This is not a bad update I myself use the 4 peice anyway just for the tractor beam, although running a MACO mk xii shield with the borg set on elites was just too much fun.
At the risk of re-igniting the flames, allow me to attempt to explain the reasoning behind this change...
The Borg Space Set was originally balanced around the concept of players using all four pieces. This included the Regenerative Shield.
After the set went live, it became very evident that the vast majority of players did not wish to use the Borg Shield. Instead, they began running 2- and 3-piece conglomerations of Borg Set + Other Shields (and frequently Other Engines or Deflectors).
The trouble this presented, is that the passive heal procs present on the 2- and 3-piece Borg Set bonuses were intended originally to offset the downside presented by having a low-capacity shield array in an end-game environment where heavy spike damage was present (STFs). When you remove that shield from the mix, and replace it with a high-capacity alternative, you begin to receive all of the benefits and none of the downsides.
Hence an imbalance came to pass.
Even after the Borg Set Bonuses were toned down several months ago, nothing really changed. The vast majority of players continued to run Borg 2- or 3-piece, plus a shield of their choosing, benefiting from a design oversight to a degree that left combat in an imbalanced state.
By removing the Console from the Borg Space Set, we've brought a semblance of balance back to that equation. Now, in order to benefit from the set bonuses in the manner that was originally intended, players must use the Shield that was intended to be a part of the package as a whole.
This is not a change we undertook lightly, as we're always hesitant to take things away from players that have already earned them through a potentially time-consuming process. In fact, this is why we added the previous 4-piece bonus (Borg Tractor Beam) to the 3-piece set, instead of including it as one of the bonuses of the new "Alt Set." So that players that had already earned this equipment lost nothing, and did not have to go out and earn new equipment in order to get something they already had.
We're watching the aftermath of all of this very closely to ensure that our motivations for making the choices that we did, match up with the results that players are experiencing. It may come to pass that the Borg Set items, or associated Set Bonuses, now need to be improved under this new design. That's something we'll continue to keep on our radar.
As one result of the feedback we've already received in relation to this change, we're performing another performance review of all of the STF set bonuses, with a specific focus on the 3-piece abilities. This includes the Heavy Graviton Beam, Gravitic Anchor, and Mask Energy Field. All of these powers will be improved in some manner, along with an upcoming patch.
Except that 3-piece + Covariant is the best tanking setup in the game. Why do I have to take a full 30% reduction in max shield capacity (and it IS 30% - 31%, actually, for me) and get a power that I don't even LIKE to make Cryptic happy? I love this game, and I usually like the devs. However, this choice is by far the biggest middle finger I've gotten from the devs, ESPECIALLY because it wasn't in the patch notes and indeed was discovered almost by ACCIDENT. Those weapons better be by far the most powerful things in the game, or you're going to make a LOT of people unhappy.
Or, you could give us a power more worth it than a tractor beam with a negligible power drain and a bloody FIVE MINUTE cooldown. I'll go along with this change on one condition: Replace the Tractor Beam with a Borg Shield Neutralizer. That's the only way a 5-minute cooldown and such a steep shield capacity loss will be in any way worth it. Without that, the Retro set will be completely irrelevant.
rubbish. The ONLY reason I use the borg engine and console is for the repair buff, so now I'm looking at ditching 2 items. Might as well go back to the AEGIS set since the 3 piece omega and khg bonus's are completely useless to me, but at least I get a console slot back for my ablative armour.
while i have your attention Borticus, add the Warp 14 bonus to more Engines and i (and probably many others) will gladly toss the Borg set away in favor of othe Sets.
99% of the reason that i CANT get rid of the old borg set items, even if i wanted, is that sector space travel time is simply the FASTEST with the Borg Engine, and if i have the borg engine equipped anyway i can as well slap that console on... and who cares about deflectors anyway, so the borg deflector goes on there as well, so that is MY reasoning for the Borg 3 piece + 1 random better shield.
i NEED the SPEED and i'm too LAZY to swap the engine every time i enter sector space.
i painfully notice anything that is slower than Driver Coil 9 + Borg Engines instantly,
Warp 10 is a bad joke by now.
i don't use the Slipstream often either because i rarely fly through all 3 sectors of a sectorblock, i have to bounce left and right into exploration sectors all the time and often have to turn around because my Ship spawns looking in the wrong direction
so Borg engine is simply THE BEST for DOffing.
Even the MACO XII engine is SLOWER.
yes DOffing!
i need to get around fast to DOff efficiently and if ALL my 11 Chars are forced to use that same engine, i can as well take the set boni with me while i use it. even if i personally think that the borg set has already been nerfed into the ground by the "ballance pass", not to mention that the passive heals always trigger when i dont need them and dont trigger when they could save my rear end for a second or two more.
So YES i'd be glad to toss it in favor of another set, if it weren't for that engine!
PS: i was utterly disappointed to learn just recently that the Klingon Honor Guard Set Engine doesn't even have the sector speed buff that the MACO engine has, so if Klingons want to do anything faster than Warp 10 they are limited to this one engine.
Except that 3-piece + Covariant is the best tanking setup in the game. Why do I have to take a full 30% reduction in max shield capacity (and it IS 30% - 31%, actually, for me) and get a power that I don't even LIKE to make Cryptic happy? I love this game, and I usually like the devs. However, this choice is by far the biggest middle finger I've gotten from the devs, ESPECIALLY because it wasn't in the patch notes and indeed was discovered almost by ACCIDENT. Those weapons better be by far the most powerful things in the game, or you're going to make a LOT of people unhappy.
Or, you could give us a power more worth it than a tractor beam with a negligible power drain and a bloody FIVE MINUTE cooldown. I'll go along with this change on one condition: Replace the Tractor Beam with a Borg Shield Neutralizer. That's the only way a 5-minute cooldown and such a steep shield capacity loss will be in any way worth it. Without that, the Retro set will be completely irrelevant.
Why do you have to?
Because you, and others, were essentially using an exploit in the system to benefit yourselves... now, that exploit is being removed
So call it a middle finger all you want, but it's actually making things right imo
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
I'll reserve judgement until I see the changes fully on Tribble, but you are TRIBBLE over a lot of players. I would of loved to have seen the ability to augment more sets. For example, a science flying a Temporal Vessel with MACO Deflector, MACO Shields, Borg Engines, Borg Console and all three Temporal Warfare pieces gets a MACO, Borg and Temporal buff (could also run both ship consoles). I liked the idea of adding a console to the MACO and OMEGA sets so you could fly MACO x2 and OMEGA x2 or add other 4 piece sets, for more possibilities and combination (IDIC, or infinite diversity in infinite combinations).
Hi, my name is: Elim Garak, Former Cardassian Oppressor
LTS, here since...when did this game launch again?
I only really use the retro engines for sector space travel LOL... with much better combos out there with omega and khg/maco theres not much of any reason for me to use anything but the engines for doffing. I am kinda hoping that season 7's reputation rewards with stf gear isn't just a nerf or upping 0.001% stats on existing items. That is what its sounding like to me that its not anything new just a grind to get something that is marginally better for min/maxers.
Except that 3-piece + Covariant is the best tanking setup in the game. Why do I have to take a full 30% reduction in max shield capacity (and it IS 30% - 31%, actually, for me) and get a power that I don't even LIKE to make Cryptic happy? I love this game, and I usually like the devs. However, this choice is by far the biggest middle finger I've gotten from the devs, ESPECIALLY because it wasn't in the patch notes and indeed was discovered almost by ACCIDENT. Those weapons better be by far the most powerful things in the game, or you're going to make a LOT of people unhappy.
Or, you could give us a power more worth it than a tractor beam with a negligible power drain and a bloody FIVE MINUTE cooldown. I'll go along with this change on one condition: Replace the Tractor Beam with a Borg Shield Neutralizer. That's the only way a 5-minute cooldown and such a steep shield capacity loss will be in any way worth it. Without that, the Retro set will be completely irrelevant.
You seem to have not read his post...
He's already said if it appears the set is now too weak, they'd look at adjusting it.
Will we see an "un-nerfing" before it hits Holodeck? Probably not. I think something like that requires a massive amount of data that a sample like Tribble can't provide.
What form that "un-nerfing" takes? Who knows. But it sounds like their intent is to make sure each 3-piece set is worth running for one reason or another (though maybe not for what the players were trying to do with them).
And I'll note here (possibly again)...this is in part why I don't worry about PvP. When changes are made, it sometimes forces whole builds to be changed. I do'nt have the time or energy to re-re-re build until I finally have it right before another massive change is made.
Because you, and others, were essentially using an exploit in the system to benefit yourselves... now, that exploit is being removed
So call it a middle finger all you want, but it's actually making things right imo
It's not an exploit. It's using a 3-piece set bonus more effectively than intentional. Now that I'm being forced to use a shield made of rice paper, tanking in ANY form in this game is dead. Long live the reign of glass cannons and exploding every five bloody seconds. You wouldn't be calling it an exploit if you'd actually used it.
He's already said if it appears the set is now too weak, they'd look at adjusting it.
Will we see an "un-nerfing" before it hits Holodeck? Probably not. I think something like that requires a massive amount of data that a sample like Tribble can't provide.
What form that "un-nerfing" takes? Who knows. But it sounds like their intent is to make sure each 3-piece set is worth running for one reason or another (though maybe not for what the players were trying to do with them).
And I'll note here (possibly again)...this is in part why I don't worry about PvP. When changes are made, it sometimes forces whole builds to be changed. I do'nt have the time or energy to re-re-re build until I finally have it right before another massive change is made.
I read every word of it. If they want to look at "adjusting" it, revert the changes or give us a decent active power to use with it. That tractor beam is the definition of useless, considering I can best the effects with a BOFF tractor beam and the Breen set (whose power drain is greatly superior and has a much shorter CD).
It's not an exploit. It's using a 3-piece set bonus more effectively than intentional. Now that I'm being forced to use a shield made of rice paper, tanking in ANY form in this game is dead. Long live the reign of glass cannons and exploding every five bloody seconds. You wouldn't be calling it an exploit if you'd actually used it.
I read every word of it. If they want to look at "adjusting" it, revert the changes or give us a decent active power to use with it. That tractor beam is the definition of useless, considering I can best the effects with a BOFF tractor beam and the Breen set (whose power drain is greatly superior and has a much shorter CD).
But I have, and I approve these changes And obviously your definition of exploit is different than mine
And sorry, but this is the right thing to do. Mixing sets like the Borg and MACO was gaining much more effectiveness than intentional... which is an exploit, technically. By removing it, it's falling into it's proper place You have your own opinion on the situation, but that's how it is
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
But I have, and I approve these changes And obviously your definition of exploit is different than mine
Sorry, but this is the right thing to do. Mixing sets like the Borg and MACO was gaining much more effectiveness than intentional... which is an exploit, technically. By removing it, it's falling into it's proper place You have your own opinion on the situation, but that's how it is
An exploit would be finding an invincibility glitch and using it to run STFs, like Voldemort way back when. This was a tactic. A build, like any other.
On to your other comment, so its "proper place" is total uselessness? I had nearly 13,000 shield capacity before this, and they were STILL being ripped apart before this. Now I've got 9,075, and that will vanish even FASTER. You may like being torn to ribbons because the Borg stick on you whether or not you're cloaked and halfway across the map, but I don't. And yes, I HAVE had that happen. Hell, I had an Elite Tactical Cube chasing an Advanced Escort for 10 minutes. But, back on topic, the point is that we had a passable tank build, and cruisers had half an iota of relevance in STFs. Now, the reign of the Glass Cannon Escort will be complete and eternal, and I don't like that playstyle. I did NOT pay $200 to EXPLODE.
The existing set is becoming Mk XI. Under the Omega Reputation, there will also be Mk X and Mk XII versions available.
Can I make a strong suggestion?
Either find a way for set bonuses to function across marks or make the higher mark version award a higher set bonus.
As it stands, Mk XII sets have too little increased benefit and someone who has two out of three pieces may hold out on equipping until they get all 3, because they'd be losing their complete Mk XI set bonus. Whereas if Mk XII has a better set bonus, swapping the 3 piece Mk XI for the 2 piece Mk XII becomes more of a choice.
If they keep the mark XII versions as random chance in the new system, then I highly agree that the set bonuses should be able to mix and match mark levels, since they don't change depending on which ones you level anyway.
They just just adjust it as XI and let it be what has always been a bridge for some players until they get their maco/khg/omega sets.
The kinda things I would like to see them engage in with their little time that they have is making more things like fleet events and such that can give fleet marks and dilithium so you can enjoy it and not be worried about oohh i gotta go do some fleet marks or i gotta do dilithium bring it back to what it was stated in their interview when stoked came to see them... "Dilithium is going to be a currency based on time played".
Also with revamps there needs to be one for the b'rel, intrepid, and the transphasics. Based on how some devs were talking in the past those employeed with Cryptic and not employed with them anymore the transphasics by design were suppossed to give the competitiveness that cannon and beam builds give for offense but even with the increase to 40% shield penetration it really doesn't come close to what it was stated to be working as intended. Also I can understand how the kar'fi phase cloak works but the intrepid needs a reworking of how that ablative armor works. My view of how it should work is a certain hp and damage resist buff when enough damage is taken then it would disassemble the armor once its integrity has been exhausted other than the current thinking of a 10 second buff. The b'rel issue goes back to the transphasics since with the nerfing with shield drains and such they don't even work well with it in PvE much less PvP so its loosing its integrity in the game as what it is basically advertised as a projectile BoP. I just rather Cryptic work on things that need to be nerfed or improved instead of things like this retro set which is fine the way it already is.
Edit: Another thing annoys me though with how the b'rel and common setups that one would use with them for purposes of the EBC... It always comes out with a change that lasts a week or two that makes it fun to fly them but then is removed with no consistency on balance with them.
everyone's favorite crutch just got kicked out from under them
good, borg 3 part with a high cap shield has always been too good. how many redundant super shield heals do you people need anyway? cycling EPtS, TSS, RSF, RSP, BFI doffs, isnt that enough? the 2 pieces set bonus is better anyway, its a HUGE hull heal, and you get to keep your high cap shield
it makes sense that just the low cap borg shield should be able to do that regeneration, i approve. now those pug escorts wont be quite the zombies they are currently.
getting the tractor for running the whole set to is a nice touch, i approve of the reasoning, anyone who ran the full set loses nothing. and if you all think a tractor beam isn't an incredibly powerful tool, your noob is showing.a tractor beam at the right time, wile an escort is trying to gun down someone, will boost the damage the target takes tremendously because you just wiped away their defense score.
everyone forgets about the borg set's counterpart, aegis, anymore. the set bonuses were great, but the shield sucks, its a cap2, if that was improved i'd like to give this set a try again. make the shield a [cap]2, [reg]2, or cap2, Reduces All Energy Damage to Shields by 10% like maco. the breen, jemhadar, and reman set could use some love too, but i'd like to see aegis fixed on the most
I'll reserve judgement until I see the changes fully on Tribble, but you are TRIBBLE over a lot of players. I would of loved to have seen the ability to augment more sets. For example, a science flying a Temporal Vessel with MACO Deflector, MACO Shields, Borg Engines, Borg Console and all three Temporal Warfare pieces gets a MACO, Borg and Temporal buff (could also run both ship consoles). I liked the idea of adding a console to the MACO and OMEGA sets so you could fly MACO x2 and OMEGA x2 or add other 4 piece sets, for more possibilities and combination (IDIC, or infinite diversity in infinite combinations).
I'll just point that almost invariably when space sets come up in forum posts or game chat, the combo that comes up is 3 Piece Borg and MACO Shield (or KHG Shield). When everyone (for some value of "everybody") is saying the same thing, that's an alarm bell that says it need to be looked at.
I use the same thing in my day job. When a large number of users are complaining about or reporting the same thing, that warrant me paying attention to it. Even if all of my monitors systems say that nothing is wrong.
The trouble this presented, is that the passive heal procs present on the 2- and 3-piece Borg Set bonuses were intended originally to offset the downside presented by having a low-capacity shield array in an end-game environment where heavy spike damage was present (STFs). When you remove that shield from the mix, and replace it with a high-capacity alternative, you begin to receive all of the benefits and none of the downsides.
Translation: "We noticed some of you were having too much fun, and we decided it was time we did something about it."
An exploit would be finding an invincibility glitch and using it to run STFs, like Voldemort way back when. This was a tactic. A build, like any other.
On to your other comment, so its "proper place" is total uselessness? I had nearly 13,000 shield capacity before this, and they were STILL being ripped apart before this. Now I've got 9,075, and that will vanish even FASTER. You may like being torn to ribbons because the Borg stick on you whether or not you're cloaked and halfway across the map, but I don't. And yes, I HAVE had that happen. Hell, I had an Elite Tactical Cube chasing an Advanced Escort for 10 minutes. But, back on topic, the point is that we had a passable tank build, and cruisers had half an iota of relevance in STFs. Now, the reign of the Glass Cannon Escort will be complete and eternal, and I don't like that playstyle. I did NOT pay $200 to EXPLODE.
Funny, because using the Borg Set combo this thread describes, I always exploded Now I don't use that set, and that doesn't happen anymore
It's simple: you can move on and try something else that works. People were abusing that combo like no tomorrow, and now it's finally over. I'm glad for that
At the risk of re-igniting the flames, allow me to attempt to explain the reasoning behind this change...
The Borg Space Set was originally balanced around the concept of players using all four pieces. This included the Regenerative Shield.
After the set went live, it became very evident that the vast majority of players did not wish to use the Borg Shield. Instead, they began running 2- and 3-piece conglomerations of Borg Set + Other Shields (and frequently Other Engines or Deflectors).
I just want to pipe up here about something that I've tried to get across a couple times before but always seems to get drowned out. Most of the sets have great 2 pcs bonuses but the idea of putting an activate-able ability as the top tier ability is DEEPLY flawed. Nerfing the Borg set may cause people to stop using the 3 BORG + MACO shield setup, but it doesn't solve the root of the issue.
The truth is, I have NEVER considered equipping a full set of space gear. Most of the abilities are either weak, have a long cool down, or don't fit the set they're applied to. In other words: The benefit of equipping a complete set is not, and never has been, worth the cost.
The borg tractor, for example, recharges magnitudes slower then the T1 tractor power. Granted it has a power drain, but what's worth more: a relatively weak power drain or much higher shield strength from another shield?
The full set bonus for a set should be the biggest, most appetizing ability, on the set. People should be looking at a set and torn by gaining the set bonuses and having to deal with the sets drawbacks. The current design actually gives players more incentive to equip 2of3 or 3of4 set pieces on their ships.
If you wanted more people to use the full sets remove the activate-able abilities from the bonuses and move them to consoles (which may or may not be part of the set) and give us passives that are worth equipping the set.
I should mention that the ground STF sets dont suffer from this issue because the nature of the set bonus, instant re modulation, is a huge boon. The other ground sets however, do.
That's just my opinion anyways, I'm guessing there's more then one person around here that will agree with me.
Funny, because using the Borg Set combo this thread describes, I always exploded Now I don't use that set, and that doesn't happen anymore
It's simple: you can move on and try something else that works. People were abusing that combo like no tomorrow, and now it's finally over. I'm glad for that
OR "You're abusing our sets, and we're putting a stop to that".
Seriously, it's not that hard :rolleyes:
:rolleyes:
You don't get to call it "abuse" just because the developers didn't think things through in advance, and I can't agree with punishing us for what they've now decided was a "mistake."
You don't get to call it "abuse" just because the developers didn't think things through in advance, and I can't agree with punishing us for what they've now decided was a "mistake."
No, but I can agree with correcting it
Which is much better than criticizing them for making the mistake in the first place. We all do that anyway with something or another, or we don't think things through in advance
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Funny, because using the Borg Set combo this thread describes, I always exploded Now I don't use that set, and that doesn't happen anymore
It's simple: you can move on and try something else that works. People were abusing that combo like no tomorrow, and now it's finally over. I'm glad for that
The fact of the matter is, the Elite STFs are an environment where a Borg torpedo (not even a HIGH YIELD torpedo) has been known to crit through 7,000 shield and 58,000 Hull. Reducing the amount of shield someone can have in order for them to keep a regen proc is nonsensical. It's like they said, "Hey, someone's having too much fun. NERF NERF NERF."
And it's not abuse.It's just use, and I very RARELY saw anyone using it, so glued up the aft section of the MACO/Omega sets had they become. I'll be glad when Cryptic nerfs the living Gre'thor out of glass cannons and see you whining about that.
Now I'm just waiting for TOR to go F2P, because Cryptic just made me not want to play this game anymore. If it hadn't been for the fact that my Lifteime was a birthday present, I'd unsubscribe. They've screwed up THAT bad.
Now I'm just waiting for TOR to go F2P, because Cryptic just made me not want to play this game anymore. If it hadn't been for the fact that my Lifteime was a birthday present, I'd unsubscribe. They've screwed up THAT bad.
Maybe your standards are just too high
But seriously, I don't agree with that assessment, as I enjoy this game, even as my opinion of the grinds is merely 'meh'.
Then again, I enjoy the medicore as much as the best And I don't care which STO is, whether in opinion or fact; I still enjoy it
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
getting the tractor for running the whole set to is a nice touch, i approve of the reasoning, anyone who ran the full set loses nothing. and if you all think a tractor beam isn't an incredibly powerful tool, your noob is showing.a tractor beam at the right time, wile an escort is trying to gun down someone, will boost the damage the target takes tremendously because you just wiped away their defense score.
In regards to Tractor Beams, a lot of people don't realize how good they for increasing damage. A ship which at a dead stop not only lose their speed Defense Bonus , they are inflicted with a -15% Defense Penalty on top of everything else. (Any lighbulbs going off?)
Its not the end of the world, people need to quit worrying about this. Tanking tac cubes is still easy in a cruiser using full MACO, Honor Guard, or Omega, I still usually survive tanking tac cube in escort too unless they get a lucky super high damage crit. I get hit by plasma torps all the time too since I let them hit me on purpose at point blank range to damage the cubes and still rarely die. Even my BOP can tank a cube long enough to solo it without 3pc borg, it really is unecessary and a crutch.
I use all the 3 pc sets all the time in STF now to get used to not using 3pc Borg and haven't had any problems. In fact I like how all the sets engines have better turnrate and deflecters have better stats too.
im honestly on both sides of the fence with this change i see why it was done but i also use the MACO XII with the 3 piece borg set i really don't see me losing much from it all i really lose the shielding i honestly don't see why everyone is so up in arms over the shield regen proc it was useful yes but ultimately fickle. im not real hurt at the change but like the borg i will adapt i may just go with a MACO/Omega Hybrid playing off the tet glyder while retaining a good shield plus accuracy is kinda important to a escort. it was a fun run with the set but i kinda agree it was kinda exploiting the set with its regen ability of the shield but hey i used the borg shield before hand as well in place of the MACO before i got it and i really did not blow up much and i fly a Defiant R so you may complain all ya want but i say it is a good balance of gameplay.
But seriously, I don't agree with that assessment, as I enjoy this game, even as my opinion of the grinds is merely 'meh'.
Then again, I enjoy the medicore as much as the best And I don't care which STO is, whether in opinion or fact; I still enjoy it
Half of that assessment is simple fact. I have LITERALLY been hit for 65k+ damage from one plasma torpedo. Many of the recent choices Cryptic has made (Bind to Characters, Into the Hive, the Dilithium Tax on Crafting, etc.) rubbed me wrong. There have been very few choices I liked, and this is nearly the last straw. It DOES seem like Cryptic doesn't want us to have fun. I play this game to have fun, and one of the best ways is being ripped out for a completely arbitrary reason.
Comments
Except that 3-piece + Covariant is the best tanking setup in the game. Why do I have to take a full 30% reduction in max shield capacity (and it IS 30% - 31%, actually, for me) and get a power that I don't even LIKE to make Cryptic happy? I love this game, and I usually like the devs. However, this choice is by far the biggest middle finger I've gotten from the devs, ESPECIALLY because it wasn't in the patch notes and indeed was discovered almost by ACCIDENT. Those weapons better be by far the most powerful things in the game, or you're going to make a LOT of people unhappy.
Or, you could give us a power more worth it than a tractor beam with a negligible power drain and a bloody FIVE MINUTE cooldown. I'll go along with this change on one condition: Replace the Tractor Beam with a Borg Shield Neutralizer. That's the only way a 5-minute cooldown and such a steep shield capacity loss will be in any way worth it. Without that, the Retro set will be completely irrelevant.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
99% of the reason that i CANT get rid of the old borg set items, even if i wanted, is that sector space travel time is simply the FASTEST with the Borg Engine, and if i have the borg engine equipped anyway i can as well slap that console on... and who cares about deflectors anyway, so the borg deflector goes on there as well, so that is MY reasoning for the Borg 3 piece + 1 random better shield.
i NEED the SPEED and i'm too LAZY to swap the engine every time i enter sector space.
i painfully notice anything that is slower than Driver Coil 9 + Borg Engines instantly,
Warp 10 is a bad joke by now.
i don't use the Slipstream often either because i rarely fly through all 3 sectors of a sectorblock, i have to bounce left and right into exploration sectors all the time and often have to turn around because my Ship spawns looking in the wrong direction
so Borg engine is simply THE BEST for DOffing.
Even the MACO XII engine is SLOWER.
yes DOffing!
i need to get around fast to DOff efficiently and if ALL my 11 Chars are forced to use that same engine, i can as well take the set boni with me while i use it. even if i personally think that the borg set has already been nerfed into the ground by the "ballance pass", not to mention that the passive heals always trigger when i dont need them and dont trigger when they could save my rear end for a second or two more.
So YES i'd be glad to toss it in favor of another set, if it weren't for that engine!
PS: i was utterly disappointed to learn just recently that the Klingon Honor Guard Set Engine doesn't even have the sector speed buff that the MACO engine has, so if Klingons want to do anything faster than Warp 10 they are limited to this one engine.
Without the regeneration bonus and the high shield of other set the ship and the character are totally useless.
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Perfect World Entertainment Community Rules and Policies . ~BranFlakes
Because you, and others, were essentially using an exploit in the system to benefit yourselves... now, that exploit is being removed
So call it a middle finger all you want, but it's actually making things right imo
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
LTS, here since...when did this game launch again?
You seem to have not read his post...
He's already said if it appears the set is now too weak, they'd look at adjusting it.
Will we see an "un-nerfing" before it hits Holodeck? Probably not. I think something like that requires a massive amount of data that a sample like Tribble can't provide.
What form that "un-nerfing" takes? Who knows. But it sounds like their intent is to make sure each 3-piece set is worth running for one reason or another (though maybe not for what the players were trying to do with them).
And I'll note here (possibly again)...this is in part why I don't worry about PvP. When changes are made, it sometimes forces whole builds to be changed. I do'nt have the time or energy to re-re-re build until I finally have it right before another massive change is made.
It's not an exploit. It's using a 3-piece set bonus more effectively than intentional. Now that I'm being forced to use a shield made of rice paper, tanking in ANY form in this game is dead. Long live the reign of glass cannons and exploding every five bloody seconds. You wouldn't be calling it an exploit if you'd actually used it.
I read every word of it. If they want to look at "adjusting" it, revert the changes or give us a decent active power to use with it. That tractor beam is the definition of useless, considering I can best the effects with a BOFF tractor beam and the Breen set (whose power drain is greatly superior and has a much shorter CD).
And sorry, but this is the right thing to do. Mixing sets like the Borg and MACO was gaining much more effectiveness than intentional... which is an exploit, technically. By removing it, it's falling into it's proper place
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
On to your other comment, so its "proper place" is total uselessness? I had nearly 13,000 shield capacity before this, and they were STILL being ripped apart before this. Now I've got 9,075, and that will vanish even FASTER. You may like being torn to ribbons because the Borg stick on you whether or not you're cloaked and halfway across the map, but I don't. And yes, I HAVE had that happen. Hell, I had an Elite Tactical Cube chasing an Advanced Escort for 10 minutes. But, back on topic, the point is that we had a passable tank build, and cruisers had half an iota of relevance in STFs. Now, the reign of the Glass Cannon Escort will be complete and eternal, and I don't like that playstyle. I did NOT pay $200 to EXPLODE.
Can I make a strong suggestion?
Either find a way for set bonuses to function across marks or make the higher mark version award a higher set bonus.
As it stands, Mk XII sets have too little increased benefit and someone who has two out of three pieces may hold out on equipping until they get all 3, because they'd be losing their complete Mk XI set bonus. Whereas if Mk XII has a better set bonus, swapping the 3 piece Mk XI for the 2 piece Mk XII becomes more of a choice.
The kinda things I would like to see them engage in with their little time that they have is making more things like fleet events and such that can give fleet marks and dilithium so you can enjoy it and not be worried about oohh i gotta go do some fleet marks or i gotta do dilithium bring it back to what it was stated in their interview when stoked came to see them... "Dilithium is going to be a currency based on time played".
Also with revamps there needs to be one for the b'rel, intrepid, and the transphasics. Based on how some devs were talking in the past those employeed with Cryptic and not employed with them anymore the transphasics by design were suppossed to give the competitiveness that cannon and beam builds give for offense but even with the increase to 40% shield penetration it really doesn't come close to what it was stated to be working as intended. Also I can understand how the kar'fi phase cloak works but the intrepid needs a reworking of how that ablative armor works. My view of how it should work is a certain hp and damage resist buff when enough damage is taken then it would disassemble the armor once its integrity has been exhausted other than the current thinking of a 10 second buff. The b'rel issue goes back to the transphasics since with the nerfing with shield drains and such they don't even work well with it in PvE much less PvP so its loosing its integrity in the game as what it is basically advertised as a projectile BoP. I just rather Cryptic work on things that need to be nerfed or improved instead of things like this retro set which is fine the way it already is.
Edit: Another thing annoys me though with how the b'rel and common setups that one would use with them for purposes of the EBC... It always comes out with a change that lasts a week or two that makes it fun to fly them but then is removed with no consistency on balance with them.
good, borg 3 part with a high cap shield has always been too good. how many redundant super shield heals do you people need anyway? cycling EPtS, TSS, RSF, RSP, BFI doffs, isnt that enough? the 2 pieces set bonus is better anyway, its a HUGE hull heal, and you get to keep your high cap shield
it makes sense that just the low cap borg shield should be able to do that regeneration, i approve. now those pug escorts wont be quite the zombies they are currently.
getting the tractor for running the whole set to is a nice touch, i approve of the reasoning, anyone who ran the full set loses nothing. and if you all think a tractor beam isn't an incredibly powerful tool, your noob is showing.a tractor beam at the right time, wile an escort is trying to gun down someone, will boost the damage the target takes tremendously because you just wiped away their defense score.
everyone forgets about the borg set's counterpart, aegis, anymore. the set bonuses were great, but the shield sucks, its a cap2, if that was improved i'd like to give this set a try again. make the shield a [cap]2, [reg]2, or cap2, Reduces All Energy Damage to Shields by 10% like maco. the breen, jemhadar, and reman set could use some love too, but i'd like to see aegis fixed on the most
I'll just point that almost invariably when space sets come up in forum posts or game chat, the combo that comes up is 3 Piece Borg and MACO Shield (or KHG Shield). When everyone (for some value of "everybody") is saying the same thing, that's an alarm bell that says it need to be looked at.
I use the same thing in my day job. When a large number of users are complaining about or reporting the same thing, that warrant me paying attention to it. Even if all of my monitors systems say that nothing is wrong.
Translation: "We noticed some of you were having too much fun, and we decided it was time we did something about it."
:mad:
It's simple: you can move on and try something else that works. People were abusing that combo like no tomorrow, and now it's finally over. I'm glad for that OR "You're abusing our sets, and we're putting a stop to that".
Seriously, it's not that hard :rolleyes:
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
I just want to pipe up here about something that I've tried to get across a couple times before but always seems to get drowned out. Most of the sets have great 2 pcs bonuses but the idea of putting an activate-able ability as the top tier ability is DEEPLY flawed. Nerfing the Borg set may cause people to stop using the 3 BORG + MACO shield setup, but it doesn't solve the root of the issue.
The truth is, I have NEVER considered equipping a full set of space gear. Most of the abilities are either weak, have a long cool down, or don't fit the set they're applied to. In other words: The benefit of equipping a complete set is not, and never has been, worth the cost.
The borg tractor, for example, recharges magnitudes slower then the T1 tractor power. Granted it has a power drain, but what's worth more: a relatively weak power drain or much higher shield strength from another shield?
The full set bonus for a set should be the biggest, most appetizing ability, on the set. People should be looking at a set and torn by gaining the set bonuses and having to deal with the sets drawbacks. The current design actually gives players more incentive to equip 2of3 or 3of4 set pieces on their ships.
If you wanted more people to use the full sets remove the activate-able abilities from the bonuses and move them to consoles (which may or may not be part of the set) and give us passives that are worth equipping the set.
I should mention that the ground STF sets dont suffer from this issue because the nature of the set bonus, instant re modulation, is a huge boon. The other ground sets however, do.
That's just my opinion anyways, I'm guessing there's more then one person around here that will agree with me.
:rolleyes:
You don't get to call it "abuse" just because the developers didn't think things through in advance, and I can't agree with punishing us for what they've now decided was a "mistake."
Which is much better than criticizing them for making the mistake in the first place. We all do that anyway with something or another, or we don't think things through in advance
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
The fact of the matter is, the Elite STFs are an environment where a Borg torpedo (not even a HIGH YIELD torpedo) has been known to crit through 7,000 shield and 58,000 Hull. Reducing the amount of shield someone can have in order for them to keep a regen proc is nonsensical. It's like they said, "Hey, someone's having too much fun. NERF NERF NERF."
And it's not abuse.It's just use, and I very RARELY saw anyone using it, so glued up the aft section of the MACO/Omega sets had they become. I'll be glad when Cryptic nerfs the living Gre'thor out of glass cannons and see you whining about that.
Now I'm just waiting for TOR to go F2P, because Cryptic just made me not want to play this game anymore. If it hadn't been for the fact that my Lifteime was a birthday present, I'd unsubscribe. They've screwed up THAT bad.
But seriously, I don't agree with that assessment, as I enjoy this game, even as my opinion of the grinds is merely 'meh'.
Then again, I enjoy the medicore as much as the best
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
In regards to Tractor Beams, a lot of people don't realize how good they for increasing damage. A ship which at a dead stop not only lose their speed Defense Bonus , they are inflicted with a -15% Defense Penalty on top of everything else. (Any lighbulbs going off?)
I use all the 3 pc sets all the time in STF now to get used to not using 3pc Borg and haven't had any problems. In fact I like how all the sets engines have better turnrate and deflecters have better stats too.
Half of that assessment is simple fact. I have LITERALLY been hit for 65k+ damage from one plasma torpedo. Many of the recent choices Cryptic has made (Bind to Characters, Into the Hive, the Dilithium Tax on Crafting, etc.) rubbed me wrong. There have been very few choices I liked, and this is nearly the last straw. It DOES seem like Cryptic doesn't want us to have fun. I play this game to have fun, and one of the best ways is being ripped out for a completely arbitrary reason.