the starbase projects that require FM, need a serious reduction in FM requirement.
The game is becoming too spread out with Embassy Holdings, starbase holdings, and now the personal Reputation system (Though the Rep system requires no FM - it is a resource sink.)
\The only good thing about this thread is you saved me and my friends $199 each on the Neverwinter founders pack.
I'm not grinding out anything in this. I got a life.
You have experienced first hand how Cryptic handles its games, how it has a "let wither" and die approach. Its not as evident in STO as it is in CO. And yet, you were really considering playing, much less investing heavily into their next release?? I don't go as far as telling my friends not to get invested in Cryptic games, but I do tell them that I'm a LTS holder for both CO and STO and I let them know how well those two games have evolved....
And what's wrong with Cryptic saying, "The Foundry is for fanfic"?
There's nothing "wrong".
Its just that Foundry missions made specifically for the repeatable mission wrapper was THE least painful way to get fleetmarks. In other words, they gave players a break, and now are taking it away. Naturally instead of fixing the real issue (fleet mark events are incredibly painful, boring, repetitive and mind numbingly stale) they instead nerf the one way to get FMs that does not make people want to step away from the computer!
Notice they aren't limiting FM rewards to once per day, they are cutting it out completely. I can only assume they know if they limited to once per day players would just adjust and live with getting it that one time. Instead they hope...what? That players will flood the fleet mark events? Lol!!
While I can understand Cryptic's reasoning with us earning FM to fast, I have to wonder why they felt that removing the FM completely was a good idea.
I mean, they had to know that this would make the players go to "RED ALERT" mode. It's never a good idea to make sweeping changes like this without even mentioning it in some form. And no, a post by a dev in the Foundry forums does not really count imo. This should have been under the news heading in the fourms with a good explanation of why they are going to do said changes.
Comming from Star Wars: Galaxies, I am used to strange updates being made that makes little to no sense. The *cries in a corner* NGE comes to mind yet again. You must never make changes like the devs of SWG did without proper long term testing and communication with the player base.
So, yeah, please explain why you felt this was a "good" idea Cryptic, and how you plan to replace the FM we are loosing. As others have pointed out earlier, the current fleet missions gives a pittance of FM to the total time taken.
lol at all the whiners. Both my Fed and KDF fleets are some of the furthest along in starbase construction and fleet events got us there a whole lot more then officer reports did. Now you actually have to do stuff together as a fleet to get FM, what a concept.
The 20 man is really fun to do as a Fleet, try it sometime.
If dil farming is any harder due to scaling rewards it isn't a problem either as most should be done with rep system and can turn in all the marks and BNP for dil, making it easy to cap after a few STF.
When "Fleet Week" happened and they added Fleet marks to the foundry it was temporary, then they added them back after the event, saying As of now Fleet marks were staying, they never said it would stay forever. it was eventful that they were going to be removed.
Now you have to work with your fleet mates now and earn your marks, instead of soloing it.
lol at all the whiners. Both my Fed and KDF fleets are some of the furthest along in starbase construction and fleet events got us there a whole lot more then officer reports did. Now you actually have to do stuff together as a fleet to get FM, what a concept.
The 20 man is really fun to do as a Fleet, try it sometime.
If dil farming is any harder due to scaling rewards it isn't a problem either as most should be done with rep system and can turn in all the marks and BNP for dil, making it easy to cap after a few STF.
Playing together as a fleet? Heretic :-P
It is much easyier to whine on the forums than to be a decent human being :-P
Comments
I can see how this will hurt small fleets though, which sucks.
Heck, I'll go one further:
Allow 1:1 conversion to FMs all the time.
Add a daily to allow 70 RMs and 70 OMs combined into 200 FM, to encourage playing diverse aspects of the game.
I'd also like, longterm, to see an option to queue multiplayer mission replay for FMs. That would effectively require identifying and tagging individual missions that are team appropriate for the queue system.
Add a Foundry option to create multiplayer Foundry missions. These might have extra requirements/limitations on the Foundry author such as enhanced enemies and minimum combat quotas. Maybe dialogue tree length limitations.
As these get spotlighted, make them queueable and award Fleet Marks.
Good idea though
This is a good idea, it should be available at all times IMO.
Also it would be nice if we could use GPL to buy 'Fleet Mark boxes' or 'Fleet Mark bonus' boxes since all we have now is the Holo-TRIBBLE nobody wants anyways....then I could have a reason to geek out on Dabo.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The o3 - Killed you good
All cryptic is doing is giving me, less reasons to play more parts of the game. Now, its doffs, the occasional STF, Colony invasion for the grins, and that, is all. I've already got one T5 rep, and almost done on the other so I've got less to do by the day. Since they don't want to give me a reason to play the foundry, I won't. I'm not interested in your stories, how much work you put into them, or whatever, I'm interested in getting something I need from it. Since it no longer has what I need, i have no need for it. I get my Dilithium, and EC from Doffs, its all I need to get them. I need Fleet marks, So, I played BRR or whatever struck me at the moment.
Guess I'll start staggering out CXP turn ins
We may never know.
I would seriously hope that the FMs being taken away will either be put into increasing rewards that already exist in other parts of the game, or will be added to other areas.
This character is why I don't play my Romulan any more. Tovan Khev is NOT my BFF! Get him off my bridge!
R.I.P. small fleets and klink fleets trying desperately for that Tier 5 starbase.
Here's a thought. Keep the rewards as is and make a tier 6 base :O
With the reward system as it is, if I could live long enough, I could have a REAL starship before my fleet hit that goal.
Thanks cryptic for making my mind up for me.
No point in trying to level up my fleet starbase.
No point in logging in.
No point in spending any more of my money here.
There is no honor in staying.
Time for the Hegh'bat.
- KDF Ambassador Syon vocalizing her objection to the discussions of possible peace talks with the UFP due to recent Borg and Undine activities. Hegh'bat, Stardate 66588.8
drkfrontiers said;
"Thanks to the grinders we now have all lost the daily FM's. Thanks. I knew that they would TRIBBLE it for the rest of us."
Fleet/Reps progression IS grinding.
Not to mention the severe lack of worthwhile sources for Fleet Marks guarantees some content gets more attention than others.
The WORST decision by Cryptic (casting the Season 7 STF fun-killing in it's shadow) in STO and it's only month 2 into 2013...
RIP KDF and PvP 2014-07-17 Season 9.5 - Death by Dev
Now, I can completely understand why they want to remove this. It was too abusive and went against the original purpose of the foundry.
BUT!
They have to realize they'll have to buff other means of obtaining FMs in the same vein. And I think they plan on doing that. But that they don't wait until that part is worked out and they can nerf and compensate AT THE SAME TIME, is what baffles me. They do this over and over again and never learn. It makes me wonder if there are really human beings on the other end or just robots. Reminds me of a scene in Simpsons were Homer touches a hot stove plate over and over again, screaming each time. He just can't stop burning himself.
They don't even earn money with FMs, there is no way slowing those down increases their revenue in any shape or form. It just does not make sense unless you are the Cryptic staff in charge I guess.
Solution A: Increase the rewards for the fleet events to make them competitive again.
Solution B: Whack the foundry with the nerf-bat.
One of the above solutions would please the players. The other would not. Which solution do we get?...
There is nothing wrong with the Fleet Events with rewards, especially if you get up to Wave 10 in No Win Scenario which yields well over 200 Fleet Marks for doing 30 minutes of work (providing you are a skilled team).
And there are some who farm it doing the Fleet Mark Bonus events and literally get over 1000 Fleet Marks this way. So a fleet of these teams can bring in 5000 fleet marks per day (1000 per teammate).
Though personally, given the nerfs to Nukara and the Foundry, I wouldn't be surprised this gets "adjusted" as well. :P
Eh yeah, that is one fleet event that 99% of the players will never see that far. The rest who are stuck to pugs or casual fleeties get awesome stuff like 20 minutes for 17 marks base defense (even fails a ton in pugs) or 20 marks for 15 minutes of transporter babysitting. Only event at least FUN is Incursion IMO, but even that only leads you mid-thirty marks in a good group and is then on cooldown so you can get back to the TRIBBLE events.
Things need to change.
If
They are to remove the Fleet Marks reward from the Daily, then they need to:
A) Beef up the Fleet Mark rewards from the Fleet Events to about 50 to 100 FM's per event
As of right now, the only event worth playing for FM, besides the obvious Foundry Daily, are the Ground starbase incursion missions.
Simply the space one gives you next to nothing - but the ground gives you a measely 24 to 25 FM <--- That is waaaaay too low of a FM rewards for the time that it takes to complete those ground fleet events.
Fleet Marks Fleet event need a serious boost, and the starbase projects that require FM, need a serious reduction in FM requirement.
The game is becoming too spread out with Embassy Holdings, starbase holdings, and now the personal Reputation system (Though the Rep system requires no FM - it is a resource sink.)
You have experienced first hand how Cryptic handles its games, how it has a "let wither" and die approach. Its not as evident in STO as it is in CO. And yet, you were really considering playing, much less investing heavily into their next release?? I don't go as far as telling my friends not to get invested in Cryptic games, but I do tell them that I'm a LTS holder for both CO and STO and I let them know how well those two games have evolved....
There's nothing "wrong".
Its just that Foundry missions made specifically for the repeatable mission wrapper was THE least painful way to get fleetmarks. In other words, they gave players a break, and now are taking it away. Naturally instead of fixing the real issue (fleet mark events are incredibly painful, boring, repetitive and mind numbingly stale) they instead nerf the one way to get FMs that does not make people want to step away from the computer!
Notice they aren't limiting FM rewards to once per day, they are cutting it out completely. I can only assume they know if they limited to once per day players would just adjust and live with getting it that one time. Instead they hope...what? That players will flood the fleet mark events? Lol!!
Don't they already have exp boosters etc...?
I mean, they had to know that this would make the players go to "RED ALERT" mode. It's never a good idea to make sweeping changes like this without even mentioning it in some form. And no, a post by a dev in the Foundry forums does not really count imo. This should have been under the news heading in the fourms with a good explanation of why they are going to do said changes.
Comming from Star Wars: Galaxies, I am used to strange updates being made that makes little to no sense. The *cries in a corner* NGE comes to mind yet again. You must never make changes like the devs of SWG did without proper long term testing and communication with the player base.
So, yeah, please explain why you felt this was a "good" idea Cryptic, and how you plan to replace the FM we are loosing. As others have pointed out earlier, the current fleet missions gives a pittance of FM to the total time taken.
The 20 man is really fun to do as a Fleet, try it sometime.
If dil farming is any harder due to scaling rewards it isn't a problem either as most should be done with rep system and can turn in all the marks and BNP for dil, making it easy to cap after a few STF.
Now you have to work with your fleet mates now and earn your marks, instead of soloing it.
I've heard of players trying to pawn off their fleet marks to fleets that need them. Must be a lucrative business then.
Playing together as a fleet? Heretic :-P
It is much easyier to whine on the forums than to be a decent human being :-P