no, saying that some blue guy shouldn't command the enterprise is racist...
I never said that he shouldn't command the Enterprise because he is blue. Stop making things up. I said SOME blue guy shouldn't be commanding the Enterprise because he is not the best character to do it, given the availability of canon characters who have been established as Captains of the Enterprise already.
Think of it as not picking the best man for the job.
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You just said it again... I'm not making things up, you just keep saying it... it's the same as me saying "Some black guy shouldn't be the president of the states because he's not the best guy to do it."
I never said that he shouldn't command the Enterprise because he is blue. Stop making things up. I said SOME blue guy shouldn't be commanding the Enterprise because he is not the best character to do it, given the availability of canon characters who have been established as Captains of the Enterprise already.
Think of it as not picking the best man for the job.
And it's already been answered. Cryptic isn't going to throw away money on spiner just because he thinks he's special and deserves more then other st actors. Heck, if we just want to pee away money why not bring picard out of retirement for the F? Sir patrick makes far more then spiner.
I never said that he shouldn't command the Enterprise because he is blue. Stop making things up. I said SOME blue guy shouldn't be commanding the Enterprise because he is not the best character to do it, given the availability of canon characters who have been established as Captains of the Enterprise already.
Think of it as not picking the best man for the job.
'Some blue guy' still implies it, dude
And 'not best for the job' is no valid reason to stop Shon (or anyone else) from having the position
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
You just said it again... I'm not making things up, you just keep saying it... it's the same as me saying "Some black guy shouldn't be the president of the states because he's not the best guy to do it."
Yes, you are making things up.
Your analogy is also false, as Andorians do not exist. A more correct statement should be "Horses with horns on their heads should not be allowed to race in the Kentucky Derby". Besides...describing him based on a physical attribute is not racist either. Would it be racist if I said "some guy with antennas on his head"? What if I didn't know his name? What then? What do I say then? See how your argument falls apart when you apply logic?
But this is all besides the point, and you are changing the topic. Stay on topic. The question remains - Why should some GUY with no history and established character be given precedence over Data when Data was already Captain of the Enterprise?
And 'not best for the job' is no valid reason to stop Shon (or anyone else) from having the position
Yes...that is a very valid reason to stop someone from having a job. If they are not the best person, they should not have the job. Should we hire Medical officers to serve as a security detail for Admirals? Should we hire bar maids to wire up electrical wiring? Should we hire someone with a degree in Political science to fill the position of a programmer or System admin?
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...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
it's still racist and you made a racist comment. Even if it's of a fictional character it is still racist. The fact you don't seem to understand that, is just sad...
Now, Captain Data was already the commander. He was promoted, or retired, or whatever... either way, he said he's moving on.
Shron is the replacement. He seems to be an able commander.
it's still racist and you made a racist comment. Even if it's of a fictional character it is still racist. The fact you don't seem to understand that, is just sad...
Now, Captain Data was already the commander. He was promoted, or retired, or whatever... either way, he said he's moving on.
Shron is the replacement. He seems to be an able commander.
But it wasn't a racist comment, as it was not done with malice. I simply describe him by a physical attribute. Is it racist to say "That guy with the blond hair" or "that woman with the brown eyes"? No. Stop drawing false conclusions.
And you have yet to explain WHY he is a better replacement than Data. In the strictest sense of the Lore, Data is better, and it gives STO more credibility.
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But this is all besides the point, and you are changing the topic. Stay on topic. The question remains - Why should some GUY with no history and established character be given precedence over Data when Data was already Captain of the Enterprise?
Everyone's an unknown until you get to know them. Picard was a captain who was never given a good ship until he got the enterprise D, after serving on a crappy constellation for 25 years. He went from flying the worst ship to flying the best. There's probably hundreds of other captains who though they were more worthy to get a galaxy.
In game canon reason: Data was missing and so they assigned Shon. Real life reason: Spiner is too expensive.
Your analogy is also false, as Andorians do not exist. A more correct statement should be "Horses with horns on their heads should not be allowed to race in the Kentucky Derby". Besides...describing him based on a physical attribute is not racist either. Would it be racist if I said "some guy with antennas on his head"? What if I didn't know his name? What then? What do I say then? See how your argument falls apart when you apply logic?
But this is all besides the point, and you are changing the topic. Stay on topic. The question remains - Why should some GUY with no history and established character be given precedence over Data when Data was already Captain of the Enterprise?
The simple answer is reality; getting Brent Spinner's likeness costs too much for too little gain. Thus, it is better to use a new character, as every other canon character is either too old (such as Picard) or too far unlikely to go into Command, much less the Enterprise-F (like Harry Kim). Not to mention the already-released official story established his captaincy
And actually no, saying " 'he's not best for the job' is valid" isn't; it's like saying someone isn't allowed to play soccer just because they're not champion-leaque. And in either case, Shon has commanded the Belfast before the Enterprise-F, so he does have experience, and thus he is able enough to command the flagship
And malice or not, your comments are still being intrepreted as racist (because believe it or not, your phrasing is borderline racist, if not over it)
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Although Shon isn't one of my favorite main characters in this game and his character being poorly voice acted doesn't help. If any main STO character needs to die and quick, it's Tovan!
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1. Didn't data retire after bringing the Enterprise E home?
2. Shon paid the iron price for command of the Enterprise F
3. If data didn't retire he'd be an Admiral by now so really not able to command the Enterprise since that is usually given to a Captain, means even Data isn't capable of commanding the Enterprise.
4. Shon is the second alien to command enterprise since Spock did command enterprise inbetween the events of 1 and 2.
Honestly I do not get the hate that Shon gets for being in command. He's doing just fine, leave him there.
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Although Shon isn't one of my favorite main characters in this game and his character being poorly voice acted doesn't help. If any main STO character needs to die and quick, it's Tovan!
Tovan is way better. Better voice actor and much more important.
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My only complaint with Shon is we really don't know him that well. All we really know from in game is he's more of a tactical character, he commanded the Belfast, and he feels honored to command the Big E.
What tiny sliver of a bit extra we know about him, you have to buy Star Trek Magazine to find out.
Every time we do see him in game, he's just kind of there, tagging along with you. Cryptic really needs to work on fleshing him out as a person, but I somehow doubt they'll put in the effort, given how lite on story we've been for awhile.
1. Data is retired or promoted. He rejected command of the Enterprise
2. Shron is an experienced battle commander and a soldier. That's why he's suited for the flagship in a time of war. Kirk was a soldier, he got the Enterprise. Picard was a diplomat, in a time of peace... he got the Enterprise (but he was also a brilliant strategic who devised a way to use warp to confuse the enemy). Command of the Enterprise is given to the best Captain for that time and for the needs of that time.
1. Didn't data retire after bringing the Enterprise E home?
2. Shon paid the iron price for command of the Enterprise F
3. If data didn't retire he'd be an Admiral by now so really not able to command the Enterprise since that is usually given to a Captain, means even Data isn't capable of commanding the Enterprise.
4. Shon is the second alien to command enterprise since Spock did command enterprise inbetween the events of 1 and 2.
Honestly I do not get the hate that Shon gets for being in command. He's doing just fine, leave him there.
I am unsure what happened to Data. I assume he is still alive.
But Shon is just so Boring. He is a terrible character, hardly worthy of a name to call him beyond "That NPC". He doesn't deserve the Enterprise. Lets look at the previous Captains
1. Kirk: That speaks for itself.
2. Picard: Accomplish diplomat, visionary, forward thinking, rational, practical, Thespian actor, Owner of the Kurlan Naiskos, Expert on The Borg.
3. Riker (for a time): Defeated the Borg in Sector 001, saved Earth and Starfleet from assimilation, saved Picard from The Borg.
4. Data: Saved Earth from Shinzon, Stopped the Romulans from getting supplies to the Duras family
5. Dr. Crusher (for two episodes): Battled the Borg, used her experience from a previous episode to destroy a Borg ship, saved 900 members of the Enterprise-D crew from that planet in the Delta Quadrant.
Now...
6. Shon: Got a Defiant Class Starship destroyed at the hands of a JHAS that was piloted by an NPC.
Shon sucks. Beverly Crusher was a better Capptain...and she was a Commander AND a Doctor...
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I am unsure what happened to Data. I assume he is still alive.
But Shon is just so Boring. He is a terrible character, hardly worthy of a name to call him beyond "That NPC". He doesn't deserve the Enterprise. Lets look at the previous Captains
1. Kirk: That speaks for itself.
2. Picard: Accomplish diplomat, visionary, forward thinking, rational, practical, Thespian actor, Owner of the Kurlan Naiskos, Expert on The Borg.
3. Riker (for a time): Defeated the Borg in Sector 001, saved Earth and Starfleet from assimilation, saved Picard from The Borg.
4. Data: Saved Earth from Shinzon, Stopped the Romulans from getting supplies to the Duras family
5. Dr. Crusher (for two episodes): Battled the Borg, used her experience from a previous episode to destroy a Borg ship, saved 900 members of the Enterprise-D crew from that planet in the Delta Quadrant.
Now...
6. Shon: Got a Defiant Class Starship destroyed at the hands of a JHAS that was piloted by an NPC.
Shon sucks. Beverly Crusher was a better Capptain...and she was a Commander AND a Doctor...
Are you already forgetting that he commanded the Belfast for a time BEFORE it was destroyed?
And even ignoring that, he helped the FE Battle for DS9 in the Enterprise-F, literally piloted the Obelisk in Sphere of Influence (and thus tactically helped drive back an Elachi Fleet), arrived to help fight against the Undine incursion in the Jelonan Dyson Sphere (if playing Fed/Fed-aligned characters, otherwise it's Koren), and helped out in distress calls for the Tau Dewa sector...
Do I go on? Because your argument's validness is flimsy enough as is imo
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
6. Shon: Got a Defiant Class Starship destroyed at the hands of a JHAS that was piloted by an NPC.
Picard got the stargazer destroyed at the hands of an npc. Riker got the enterprise D destroyed at the hands of an npc. The defiant was destroyed by an npc in the second battle of chintoka. What's your point?
Are you already forgetting that he commanded the Belfast for a time BEFORE it was destroyed?
And even forgetting that, he helped the FE Battle for DS9 in the Enterprise-F, literally piloted the Obelisk in Sphere of Influence (and thus tactically helped drive back an Elachi Fleet), arrived to help fight against the Undine incursion in the Jelonan Dyson Sphere (if playing Fed/Fed-aligned characters, otherwise it's Koren), and helped out in distress calls in the Tau Dewa sector...
Do I go on? Because your argument's validness is flimsy enough as is imo
Picard, Kirk, and Data also responded to distress calls. They responded to distress calls that involved: The Borg, Planet Killers and the KDF.
So answering one distress call in the Tua Dewa makes him qualified?
Shon has done nothing impressive in this game or in the lore. He does not deserve the Flagship. The Enterprise is considered the greatest ship in the history of Starfleet. It is crewed and commanded by the best of the best and the brightest of the bright. Shon is neither of these.
Data, on the other hand...WAY better than SHon.
I realize Spiner ain't cheap...but seriously...they should at least make the effort. Take out a loan or put him on a payment plan. Make the effort beyond not at all to try and get Spiner on-board.
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My only complaint with Shon is we really don't know him that well. All we really know from in game is he's more of a tactical character, he commanded the Belfast, and he feels honored to command the Big E.
What tiny sliver of a bit extra we know about him, you have to buy Star Trek Magazine to find out.
Every time we do see him in game, he's just kind of there, tagging along with you. Cryptic really needs to work on fleshing him out as a person, but I somehow doubt they'll put in the effort, given how lite on story we've been for awhile.
He and the Ent-F crew get fleshed out in the stories Kestral writes in Star Trek Magazine, but not many of us apparently read that (myself included).
What they ought to do is put the ST Magazine short stories featuring the Enterprise crew into the C-Store as a pack of e-books or something, or make a book like the Star Wars EU did with several groups of Star Wars Adventure Journal stories back in the '90s.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Picard, Kirk, and Data also responded to distress calls. They responded to distress calls that involved: The Borg, Planet Killers and the KDF.
So answering one distress call in the Tua Dewa makes him qualified?
Shon has done nothing impressive in this game or in the lore. He does not deserve the Flagship. The Enterprise is considered the greatest ship in the history of Starfleet. It is crewed and commanded by the best of the best and the brightest of the bright. Shon is neither of these.
Data, on the other hand...WAY better than SHon.
I realize Spiner ain't cheap...but seriously...they should at least make the effort. Take out a loan or put him on a payment plan. Make the effort beyond not at all to try and get Spiner on-board.
If you've done the Tau Dewa dailies by the dozen's, it's not one time (and the story doesn't consider it one time either).
I'm serious; you're just looking for reasons to hate him, and mostly ignoring fair arguments and points about him (which does not reflect well on you, even more than you've already accomplished)
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Real question is... who would you rather have as Captain of the Enterprise, Shon or Wesley Crusher?
Wesley. At least he did some cool stuff...like...Static Warp Bubbles and chilling with The Traveler. He also was doing Star Trek Insurrection stuff with Native Americans before it Picard did it with the Baku. He actually had more foresight than Picard did.
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I realize Spiner ain't cheap...but seriously...they should at least make the effort. Take out a loan or put him on a payment plan. Make the effort beyond not at all to try and get Spiner on-board.
Oh, I get it now. You're a spiner fanboy!
Yes, let's fire 4 or 5 devs just so we can pay spiner to have Data captain a ship we see in the game for all of 15 minutes all missions combined. Makes perfect sense now.
Yes, let's fire 4 or 5 devs just so we can pay spiner to have Data captain a ship we see in the game for all of 15 minutes all missions combined. Makes perfect sense now.
That, or he's trolling us, or he's so single-minded on his opinion that it might seem that way...
I'm not sure which is worse, or even which is the reality anymore
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Y'know what, let's make it fair: Koren shouldn't be the captain of the Bortasqu' because she's a girl. Let's put Worf there instead. And Jarok shouldn't be the captain of the Lleiset because her father worked for the old Romulan Star Empire (I know, I'm totally reaching here). D'Tan should be pulling double duty and piloting it, too! :rolleyes:
Comments
I never said that he shouldn't command the Enterprise because he is blue. Stop making things up. I said SOME blue guy shouldn't be commanding the Enterprise because he is not the best character to do it, given the availability of canon characters who have been established as Captains of the Enterprise already.
Think of it as not picking the best man for the job.
It's like this every season... :rolleyes:
And 'not best for the job' is no valid reason to stop Shon (or anyone else) from having the position
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Yes, you are making things up.
Your analogy is also false, as Andorians do not exist. A more correct statement should be "Horses with horns on their heads should not be allowed to race in the Kentucky Derby". Besides...describing him based on a physical attribute is not racist either. Would it be racist if I said "some guy with antennas on his head"? What if I didn't know his name? What then? What do I say then? See how your argument falls apart when you apply logic?
But this is all besides the point, and you are changing the topic. Stay on topic. The question remains - Why should some GUY with no history and established character be given precedence over Data when Data was already Captain of the Enterprise?
Yes...that is a very valid reason to stop someone from having a job. If they are not the best person, they should not have the job. Should we hire Medical officers to serve as a security detail for Admirals? Should we hire bar maids to wire up electrical wiring? Should we hire someone with a degree in Political science to fill the position of a programmer or System admin?
Yes, yes it is. The race card gets too much play as it is, and would be incredibly dumb to start extending it to species that don't even exist.
I'm fine with it.
Now, Captain Data was already the commander. He was promoted, or retired, or whatever... either way, he said he's moving on.
Shron is the replacement. He seems to be an able commander.
But it wasn't a racist comment, as it was not done with malice. I simply describe him by a physical attribute. Is it racist to say "That guy with the blond hair" or "that woman with the brown eyes"? No. Stop drawing false conclusions.
And you have yet to explain WHY he is a better replacement than Data. In the strictest sense of the Lore, Data is better, and it gives STO more credibility.
In game canon reason: Data was missing and so they assigned Shon. Real life reason: Spiner is too expensive.
And actually no, saying " 'he's not best for the job' is valid" isn't; it's like saying someone isn't allowed to play soccer just because they're not champion-leaque. And in either case, Shon has commanded the Belfast before the Enterprise-F, so he does have experience, and thus he is able enough to command the flagship
And malice or not, your comments are still being intrepreted as racist (because believe it or not, your phrasing is borderline racist, if not over it)
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
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2. Shon paid the iron price for command of the Enterprise F
3. If data didn't retire he'd be an Admiral by now so really not able to command the Enterprise since that is usually given to a Captain, means even Data isn't capable of commanding the Enterprise.
4. Shon is the second alien to command enterprise since Spock did command enterprise inbetween the events of 1 and 2.
Honestly I do not get the hate that Shon gets for being in command. He's doing just fine, leave him there.
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http://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1145998/star-trek-battles-channel-got-canon/p1
Because people need to be angry about anything that doesn't fit with their vision (the only right one) of Star Trek.
Tovan is way better. Better voice actor and much more important.
What tiny sliver of a bit extra we know about him, you have to buy Star Trek Magazine to find out.
Every time we do see him in game, he's just kind of there, tagging along with you. Cryptic really needs to work on fleshing him out as a person, but I somehow doubt they'll put in the effort, given how lite on story we've been for awhile.
1. Data is retired or promoted. He rejected command of the Enterprise
2. Shron is an experienced battle commander and a soldier. That's why he's suited for the flagship in a time of war. Kirk was a soldier, he got the Enterprise. Picard was a diplomat, in a time of peace... he got the Enterprise (but he was also a brilliant strategic who devised a way to use warp to confuse the enemy). Command of the Enterprise is given to the best Captain for that time and for the needs of that time.
I am unsure what happened to Data. I assume he is still alive.
But Shon is just so Boring. He is a terrible character, hardly worthy of a name to call him beyond "That NPC". He doesn't deserve the Enterprise. Lets look at the previous Captains
1. Kirk: That speaks for itself.
2. Picard: Accomplish diplomat, visionary, forward thinking, rational, practical, Thespian actor, Owner of the Kurlan Naiskos, Expert on The Borg.
3. Riker (for a time): Defeated the Borg in Sector 001, saved Earth and Starfleet from assimilation, saved Picard from The Borg.
4. Data: Saved Earth from Shinzon, Stopped the Romulans from getting supplies to the Duras family
5. Dr. Crusher (for two episodes): Battled the Borg, used her experience from a previous episode to destroy a Borg ship, saved 900 members of the Enterprise-D crew from that planet in the Delta Quadrant.
Now...
6. Shon: Got a Defiant Class Starship destroyed at the hands of a JHAS that was piloted by an NPC.
Shon sucks. Beverly Crusher was a better Capptain...and she was a Commander AND a Doctor...
And even ignoring that, he helped the FE Battle for DS9 in the Enterprise-F, literally piloted the Obelisk in Sphere of Influence (and thus tactically helped drive back an Elachi Fleet), arrived to help fight against the Undine incursion in the Jelonan Dyson Sphere (if playing Fed/Fed-aligned characters, otherwise it's Koren), and helped out in distress calls for the Tau Dewa sector...
Do I go on? Because your argument's validness is flimsy enough as is imo
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Picard, Kirk, and Data also responded to distress calls. They responded to distress calls that involved: The Borg, Planet Killers and the KDF.
So answering one distress call in the Tua Dewa makes him qualified?
Shon has done nothing impressive in this game or in the lore. He does not deserve the Flagship. The Enterprise is considered the greatest ship in the history of Starfleet. It is crewed and commanded by the best of the best and the brightest of the bright. Shon is neither of these.
Data, on the other hand...WAY better than SHon.
I realize Spiner ain't cheap...but seriously...they should at least make the effort. Take out a loan or put him on a payment plan. Make the effort beyond not at all to try and get Spiner on-board.
What they ought to do is put the ST Magazine short stories featuring the Enterprise crew into the C-Store as a pack of e-books or something, or make a book like the Star Wars EU did with several groups of Star Wars Adventure Journal stories back in the '90s.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
I'm serious; you're just looking for reasons to hate him, and mostly ignoring fair arguments and points about him (which does not reflect well on you, even more than you've already accomplished)
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Wesley. At least he did some cool stuff...like...Static Warp Bubbles and chilling with The Traveler. He also was doing Star Trek Insurrection stuff with Native Americans before it Picard did it with the Baku. He actually had more foresight than Picard did.
Yes, let's fire 4 or 5 devs just so we can pay spiner to have Data captain a ship we see in the game for all of 15 minutes all missions combined. Makes perfect sense now.
I'm not sure which is worse, or even which is the reality anymore
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.