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A Reminder on How to Have a Discussion
ambassadorkael
Member, Administrator Posts: 2,679 Community Manager
Hey folks, Kael here. I wanted to chat with everyone, especially as we continue to move into this new era of Trek content, and remind you all that everyone on this forum is a human being that you are interacting with. We've had a lot of passionate discussions over the past few years, and a lot of moderator actions and warnings having to be handed out that shouldn't have been necessary. So let's talk a little bit about how we should all be behaving on this forum (and online in general, really.).
When you're in a conversation online, it is very easy to forget the humanity of the participants. The other person is just an image and a made up name, so it's very easy to boil them down into just the things you don't like. (This is also true of folks you can't interact with normally, like the creatives of Star Trek or the developers of Star Trek Online.) The best approach is to imagine your conversation happening in the real world. Read what you've just typed, out loud, to yourself or to a friend if you need. Imagine yourself in the other person's shoes. If you find that the statement has made you mad, or upset, it's probably best to rephrase.
"I feel" statements are really important, here. We have a tendency, especially in our wonderful nerd community, to jump to all or nothing, blanket statements that, while they may describe how we feel, don't contribute anything to an actual discussion except get an emotional response out of other users. For example: "[Star Trek Show] is hot trash," is a declarative, universal statement that does nothing but inspire anger in folks who DO like that show. "I don't like, [Star Trek Show] because [reasons]," is a discussion, and one that can be had, civilly.
I'm a firm believer in the "remove the problem," method of Community Management. As we move forward, folks who can't contribute civilly will be asked to not contribute at all. Whether this means warnings or bans will depend on the situation, but there is a lovely community here on the forums, and I'm sure you are as sick as I am of having it drowned out in wars over things that are, ultimately, insignificant.
Cryptic Studios, the STO development team, and the creatives behind Star Trek have and will do things that make you upset. As fans, we dedicate a lot of our lives to these properties and games, and it's reasonable to feel upset, disappointed, or even angry when something happens that you don't agree with. I'm not saying that any criticism is frowned upon. To repeat that in bold: I'm not saying any negativity will be frowned upon. But we have to be able to critique constructively, using statements that explain how we feel, instead of responding in a way that will only make others upset. I know you all can do it.
Thanks!
When you're in a conversation online, it is very easy to forget the humanity of the participants. The other person is just an image and a made up name, so it's very easy to boil them down into just the things you don't like. (This is also true of folks you can't interact with normally, like the creatives of Star Trek or the developers of Star Trek Online.) The best approach is to imagine your conversation happening in the real world. Read what you've just typed, out loud, to yourself or to a friend if you need. Imagine yourself in the other person's shoes. If you find that the statement has made you mad, or upset, it's probably best to rephrase.
"I feel" statements are really important, here. We have a tendency, especially in our wonderful nerd community, to jump to all or nothing, blanket statements that, while they may describe how we feel, don't contribute anything to an actual discussion except get an emotional response out of other users. For example: "[Star Trek Show] is hot trash," is a declarative, universal statement that does nothing but inspire anger in folks who DO like that show. "I don't like, [Star Trek Show] because [reasons]," is a discussion, and one that can be had, civilly.
I'm a firm believer in the "remove the problem," method of Community Management. As we move forward, folks who can't contribute civilly will be asked to not contribute at all. Whether this means warnings or bans will depend on the situation, but there is a lovely community here on the forums, and I'm sure you are as sick as I am of having it drowned out in wars over things that are, ultimately, insignificant.
Cryptic Studios, the STO development team, and the creatives behind Star Trek have and will do things that make you upset. As fans, we dedicate a lot of our lives to these properties and games, and it's reasonable to feel upset, disappointed, or even angry when something happens that you don't agree with. I'm not saying that any criticism is frowned upon. To repeat that in bold: I'm not saying any negativity will be frowned upon. But we have to be able to critique constructively, using statements that explain how we feel, instead of responding in a way that will only make others upset. I know you all can do it.
Thanks!
Post edited by ambassadorkael#6946 on
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Comments
However, I will point out that communications on this official forum are nearly always behind that of Twitter, Reddit and even Facebook. This forum should be the first port of call for any and all posts. Not all of us want to be checking 3 other platforms for our information because Twitter and Reddit are especially superflouous to requirements for us, given the lack of control of their own anti-troll and unaccountibility methods. What maybe 'easier' for one, isn't for others.
I will continue to try and get better about monitoring these forums and answering your questions. You're right, I could be better about that. Part of that, if I'm honest, is that it's hard to get up the will to even open threads with titles like, "WHAT THE HELL, CRYPTIC?"
But - and this is very important. You can be upset and call me out about not communicating enough. Just do so constructively is all I'm asking. The rage posts serve no greater purpose.
So let's talk about that "new rule," which was actually me clarifying an old rule. There are some folks that seem to think I crossed the line by saying out right that wishing a dev would be fired is against the rules. I've heard a lot of talk about censorship and a lot more about how I must be thin skinned and self absorbed because that no rule is entirely about me.
That rule was actually inspired by the person on Reddit who said one of my coworkers should be fired, in the same post where they implied said developer should be shot out an airlock. And saying, "this person should be fired," shows a complete lack of what I was trying to talk about in the OP of this thread - understanding that the people you're talking about are human beings. "I wish this person would lose their job," also means, "I wish this person would suddenly have to struggle to pay rent and bills. I wish this person would lose the ability to take care of their family. I wish this person would have to perhaps move and leave the things they love behind." Now, some people will read what I just wrote and say, "Yes, we should be able to say that, because we were disappointed in a decision that was made about a Star Trek video game."
The culture of "the customer is always right," has lead to a lot of people who believe that what they want is more important than another person's humanity. You see it every day as people berate staff members at restaurants and stores over things that are, ultimately, trivial. You see it happen on these forums, and on Twitter, and on Reddit, and elsewhere every single day. And it *is* my job to go through all of that, and come up with actionable feedback for the team. But the thing about that is - most of the time, I already know what ya'll are going to say.
I've been at this for five years now. It isn't a sudden surprise to me that folks are upset when a blog has a mistake, that they want me to be fired, that some of them would prefer I stop breathing. (Again, over a Star Trek video game.) I've put procedures in place to help with the issues, and they have gotten less and less over time. But I don't need to read 500 comments about how much people hate my guts when I make a mistake. I don't need to read 1000 comments about our pricing model to know some folks are unhappy with things like Mudd's. That's information I already have, and can pass on with a glance.
When you say, "be a part of this community," I would love to. I would love to chat with folks about STO and Star Trek, to listen to constructive feedback, to meet the people who play our game. That's actually the point of this thread. Because, you see, it isn't part of anyone's job to just stand there and be abused. It's not. I don't get paid for that, it's not a part of my job description, and I certainly have never had my boss sit me down in a review and say, "You need to be insulted more."
Again, constructive conversation is not being 100% positivity. Constructive conversation is taking the moment to understand that the other person in a conversation is also a human being. It's very easy on the internet to reduce someone down to a caricature. What I'm asking is that people take a moment to think about how they would feel if they were confronted by the same tone and language. And if it seems like it would anger you, if it seems like it only exists to provoke an emotional response, please don't post it.
Stuff like that should be announced at least a week in advance, especially if there's a sale that only lasts so long tied to it, and doubly especially if it's close to a major holiday - you might want to let whoever is in charge of things like that know that.
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
> Well, here's some constructive criticism - dropping a new Mudd's bundle with barely any warning is not a good way to get sales...people need to budget around things that extremely expensive, especially given it was dropped with less than 2 weeks to Christmas day and a good majority of people have probably finished or are in the process of finishing their Christmas shopping and likely don't have much money left.
>
> Stuff like that should be announced at least a week in advance, especially if there's a sale that only lasts so long tied to it, and doubly especially if it's close to a major holiday - you might want to let whoever is in charge of things like that know that.
While this is wildly off topic to the thread, it IS an example of a well thought out, constructive post. Thank you!
To another point you made: if someone's being a jerk to you, don't engage, just report. The mods do their job damn well, here, and don't get nearly the credit they deserve. Let them or me take care of it.
Now this thread was about having a civil discussion, and we're starting to descend into accusations and petty bickering amongst yourselves. I'll ask this one time to stop with the assumptions against me and against your fellow users, or otherwise we will have to shut this thing down.
Remember the point of this thread. Treat people as human beings.
Why not demand better working conditions? Are you getting paid for every different hat you're wearing? If you're doing 16 different jobs, then your salary should reflect that. Or you know, you could bring up to your bosses that 1 person working 16 roles is absolutely ridiculous, and frankly unfair worker treatment. And potentially illegal if you are not being fairly compensated or given adequate time off.
It's not intended for us to pass judgement on his salary.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Sorry, I am not a frequent contributor, and perhaps I'm off base here, but I thought Badd Moon Rizin was in charge of monitoring the forums. Are they not the Community Manager? Has there been a recent change?
This isn't a TRIBBLE post. I am genuinely asking, because I don't follow all the comings and goings closely.
I think Kael's comment which someone quoted above, "Now this thread was about having a civil discussion, and we're starting to descend into accusations and petty bickering amongst yourselves. I'll ask this one time to stop with the assumptions against me and against your fellow users, or otherwise we will have to shut this thing down."
Personally I was a little disappointed, as conversation shifted to another post he tweeted! What many may not realize is that Kael only tweeted that to support another CM (female) and trying to show Cryptic compensates employees in similar roles, very similar rates regardless of their sex; based on their experience. That female employee is also a newer mother, and also spoke of the high cost of child care, rent being over 2700 a month as it's near Santa Clara County California closer to the Coast. It's not likely to be as affordable as Washington State, Idaho, North Dakota or countless other examples, depending where you live.
Please guys try and think of others before you type, or when you do say something, if it didn't come out as intended consider a subtle revision. Interpersonal Communications is a complicated matter, and we can't hear the tone so we have to perceive it based on word choices; yet also our own emotions at the time. Most on the Volunteer Team, try to focus on the issue not the individual, while also having a bit of empathy for the persons involved whom ever they are in life.
Till the season to be Merry, so please some Kindness more often! We've all been thru a rough 2 years where ever we are, so lets all hope for innovations in Medicine, Research, Engineering, and several others that Star Trek tries to inspire with a brighter future for Humanity still ahead.
Thank you for clarifying.
"Constructive Criticisms?" Here goes:
- Cryptic personnel ought to lose the "Rock Star" attitude. You work for a gaming company. A very small gaming company which has been passed around the industry like Last Year's Fruitcake. 'Nuff said.
- Personalities and forum regulars around here (myself included) also ought to lose the "Rock Star" attitude.
- Make the' "Official Forums"' OFFICIAL! Post new information about the game here FIRST!! THEN post it anywhere else you like afterwards. I find it irritating in the extreme to hunt through Twitter, Instagram, Facebook or any of another hundred or so websites to find out about the latest goings on in my favorite MMO. If this place isn't important enough to be first in line for new information, close it down. I understand advertising to attract new players. Makes good business sense. But once you get them here, doesn't it also make good business sense to give them a reason to stay longer? They'll spend more money this way.
- Restrict Access to Closed Threads which are closed due to Moderation. Regardless of the reason they were moderated. That Guy posts something which is against the rules, the thread gets closed and then continues to get looks because it is still up. Why reward someone in this manner? Why should their ego continue to positively benefit from bad behavior?
- Lastly, shut down all of the, "That's not real Star Trek!" B.S. I'm thoroughly sick and tired of gatekeepers masquerading as Star Trek fans. It is one of the primary reasons I seldom come here or post anything anymore. Star Trek is a big enough tent now there's room for everyone. Are there things about TNG, VOY, DS9 which I don't like? You betcha! Not going to burden another Star Trek fan with them in public. Not going to pounce on another Star Trek fan who likes them in public. Doing so is disrespectful.
Doing so and being allowed to get away with it repeatedly is a leadership failure, Ambassadorkael. So now you're gonna act like the new sheriff in town? Any organization will always be a reflection of its leadership.
While I'm pleased to see at long last somebody wants to clean up the place, I'm also cynical enough after being a part of this for nearly ten years to realize nothing will really change around here. Because the people who can make such a change do not have enough backbone to see the changes through.
Going back to lurking now.
We on the Mod Team have been working on that already. Its been a standing rule for a couple years now at least because it is a form of Gatekeeping, and used to attack not only stuff they don't like, but people who do like it. The problem is we can't catch EVERY instance of it without people reporting it. We're not all knowing. And its also a fine line between expressing your opinion and Gatekeeping. While I agree that it is disrespectful... again we are only human. We're not Q.
I may be the rookie, but I don't know if that is possible with this forum software. However threads that are closed aren't always closed for blatant violations or flame wars. Some are just closed because of being necro'd, and some are closed by request of the OP. For this... if it was possible I'd lean more towards on a case by case basis determined by how MUCH moderation was needed. But as this stands now... that would mean you can't see the FCT thread because its closed. And its referenced a lot when it comes to certain subjects. However... since closed threads don't get updated, they tend to sink, which makes them less visible over time due to new threads pushing them down.