first of all there are more than 1 class (hr) that has broken passives so you aren't the only ones. second of all . self healing u get from doing damage normal hits/dots etc. isn;t that much gaining all that lifesteal?
ok. glad you will whine about others too.
I have not heard even one proposal from you. just nerf cry.
and btw aryox and us had a very good idea of alternative pass for HR. not realated with selfhealing.
Yet still you had 0 ideas. 0 good propasals except to benefit your class in what you call "balance".
1 good note about "broken" offhand and 1 new word i learned from you. Yet still you had not accomplished to tell us how "hard" it is for any GWF to kill Archer or Trapper HR? go on. I want to hear what is your idea of place for HR without selfheal.
And side note about beeing an adult - I don't know much about GWF. I don't know much about CWs. I don't cry about how they should work or play. I don't call for nerf. I may state that it looks too much from my point of view. How to fix it? CWs GWFs and game designer decide themself. There is enought adaquate people to overreason any nerf cry.
If you are adult yourself behaive like a one.
ok. glad you will whine about others too.
I have not heard even one proposal from you. just nerf cry.
and btw aryox and us had a very good idea of alternative pass for HR. not realated with selfhealing.
Yet still you had 0 ideas. 0 good propasals except to benefit your class in what you call "balance".
1 good note about "broken" offhand and 1 new word i learned from you. Yet still you had not accomplished to tell us how "hard" it is for any GWF to kill Archer or Trapper HR? go on. I want to hear what is your idea of place for HR without selfheal.
And side note about beeing an adult - I don't know much about GWF. I don't know much about CWs. I don't cry about how they should work or play. I don't call for nerf. I may state that it looks too much from my point of view. How to fix it? CWs GWFs and game designer decide themself. There is enought adaquate people to overreason any nerf cry.
If you are adult yourself behaive like a one.
ok i am benefiting my class so much. when i said broken class passive i meant they aren't working at all/ or they aren't working as intended. nvm you delusional.
you only want to denigrate me.
then tell me how to kill the hr in the video without ferocious or without intimidation , i am waiting for your KNOWLEDGE on that.
and the way i c balanced isn't that HR must be in top without even strugglin to much.
you say "whine" on everythin i reply on what you say. geez
it's like you are a robot , you and 20 other hrs in this game, forgive god if someone says someth about them.
"whine" "cry" , other things you dont know what to say...
and yes i didn't think for a solution, but m8, if you are playin hr class how can i see that he excel in everythin in Offfense and in defense, and you see like he still needs buffs. i dont get you.
btw: watch again http://youtu.be/LXOnEGW3gAY?list=UUTamWwOKo7kZjAk8Iux2P4w
and tell me after that 14k crit , he activated his artefact and then i ' ve done another 10k with savage advance. and that for nothin ? ;-ss
bless feracious reaction cuz without it i couldn't even get to use 1 rotation , cause of how weak hrs are..
ok i am benefiting my class so much. when i said broken class passive i meant they aren't working at all/ or they aren't working as intended. nvm you delusional.
you only want to denigrate me.
then tell me how to kill the hr in the video without ferocious or without intimidation , i am waiting for your KNOWLEDGE on that.
and the way i c balanced isn't that HR must be in top without even strugglin to much.
you say "whine" on everythin i reply on what you say. geez
it's like you are a robot , you and 20 other hrs in this game, forgive god if someone says someth about them.
"whine" "cry" , other things you dont know what to say...
and yes i didn't think for a solution, but m8, if you are playin hr class how can i see that he excel in everythin in Offfense and in defense, and you see like he still needs buffs. i dont get you.
fist of all. Gwf do need a stun or prone of what ever. Not as old roar. How to kill - well 30k damage does its good job. You need to land it. Other GWf manage to do this. you are not the only one out there. Learn it. Like HR leared how to kill GWF abusing roar in mod 3, or CW at first in mod 4.
second - i don't call all whines or cry. Just you since you keep intimidating and harasing other people.Too much play as gwf? For me - same no-respect line of people who cry about "yes one HR nerf makes me happy" or "why i can not kill them in one rotation? i have big havy stick (wand) in my hand? They are so OP. NERF!"
third - combat HR do need defence. Not just for pvp. for pve too. HR have 0 cc or anti CC. Ls and self heal is the only thing keeps ups alive.
I already proposed multiple options for HRs instead of WM and so havy relly on LS. Read them. Here or even in mod 4 preview threads. Not gonna copy paste just for another one. Feedback is for Crush.
HRs need rework. Not buff. Im teired as fk to hear winers cry about how HR are so OP while we accaully left with one valueble pvp path at all. Unofortunatly only one combat HR path at the same time. There are no trapper or archers in pvp not because Combat is so op. Because it is the only way not to be a dead meat.
ok. glad you will whine about others too.
I have not heard even one proposal from you. just nerf cry.
and btw aryox and us had a very good idea of alternative pass for HR. not realated with selfhealing.
Yet still you had 0 ideas. 0 good propasals except to benefit your class in what you call "balance".
1 good note about "broken" offhand and 1 new word i learned from you. Yet still you had not accomplished to tell us how "hard" it is for any GWF to kill Archer or Trapper HR? go on. I want to hear what is your idea of place for HR without selfheal.
And side note about beeing an adult - I don't know much about GWF. I don't know much about CWs. I don't cry about how they should work or play. I don't call for nerf. I may state that it looks too much from my point of view. How to fix it? CWs GWFs and game designer decide themself. There is enought adaquate people to overreason any nerf cry.
If you are adult yourself behaive like a one.
how would fixing broken HR life steal affect trapper or archer ? archer is a clear pve dps tree and trapper is just fail and needs rework
intimidation should be reworked(its plain stupid) but thats the only thing keeping GWF useful, they need to buff GWF damage, or bring back the old Unstoppable
and if you really believe combat isnt op then there is no use in talking to u
This boon should become 2x or 1.5x as 3x gives to much. As in this boon is so good you must take it because it provides lifesteal at 1.5x through hd which to me is broken for pvp.
This boon should become 2x or 1.5x as 3x gives to much. As in this boon is so good you must take it because it provides lifesteal at 1.5x through hd which to me is broken for pvp.
endless consumption isn't even a 100% proc rate on top of the double whammy of tenacity reducing dps and healing depression (triple whammy for temptation warlocks since their aoe heals are reduced to 62.5% or prior levels). i could barely heal at all in pvp as a templock with 2x life-steal heals >.>
i don't think anyone is life-stealing to a noticeable degree in pvp....maybe like 3k b4 they die? only exception to that might be combat hunters.
I know truth hurts whoever disagree with me should not be in this thread. Anybody who doesnt want balance shame on yourself for being in this thread. :rolleyes:
Feedback: Control Wizard Too much damage.... too much control... why dont you separate this two things and you will get balanced CW, because crowd control works as offensive and defensive at the same time high damage encounters coupled by bunch of crowd control with low cooldowns and bwalah! you have a monster class.
Feedback: Hunter Ranger Six encounters back to back. successful deflect that heals.... TAB without cooldown and casting time...... root, stun, prone..... cheap dailies. can stealth...... tough for a leather user. short cooldowns..... seriously? Im a pro gamer I know what is cookie cutter and what is not!
Feedback: Guardian Fighter
I will not question the tankiness but! holy cow! a tanker with cc lock and insane single target dps! who wants some donuts?
Feedback: Great Weapon Fighter I will leave this class since it is melee and not so durable as the above class but reduce its deflect chance and increase armor %
Feedback: Trickster Rogue TAB that depletes when receiving damage (seriously this needs attention).... when using At-wills and Encounters depletes TAB (ok if its fair for everyone even if other class is OP) SLOW..... SLUGGISH......WEAK DAMAGE..... LONG COOLDOWNS...... LOWEST DURABILTY..... LOWEST DEFLECT for a LEATHER USER....... INT RECOVERY reliant reducing its dps potential...... MAIN STAT IS DEX BUT damage% goes to STR! this class is a joke if you want hardcore self inflicting pain class.... this is the right job for you guys and devs seriously! Christmas is coming I will not spend money for this class, delete and roll another OP class if you want to enjoy this game.
how would fixing broken HR life steal affect trapper or archer ? archer is a clear pve dps tree and trapper is just fail and needs rework
intimidation should be reworked(its plain stupid) but thats the only thing keeping GWF useful, they need to buff GWF damage, or bring back the old Unstoppable
and if you really believe combat isnt op then there is no use in talking to u
Never asked your opinion as I remember. So keep it to yourself. What I think is none of your personal business. Seems like you have problems reading in a first place.
You are accually funny. So you agree that trapper and acher are broken in pvp. intimidation should be reworked. But all you what is to nerf combat HR. only one valueble HRs path left. So 3 out ot 3 pather should be nerfed to "pve dps tree' or "just fail and needs rework" since you have class issues with only one valueble HR path and you think that it should be nerfed? Lol) GWF balancing spirit.
What alternative nerfs for HRs would you suggest then?
Endless consuption is a good nerf for all. Not just HR. If you disagree that in current state LS gives too much well and jsut call to nerf HR it does looks like you do have issues with HRs. While still what other classes to keep same. No good. What keeps SW from having exact same LS rating as HR without any feets applied. My SW has 22% LS flat just from gear.
My combat HR has 18%-22% depending with all feats applied and 15% maxed on 3 run. I did the math earlier look at it. Both have Healing depression applied in pvp. No difference. I can heal my SW while in fight.
Alternative was writen earlier. Deflection Severity. Ability to use and benefit from freaking TAB and making Bow not just a thing on back of HRs. Reorganising feats so that trapper or archer could have some survivabilty or control for archer. Making freaking ecounter work after all the nerf. Making usable daily finally. Plenty of options really. Just start to bother reading first.
instigator :
- Mighty leap should prone
- the tier 3 nimble runner should be changed with tier 4 group assault : Wicked Strike and punishing charge deals up to 10% more damage
- nimble runner should be changed this while "While slotting SteadFast Determination you gain up to 50% determination faster and while in unstopable you gain 10% deflect.
- capstone should give 10% damage bonus, and get 5% damage bonus more per stack x 4 = 20% = 30% .
this capstone should grant 25-50% damage resistance.
destroyer: destroyer purpose capstone should always give 20% damage bonus , while unstopable gain 10% more damage bonus and gaining 1% damage bonus / 1 stack = 50% damage bonus.
sentinel: intimidation : daring shout and come and get it should give 50% out of max Defense as damage , reason is that we wont get so much DEFENSE in PVP the same we have with POWER right now.
so half of defense is transformed in damage and multiplied with damage bonus+crit severity etc. shorten cooldowns on daring shout and cagi by 2 seconds.
MAKE THIS HAPPEN !
This is how will make the GWF all paragons viable for PVP , givin them a fair chance of fighting.
and they are resonable changes. this would give a fair chance to PVE content aswell.
Many players want to fight sentinels and keep threat, but they cant, cause they need to stack power for the intimidation feat, so they will lack defense.
there is no need in this game to one shot people to overcome other classes ways of healings. Like other says and i say to, it's unfun fighting short fights.
for CW and GWF players i think our paragons such as thaumaturg/opressor / destroyer / instigator , and probably renegade aswell , are close on having what you call a fair chance and balanced fight. and i would like for cws to have their shard back on TAB back .t hat would make fighting a cw 1vs1 challenging .
for HR classes is time for them to be changed: i dont dislike the class or the players and i am rather fond with some hr users, but this class is on another level than others. and that should be changed.
mod3 was the problem of that mediation that healed them very fast, and mod4 it's about how they heal from all those healing abilities. to be honest i think fightin a hr from mod3 was more balanced than this one, that he doesnt give a fair chance to a fight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXOnEGW3gAY&index=1&list=UUTamWwOKo7kZjAk8Iux2P4w
as u can see most of the time because of the deflection he cannot even be stunned properly.
not to say without my offhand there, the fight would have ended in merely 20 seconds. and you cannot debate this on how poorly i am playin the GWF , just dont.
SW is the newly class in this game and in mod5 they'll have the new paragon , we all know they are buggy but lets give them a time to adjust in this game, like we did with hunters.
DC & TRs , dunno why but most of the QQs were based on how to defeat a hunter ranger mostly, because of the selfhealing he has, if TRs and DC come out as they are now on preview , i think it's bad.
GWf POV : i want to see this
destroyer lacks surviability , but can do high DPS , so i see him like a striker.
sentinel has better surviability , but will lack high DPS, but instead he will deal some resonable burst damage.
and instigator will end up with medium DPS and medium surviability.
i dont see a reason why would you not implement this on GWF , this will not break the GWF mechanics, it only equalling the paragons between them.
Destroyer wil lbe chosen by those who want to DPS , Sentienl for those who want to tank, and instigator for those who want a little tankyness and little dps.
why Mighty leap a prone?
cause it's AOE skill , and landing a mighty leap in pvp it will be pretty hard, i will not use this skill, but for what i've seen so far on twitch even devs/akro were using it.
Feedback
Instigator: Fleet Footed:
Whenever you control a target you gain an additional 3/6/9/12/15% Run Speed for 3s
needs a rework cause GWFs have very poor control.
could change something into a
Whenever you crit a target you slow them for 3/6/9/12/15% Run Speed for 3s
Instigator: Allied Opportunity: Damage Bonus increased to 6/12/18/24/30% (up from 2/4/6/8/10%) and the Combat Advantage Duration is increased to 1.5/3/4.5/6/7.5 seconds (up from 1/1.5/2/2.5/3 seconds).
The combat advantage to not so fast and mighty leap is obsolete, since combat advantage can be easily achieved with mark and other class mechanics.
I suggest a different upgrade to those 2 encounters instead, add a daze to not so fast and mighty leap instead.
Feedback
Instigator: Fleet Footed:
Whenever you control a target you gain an additional 3/6/9/12/15% Run Speed for 3s
needs a rework cause GWFs have very poor control.
could change something into a
Whenever you crit a target you slow them for 3/6/9/12/15% Run Speed for 3s
Instigator: Allied Opportunity: Damage Bonus increased to 6/12/18/24/30% (up from 2/4/6/8/10%) and the Combat Advantage Duration is increased to 1.5/3/4.5/6/7.5 seconds (up from 1/1.5/2/2.5/3 seconds).
The combat advantage to not so fast and mighty leap is obsolete, since combat advantage can be easily achieved with mark and other class mechanics.
I suggest a different upgrade to those 2 encounters instead, add a daze to not so fast and mighty leap instead.
i disagree with fleet flooted, i think it's okai as it is.
and i agree with allied opportunity: either prone on mighty leap / and bigger slow on not so fast.
Never asked your opinion as I remember. So keep it to yourself. What I think is none of your personal business. Seems like you have problems reading in a first place.
this is a public forum so i dont really give a . if u asked for it, you are just a little combat HR fanboy who sucks at his class, since you dont believe its OP as fk.
You are accually funny. So you agree that trapper and acher are broken in pvp. intimidation should be reworked. But all you what is to nerf combat HR. only one valueble HRs path left. So 3 out ot 3 pather should be nerfed to "pve dps tree' or "just fail and needs rework" since you have class issues with only one valueble HR path and you think that it should be nerfed? Lol) GWF balancing spirit.
archer is a pve tree, and works fine at that
i dont give a rats <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> about trapper, it will be changed at some point every class has a useless tree, instigator was useless since launch, oppressor for cw was useless for a long time etc. asking for 3 balanced paragons, that all work in both pve and pvp is just stupid and selfish
combat is OP. at least if you CAN play your class instead of being a little fanboy crying when u cant faceroll everybody anymore
intimidation is stupid fail design, gwf dev doesnt have a clue what to do with the class so he adds just some fkd up random buffs/nerfs
Endless consuption is a good nerf for all. Not just HR. If you disagree that in current state LS gives too much well and jsut call to nerf HR it does looks like you do have issues with HRs. While still what other classes to keep same. No good. What keeps SW from having exact same LS rating as HR without any feets applied. My SW has 22% LS flat just from gear.
My combat HR has 18%-22% depending with all feats applied and 15% maxed on 3 run. I did the math earlier look at it. Both have Healing depression applied in pvp. No difference. I can heal my SW while in fight.
Alternative was writen earlier. Deflection Severity. Ability to use and benefit from freaking TAB and making Bow not just a thing on back of HRs. Reorganising feats so that trapper or archer could have some survivabilty or control for archer. Making freaking ecounter work after all the nerf. Making usable daily finally. Plenty of options really. Just start to bother reading first.
so instead of nerfing the OP life steal on HR you want to nerf all the classes, good thinking
what keeps other classes from getting 30% life steal ? ever heard of diminishing returns ? it takes over 3k to get to 15% and over 20k to get to 20%(from gear)
Well, I read through the last few pages of this topic before I got bored of people arguing with extremely incorrect information.
First off: effectenstein, why are you posting about fighting a fully potted HR when you're not potted yourself? While the vid does show the intended things i.e. hr self-healing, it's inaccurate because you're not fighting on equal grounds. Also while this isn't entirely relevant, you're definitely at a disadvantage there because HR will destroy any melee class except TR if they're using Slasher's Mark, because of the infinite dodge. And... HRs should be banned from using red glyphs.
Secondly, to the people saying Wild's Medicine should be reverted to its state on live, I'd like to say NO. I'll post logs when I can be bothered to, but WM is approximately 50-60% of a HR's healing on live, with Life Steal being second at around 30%. These numbers will vary slightly depending on the class you're fighting i.e. on preview, Life Steal will be about 50% vs 25/25% regen/WM when fighting a burst one-rotation GF. As it stands, WM is extremely effective as a HOT while HR Life Steal is effective as burst healing, and both of them make for a rather unbalanced healing combination on live. The nerf to WM brings the feat more in line. Life Steal I think is mostly fine, but if anything, the main problem with life steal is not the life steal % itself but the Dread Ring boon Endless Consumption. Take away that and HR life steal isn't as effective as it seems to be.
Also k9madrush - "nerf every class and buff mine" isn't very good feedback imo. TRs are already getting a buff that will make them the top of the pvp food chain so I don't know why you're complaining.
Feedback
We need to collect as much feedback as possible on this so we can tweak the feel and effects of the changes in PVE and performance in PVP. Given that, we would like you to categorize and color code your feedback so we can sort it and act on it most effectively! Please use the below format to submit bugs/feedback.
Type: Bug/Feedback (Please only choose one) Spec: (Please enter the spec that you are providing feedback for here)
Please use “Bold” face text for the Type & Spec then type your feedback in the body of your post. If you are listing a bug please have this text in RED, if you are posting an opinion or feedback please use BLUE.
(Concise Feedback & Screen Shots are much appreciated)
Examples: Bug: Destroyer Destroyer’s Purpose didn’t grant stacks while dealing damge.
Feedback: Sentinel I feel like I don’t have enough tools to stay alive under fire now and it makes tanking too hard.
Please try to play for a few hours to get used to the changes. Thank you again for all your help Adventurers! We look forward to hearing back from you!
Chris “Gentleman_Crush” Meyer
Can we go back to providing our feedbacks on the proposed Mod5 changes using the mechanics as proposed above by Chris to help the Devs ?
As example, my 2 cents posted below yesterday, on CW's Mod5 feedbacks, but I'm afraid already lost on all the discussion:
Well, I read through the last few pages of this topic before I got bored of people arguing with extremely incorrect information.
First off: effectenstein, why are you posting about fighting a fully potted HR when you're not potted yourself? While the vid does show the intended things i.e. hr self-healing, it's inaccurate because you're not fighting on equal grounds. Also while this isn't entirely relevant, you're definitely at a disadvantage there because HR will destroy any melee class except TR if they're using Slasher's Mark, because of the infinite dodge. And... HRs should be banned from using red glyphs.
Secondly, to the people saying Wild's Medicine should be reverted to its state on live, I'd like to say NO. I'll post logs when I can be bothered to, but WM is approximately 50-60% of a HR's healing on live, with Life Steal being second at around 30%. These numbers will vary slightly depending on the class you're fighting i.e. on preview, Life Steal will be about 50% vs 25/25% regen/WM when fighting a burst one-rotation GF. As it stands, WM is extremely effective as a HOT while HR Life Steal is effective as burst healing, and both of them make for a rather unbalanced healing combination on live. The nerf to WM brings the feat more in line. Life Steal I think is mostly fine, but if anything, the main problem with life steal is not the life steal % itself but the Dread Ring boon Endless Consumption. Take away that and HR life steal isn't as effective as it seems to be.
Also k9madrush - "nerf every class and buff mine" isn't very good feedback imo. TRs are already getting a buff that will make them the top of the pvp food chain so I don't know why you're complaining.
well i wasn't doing 1vs1 for the purpose who is greater, i was just demonstrating more things in that video
1. the offhand being broken for gwf
2. the procc of ferocious heals , that procc 2 times, instead of 1 time.
and HR in my opinion is heckin up the PVP so much, thats why it happened before things like
CW : with assailnt
GWF : with intimidation
and we will have tricksters that will one shot, for this special reason, people bringing up feedback mostly to beat up Hrs.
cause the way i am seeing up HRs is like they are out of pvp:
they shot, they pass, they are goalkeepers , they are doing everything to sum it up, thats too much on a single class, and people are callin up for DAMAGE BOOST for their own classes especially for this reason, bringin up fights that if you hit first , you win, that's not cool.
54% deflection chance.
what happened with GF and GWF those should have the best defense in-game.
and i am not in favor boost my class damage , cause i belive there is enough DPS in-game , only small tweaks on each class would solve that, but people like thedemien thinks that playin an OP class he has "skills".
@deepfight007, the posts are being read, as you can see if you read until this page, Gentlemancrush sniped out my combat Log , so yeah, they are pretty much being read, and probably someone is takin all the feedback
Everyone has issues with HRs since they are broken overpowered in PVP. The question is just how much HRs should be nerfed to bring them down to the level of other classes. The Wilds Medicine nerf and the Piercing Blade fix are good starts. It may be that it's better to boost some other classes that are currently a bit on the weak side rather than nerf HRs further than that, though. TRs and DCs are getting a bit of love now, so that leaves boosts for SWs and CWs.
I agree on this. There is a fix for Piercing. So less damage. And actually way less damage to DR heavy classes as GWF and GF since piercing now is calculated on real damage done after .Eg 40% more damage from real damage after DR calcs. Not 40% of orginal power damage. So HR will be getting less damage from LS since we now do less damage inm first place.
WM is half now and as ralexinor state will be around 25%. So less HoT for all HRs.
This depend of how HR is set up cause mine have most of incoming healing from Regen ~ 60% while LS and WM shared 40% top on live.
What keeps SWs from that is that they don't get the same paragon feats as combat HRs, and their damage output is lower because they lack Piercing Blade. SWs also lack the other defensive features that HRs get -- disrupts, lots of dodges, Wilds Medicine, stealth. The only defensive feature SWs get is sprinting and doing damage to kill faster or heal with life steal. So even just comparing life steal between HRs and SWs is extremely myopic.
As SW i can say that they have nice dot too. Hellish Rebuke is pretty good. And is very close by mechanic to Careful attack.
Im only comparing those two cause they both have high LS. And on my SW with proper positioning I can help my char from 10 to 100% in one rotation of encounter in pvp. Even without Endless.
I have no meaning to compare melee class defenses to Range class defenses. And combat HR is now 95% melee class. This lead to one more thing.
Base melee damage for HR comes from offhand. Main hand is not applied in calcs at all except from stats boost. Top offhand has ~ 500 base.
Base damage for SW is main hand ~ 900 base. You can compare to any other class you what. Only HRs have offhand as main for combat.
Now 500 + 0.4 *500 = 700.
So look at Piercing as not a feet that does something overpowered. Look at it as how devs try to fix combat HRs base damage. Since unfortunately offhand is forced to be our main weapon.
No, the question is what you would nerf about HRs instead of Wilds Medicine, not what you would fix or boost. The former is needed, the latter is probably nice, but unnecessary -- and may require additional nerfs.
I d really prefer to comeback to some mod 3 HR. Where Skill were consistent .We did not have 3 same skills that are only usable in trapper path and do same stuff. Where tab did really matter for combat and for archer. And was not just quick switch for buff.
In mod 3 HR had 2 possible way to have pvp - both valuable enough. Now only combat.
Also we lost all buffer path. Not valuable for pvp but handy in pve.
Best way to go now is to comeback to mod 3 and fix its problems rather then this broken mod 4 HRs. Or buff other classes. You btw had really good suggestion for CW dodges somewhere.
Second and probably hard but required fix - nerf Endless consumption. Devs stated they will rework LS. So i do expect it do less healing now. But this will affect all classes not just HR and is way better if you look at it from point of DC.
well just stop talking then. easy is not?
so devs no nothing. they forgot to ask your opinion. Cool story bro. No faceroll in other direction please and stop cry like a baby about it. Right now HR have 1 valueble path for pvp. You are crying to make it 0. That is all.
WM is half now on preview for PVP. Piercing is fixed. So less hot heal and less burst damage -> less LS heal. Make a descent test first. There is no need right now for more nerf cause some crybaby tries to make 0 valuable HRs in pvp since his butt hurts too much.
the only crybaby here is u, crying about how he needs his class to be OP to play, and HR is still the strongest class or close enough
As much as I miss dropping TW on a node and faceplanting myself in a Meditation to recover 60% of my HP while the enemies jump around me frustrated that they cannot hit, I'd rather not.
Mod 3 HR was arguably even more broken than it is now at BiS gear levels. I was able to kill pretty much every class at the end of the module, my only (slight) issues were:
- good GWF with Kessels
- great perma TRs, once it took me exactly and hour to kill one
- 1vs2 situations where some CW decided to icy rays me for his teammate
CWs were pushovers, GFs were unable to dent me, DC took a bit to kill but in the end it still happened. The class was godmode.
HR has only 1 viable paragon for pvp like GWF with sentinel paragon, difference between me and you thedemien is that i want to have all 3 paragons balanced between them, and not havin all paragons to one hit the same as sentinel does.
you or clinging to combat paragon too much instead of wanting to have the otehr 2 viable for pvp, for that you may bring suggestion, but nerfs as well, as i can see it, you either debating
they need to nerf boons
or either bring the old hr from mod3
but you dont want that for combat and selfhealing to be tonned down as first thing. to get it up in line with the other classes.
As much as I miss dropping TW on a node and faceplanting myself in a Meditation to recover 60% of my HP while the enemies jump around me frustrated that they cannot hit, I'd rather not.
Mod 3 HR was arguably even more broken than it is now at BiS gear levels. I was able to kill pretty much every class at the end of the module, my only (slight) issues were:
- good GWF with Kessels
- great perma TRs, once it took me exactly and hour to kill one
- 1vs2 situations where some CW decided to icy rays me for his teammate
CWs were pushovers, GFs were unable to dent me, DC took a bit to kill but in the end it still happened. The class was godmode.
Well this is what i mean by fixing mod 3 spikes. I like the play style in mod 2/3. And nod holder HR is no anyway right way to be. What i mean is that I liked synergy between bow and melee to to damage and usage of all encounter rather then having 1 rotation for all cases. Plus CWs GF DCs are now changed too. so picture is different now I hope.
Comments
ok. glad you will whine about others too.
I have not heard even one proposal from you. just nerf cry.
and btw aryox and us had a very good idea of alternative pass for HR. not realated with selfhealing.
Yet still you had 0 ideas. 0 good propasals except to benefit your class in what you call "balance".
1 good note about "broken" offhand and 1 new word i learned from you. Yet still you had not accomplished to tell us how "hard" it is for any GWF to kill Archer or Trapper HR? go on. I want to hear what is your idea of place for HR without selfheal.
And side note about beeing an adult - I don't know much about GWF. I don't know much about CWs. I don't cry about how they should work or play. I don't call for nerf. I may state that it looks too much from my point of view. How to fix it? CWs GWFs and game designer decide themself. There is enought adaquate people to overreason any nerf cry.
If you are adult yourself behaive like a one.
ok i am benefiting my class so much. when i said broken class passive i meant they aren't working at all/ or they aren't working as intended. nvm you delusional.
you only want to denigrate me.
then tell me how to kill the hr in the video without ferocious or without intimidation , i am waiting for your KNOWLEDGE on that.
and the way i c balanced isn't that HR must be in top without even strugglin to much.
you say "whine" on everythin i reply on what you say. geez
it's like you are a robot , you and 20 other hrs in this game, forgive god if someone says someth about them.
"whine" "cry" , other things you dont know what to say...
and yes i didn't think for a solution, but m8, if you are playin hr class how can i see that he excel in everythin in Offfense and in defense, and you see like he still needs buffs. i dont get you.
btw: watch again http://youtu.be/LXOnEGW3gAY?list=UUTamWwOKo7kZjAk8Iux2P4w
and tell me after that 14k crit , he activated his artefact and then i ' ve done another 10k with savage advance. and that for nothin ? ;-ss
bless feracious reaction cuz without it i couldn't even get to use 1 rotation , cause of how weak hrs are..
fist of all. Gwf do need a stun or prone of what ever. Not as old roar. How to kill - well 30k damage does its good job. You need to land it. Other GWf manage to do this. you are not the only one out there. Learn it. Like HR leared how to kill GWF abusing roar in mod 3, or CW at first in mod 4.
second - i don't call all whines or cry. Just you since you keep intimidating and harasing other people.Too much play as gwf? For me - same no-respect line of people who cry about "yes one HR nerf makes me happy" or "why i can not kill them in one rotation? i have big havy stick (wand) in my hand? They are so OP. NERF!"
third - combat HR do need defence. Not just for pvp. for pve too. HR have 0 cc or anti CC. Ls and self heal is the only thing keeps ups alive.
I already proposed multiple options for HRs instead of WM and so havy relly on LS. Read them. Here or even in mod 4 preview threads. Not gonna copy paste just for another one. Feedback is for Crush.
HRs need rework. Not buff. Im teired as fk to hear winers cry about how HR are so OP while we accaully left with one valueble pvp path at all. Unofortunatly only one combat HR path at the same time. There are no trapper or archers in pvp not because Combat is so op. Because it is the only way not to be a dead meat.
how would fixing broken HR life steal affect trapper or archer ? archer is a clear pve dps tree and trapper is just fail and needs rework
intimidation should be reworked(its plain stupid) but thats the only thing keeping GWF useful, they need to buff GWF damage, or bring back the old Unstoppable
and if you really believe combat isnt op then there is no use in talking to u
This boon should become 2x or 1.5x as 3x gives to much. As in this boon is so good you must take it because it provides lifesteal at 1.5x through hd which to me is broken for pvp.
Revert wild medicine nerf. Apply the nerf here.
You mean nerf everyone, instead of nerfing HRs? Common man...
i don't think anyone is life-stealing to a noticeable degree in pvp....maybe like 3k b4 they die? only exception to that might be combat hunters.
Feedback: Control Wizard
Too much damage.... too much control... why dont you separate this two things and you will get balanced CW, because crowd control works as offensive and defensive at the same time high damage encounters coupled by bunch of crowd control with low cooldowns and bwalah! you have a monster class.
Feedback: Hunter Ranger
Six encounters back to back. successful deflect that heals.... TAB without cooldown and casting time...... root, stun, prone..... cheap dailies. can stealth...... tough for a leather user. short cooldowns..... seriously? Im a pro gamer I know what is cookie cutter and what is not!
Feedback: Scourge Warlock
dps dps dps dps dps dps dps dps dps........ debuff debuff debuff debuff debuff......... lifesteal lifesteal lifesteal lifesteal....... Con with % penetration! omg!
Feedback: Guardian Fighter
I will not question the tankiness but! holy cow! a tanker with cc lock and insane single target dps! who wants some donuts?
Feedback: Great Weapon Fighter
I will leave this class since it is melee and not so durable as the above class but reduce its deflect chance and increase armor %
Feedback: Trickster Rogue
TAB that depletes when receiving damage (seriously this needs attention).... when using At-wills and Encounters depletes TAB (ok if its fair for everyone even if other class is OP) SLOW..... SLUGGISH......WEAK DAMAGE..... LONG COOLDOWNS...... LOWEST DURABILTY..... LOWEST DEFLECT for a LEATHER USER....... INT RECOVERY reliant reducing its dps potential...... MAIN STAT IS DEX BUT damage% goes to STR! this class is a joke if you want hardcore self inflicting pain class.... this is the right job for you guys and devs seriously! Christmas is coming I will not spend money for this class, delete and roll another OP class if you want to enjoy this game.
Never asked your opinion as I remember. So keep it to yourself. What I think is none of your personal business. Seems like you have problems reading in a first place.
You are accually funny. So you agree that trapper and acher are broken in pvp. intimidation should be reworked. But all you what is to nerf combat HR. only one valueble HRs path left. So 3 out ot 3 pather should be nerfed to "pve dps tree' or "just fail and needs rework" since you have class issues with only one valueble HR path and you think that it should be nerfed? Lol) GWF balancing spirit.
Endless consuption is a good nerf for all. Not just HR. If you disagree that in current state LS gives too much well and jsut call to nerf HR it does looks like you do have issues with HRs. While still what other classes to keep same. No good. What keeps SW from having exact same LS rating as HR without any feets applied. My SW has 22% LS flat just from gear.
My combat HR has 18%-22% depending with all feats applied and 15% maxed on 3 run. I did the math earlier look at it. Both have Healing depression applied in pvp. No difference. I can heal my SW while in fight.
Alternative was writen earlier. Deflection Severity. Ability to use and benefit from freaking TAB and making Bow not just a thing on back of HRs. Reorganising feats so that trapper or archer could have some survivabilty or control for archer. Making freaking ecounter work after all the nerf. Making usable daily finally. Plenty of options really. Just start to bother reading first.
instigator :
- Mighty leap should prone
- the tier 3 nimble runner should be changed with tier 4 group assault : Wicked Strike and punishing charge deals up to 10% more damage
- nimble runner should be changed this while "While slotting SteadFast Determination you gain up to 50% determination faster and while in unstopable you gain 10% deflect.
- capstone should give 10% damage bonus, and get 5% damage bonus more per stack x 4 = 20% = 30% .
this capstone should grant 25-50% damage resistance.
destroyer: destroyer purpose capstone should always give 20% damage bonus , while unstopable gain 10% more damage bonus and gaining 1% damage bonus / 1 stack = 50% damage bonus.
sentinel: intimidation : daring shout and come and get it should give 50% out of max Defense as damage , reason is that we wont get so much DEFENSE in PVP the same we have with POWER right now.
so half of defense is transformed in damage and multiplied with damage bonus+crit severity etc. shorten cooldowns on daring shout and cagi by 2 seconds.
MAKE THIS HAPPEN !
This is how will make the GWF all paragons viable for PVP , givin them a fair chance of fighting.
and they are resonable changes. this would give a fair chance to PVE content aswell.
Many players want to fight sentinels and keep threat, but they cant, cause they need to stack power for the intimidation feat, so they will lack defense.
there is no need in this game to one shot people to overcome other classes ways of healings. Like other says and i say to, it's unfun fighting short fights.
for CW and GWF players i think our paragons such as thaumaturg/opressor / destroyer / instigator , and probably renegade aswell , are close on having what you call a fair chance and balanced fight. and i would like for cws to have their shard back on TAB back .t hat would make fighting a cw 1vs1 challenging .
for HR classes is time for them to be changed: i dont dislike the class or the players and i am rather fond with some hr users, but this class is on another level than others. and that should be changed.
mod3 was the problem of that mediation that healed them very fast, and mod4 it's about how they heal from all those healing abilities. to be honest i think fightin a hr from mod3 was more balanced than this one, that he doesnt give a fair chance to a fight:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXOnEGW3gAY&index=1&list=UUTamWwOKo7kZjAk8Iux2P4w
as u can see most of the time because of the deflection he cannot even be stunned properly.
not to say without my offhand there, the fight would have ended in merely 20 seconds. and you cannot debate this on how poorly i am playin the GWF , just dont.
SW is the newly class in this game and in mod5 they'll have the new paragon , we all know they are buggy but lets give them a time to adjust in this game, like we did with hunters.
DC & TRs , dunno why but most of the QQs were based on how to defeat a hunter ranger mostly, because of the selfhealing he has, if TRs and DC come out as they are now on preview , i think it's bad.
GWf POV : i want to see this
destroyer lacks surviability , but can do high DPS , so i see him like a striker.
sentinel has better surviability , but will lack high DPS, but instead he will deal some resonable burst damage.
and instigator will end up with medium DPS and medium surviability.
i dont see a reason why would you not implement this on GWF , this will not break the GWF mechanics, it only equalling the paragons between them.
Destroyer wil lbe chosen by those who want to DPS , Sentienl for those who want to tank, and instigator for those who want a little tankyness and little dps.
why Mighty leap a prone?
cause it's AOE skill , and landing a mighty leap in pvp it will be pretty hard, i will not use this skill, but for what i've seen so far on twitch even devs/akro were using it.
MAKE THIS HAPPEN !
Instigator: Fleet Footed:
Whenever you control a target you gain an additional 3/6/9/12/15% Run Speed for 3s
needs a rework cause GWFs have very poor control.
could change something into a
Whenever you crit a target you slow them for 3/6/9/12/15% Run Speed for 3s
Instigator: Allied Opportunity: Damage Bonus increased to 6/12/18/24/30% (up from 2/4/6/8/10%) and the Combat Advantage Duration is increased to 1.5/3/4.5/6/7.5 seconds (up from 1/1.5/2/2.5/3 seconds).
The combat advantage to not so fast and mighty leap is obsolete, since combat advantage can be easily achieved with mark and other class mechanics.
I suggest a different upgrade to those 2 encounters instead, add a daze to not so fast and mighty leap instead.
i disagree with fleet flooted, i think it's okai as it is.
and i agree with allied opportunity: either prone on mighty leap / and bigger slow on not so fast.
i dont give a rats <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> about trapper, it will be changed at some point every class has a useless tree, instigator was useless since launch, oppressor for cw was useless for a long time etc. asking for 3 balanced paragons, that all work in both pve and pvp is just stupid and selfish
combat is OP. at least if you CAN play your class instead of being a little fanboy crying when u cant faceroll everybody anymore
intimidation is stupid fail design, gwf dev doesnt have a clue what to do with the class so he adds just some fkd up random buffs/nerfs
so instead of nerfing the OP life steal on HR you want to nerf all the classes, good thinking
what keeps other classes from getting 30% life steal ? ever heard of diminishing returns ? it takes over 3k to get to 15% and over 20k to get to 20%(from gear)
First off: effectenstein, why are you posting about fighting a fully potted HR when you're not potted yourself? While the vid does show the intended things i.e. hr self-healing, it's inaccurate because you're not fighting on equal grounds. Also while this isn't entirely relevant, you're definitely at a disadvantage there because HR will destroy any melee class except TR if they're using Slasher's Mark, because of the infinite dodge. And... HRs should be banned from using red glyphs.
Secondly, to the people saying Wild's Medicine should be reverted to its state on live, I'd like to say NO. I'll post logs when I can be bothered to, but WM is approximately 50-60% of a HR's healing on live, with Life Steal being second at around 30%. These numbers will vary slightly depending on the class you're fighting i.e. on preview, Life Steal will be about 50% vs 25/25% regen/WM when fighting a burst one-rotation GF. As it stands, WM is extremely effective as a HOT while HR Life Steal is effective as burst healing, and both of them make for a rather unbalanced healing combination on live. The nerf to WM brings the feat more in line. Life Steal I think is mostly fine, but if anything, the main problem with life steal is not the life steal % itself but the Dread Ring boon Endless Consumption. Take away that and HR life steal isn't as effective as it seems to be.
Also k9madrush - "nerf every class and buff mine" isn't very good feedback imo. TRs are already getting a buff that will make them the top of the pvp food chain so I don't know why you're complaining.
Hindering shot
Binding arrow
Constricting arrow
are now THE SAME THING. The only difference is that hindering has 3 seconds cooldown the other 15.
And this is like this since the start of module 4.
Can we go back to providing our feedbacks on the proposed Mod5 changes using the mechanics as proposed above by Chris to help the Devs ?
As example, my 2 cents posted below yesterday, on CW's Mod5 feedbacks, but I'm afraid already lost on all the discussion:
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?773431-Official-Feedback-Thread-Other-Balance-Changes&p=9327641#post9327641
Thanks to all.
well i wasn't doing 1vs1 for the purpose who is greater, i was just demonstrating more things in that video
1. the offhand being broken for gwf
2. the procc of ferocious heals , that procc 2 times, instead of 1 time.
and HR in my opinion is heckin up the PVP so much, thats why it happened before things like
CW : with assailnt
GWF : with intimidation
and we will have tricksters that will one shot, for this special reason, people bringing up feedback mostly to beat up Hrs.
cause the way i am seeing up HRs is like they are out of pvp:
they shot, they pass, they are goalkeepers , they are doing everything to sum it up, thats too much on a single class, and people are callin up for DAMAGE BOOST for their own classes especially for this reason, bringin up fights that if you hit first , you win, that's not cool.
54% deflection chance.
what happened with GF and GWF those should have the best defense in-game.
and i am not in favor boost my class damage , cause i belive there is enough DPS in-game , only small tweaks on each class would solve that, but people like thedemien thinks that playin an OP class he has "skills".
@deepfight007, the posts are being read, as you can see if you read until this page, Gentlemancrush sniped out my combat Log , so yeah, they are pretty much being read, and probably someone is takin all the feedback
I agree on this. There is a fix for Piercing. So less damage. And actually way less damage to DR heavy classes as GWF and GF since piercing now is calculated on real damage done after .Eg 40% more damage from real damage after DR calcs. Not 40% of orginal power damage. So HR will be getting less damage from LS since we now do less damage inm first place.
WM is half now and as ralexinor state will be around 25%. So less HoT for all HRs.
This depend of how HR is set up cause mine have most of incoming healing from Regen ~ 60% while LS and WM shared 40% top on live.
As SW i can say that they have nice dot too. Hellish Rebuke is pretty good. And is very close by mechanic to Careful attack.
Im only comparing those two cause they both have high LS. And on my SW with proper positioning I can help my char from 10 to 100% in one rotation of encounter in pvp. Even without Endless.
I have no meaning to compare melee class defenses to Range class defenses. And combat HR is now 95% melee class. This lead to one more thing.
Base melee damage for HR comes from offhand. Main hand is not applied in calcs at all except from stats boost. Top offhand has ~ 500 base.
Base damage for SW is main hand ~ 900 base. You can compare to any other class you what. Only HRs have offhand as main for combat.
Now 500 + 0.4 *500 = 700.
So look at Piercing as not a feet that does something overpowered. Look at it as how devs try to fix combat HRs base damage. Since unfortunately offhand is forced to be our main weapon.
I d really prefer to comeback to some mod 3 HR. Where Skill were consistent .We did not have 3 same skills that are only usable in trapper path and do same stuff. Where tab did really matter for combat and for archer. And was not just quick switch for buff.
In mod 3 HR had 2 possible way to have pvp - both valuable enough. Now only combat.
Also we lost all buffer path. Not valuable for pvp but handy in pve.
Best way to go now is to comeback to mod 3 and fix its problems rather then this broken mod 4 HRs. Or buff other classes. You btw had really good suggestion for CW dodges somewhere.
Second and probably hard but required fix - nerf Endless consumption. Devs stated they will rework LS. So i do expect it do less healing now. But this will affect all classes not just HR and is way better if you look at it from point of DC.
the only crybaby here is u, crying about how he needs his class to be OP to play, and HR is still the strongest class or close enough
i want 7 viable classes for PvP and PvE
Mod 3 HR was arguably even more broken than it is now at BiS gear levels. I was able to kill pretty much every class at the end of the module, my only (slight) issues were:
- good GWF with Kessels
- great perma TRs, once it took me exactly and hour to kill one
- 1vs2 situations where some CW decided to icy rays me for his teammate
CWs were pushovers, GFs were unable to dent me, DC took a bit to kill but in the end it still happened. The class was godmode.
you or clinging to combat paragon too much instead of wanting to have the otehr 2 viable for pvp, for that you may bring suggestion, but nerfs as well, as i can see it, you either debating
they need to nerf boons
or either bring the old hr from mod3
but you dont want that for combat and selfhealing to be tonned down as first thing. to get it up in line with the other classes.
Well this is what i mean by fixing mod 3 spikes. I like the play style in mod 2/3. And nod holder HR is no anyway right way to be. What i mean is that I liked synergy between bow and melee to to damage and usage of all encounter rather then having 1 rotation for all cases. Plus CWs GF DCs are now changed too. so picture is different now I hope.