From the threads on the forum in the last 60 days...
- Marion is OP
- TIF is OP
- Aceton Assimilators are OP
- Escorts are OP
- BO is OP
- DHCs are OP
- BFAW is OP
- BOPs are OP
- Romulans are OP
- Elite Fleet Shields are OP
- Rep is OP
- APA is OP
- APO is OP
- APB is OP
- Everything tactical is OP
- Subnuke is OP
- Tykens Rift is OP
- Drain builds are OP
So... in order to PvP in this game without causing a thread to show up on these forums, one must be in a free level 40 neghvar with an engineer captain specced for cannons, using the 180 degree singles, white base gear, a bunch of biologist duty officers, not a member of a fleet, that has never done the rep system
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
Standard build for farming that is sitll scatter and gravity well.
Not FAW itself...just something out of whack. It's one of those things that almost each time there's been that much NWS spam (been insane since Thursday) - there's usually something borked.
It's one of the ways that folks get things fixed - leak it to the general community, they don't think anything of it - Cryptic addresses the issue.
[System] Link has been on active duty for 415 days, 23 hours, 9 minutes, 16 seconds.
[System] Zelda has been on active duty for 126 days, 11 hours, 51 minutes, 48 seconds.
Your right 12 million in healing.... there is something fishy going on in the game.
I played with them earlier today... nothing fishy going on at all... its simple they have decided (made a choice) to strip there team down to only the most essential of heals and attack things in a different direction.
Whats the issue... you just proved 12 mill in healing still did the job... not sure how this is broken accept for proving the game still has way way way to much healing potential.
You run into a Panda premade where some of the guys are running FAW and they beat you a few times in a row. You start accusing people of using cheese, despite the fact that you're using scramble doffs and other unmentionables. Then you make a nerf FAW thread.
Skip forward a couple days and you run into another Panda premade using the same strategy, get a good 15-10 win out of it, and proceed to be a poor winner about it. At this stage, a logical person should be rethinking the nerf thread he created.
Zelda, you suffer from a reality distortion field. Anything that beats you is broken and needs to be fixed. Anyone that you beat needs to be ridiculed. And you throw accusations around left and right despite using some of the most broken abilities in the game. The cognitive dissonance on display here is mind boggling.
Have to agree with Jorf. Some of the Pandas decided they wanted to try to shake up the meta a little bit. They developed a new strategy based on dmg saturation instead of heal saturation. You can argue all you like if its effective or not... you have obviously lost to it a few times so I would say yes effective. You have proven that it is not in anyway OP as you seem to have scored a win.
Tweek your team accordingly if you saw something you like or don't... really though poor looser and winner about sums it up.
Myself I say hats off to the guys trying to do something different for a change. They have come up with a new effective premade build that doesn't revolve around a bunch of broken consoles and sets.
Perhaps the lesson people should be taking away from what they have been trying to pull off. Pressure dmg is NOT dead at all. Pay attention to what they are doing with there targeting, and how they are complementing each others builds. To often people are willing to go with the flow... if you have read this far... When is the last time you tried to honestly tweak a team pressure build ? Have you considered how to apply that pressure ? .... Or did you give up when you heard someone tell you pressure is dead don't even bother.
You run into a Panda premade where some of the guys are running FAW and they beat you a few times in a row. You start accusing people of using cheese, despite the fact that you're using scramble doffs and other unmentionables. Then you make a nerf FAW thread.
Skip forward a couple days and you run into another Panda premade using the same strategy, get a good 15-10 win out of it, and proceed to be a poor winner about it. At this stage, a logical person should be rethinking the nerf thread he created.
Zelda, you suffer from a reality distortion field. Anything that beats you is broken and needs to be fixed. Anyone that you beat needs to be ridiculed. And you throw accusations around left and right despite using some of the most broken abilities in the game. The cognitive dissonance on display here is mind boggling.
For the record, he did not play in the match.
The point he's trying to make is that the damage from those setups is ridiculous and require an insane amount of healing to counter .
We had to take one engie healer just to compensate for it.
It's also not the first time that setup has been beaten by other teams as well.
This was the second time I faced that team, the first time I basically ran my PvE build with 2 other mates, and we called on some other guys to make a 5 man to be ready for the next match we may get against that setup.
Your right 12 million in healing.... there is something fishy going on in the game.
I played with them earlier today... nothing fishy going on at all... its simple they have decided (made a choice) to strip there team down to only the most essential of heals and attack things in a different direction.
Whats the issue... you just proved 12 mill in healing still did the job... not sure how this is broken accept for proving the game still has way way way to much healing potential.
The funny thing is that basically one of the more reliable counters to that approach is to bring even more healing, so instead of reducing healing, you're increasing it.
If you had faced that setup at all, you would not think that is ok.
The Pandas are just milking another setup that most teams will not be equipped properly to face, that is all.
Those 2 other pugs that got rolled in our first game surely did not profit from that encounter. If anything, they won't queue up again.
The funny thing is that basically one of the more reliable counters to that approach is to bring even more healing, so instead of reducing healing, you're increasing it.
If you had faced that setup at all, you would not think that is ok.
The Pandas are just milking another setup that most teams will not be equipped properly to face, that is all.
Those 2 other pugs that got rolled in our first game surely did not profit from that encounter. If anything, they won't queue up again.
But whatever, have your fun.
I played a few with them earlier today... and yes I have faced builds like this.
Is the idea of a premade not to come up with ways to beat the other team ?
Why bang your head against a wall doing the exact same thing you been doing for 3 years.
Everyone agrees there is to much healing so why not in fact try to break it.
The other option instead of bringing a healer would be to rethink how some of you are playing. The other counter would be to bring just as much dps yourselves... I don't know those panda guys seem to be pretty light on healing.
I played a few today with them... and you want to know what is hillarious a very very good premade basicly ignored me for 14 min of a 15 min match... and let me rack up 2mil in dmg. Perhaps its the old Focus target mentality that is holding back most teams that face this type of setup.
Just spit balling... like most well organized teams facing them with out and ideal counter setup is annoying no doubt.
I played a few with them earlier today... and yes I have faced builds like this.
Is the idea of a premade not to come up with ways to beat the other team ?
Why bang your head against a wall doing the exact same thing you been doing for 3 years.
Everyone agrees there is to much healing so why not in fact try to break it.
The other option instead of bringing a healer would be to rethink how some of you are playing. The other counter would be to bring just as much dps yourselves... I don't know those panda guys seem to be pretty light on healing.
I played a few today with them... and you want to know what is hillarious a very very good premade basicly ignored me for 14 min of a 15 min match... and let me rack up 2mil in dmg. Perhaps its the old Focus target mentality that is holding back most teams that face this type of setup.
Just spit balling... like most well organized teams facing them with out and ideal counter setup is annoying no doubt.
Oh yeah, those setups trade quite a bit for their damage.
If you can survive the damage those Scims deal, they die fairly quick to good spike, especially if they can't run.
We were not used to dealing with that mix initially, and despite the initial troubles we had with the setup it was interesting to fight.
Overall I think we did ok, considering the team was put together in 5 mins.
We learned a lot about the weaknesses of that premade setup.
Would you people please just stop it! This hand-wringing over the now "OP" BFAW skill is going to scare off all the escort jockeys who think my big, fat, juicy cruiser is another toothless feddie target just waiting to be popped.
I've lost count of the number of elachi-wielding bugs I've slaughtered in this configuration. It love watching them splatter themselves all over my wall of "harmless" BFAW spam. It never gets old, so...
Oh yeah, those setups trade quite a bit for their damage.
If you can survive the damage those Scims deal, they die fairly quick to good spike, especially if they can't run.
We were not used to dealing with that mix initially, and despite the initial troubles we had with the setup it was interesting to fight.
Overall I think we did ok, considering the team was put together in 5 mins.
We learned a lot about the weaknesses of that premade setup.
This sums it up doesn't it. Instead of the OP saying to nerf FAW, to actually adapt like you obviously have. Premades are a team not an individual to which NO BS tournament is not about one person but a team. A lot has happened since the tournament, the meta has changed and alot of people have adapted their builds.
Unless... You want to bring back Double tapping
Unfortunately Zelda, pressure damage no longer rules anymore with 4 DHC's
Now found frequenting MWO short term and then Star Citizen long term. Raged Quit PVP long ago
- Gohan (House of Beautiful /Sad Pandas)
Revamp of PvP system
(To happen gradually after launch of Season 8 (imo this is a typo, i think they wanted to write Season 88, and will have 1% chance to happen if community rage is max) , main focus will be on space gameplay at first )
STO will be first game to implement a new PvP engine developed by Cryptic (God save you all. And 1% chance to working as intended)
PvP-faction for the Reputation System, "PvP Marks" as rewards
All PVP in the new system will be cross faction queues
Matchmaking, e.g. matching people of comparable gear level
Rewards based on participation more than completion
PvP ratings/leaderboard tech is now available
Either replacing current PvP maps or revamping the existing ones
Space combat prototype map (arena style?) to be released on Tribble server in the coming months (2013?) for extensive public testing
Transferring existing PvE maps (Facility 4028 amongst others) to ground PvP maps, possibly with capture-the-flag mod
King of the Hill PvP map for space and/or ground
Ground combat may have Battleground-style development in long-term
Possible: Starbase PvP Challenges
Fleet vs Fleet (KDF vs FED) territory control game ("controlling and or harvesting a vast variety of resources")
Revamp of PvP system
(To happen gradually after launch of Season 8 (imo this is a typo, i think they wanted to write Season 88, and will have 1% chance to happen if community rage is max) , main focus will be on space gameplay at first )
STO will be first game to implement a new PvP engine developed by Cryptic (God save you all. And 1% chance to working as intended)
PvP-faction for the Reputation System, "PvP Marks" as rewards
All PVP in the new system will be cross faction queues
Matchmaking, e.g. matching people of comparable gear level
Rewards based on participation more than completion
PvP ratings/leaderboard tech is now available
Either replacing current PvP maps or revamping the existing ones
Space combat prototype map (arena style?) to be released on Tribble server in the coming months (2013?) for extensive public testing
Transferring existing PvE maps (Facility 4028 amongst others) to ground PvP maps, possibly with capture-the-flag mod
King of the Hill PvP map for space and/or ground
Ground combat may have Battleground-style development in long-term
Possible: Starbase PvP Challenges
Fleet vs Fleet (KDF vs FED) territory control game ("controlling and or harvesting a vast variety of resources")
STO Wiki.
Ah yeah, that's just a running gag that's running for quite some time now. Nothing to see there move along people move along...
This sums it up doesn't it. Instead of the OP saying to nerf FAW, to actually adapt like you obviously have.
From a pug perspective: Adapt? You mean, I have to do things that would require going trough logs, playing with toons/powers that I wouldn't normally, giving away bunch of energy credits, just to be able to counter something which is stupidly opx5? Sorry, its a game, not a math class.
Premades are a team not an individual to which NO BS tournament is not about one person but a team. A lot has happened since the tournament, the meta has changed and alot of people have adapted their builds.
Teams can have their own que or private matches with a prearranged rules. That way Nova Core and sad pandas can fight till the end of days.
Unfortunately Zelda, pressure damage no longer rules anymore with 4 DHC's
Unfortunately, it still rules. If u know what are u doing. From a 1vs1 perspective as a sci capt, no bfaw setup can do serious harm to me, while 4dhc setup do it quite effective. Of course if capt knows what he is doing.
Anyways, this whole vicious circle has come to beginning, ie. we desperately need new pvp game modes, with meaningful objectives, not just a spacbar bashing arenas.
[10:49] [Combat (Self)] Your Proton Barrage deals 96581 (43411) Proton(Critical) to Seto.
Poor soul didnt have time to log out.
Which is sort of why some folks have decided to stop running 4 dhc, and run teams that don't simply go focus A focus B... Switch switch switch... Nuke... Switch. bla bla bla.
I think the people that where upset about the team based faw might not have been paying much attention to what was really going on....
The only thing the panda boys changed... was the healers stripped down to the bare bones on the healing side so the overall pressure could be ramped to a point where the typical 3-4 dhc escort isn't the only way to score a kill backed by 2 nukes all the time.
Comments
Yes. No boff skills.
Also missed Cloak, Battle cloak, Adapted Cloak, and Enhanced Battle cloak.
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
As long as you're in Space, no Kits, then that's where they're balanced!
Maybe we just need to space the jokes out a bit, like a joke bufFAW.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
These are just FAWntastic FAW the PvP community. Who said we dont have a FAWn sense of humour??....
Don't think there is much faw going on in NWS....
Standard build for farming that is sitll scatter and gravity well.
Not FAW itself...just something out of whack. It's one of those things that almost each time there's been that much NWS spam (been insane since Thursday) - there's usually something borked.
It's one of the ways that folks get things fixed - leak it to the general community, they don't think anything of it - Cryptic addresses the issue.
[System] Zelda has been on active duty for 126 days, 11 hours, 51 minutes, 48 seconds.
French Canadian
Your right 12 million in healing.... there is something fishy going on in the game.
I played with them earlier today... nothing fishy going on at all... its simple they have decided (made a choice) to strip there team down to only the most essential of heals and attack things in a different direction.
Whats the issue... you just proved 12 mill in healing still did the job... not sure how this is broken accept for proving the game still has way way way to much healing potential.
Can I jump in here with a random aside from the peanut gallery on what I think the issue might be in a more general sense?
Lack of Opportunity Cost.
Survivability/Healing or Damage...vs...Survivability/Healing and Damage.
With all the procs/passives/etc/etc/etc - it's much easier to do both, and it looks like that's the way it's going to continue every 6 months.
Let me get this straight...
You run into a Panda premade where some of the guys are running FAW and they beat you a few times in a row. You start accusing people of using cheese, despite the fact that you're using scramble doffs and other unmentionables. Then you make a nerf FAW thread.
Skip forward a couple days and you run into another Panda premade using the same strategy, get a good 15-10 win out of it, and proceed to be a poor winner about it. At this stage, a logical person should be rethinking the nerf thread he created.
Zelda, you suffer from a reality distortion field. Anything that beats you is broken and needs to be fixed. Anyone that you beat needs to be ridiculed. And you throw accusations around left and right despite using some of the most broken abilities in the game. The cognitive dissonance on display here is mind boggling.
Tweek your team accordingly if you saw something you like or don't... really though poor looser and winner about sums it up.
Myself I say hats off to the guys trying to do something different for a change. They have come up with a new effective premade build that doesn't revolve around a bunch of broken consoles and sets.
Perhaps the lesson people should be taking away from what they have been trying to pull off. Pressure dmg is NOT dead at all. Pay attention to what they are doing with there targeting, and how they are complementing each others builds. To often people are willing to go with the flow... if you have read this far... When is the last time you tried to honestly tweak a team pressure build ? Have you considered how to apply that pressure ? .... Or did you give up when you heard someone tell you pressure is dead don't even bother.
"Last Engage! Magical Girl Origami-san" is in print! Now with three times more rainbows.
Support the "Armored Unicorn" vehicle initiative today!
Thanks for Harajuku. Now let's get a real "Magical Girl" costume!
For the record, he did not play in the match.
The point he's trying to make is that the damage from those setups is ridiculous and require an insane amount of healing to counter .
We had to take one engie healer just to compensate for it.
It's also not the first time that setup has been beaten by other teams as well.
This was the second time I faced that team, the first time I basically ran my PvE build with 2 other mates, and we called on some other guys to make a 5 man to be ready for the next match we may get against that setup.
The funny thing is that basically one of the more reliable counters to that approach is to bring even more healing, so instead of reducing healing, you're increasing it.
If you had faced that setup at all, you would not think that is ok.
The Pandas are just milking another setup that most teams will not be equipped properly to face, that is all.
Those 2 other pugs that got rolled in our first game surely did not profit from that encounter. If anything, they won't queue up again.
But whatever, have your fun.
I played a few with them earlier today... and yes I have faced builds like this.
Is the idea of a premade not to come up with ways to beat the other team ?
Why bang your head against a wall doing the exact same thing you been doing for 3 years.
Everyone agrees there is to much healing so why not in fact try to break it.
The other option instead of bringing a healer would be to rethink how some of you are playing. The other counter would be to bring just as much dps yourselves... I don't know those panda guys seem to be pretty light on healing.
I played a few today with them... and you want to know what is hillarious a very very good premade basicly ignored me for 14 min of a 15 min match... and let me rack up 2mil in dmg. Perhaps its the old Focus target mentality that is holding back most teams that face this type of setup.
Just spit balling... like most well organized teams facing them with out and ideal counter setup is annoying no doubt.
Oh yeah, those setups trade quite a bit for their damage.
If you can survive the damage those Scims deal, they die fairly quick to good spike, especially if they can't run.
We were not used to dealing with that mix initially, and despite the initial troubles we had with the setup it was interesting to fight.
Overall I think we did ok, considering the team was put together in 5 mins.
We learned a lot about the weaknesses of that premade setup.
I've lost count of the number of elachi-wielding bugs I've slaughtered in this configuration. It love watching them splatter themselves all over my wall of "harmless" BFAW spam. It never gets old, so...
...please, STFU! You're ruining all my fun!
RCK
This sums it up doesn't it. Instead of the OP saying to nerf FAW, to actually adapt like you obviously have. Premades are a team not an individual to which NO BS tournament is not about one person but a team. A lot has happened since the tournament, the meta has changed and alot of people have adapted their builds.
Unless... You want to bring back Double tapping
Unfortunately Zelda, pressure damage no longer rules anymore with 4 DHC's
- Gohan (House of Beautiful /Sad Pandas)
(To happen gradually after launch of Season 8 (imo this is a typo, i think they wanted to write Season 88, and will have 1% chance to happen if community rage is max) , main focus will be on space gameplay at first )
STO will be first game to implement a new PvP engine developed by Cryptic (God save you all. And 1% chance to working as intended)
PvP-faction for the Reputation System, "PvP Marks" as rewards
All PVP in the new system will be cross faction queues
Matchmaking, e.g. matching people of comparable gear level
Rewards based on participation more than completion
PvP ratings/leaderboard tech is now available
Either replacing current PvP maps or revamping the existing ones
Space combat prototype map (arena style?) to be released on Tribble server in the coming months (2013?) for extensive public testing
Transferring existing PvE maps (Facility 4028 amongst others) to ground PvP maps, possibly with capture-the-flag mod
King of the Hill PvP map for space and/or ground
Ground combat may have Battleground-style development in long-term
Possible: Starbase PvP Challenges
Fleet vs Fleet (KDF vs FED) territory control game ("controlling and or harvesting a vast variety of resources")
STO Wiki.
btw rumors are Hank dude was on an Engi healer because he couldn't be arsed to switch toons... xD
Ah yeah, that's just a running gag that's running for quite some time now. Nothing to see there move along people move along...
Anyways, this whole vicious circle has come to beginning, ie. we desperately need new pvp game modes, with meaningful objectives, not just a spacbar bashing arenas.
Poor soul didnt have time to log out.
Which is sort of why some folks have decided to stop running 4 dhc, and run teams that don't simply go focus A focus B... Switch switch switch... Nuke... Switch. bla bla bla.
I think the people that where upset about the team based faw might not have been paying much attention to what was really going on....
The only thing the panda boys changed... was the healers stripped down to the bare bones on the healing side so the overall pressure could be ramped to a point where the typical 3-4 dhc escort isn't the only way to score a kill backed by 2 nukes all the time.