Common Misconceptions
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Wow... all this 'i can haz a herc' / 'i dun haz a herc' BS is still going on?
lololol
/continueI post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.0 -
And a veno without a herc can, but I'd rather have an idiot with a herc than an idiot without, and I'd rather have a good veno with a herc than a good veno without. Just like I'd rather have an archer with a lunar bow +8 than an archer with a TT99 wep +4.
The game has changed, I remember when people used to think TT2-3 required the members to be charmed, people aren't bringing charms there anymore.
The fact is, if you're below the standards of every other member of your class in your level range, then you aren't going to be taken on instances. A tank without proper gears for defense and HP is not going to be taken to instance, a damage dealer without proper gears to output damage is not going to be taken to instances, a cleric without proper gears is not going to be taken to instances, and a veno without a herc is not going to be taken into instances. Because it's important to meet the "standard" for your class. No you don't have to have full +12 gears, no you don't need to have the best gears, but you do need to meet the standard for your class. If you're a DD and you dont have a good weapon, then you're not useful, if you're a tank and you dont have good HP/Defense, you're not useful, and if you're a herc at endgame, and you don't have a herc, then you're not useful.
If you don't want to bite the bullet and get reach the standard for your level, that's fine, but don't complain when people that do don't want to run instance with you.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."0 -
I never want a herc and never will have a herc ( after seeing how some venos with hercs act) yes hercs are great and can do this and that
i can still amp purge pass chi and bramble when needed
and i know i cant tank some bosses with the pets i have
gawd i can tank some bosses without a pet just have a cleirc healing enjoy been HA LOL
But Hercs have made Some Venos lazy ( Not all of them) just some
has like one in a bh79 did pull out a herc for 1 min but then put it away
they
Didnt pull one mob or boss at all * didnt even amp or purge or even pass chi at all WTF * b:angry I did all the pulling with a armoured bear amp purge and passing chi and only then she actked the boss when it was over half way down b:shutup
and another takes off leaving all the mobs behind to clean up the rest of team while races to pulls the boss when noone is ready or even there and starts srceaming out to cleric *btw who is healing and helpping the rest of team * to RES her after the boss cleans her up When was asked to wait and help please the Answer IS WHY ??
Isnt doing BH Fcc TT Fb meant to be we all act has a team and help each other b:surrender and back eachother up[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Lenore - Harshlands wrote: »lolumad
Obviously you have a hard time thinking flexibly from the usual tank tanks, healer heals, DD sit there and look pretty mindset. I actually like partying with Kiyo, but I bet I'd fall asleep partying with you.
Barb's are designed, and uniquely qualified to tank most bosses. Correct?
I have no problem with *anyone*, and I mean *anyone* who wishes to tank whatever boss he or she wants. You wanna tank, then say so, and I'll happily DD, or debuff, or cancel the boss' casts while someone else tanks.
What I take exception to is someone who squads up with a lvl 10 nirvana weapon, looks at his/her squad, and makes the conscious effort to crit as often as possible, and *try* to rip aggro off the tank, *just because they can*.
Tell me you don't know anyone like this. Then tell me that the attitude "If he cant keep aggro from me, he's uberFAIL" isn't the same thing.
If you wanna play "Who's got the biggest Jimmy" with me over a boss, have the courtesy to tell me first, and I'll sit back and let you smack it to death with yer wang I'm in a squad to kill the boss in the most efficient manner possible.
You can have him. I squad with people who work together.
RedMenaceA human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
Robert A. Heinlein0 -
It has already been stated that it's fine if you refuse to have a herc because you don't want to conform/spend money/think it's useless/'only want to play for fun'/whatever reason. Just don't complain about people booting you or not wanting you in squads when you reach higher levels. End of story. You can't have it both ways; either you get the herc, or you make do with what squads will take you and not QQ about squads/factions that don't.0
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Lol then if you're fine with people who wish to tank because it's simply faster that way, there's no need to call anyone a jackass because they can and have the balls to say so. I'm sure if they know they can't tank something they'd be smart enough to nudge their butt over and let you be the man. I don't see what you were upset about. From what I see you were mad because Kiyo said he can tank, then I said you can't think flexibly, but you refute that by saying you don't mind if DDs tank if they say so, which goes back to square one: Kiyo (a DD) saying he can tank.Redmenace - Heavens Tear wrote: »Barb's are designed, and uniquely qualified to tank most bosses. Correct?
I have no problem with *anyone*, and I mean *anyone* who wishes to tank whatever boss he or she wants. You wanna tank, then say so, and I'll happily DD, or debuff, or cancel the boss' casts while someone else tanks.
What I take exception to is someone who squads up with a lvl 10 nirvana weapon, looks at his/her squad, and makes the conscious effort to crit as often as possible, and *try* to rip aggro off the tank, *just because they can*.
Tell me you don't know anyone like this. Then tell me that the attitude "If he cant keep aggro from me, he's uberFAIL" isn't the same thing.
If you wanna play "Who's got the biggest Jimmy" with me over a boss, have the courtesy to tell me first, and I'll sit back and let you smack it to death with yer wang I'm in a squad to kill the boss in the most efficient manner possible.
You can have him. I squad with people who work together.
RedMenace0 -
People that wear fashion tank the best.
ijs0 -
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Allisandre - Sanctuary wrote: »After playing the game for a very long time I am often surprised that the things that people don't know, realize, or misunderstand. So I figured I'd fire off a thread listing them. I do ask that you post respectfully and that the troll stay out, but I know that won't happen so I'll just suck the good points out later and update this, the primary list.
1. Barbs tanking in 59. All of the bosses have magical attacks and barbs just don't have any decent magical defense. HP isn't the issue here, and a wizard can hold aggro if the rest of the squad plays smart. So please, stop thinking the barb is always the tanker. (Also not that Drake and Glutt have a fire DoT attack and whoever is tanking needs to be purified regularly so that these to stack up badly.)(Almost forgot to mention that the same is true for Calcid and Trioc in 39.) Yes barbs are good tanks, but people need to realize that in some cases, other classes can tank, and may even be a better choice.
i agree, i was told to tank mantavip once. ( on my barb) i just left that sqaud
2. The veno pulls. With the addition of genies, it is possible for other classes to pull. HOWEVER, if you have a veno in the squad, let them pull. If you decide that you wish to pull with your genie instead, then discuss it beforehand. Many a party is wiped because the veno goes to pull and some other player decides that he/she will instead.
agreed
3. Do BH's to level up. While BH is a great tool to level, and is awesome for filling that gap in the higher levels, leveling exclusively with BH is just going to make life harder for you. Sure you can get from 0 to 60 in 5 days, but what have you learned? Now you've got a huge pile of skills to learn and no money or spirit needed to learn them. For venomancers it is especially hard keeping the pets caught up with your level. Do your quests first, and fill in the space after quests with BH. You'll play better when you know how to play your character and have the skills you need to not fail. (NOTE: Despite the arguments, you learn more about your characters skills soloing in the lower levels than you do in BH squads. Once you have achieved the higher levels, BH is a necessary part of leveling because it basically replaces the tedium of grinding. By this point you should know how to play your character for the most part. You'd be surprised at how many don't. (oh wait, you do know, look at all the QQ threads on failed BH runs.))
err well, this goes both ways.
personally i do bh for the spirit and stick the exp in a genie that way i can level up my skills before lvling to much
4. You have to spend money to do good in the game. No, this is absolutely not true. I hardly spend any money in the cash shop, and when I do, it's usually just a couple of charms when they are on sale. I've for a 94cleric with good gear that does TW, an 82 barb, also with excellent gear for his level, and a few other characters that have done just fine without spending oodles of cash on the game. Use your coins wisely, farm and merchant for the extra cash you need and you'll do just fine.
err you dont HAVE to, but in almost every circumstance this holds true.
5. A venomancer is worthless if she doesn't have a herc. Yes the herc is good, but it's not that exclusive anymore. The abilities of the herc were nerfed many months ago and it is much more difficult for a herc to hold aggro. The only difference between a walker and a herc at level 90 is about 1200hp and the skills. My walker will actually take aggro from an equally leveled herc if I'm not careful. So knock it off and let non-herced venos do FCC ect.
This one is i agree with 100% yeah hercs are good, but my god saying that every veno that doens't have 70 mill or $120 lying around sucks just shows that ur a moron. i find that people wihout herc are generally better than people WITH them. people with hercs get too careless and headstrong
its also pisses me of when people say kowlins are only good for pulling. my god people kowlins are awesome the deal GREAT damage have decent hp and and nice magic def.
not thier not ur tanking pet. but they function fine as a main pet.
6. The squad got wiped at 'X' boss because the cleric wan't healing everyone. Clerics seems to get blamed a lot for people dying, especially at bosses. Never mind that the archer/assasin/blademaster was going all out in an effort to prove how OP they were and take aggro from the barb. What usually happens is that the cleric is focused on healing the barb, someone without enough HP to tank gets aggro, and pandemonium ensues. When you take aggro, it resets the values. Also, there's is some delay in seeing that a person is taking aggro and noticing their hp drop, selecting said individual, and then beginning the healing process. Typically, they die, and the aggro goes to the next individual dealing a lot of damage. Give the clerics a break and pay attention to how you are fighting and what you are aggroing. (Also keep in mine that hyper-leveled clerics often have sucky heal skills because they can't afford to level them)
i play every class. And while some of this is true. having a cleric that knows what to do IS important. clerics are NOT that hard to play. you just need to know when and who to heal.
YES it takes a lot of pratice. but as a cleric you NEED to know when not heal and let them die. i find my self saying this over and over. the cleric's TOP priorty is to keep THEMSELF alive, THEN the rest of the sqaud. So when i say precast Ironheart DONT keep on healing me after i have taken aggro but not attacked. there are WAY to many cleric who fail at precasting in FC
7. Reflect will reduce the damage I take. Bramble guard does not reduce your damage taken all it does is return some of the attackers damage back to them. Skill Description: "Cast a bramble shield of protection on a friendly target. Returns XX% of melee damage to attackers." The Psychic version reads similarly but with a lot more words because of the soulforce. (NOTE: I have tested this extensively on both my venomancer and my psychic and there was NO reduction in the damage taken by the mob hitting me.)
i wasnt aware they was anyone who didnt know this...
8. Skills and equips boost your flying speed. Specifically True Form, SumerSprint, gear that adds to speed ect. No matter what class you are, or gear or whatever, your base flying speed is 5. The Aerogear will add to that, along with apoc speed boosts and the white genies base skill, and some skill that the Tideborn have. (forget the names, will add later.) For example: A Barb in True Form has a run speed of 8. When he takes to the air, his +3 aerogear does not add the +3 to 8 making +11. Rather it adds the +3 to a SET base speed of 5 to make it +8. (yes the barb would be slower flying than runnin, and in some cases a barb can get faster than a mount.)
well they did add that lvl 79 psy skill.. but yeah
9. Venomancers can get banned for attacking ground mobs from the air, with an air pet. As long as the mob is able to fight back it is totally legal. Mob does not have to be able to attack the veno, but at least her pet. The only occation where this is bannable is where there is a glitch that prevents the mob from fighting back without resetting. The only one I am familiar with that glitches atm is Gouf.
correct
Updated: Added a bit of information and added NOTES to some of the sections.
Also, when quoting this post, please reduce it to the specifics that you are quoting, not the entire post. It's cluttering up the thread.
see aboveKilling level 80's with a lvl 60 is a lot more fun than killing level 90's with a level 100.0 -
LadyMaraJade - Sanctuary wrote: »I never want a herc and never will have a herc ( after seeing how some venos with hercs act) yes hercs are great and can do this and that
i can still amp purge pass chi and bramble when needed
and i know i cant tank some bosses with the pets i have
gawd i can tank some bosses without a pet just have a cleirc healing enjoy been HA LOL
But Hercs have made Some Venos lazy ( Not all of them) just some
has like one in a bh79 did pull out a herc for 1 min but then put it away
they
Didnt pull one mob or boss at all * didnt even amp or purge or even pass chi at all WTF * b:angry I did all the pulling with a armoured bear amp purge and passing chi and only then she actked the boss when it was over half way down b:shutup
and another takes off leaving all the mobs behind to clean up the rest of team while races to pulls the boss when noone is ready or even there and starts srceaming out to cleric *btw who is healing and helpping the rest of team * to RES her after the boss cleans her up When was asked to wait and help please the Answer IS WHY ??
Isnt doing BH Fcc TT Fb meant to be we all act has a team and help each other b:surrender and back eachother up
No offense but that's the dumbest reason I've ever seen for not having a herc. Sorry b:surrender
Although any veno that doesn't have amp + purge leveled up = fail
Tapout 0 -
A lot of you have mention that you ran into **** herc veno and hence that's a reason not to get a herc. So does that mean all the non herc venous are a god send? I am willing to bet that there are just as many fail non herc veno as there are herc veno... if not more. That's like assuming all cv/fist archer/bm are fail just cause you ran into a couple fail ones. But the truth is that the majority of the cv archers can one shot you and the fist bm are 5aps and can run you over... back up and run you over again.
You can come up with all the reason you want for not getting a herc. But at the end of the day it's going to be you without a squad. How ironic... just as I am posting there is several wc asking for a herc veno 80-90 for ff... and they are willing to pay hypers for the herc veno. I guess that's something you non herc venos won't be enjoying. Just like lenore said... you are the ones who made the decision of not getting a herc... now live with.1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.
Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf0 -
Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »Dark and I... unlike some other people... like to stay competitive. Like it was mention millions of times before... an average veno don't need hercs... but a competitive one does. From the looks of your level your average (in your server) at best... so there is really no reason for you to get a herc. But other people... such as my 101 veno... who has a herc, a nix, pet bag filled with other pets, tt99 gold and event gear can be bearly considered to be average in the competitive arena on HT.
No, i'm not average, i may not be top tier elite but i'm competent. I can honestly say i'm at a level above 90% of venos my level doing PUGs, and this is just from the fact alone that i amp bosses and ressilient mobs... Now, granted, and i'll be the first to admit it, i may never be top tier without an herc. However top tier is something i would myself consider there is no more than a couple of dozen venos on any given server. I've certainly outperformed venos much higher level with high refines and hercs. And outperformed to me means i've kept squadmates alive where they wouldn't.
Being competitive can hold many meanings, joining the squads YOU get invited to is not the sole definition, and some of us couldn't really care less about it.
Edit; And dude give it a break, your whole argument revolves around the ability to get into squads, not actual gameplay considerations. Many of us do live with that, doesn't mean we can't come to forums and argue our point... This thread was about mispelling misconceptions, not getting you to change your mind... If you won't listen to reason nor counter arguments what's the point in continuing the discussion? Actually give me a sound reason a squad needs an herc or give it a rest...0 -
MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »No, i'm not average, i may not be top tier elite but i'm competent. I can honestly say i'm at a level above 90% of venos my level doing PUGs, and this is just from the fact alone that i amp bosses and ressilient mobs... Now, granted, and i'll be the first to admit it, i may never be top tier without an herc. However top tier is something i would myself consider there is no more than a couple of dozen venos on any given server. I've certainly outperformed venos much higher level with high refines and hercs. And outperformed to me means i've kept squadmates alive where they wouldn't.
Being competitive can hold many meanings, joining the squads YOU get invited to is not the sole definition, and some of us couldn't really care less about it.
Edit; And dude give it a break, your whole argument revolves around the ability to get into squads, not actual gameplay considerations. Many of us do live with that, doesn't mean we can't come to forums and argue our point... This thread was about mispelling misconceptions, not getting you to change your mind... If you won't listen to reason nor counter arguments what's the point in continuing the discussion? Actually give me a sound reason a squad needs an herc or give it a rest...
You can say that you are the best veno out there and rule over all herc venos for whatever that'll do you. But you also admitted that you got kicked for someone better. So obveriosly that squad leader don't think you are worth keeping. Aleast I can say when I join a squad no one kicks me thinking they can get a better replacement.1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.
Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf0 -
Toxic - Dreamweaver wrote: »No offense but that's the dumbest reason I've ever seen for not having a herc. Sorry b:surrender
Although any veno that doesn't have amp + purge leveled up = fail
No its not the dumbest reason *plus the cost of herc in RL money 290 to 300 newzealand* for each pet for me and my parter cant justflied that after all it is just a game
plus having asked Many herc Veno can u amp or purge please only to be told
Am a caster veno and I dont have or never lvled any fox form Skills b:surrender and the ones who dont have a herc been told you are fail or U must have a herc when some of the one's who do have herc's Dont even have amp or purge b:shutup
in the end its the way how you want to play the game and how u play your Toon
Its up to noone esle but you[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Yeah, for sure how you play your "toon" is up to you, but guess what, when an instance squad wants something, you can't really argue with them. Indeed it was right by Kyo that a competitive veno will have a herc, because so many venos have a herc, to stay competitive, a player gets one. Similarly, a pure sword or pure fist blademaster is useless to a squad and it's wants in many instances, including both frost and rebirth. So they choose BM's who, whether it's their main skill tree or one of their alt specialties, have learned axes/poleblades.LadyMaraJade - Sanctuary wrote: »No its not the dumbest reason *plus the cost of herc in RL money 290 to 300 newzealand* for each pet for me and my parter cant justflied that after all it is just a game
plus having asked Many herc Veno can u amp or purge please only to be told
Am a caster veno and I dont have or never lvled any fox form Skills b:surrender and the ones who dont have a herc been told you are fail or U must have a herc when some of the one's who do have herc's Dont even have amp or purge b:shutup
in the end its the way how you want to play the game and how u play your Toon
Its up to noone esle but you
It is not a requirement to CS a herc -- most venos on my FL didn't even spend rl money on their herc. They farmed for it. Many of them played, also, when PF/SOF cost at or under 2,000 coins each.
You also said you don't like fox skills, which makes you useless in every single instance that requires you to purge (2-3 / 3-2 / 3-3 / Nirvana) or hit in fox form. Your religious-like mentality about a friggen character is only going to limit your own enjoyment, not any other veno who wants to actually succeed and not get kicked out of squads for being fail.0 -
JanusZeal - Heavens Tear wrote: »
You also said you don't like fox skills, which makes you useless in every single instance that requires you to purge (2-3 / 3-2 / 3-3 / Nirvana) or hit in fox form. Your religious-like mentality about a friggen character is only going to limit your own enjoyment, not any other veno who wants to actually succeed and not get kicked out of squads for being fail.
b:chuckle i never said i dont like Fox Skills I have Amp and purge maxed Out b:laugh you have missread what i have said[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
LadyMaraJade - Sanctuary wrote: »No its not the dumbest reason *plus the cost of herc in RL money 290 to 300 newzealand* for each pet for me and my parter cant justflied that after all it is just a game
plus having asked Many herc Veno can u amp or purge please only to be told
Am a caster veno and I dont have or never lvled any fox form Skills b:surrender and the ones who dont have a herc been told you are fail or U must have a herc when some of the one's who do have herc's Dont even have amp or purge b:shutup
in the end its the way how you want to play the game and how u play your Toon
Its up to noone esle but you
Your mentality sucks ***.
Let me tell you something little miss AllHercVenosAreRudeAndDon'tDoAnything:
You don't have Herc, so you wouldn't know, but have you seen how some Herc venos get treated? Have you? No? Let me tell you then because my veno does have a Herc, has had a Herc since 65 or so, and will continue to use her Herc in order to remain competitive enough to get squads:
Plenty of people out there treat Herc venos like a "free ride" ticket. No joke. No emphasis. This became particularly apparent when I hit 70 and started actively questing and BHing so I could try and hit 80, open up OHT and get my 79 skills.
90% of all BH squads would see I had a Herc. They would then demand that I:
Tank, heal, amp, DD, lure and make sure everybody was brambled.
Want to know what makes this situation worse? Nearly every single one of these squads had at least one other veno. One non-Herc veno I might add. What did these non-Herc venos do? NOTHING. That's right. Every venomancer I ended up with who didn't have a Herc didn't pull, didn't amp, didn't bramble - every single job a venomancer has was left to me because I had a Herc.
Before you sit there from your high horse and preach to everybody how the attitude of Herc'd venomancers sucks balls, I recommend you shut up and maybe talk to some of the people you're condemning. I'm not a bad Herc veno, I do everything I have to in a squad that my class dictates, I'm not an ***. I'm nothing that you accuse me of being.
If anything, you non-Herc venos are everything you're accusing the Herc venos of being if a Herc veno and non-Herc veno end up in a squad.
Does this mean I sit here saying every single non-Herc veno under the sun sucks balls? No. Does it mean I will refuse to do every single job of a veno if there's more then one in a squad? **** yes it does. You non-Herc'd venos can be just as pompous, just as fail and just as ****ing stupid.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Sooo...
how bout thems saints.0 -
So... I think I get this, Lady won't get a herc because of the way veno's with hercs act?
If so, this means that the act of getting a herc actually changes your personality and makes you a snob? Or an idiot?
Wow that's a totally new way to fail I've never heard of.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »Your mentality sucks ***.
Let me tell you something little miss AllHercVenosAreRudeAndDon'tDoAnything:
You don't have Herc, so you wouldn't know, but have you seen how some Herc venos get treated? Have you? No? Let me tell you then because my veno does have a Herc, has had a Herc since 65 or so, and will continue to use her Herc in order to remain competitive enough to get squads:
Plenty of people out there treat Herc venos like a "free ride" ticket. No joke. No emphasis. This became particularly apparent when I hit 70 and started actively questing and BHing so I could try and hit 80, open up OHT and get my 79 skills.
90% of all BH squads would see I had a Herc. They would then demand that I:
Tank, heal, amp, DD, lure and make sure everybody was brambled.
Want to know what makes this situation worse? Nearly every single one of these squads had at least one other veno. One non-Herc veno I might add. What did these non-Herc venos do? NOTHING. That's right. Every venomancer I ended up with who didn't have a Herc didn't pull, didn't amp, didn't bramble - every single job a venomancer has was left to me because I had a Herc.
Before you sit there from your high horse and preach to everybody how the attitude of Herc'd venomancers sucks balls, I recommend you shut up and maybe talk to some of the people you're condemning. I'm not a bad Herc veno, I do everything I have to in a squad that my class dictates, I'm not an ***. I'm nothing that you accuse me of being.
If anything, you non-Herc venos are everything you're accusing the Herc venos of being if a Herc veno and non-Herc veno end up in a squad.
Does this mean I sit here saying every single non-Herc veno under the sun sucks balls? No. Does it mean I will refuse to do every single job of a veno if there's more then one in a squad? **** yes it does. You non-Herc'd venos can be just as pompous, just as fail and just as ****ing stupid.
Start with Dont call me Little Miss and another thing I never said All herc Veno are rude and do not know nothing i Said Some are Not all * read what i said fully before starting the name calling * and Yes i have seen and do know what herc Venos go through cause i have many freinds In factoin and just good mates who are venos and own Hercs
and seen how they have been talked to and treated Oh you got a herc u can tank or wow we got a veno in the team now they can tank or on the boss Veno amp amp amp purge pass chi hurry up
venos with/without herc both can be lazy and rude[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
I never mentioned that I've also experienced, with my veno (who indeed has had a herc for over a year now), players who refused to squad with my veno simply because she had a herc (hilariously one of these players, I vividly recall, had a nix), and even at times when I didn't want to tank, squads demanded I do with her+herc because it's presumed that due to me having a herc I'll always want it to tank stuff.
Far more often than not when it comes to attitude surrounding the issue of hercs it's the non-herc venos that get the attitude simply because certain squads (mostly FF) favor herc venos.0 -
Common Misconception:
Anybody cares about this herc veno debate.
Common Misconception:
Mods speak English.0 -
Indeed. Not like anyone is actually posting about it, signifying they care. b:byeNightRage - Raging Tide wrote: »Common Misconception:
Anybody cares about this herc veno debate.
.0 -
JanusZeal - Heavens Tear wrote: »Indeed. Not like anyone is actually posting about it, signifying they care. b:bye
Most people really don't. I stopped paying attention at like... page 7 or 8.
The people who ARE interested are either defensive venos without hercs or those that are trolling them.
It's not even entertaining troll.
/facepalmI post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.0 -
Lenore - Harshlands wrote: »Lol then if you're fine with people who wish to tank because it's simply faster that way, there's no need to call anyone a jackass because they can and have the balls to say so. I'm sure if they know they can't tank something they'd be smart enough to nudge their butt over and let you be the man. I don't see what you were upset about. From what I see you were mad because Kiyo said he can tank, then I said you can't think flexibly, but you refute that by saying you don't mind if DDs tank if they say so, which goes back to square one: Kiyo (a DD) saying he can tank.
Why do you keep putting words into my mouth?
If he can tank, good for him. There's a claw BM I run Nirvana with that I don't even try to take aggro from.
*My* problem is his assertion that 1) venos are effectively hangers-on if they don't show up with a herc and 2) anyone else who can't keep aggro from lvl 100+ archer crits/5aps BM claws is a fail tank.
Or have you not noticed, from every barb on the server, that PWI has failed to keep barb skills up with everyone's else ridiculous aggro?
I've spent the last 10 levels building this barb to keep aggro from a lvl 10x wiz with a +10 weapon. Why? Not because of my e-peen. Because if I can keep a hold of the bastage, you DD's can beat the living **** out of him faster. That's the whole "working as a team" part.
RedMenace
\still stands - Watermelons and Peas
\\I'm sure teenage testosterone (or Estrogen, in your case) expalins much of this threadA human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
Robert A. Heinlein0 -
Michael_dark - Lost City wrote: »Most people really don't. I stopped paying attention at like... page 7 or 8.
The people who ARE interested are either defensive venos without hercs or those that are trolling them.
It's not even entertaining troll.
/facepalm
And yet you're here posting on page 21.
Concern Troll is Concerned.A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.
Robert A. Heinlein0 -
Let's just finish this....
1) Competitive players will always aim for the best. Hercules is the best tank pet therefore competitive Venomancers will own the Hercules. Others who want to compete with them will buy a Hercules sooner or later. Nothing and nobody will stop them. No matter how much you invest in other pets, even with the legendary skills there is no pet that can match the Hercules. Sure it can get close but it will never be equal due to the lower stats.
2) Venomancers can be good and know how to play or can be bad and lazy regardless of pet. Venomancers can be polite and willing to learn or can be rude and a**es regardless of pet. I have met good Herc Venos. I have met bad Herc Venos. I have met good non-Herc Venos. I have met bad non-Herc Venos.
Personally most Herc Venos I have squaded with didn't know how to play properly but then again most non-Herc Venos I have squaded with didn't know how to play either.
3) The rest of the classes and squads in general should stop relying on the Hercules so much. There are many situations where Hercules is obviously not the ideal tank. DDs have to gimp their damage and things just take longer especially when the Venomancer has no time to use amplify damage properly/often. I'm not against using a Hercules to tank. A lot of times I've been happy that a Hercules can tank because there's a lack of tanks. It's also nice to be able to save the Barbarian some repair cost but everyone just relies on in too much...
I don't have a Hercules in PWI but I can understand how Herc Venomancers feel when you end up doing everything. I feel the same when I'm with another Venomancer who does nothing. I feel the same when I'm on my Cleric and I end up doing most of the healing. I hate it when I have to reach my limits just because the others won't bother giving a hand of help.
I have used a Hercules however and I can see the benefits very well. I love it but I simply chose not to buy it for my Venomancer here for my own reasons. I do not complain about not getting into squads though. I prefer to do instances with friends and people I know so I don't join random squads very often (except for BHs). People in random squads will have to judge by your gear (and pet for the Venomancers) because they won't do half run just to test you out. Sometimes though they might just care for luring and trust you that you know how to you amplify damage and purge. Non-Herc Venomancers shouldn't complain because people have certain expectations which you are unable to meet.
And really..Herc Venomancers should try to understand how non-Herc Venomancers feel but non-Herc Venomancers should also try to understand what Herc ones have to go through. As for everyone else, they should start considering other options than Herc Herc Herc Herc.
I just wish people would also stop judging a Venomancer's skill by the pet they own. It's just..silly but I guess this won't stop either.
Well not that my post will stop this argument but I wanted to add my thoughts.[SIGPIC]http://i.imgur.com/MtwcqjL.png[/SIGPIC]
★ Venomancer videos - tinyurl.com/k6ppkw4 ★ Desdi - Demon ♪ Wyvelin - Sage ★0 -
Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »Let's just finish this....
1) Competitive players will always aim for the best. Hercules is the best tank pet therefore competitive Venomancers will own the Hercules. Others who want to compete with them will buy a Hercules sooner or later. Nothing and nobody will stop them. No matter how much you invest in other pets, even with the legendary skills there is no pet that can match the Hercules. Sure it can get close but it will never be equal due to the lower stats.
2) Venomancers can be good and know how to play or can be bad and lazy regardless of pet. Venomancers can be polite and willing to learn or can be rude and a**es regardless of pet. I have met good Herc Venos. I have met bad Herc Venos. I have met good non-Herc Venos. I have met bad non-Herc Venos.
Personally most Herc Venos I have squaded with didn't know how to play properly but then again most non-Herc Venos I have squaded with didn't know how to play either.
3) The rest of the classes and squads in general should stop relying on the Hercules so much. There are many situations where Hercules is obviously not the ideal tank. DDs have to gimp their damage and things just take longer especially when the Venomancer has no time to use amplify damage properly/often. I'm not against using a Hercules to tank. A lot of times I've been happy that a Hercules can tank because there's a lack of tanks. It's also nice to be able to save the Barbarian some repair cost but everyone just relies on in too much...
I don't have a Hercules in PWI but I can understand how Herc Venomancers feel when you end up doing everything. I feel the same when I'm with another Venomancer who does nothing. I feel the same when I'm on my Cleric and I end up doing most of the healing. I hate it when I have to reach my limits just because the others won't bother giving a hand of help.
I have used a Hercules however and I can see the benefits very well. I love it but I simply chose not to buy it for my Venomancer here for my own reasons. I do not complain about not getting into squads though. I prefer to do instances with friends and people I know so I don't join random squads very often (except for BHs). People in random squads will have to judge by your gear (and pet for the Venomancers) because they won't do half run just to test you out. Sometimes though they might just care for luring and trust you that you know how to you amplify damage and purge. Non-Herc Venomancers shouldn't complain because people have certain expectations which you are unable to meet.
And really..Herc Venomancers should try to understand how non-Herc Venomancers feel but non-Herc Venomancers should also try to understand what Herc ones have to go through. As for everyone else, they should start considering other options than Herc Herc Herc Herc.
I just wish people would also stop judging a Venomancer's skill by the pet they own. It's just..silly but I guess this won't stop either.
Well not that my post will stop this argument but I wanted to add my thoughts.
Well said and well put Desdi has allways +1b:thanks[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Redmenace - Heavens Tear wrote: »I've spent the last 10 levels building this barb to keep aggro from a lvl 10x wiz with a +10 weapon. Why? Not because of my e-peen. Because if I can keep a hold of the bastage, you DD's can beat the living **** out of him faster. That's the whole "working as a team" part.
Trying to hold agro from Rule?b:chuckle
I am sick of the "herc veno only" when it comes to things like frost. Sure, I understand the reasoning behind it in terms of a barbs repair bill. Having played my barb in frost a few times I know that a herc tanking most of the bosses saves me a ton on my repairs, but the repairs come with the class. If you don't like the high repairs, don't play a barb.
Yesterday in a frost I got a compliment on holeen based on me being the only veno that bothers to purge it. Very sad.Main characters
Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
Sage Barbarian Malego - 910 -
Redmenace - Heavens Tear wrote: »And yet you're here posting on page 21.
Concern Troll is Concerned.
Of course I'm concerned.
I see this not so vicious circular argument just rolling over and over, people making the same points today that were made a half dozen pages ago, yet it keeps going on and on...
So, that much entertains me at least. Slightly.I post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.0
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