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A new nerf thread by Pax - Tier 4 Omega Passive for Shields

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  • dontdrunkimshootdontdrunkimshoot Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    rudiefix1 wrote: »
    Does this also count for the plasma DOT from plasma cannons?

    the DOT is a status applied to your enemy. but every time a weapon cycle starts, there is a role for proc. not every time 2-4 shots are fired in the cycle.

    things like tet glider and DEM have per shot effects though
  • broken1981broken1981 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    paxottoman wrote: »
    That sucks man, sorry your post got ignored. At least we're all on the same page on this one!

    About the respec, I think they're going to keep those intact for these passives. They're making a good fortune off respect tokens. Kind of stupid if they didn't, it is after all a mutual benefit for them to allow that at this point.

    On another note, ok I was not aware the target disappears while under the effects of the romulan t4 placate passive. Could it not be made as though someone is using the Honor Guard shield where you just lose target and can re-acquire it manually?

    Thanks.
    well you did come in with numbers while i made a post going with my gut. guess math wins lol. even when they make it every 6 secs this will still be a powerful passive. hell everyone has high knitic resist. why go with a knitic passive inless ur going tric bombig which in that case u still dont need that passive.
    At first I chuckled at this comment. Then it kind of ticked me off. That attitude is what's wrong with a lot of games and a lot of people.

    "Oh, there's a bug - let's exploit it instead of reporting it."

    That's just sad... that's just really sad.

    whats so sad? to respec a passive a geart thing. you dont think it sucks that you pick 1 passive just for the system to pick the other passive that you did not ask for? or some day down the line you might want to pick a different passive. hey if it was a bug that would hurt pvp or even pve i say report it. but a respec passive? they never said u can respec this which you should. just pick and chose your battles man. more important TRIBBLE on the horizon to worry about.
    Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
    I can throw [Fireworks] at you and hope you catch on fire and burn to death lol
  • broken1981broken1981 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    paxottoman wrote: »
    No, the honor guard shield often forces you to change targets, kind of like a mini scramble sensors except you're targeting another foe rather than friendly. On the other hand, its become incredibly difficult to kill anything with this new passive.

    pax, i talked alot about this in my ts. even to a degree in pvp chat.i dont think people are fully understanding the promlem that i had posted about in my post that was ignored. just wanted to show fellow pvp'ers the huge mess up thats been created. now you did some what touch on the subject. the sheild passive and now the placate proc. let me run it down the line,

    fed/klink khg proc, they cit me i cant see them. i crit them and they dissapare again. (lameness anyone)

    t4 passive placate proc (about every 10 secs this passive kicks in)

    cpb doff= placate(3) (yeah sheild drain with a placitae proc goooo sci!!!!)

    entainer doff placate , rand had one actually. tho i did not notice it being something to rush out and buy off the exchange.

    then the random jam sencors skill and random people in ques using ams. my qut tells me things can get compleatly out of control.

    still as an escourt player ill still go with cit to my sheilds heal and better regen. i might not see the emeny team even tho they see me but my team mates will see me and add to my healing. if i ever get purma proced, having placate proc skill just might not save me if i cant even get a shot off. i just look at my extra healing as a counter for the majorty of people going for placate.
    Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
    I can throw [Fireworks] at you and hope you catch on fire and burn to death lol
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Well, the "does not believe in a No-Win Scenario" stuff's started to pop... have to figure additional changes are in the wind, eh? Kind of like all the Stage 9 spam finally did something about TBRs... the Stage 10 stuff will get their attention.
  • shookyangshookyang Member Posts: 1,122
    edited December 2012
    Did some internal fleet PvP last night, and one our fleet members chose the placate ability for their Wells ship.

    With Jam Sensors and this ability, it was crazy annoying. If I was doing too much damage to him, he'd hit me with Jam Sensors so that he could go attack my team mate. And when he targeted me, I kept losing weapon lock and would attack a cruiser.

    I ended up picking my T4 Romulan passive in the middle of the match. Still waiting on the T4 Omega passives, however. Really curious to know how others like that kinetic proc.

    Since I picked the placate, I'm going to replace the two Borg turrets on my aft with some [crth]x3. Even if they put an immunity on it, I'm still going to want this to proc as often as I can.
  • shimmerlessshimmerless Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    broken1981 wrote: »
    pax, i talked alot about this in my ts. even to a degree in pvp chat.i dont think people are fully understanding the promlem that i had posted about in my post that was ignored. just wanted to show fellow pvp'ers the huge mess up thats been created. now you did some what touch on the subject. the sheild passive and now the placate proc. let me run it down the line,

    fed/klink khg proc, they cit me i cant see them. i crit them and they dissapare again. (lameness anyone)

    t4 passive placate proc (about every 10 secs this passive kicks in)

    cpb doff= placate(3) (yeah sheild drain with a placitae proc goooo sci!!!!)

    entainer doff placate , rand had one actually. tho i did not notice it being something to rush out and buy off the exchange.

    then the random jam sencors skill and random people in ques using ams. my qut tells me things can get compleatly out of control.

    Honestly dude we're in complete agreement, at least over here. We've been talking about it a lot and what it comes down to is the same problem with the insane shield regen thingy: you can focus and stack all of these different sources to the point where your ship is essentially cloaked (although it's likely even worse since I don't think you can "break" a placate with high aux or a scan).

    The whole passive is just a stupid and frustrating thing to put into the game, it comes across like something the devs thought would sound cool so why not throw it in there! It's gonna be even rougher because the counters to a constant placate are very limited, bar AoE or extremely precise timing with overwhelming force.
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  • broken1981broken1981 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    well im sure at some point they will put an immune to the t4 placate passive. they did "tone" down the khg passive proc. to be honest im not finding pvp all that fun. t1 to t3 passives are cool. but t4 to t5 are just imba. picking my t4 sheild regen even made hive less fun. i know that sounds odd but even when a tact cube can only kill you due to bleed is more boring then the 1 shots.

    well i do thank pax for this topic that got people to comment. also for what you had said as well. if i think im the only person frusted i want to bash this game into a million peices. was thinking most people did not give 2 cents less. least now i know there is a line of thought going around it took some weight off. sure its a game, but again a game is ment to be fun. this may have had good intetions by devs but in the process its killing my fun. its usless in pve and crashes the world in pvp. and it stright out sucks that we as pvp'ers can not get together on this hit t5 and do a total respec and just pick our t1 to t3 passives and not go into ques with anything beyond that.

    i just cant understand why we cant all agree to do this. it would keep pvp semi ok. hell most of us dont even use consoles. we did kinda all get together on that. but really we cant count on crytpic to keep pvp clean. we can only achieve this by banding togther, and in the end this is a true sign of respect for a fellow pvp'er
    Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
    I can throw [Fireworks] at you and hope you catch on fire and burn to death lol
  • paxottomanpaxottoman Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    broken1981 wrote: »
    well im sure at some point they will put an immune to the t4 placate passive. they did "tone" down the khg passive proc. to be honest im not finding pvp all that fun. t1 to t3 passives are cool. but t4 to t5 are just imba. picking my t4 sheild regen even made hive less fun. i know that sounds odd but even when a tact cube can only kill you due to bleed is more boring then the 1 shots.

    I'm sure cubes and yourself will be back to 1 shotting stuff in no time.

    I doubt they will keep this stuff going, Bran has already posted something about this. I hope that he looked into the feedback about the lesser OP stuff too on this thread.

    But I doubt speculating will do anyone any good at this point.
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  • broken1981broken1981 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    paxottoman wrote: »
    I'm sure cubes and yourself will be back to 1 shotting stuff in no time.

    I doubt they will keep this stuff going, Bran has already posted something about this. I hope that he looked into the feedback about the lesser OP stuff too on this thread.

    But I doubt speculating will do anyone any good at this point.

    a cube 1 shotting is much better then me flying around with 100% sheilding. the TRIBBLE thats going on is getting old. i have love for this game. most of all pvp. but ive never played a game where balance is so out of control. heck even company of heroes is far more blanced even when they put tales of valor into the game.

    but with these passives i cant see them not making a immune duration to placate t4 proc. im not saying ill leave the game, but ill never step foot into pvp. im hardly in pvp due to tric bombers. im missing out on a huge part of the game i love atm. but like i said when you have 3 tact cubes in hive elites and your sheilds are up with out the use of rsp and sdo doffs something went wrong. ill give anything to have no sheilds in stf again. atm all i need is he 1 and 2 wtf?!?
    Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
    I can throw [Fireworks] at you and hope you catch on fire and burn to death lol
  • archoncrypticarchoncryptic Member, Cryptic Developers Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Just a quick heads up about some relevant changes that are coming:

    -Superior Shield repair is being reduced in effect significantly.
    -Sensor Targeting Assault now triggers a 12 second placate immunity on the target.
    -Fixed bugs that were preventing Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding from working properly.
    -Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding will now heal for a flat number instead of a percentage of your maximum shields. This should, in almost all cases, be an improvement.

    We'll continue to tune these as needed until they feel like they're at an appropriate level of power.
  • mancommancom Member Posts: 784 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    We'll continue to tune these as needed until they feel like they're at an appropriate level of power.
    Could you comment on why you chose to ignore the players' request to have these things unlocked on tribble and ready to test when S7 launched on tribble?

    All of these issues could be found within minutes of unlocking the T4 traits. Obviously your QA team did not bother to check them at all. So why didn't you at least let the players test it before you put it live and ruined the game for a week (or more, depending on how long it takes you to get the fix live)?


    And "is being reduced in effect significantly" is really an insulting way of phrasing the fact that you shipped a completely bugged version. It's not just an issue of you guys choosing wrong values (like so many times before), it's also an issue of messing up the implementation of these values (it ticks every second instead of every six seconds).
    1042856
  • frostyjonesfrostyjones Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Just a quick heads up about some relevant changes that are coming:

    -Superior Shield repair is being reduced in effect significantly.
    -Sensor Targeting Assault now triggers a 12 second placate immunity on the target.
    -Fixed bugs that were preventing Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding from working properly.
    -Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding will now heal for a flat number instead of a percentage of your maximum shields. This should, in almost all cases, be an improvement.

    We'll continue to tune these as needed until they feel like they're at an appropriate level of power.

    I do hope that these changes come with a respec.
  • devorasxdevorasx Member Posts: 693
    edited December 2012
    I do hope that these changes come with a respec.

    I second this. I do not appreciate a change to where we are not compensated for an error the devs made.
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  • dontdrunkimshootdontdrunkimshoot Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Just a quick heads up about some relevant changes that are coming:

    -Superior Shield repair is being reduced in effect significantly.
    -Sensor Targeting Assault now triggers a 12 second placate immunity on the target.
    -Fixed bugs that were preventing Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding from working properly.
    -Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding will now heal for a flat number instead of a percentage of your maximum shields. This should, in almost all cases, be an improvement.

    We'll continue to tune these as needed until they feel like they're at an appropriate level of power.

    excellent! glad to hear. this is stuff that truly should have been unlocked on tribble by default to play with.

    unless the QA team does pvp with stuff like this, its unlikely they would be able to find anything wrong with them. im sure there is a QA team, and that they do try to stress test things, but they simply arent taking it far enough. and far enough is just a simple pvp match. that really should be a job requirement, be able to pvp well. theres no other way to get a true feel for things.

    and pvp is easy, you just need to be armed with the right knowledge. and thats overflowing on this board, fleet team speak and OPVP. then its just a mater of developing skill, and that comes quickly if you have the right knowledge.
  • xantrisxantris Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012

    -Superior Shield repair is being reduced in effect significantly.

    You guys are aware this is a bug right? You keep saying the effect is too strong like its working properly but you need to tweak the numbers. I just want to make sure we fix the actual skill instead of tweaking a bugged version that will then get debugged later and end up being completely useless.
  • jonathanlonehawkjonathanlonehawk Member Posts: 674 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Just a quick heads up about some relevant changes that are coming:

    -Superior Shield repair is being reduced in effect significantly.
    -Sensor Targeting Assault now triggers a 12 second placate immunity on the target.
    -Fixed bugs that were preventing Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding from working properly.
    -Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding will now heal for a flat number instead of a percentage of your maximum shields. This should, in almost all cases, be an improvement.

    We'll continue to tune these as needed until they feel like they're at an appropriate level of power.

    Lots of changes there...

    Free respec, right?
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  • meurikmeurik Member Posts: 856 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Lots of changes there...

    Free respec, right?

    Free? HAHAH!! You must be one of the older STO gamers from around the Pre-F2P time. Post-F2P, NOTHING is ever Free anymore. It's all grind, grind, grind with more grind.
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  • aegon1iceaegon1ice Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    TBH I feel cheated. I spend so much money, time and effort to reach T4 and chose this skill. Now you are telling me that you are going to overhaul this skill, which was obviously shipped totaly bugged and untested.

    I do remember us asking you to get a way to test the reputation system on Tribble, promises were made to make this available before launch of S7 and nothing happened. Instead you pushed it and now players found it out on the hard way. Not your QA.

    I really hope you give us a respec for that. It is simply unfair and not honest of you guys to blame us for your QAs faults.
  • stevehalestevehale Member Posts: 437
    edited December 2012
    Just a quick heads up about some relevant changes that are coming:

    -Superior Shield repair is being reduced in effect significantly.
    -Sensor Targeting Assault now triggers a 12 second placate immunity on the target.
    -Fixed bugs that were preventing Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding from working properly.
    -Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding will now heal for a flat number instead of a percentage of your maximum shields. This should, in almost all cases, be an improvement.

    We'll continue to tune these as needed until they feel like they're at an appropriate level of power.


    Thank you.
    __________________________________________
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  • mrkollinsmrkollins Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    At least we have a change!

    Thanks random system guy :D
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  • phantomeightphantomeight Member Posts: 567 Bug Hunter
    edited December 2012
    Picking a reputation power is permanent... Respecs will not allow you to re pick them
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  • broken1981broken1981 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Just a quick heads up about some relevant changes that are coming:

    -Superior Shield repair is being reduced in effect significantly.
    -Sensor Targeting Assault now triggers a 12 second placate immunity on the target.
    -Fixed bugs that were preventing Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding from working properly.
    -Reactive Shielding and Emergency Secondary Shielding will now heal for a flat number instead of a percentage of your maximum shields. This should, in almost all cases, be an improvement.

    We'll continue to tune these as needed until they feel like they're at an appropriate level of power.

    Awesome love this change. Also placate geting 12 sec immune is awesome. I was thinking 10 secs but 12 is better
    Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
    I can throw [Fireworks] at you and hope you catch on fire and burn to death lol
  • broken1981broken1981 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Picking a reputation power is permanent... Respecs will not allow you to re pick them
    We can respec our passives. But its very stupid for people asking for a free one.
    Join Date: Dec 2007Originally Posted by BROKEN1981
    I can throw [Fireworks] at you and hope you catch on fire and burn to death lol
  • baudlbaudl Member Posts: 4,060 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    acording to dStahl and "ask cryptic", there will be a reselecting feature for the reputation powers in early 2013...
    so no respecc needed, but what that means is pretty clear...you are stuck with that power for a couple of month to come.
    Go pro or go home
  • blznfunblznfun Member Posts: 241 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Before I going ranting and raving here...

    I like this passive skill. Its not "unbeatable" as some may think. First of all, you are only going to get that shield regen listed based off your shield power. If your a tac and run around with full weapons secondary engines, like I do, you're not going to see the full benefit. I really fail to see what the problem is with this passive.

    It needs to stay AS IT. As I said, its not unbeatable, if not right away, in time. Just takes a little more fineness. Its not like the SNB doffs where you couldn't combat it, this can be.

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  • blznfunblznfun Member Posts: 241 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    If it must be changed, a deduction of ONLY 25% should make "better" for the ones complaining that its overpowered.

    Does anyone not realize that this is the chance to get away from the "cookie cutter" builds? Having this shield heal (passive) could augment something else or let you get rid of a shield heal in leu of something else since you really wouldn't need it anymore. Trade out a TSS for a Tractor beam or something else...

    Come on guys, be realistic here. This passive gives opportunities.

    As I stated this was based off of shield power. That is an assumption. If this isn't correct, maybe making it based off that instead of a outright nerf? Running 125 shield power would give you the full effect of the passive being reduced exponetially based off shield power level?
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  • p2wsucksp2wsucks Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    blznfun wrote: »
    If it must be changed, a deduction of ONLY 25% should make "better" for the ones complaining that its overpowered.

    Does anyone not realize that this is the chance to get away from the "cookie cutter" builds? Having this shield heal (passive) could augment something else or let you get rid of a shield heal in leu of something else since you really wouldn't need it anymore. Trade out a TSS for a Tractor beam or something else...

    Come on guys, be realistic here. This passive gives opportunities.

    As I stated this was based off of shield power. That is an assumption. If this isn't correct, maybe making it based off that instead of a outright nerf? Running 125 shield power would give you the full effect of the passive?

    I take it you have no idea how easy it is to max power in multple systems these days. Also, it is possible to pilot ships w/minimal shield repairs. On 1 of my toons all I have is 2xepts, Sci Team, Shield Batt. Another EPTS3, RSP1, Shield Batt, Sci Team, aux2batt. That leaves plenty of boff stations for other things.

    Shields have been a joke for awhile now. The fixed the exploit of shield swapping, then introduce a doff which at the time had greater shield repair than TSS3, they nerf that and then "nerf" borg set to trigger when it's needed most, then they nerf that and introduce not only this TRIBBLE, but sci console shield repair procs as well.

    This stuff has been like putting training wheels on a Harley.
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  • aquitaine985aquitaine985 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    12 second placate seems a remarkably long time to me.
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  • shimmerlessshimmerless Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    blznfun wrote: »
    Before I going ranting and raving here...

    I like this passive skill. Its not "unbeatable" as some may think. First of all, you are only going to get that shield regen listed based off your shield power. If your a tac and run around with full weapons secondary engines, like I do, you're not going to see the full benefit. I really fail to see what the problem is with this passive.

    It needs to stay AS IT. As I said, its not unbeatable, if not right away, in time. Just takes a little more fineness. Its not like the SNB doffs where you couldn't combat it, this can be.

    Jeremy

    I think it's worth watching one of Hilbert's videos on the subject. The shield regen isn't just strong, it's outright absurd. Can you imagine someone being Extended with this passive on? No amount of damage, no tet glider in the world would break an inch off that barrier.

    The highest-damaging base weapons in the game, Dual Heavy Cannons, only fire a burst once every 3 seconds. In the time it takes for your DHCs to ready again, your shields have already regenerated ~3,600 (possibly even per facing, making it 14,400). This is magnitudes higher than that of the total unbuffed DHC damage, and a good chunk of the fully-buffed damage as well. This is before shield resistance, natural regen, BOff power resistances and other sources have substantially dampened the cannon damage.

    I don't use DHCs as an example because I want to encourage "cookie cutter builds", it's because if DHCs struggle to make a dent, every other weapon class will be worthless. Everyone will be running around tric bombing and tranny-clustering each other, with occasional bouts of DEM/FAW-spam. It's absurd.
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  • admgreeradmgreer Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Picking a reputation power is permanent... Respecs will not allow you to re pick them

    Umm. I did a Respec today and it let me re-choose all 4 of my Reputation abilities no problem. I dont know what problem you may have had but it worked fine for me.
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