Are those resistances due to abilities being put up, consoles or is it just from the shields? 20% you can get just from the assimilated shields, which is not that much. How many shots did he take? I've also asked you in what way PvE is challenging, you haven't answered that one. And I've told you why I don't have a lovely video for you.
You don't seem to have a problem with the guy that has a 90k scimi and no video.
There is a video of a guy that solos ISA in a pilot ship and only moves when he tackles the tac cube. Have you seen that one or do you want the link?
Are those resistances due to abilities being put up, consoles or is it just from the shields? 20% you can get just from the assimilated shields, which is not that much.
How many shots did he take?
I've also asked you in what way PvE is challenging, you haven't answered that one.
And I've told you why I don't have a lovely video for you.
You don't seem to have a problem with the guy that has a 90k scimi and no video.
There is a video of a guy that solos ISA in a pilot ship and only moves when he tackles the tac cube. Have you seen that one or do you want the link?
I believe Paxdawn asked for a video or parse. The 90k scim probably has a parse. The guy soloing ISA with a pilot ship moves quite a bit, did you not watch that video?
I did, he moved a lot for better positioning but not for speed tanking or evading damage. As I pointed out earlier though I don't use a ludicrously high DPS build like the pilot guy because I personally don't see the point and I'm not about to spend 100mil EC getting one to prove an obvious point.
Ok, I'mma post here on this once since it's a debated topic and then promptly forget this thread (I hope).
A few tiny "facts" if you will with how I see things...
1) Tactical prettymuch always meant more damage, less survival
2) Science prettymuch always meant Debuffing and Healing, less damage, more survival in a manner
3) Engineers are the tanks in space missions while Tacs used to be the tanks in ground... Eng's can take a heck of a beating as a Tank and survive things that others simple cant (IE I learned how to survive the CCA explosion when everyone else just kept shooting)
4) It's up to the player what style they choose of my prior examples, no, science or engineers wont do the damage of a tac player... it's a matter of their focus, but it isnt a limit persay. Anyone can complain about someone else over performing or underperforming though the latter is most common. But only ONE person can play your way and that's you. Do what you enjoy, do it as best you can and be open to suggestions but not offended or feeling dragged into changing what you enjoy about a game.
To the OP. Well, it's an obsessions if YOU want to set it as an obsession. That doesn't have to be an obsession, of course. It's true it's an obsession for someone, but at the end it's just a personal pov of the game, something we can't really complain at.
The problems start when this obsession prevaricate the game experience for others, especially in a small group or in a fleet. When this obsession becomes the only thing that push you through the game, well... it's an O.C.D.
So, replying to your comment, until this obsession doesn't hurt you and your gaming experience, who cares? Let them fight for their e-peen lol
ps: and i'm one of those "dpsers", so...
I did, he moved a lot for better positioning but not for speed tanking or evading damage. As I pointed out earlier though I don't use a ludicrously high DPS build like the pilot guy because I personally don't see the point and I'm not about to spend 100mil EC getting one to prove an obvious point.
Excuses, excuses. Like all self proclaim PvPers in STO forums, all air no show. When challenge is up, everyone makes excuses like yourself. The thread posts are more of an ego massaging process/post to make themselves feel superior that they can do what ToP Pvers can do but dont know even half of what ToP PvErs do.
Because like you said, you dont do elite stuff and you dont even parse. How in the world can you even know your team and yourselfs resistances nor even know what happens at elite when you have not even complete all the elite space STFs nor even use a parser?
In short, you have no proof. Just spreading rumours, lies and hate.
I have set builds for set tasks instead of going for pure DPS, my science builds are all about support and crowd control, my cruisers are built for tanking damage and my escorts are my DPS set ups
"The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Lol @paxdawn, if you want to meet in game for a match, I can prove I'm a PvPer. I do elites but I pug them. The only elite pug I've done successfully on a regular basis is GGE and that's because everyone knows the objective. Its very rare for me to team up with more than one person.
Like I said, if you want to meet in-game, do a couple STFs and a challenge match, I'm all for it. Tell you what, we'll get a team that knows what they're doing and we'll see how tough it is.
Lol @paxdawn, if you want to meet in game for a match, I can prove I'm a PvPer. I do elites but I pug them. The only elite pug I've done successfully on a regular basis is GGE and that's because everyone knows the objective. Its very rare for me to team up with more than one person.
Like I said, if you want to meet in-game, do a couple STFs and a challenge match, I'm all for it. Tell you what, we'll get a team that knows what they're doing and we'll see how tough it is.
Jeez. Typical PvP player nonsense? You are no different like any other PvP player troll in the STO forums who has the same view as you. When the facts are not looking good and you cannot back it up with facts, challenge people to PvP when you are talking PvE.
Like I said, if you want to talk about PvE better sure you are knowledgeable about PvE and have facts to back it up and stick to PvE rather makes stories and go around circles and end up challenging me in PvP.
Just make sure your story above is true that you PuG, GG Elite not GG advance nor GG Normal. Since you got no proof even that or the rest of your claims nor can you explain how the high DPSer even have resistances at all with parses posted a few posts above. Otherwise, we will add another to one of your stories without proof.
I offered to pug PvE with you to prove my point. I also offered to PvP you to prove my claim that I am a PvPer, but I'm glad you believe that without needing proof.
I offered to pug PvE with you to prove my point. I also offered to PvP you to prove my claim that I am a PvPer, but I'm glad you believe that without needing proof.
You can easily record it. Easier to cheat 0 resistances or below if I come with you since I wont be seeing your resistances. Parse it and post it here. that you and your teammates have 0 resistances or below in all elite queues.
No need to prove your a PvPer nor PvP on a topic about PvE. If this were the PVP topic in PVP Subforum, but this is a PvE topic and we are talking about PvE.
It also doesnt mean one Elite queue, it means all elite queues. You cannot generalize one queue for all since every STF is a different meta. This means Korfez elite, BDE, HSE, GGE, Breach Elite, Storming the Spire Elite, The herald Sphere elite. Dont whine about DPS because if you can carry GGE puG with your DPS(as you claim), assuming you can carry GGE PuG should be able to carry all that elite queues of course not unless you are spinning stories again that your GGE is GGA or even GGN PuG. For HSE upload it at SCM so we have a third party to check if you cheated or not.
Show us thru video and even parse you and your teammates have 0 resistances and below. All of your teammates should park and shoot and shouldnt move after you stop. if they do move and you dont, you are just technically leeching off them. We want completed mission of this claim of yours. Parse for resistances recording, video for park and shoot.
I am looking for good examples of team play inside STO and possibly some hints on what makes a team better.
I want to see the interaction between careers and the coordination inside efficient teams.
Who takes what "role"? Does everyone concentrate on their specific part or do they do everything?
How do these "builds" work together?
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Lol K. Seeing as I've said multiple times I don't use the current meta, specifically because I think it's pointless since it'll all be nerfed and everyone will have to start their build all over again, I instead offered to do STFs with you. What would lying achieve? You are quite happy with the fact that I'm a PvPer despite no proof, I suspect that if I go with a competent team (2 tacs, a tank, a healer and a debuffer) there's every chance you'll complain that I'm not pulling my own weight because I have help. @deokkent has a point. Good video. The good old days.
Lol K. Seeing as I've said multiple times I don't use the current meta, specifically because I think it's pointless since it'll all be nerfed and everyone will have to start their build all over again, I instead offered to do STFs with you. What would lying achieve? You are quite happy with the fact that I'm a PvPer despite no proof, I suspect that if I go with a competent team (2 tacs, a tank, a healer and a debuffer) there's every chance you'll complain that I'm not pulling my own weight because I have help. @deokkent has a point. Good video. The good old days.
I'll run w/ you under the conditions that you stated you encountered before. Lets see what happens.
Lol K. Seeing as I've said multiple times I don't use the current meta, specifically because I think it's pointless since it'll all be nerfed and everyone will have to start their build all over again, I instead offered to do STFs with you. What would lying achieve? You are quite happy with the fact that I'm a PvPer despite no proof, I suspect that if I go with a competent team (2 tacs, a tank, a healer and a debuffer) there's every chance you'll complain that I'm not pulling my own weight because I have help. @deokkent has a point. Good video. The good old days.
Jeez, you are still here. You either parse, find proof or you are trolling or ego massaging yourself like any other PvP player in STO forums.
That is why you do this below rather than reply with me for pages:
Lol K. Seeing as I've said multiple times I don't use the current meta, specifically because I think it's pointless since it'll all be nerfed and everyone will have to start their build all over again, I instead offered to do STFs with you. What would lying achieve? You are quite happy with the fact that I'm a PvPer despite no proof, I suspect that if I go with a competent team (2 tacs, a tank, a healer and a debuffer) there's every chance you'll complain that I'm not pulling my own weight because I have help. @deokkent has a point. Good video. The good old days.
I'll run w/ you under the conditions that you stated you encountered before. Lets see what happens.
Wouldnt that consitute cheating or leeching from us, if you, I or sarcasmdetector tags along on that GGE? suddenly that 4 deadweight PuGs will just be 3 deadweight pugs.
Dont forget to check with 0 resistances since the original claim was park, shoot with no resistances.
Could you clarify that last bit @paxdawn? Are you saying I have to do GGE and other elites on my own?
The 0 resistances thing is pretty impossible since elite shields give you resistance, even non rep shields give you 20% minimum to particular weapon types. I was referring to resistance tanking and using engineering consoles for resistances as the majority of DPS build's will put universal consoles that give extra Crit, power or leech. But now you're going to say: "Aaaaahhhaaahhh that's not what you said! You're just here like every other PvPer thinking that he's better than everyone", seeing as you take everything I say as lies except for me being a PvPer.
But it's true, the average PvPer is better than the average PvEr when it come to combat. Against an NPC or player.
I'm definitely seeing a trend here with your side of the argument.
The OP is complaining about people who are jerks about dps, not about dps in general. I suggest you read carefully before insulting people who have legitimate complaints about the behavior of a rather loud and obnoxious group of players, even if they are a minority.
An entirely fabricated argument, created because OP is frustrated at other people wanting to be successful in a certain aspect of the game.
Reading through this thread, I'm not actually convinced that this so-called 'DPS obsession' is the issue. I would argue that it's more 'ISA obsession'.
Which I continue to find a little odd; I am fully aware of why ISA is the standard DPS is measured by; which doesn't change the fact that ISA is a very predictable STF full of dumb NPCs that don't move very fast. And the actions that can be taken against are just as predictable as the NPCs themselves.
Well what can one do? A lot of players seem to favour contend which is not time gated. Reason is most likely the fact that the game progression of each individual pays off best on such maps. Task like do thing x for y minutes gets dull rather soonsih (senseless even because one cant get better at some point) while forced in game cinematics also tend to annoy after the 500th time.
ISA is probably also favoured because it’s an "easy" team map where the influence of single individuals can get quiet high resulting in a huge average success rate for others (One 50k DPS team member can pull 4 others through which only make 7k each and all 5 players still get a fun match with feeling of success out of it) .
More intelligent NPCs would be cool but if I recall correctly any measures cryptic takes to make the game more difficult are met with much scepticism. (The Hard Fail Conditions, the buff to the tachyon beams e.g.) They also have a habbit to come up with annoying stuff rather than interesting things (knock back armors on ground come to mind).
So I’m rather happy the way it is atm (aside from a mission elite mode).
ISA sells ships while so many other maps do not. My advice to cryptic is find out why and make more contend like it.
It does not have to be all about DPS but without it there will be very small room to make game progression worthwhile for the player. VCE feels like a fair mix here. I like it much as of late.
Post edited by peterconnorfirst on
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Reading through this thread, I'm not actually convinced that this so-called 'DPS obsession' is the issue. I would argue that it's more 'ISA obsession'.
Which I continue to find a little odd; I am fully aware of why ISA is the standard DPS is measured by; which doesn't change the fact that ISA is a very predictable STF full of dumb NPCs that don't move very fast. And the actions that can be taken against are just as predictable as the NPCs themselves.
It also helps greatly that it's probably the fastest of all Queued Missions to run, and more DPS will make it run faster. There are no time-gates or anything, you do the mission at your pace. And if you're min/maxing rewards gained in time, ISA is the best, especially when you're not worrying about marks or elite marks anymore, just Dilithium.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
It is frustrating though that a lot of players don't realise that science is amazing the moment. They've been buffed in recent months. Meaning that a 10k DPS tac could annihilate anything in his path with a sci there to throw debuffs around. Problem is no one wants to be that sci captain, no one wants to be the tank that pulls all the aggro to let the team do the mission properly and easily, why? Because the attitude now is "if you haven't got the DPS, don't bother queuing up!"
And that's just sad. Teamwork has always been way more op than any amount of DPS but everyone wants to solo everything for bragging rights.
All defensive skills have huge diminishing returns because of Engineering being nerfed years, and years ago due to it being "too strong" in PVP (This was pre-F2P so my knowledge of this is non-existent). Anyone saying to stack up on Resistances doesn't seem to understand that tankiness is directly related to max hull / shields / how many of those broken invincibility moves you've got.
People mentioning Tanking CCA's Blast. The mechanics behind that are asinine and completely random. I've had it deal over 100K to me through RSP, the Iconian Shield Generator and the Kobali 4pc reactionary heal.
This was with Council of Thought.
The same goes for Ground. I've got over 1k HP in on the ground / 120 resists and that doesn't stop me from being instanuked in some of the Advanced Maps. Could not even put BHA with full Mk XIV gear (Ico set).
It's an interest in improving the capability of your build, piloting and teamwork by using a consistent benchmark, not an "Obsession"
I have to agree.
I have always found the DPS community helpful and welcoming. When I was new and had no idea what I was doing, the DPS community helped me learn how to use powers and skill effectively. Contrary to what some think, there was never any discouragement of variety or criticism for 'non optimal' choices.
The DPS community is perfectly happy offering advice to help players work inside the structure of their own specific needs. It's not all about chasing every last percent possible. The people that paint the DPS community as a group of exclusionary min/maxers are the people that have never interacted with that community. It's a false perception.
I have always found the "dps community" hostile, belittling, and of no general use to other players whatsoever.
^ that is also my experience with pretty much ALL DPS'ers. Its to the point now where no one will even play with you if you are below a certain amount. So basically all new players and people that don't pay real money for DPS have to fend for themselves which just destroys the community aspect of this game.
I've basically stopped caring, and do my best with what I get. I play this game to have fun. And if my DPS is too low for someone, then I will enjoy the hissyfit they have over it lol
Comments
How many shots did he take?
I've also asked you in what way PvE is challenging, you haven't answered that one.
And I've told you why I don't have a lovely video for you.
You don't seem to have a problem with the guy that has a 90k scimi and no video.
There is a video of a guy that solos ISA in a pilot ship and only moves when he tackles the tac cube. Have you seen that one or do you want the link?
I believe Paxdawn asked for a video or parse. The 90k scim probably has a parse. The guy soloing ISA with a pilot ship moves quite a bit, did you not watch that video?
A few tiny "facts" if you will with how I see things...
1) Tactical prettymuch always meant more damage, less survival
2) Science prettymuch always meant Debuffing and Healing, less damage, more survival in a manner
3) Engineers are the tanks in space missions while Tacs used to be the tanks in ground... Eng's can take a heck of a beating as a Tank and survive things that others simple cant (IE I learned how to survive the CCA explosion when everyone else just kept shooting)
4) It's up to the player what style they choose of my prior examples, no, science or engineers wont do the damage of a tac player... it's a matter of their focus, but it isnt a limit persay. Anyone can complain about someone else over performing or underperforming though the latter is most common. But only ONE person can play your way and that's you. Do what you enjoy, do it as best you can and be open to suggestions but not offended or feeling dragged into changing what you enjoy about a game.
The problems start when this obsession prevaricate the game experience for others, especially in a small group or in a fleet. When this obsession becomes the only thing that push you through the game, well... it's an O.C.D.
So, replying to your comment, until this obsession doesn't hurt you and your gaming experience, who cares? Let them fight for their e-peen lol
ps: and i'm one of those "dpsers", so...
Excuses, excuses. Like all self proclaim PvPers in STO forums, all air no show. When challenge is up, everyone makes excuses like yourself. The thread posts are more of an ego massaging process/post to make themselves feel superior that they can do what ToP Pvers can do but dont know even half of what ToP PvErs do.
Because like you said, you dont do elite stuff and you dont even parse. How in the world can you even know your team and yourselfs resistances nor even know what happens at elite when you have not even complete all the elite space STFs nor even use a parser?
In short, you have no proof. Just spreading rumours, lies and hate.
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Like I said, if you want to meet in-game, do a couple STFs and a challenge match, I'm all for it. Tell you what, we'll get a team that knows what they're doing and we'll see how tough it is.
Jeez. Typical PvP player nonsense? You are no different like any other PvP player troll in the STO forums who has the same view as you. When the facts are not looking good and you cannot back it up with facts, challenge people to PvP when you are talking PvE.
Like I said, if you want to talk about PvE better sure you are knowledgeable about PvE and have facts to back it up and stick to PvE rather makes stories and go around circles and end up challenging me in PvP.
Just make sure your story above is true that you PuG, GG Elite not GG advance nor GG Normal. Since you got no proof even that or the rest of your claims nor can you explain how the high DPSer even have resistances at all with parses posted a few posts above. Otherwise, we will add another to one of your stories without proof.
We go back to this:
You can easily record it. Easier to cheat 0 resistances or below if I come with you since I wont be seeing your resistances. Parse it and post it here. that you and your teammates have 0 resistances or below in all elite queues.
No need to prove your a PvPer nor PvP on a topic about PvE. If this were the PVP topic in PVP Subforum, but this is a PvE topic and we are talking about PvE.
It also doesnt mean one Elite queue, it means all elite queues. You cannot generalize one queue for all since every STF is a different meta. This means Korfez elite, BDE, HSE, GGE, Breach Elite, Storming the Spire Elite, The herald Sphere elite. Dont whine about DPS because if you can carry GGE puG with your DPS(as you claim), assuming you can carry GGE PuG should be able to carry all that elite queues of course not unless you are spinning stories again that your GGE is GGA or even GGN PuG. For HSE upload it at SCM so we have a third party to check if you cheated or not.
Show us thru video and even parse you and your teammates have 0 resistances and below. All of your teammates should park and shoot and shouldnt move after you stop. if they do move and you dont, you are just technically leeching off them. We want completed mission of this claim of yours. Parse for resistances recording, video for park and shoot.
I am looking for good examples of team play inside STO and possibly some hints on what makes a team better.
I want to see the interaction between careers and the coordination inside efficient teams.
Who takes what "role"? Does everyone concentrate on their specific part or do they do everything?
How do these "builds" work together?
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Proof or STFU.
@deokkent has a point. Good video. The good old days.
PvP in this game was sooo much fun
I'll run w/ you under the conditions that you stated you encountered before. Lets see what happens.
Fleet Defiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support | Fleet Manticore Kinetic Strike Ship | Tactical Command Kinetic Siege Refit | Fleet Defiant Quantum Phase Escort | Fleet Valiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support
Turning the Galaxy-X into a Torpedo Dreadnought & torpedo tutorial, with written torpedo guide.
"A good weapon and a great strategy will win you many battles." - Marshall
I knew using Kinetics would be playing the game on hard mode, but what I didn't realize was how bad the deck is stacked against Kinetics.
Jeez, you are still here. You either parse, find proof or you are trolling or ego massaging yourself like any other PvP player in STO forums.
That is why you do this below rather than reply with me for pages:
Wouldnt that consitute cheating or leeching from us, if you, I or sarcasmdetector tags along on that GGE? suddenly that 4 deadweight PuGs will just be 3 deadweight pugs.
Dont forget to check with 0 resistances since the original claim was park, shoot with no resistances.
The 0 resistances thing is pretty impossible since elite shields give you resistance, even non rep shields give you 20% minimum to particular weapon types. I was referring to resistance tanking and using engineering consoles for resistances as the majority of DPS build's will put universal consoles that give extra Crit, power or leech. But now you're going to say: "Aaaaahhhaaahhh that's not what you said! You're just here like every other PvPer thinking that he's better than everyone", seeing as you take everything I say as lies except for me being a PvPer.
But it's true, the average PvPer is better than the average PvEr when it come to combat. Against an NPC or player.
I'm definitely seeing a trend here with your side of the argument.
Never said anything you should do it alone. Check your statements that some of us replied to that some of us were asking proof of.
An entirely fabricated argument, created because OP is frustrated at other people wanting to be successful in a certain aspect of the game.
Well what can one do? A lot of players seem to favour contend which is not time gated. Reason is most likely the fact that the game progression of each individual pays off best on such maps. Task like do thing x for y minutes gets dull rather soonsih (senseless even because one cant get better at some point) while forced in game cinematics also tend to annoy after the 500th time.
ISA is probably also favoured because it’s an "easy" team map where the influence of single individuals can get quiet high resulting in a huge average success rate for others (One 50k DPS team member can pull 4 others through which only make 7k each and all 5 players still get a fun match with feeling of success out of it) .
More intelligent NPCs would be cool but if I recall correctly any measures cryptic takes to make the game more difficult are met with much scepticism. (The Hard Fail Conditions, the buff to the tachyon beams e.g.) They also have a habbit to come up with annoying stuff rather than interesting things (knock back armors on ground come to mind).
So I’m rather happy the way it is atm (aside from a mission elite mode).
ISA sells ships while so many other maps do not. My advice to cryptic is find out why and make more contend like it.
It does not have to be all about DPS but without it there will be very small room to make game progression worthwhile for the player. VCE feels like a fair mix here. I like it much as of late.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
And that's just sad. Teamwork has always been way more op than any amount of DPS but everyone wants to solo everything for bragging rights.
People mentioning Tanking CCA's Blast. The mechanics behind that are asinine and completely random. I've had it deal over 100K to me through RSP, the Iconian Shield Generator and the Kobali 4pc reactionary heal.
This was with Council of Thought.
The same goes for Ground. I've got over 1k HP in on the ground / 120 resists and that doesn't stop me from being instanuked in some of the Advanced Maps. Could not even put BHA with full Mk XIV gear (Ico set).
^ that is also my experience with pretty much ALL DPS'ers. Its to the point now where no one will even play with you if you are below a certain amount. So basically all new players and people that don't pay real money for DPS have to fend for themselves which just destroys the community aspect of this game.
I've basically stopped caring, and do my best with what I get. I play this game to have fun. And if my DPS is too low for someone, then I will enjoy the hissyfit they have over it lol