I gotta question what the problem with the new Defiant's turn rate is when it is going to have pilot maneuvers. No they don't help you turn faster,
Actually, Pilot Team *does* make you turn faster. My point wasn't necessarily that I can't work with a 15+ turn rate, though, but ere was wondering why they did so, since -- as everyone else has mentioned already too -- the difference between 15.5 and 17 is negligible, of course.
I was specifically talking about pilot maneuvers. Those are the rolls and forward/reverse thrusts a full pilot ship can do, which the Valiant doesn't have, but the new Defiant will have.
Ah yes, those. And they are great! And I would definitely pay like $50 for the new Defiant, when offered standalone.
What if it's $120 or $90? Around that price range for 1 ship from the pack? Actual lock box ship is $120 retail, granted you also get a lobi outfit, phoenix box gun and a T3 and T5 ship. 4 of the T6 ships models were exclusive to gamble boxes and 1 was to lobi. You get all of the previous traits, associated gear and consoles and the new trait... and skins. I dont think if they were to sell this it will be $50 range. You have a ship that would make a Fed 3 pack ship bundle obsolete, thats $60 right there for a ship bundle that would be killed. I think if they sell it as a single... it'll be around $100 at the low end.
$100 for thew Defiant?! Yeah, no. Keep in mind existing (Fleet) T6 Defiant is just a C-store ship ($35). So, I'll be nice, and will pay $60 or so for it. But not $100.
And that's the trick in selling the ships individually...
No way they would all be the same price. The new Defiant.. 4000-4500 Zen seems about right. No one is going to pay $100 for the Defiant, but the Constitution Class would obviously command a higher price.
It's all just opinion, but to me, 4500 Zen per ship sounds fair, but make the Connies only available in a 2pk for 8-10k Zen. $100 for the 2 connies is a bit much, but there are a lot of people that just want those ships out of the bundle and that's still 1/3 of the normal price. Considering you get the Phasers and pets as an account unlock.. it seems fair to me.
Again though, that's based on nothing but my own personal opinion of how much they're worth.
If they offered the legendary Defiant/Galaxy/Intrepid/Odyssey, (new skin, new trait, no console) as stand-alone ships on the c-store, they should each cost 3000 Zen. Just like any other T6 variant. There's no reason why they should be more expensive.
There IS a reason they should be more expensive, they include every console and cosmetic item from every previous variant. 6k zen would be fair imo, possibly with a scaling discount for those who own previous variants.
I'd think 4-5k is more appropriate. The thing is the lower tier ships are greatly overpriced now since the T6 scaling came into play. They are admiralty cards and no-passive consoles and costumes, but they aren't worth their old prices at all because the ship itself is next to worthless. They have significantly depreciated in value and yet the pricing hasn't been adjusted to match.
Compared to the existing T6s, you expect the new ships to have the consoles that the existing T6s do at the very least. They are variant layouts and in some cases strictly superior, however, they sell full specialty seating ships at 3k a piece, whereas ships that need a fleet upgrade for full potential are also 3k. So while you get a host of costumes and the low tier consoles, none of which is new that isn't exclusive to the new ship, you still only get one ship and one admiralty card.
Even the new Odyssey isn't worth 6k because you have no variant BOFF layouts as you do with the existing T6s that you can already get for 6k. 3 ships for 6k or 1? I think that's a serious thing to consider.
Discounts for already having the older ships is also something they could do to up the price towards 6k, but probably won't.
Compared to the existing T6s, you expect the new ships to have the consoles that the existing T6s do at the very least.
Why would you expect that? Existing T6s with multiple T6 variants each have different consoles and if you want the whole set you have to buy every ship. The Odyssey, the various specialization bundles, the Sovereign, none of them include items that exist on other T6 variants, only the Legendary ships do that and it is one of the reasons they would warrant a higher than normal price tag if they were offered individually.
Compared to the existing T6s, you expect the new ships to have the consoles that the existing T6s do at the very least.
Why would you expect that? Existing T6s with multiple T6 variants each have different consoles and if you want the whole set you have to buy every ship. The Odyssey, the various specialization bundles, the Sovereign, none of them include items that exist on other T6 variants, only the Legendary ships do that and it is one of the reasons they would warrant a higher than normal price tag if they were offered individually.
Yes the Oddy and Sov have multiple T6 consoles, none of the others do. Those are the ones I could see putting towards 5k while Galaxy, Defiant, and Intrepid I'd put at 4k.
If by smaller, you mean just the 10 Ships without the Keys, Promotion Packs, etc.? Yes, that will be 19,500 Zen.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
i did some research because i hated the price. however come to find out the bundle is super cheap. if you want theLegendary Temporal Flight-Deck Carrier alone it goes for over one bil on exchange if you do not like to gamble you will spend 200 on keys alone. if you do not have a lot of these ships its even cheaper because you are getting everything that comes with their t5 and t6 counter parts. so i am fine with the price. if they didn't come in a bundle it would still cost a lot if they sold them one at a time because they come with all the consoles of their counter parts so they would still cost more then the normal 3k
I think a good portion of the 'value determination' depends on where you are in the game currently and how long you have already been playing.
For someone that has been here for years, has tons of ships and has already established a method of gaining in game money to get the ships they want.. this bundle is not a great deal. That's the position I find myself in and I am certainly not going to drop the money for this bundle.
To someone that hasn't been playing as long, doesn't have a ton of ships and is struggling to get that T6 Connie they have always wanted.. then sure, this isn't a bad deal.
The problem I think Cryptic might face is that your 'whales' are usually in that first group. Sure, a lot of them will buy it no matter what because.. well... they're whales and that's what whales do.
The players in group 2 are usually in group 2 because they are either unable or unwilling to put hundreds of dollars into a video game. If that's the case then a $200-$300 ship bundle just doesn't seem like it's going to be popular.
While you will have your occasional newer player that decides that this bundle is worth it, it seems to me like the primary focus of this bundle is the games biggest spenders. The real determination will be rather or not those 'whales' buy enough to make this bundle profitable. If the bundle sells well then you won't see the ships available individually.. but if it flops.. they might break it down into smaller chunks to encourage people to spend.
Time will tell.
I think there is a third group, the Non-gambler vets, we have ship mostly C-Store and Event ships, that may not gamble at all or indulge in the occasion lock-box but are not chasing ships. The Iconic Ships in the bundle speak to them alot I think. Heck I almost dropping to the money just for a Crossfield but I get value out of other ships too. The Video of the TheGrandNagus1 posted is a great break down. whether you agree is your own choice. I think My group three and i think you underestimate the value to group two that this bundle has.
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And yet here I am.
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i did some research because i hated the price. however come to find out the bundle is super cheap. if you want theLegendary Temporal Flight-Deck Carrier alone it goes for over one bil on exchange if you do not like to gamble you will spend 200 on keys alone. if you do not have a lot of these ships its even cheaper because you are getting everything that comes with their t5 and t6 counter parts. so i am fine with the price. if they didn't come in a bundle it would still cost a lot if they sold them one at a time because they come with all the consoles of their counter parts so they would still cost more then the normal 3k
I think a good portion of the 'value determination' depends on where you are in the game currently and how long you have already been playing.
For someone that has been here for years, has tons of ships and has already established a method of gaining in game money to get the ships they want.. this bundle is not a great deal. That's the position I find myself in and I am certainly not going to drop the money for this bundle.
To someone that hasn't been playing as long, doesn't have a ton of ships and is struggling to get that T6 Connie they have always wanted.. then sure, this isn't a bad deal.
The problem I think Cryptic might face is that your 'whales' are usually in that first group. Sure, a lot of them will buy it no matter what because.. well... they're whales and that's what whales do.
The players in group 2 are usually in group 2 because they are either unable or unwilling to put hundreds of dollars into a video game. If that's the case then a $200-$300 ship bundle just doesn't seem like it's going to be popular.
While you will have your occasional newer player that decides that this bundle is worth it, it seems to me like the primary focus of this bundle is the games biggest spenders. The real determination will be rather or not those 'whales' buy enough to make this bundle profitable. If the bundle sells well then you won't see the ships available individually.. but if it flops.. they might break it down into smaller chunks to encourage people to spend.
Time will tell.
I think there is a third group, the Non-gambler vets, we have ship mostly C-Store and Event ships, that may not gamble at all or indulge in the occasion lock-box but are not chasing ships. The Iconic Ships in the bundle speak to them alot I think. Heck I almost dropping to the money just for a Crossfield but I get value out of other ships too. The Video of the TheGrandNagus1 posted is a great break down. whether you agree is your own choice. I think My group three and i think you underestimate the value to group two that this bundle has.
yep i am in that group i gambled one time and called it quits spent 200 dollars and still didnt get the ship i wanted so i do not do that anymore
> @valoreah said:
> (Quote)
>
> That is not what predatory pricing is.
Well, when one doesn't truly understand a thing, but is against it anyway, hyperbole, obfuscation, and misdirection seem to be the reaction.
Should I now bring up a recent post in which in certain moderator got schooled on the proper meaning of 'gatekeeping', and from his misunderstanding impute he was therefore resorting to 'hyperbole, obfuscation, and misdirection'? Or shall we decide to not go that route?
Also, I didn't even use the term 'predatory pricing', but instead I was literally talking about "predatory sales tactics" (which is much broader). But even if I had used the former (which I didn't), ppl would still have understood what I meant to express perfectly.
i did some research because i hated the price. however come to find out the bundle is super cheap. if you want theLegendary Temporal Flight-Deck Carrier alone it goes for over one bil on exchange if you do not like to gamble you will spend 200 on keys alone. if you do not have a lot of these ships its even cheaper because you are getting everything that comes with their t5 and t6 counter parts. so i am fine with the price. if they didn't come in a bundle it would still cost a lot if they sold them one at a time because they come with all the consoles of their counter parts so they would still cost more then the normal 3k
I think a good portion of the 'value determination' depends on where you are in the game currently and how long you have already been playing.
For someone that has been here for years, has tons of ships and has already established a method of gaining in game money to get the ships they want.. this bundle is not a great deal. That's the position I find myself in and I am certainly not going to drop the money for this bundle.
To someone that hasn't been playing as long, doesn't have a ton of ships and is struggling to get that T6 Connie they have always wanted.. then sure, this isn't a bad deal.
The problem I think Cryptic might face is that your 'whales' are usually in that first group. Sure, a lot of them will buy it no matter what because.. well... they're whales and that's what whales do.
The players in group 2 are usually in group 2 because they are either unable or unwilling to put hundreds of dollars into a video game. If that's the case then a $200-$300 ship bundle just doesn't seem like it's going to be popular.
While you will have your occasional newer player that decides that this bundle is worth it, it seems to me like the primary focus of this bundle is the games biggest spenders. The real determination will be rather or not those 'whales' buy enough to make this bundle profitable. If the bundle sells well then you won't see the ships available individually.. but if it flops.. they might break it down into smaller chunks to encourage people to spend.
Time will tell.
I think there is a third group, the Non-gambler vets, we have ship mostly C-Store and Event ships, that may not gamble at all or indulge in the occasion lock-box but are not chasing ships. The Iconic Ships in the bundle speak to them alot I think. Heck I almost dropping to the money just for a Crossfield but I get value out of other ships too. The Video of the TheGrandNagus1 posted is a great break down. whether you agree is your own choice. I think My group three and i think you underestimate the value to group two that this bundle has.
yep i am in that group i gambled one time and called it quits spent 200 dollars and still didnt get the ship i wanted so i do not do that anymore
do you guys think they should have changed some of the stats on some of these consoles? lets be real most of them are gimmicks that do not add much. just something to goof off with for an hour or two. if they changed the stats on some of them to make people want to keep them on the ship. it would help make the ships legendary and stand out. aero shuttle bay on the intripid is a good example make the aero has strong has some of the better pets and add better hull and add shield ability's and make the console give a passive boost to exotic damage has good has lets say an epic console
> @thegrandnagus1 said: > > @baddmoonrizin said: > > People have been claiming for years that they'd be willing to pay $100s for various Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships if they were made available in the C-Store as guaranteed account unlocks. Well, here we are. It's happening and, not surprising, people are still complaining about it. 😒 > > > Come on BMZ, dont be a strawman. Youre better than that. You know the vast majority of people complaining about the bundle price ARENT the folks who want the connies/lockbox ships, they are the folks who just want one or two of the "normal" ships without having to buy the whole bundle. And that is a completely valid complaint. So dont try to write off that majority by talking about the lockbox ships.
Apologies, I was actually trying to make 2 separate points with that post. 1) That if the ships are ever offered individually, they will most likely be priced higher than a regular T6 ship. That should be expected, because the way they are being offered isn't "normal." No other C-Store ships offer access to every other variant and the equipment of their lineage. 2) That since the Visier and Miradorn came out in the C-Store, people have been complaining about the prices. I anticipate these ships following similar pricing, therefore, there will be complaints. But despite those anticipated complaints, people have been asking exactly for this: a way to acquire Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships from the C-Store as account unlocks at higher than normal prices.
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Community Moderators are Unpaid Volunteers and NOT Employees of Gearbox/Cryptic
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do you guys think they should have changed some of the stats on some of these consoles? lets be real most of them are gimmicks that do not add much. just something to goof off with for an hour or two. if they changed the stats on some of them to make people want to keep them on the ship. it would help make the ships legendary and stand out. aero shuttle bay on the intripid is a good example make the aero has strong has some of the better pets and add better hull and add shield ability's and make the console give a passive boost to exotic damage has good has lets say an epic console
They really should update the ancient consoles with passives. As it is, many of them you use the T6 and 1 other because the set bonus can justify the slot as its own passive, however not all the sets are worth that. I think pet/separation consoles could use some additional work to make the pets less terrible.
> @baddmoonrizin said: Apologies, I was actually trying to make 2 separate points with that post. 1) That if the ships are ever offered individually, they will most likely be priced higher than a regular T6 ship. That should be expected, because the way they are being offered isn't "normal." No other C-Store ships offer access to every other variant and the equipment of their lineage. 2) That since the Visier and Miradorn came out in the C-Store, people have been complaining about the prices. I anticipate these ships following similar pricing, therefore, there will be complaints. But despite those anticipated complaints, people have been asking exactly for this: a way to acquire Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships from the C-Store as account unlocks at higher than normal prices.
Thats all well and good, just dont confuse that stuff with the fact that most of the complaints about this bundle have nothing to do with any of that. Again, most of the bundle complaints are from people who want to buy a pilot defiant (just an example) without buying the entire bundle. So most of the complaints about this bundle are completely valid and completely unrelated to the lockbox ships.
I guess my point is this: if you want to defend this bundle from complaints, then address the issue that the majority of the complaints are actually about.
People have been claiming for years that they'd be willing to pay $100s for various Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships if they were made available in the C-Store as guaranteed account unlocks. Well, here we are. It's happening and, not surprising, people are still complaining about it. 😒
Yeah, but partially because there's more than two groups on the forums: whales happy to spend piles for RNG ships, the people claiming they'd pay 100's if they could just avoid RNG... and the people who wouldn't pay 100's either way, but are fine buying single c-store ships for reasonable prices.
(well, and the people who won't even do that. )
edit: ah, nm. should have read further first.
edit 2: anyway, I don't see why ships sold later singly (like the basic ones - Defiant/Galaxy/Intrepid/etc) would necessarily have to include everything that's in this bundle. There's a bunch of bundles you can buy that include ships & other stuff, but the ship itself is still available in it's basic form (ship stats, single new skin). I suppose it all depends on how they've built the bundle - if the ship itself has all that stuff pre-defined onto it, or if when you open the 'box' the ship comes in, several separate items pop out (ship, extra consoles, extra trait, etc). Like the holiday & anniversary ships where you open the box and get a ship and a separate warp core.
Eh, whatever. It's all speculation. /shrug
> @thegrandnagus1 said: > > @baddmoonrizin said: > Apologies, I was actually trying to make 2 separate points with that post. 1) That if the ships are ever offered individually, they will most likely be priced higher than a regular T6 ship. That should be expected, because the way they are being offered isn't "normal." No other C-Store ships offer access to every other variant and the equipment of their lineage. 2) That since the Visier and Miradorn came out in the C-Store, people have been complaining about the prices. I anticipate these ships following similar pricing, therefore, there will be complaints. But despite those anticipated complaints, people have been asking exactly for this: a way to acquire Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships from the C-Store as account unlocks at higher than normal prices. > > > > Thats all well and good, just dont confuse that stuff with the fact that most of the complaints about this bundle have nothing to do with any of that. Again, most of the bundle complaints are from people who want to buy a pilot defiant (just an example) without buying the entire bundle. So most of the complaints about this bundle are completely valid and completely unrelated to the lockbox ships. > > I guess my point is this: if you want to defend this bundle from complaints, then address the issue that the majority of the complaints are actually about.
Apologies again. I concede that there are folks who have an issue with the bundle because they only want a single ship and not willing to buy the whole thing for that one ship. I won't argue that. That's a valid objection. I took this as a given, but probably should've expressed that.
From a marketing perspective, I can understand making this initial offering only in the bundle and only for a limited time. It generates hype. It generates sales. There's no mistaking that. I do believe, however, that we can expect the ships to return after this limited time, and I would expect them to be offered individually at some point. It would be a mistake not to, in my opinion.
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> @tigeraries said: > what if they offered the ships as individual listings... but on the Lobi store instead?
God no. Lobi have always been single character purchases (much to my chagrin). These ships, as a bundle, are being offered in the C-Store. Individually, if that should happen, they should go to the C-Store as well, even if that means at a higher price point.
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> @tigeraries said:
> what if they offered the ships as individual listings... but on the Lobi store instead?
God no. Lobi have always been single character purchases (much to my chagrin). These ships, as a bundle, are being offered in the C-Store. Individually, if that should happen, they should go to the C-Store as well, even if that means at a higher price point.
they are discussing making lock box, phoenix box and lobi stuff account unlocks...
what if they introduced a new premium lobi... that stuff is all account unlocks. so if you want you can buy a single character item or if you want to spend a bit more... account unlock.
anyway zen sale up... extra 5k zen at $200 price point... up from 3k standard to 8k bonus. 20% ship sale... lowest I have ever seen... old flash sales was 35% off, better than recent black friday sales
> @tigeraries said: > (Quote) > > they are discussing making lock box, phoenix box and lobi stuff account unlocks... > > what if they introduced a new premium lobi... that stuff is all account unlocks. so if you want you can buy a single character item or if you want to spend a bit more... account unlock.
IF they were to make Lobi purchases account unlocks, I might support that.
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Community Moderators are Unpaid Volunteers and NOT Employees of Gearbox/Cryptic
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do you guys think they should have changed some of the stats on some of these consoles? lets be real most of them are gimmicks that do not add much. just something to goof off with for an hour or two. if they changed the stats on some of them to make people want to keep them on the ship. it would help make the ships legendary and stand out
Not so much the stats, but some passive abilities would've been VERY welcome.
As it is, no longer keen on using consoles that activate a brief ability and then go onto a two-minute cooldown and offer literally nothing else (Ablative Generator on the Intrepid for example).
I feel like this feedback hasn't got the full attention it deserves along with the ships should have two different seating not just a few.
Does "LE Bundle sale Ends in" mean it will go from 19,5k too 30k zen after 25 days or that the bundle won't be there anymore?
No details known... right now it is on sale... so after a week or so? back to full price? then probably the listing will go poof once the anniversary is over. next time up, probably at full price. all guesses.
I'll guarantee you that if these ships are ever sold individually, they will go for quite a bit more than your average C-Store T6. They've included every skin, every console, and every weapon of every other variant with these ships, plus 2 Starship Traits, and they're Fleet level to boot. All of that will be used to justify the higher cost. And rightly so.
People have been claiming for years that they'd be willing to pay $100s for various Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships if they were made available in the C-Store as guaranteed account unlocks. Well, here we are. It's happening and, not surprising, people are still complaining about it. 😒
Yup...I mean I'd honestly expect the TOS and Discovery Connies to go for 8-10k or so zen...maybe get a bit of a sale in Mudd's Market. Others for maybe 5-6k
I've seen people complaining about how scummy lock box/r&d ships are but they're also complaining about the price...well CBS doesn't fund them game, they need to make money in order to keep the doors open. I guess some people were expecting to get their account unlocked Discovery Connie for 3k
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
> @baddmoonrizin said: Apologies again. I concede that there are folks who have an issue with the bundle because they only want a single ship and not willing to buy the whole thing for that one ship. I won't argue that. That's a valid objection. I took this as a given, but probably should've expressed that. > > From a marketing perspective, I can understand making this initial offering only in the bundle and only for a limited time. It generates hype. It generates sales. There's no mistaking that. I do believe, however, that we can expect the ships to return after this limited time, and I would expect them to be offered individually at some point. It would be a mistake not to, in my opinion.
I agree with all of that. I just want to add/emphasize this point though: the majority of folks (whose feedback I have read here and on reddit) that have an issue with this bundle is because of this issue we are both acknwoldge is valid, not "oh I said I would spend a bunch for a connie but now I dont want to". Thats not what the vast majority of people (that I have read) are saying.
The point: the majority of complaint against this bundle is valid and cannot be dismissed as otherwise.
Hey folks!
There's a bug in the C-store, so I want to correct this before people miss out on the sale. The 35% off sale on the bundle lasts until 2/27. The bundle itself is available until 3/9. Thanks!
Comments
I'd think 4-5k is more appropriate. The thing is the lower tier ships are greatly overpriced now since the T6 scaling came into play. They are admiralty cards and no-passive consoles and costumes, but they aren't worth their old prices at all because the ship itself is next to worthless. They have significantly depreciated in value and yet the pricing hasn't been adjusted to match.
Compared to the existing T6s, you expect the new ships to have the consoles that the existing T6s do at the very least. They are variant layouts and in some cases strictly superior, however, they sell full specialty seating ships at 3k a piece, whereas ships that need a fleet upgrade for full potential are also 3k. So while you get a host of costumes and the low tier consoles, none of which is new that isn't exclusive to the new ship, you still only get one ship and one admiralty card.
Even the new Odyssey isn't worth 6k because you have no variant BOFF layouts as you do with the existing T6s that you can already get for 6k. 3 ships for 6k or 1? I think that's a serious thing to consider.
Discounts for already having the older ships is also something they could do to up the price towards 6k, but probably won't.
Why would you expect that? Existing T6s with multiple T6 variants each have different consoles and if you want the whole set you have to buy every ship. The Odyssey, the various specialization bundles, the Sovereign, none of them include items that exist on other T6 variants, only the Legendary ships do that and it is one of the reasons they would warrant a higher than normal price tag if they were offered individually.
Yes the Oddy and Sov have multiple T6 consoles, none of the others do. Those are the ones I could see putting towards 5k while Galaxy, Defiant, and Intrepid I'd put at 4k.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I think there is a third group, the Non-gambler vets, we have ship mostly C-Store and Event ships, that may not gamble at all or indulge in the occasion lock-box but are not chasing ships. The Iconic Ships in the bundle speak to them alot I think. Heck I almost dropping to the money just for a Crossfield but I get value out of other ships too. The Video of the TheGrandNagus1 posted is a great break down. whether you agree is your own choice. I think My group three and i think you underestimate the value to group two that this bundle has.
And yet here I am.
12th Century Swedish knight turned Star Trek Captain
yep i am in that group i gambled one time and called it quits spent 200 dollars and still didnt get the ship i wanted so i do not do that anymore
Should I now bring up a recent post in which in certain moderator got schooled on the proper meaning of 'gatekeeping', and from his misunderstanding impute he was therefore resorting to 'hyperbole, obfuscation, and misdirection'? Or shall we decide to not go that route?
Also, I didn't even use the term 'predatory pricing', but instead I was literally talking about "predatory sales tactics" (which is much broader). But even if I had used the former (which I didn't), ppl would still have understood what I meant to express perfectly.
> > @baddmoonrizin said:
> > People have been claiming for years that they'd be willing to pay $100s for various Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships if they were made available in the C-Store as guaranteed account unlocks. Well, here we are. It's happening and, not surprising, people are still complaining about it. 😒
>
>
> Come on BMZ, dont be a strawman. Youre better than that. You know the vast majority of people complaining about the bundle price ARENT the folks who want the connies/lockbox ships, they are the folks who just want one or two of the "normal" ships without having to buy the whole bundle. And that is a completely valid complaint. So dont try to write off that majority by talking about the lockbox ships.
Apologies, I was actually trying to make 2 separate points with that post. 1) That if the ships are ever offered individually, they will most likely be priced higher than a regular T6 ship. That should be expected, because the way they are being offered isn't "normal." No other C-Store ships offer access to every other variant and the equipment of their lineage. 2) That since the Visier and Miradorn came out in the C-Store, people have been complaining about the prices. I anticipate these ships following similar pricing, therefore, there will be complaints. But despite those anticipated complaints, people have been asking exactly for this: a way to acquire Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships from the C-Store as account unlocks at higher than normal prices.
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They really should update the ancient consoles with passives. As it is, many of them you use the T6 and 1 other because the set bonus can justify the slot as its own passive, however not all the sets are worth that. I think pet/separation consoles could use some additional work to make the pets less terrible.
Apologies, I was actually trying to make 2 separate points with that post. 1) That if the ships are ever offered individually, they will most likely be priced higher than a regular T6 ship. That should be expected, because the way they are being offered isn't "normal." No other C-Store ships offer access to every other variant and the equipment of their lineage. 2) That since the Visier and Miradorn came out in the C-Store, people have been complaining about the prices. I anticipate these ships following similar pricing, therefore, there will be complaints. But despite those anticipated complaints, people have been asking exactly for this: a way to acquire Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships from the C-Store as account unlocks at higher than normal prices.
Thats all well and good, just dont confuse that stuff with the fact that most of the complaints about this bundle have nothing to do with any of that. Again, most of the bundle complaints are from people who want to buy a pilot defiant (just an example) without buying the entire bundle. So most of the complaints about this bundle are completely valid and completely unrelated to the lockbox ships.
I guess my point is this: if you want to defend this bundle from complaints, then address the issue that the majority of the complaints are actually about.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Yeah, but partially because there's more than two groups on the forums: whales happy to spend piles for RNG ships, the people claiming they'd pay 100's if they could just avoid RNG... and the people who wouldn't pay 100's either way, but are fine buying single c-store ships for reasonable prices.
(well, and the people who won't even do that.
edit: ah, nm. should have read further first.
edit 2: anyway, I don't see why ships sold later singly (like the basic ones - Defiant/Galaxy/Intrepid/etc) would necessarily have to include everything that's in this bundle. There's a bunch of bundles you can buy that include ships & other stuff, but the ship itself is still available in it's basic form (ship stats, single new skin). I suppose it all depends on how they've built the bundle - if the ship itself has all that stuff pre-defined onto it, or if when you open the 'box' the ship comes in, several separate items pop out (ship, extra consoles, extra trait, etc). Like the holiday & anniversary ships where you open the box and get a ship and a separate warp core.
Eh, whatever. It's all speculation. /shrug
> > @baddmoonrizin said:
> Apologies, I was actually trying to make 2 separate points with that post. 1) That if the ships are ever offered individually, they will most likely be priced higher than a regular T6 ship. That should be expected, because the way they are being offered isn't "normal." No other C-Store ships offer access to every other variant and the equipment of their lineage. 2) That since the Visier and Miradorn came out in the C-Store, people have been complaining about the prices. I anticipate these ships following similar pricing, therefore, there will be complaints. But despite those anticipated complaints, people have been asking exactly for this: a way to acquire Lockbox/Lobi/Promo ships from the C-Store as account unlocks at higher than normal prices.
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>
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> Thats all well and good, just dont confuse that stuff with the fact that most of the complaints about this bundle have nothing to do with any of that. Again, most of the bundle complaints are from people who want to buy a pilot defiant (just an example) without buying the entire bundle. So most of the complaints about this bundle are completely valid and completely unrelated to the lockbox ships.
>
> I guess my point is this: if you want to defend this bundle from complaints, then address the issue that the majority of the complaints are actually about.
Apologies again. I concede that there are folks who have an issue with the bundle because they only want a single ship and not willing to buy the whole thing for that one ship. I won't argue that. That's a valid objection. I took this as a given, but probably should've expressed that.
From a marketing perspective, I can understand making this initial offering only in the bundle and only for a limited time. It generates hype. It generates sales. There's no mistaking that. I do believe, however, that we can expect the ships to return after this limited time, and I would expect them to be offered individually at some point. It would be a mistake not to, in my opinion.
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> what if they offered the ships as individual listings... but on the Lobi store instead?
God no. Lobi have always been single character purchases (much to my chagrin). These ships, as a bundle, are being offered in the C-Store. Individually, if that should happen, they should go to the C-Store as well, even if that means at a higher price point.
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they are discussing making lock box, phoenix box and lobi stuff account unlocks...
what if they introduced a new premium lobi... that stuff is all account unlocks. so if you want you can buy a single character item or if you want to spend a bit more... account unlock.
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> they are discussing making lock box, phoenix box and lobi stuff account unlocks...
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> what if they introduced a new premium lobi... that stuff is all account unlocks. so if you want you can buy a single character item or if you want to spend a bit more... account unlock.
IF they were to make Lobi purchases account unlocks, I might support that.
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No details known... right now it is on sale... so after a week or so? back to full price? then probably the listing will go poof once the anniversary is over. next time up, probably at full price. all guesses.
Yup...I mean I'd honestly expect the TOS and Discovery Connies to go for 8-10k or so zen...maybe get a bit of a sale in Mudd's Market. Others for maybe 5-6k
I've seen people complaining about how scummy lock box/r&d ships are but they're also complaining about the price...well CBS doesn't fund them game, they need to make money in order to keep the doors open. I guess some people were expecting to get their account unlocked Discovery Connie for 3k
Apologies again. I concede that there are folks who have an issue with the bundle because they only want a single ship and not willing to buy the whole thing for that one ship. I won't argue that. That's a valid objection. I took this as a given, but probably should've expressed that.
>
> From a marketing perspective, I can understand making this initial offering only in the bundle and only for a limited time. It generates hype. It generates sales. There's no mistaking that. I do believe, however, that we can expect the ships to return after this limited time, and I would expect them to be offered individually at some point. It would be a mistake not to, in my opinion.
I agree with all of that. I just want to add/emphasize this point though: the majority of folks (whose feedback I have read here and on reddit) that have an issue with this bundle is because of this issue we are both acknwoldge is valid, not "oh I said I would spend a bunch for a connie but now I dont want to". Thats not what the vast majority of people (that I have read) are saying.
The point: the majority of complaint against this bundle is valid and cannot be dismissed as otherwise.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Kael gave an answer in the announcement thread: