After that part of the population has been separated from their money, then it's possible that something with a wider appeal will come out. If they announced it now, then some people who are already grudgingly sucking up the price of the current pack would go for the cheaper option instead. (This is banking on the already demonstrated fluidity of the concept of "exclusive".)
I said the exact same thing (though in friendlier terms) several pages ago. Once the large pack purchasers are "cheated/milked/bilked/extorted/separated from" their money like idiots then they will releases a lesser pack that will be worth even less, but look more enticing because it's cheaper for the cheap to be "cheated/milked/bilked/extorted/separated from" their money like idiots also. So I suppose anyone who spends any money on this game are all a bunch of idiots, because if you spend $100 on non tangible pixel candy it's really no different logically from spending $1 on the same thing: non tangible pixel candy.
It's how the game (of business) is played. What I don't get is how the hell anyone is surprised by any of this at all? LOL
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited August 2014
<- spends money on game
I used the terminology I did because the corporate overlords *are* attempting to separate money from consumers. It's what they do.
That's where I think the business model is pointed in this particular case, to carry on a different metaphor... suspecting that someone is going to go after the small fish but only after they've caught as many potential whales as they can.
That wasn't meant to imply denigration of any particular subset of consumers. All of our money is good money, but they need to figure out how to get us to spend as much possible, and offering a budget option only some time after the big ticket item is one of them.
I somewhat expect a standalone (paid, not free) release or a smaller pack to be announced in the future, but only once the consumers who actually are willing to fork at the higher price point have been milked.
Not gonna happen. The alternate Drow and Moon Elves are still gated behind their respective packs. If there was any intention to break them out into less expensive options it would have been done by now. The price of the Dragonborn Legends pack might change, maybe even its contents, but you are not going to see that race outside of that pack.
@Venture-1@Venture from City of Heroes if you remember that far back. Yes, *that* Venture. Yes, I probably trashed your MA arc. For me it was Tuesday.
I used the terminology I did because the corporate overlords *are* attempting to separate money from consumers. It's what they do.
That's where I think the business model is pointed in this particular case, to carry on a different metaphor... suspecting that someone is going to go after the small fish but only after they've caught as many potential whales as they can.
That wasn't meant to imply denigration of any particular subset of consumers. All of our money is good money, but they need to figure out how to get us to spend as much possible, and offering a budget option only some time after the big ticket item is one of them.
I understand (I think you and I understand we each speak plainly without sugar-coating anything, but without malice).
This: "suspecting that someone is going to go after the small fish but only after they've caught as many potential whales as they can." is exactly how it works. If I were in charge of this stuff for Cryptic this is exactly and precisely how I'd approach this. I've said I believe this is what *will* happen much earlier in this thread.
It's simple: "Exclusive Shiny in this Box with other shinies: $100"
[We also have exclusive shiny without other shines for only $25 - but we don't DARE announce or leak that information so those buying the big box will buy the big box because they only want the exclusive shiny mostly]
Delivery day: Big Box with exclusive shiny and other shines is delivered and opened and used by buyers.
Delivery day + one week at next patch: New items in Zen market: Exclusive shiny without other shines for only 2500 Zen!
All the highly-opinionated naysayers flock like crazy clowns to the Zen market to buy small box.
Shrill complaints about Zen Exchange Backlog ensue-renewed, but at much higher-octave pitch because they did not anticipate such (typical and obvious) business practices by converting (right now) ahead of time to allow the time-lag and want to sell their ill-gotten Astral Diamonds for Zen NOW!
In November and December: rinse and repeat with new shiny. LOL
TL;DR: I am actually willing to bet money they WILL release a Race-only option - some will proclaim it's still too expensive, and when they do announce and release it it will be likely a minimum one-week after Mod 4 release (if not longer) to not HAMSTER-off all the already-purchased-by-whales people ( but I personally would welcome such an option and think it's a good idea).
Id love to test this on the PTR without having to pay for it, to decide if I want to....
On the PTR you CAN change to it, but it wants you to pay for it.... I want to see and know what I get before purchasing (if I do) - I know... I MAY just be INSANE at this price... I definitely wont buy unless I can try for free....
Either that or drop the price to $50 and ill buy it anyways..... YOur move cryptic
Id love to test this on the PTR without having to pay for it, to decide if I want to....
On the PTR you CAN change to it, but it wants you to pay for it.... I want to see and know what I get before purchasing (if I do) - I know... I MAY just be INSANE at this price... I definitely wont buy unless I can try for free....
Either that or drop the price to $50 and ill buy it anyways..... YOur move cryptic
I plan to create a DemoRecord video with detailed views of both male and female versions for people in your situation: a way to at least evaluate the artwork.
I plan to create a DemoRecord video with detailed views of both male and female versions for people in your situation: a way to at least evaluate the artwork.
Yeah Id really like to see it. It looks like they are bigger than half orcs which is cool, Cause you can make a Half Orc HUGE!!!
Id like to see skin color options, along with how the character looks when they move or attack. Messing with a Half orc they feel really "clunky" so im curious to know the DB and how they look with things.
I may just buy the pack since money is more "meh" than my curiosity sometimes but id like to atleast TEST it first.
0
dheffernanMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 216Arc User
Delivery day: Big Box with exclusive shiny and other shines is delivered and opened and used by buyers.
Delivery day + one week at next patch: New items in Zen market: Exclusive shiny without other shines for only 2500 Zen!
Allow me to point out the flaw in your genius plan: if the company does this EVEN ONCE no one will ever bite at the HAMSTER Bait again because they'll know, or at least reasonably suspect, they'll get a better deal if they wait.
So it's not going to happen.
@Venture-1@Venture from City of Heroes if you remember that far back. Yes, *that* Venture. Yes, I probably trashed your MA arc. For me it was Tuesday.
We will all be able see on release day how well the pack sold. The more Dragonborn you see running around the more likely it is that they choose the right price point, if there not very many then the wrong price point was chosen and Cryptic will adjust accordingly with future offereings. Until then the debate over whether it is too expensive or not is pointless. After release we can all sit around and endlessly discuss the price structure and Cryptic's success or demise with glee and abandon.
I plan to create a DemoRecord video with detailed views of both male and female versions for people in your situation: a way to at least evaluate the artwork.
I am going to laugh if you manage to beat them at showing what their own race looks like in game.
considering there's still no female dragonborn on the promotional material with 8 days left in the sale.
I am going to laugh if you manage to beat them at showing what their own race looks like in game.
considering there's still no female dragonborn on the promotional material with 8 days left in the sale.
Female dragon born are previewable on the test shard
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Allow me to point out the flaw in your genius plan: if the company does this EVEN ONCE no one will ever bite at the HAMSTER Bait again because they'll know, or at least reasonably suspect, they'll get a better deal if they wait.
So it's not going to happen.
Good point, and you may be right. But I'm not willing to rule it out 100%.
We will all be able see on release day how well the pack sold. The more Dragonborn you see running around the more likely it is that they choose the right price point, if there not very many then the wrong price point was chosen and Cryptic will adjust accordingly with future offereings. Until then the debate over whether it is too expensive or not is pointless. After release we can all sit around and endlessly discuss the price structure and Cryptic's success or demise with glee and abandon.
This is an excellent observation (and probably best in this thread). Note that they have admitted (Reddit thread on this subject) that pretty much everything regarding Zen Market and Cash-based paks are always an experiment. This is certainly their most ambitious experiment to date.
I am going to laugh if you manage to beat them at showing what their own race looks like in game.
considering there's still no female dragonborn on the promotional material with 8 days left in the sale.
I hadn't thought of that, but yes... I suppose it would be funny. I am a pro video editor and here's one thing I've noticed: their early videos were really too "twitchy" (cuts were too fast and too much movement) - I had released a couple machinima movies and commented how I did it (even wrote a DemoRecord User Guide - free at iBooks if you have iOS) and explained how their videos could be better (explained to player base, not to Cryptic) - their newer videos are much better (composition, editing) - I don't know if I had any influence or not - but I'm sure my Dragonborn video will will help any fence-sitters to make their decision because I'm a stickler for detail.
By the way - on Preview Server you can select the Dragonborn Race (you can't create it, but you can see the Female version on Character Creation screen. My thoughts: FUGLY).
By the way - on Preview Server you can select the Dragonborn Race (you can't create it, but you can see the Female version on Character Creation screen. My thoughts: FUGLY).
I actually love how gruesome the female is looking. I'm sure the temptation was to pretty it up more ala certain other games' approach to females but dragonborn should look scary. And it could be my imagination but it appears the female is very slightly taller then the male, though obviously not nearly as wide: The male has a build like a dwarf, just taller.
I actually love how gruesome the female is looking. I'm sure the temptation was to pretty it up more ala certain other games' approach to females but dragonborn should look scary. And it could be my imagination but it appears the female is very slightly taller then the male, though obviously not nearly as wide: The male has a build like a dwarf, just taller.
I agree. My *impression* is that the female has longer legs, making her as tall, possibly slightly taller than the male (but these can be player-adjusted, obviously) - the male looking like a taller dwarf is a good description. As for the female being so FUGLY - that's a good thing. I want FUGLY. LOL
Not being personally interested in the Dragonborn per say, but I do want the game to include interesting visuals etc so it enhances the ingame immersion and experience.
IMHO as well fugly is a good way to go. There are too many pretty races (especially elves - no looking at my 6 elven ladies, that's just coincidence) and some contrast will definitely be a good things and fug things to a more realistic feel. I mean, even the new editor makes some of the female half-orcs look prettier than a couple of ladies I've brought back from a night club (bright light/logic/taste - why has thou forsaken me??)
yeah, thought I'd take another peek because for some oddball reason it refuses to die (neither of us are helping with that, obviously). Either way: I think the "it's too expensive/no value for its price/I'd buy it if it were cheaper even though I probably wouldn't" messages have been clearly expressed and received by Cryptic.
I just find it absolutely hilarious when people proclaim how they 'used to spend money here" but now "will never again because of this very thing!" - C'mon, admit it: you're rolling your eyes at these statements, too.
Here's the thing: some people may really just stop playing because this this, but it's only the final straw in their long path of doubts and frustrations. Some people really would buy this package if it cost less, but nowhere near as many as those who proclaimed it (among all those who proclaimed it). Sure, more people would buy the package if it included *another* (yawn) mount and companion.
In short it is what it is. I purchased it - and I and other like me have had mud thrown at us just because we've purchased something for ourselves that the slingers don't like. I won't say offended because it's pretty damned hard to offend me. But just the same: you accuse me of generalizations?
Okaaaay.
Fact: I purchased this package. Happy I did. Even if I hand;t yet, read every single comment in this thread, I'd still likely do it. I'm satisfied I'm getting what I've paid for. As for value and worth: pffft - the players have decided the value and worth of things like Artifacts and whatnot by the astronomical pricing in the Auction House and such. Is the $100 too rich? Sure, for most. I'd have a hard time swallowing the full hundred, but I'll drop the 75. I didn't do it willy-nilly. I percolated on it for a few days then decided to do it. It's not like I'm some mindless bazillionaire who throws cash around willy-nilly.
But I can afford it and Neverwinter is my chosen entertainment source, so for me it's simply an investment into that entertainment source. I don't spend money going to the movies very week, or eating out every single day, or buying music all over the place or buying a stupid $7 coffee three times a day. Now if half these commentators who do buy those things stopped - the $75 tag might not be as steep as it looks.
People actually complaining about a one-time purchase of something that will last forever (as long as the game survives) - but will actually happily spend $7 on a COFFEE? LOL As I've said: Okaaaay.
Just saying. We all pick and choose how we spend our money. Tomorrow I'll still have my shiny race on the next hundred new toons I make for no additional cost, you'll still have to pay that $7 for a coffee. (General public "you" - no one in particular).
If you guys can use female dragonborn on test can you post a screenshot?
Thanks.
You cannot use the Dragonborn on the preview server. You can see it in the Race Slection screen (creating a new character) and right now that's the only visual we can get (but you can select the Male and Female sex to see the previews of each). I'll post screenshots and a video once Mod 4 launches. Problem for fence-sitters then will be that the 25%-off sale will be over by then.
You cannot use the Dragonborn on the preview server. You can see it in the Race Slection screen (creating a new character) and right now that's the only visual we can get (but you can select the Male and Female sex to see the previews of each). I'll post screenshots and a video once Mod 4 launches. Problem for fence-sitters then will be that the 25%-off sale will be over by then.
Could you post a screenshot of the selection screen please?
I am pretty sure that there are people out there who would appreciate it.
0
dheffernanMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 216Arc User
Note that they have admitted (Reddit thread on this subject) that pretty much everything regarding Zen Market and Cash-based paks are always an experiment.
"It's just an experiment." -- V. Frankenstein
@Venture-1@Venture from City of Heroes if you remember that far back. Yes, *that* Venture. Yes, I probably trashed your MA arc. For me it was Tuesday.
Could you post a screenshot of the selection screen please?
I've added screenshots of the selection screen for both male and female genders to a gallery on the preliminary gamepedia wiki page for Dragonborn so that people without access to preview server can get a glimpse of their potential purchase. Just click on the image to see a larger version: http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/Dragonborn
A few side notes:
* Hopping back and forth between race selections, I think the female dragonborn mesh started out as a resized female half-orc but with some very slight thickening of limbs and the head-swap. The female lacks the fringes the male does, so it is possible she still represents a preliminary form, or the fringes could be optional for both (which would be great if that is the case). In any case even if this is what we get I think she looks striking. Her face comes off as a bit uglier then she should thanks to facing directly at the screen and will probably look more like the male in profile judging from the illustration in the bottom right corner.
* The male dragonborn mesh, while built stocky like a dwarf, doesn't seem to proportionately line up with dwarf (or half-orc for that matter). They could have started with either of those, but it is definitely a unique mesh build at this point. I'm definitely liking the look (regardless of my views on the price).
* Unrelated to dragonborn directly, but Moon Elf, Sun Elf, and Wood Elf are all under one pull-down now to make room for it.
I've added screenshots of the selection screen for both male and female genders to a gallery on the preliminary gamepedia wiki page for Dragonborn so that people without access to preview server can get a glimpse of their potential purchase. Just click on the image to see a larger version: http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/Dragonborn
Thanks.
The female looks... interesting. But its probably because of the perspective on the head.
And I do not really want to see her in a more revealing outfit (which actually isn't bad at all).
Comments
I said the exact same thing (though in friendlier terms) several pages ago. Once the large pack purchasers are "cheated/milked/bilked/extorted/separated from" their money like idiots then they will releases a lesser pack that will be worth even less, but look more enticing because it's cheaper for the cheap to be "cheated/milked/bilked/extorted/separated from" their money like idiots also. So I suppose anyone who spends any money on this game are all a bunch of idiots, because if you spend $100 on non tangible pixel candy it's really no different logically from spending $1 on the same thing: non tangible pixel candy.
It's how the game (of business) is played. What I don't get is how the hell anyone is surprised by any of this at all? LOL
I used the terminology I did because the corporate overlords *are* attempting to separate money from consumers. It's what they do.
That's where I think the business model is pointed in this particular case, to carry on a different metaphor... suspecting that someone is going to go after the small fish but only after they've caught as many potential whales as they can.
That wasn't meant to imply denigration of any particular subset of consumers. All of our money is good money, but they need to figure out how to get us to spend as much possible, and offering a budget option only some time after the big ticket item is one of them.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
Not gonna happen. The alternate Drow and Moon Elves are still gated behind their respective packs. If there was any intention to break them out into less expensive options it would have been done by now. The price of the Dragonborn Legends pack might change, maybe even its contents, but you are not going to see that race outside of that pack.
Maybe they can't find what's broken about it because it's not broken for all users. Works fine for me.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
I understand (I think you and I understand we each speak plainly without sugar-coating anything, but without malice).
This: "suspecting that someone is going to go after the small fish but only after they've caught as many potential whales as they can." is exactly how it works. If I were in charge of this stuff for Cryptic this is exactly and precisely how I'd approach this. I've said I believe this is what *will* happen much earlier in this thread.
It's simple: "Exclusive Shiny in this Box with other shinies: $100"
[We also have exclusive shiny without other shines for only $25 - but we don't DARE announce or leak that information so those buying the big box will buy the big box because they only want the exclusive shiny mostly]
Delivery day: Big Box with exclusive shiny and other shines is delivered and opened and used by buyers.
Delivery day + one week at next patch: New items in Zen market: Exclusive shiny without other shines for only 2500 Zen!
All the highly-opinionated naysayers flock like crazy clowns to the Zen market to buy small box.
Shrill complaints about Zen Exchange Backlog ensue-renewed, but at much higher-octave pitch because they did not anticipate such (typical and obvious) business practices by converting (right now) ahead of time to allow the time-lag and want to sell their ill-gotten Astral Diamonds for Zen NOW!
In November and December: rinse and repeat with new shiny. LOL
TL;DR: I am actually willing to bet money they WILL release a Race-only option - some will proclaim it's still too expensive, and when they do announce and release it it will be likely a minimum one-week after Mod 4 release (if not longer) to not HAMSTER-off all the already-purchased-by-whales people ( but I personally would welcome such an option and think it's a good idea).
But only time will tell.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
On the PTR you CAN change to it, but it wants you to pay for it.... I want to see and know what I get before purchasing (if I do) - I know... I MAY just be INSANE at this price... I definitely wont buy unless I can try for free....
Either that or drop the price to $50 and ill buy it anyways..... YOur move cryptic
I plan to create a DemoRecord video with detailed views of both male and female versions for people in your situation: a way to at least evaluate the artwork.
Yeah Id really like to see it. It looks like they are bigger than half orcs which is cool, Cause you can make a Half Orc HUGE!!!
Id like to see skin color options, along with how the character looks when they move or attack. Messing with a Half orc they feel really "clunky" so im curious to know the DB and how they look with things.
I may just buy the pack since money is more "meh" than my curiosity sometimes but id like to atleast TEST it first.
Allow me to point out the flaw in your genius plan: if the company does this EVEN ONCE no one will ever bite at the HAMSTER Bait again because they'll know, or at least reasonably suspect, they'll get a better deal if they wait.
So it's not going to happen.
I am going to laugh if you manage to beat them at showing what their own race looks like in game.
considering there's still no female dragonborn on the promotional material with 8 days left in the sale.
Female dragon born are previewable on the test shard
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Good point, and you may be right. But I'm not willing to rule it out 100%.
This is an excellent observation (and probably best in this thread). Note that they have admitted (Reddit thread on this subject) that pretty much everything regarding Zen Market and Cash-based paks are always an experiment. This is certainly their most ambitious experiment to date.
I hadn't thought of that, but yes... I suppose it would be funny. I am a pro video editor and here's one thing I've noticed: their early videos were really too "twitchy" (cuts were too fast and too much movement) - I had released a couple machinima movies and commented how I did it (even wrote a DemoRecord User Guide - free at iBooks if you have iOS) and explained how their videos could be better (explained to player base, not to Cryptic) - their newer videos are much better (composition, editing) - I don't know if I had any influence or not - but I'm sure my Dragonborn video will will help any fence-sitters to make their decision because I'm a stickler for detail.
By the way - on Preview Server you can select the Dragonborn Race (you can't create it, but you can see the Female version on Character Creation screen. My thoughts: FUGLY).
Seens that brazilians cant purchase packs others than hero of the north. can u send a link that works for us?
I agree. My *impression* is that the female has longer legs, making her as tall, possibly slightly taller than the male (but these can be player-adjusted, obviously) - the male looking like a taller dwarf is a good description. As for the female being so FUGLY - that's a good thing. I want FUGLY. LOL
IMHO as well fugly is a good way to go. There are too many pretty races (especially elves - no looking at my 6 elven ladies, that's just coincidence) and some contrast will definitely be a good things and fug things to a more realistic feel. I mean, even the new editor makes some of the female half-orcs look prettier than a couple of ladies I've brought back from a night club (bright light/logic/taste - why has thou forsaken me??)
Thanks.
The class isn't able to be chosen on preview , they must have done all racial testing inhouse.
+10 Enjoy your race my friend!
You cannot use the Dragonborn on the preview server. You can see it in the Race Slection screen (creating a new character) and right now that's the only visual we can get (but you can select the Male and Female sex to see the previews of each). I'll post screenshots and a video once Mod 4 launches. Problem for fence-sitters then will be that the 25%-off sale will be over by then.
Could you post a screenshot of the selection screen please?
I am pretty sure that there are people out there who would appreciate it.
"It's just an experiment." -- V. Frankenstein
A few side notes:
* Hopping back and forth between race selections, I think the female dragonborn mesh started out as a resized female half-orc but with some very slight thickening of limbs and the head-swap. The female lacks the fringes the male does, so it is possible she still represents a preliminary form, or the fringes could be optional for both (which would be great if that is the case). In any case even if this is what we get I think she looks striking. Her face comes off as a bit uglier then she should thanks to facing directly at the screen and will probably look more like the male in profile judging from the illustration in the bottom right corner.
* The male dragonborn mesh, while built stocky like a dwarf, doesn't seem to proportionately line up with dwarf (or half-orc for that matter). They could have started with either of those, but it is definitely a unique mesh build at this point. I'm definitely liking the look (regardless of my views on the price).
* Unrelated to dragonborn directly, but Moon Elf, Sun Elf, and Wood Elf are all under one pull-down now to make room for it.
Thanks.
The female looks... interesting. But its probably because of the perspective on the head.
And I do not really want to see her in a more revealing outfit (which actually isn't bad at all).
Unfortunately wont be able to log in until after the sale ends so i'm reliant on either cryptic or joe youtube.