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TRIBBLE Maintenance and Release Notes - October 6, 2011

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  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    It's hilarious that on STOked they talk about letting people play how they want, but instead they're forcing everyone to grind dailies and Doff Assignments for dilithium to buy a ship. I suppose being able to play how you want only applies to people who make it to 51 in their connies or novas
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    KoshiirRa wrote: »
    So far, my 10000 Test Points have been overwritten by the free 1200, and refining dilithium ore is a recipe for a disconnection.

    How did you get your test points? I purchased some as well but they never came over. I ensured that I purchased the day they anounced it. I better get what I paid for.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Shakkar wrote: »
    So we'll only be able to get enough money to get an item every week or two? We can't repeat exploration missions anymore? We'll have to use some of that money that takes months to outfit a ship and use it to buy the ship instead? And lets see...I wont be able to get a new ship at commander because I've already levelled up? You're punishing people for testing early for you? Way to incentivize your players...you punish them for testing.

    What I'm reading here is everybody better get all their alts to vice admiral on holodeck before this goes live, and they better spend all their emblems on items that will be worth millions when f2p comes along.

    We pay a monthly fee to be abused now it appears. Somehow I don't think this is going to compete well with the many other games coming down the pike.

    I paid a lot of money up front for an unfinished game, because I love Star Trek and I wanted to be there to see what the game could become. It sounds like you're making a fool out of me. It sounds like you're breaking the game. I am very disappointed in you guys.

    Welcome to testing - if stuff like this upsets you, you would have hated closed beta back in the day as they did full character database wipes multiple times. Such is the life of a beta tester (and make no mistake a beta is what we're in.) If it really upsets you; you take a break from testing until the F2P client is WAY closer to release in December. But stuff like this is normal for a beta.

    And for the reciord, I too don't like a lot of the changes like:

    - The fact that ALL story missions are interconnect now to the point you can't skip one you don't like, as they all need to be done (and in the same order for every toon you make too); front to back to unlock all the content, and the pre-F2P FE series.

    - I don't like making all Explore missions dailiies; and (IMO) stuff like this is really counter intuative to drawing ppeople in and keeping them playing as with what they've done, people will log in, do the dailies, and log out; and EVERYONE will be watching the clock (and probably be upset if they find they have 15 minutes to play one evening; log in, and find they CAN'T do anything they want because the daily still had 20 minutes to go.

    - I understand the reason for the 'refining dilithium' mechanic, as they don't want runaway inflation; BUT I will say again, the argument that "They can get all the raw dilithium they want..." somehow thinking that will keep players playing -- IMO - wrong, because once players realize they can only refine so much per day, if they have a HUGE raw diilithium stockpile; WHY play and get more, when they CAN'T refine the stockpile they have to buy what they want? In the end, (with F2P) all taht means is eventually, players will be logging in once a day to click the 'refine dilithium' button, and log out again. maybe after a month or two, they MAY play a mission here or there if their raw dilithium gets low; but I don't think they'll be all that enthused.

    But, again, testing is and can be a pain in treh butt; but if you want to provide valid feedback, (that may or may not get listened to); you grin and bear it; or walk away and hope those who did test felt like you and were able to make their feedback heard.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Well, at least we now know what they plan on calling the f2p version of STO:

    Star Trek Online: Mining and Piracy in Deep Space
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    decker999 wrote: »
    Soooo, thanks to the deep and high quality QA we have, here's the problem: The damn Exploration Cluster dailies do not give Dilithium, they only give Skill Points and Bridge Officer Skill Points.

    correct I have not noticed anything but the skill points. I was sure I read somewhare you can get dilithium doing the exploration missions. I guess I have to go fix a satellite.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    At the other side, let them do exactly that. Drive the Car against the next Wall so that the Game will end. Because only if it ends there is a chance that a better Company than TRIBBLE...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Didn't you get the memo. This is testing a new faction - The Ferengi :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Dear Cryptic: I couldn't be bothered to help test if you're going to continue to treat us like idiots. I don't need to in order to point out your blatant arrogance and short-sightedness.

    You can't buy a ship for what you're given in dilithium, even with a discount token? Please... Everyone knows that this is just an audacious cash grab, and a serious slap to the face against subs, who get ships free currently on rank up.

    You can only refine 8000 dilithium per day? Now you're just rigging the system to force people into your C-Point exchange or outright buy Cryptic Points for the C-Store. Yeah, that'll go over well.

    The prices of the dilithium shops are horribly inflated because Cryptic, despite wanting to control inflation (my behind, btw), set the prices too high? Just how stupid do you think we are, anyway? How much time do you think we really have? How much money do you think we have to burn? You guys are seriously out of touch with reality.

    I understand you guys need to make money, but what you're doing is morally bankrupt. The more I look at these rollouts to Tribble, the more my opinion and hunch get confirmed. I'm also seeing people starting to turn on you guys everyday. So please, stop being so damned arrogant and start wising up.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    I see a lot of fail in this update.

    Too bad we can use the sun to slingshot to Dec 20th.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    V-Mink wrote:
    I'll be honest: None of this is surprising me. Not the C-Store price increases (though apparently the +1 ship prices got cut in half? Really?) and not the incentivizing of real money transactions.

    Never forget, by he way, that in going F2P that the producer MUST find some way to make money, else this is a useless venture. STO *must* make a profit somehow. Now, how it makes that profit is clearly a point of contention, but 'free to play' does have to mean 'free to play but we have to get paid somehow.' They've cut themselves off by saying all content will be free (what there is of the content, anyway) so they have to look to some other source of revenue. When providing suggestions, please keep this in mind. (Side note: I have some ideas; none of them are what we're seeing on Tribble; big surprise! But I'm probably not the one to ask since I have loathed the C-Store for some time now.)

    However, I don't think the solution is for STO to die horribly. It is entirely possible that if CBS pulls the license (if they even can; I'm sure there are clauses regarding when they can do that) then we will not see a Trek MMO for at least another ten years. And there is no garauntee that a "Star Trek Online Again" will not stink like rotten apples.

    Keep in mind too that it takes a LOT to kill an MMO. NCSoft killed Auto Assault and Tabula Rasa (*******S!) over politics, but Ultima Online has been going on for 14 years, FFXI is still going pretty strong, and even EverQuest is still progress-questing. You'd kind of need an isolytic charge to the server farm to kill STO at this point, I think.

    One can also not count on PWI pulling a Paragon, and putting STO into the hands of an in-house development group. This did a lot of good for CoH but I don't think it would do anything in this case: Consider that most of these in-game economic changes appear to be driven strongly by PWI dictates. Changing developers will not change the economic model of STO, only the names of the people we yell at.

    So Cryptic dying a horrible death might satisfy schadenfreude but in the long run I don't think that it will automagically result in some nebulous "someone better" getting the license to do a Trek MMO. At this time I would encourage people to make their voices heard by Cryptic, exhaust all patience and avenues of appeal, remind Cryptic and PWI that 'free to play' does not have to mean 'gouge the players for everything in their wallets' (CoH's free-to-play seems to be going amazingly well for them, and I was very happy with DDO,) and then and only then give up.

    And if you have already reached that point, I can't say that I blame you. =P

    You are probably right that there will not another Star Trek MMO for a long Time if this one dies. And of course a Company has to make Money. But to not value the Costumers, taking things away from them like the free Ship for each Rank or the freedom to do as many Cluster Missions as you like, even if they told they would not take away anything and on top of that raising the Prices for C-Store Items and making the Game a Grind Fest so you have to buy C-Points for Ships if you don't want to die of old age before you get your Ship with full Equip even if you are a Gold Member, is just not the right way. If they did not had an MMO, but instead a Store and they would treat the Costumers this way they could close the Doors forever after six Month at latest.

    I really had the hope that this would be the great Star Trek MMO i was waiting for. Because of that hope i bought the Lifetime Sub even before the Game was released. But all they deliverd til now are empty promises and now a F2P System that, if it goes live anything near to whats on Tribble now, looks like the Company is called "Money Graptic".
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    I did not recieve dilithium in any form, or a ship discount at Rear Admiral Upper Half 1... is this no longer counter as a rank?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    http://www.startrekonline.com/node/2638

    this just droped, hope it explains dilithium to our satisfaction, reading now...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Aevn wrote:
    It's hilarious that on STOked they talk about letting people play how they want, but instead they're forcing everyone to grind dailies and Doff Assignments for dilithium to buy a ship. I suppose being able to play how you want only applies to people who make it to 51 in their connies or novas

    You can play the game any way you want so long as you grind or pay :rolleyes: ;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    A DOF idea for the KDF: Have a dilithium mining "mission" at Rura Penthe.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    SatansHell wrote: »
    You can play the game any way you want so long as you grind or pay :rolleyes: ;)

    Like every other F2P game, look at all the F2P games I have played so far and looking into what STO turns, it will be a "F2P scheme 101".

    What I am Interessted in, is in what merrits get converted... I have over 300k in merits... considering they are harder to earn then credits and where the main means to level your boffs they need to give us dilithium for it...

    But i bet even when they do it we get a TRIBBLE exchange rate, like 1:10 or something like that... een with 300k merits you only would get 30k del and thats not enough for even one mkx purple... :rolleyes:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    From what I'm seeing here I'll be getting my test-Fed to 51 for the bonuses then going back to Holo to grab as much purple gear as possible before this mess goes live.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    http://www.startrekonline.com/node/2638

    this just droped, hope it explains dilithium to our satisfaction, reading now...

    Not a word on the refine rate...

    And, what almost sounds like a threat at this point, changes to the crafting systems are coming....
    Seriously, I am literally afraid of what's coming to Memory Alpha within the next days.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Per the Free-to-Play FAQ:
    F2P FAQ wrote:
    Q: Will there be any changes to the C-Store now that STO is going free-to-play?
    Yes. We'll be reviewing the content and prices of goods on offer in the C-store. This includes prices for ships at all tiers. There are currently no plans to increase the price of any premium ship. For now, we know that some previously purchasable playable species will soon be free (Ferengi, Rigelian, Pakled, Tellarite), and others (Liberated Borg, Joined Trill, Federation Klingons) will be earned through other means. If you have already unlocked access to any C-store items, including playable species, you will retain that access in the free-to-play transition.

    So.... Have plans changed then ?

    Currently on Tribble:

    Excelsior Cruiser Retrofit T3
    • 800 CStore Points
    • Used to be EC only

    Excelsior Cruiser Retrofit T5
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    Multi-Vector Advanced Escort
    • 2000 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore points

    Vulcan D'Kyr
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    B'rel Bird-of-Prey Retrofit
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    Kar'Fi Battle Carrier
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    Marauder Patrol Cruiser
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    Varanus Fleet Support Vessel
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points


    While some ships have also come down (thanks for that):
    TOS USS Enterprise - Down 560 points
    Rhode Island - Down 400 points


    Still, this being said, FAR more ships have gone up in price than down.

    And we don't even have access to all the CStore ships yet !

    Cryptic, what the heck is going on ? I understand that this is the first iteration of the F2P CStore, but to so blatantly go against what you own FAQ says is simply mind boggling !

    Especially when *EVERYTHING* else, with the exception of the Services (so far) has ALSO gone up !

    Can we get an explanation please ?

    Oh, and for Reference -
    Live Ships Tribble CStore Ships
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Ok, first, most of the things rolled out in this update were broken, or broke previously working things. But this is Beta, so I can live with it.

    Second, read the new Dev post http://www.startrekonline.com/node/2638 It at least shows that they know this system is broken, and they know we're Miffed about it. Stop the dev bashing until you play the beta and research the problems.

    Third, and I hate to say it again, THIS IS A BETA! Yes, it sucks that you put in time and can't afford your new ship. Yes it sucks that prices are currently way too high. Yes it sucks that some things increased in price in the C-Store, but if you read the original post, http://www.startrekonline.com/f2p_faq#16 it state that "We'll be reviewing the content and prices of goods on offer in the C-store. This includes prices for ships at all tiers. There are currently no plans to increase the price of any premium ship." Key words here are, "Reviewing the content and prices" and "Currently no plans to increase prices" None of this promises anything and leaves them quite a bit of room for thing to change.

    So please, everyone take a deep breath, remember we are testing this in hopes of making a better Star Trek for tomorrow, and enjoy playing with any of the new goodies they throw out there for us.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Not a word on the refine rate...

    And, what almost sounds like a threat at this point, changes to the crafting systems are coming....
    Seriously, I am literally afraid of what's coming to Memory Alpha within the next days.

    I have a prediction;
    They will gate the system the same way.

    Why?
    To make players spend more days in-game.
    Why?
    To increase the temptation to spend money on the C-Store.
    Of course.

    Man. You know its hit the rotary cooling device when *I* am getting snarky towards Cryptic.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    So please, everyone take a deep breath, remember we are testing this in hopes of making a better Star Trek for tomorrow, and enjoy playing with any of the new goodies they throw out there for us.

    I believe a great deal of this dissent is because we want a better Star Trek for tomorrow and people are not seeing it with these economic and C-Store changes.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Necrion wrote:
    Per the Free-to-Play FAQ:


    So.... Have plans changed then ?

    Currently on Tribble:

    Excelsior Cruiser Retrofit T3
    • 800 CStore Points
    • Used to be EC only

    Excelsior Cruiser Retrofit T5
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    Multi-Vector Advanced Escort
    • 2000 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore points

    Vulcan D'Kyr
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    B'rel Bird-of-Prey Retrofit
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    Kar'Fi Battle Carrier
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    Marauder Patrol Cruiser
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points

    Varanus Fleet Support Vessel
    • 1600 CStore Points
    • Used to be 1200 CStore Points


    While some ships have also come down (thanks for that):
    TOS USS Enterprise - Down 560 points
    Rhode Island - Down 400 points


    Still, this being said, FAR more ships have gone up in price than down.

    And we don't even have access to all the CStore ships yet !

    Cryptic, what the heck is going on ? I understand that this is the first iteration of the F2P CStore, but to so blatantly go against what you own FAQ says is simply mind boggling !

    Especially when *EVERYTHING* else, with the exception of the Services (so far) has ALSO gone up !

    Can we get an explanation please ?

    Oh, and for Reference -
    Live Ships Tribble CStore Ships

    You know that really worries me.
    Are the old Vice Admiral ships now un-obtainable in-game? I.E are they C-Store only now? :(
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    segma wrote: »
    I believe a great deal of this dissent is because we want a better Star Trek for tomorrow and people are not seeing it with these economic and C-Store changes.

    It's true, if the economy that was just released doesn't have drastic changes before the December release, even people like me who have paid for the game non-stop since day one might walk away. I just really want to remind people that this is what, week 2 of the beta? We still have months of testing to go before the final build, and the almost daily Path to F2P Dev Blogs are showing that they are trying, not flat out ignoring us.

    Just seems to be way more anger in these posts, and not enough people staying calm and trying to live up to the ideas that Star Trek represents.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    I have a prediction;
    They will gate the system the same way.

    Why?
    To make players spend more days in-game.
    Why?
    To increase the temptation to spend money on the C-Store.
    Of course.

    Man. You know its hit the rotary cooling device when *I* am getting snarky towards Cryptic.

    They have to... all the highend gear set items that are craftable swarming the market and are worth basically nothing...

    Maybe i spent some of my millions of credits and buy some of the rare stuff on the market, everything starting from MK IV to MK XI and craft all the bazillion anomalies i have gathered to gear and then gamble the market in F2P.... :p
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Yes... I'm honestly surprised that they'd ignore all the negativity in this thread. How is that even good business sense!?

    As unfortunate as it is.. I see them going forward with all of these changes, or at least a lot of them. As far as 'bad business sense' .. it's like a friend of mine who works for a telecom company. They don't really care about customer retention. It's the new sales that butter their bread.

    I agree that a large portion of the current player base will flee with these changes, as they are. But as evidenced with some posts even in this thread, there are some that won't, and new players won't have experience of the "good ole days." to compare their game play to.

    I've been a Cryptic "fanboi" since their launch of City of Heroes in '04. I bought an LTS for Champions, then followed suit and bought a LTS for STO when it became available. I've been an avid supporter of the C-Store, and have everything offered there that my account allows (no end game KDF ships, as I'm not high enough.) But really.. this is really bad, IMO.

    I never bought into the whole, "Cryptic lied about game-altering items in the C-Store" .. because what has been "quoted" hasn't always been what was actually said. I never bought into the "they lied to us about the lack of content over the last year" because I've worked in corporate America long enough to know a lot of that was not their fault, and they could not say anything or be in violation of their work contracts.

    With Dan's announcement that he was leaving I started getting really nervous. Especially since it was made very clear that he chose to leave. He wasn't fired. To me, that's worse than being fired because it makes me think he saw what was coming and couldn't in good conscience stick around for it all. That's all conjecture, mind you... but with what's been hitting Tribble for the F2P, and the apparent ... confusion... surrounding statement that C-Store prices would be dropping... that the Golds wouldn't be losing anything... etc... etc...

    This is definitely not boding well for *our* continued well-being in game. I honestly feel like they'll survive the same way most of the Asian F2P games do.. but it's going to be a complete b*stardization of the game we had before.

    Please... Cryptic.. prove me wrong here. Please listen to the posts here.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Hornet331 wrote: »
    They have to... all the highend gear set items that are craftable swarming the market and are worth basically nothing...

    Maybe i spent some of my millions of credits and buy some of the rare stuff on the market, everything starting from MK IV to MK XI and craft all the bazillion anomalies i have gathered to gear and then gamble the market in F2P.... :p

    Hmmm.... *twirls moustache*

    Interesting.
    Can I steal this idea?

    I wonder how much I could make off a full blow Aegis set in the new order?
    oh yes. This could be most profitable indeed.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    Hmmm.... *twirls moustache*

    Interesting.
    Can I steal this idea?

    I wonder how much I could make off a full blow Aegis set in the new order?
    oh yes. This could be most profitable indeed.

    New faction release ... Ferengi have come to STO. ... Thought about it myself.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    BTW ... Has craft on Tribble been improved? ... or still just odd mark stuff?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    ~snip~

    As the borg would state: Your life, as it has been, is over.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited October 2011
    BTW ... Has craft on Tribble been improved? ... or still just odd mark stuff?

    To be fixed in next release. They said it's currently being reworked in the new dev blog #7
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