it means merits are removed and not replaced and everything that used them is not updated to use anything else.
just add that to the list of things that need dilithium. at the rate we level up, we are going to have empty boff stations, a ship 1 or 2 tiers lower then we should have and gear 4 or 5 levels lower then we should have. how the hell are we supposed to pvp? the game couldn't be more ruined, they would have to do an unprecedented rollback on what they have already done for F2P to be 1/5 as good as it is on holodeck now. i just don't see them rolling it back a sufficient amount, unless they admit they haven't spent 5 minutes worrying about prices yet. does anyone beleave that? or that the situation they are putting players in isn't at least partially intentional?
I am for all these changes if it means...PVP goes away.
Also, your argument is not coherent.
The first half says you cannot afford items for ships. Then you leap to PVP. Then you leap to F2P needing to be roll-back and it is not as good as Holodeck. F2P is not on holodeck. Also, we are only on the first phase of testing which is planned to go on until December. I think we need to get to phase 2 first before we can get to the Holodeck comparison.
Also, you then leap to an argument about 'intentionally leading players."
By definition, developers of a game plan events. You have agreed to let them 'intentionally' lead you to where they want to go.
Part of the testing is to phase in or take small steps to fulfill a larger goal (lead you to an event).
So, is your purpose to have:
1. Lower prices
2. PVP
3. The developers rollback to prior to Season 4
4. Force the developers to lead us nowhere
I would say 'off the top of my head' none of those aspects can lead to a real world or practical solution.
However, in context of the post, you have to wait-and-see like the rest of us are doing.
Well I can say I am not suprised that the grind for gear will be increased even more. I would have no problem if there was more variety in things to grind, but limiting Exploration now to a daily is just a bad move. The exploration system is bad as it is, now to make it a daily makes the situation even worse. Nice to take a BIG part of Star Trek out of STO. Sorry Picard, you have done enough exploring for today, here is your allotment of dilithium.
Honestly I did like that you got a level appropriate reward with exploration, it gave me A REASON to go into and use such a crappy system. If it is limited to once a day and only dilithium rewards, forget it I am done. You might as well delete those sectors and use the space for something else.
/FIX EXPLORATION don't gimp it even further. While you are at it, /FIX the Aid missions as they are not offering a gift any more and there is really no reason to bother even doing them. Give a level appropriate reward there or just delete them.
So we can have an STO where there is a limit on exploration and the Federation does not give aid...
The new high end is purple Mk XII, which ONLY comes from STFs.
Hmmm... ok. Well my point is still valid. If it only comes from grinding STF's, then dilithium isn't an issue.
Either buy rare drops on the exchange for EC, which is better than most things you can get with Dilithium, or grind STF's. Either way, the best loot out there is not to be had with Dilithium.
Well I can say I am not suprised that the grind for gear will be increased even more. I would have no problem if there was more variety in things to grind, but limiting Exploration now to a daily is just a bad move. The exploration system is bad as it is, now to make it a daily makes the situation even worse. Nice to take a BIG part of Star Trek out of STO. Sorry Picard, you have done enough exploring for today, here is your allotment of dilithium.
Honestly I did like that you got a level appropriate reward with exploration, it gave me A REASON to go into and use such a crappy system. If it is limited to once a day and only dilithium rewards, forget it I am done. You might as well delete those sectors and use the space for something else.
/FIX EXPLORATION don't gimp it even further. While you are at it, /FIX the Aid missions as they are not offering a gift any more and there is really no reason to bother even doing them. Give a level appropriate reward there or just delete them.
So we can have an STO where there is a limit on exploration and the Federation does not give aid...
Hear that???? I think Gene just rolled over.
i agree
i thought they were going to fix exploration not break it some more
/FIX EXPLORATION don't gimp it even further. While you are at it, /FIX the Aid missions as they are not offering a gift any more and there is really no reason to bother even doing them. Give a level appropriate reward there or just delete them.
So we can have an STO where there is a limit on exploration and the Federation does not give aid...
Hear that???? I think Gene just rolled over.
The problem is Federation Captains are busy farming Dilithium and refining it. No time and equipment to explore, aid or fight a stupid war. The only thing we are fighting are other Federation Captains that try to get our ore.
Either buy rare drops on the exchange for EC, which is better than most things you can get with Dilithium, or grind STF's. Either way, the best loot out there is not to be had with Dilithium.
True, but every other single item or power or skill you need in order to GET to the point you reach full endgame kit will cost you an endless long grind for DL (or between $$$ and $$$$ in real-life money to shortcut the grind).
Okay number one, subscribers should get a free ship every level just like we ALWAYS did. If they give subs the amount of dilithuim that is the price of the ship, or discount it for subs, or give us a ship token, i don't really care. But the NEED to do one of the three. As for the 8,000 dilituim ore refinement a day, you people are forgetting one VERY big thing {I hope :rolleyes:}
You get already Refined Dilithum for alot of missions too. So that, plus the 8,000 a day, will hopefully make it reasonable. I don't know if this will be true, but it seem like everyone thinks the Maximum REFINED dilithium you can get a day is 8,000.
I don't think this is true. I think this is the maximum UNREFINED dilithium you can REFINE a day. Just saying
Well, this is all speculation at this point, considering no one has even played with the new build yet.
Yes, the restrictions sound harsh from what the release notes stated. But remember, that's the 1st implementation, and is likely purposely harsh. They will continue to tweak it until they find a happy medium.
I haven't read through the entire thread only up to page 10, but the last page still indicated Tribble isn't back up so I'll comment with this. My gut reactions are like most of everyone's concerning the huge difference between the refining limit and current store prices. But intellectually, I'm need to reserve my judgment.
1) We can't the current state of the economy. We only have the Daily Refining limit. Heretic(?) posted recently some of the store prices are not right. They are going to change. We also need the see store prices of equipment and the new net prices for ships upon promition.
2) Two is that Cryptic has referred to both forms of Dilithium interchangeably which sowed a lot a confusion about the economy. See we need to see what all of the all of the rewards are and what type of Dilithium they give.
So I'm not blowing a gasket until the server comes back up, and I can see what's really go on.
I agree, thats way to limited.
Just fully "arming" a T5 cruiser alone would take 108 days aka more than Three and a Half months! And that just isn't acceptable.
Fine for silver members, but still "unacceptable" for us loyal gold members.
Your still ripping us off, as instead of grinding dailies, PvP and exploration missions for better "equipment" we end up being "forced" to spend it on a new ship instead. :mad:
I'm sorry, but the only real solution here is to bring back the Free Ship Token's, at least for subscribers.
yes as I am one of those Lifetime members we should have the tokens....I mean what do we really get?
I also think that the dilithium limit is a bit harsh, especially since there is no subscriber or C-Store solution.
I find it somewhat amusing that Duty Officers got fixes, but Bridge Officer powers were broken. Considering the servers are down anyways, I would not mind them staying down until Bridge Officers were fixed, considering how fast you level up in this game.
I am still unsatisfied with the weakness or outright lack of trainable BO abilities from Captain skills that have 9 ranks invested into them. As it stands, there is no difference between training your Bridge Officers from the Power Trainer NPC and training from your Captain. Just as an example, an Engineer Captain with 9 ranks in Drones should offer Support Drone Fabrication 2.
At the ranks of Commander and above you will need to earn some additional dilithium to be able to afford the next ship, so be sure to play some daily missions for those rewards.
We are just testing it my peeps! Nothing is final yet, thats why we are here, to suggest changes. If and when they see your article, It may be obsolete
You have to grind dilithium for ships at Commander and above? That's absolutely absurd! I definitely agree that gold members should get free ships at every rank up.
On top of that you want to limit the amount of dilithium we can process per day? Again, I can understand that for silver players, but absolutely NOT for gold players.
Gold players should have NO restrictions whatsoever - we paid for that right. In all truth, the changes presented in these patch notes are so horrible that I really don't even want to test anything other than the doff system - and I really like testing new stuff!
Hahahaha, anybody remember the comment from DStahl that C-Store prices are not going up and probably even go down? My math may not be the best but a T5 Excelsior and D'Kyr for 1600 C Points or ship costumes for 360 C Points looks like an increase to me.
That's just for all the wise guys that said, just buy a T5 ship for your testing points. Will be difficult with only 1200 free points, won't it?
We don't know that ore to refined dilithium is at a 1:1 ratio. It's entirely possible that every piece of ore will yield 5 pieces of refined dilithium. They can also change the ratio as needed. Don't panic about this yet.
If itss 8000 ore = 8000 refined Dilithium.. you aren't even IN THE BALLPARK.
How can people who don't play 12 hours a day get anything done?
Not only is the 8000 cap unreasonable in every way, the rate at which you earn ore will require long play sessions to even get that 8000.. and you can't do anything else?
You have it totally backwards, they made the limit so people DON'T have to grind 12 hours a day. They wanted to give people who don't have time to play during the week to be able to keep up with the people who do. There isn't a limit on how much you can EARN per day, just how much you can CONVERT per day. This means that the people who only have the time to play on the weekend can amass ore during the weekend and then just log on for a few minutes each week night to do their 8k conversion.
I can actually agree with doing a few dailys to purchase my next ship. As you level up you are bound to do a few here and a few there. By the time you get to the point of getting your new ship you should have enough to purchase it.
But the limit to refine it is TRIBBLE! If I get a new ship and I have done the missions for the rewards to spec it out with new shiny weapons, engines, shields, deflector and so forth. I should not have to wait 3 months to (refining the stuff) to load up my ship.
I know that this is test and I really hope that the Devs see this as major turn off for the game. At least take care of those who are paying for the game and the membership. But still 3 months is terrible even for the freebie out there playing it.
just add that to the list of things that need dilithium. at the rate we level up, we are going to have empty boff stations, a ship 1 or 2 tiers lower then we should have and gear 4 or 5 levels lower then we should have. how the hell are we supposed to pvp? the game couldn't be more ruined, they would have to do an unprecedented rollback on what they have already done for F2P to be 1/5 as good as it is on holodeck now. i just don't see them rolling it back a sufficient amount, unless they admit they haven't spent 5 minutes worrying about prices yet. does anyone beleave that? or that the situation they are putting players in isn't at least partially intentional?
I am for all these changes if it means...PVP goes away.
Also, your argument does is not coherent.
The first half says you cannot afford items for ships. Then you leap to PVP. Then you leap to F2P needing to be roll-back and it is not as good as Holodeck. F2P is not on holodeck. Also, we are only on the first phase of testing which is planned to go on until December. I think we need to get to phase 2 first before we can get to the Holodeck comparison.
Also, you then leap to an argument about 'intentionally leading players."
By definition, developers of a game plan events. You have agreed to let them 'intentionally' lead you to where they want to go.
Part of the testing is to phase in or take small steps to fulfill a larger goal (lead you to an event).
So, is your purpose to have:
1. Lower prices
2. PVP
3. The developers rollback to prior to Season 4
4. Force the developers to lead us nowhere
I would say 'off the top of my head' none of those aspects can lead to a real world or practical solution.
However, in context of the post, you have to wait-and-see like the rest of us are doing.
Thank you.
great way to lead off, hating on the only part of this game that is fun and requires any skill. your reading comprehension is the problem. if you were keeping up with the tribble build you would know how hard it is to gear up, let alone buy a ship at the tier you should have at your level. that's a problem if you want to pvp, quality gear is critical for success there.
when i said rollback i was talking about the scale and prices of this dilithium economy as it is now, and how much they would have to slash prices for the game to flow anything like holodack does now. i think they wont slash it enough, and i think the horidness of the economy is intentional.
not sure were you got "intentionally leading players" from, but if your going to try to directly quote me, try actually directly quoting me.
Comments
server looks like it is back up time to patch and play.
Yes, but on Live anyway, the Mk XII stuff is only common (maybe uncommon? I don't know). Mk XI purples are just as good as Mk XII commons.
I am for all these changes if it means...PVP goes away.
Also, your argument is not coherent.
The first half says you cannot afford items for ships. Then you leap to PVP. Then you leap to F2P needing to be roll-back and it is not as good as Holodeck. F2P is not on holodeck. Also, we are only on the first phase of testing which is planned to go on until December. I think we need to get to phase 2 first before we can get to the Holodeck comparison.
Also, you then leap to an argument about 'intentionally leading players."
By definition, developers of a game plan events. You have agreed to let them 'intentionally' lead you to where they want to go.
Part of the testing is to phase in or take small steps to fulfill a larger goal (lead you to an event).
So, is your purpose to have:
1. Lower prices
2. PVP
3. The developers rollback to prior to Season 4
4. Force the developers to lead us nowhere
I would say 'off the top of my head' none of those aspects can lead to a real world or practical solution.
However, in context of the post, you have to wait-and-see like the rest of us are doing.
Thank you.
Honestly I did like that you got a level appropriate reward with exploration, it gave me A REASON to go into and use such a crappy system. If it is limited to once a day and only dilithium rewards, forget it I am done. You might as well delete those sectors and use the space for something else.
/FIX EXPLORATION don't gimp it even further. While you are at it, /FIX the Aid missions as they are not offering a gift any more and there is really no reason to bother even doing them. Give a level appropriate reward there or just delete them.
So we can have an STO where there is a limit on exploration and the Federation does not give aid...
Hear that???? I think Gene just rolled over.
Lies. Still down for maintenance.
Tolerance is a wonderful thing, isn't it?
I am still patching but the icon for the server was up so i thought the server was running.
Hmmm... ok. Well my point is still valid. If it only comes from grinding STF's, then dilithium isn't an issue.
Either buy rare drops on the exchange for EC, which is better than most things you can get with Dilithium, or grind STF's. Either way, the best loot out there is not to be had with Dilithium.
i agree
i thought they were going to fix exploration not break it some more
The problem is Federation Captains are busy farming Dilithium and refining it. No time and equipment to explore, aid or fight a stupid war. The only thing we are fighting are other Federation Captains that try to get our ore.
You get already Refined Dilithum for alot of missions too. So that, plus the 8,000 a day, will hopefully make it reasonable. I don't know if this will be true, but it seem like everyone thinks the Maximum REFINED dilithium you can get a day is 8,000.
I don't think this is true. I think this is the maximum UNREFINED dilithium you can REFINE a day. Just saying
Yes, the restrictions sound harsh from what the release notes stated. But remember, that's the 1st implementation, and is likely purposely harsh. They will continue to tweak it until they find a happy medium.
1) We can't the current state of the economy. We only have the Daily Refining limit. Heretic(?) posted recently some of the store prices are not right. They are going to change. We also need the see store prices of equipment and the new net prices for ships upon promition.
2) Two is that Cryptic has referred to both forms of Dilithium interchangeably which sowed a lot a confusion about the economy. See we need to see what all of the all of the rewards are and what type of Dilithium they give.
So I'm not blowing a gasket until the server comes back up, and I can see what's really go on.
Edit :And my timing is truly amazing. :rolleyes:
yes as I am one of those Lifetime members we should have the tokens....I mean what do we really get?
I find it somewhat amusing that Duty Officers got fixes, but Bridge Officer powers were broken. Considering the servers are down anyways, I would not mind them staying down until Bridge Officers were fixed, considering how fast you level up in this game.
I am still unsatisfied with the weakness or outright lack of trainable BO abilities from Captain skills that have 9 ranks invested into them. As it stands, there is no difference between training your Bridge Officers from the Power Trainer NPC and training from your Captain. Just as an example, an Engineer Captain with 9 ranks in Drones should offer Support Drone Fabrication 2.
Hahahaha...no, I don't think this is gonna fly.
Try again.
We are just testing it my peeps! Nothing is final yet, thats why we are here, to suggest changes. If and when they see your article, It may be obsolete
On top of that you want to limit the amount of dilithium we can process per day? Again, I can understand that for silver players, but absolutely NOT for gold players.
Gold players should have NO restrictions whatsoever - we paid for that right. In all truth, the changes presented in these patch notes are so horrible that I really don't even want to test anything other than the doff system - and I really like testing new stuff!
That's just for all the wise guys that said, just buy a T5 ship for your testing points. Will be difficult with only 1200 free points, won't it?
You have it totally backwards, they made the limit so people DON'T have to grind 12 hours a day. They wanted to give people who don't have time to play during the week to be able to keep up with the people who do. There isn't a limit on how much you can EARN per day, just how much you can CONVERT per day. This means that the people who only have the time to play on the weekend can amass ore during the weekend and then just log on for a few minutes each week night to do their 8k conversion.
But the limit to refine it is TRIBBLE! If I get a new ship and I have done the missions for the rewards to spec it out with new shiny weapons, engines, shields, deflector and so forth. I should not have to wait 3 months to (refining the stuff) to load up my ship.
I know that this is test and I really hope that the Devs see this as major turn off for the game. At least take care of those who are paying for the game and the membership. But still 3 months is terrible even for the freebie out there playing it.
great way to lead off, hating on the only part of this game that is fun and requires any skill. your reading comprehension is the problem. if you were keeping up with the tribble build you would know how hard it is to gear up, let alone buy a ship at the tier you should have at your level. that's a problem if you want to pvp, quality gear is critical for success there.
when i said rollback i was talking about the scale and prices of this dilithium economy as it is now, and how much they would have to slash prices for the game to flow anything like holodack does now. i think they wont slash it enough, and i think the horidness of the economy is intentional.
not sure were you got "intentionally leading players" from, but if your going to try to directly quote me, try actually directly quoting me.