Negative... here is my current Defiant build... Go kill premades with it. Enjoy
Tac team 1 - High Yield 2 - Omega 1 - Rapid Fire 3
Tac team 1 - Rapid fire 1 - Omega 1
High Yield 1
Emergency power to engines 1 - EPTS 2
Hazards 1 - TSS 2
2 DC (thats right DC)
2 Quantums
2 Turrets
1 KCB
Glider 2 piece + maco
2 Flow Cap sci units.... +Shield heal rep ones if you can.
3 Tet Dmg units 2 Quantum
2-3 Torp doffs... with 2-3 Dmg Control doffs...
No you don't insta pop... and you will like tet DC with glider... they won't kill anything but facings drop all the time... and then light them up with the constant stream of high dmg qunatums.
People are way to hung up on running 4 dhc on everything... that is very 6 months ago.
If Elite Fleet Shields proc resistance per shot and not per cycle, then DCs have actually gotten worse.
All nrg has... but you still need to drop shields... which now have multiple passive regens and crit hit recharges.... The point of the DC is to get the same glider effect (in fact you get much more do to the power drain on only 2)... + the KCB proc is almost needed to keep glider dmg at max.
Trust me the build I listed works... 2 turrets + 2 dc... + 125 power glider all the time will strip a facing fleet shields or not... and the quantums will do there work... cycle HY 2 and HY 1 and with doffs keeping them spitting... it makes people very uncomfy... everyone is used to there shields being invinci mode these days... do something that pullls there facings down and they start doing all sorts of very stupid things they wouldn't have done back when they expected that to happen.
Still Cryptic has screwed up the mechanics so bad I pvp in GW 95% of the time these days anyway... so what do I know anyway I guess.
Antoniosalieri, what you've posted is a perfect example of a fail build. You need to pick a role and stick to it, either fully into tet glider or fully into spike damage. As it stands, you've built something that is mediocre at both.
Antoniosalieri, what you've posted is a perfect example of a fail build. You need to pick a role and stick to it, either fully into tet glider or fully into spike damage. As it stands, you've built something that is mediocre at both.
no ive seen this type of build. but its dhcx2 3 turents and 2 torps. with rep system now its useless. ive tryed tet weps and they dont really seem to do anything compaired to phasers or polaron.
Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
yes the weps do matter but no so much the purple consoles. doffs do help. the problem is the bug ship has an rsp. the defaint has epts 1 2. the jem has better sheilds and turn rate the defiant has less on all accounts. if the jem loses its sheilds can rsp, if that fails can tss 2 if that fails there is 3 sdo. less see defaint sheilds break tss2, that fails 3 sdo, that fails well hello respwn timer.
if the defiant was able to use cloak under combat that would actually help it alot more. then you would actually get to use better spike damage, not wast a console slot and actually slot the cloak console. i care less that jem has 4 engy consoles. most go 2 neut consoles , other morons go 4. i fly my bug with no armor consoles. my engy lay out most times is 2 mk12 purple rcs ,tact converter borg console. sci is sheild emiter, tact is 4 tact phaser consoles and zero point. if i tryed that layout in my defiant it would be pure death.
the greater turn rate of the JHAS is an advantage only in a 1vs1 scenario... in a many vs many scenario the bug ships is disadvantaged by its worse shields. In a 1 vs 2 scenario I win only if the 2 opponents do not collaborate... else my better turn rate is useless.
Moreover there are several way to have an instant boost to your turn rate: deuterium surplus, evasive maneuvers (+ purple conn officers), AtD, a pair of APO... You can also use TBR... and you are helped by a better shields system...
I also think that in a pvp build you need only a few basic consoles: neutronium alloy, one RCS (or the console from the temporal set), a shield emitter ad the appropriate tactical consoles. The others console generally are (IMHO) a waste.
Sir you are giving reasons WHY the Bug is an overpowered ship instead, of arguing otherwise...
I tried to tell something very different:
JHAS and FTER have a very similar shield modifier... 0.99 is not so far from 1, but the FTER has 2 science console so can have greater and better shield. That is IMHO an advantage in a many vs many, the typical pvp scenario, more than having a better turn rate... simply because in a many vs many scenario probably you will be targeted by several ships at the same time.
Also the hull it points is very similar, even if the JHAS has a bit more hull, the difference is less than the DPS of one of my unbuffered DHC.
I think that the real difference between the two ships is the ensign tactical station of the FTER... I simply think it's a waste, so all in all is not the JHAS overpowered but the FTER underpowered in pvp (but much better in pve).
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Playing STO spamming FAW is like playing chess using always the computer's suggested moves
Except with superior Turn Rate, Impulse modifier and Engineering room for extra resists, even in group focus fire it can pull a 180 and survive the 2-3 seconds it takes to get out of combat range to heal up and restack alpha buffs.
the greater turn rate of the JHAS is an advantage only in a 1vs1 scenario... in a many vs many scenario the bug ships is disadvantaged by its worse shields. In a 1 vs 2 scenario I win only if the 2 opponents do not collaborate... else my better turn rate is useless.
Moreover there are several way to have an instant boost to your turn rate: deuterium surplus, evasive maneuvers (+ purple conn officers), AtD, a pair of APO... You can also use TBR... and you are helped by a better shields system...
I also think that in a pvp build you need only a few basic consoles: neutronium alloy, one RCS (or the console from the temporal set), a shield emitter ad the appropriate tactical consoles. The others console generally are (IMHO) a waste.
I tried to tell something very different:
JHAS and FTER have a very similar shield modifier... 0.99 is not so far from 1, but the FTER has 2 science console so can have greater and better shield. That is IMHO an advantage in a many vs many, the typical pvp scenario, more than having a better turn rate... simply because in a many vs many scenario probably you will be targeted by several ships at the same time.
Also the hull it points is very similar, even if the JHAS has a bit more hull, the difference is less than the DPS of one of my unbuffered DHC.
I think that the real difference between the two ships is the ensign tactical station of the FTER... I simply think it's a waste, so all in all is not the JHAS overpowered but the FTER underpowered in pvp (but much better in pve).
Read what the guy above me said.
The turn rate makes it's defense very high.
Most people don't even run neutroniums in the engi spot (two max) and us it for universal consoles
The Average PvP player
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
1) Teamwork and timing is #1
2) You cannot "Kirk It" in every ship
3) You are going to die, just get back up
Most people do run a nuet, at lest one of them. In a team how si the ZOMG ITZ TURNZ rate so op? The answer is, it's not. For all you people that cry thats it's so op are just not skilled players. It IS the best escort in game, hands down; but there are other ships that are equally as good in different categories. Your blaming on being pop'ed in the Jem and not for your own skill set. These days it seems like people have to blame something/someone else for failing and not themselves. (ZOMG ITZ HAX!) Second, thsoe that QQ about the Jem space set have no clue what they are talking about. It has a proc to strip 1 ability and then an immunity is applied. The set its self is not that great, the borg/maco set IS better.
SO go back to your "wack-a-spacebar" build and prepare to get pwn over and over again by skilled players.
Antoniosalieri, what you've posted is a perfect example of a fail build. You need to pick a role and stick to it, either fully into tet glider or fully into spike damage. As it stands, you've built something that is mediocre at both.
I don't think I'll take fail build advice from you hurly look me up in game any time you want to see how fail such a build is.... @husanak I should be on your friends list. :P lol
Seriously thought for reasons people have pointed out full energy does not work anymore all 4 cannons does these days is recharge shields for people... or boost there resists, if there running Dbag shields. You need torps... running just 1 is a terrible idea as we all know... for torps to work you have to have them up all the time. Which is why you really need 2+doffs. I know the build I listed goes against everything we have done for 3 years... but it honestly works better then I expected DC dmg sucks but it seems to allow glider to do its thing... the KCB proc really heals that as well.... as wrong as it seems it works. Overload builds suck mostly now for spike as the stupid shield regens / resists are just out of hand... I found 2 DC + 2 turrets was just enough to get facings... I did try 4 dc to test with and it was procing shield junk like mad.
The days of the 4 dhc escorts are over imo... unless cryptic does something about the out of hand shield junk they have added.
lol then bring it son, I will show you what it takes. From the sounds of it your just a button smashing noob anyways. Let us skool on how its done. You seem to think that just because someone has a Jem bug then can instantly kill you or are OP'ed. The Steamrunner is way more OP than a bug in terms or healing. epts1x2 and 2rsp. Really now, thats way to OP compared to the Jem bug. Your just hatin because a skilled player in a Jem bug can pop you just about every time.
Bring your best 5 and we will love to skool you on PvP.
Of course it is way OP, its a better peregrine fighter in the show, and not the uebership of doom. It simply has no place outside of fighters and shuttles. It does not belong as escort at all.
I dont need a bug to pop you, all I need is a shuttle. Last time I checked the bug ship did not have a lt.cmd sci slot, so where these magic abilities your talking about coming from? You don't have anything extra to spare.
Everything in a bug is the same as an escort, you building to stay alive for everything no connected to damage.
When will this thread just die. Its so full of fail. Every time I pop somone in a gud its this, but if I am ina defiant or Steamrunner no one says anything. Being in a bug also seems to make you an instant target in pug games, which I am fine with. It makes it more fur for me that way.
A Jem bug has to do the same thing, we are forced to make our ships as powerful and as possible. Turn rate is NOT king in team PvP. If a pilot in a fleet patrol or defiant has to change there build or skill set to be competitive with a Jem bug, is that not a good thing? We are forcing you to be a better pilot and gamer. You should tank skilled bug ship players for helping you better yourself as a Tac player in an escort. Also how are its weapons any different? All escorts can run phasers, polarons, or whatever flavor it is this week.
the greater turn rate of the JHAS is an advantage only in a 1vs1 scenario... in a many vs many scenario the bug ships is disadvantaged by its worse shields. In a 1 vs 2 scenario I win only if the 2 opponents do not collaborate... else my better turn rate is useless.
turn rate is more then just 1v1, the better the turn rate the easier to get your guns on a weak facing. wtf does worse sheilds even mean? at base the jem has better sheild points and better regen then a defaint.
Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
A Jem bug has to do the same thing, we are forced to make our ships as powerful and as possible.
you did kinda convince me. 20 shuttles just came after my bug ship and poped me wtf? polie me and you both have jems. ill kill you in my bug ship if you ran a defaint. if im in my defaint and you in ur bug i will get poped.
Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
I got bored of reading the pigeon english spelling, pot stirring and PVE player inaccuracies after page 3 so:
Pound for pound i think the Jemmy is over powered. I thought so before i got one and i still think so. But there are SO MANY Jemmies around it doesen't matter anymore. After the previous Q Wonderland they were still a rarety, kept at the 800-1Billion mark. But since then they've been re-released twice by our greedy game developers. They are now HALF the price they once were. A car was "OP" before everyone got one. Now cars are pretty normal.
This subject has become tedius. It usually flares up because of the same few who don't yet own one wanting to make it clear they don't for whatever reason. Before i may have been the same. But JHAS' are so common now anything special about them is lost in the mix. Get over it.
On the subject of "Oh noes! If somebody has these new consoles equipped they'll be in perma-godmode!!11" - no, because that involves 160million EC's worth of devotion that won't really pay off unless the player is with a decent team that can exploit the 2 consoles properly. Get over it.
As i said, the subject is tedius, kids. We've had these topics for over a year now, since then the ship has been buffed. They put it where it is for a good reason. It makes Cryptic lots of money every time. And as long as total idiots pay fistfuls for it while i can so far grind to buy TWO of them, the world is fine in my book. They're paying so i don't have too.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] @Aquitaine985 Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre. 2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
I got bored of reading the pigeon english spelling, pot stirring and PVE player inaccuracies after page 3 so:
Pound for pound i think the Jemmy is over powered. I thought so before i got one and i still think so. But there are SO MANY Jemmies around it doesen't matter anymore. After the previous Q Wonderland they were still a rarety, kept at the 800-1Billion mark. But since then they've been re-released twice by our greedy game developers. They are now HALF the price they once were. A car was "OP" before everyone got one. Now cars are pretty normal.
This subject has become tedius. It usually flares up because of the same few who don't yet own one wanting to make it clear they don't for whatever reason. Before i may have been the same. But JHAS' are so common now anything special about them is lost in the mix. Get over it.
On the subject of "Oh noes! If somebody has these new consoles equipped they'll be in perma-godmode!!11" - no, because that involves 160million EC's worth of devotion that won't really pay off unless the player is with a decent team that can exploit the 2 consoles properly. Get over it.
As i said, the subject is tedius, kids. We've had these topics for over a year now, since then the ship has been buffed. They put it where it is for a good reason. It makes Cryptic lots of money every time. And as long as total idiots pay fistfuls for it while i can so far grind to buy TWO of them, the world is fine in my book. They're paying so i don't have too.
Have my babies
But there is time for devs to release the next OPed thing... The Vesta was thought to be the chosen one but then it turn out to be a bust. But there will be another op thing to hit the scene... Make the bug look like a toy... Gigs cryptic... Ggs in advance
The Average PvP player
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
1) Teamwork and timing is #1
2) You cannot "Kirk It" in every ship
3) You are going to die, just get back up
I suspect that the JHAS wouldn't be such an issue if a lot of people didn't already feel as though escorts were superior in a lot of ways to the other ship classes. As the most powerful of all the escorts, it becomes a very easy target for hatred in the community.
As has been being discussed in other threads recently, a large part of the blame with the success of the JHAS probably lies with Dual Heavy Cannons. As they are now, they provide far too much burst in comparison to the other weapon classes. Since the JHAS has an extremely high turn rate, it has the highest potential to utilize the DHC's, making it seem like a potent and overpowered advantage.
If DHC firing rate was normalized to the standard of the DC's and single cannons, the JHAS would still be really good, but the damage would be far more manageable in a team setting. That isn't to say that it isn't still itemized too high in stats compared to the other escorts, but it would manage to keep it from being the insane damage-pressure machine it is now.
Turn rate has a high value only because it's the best stat to increase damage with DHC's. Most other escorts need a burst ability like Beam Overload to land kills where the JHAS can keep enough uptime to do without.
"Would Turkish RP Heroes EVER field a team of 5 in Arena or Ker'rat, without a Jem'Hadar Attack ship on the lineup?"
Answer's probably "No, they're not stupid."
I am afraid that answer is not correct. Turkish RP Heroes is not dependent on the JHAS.
While I will not deny that the JHAS is in my opinion the best escort overall (and that being the reason why JHAS is the prefered escort of choice), ships like the Fleet Escort, Fleet Patrol Escort, Steamrunner, or Moebius are also viable in team settings. If set up right, these ships can be operated just like the JHAS. An opposing team would hardly feel the difference.
A skilled escort player will be almost as deadly on other, "lesser" escorts as well.
Put Broken or Mara Jade in a Defiant, or Shimmer in a MVAM, or Randal in a Moebius, or Yoda or Strike in a fricking shuttle , and you'll see what I mean.
In some of my videos (link in signature) among other things you can see me flying a Fleet Patrol with some success as well.
And by the way, Turkish ERP Heroes is NOT Turkish RP Heroes (damn you Broken )
ermmm.... I call BS on your "Skill" claim-it takes NO skill to run a Bugship, just money and/or time to buy it.
Most of that time, incidentally, would be spent on PvE, as in EC grinding, with some Doffing along the way.
An UN_BUFFED JHAS is as good as a lot of ships can temporarily get with buffs and rep passives, there is no 'skill' involved beyond the barest of basics to running one.
Let us go over this again...
Turn rate of a Bird of Prey (but without the disadvantages)
Shields of a Cruiser (but without the disadvantages)
One of the best Hull strengths you can get on an Escort (matches some cruisers, even)
Universal Bridge officer slots (you don't get that on FedScorts or Raptors)
High Impulse modifer (there may be some fighters that can match this)
Five tac consoles (the other ships with 5 TC's sacrifice heavily for them-only the Jem ship sacrifices NOTHING for it...)
1 sci slot you'll never actually need.
and you say it's not OP.
B.S., it's not OP, it's Munchkin. It's the kid who used to show up for a D&D game with all 18's on his stat sheet, and a Legendary Relic magic item he found under the cupboard at home (and for a 'flaw' a "Tragic Past" that reads like a particularly bad form of marysue fanfiction.) It's munchkin to the level of the guy who shows up to the Battletech game with his Clan/Mixed tech custom assembled out of cherry-picked items from Maxtech, with the 0/0 pilot with EI and DNI implants (buffered, of course), myomer subcutaneous armor, etc. to ignore pilot hits...in a 3025 setting.
It's an Ewok with more Darkside points than the EMPEROR, (and his own private sun-crusher) level.
Okay, maybe that last bit was an exaggeration.
but don't pretend it takes ANY skill to run this thing, don't lie to yourself that way. No skills are actually NEEDED to run a Bugship save one: "Hit Spacebar and steer on Autofire".
shields of a cruiser??
1 sci console does not = shields of a cruiser, i dont even bother using my sci console in my bug for shields and with mark XII maco shields im barely over 9k shield cap
But there is time for devs to release the next OPed thing... The Vesta was thought to be the chosen one but then it turn out to be a bust. But there will be another op thing to hit the scene... Make the bug look like a toy... Gigs cryptic... Ggs in advance
the vesta is the op science ship, it has edges over every other science ship in the game making it the "must have" of science ships.
you show me a sci build on any other sci ship and ill show you how the vesta can do it, and do it better.
There's one thing* I don't understand. The JHAS is available to both factions, so ANYYONE in the game can potentially fly one if they put enough effort towards getting the EC for one.
*Ok, there's LOTS of things, but only one relevant to this thread :P
The way I see it, the people QQing about balance are the people that are just too lazy to actually go and pick one up for themselves, and are bitter about the players that are lucky/wealthy enough to own one.
The way I see it, the people QQing about balance are the people that are just too lazy to actually go and pick one up for themselves, and are bitter about the players that are lucky/wealthy enough to own one.
You clearly haven't read the thread in question.
No one is bitter about anything. Why is it when someone makes an observation about the JHAS in comparison to other Escorts you have some weasel claim that it's a null observation because you don't own it or are jealous?
Apart from a few people, no one is asking for a nerf. They just want the other Escorts to be made relevant again.
I don't mind the JHAS having the stats it has, I just want an excuse to take my Defiant into a fight against one.
I'm not gonna argue whether or not the Bug is the best escort in the game, I don't really have anything to add to that.
BUT
In a way, the Bug is kind of like SNB DOFFs. Namely that at the start, they were extremely rare, worth a ton of EC. They got much more common eventually, and much cheaper because of it. As such, the proliferation of SNB DOFFs is what eventually led to the big SNB-crisis last year.
On a similar note, the bug ship is the same way. Originally it was extraordinarily rare. However, now that they've been re-released twice, there are a ton more out there, so they're much more apparent when you see them. As such, maybe before it was...tolerable to deal with bugs. Regardless of whether they are OP or not, they were few and far between.
Now, not so much. You see them much more often, and because of it, they are playing a larger role in PvP, much like the SNB DOFFs did.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
Comments
Tac team 1 - High Yield 2 - Omega 1 - Rapid Fire 3
Tac team 1 - Rapid fire 1 - Omega 1
High Yield 1
Emergency power to engines 1 - EPTS 2
Hazards 1 - TSS 2
2 DC (thats right DC)
2 Quantums
2 Turrets
1 KCB
Glider 2 piece + maco
2 Flow Cap sci units.... +Shield heal rep ones if you can.
3 Tet Dmg units 2 Quantum
2-3 Torp doffs... with 2-3 Dmg Control doffs...
No you don't insta pop... and you will like tet DC with glider... they won't kill anything but facings drop all the time... and then light them up with the constant stream of high dmg qunatums.
People are way to hung up on running 4 dhc on everything... that is very 6 months ago.
If Elite Fleet Shields proc resistance per shot and not per cycle, then DCs have actually gotten worse.
All nrg has... but you still need to drop shields... which now have multiple passive regens and crit hit recharges.... The point of the DC is to get the same glider effect (in fact you get much more do to the power drain on only 2)... + the KCB proc is almost needed to keep glider dmg at max.
Trust me the build I listed works... 2 turrets + 2 dc... + 125 power glider all the time will strip a facing fleet shields or not... and the quantums will do there work... cycle HY 2 and HY 1 and with doffs keeping them spitting... it makes people very uncomfy... everyone is used to there shields being invinci mode these days... do something that pullls there facings down and they start doing all sorts of very stupid things they wouldn't have done back when they expected that to happen.
Still Cryptic has screwed up the mechanics so bad I pvp in GW 95% of the time these days anyway... so what do I know anyway I guess.
no ive seen this type of build. but its dhcx2 3 turents and 2 torps. with rep system now its useless. ive tryed tet weps and they dont really seem to do anything compaired to phasers or polaron.
the greater turn rate of the JHAS is an advantage only in a 1vs1 scenario... in a many vs many scenario the bug ships is disadvantaged by its worse shields. In a 1 vs 2 scenario I win only if the 2 opponents do not collaborate... else my better turn rate is useless.
Moreover there are several way to have an instant boost to your turn rate: deuterium surplus, evasive maneuvers (+ purple conn officers), AtD, a pair of APO... You can also use TBR... and you are helped by a better shields system...
I also think that in a pvp build you need only a few basic consoles: neutronium alloy, one RCS (or the console from the temporal set), a shield emitter ad the appropriate tactical consoles. The others console generally are (IMHO) a waste.
I tried to tell something very different:
JHAS and FTER have a very similar shield modifier... 0.99 is not so far from 1, but the FTER has 2 science console so can have greater and better shield. That is IMHO an advantage in a many vs many, the typical pvp scenario, more than having a better turn rate... simply because in a many vs many scenario probably you will be targeted by several ships at the same time.
Also the hull it points is very similar, even if the JHAS has a bit more hull, the difference is less than the DPS of one of my unbuffered DHC.
I think that the real difference between the two ships is the ensign tactical station of the FTER... I simply think it's a waste, so all in all is not the JHAS overpowered but the FTER underpowered in pvp (but much better in pve).
Playing STO spamming FAW is like playing chess using always the computer's suggested moves
Read what the guy above me said.
The turn rate makes it's defense very high.
Most people don't even run neutroniums in the engi spot (two max) and us it for universal consoles
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
1) Teamwork and timing is #1
2) You cannot "Kirk It" in every ship
3) You are going to die, just get back up
SO go back to your "wack-a-spacebar" build and prepare to get pwn over and over again by skilled players.
/thread
I don't think I'll take fail build advice from you hurly look me up in game any time you want to see how fail such a build is.... @husanak I should be on your friends list. :P lol
Seriously thought for reasons people have pointed out full energy does not work anymore all 4 cannons does these days is recharge shields for people... or boost there resists, if there running Dbag shields. You need torps... running just 1 is a terrible idea as we all know... for torps to work you have to have them up all the time. Which is why you really need 2+doffs. I know the build I listed goes against everything we have done for 3 years... but it honestly works better then I expected DC dmg sucks but it seems to allow glider to do its thing... the KCB proc really heals that as well.... as wrong as it seems it works. Overload builds suck mostly now for spike as the stupid shield regens / resists are just out of hand... I found 2 DC + 2 turrets was just enough to get facings... I did try 4 dc to test with and it was procing shield junk like mad.
The days of the 4 dhc escorts are over imo... unless cryptic does something about the out of hand shield junk they have added.
Yeah, uh, that guy up top is just kidding about being Hus.
I'm going to bet they don't care anymore... besides I have unlimited free email addresses. lol
lol then bring it son, I will show you what it takes. From the sounds of it your just a button smashing noob anyways. Let us skool on how its done. You seem to think that just because someone has a Jem bug then can instantly kill you or are OP'ed. The Steamrunner is way more OP than a bug in terms or healing. epts1x2 and 2rsp. Really now, thats way to OP compared to the Jem bug. Your just hatin because a skilled player in a Jem bug can pop you just about every time.
Bring your best 5 and we will love to skool you on PvP.
I dont need a bug to pop you, all I need is a shuttle. Last time I checked the bug ship did not have a lt.cmd sci slot, so where these magic abilities your talking about coming from? You don't have anything extra to spare.
Everything in a bug is the same as an escort, you building to stay alive for everything no connected to damage.
EDIT: Yes the TERPS did field a team of 4 shuttles and 1 recluse and we pwnd everyone in kerate.
When will this thread just die. Its so full of fail. Every time I pop somone in a gud its this, but if I am ina defiant or Steamrunner no one says anything. Being in a bug also seems to make you an instant target in pug games, which I am fine with. It makes it more fur for me that way.
A Jem bug has to do the same thing, we are forced to make our ships as powerful and as possible. Turn rate is NOT king in team PvP. If a pilot in a fleet patrol or defiant has to change there build or skill set to be competitive with a Jem bug, is that not a good thing? We are forcing you to be a better pilot and gamer. You should tank skilled bug ship players for helping you better yourself as a Tac player in an escort. Also how are its weapons any different? All escorts can run phasers, polarons, or whatever flavor it is this week.
turn rate is more then just 1v1, the better the turn rate the easier to get your guns on a weak facing. wtf does worse sheilds even mean? at base the jem has better sheild points and better regen then a defaint.
the FTER has .99 the bug ship has 1... 0.1% difference is ridiculous, even because the FTER has 2 science consoles.
Playing STO spamming FAW is like playing chess using always the computer's suggested moves
so its almost a 2k difference. but again who cares about ur sci consoles. most tacts that i know put uni consoles in sci slots.
Pound for pound i think the Jemmy is over powered. I thought so before i got one and i still think so. But there are SO MANY Jemmies around it doesen't matter anymore. After the previous Q Wonderland they were still a rarety, kept at the 800-1Billion mark. But since then they've been re-released twice by our greedy game developers. They are now HALF the price they once were. A car was "OP" before everyone got one. Now cars are pretty normal.
This subject has become tedius. It usually flares up because of the same few who don't yet own one wanting to make it clear they don't for whatever reason. Before i may have been the same. But JHAS' are so common now anything special about them is lost in the mix. Get over it.
On the subject of "Oh noes! If somebody has these new consoles equipped they'll be in perma-godmode!!11" - no, because that involves 160million EC's worth of devotion that won't really pay off unless the player is with a decent team that can exploit the 2 consoles properly. Get over it.
As i said, the subject is tedius, kids. We've had these topics for over a year now, since then the ship has been buffed. They put it where it is for a good reason. It makes Cryptic lots of money every time. And as long as total idiots pay fistfuls for it while i can so far grind to buy TWO of them, the world is fine in my book. They're paying so i don't have too.
@Aquitaine985
Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
Have my babies
But there is time for devs to release the next OPed thing... The Vesta was thought to be the chosen one but then it turn out to be a bust. But there will be another op thing to hit the scene... Make the bug look like a toy... Gigs cryptic... Ggs in advance
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
1) Teamwork and timing is #1
2) You cannot "Kirk It" in every ship
3) You are going to die, just get back up
As has been being discussed in other threads recently, a large part of the blame with the success of the JHAS probably lies with Dual Heavy Cannons. As they are now, they provide far too much burst in comparison to the other weapon classes. Since the JHAS has an extremely high turn rate, it has the highest potential to utilize the DHC's, making it seem like a potent and overpowered advantage.
If DHC firing rate was normalized to the standard of the DC's and single cannons, the JHAS would still be really good, but the damage would be far more manageable in a team setting. That isn't to say that it isn't still itemized too high in stats compared to the other escorts, but it would manage to keep it from being the insane damage-pressure machine it is now.
Turn rate has a high value only because it's the best stat to increase damage with DHC's. Most other escorts need a burst ability like Beam Overload to land kills where the JHAS can keep enough uptime to do without.
Lag Industries STO/TOR Guild
I am afraid that answer is not correct. Turkish RP Heroes is not dependent on the JHAS.
While I will not deny that the JHAS is in my opinion the best escort overall (and that being the reason why JHAS is the prefered escort of choice), ships like the Fleet Escort, Fleet Patrol Escort, Steamrunner, or Moebius are also viable in team settings. If set up right, these ships can be operated just like the JHAS. An opposing team would hardly feel the difference.
A skilled escort player will be almost as deadly on other, "lesser" escorts as well.
Put Broken or Mara Jade in a Defiant, or Shimmer in a MVAM, or Randal in a Moebius, or Yoda or Strike in a fricking shuttle
In some of my videos (link in signature) among other things you can see me flying a Fleet Patrol with some success as well.
And by the way, Turkish ERP Heroes is NOT Turkish RP Heroes (damn you Broken
shields of a cruiser??
1 sci console does not = shields of a cruiser, i dont even bother using my sci console in my bug for shields and with mark XII maco shields im barely over 9k shield cap
the vesta is the op science ship, it has edges over every other science ship in the game making it the "must have" of science ships.
you show me a sci build on any other sci ship and ill show you how the vesta can do it, and do it better.
Do you even Science Bro?
*Ok, there's LOTS of things, but only one relevant to this thread :P
The way I see it, the people QQing about balance are the people that are just too lazy to actually go and pick one up for themselves, and are bitter about the players that are lucky/wealthy enough to own one.
You clearly haven't read the thread in question.
No one is bitter about anything. Why is it when someone makes an observation about the JHAS in comparison to other Escorts you have some weasel claim that it's a null observation because you don't own it or are jealous?
Apart from a few people, no one is asking for a nerf. They just want the other Escorts to be made relevant again.
I don't mind the JHAS having the stats it has, I just want an excuse to take my Defiant into a fight against one.
BUT
In a way, the Bug is kind of like SNB DOFFs. Namely that at the start, they were extremely rare, worth a ton of EC. They got much more common eventually, and much cheaper because of it. As such, the proliferation of SNB DOFFs is what eventually led to the big SNB-crisis last year.
On a similar note, the bug ship is the same way. Originally it was extraordinarily rare. However, now that they've been re-released twice, there are a ton more out there, so they're much more apparent when you see them. As such, maybe before it was...tolerable to deal with bugs. Regardless of whether they are OP or not, they were few and far between.
Now, not so much. You see them much more often, and because of it, they are playing a larger role in PvP, much like the SNB DOFFs did.
Vin Naftero@playhard88 - FED Sciencie
K'tan@playhard88 - KDF Tactical
Argento@playhard88 - RRF Tactical (FED)