Of course Ideally Cryptic would simply have a Spec deactivation button. We know that isn't going to happen though... from what we have seen of there code through all the bugs I think its safe to say it would be a nightmare to code, and not a simple 5 min thing.
Eh, this would be a great solution but... :rolleyes: cryptic, u know. Btw, nothing forbids us to try to ask devs for a solution like this one. At least a tentative :P
Eh, this would be a great solution but... :rolleyes: cryptic, u know. Btw, nothing forbids us to try to ask devs for a solution like this one. At least a tentative :P
Worth a shot. Probably be no, but it cant hurt to try...
Besides specialisation points, is there anything that affects performance when going from 50 to 60? Or is a lvl 50 equivalent to a lvl 60 without specialisation (when using the same plain T5 gear / ship)?
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Besides specialisation points, is there anything that affects performance when going from 50 to 60? Or is a lvl 50 equivalent to a lvl 60 without specialisation (when using the same plain T5 gear / ship)?
Its all about the spec stuff. For pvp though I have a feeling that it will mostly wash out... at least I'm hoping. There are a ton of defense bonuses ... but there is also a ton of offensive bonuses. They add up to the difference between being able to do higher end PvE or not though. Which is why I say asking new players to skip it is asking a lot it pretty much means never doing anything other then normal mod PvE Ques... being complained about in Advanced... and a pure troll if they try E mode.
I don't know not sure how many new new players are going to be popping by for any pvp anyway. Not to sound negative... just saying pehraps the one clean vPvP toon isn't the end of the world. Another down side of courese is people not really being flexable where they can jump in a healer or something instead to even up sides.
If the spec grind was allowed, it would mean the introduction of an inescapable timegate on VPvP. And I really don't like substantial timegating. If some old friend comes back and needs a couple million to set up a VPvP toon, I can help them out, but if they need to invest several weeks/months then VPvP's entry requirements are not better than "Real PVP".
If the spec grind was allowed, it would mean the introduction of an inescapable timegate on VPvP. And I really don't like substantial timegating. If some old friend comes back and needs a couple million to set up a VPvP toon, I can help them out, but if they need to invest several weeks/months then VPvP's entry requirements are not better than "Real PVP".
That's a good point. I guess people will just have to leave a vanilla toon around. I guess there useful for running contraband missions outside of PvP anyway. lol
They will also have to resist the urge to click any spec point stuff... cause once you do there is no undoing it ever.
If the spec grind was allowed, it would mean the introduction of an inescapable timegate on VPvP. And I really don't like substantial timegating. If some old friend comes back and needs a couple million to set up a VPvP toon, I can help them out, but if they need to invest several weeks/months then VPvP's entry requirements are not better than "Real PVP".
2 things.
1 - its just skill points - you know, those numbers everyone has millions of with no effort what so ever? Those. It is pretty much impossible NOT to max out specialisation points.
And anyway, once you have it is bonus Dil, so the chances are anyone new will want them if only for making PvE take less time.
2 - People were maxing these Specialisations on Day One of DR, so while it is an inescapeable timegate on VPvP, it doesn't actually take that long - it is an extra grind yes, but it will likely be preferred over needing to set aside a spare character.
The major issue is at some point more will be added, but even then, it is only skill points to earn them.
The major issue is at some point more will be added, but even then, it is only skill points to earn them.
That's yet another problem. If we allow specializations now, we have no idea what could be done with them in the future. In a year, we could be up to our neck in added stats and clickies from them.
That's yet another problem. If we allow specializations now, we have no idea what could be done with them in the future. In a year, we could be up to our neck in added stats and clickies from them.
Same as Rep Traits probably. Not that it would take 40 days to level up enough to get however many specialisations they do.
It really is a damned if we do, damned if we don't.
To me, that means we allow them as it is easier to ask "You will need to get all these little bonuses, which will also help in every other bit of STO you do, reward you a little Dilithium, and which you have likely started on already, in order to do VPvP" Than it is to say "You will need to dedicate a character to VPvP, as we don't allow Specialisation traits" (a reasonable assumption being someone may well already earn some by the time they want to do VPvP.)
It is power creep, and it is quite annoying, but at least it is free power creep available to everyone just by playing STO, based on a resource you can easily accumulate millions of.
Same as Rep Traits probably. Not that it would take 40 days to level up enough to get however many specialisations they do.
It really is a damned if we do, damned if we don't.
To me, that means we allow them as it is easier to ask "You will need to get all these little bonuses, which will also help in every other bit of STO you do, reward you a little Dilithium, and which you have likely started on already, in order to do VPvP" Than it is to say "You will need to dedicate a character to VPvP, as we don't allow Specialisation traits" (a reasonable assumption being someone may well already earn some by the time they want to do VPvP.)
It is power creep, and it is quite annoying, but at least it is free power creep available to everyone just by playing STO, based on a resource you can easily accumulate millions of.
As others have pointed out it's time gated powercreep w/no end to it in site. They aren't that insignificant either, anti-movement debuffs would allow for higher defenses even if just slowed and not at a full stop, resists when shield facing drops, regen rate boosts when shield facing drops aren't small when considering shields mitigate torps and resists boost all repairs including those from allies. This doesn't even cover offensive ones.
Imo, it's better just have toons which don't require investment time for upkeep and keep time gated powers out of it. Technically all reps are "free" power creep as well.
[Zone] Dack@****: cowards can't take a fed 1 on 1 crinckley cowards Hahahaha you smell like flowers
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
As others have pointed out it's time gated powercreep w/no end to it in site. They aren't that insignificant either, anti-movement debuffs would allow for higher defenses even if just slowed and not at a full stop, resists when shield facing drops, regen rate boosts when shield facing drops aren't small when considering shields mitigate torps and resists boost all repairs including those from allies. This doesn't even cover offensive ones.
Imo, it's better just have toons which don't require investment time for upkeep and keep time gated powers out of it. Technically all reps are "free" power creep as well.
I never said it was not significant, or that it didn't have an end in sight - I am saying we need to look at the wider picture.
For new players and current players, if we ban it we will have to tell new people they will need to create a brand new character for VPvP, who will have a harder time in PvE and who will never be competitive in normal PvP.
Or, we can tell them that they will need to finish a grind that they were going to do anyway, and will probably have already started by the time they learn about VPvP - I played STO for a good 5 or 6 months by the time I even worked out PvP existed in STO, let alone that I might actually try it.
It is a bad situation, but enforcing no Specialisations is the worse course of action in my view.
I never said it was not significant, or that it didn't have an end in sight - I am saying we need to look at the wider picture.
For new players and current players, if we ban it we will have to tell new people they will need to create a brand new character for VPvP, who will have a harder time in PvE and who will never be competitive in normal PvP.
Or, we can tell them that they will need to finish a grind that they were going to do anyway, and will probably have already started by the time they learn about VPvP - I played STO for a good 5 or 6 months by the time I even worked out PvP existed in STO, let alone that I might actually try it.
It is a bad situation, but enforcing no Specialisations is the worse course of action in my view.
"You will need to get all these little bonuses, which will also help in every other bit of STO you do"
I took the above portion to be dismissive as of the powers' impact. Seriously, that stuff is significant. Imo, the movement bonuses/abilities alone would decide most escort fights, ala Bug ships.
Regarding new players and VPvP toons:
They could utilize ground focused toons regarding the new system and stay out of space stuff (they could avoid they 2ndary space on altogether), use an item mule, use a doff alt, use an off faction alt for playing the market, or use a test alt for learning how Captain's/factions that's not their main really play. I'm sure there are other reasons, but I don't think it's that big a deal.
Really how long does it take to get to level 50 anyway, 2 weeks casually or a weekend if they Rush? For a couple of million ECs they can buy a mirror ship and fit it. Then spend a couple million more over time to get slightly better gear if they want (or run some Story line missions that level 50-60 can easily do even now). After that there would be zero investment into the toon assuming Cryptic's mechanics stay as they are for the near future.
Tbh, this is a Pandora's box.
[Zone] Dack@****: cowards can't take a fed 1 on 1 crinckley cowards Hahahaha you smell like flowers
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
You both have perfectly legitimate points and I can honestly not say which is the better side. p2wsucks has a good point with this being a Pandora's box. If we open it up, there is no way to put it all back inside. But cbrjwrr also has a good point in that everyone will get it easily by doing anything.
I'd like to hear everyone's (and anyone's) opinion on this.
I could argue more, but really, this, exactly. It is a pain. (and little was just a throwaway line)
We are pretty much at the point where everyone who PvPs now knows about VPvP, and has decided whether to take part or not. Some are not, but I would say between a third to a half of current PvPers are interested - we will now be looking at new players or PvE players coming into PvP for the future, and they will be bringing at least some use of post lvl 60 content.
I suspect they would rather do a skill point grind on their main than do a skill point grind on a new character.
Well everyone will have to face facts that 60 is the new 50.
Those that come with it will be like standard XP points of before DR.
IMHO only way to keep things going.
The thing is it will NOT stop at 60 though.
"As mentioned earlier, we look forward to putting out additional Specializations alongside future updates. Our hope with this system is to revitalize the high-end content of the game by introducing new progression options for all players that can continue to feel rewarding long after levels have stopped being earned. We hope that this newfound sense of endless progression can simultaneously grant each player the opportunity to explore different choices as they continue to earn progress.
Although only a single Primary Specialization will be included with Delta Rising, we have already begun laying the ground work for an additional Primary Specialization to be released with an upcoming update. Future updates may also result in the conversion of an existing Secondary Specialization into a Primary Specialization, expanded to include additional progression options within that specialization."
At this point I'll stay out of it, but want to make sure everyone gets this thing will be a massive time gated power creep.
[Zone] Dack@****: cowards can't take a fed 1 on 1 crinckley cowards Hahahaha you smell like flowers
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
That's just more depressing and not surprising at the same time.
Its a good thing for vPvP though... they aren't adding more stuff just more options. You can only have one primary and one secondary active. So if they add another primary it won't be MORE stuff it will be a second option.
I say it will be good cause new players coming in can select which ever to grind. If a new player happens to jump in just as a new tree hits that people want to use they will be = to the vets that are starting in on that tree.
I don't really see an issue with them adding new trees to infinity... as long as they don't at some point decide to let you activate a third tree or something stupid.
Looking at the way rep works for instance... a new player right now (not counting new delta) can be ready to go in around 2 weeks really... they CAN go crazy and grind every rep... but they don't have to. As long as they unlock 4 rep traits at level 2 that fit there build there pretty much good to go not counting possible rep gear. If they use fleet gear though + 4 level 2 reps its really not long at all to get a toon up to 50 Par. The new 60 stuff... from what I am seeing it doesn't take all that long to max it out if you really want to either.
If the spec grind was allowed, it would mean the introduction of an inescapable timegate on VPvP. And I really don't like substantial timegating. If some old friend comes back and needs a couple million to set up a VPvP toon, I can help them out, but if they need to invest several weeks/months then VPvP's entry requirements are not better than "Real PVP".
That's correct, but in the other hand, if i have to do a new char just for leave it without spec points, it will require a considerable amount of time for me.
Is a dead end, i think we can get rid of the secondary spec tree just be selecting a ground one (i believe there can be 2 secondary trees active at a given time, when they add more, we could have 2 ground trees for set as active), but there is no way of get rid of the primary tree (witch is a mix of space and ground)
The new 60 stuff... from what I am seeing it doesn't take all that long to max it out if you really want to either.
maybe not for players that have many alts for grind (like most of us), but for a new player which can only refine 8k daily (and probably can't grind too much EC yet), is really hard
maybe not for players that have many alts for grind (like most of us), but for a new player which can only refine 8k daily (and probably can't grind too much EC yet), is really hard
Wasn't really talking about the MK 14 gold upgrade D sink.
Was talking more about the spec points. Even a toon in a mirror with mission weapons can spend a day farming japory and complete half or more of the spec tree.
For vPvP we assume people wills till be using the lower tier ships and weapons. Simply not asking new players to not spend there spec points. That person with one toon... asking them to never again do or try to do any high end pve so they can compete in vPvP is a bit much.
So one option is to have everybody to grind up all their VPvP toons, possibly again and again when new specialisations with better abilities appear. And this bears the risk of harming the VPvP gameplay by introducing some level of powercreep.
The other option is to have players keep one character (or three, if you want all careers) without spec points (or create such a character, if you really only have one character). Instead of a possibly recurring grind this is a one-time effort that most older players with multiple toons have already completed. The only people who might actually need to do something extra are new F2Pers who don't have the alts and/or the character slots.
(And character slots are actually a non-issue, because one could simply create a second F2P account. Since everything C-Store related is banned in VPvP, one doesn't lose anything by using a second account without the unlocks.)
I have absolutely no desire to grind my VPvP toons up to 60. And leveling through PVP dailies that complete via VPvP matches is most likely not even remotely fast enough to be relevant.
Perhaps we can try a test. We can get five people with VPvP alts that don't have specs to fight five people with characters that do have specs stripped down to VPvP rules. We might be able to see how much a difference it makes. If over the course of say five matches the spec team wins every time, we'll know that if allowed specs will be necessary. If it's a mixed bag, then it might be okay.
We'd have to do several matches to know for certain though. I still can't get into the game so someone else would need to organize it.
Opposite way round - anyone new to VPvP now will be using characters who've started or are midway through, possibly even finished, these specialisations - Some people were Fleet Admirals on day one of DR, and a lot of players are now maxing this first specialisation set out.
Oh and another thing. If any admin/op wants, I can take the photoshop file of my signature and swap out the bear for another Five Nights at Freddy's animatronic and you'll have your very own VPvP sig picture. Why the animatronics? Because it'll match my sig of course.
I'm looking at you two, Gio and Cbr, you have no sig pics. :rolleyes:
Perhaps we can try a test. We can get five people with VPvP alts that don't have specs to fight five people with characters that do have specs stripped down to VPvP rules. We might be able to see how much a difference it makes. If over the course of say five matches the spec team wins every time, we'll know that if allowed specs will be necessary. If it's a mixed bag, then it might be okay.
We'd have to do several matches to know for certain though. I still can't get into the game so someone else would need to organize it.
The spec team will win every time. That isn't really the point.
Yes the spec is obviously better then no spec. Of course a team of 5 of them is going to roll a team with nothing spent.
Not really the question. The question is can you still attract a good number of people asking them to abandon a toon 10 levels short of the cap unable to do anything else at all accept be a bank/exchange/vpvp toon.
My concern is others have tried to start T4/T3 leagues ect back when T5 was end game and they all died cause no one really wants to leave a toon unable to do anything else.
Yes most of us vets have toons we could abandon like that I know I do... I have plenty that I have just reduced to bank status cause the game is just to much grind to support them anymore. I am just not sure asking new players to abandon toons that early is going to really work.
I guess there is also the option of just having people declare if there spec or non spec. Run 2 types of games... not sure how that would end either.
On one hand I agree with mancom and it would be great to keep it out completely... on the other hand I remember all those previous low level projects that all died.
Well if it is true that they're coming out with more of these, and that space secondaries can be switched off for ground, perhaps we can reach a sort of bad, but not that bad compromise. As someone earlier pointed out, we could have the space secondaries banned when another primary comes out and then we have only a few things to specs with.
I really wish we could find Bort or someone and ask them to put in a switch off option just for us.
Gio and I went over the primary specialization stuff. The only worrying ones were the +15% Crit damage and +5% crit chance buffs. It looks like the space secondary can be turned off at any time, so that's not a problem. I also put in a good word with a certain higher-up for a turn-off button for VPvP.
The primary specs, from what I see, and excluding the active powers, don't look too terribly bad. But then there's also still the need to grind them out, which puts a timegate on entering VPvP.
Comments
Yep - that's the bit that makes it less objectionable...
Worth a shot. Probably be no, but it cant hurt to try...
I might say to hell with it, if I could access the game and review the traits, and change the message of the day.
Edit: If either one of you wants to try to find a dev and ask him, good luck.
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Its all about the spec stuff. For pvp though I have a feeling that it will mostly wash out... at least I'm hoping. There are a ton of defense bonuses ... but there is also a ton of offensive bonuses. They add up to the difference between being able to do higher end PvE or not though. Which is why I say asking new players to skip it is asking a lot it pretty much means never doing anything other then normal mod PvE Ques... being complained about in Advanced... and a pure troll if they try E mode.
I don't know not sure how many new new players are going to be popping by for any pvp anyway. Not to sound negative... just saying pehraps the one clean vPvP toon isn't the end of the world. Another down side of courese is people not really being flexable where they can jump in a healer or something instead to even up sides.
That's a good point. I guess people will just have to leave a vanilla toon around. I guess there useful for running contraband missions outside of PvP anyway. lol
They will also have to resist the urge to click any spec point stuff... cause once you do there is no undoing it ever.
2 things.
1 - its just skill points - you know, those numbers everyone has millions of with no effort what so ever? Those. It is pretty much impossible NOT to max out specialisation points.
And anyway, once you have it is bonus Dil, so the chances are anyone new will want them if only for making PvE take less time.
2 - People were maxing these Specialisations on Day One of DR, so while it is an inescapeable timegate on VPvP, it doesn't actually take that long - it is an extra grind yes, but it will likely be preferred over needing to set aside a spare character.
The major issue is at some point more will be added, but even then, it is only skill points to earn them.
That's yet another problem. If we allow specializations now, we have no idea what could be done with them in the future. In a year, we could be up to our neck in added stats and clickies from them.
Same as Rep Traits probably. Not that it would take 40 days to level up enough to get however many specialisations they do.
It really is a damned if we do, damned if we don't.
To me, that means we allow them as it is easier to ask "You will need to get all these little bonuses, which will also help in every other bit of STO you do, reward you a little Dilithium, and which you have likely started on already, in order to do VPvP" Than it is to say "You will need to dedicate a character to VPvP, as we don't allow Specialisation traits" (a reasonable assumption being someone may well already earn some by the time they want to do VPvP.)
It is power creep, and it is quite annoying, but at least it is free power creep available to everyone just by playing STO, based on a resource you can easily accumulate millions of.
As others have pointed out it's time gated powercreep w/no end to it in site. They aren't that insignificant either, anti-movement debuffs would allow for higher defenses even if just slowed and not at a full stop, resists when shield facing drops, regen rate boosts when shield facing drops aren't small when considering shields mitigate torps and resists boost all repairs including those from allies. This doesn't even cover offensive ones.
Imo, it's better just have toons which don't require investment time for upkeep and keep time gated powers out of it. Technically all reps are "free" power creep as well.
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
I never said it was not significant, or that it didn't have an end in sight - I am saying we need to look at the wider picture.
For new players and current players, if we ban it we will have to tell new people they will need to create a brand new character for VPvP, who will have a harder time in PvE and who will never be competitive in normal PvP.
Or, we can tell them that they will need to finish a grind that they were going to do anyway, and will probably have already started by the time they learn about VPvP - I played STO for a good 5 or 6 months by the time I even worked out PvP existed in STO, let alone that I might actually try it.
It is a bad situation, but enforcing no Specialisations is the worse course of action in my view.
"You will need to get all these little bonuses, which will also help in every other bit of STO you do"
I took the above portion to be dismissive as of the powers' impact. Seriously, that stuff is significant. Imo, the movement bonuses/abilities alone would decide most escort fights, ala Bug ships.
Regarding new players and VPvP toons:
They could utilize ground focused toons regarding the new system and stay out of space stuff (they could avoid they 2ndary space on altogether), use an item mule, use a doff alt, use an off faction alt for playing the market, or use a test alt for learning how Captain's/factions that's not their main really play. I'm sure there are other reasons, but I don't think it's that big a deal.
Really how long does it take to get to level 50 anyway, 2 weeks casually or a weekend if they Rush? For a couple of million ECs they can buy a mirror ship and fit it. Then spend a couple million more over time to get slightly better gear if they want (or run some Story line missions that level 50-60 can easily do even now). After that there would be zero investment into the toon assuming Cryptic's mechanics stay as they are for the near future.
Tbh, this is a Pandora's box.
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
I'd like to hear everyone's (and anyone's) opinion on this.
I could argue more, but really, this, exactly. It is a pain. (and little was just a throwaway line)
We are pretty much at the point where everyone who PvPs now knows about VPvP, and has decided whether to take part or not. Some are not, but I would say between a third to a half of current PvPers are interested - we will now be looking at new players or PvE players coming into PvP for the future, and they will be bringing at least some use of post lvl 60 content.
I suspect they would rather do a skill point grind on their main than do a skill point grind on a new character.
The thing is it will NOT stop at 60 though.
"As mentioned earlier, we look forward to putting out additional Specializations alongside future updates. Our hope with this system is to revitalize the high-end content of the game by introducing new progression options for all players that can continue to feel rewarding long after levels have stopped being earned. We hope that this newfound sense of endless progression can simultaneously grant each player the opportunity to explore different choices as they continue to earn progress.
Although only a single Primary Specialization will be included with Delta Rising, we have already begun laying the ground work for an additional Primary Specialization to be released with an upcoming update. Future updates may also result in the conversion of an existing Secondary Specialization into a Primary Specialization, expanded to include additional progression options within that specialization."
http://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/7007273
At this point I'll stay out of it, but want to make sure everyone gets this thing will be a massive time gated power creep.
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
Its a good thing for vPvP though... they aren't adding more stuff just more options. You can only have one primary and one secondary active. So if they add another primary it won't be MORE stuff it will be a second option.
I say it will be good cause new players coming in can select which ever to grind. If a new player happens to jump in just as a new tree hits that people want to use they will be = to the vets that are starting in on that tree.
I don't really see an issue with them adding new trees to infinity... as long as they don't at some point decide to let you activate a third tree or something stupid.
Looking at the way rep works for instance... a new player right now (not counting new delta) can be ready to go in around 2 weeks really... they CAN go crazy and grind every rep... but they don't have to. As long as they unlock 4 rep traits at level 2 that fit there build there pretty much good to go not counting possible rep gear. If they use fleet gear though + 4 level 2 reps its really not long at all to get a toon up to 50 Par. The new 60 stuff... from what I am seeing it doesn't take all that long to max it out if you really want to either.
That's correct, but in the other hand, if i have to do a new char just for leave it without spec points, it will require a considerable amount of time for me.
Is a dead end, i think we can get rid of the secondary spec tree just be selecting a ground one (i believe there can be 2 secondary trees active at a given time, when they add more, we could have 2 ground trees for set as active), but there is no way of get rid of the primary tree (witch is a mix of space and ground)
maybe not for players that have many alts for grind (like most of us), but for a new player which can only refine 8k daily (and probably can't grind too much EC yet), is really hard
Vin Naftero@playhard88 - FED Sciencie
K'tan@playhard88 - KDF Tactical
Argento@playhard88 - RRF Tactical (FED)
Wasn't really talking about the MK 14 gold upgrade D sink.
Was talking more about the spec points. Even a toon in a mirror with mission weapons can spend a day farming japory and complete half or more of the spec tree.
For vPvP we assume people wills till be using the lower tier ships and weapons. Simply not asking new players to not spend there spec points. That person with one toon... asking them to never again do or try to do any high end pve so they can compete in vPvP is a bit much.
The other option is to have players keep one character (or three, if you want all careers) without spec points (or create such a character, if you really only have one character). Instead of a possibly recurring grind this is a one-time effort that most older players with multiple toons have already completed. The only people who might actually need to do something extra are new F2Pers who don't have the alts and/or the character slots.
(And character slots are actually a non-issue, because one could simply create a second F2P account. Since everything C-Store related is banned in VPvP, one doesn't lose anything by using a second account without the unlocks.)
I have absolutely no desire to grind my VPvP toons up to 60. And leveling through PVP dailies that complete via VPvP matches is most likely not even remotely fast enough to be relevant.
We'd have to do several matches to know for certain though. I still can't get into the game so someone else would need to organize it.
I'm looking at you two, Gio and Cbr, you have no sig pics. :rolleyes:
The spec team will win every time. That isn't really the point.
Yes the spec is obviously better then no spec. Of course a team of 5 of them is going to roll a team with nothing spent.
Not really the question. The question is can you still attract a good number of people asking them to abandon a toon 10 levels short of the cap unable to do anything else at all accept be a bank/exchange/vpvp toon.
My concern is others have tried to start T4/T3 leagues ect back when T5 was end game and they all died cause no one really wants to leave a toon unable to do anything else.
Yes most of us vets have toons we could abandon like that I know I do... I have plenty that I have just reduced to bank status cause the game is just to much grind to support them anymore. I am just not sure asking new players to abandon toons that early is going to really work.
I guess there is also the option of just having people declare if there spec or non spec. Run 2 types of games... not sure how that would end either.
On one hand I agree with mancom and it would be great to keep it out completely... on the other hand I remember all those previous low level projects that all died.
I really wish we could find Bort or someone and ask them to put in a switch off option just for us.
The primary specs, from what I see, and excluding the active powers, don't look too terribly bad. But then there's also still the need to grind them out, which puts a timegate on entering VPvP.
Just logging on now to say goodbye to Fleetmates - not much stuff to give away, so don't bother asking...