Also lets not pretend the classes are balanced, and in the same breath rate them by damage and utility. Classes are not balanced, when one dps class can decisively outdps properly specced another dps class with at least 10 mil more AD investment in gear (+- 3k to 4k), something is not balanced.
So what you are saying is that different classes should all be the same, but different?
Class balance has nothing to do with item level.
A CW should not be a tank. A GWF should not be a healer. etc, etc. Or to simplfiy... because one DPS can out DPS another DPS class with inferior item level, does not mean there is imbalance. It means they are doing what their class is supposed to do. The statement about lack of class balance based on item levels, would be suggesting that all classes do the same based on item level.
This may not be what you wanted to say... or maybe it is... but if it is... then what's the point of having different classes?
Here is how I see them:
Control Wizards have with High burst and sustained DPS, with moderate Control. Great Weapon Fighters have Critical sustained and burst DPS. Trickster Rouges have Critcal Evasion and moderate-to-high DPS. Paladins have Critical Heals, High-to-Critical-tankiness with low-to-moderate burst DPS. Guardian Fighters have Moderate Buffs/Debuffs and Moderate tankiness with moderate burst DPS. Hunter Rangers have High Control with Moderate-to-high DPS Devoted Clerics have High Heals to High Buffs/Debuffs Scourge Warlocks have High-to-critical Brokeness with Critical glitch damage
When you look at them for what they are... The way this set works makes sense.
0
Options
zekethesinnerMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 805Arc User
A farming approach to the game isn't something healthy from my POV, but let's not talk about 'personal interests' (you farm to sell) but what it's good for everyone.
Start is always tough. We farm what we can to progress, we progress to farm faster, farm faster and to progress even faster. So we can take on next challenge.
All about MMORPG games r... is CONSTANT PROGRESSION, endless grind (just new lvles added on top of old ones, sometimes covered with nice storyline, sometimes with reactive challenge system, sometimes not covered at all). If u play game for a year and u cant even get to newest content, coz "too hard", while others, with same experience, in time of ur failed attept can finish it 5 times (without exploits, i mean those true exploits like glitching boss to fail) U r the one who is doing horrible bad, its not they fault that u r stubborn in ur choices.
Problem is, MMORPG is all about farming, go kill 100 gobins for next lvl, go kill 200 goblins, maybe one will drop nice sword. Go kill that bigass boss, he will drop one weap for whole 30-man raid, do it 150 times, still no weap for u? oh look u have that weap on AH. If u have problem with this "non-healthy approach"... drop MMO.
So yes, we want progressing faster, we want to see results, thats the whole point of MMORPG
So to get back the developers freedom to make new sets, the Lostmauth set needs to be brought back in line.
I do agree with this. For the progression model in this game to work properly it would be wise. Or you'll find bored players in MoD9 with nothing to work for still wearing the the lostmauth set and still wearing lvl 60 sets.
x silverkelt: They aren't supposed to make it trash, just fix it. If you gain 10% more DPS it will be still your top choice so you don't lose anyhing. No one is asking to make it trash.
x micky1p00: If they drop more pieces, those will lower in price. Not bad for players (until Cryptic will tune it to drop less, in that case I agree with you but that move would be a bit evil). Glitches and exploits are always bad in the end, I agree. A farming approach to the game isn't something healthy from my POV, but let's not talk about 'personal interests' (you farm to sell) but what it's good for everyone. It's explicit from devs that they don't want you to 'farm for selling' (T2 stuff bind to account, low drop rates, etc. their message seems pretty clear to me).
They should nerf this to balance things out, I don't want the set to be trash nor people get burned, just balance. Still benefit with balance. This will directly affect class balance and then they can work on issues on solid ground.
1. Devs are irrelevant you said it wont affect you, I pointed that it will. 2. MMOs are based on farming something:
0
Options
micky1p00Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,594Arc User
Also lets not pretend the classes are balanced, and in the same breath rate them by damage and utility. Classes are not balanced, when one dps class can decisively outdps properly specced another dps class with at least 10 mil more AD investment in gear (+- 3k to 4k), something is not balanced.
So what you are saying is that different classes should all be the same, but different?
Class balance has nothing to do with item level.
This may not be what you wanted to say... or maybe it is... but if it is... then what's the point of having different classes?
What she is saying is that Lostmauth makes one DPS class at 3k out-damage another at 4k not using the set. And that's quite severely unbalanced.
I voted no. I spent a large amount of AD getting this set and upgrading it, so that I could do a ton of damage. I would like other sets to be buffed, or new sets added that are on-par with what the Lostmauth set can do.
Yeah, right. Buffing your ego is surely the best reason for this set to stay...
It's not working correctly, you know this.
That means you like to play imbalanced stuff just to feel superior to people not able to afford it. You farmed your stuff, so you can be proud now? No, you used leadership or any other cheap method to gain an amount of AD new players can only dream of. These times are over and no one deserves to get +25% damage sets anymore. (I did not use curse words, disregarding someones achievements should be allowed, right?)
The whole point is to better your character for higher content.. Which NWO severely lacks. I can see the reasoning for not grinding in its current state where no content requires 2500+ besides PvP.
People do not complain about the set being grindy to get. The devs wanted to remove "big set boni" back in Mod 6. Lostmauth-Set is the complete opposite. Buffing the other sets isn't an option for the reason you mentioned. It would further trivialize the current content.
I voted no. I spent a large amount of AD getting this set and upgrading it, so that I could do a ton of damage. I would like other sets to be buffed, or new sets added that are on-par with what the Lostmauth set can do.
Yeah, right. Buffing your ego is surely the best reason for this set to stay...
It's not working correctly, you know this. That means you like to play imbalanced stuff just to feel superior to people not able to afford it. You farmed your stuff, so you can be proud now? No, you used leadership or any other cheap method to gain an amount of AD new players can only dream of. These times are over and no one deserves to get +25% damage sets anymore. (I did not use curse words, disregarding someones achievements should be allowed, right?)
The whole point is to better your character for higher content.. Which NWO severely lacks. I can see the reasoning for not grinding in its current state where no content requires 2500+ besides PvP.
People do not complain about the set being grindy to get. The devs wanted to remove "big set boni" back in Mod 6. Lostmauth-Set is the complete opposite. Buffing the other sets isn't an option for the reason you mentioned. It would further trivialize the current content.
Elol set is dirt cheap now. 450k for the horn, 35k for the neck, 8k for the belt. Having something that effective at that price is more helpful for newer players than anything in the game.
That comics is why I think isn't worthed to grind. Better play an let the things come when it is time.
I never farmed except long ago with Dragons in the Well. That was a big waste of time, definitely.
Better start another toon if you completed all campaigns.
Well of Dragons happens to be one of the most effective places to grind AD atm. If you keep starting toons, and don't grind for them at all, they'll always be weak, especially with builds not properly tailored for damage. Grinding has always been a key principle for MMOs. If you don't like grinding, you're playing the wrong game, go play a single player RPG, same style of play without the grinding.
That's the problem, the players want things handed to them rather than going and farming to obtain the gear and things that top players have. If you want something expensive farm and grind towards that goal, that's the whole point of an MMO.
Arcotep and his ilk want us to farm for rank 12s to get that super awesome 1.75% crit chance or whatever.
God forbid there's something for 1/3 the price that lets newer players deal some damage in dungeons.
I vote yes. When over 95% all high DPS players are using the same thing, it's clear you have imbalance.
I hear the comments to improve the other sets, and yes that's likely needed. But it just further removes the stat only belts from ever being viable. But that is A LOT more work. It's easier just to scale this set down, as it's clearly performing beyond their expectations.
Yes, every player hates the nerf bat. But, sometimes it is the appropriate tool to use. But given the last livestream with the devs, and the comment "we don't want portions of the game to become unplayable" when discussing the paladin bubble, it's clear balance is NOT a main factor in their design. So I chalk this thread up to a pointless community outreach to placate people who want to be heard.
Ridiculous keeping a known bugged set in the game for over a year now. As a CW I went with the Valindra set because according to the tool tip it would be BiS for my class. I stuck with my choice when I read the Dev's where going to fix the Lostmauth set and been waiting patently ever since... pipe dream. For those complaining about how hard it was to obtain their Lostmauth set forget or have no idea that the shard of Valindra's crown is also hard to get. To further the ridiculousness a GWF with half of my stat's does much more damage than I do. I would be fine with it if I could CC the way a "CONTROL" WIZARD should. Now I find myself in a position that I'll have to change my set because the one I have is useless, along with 3 artifact to fix my stats. If I can't control properly I might as well go for a full out DPS configuration. People complaining that the game will be to hard if they fix the set is hilarious, it's not meant to be easy, next off you guy's want the command /kill target and end attacking... why not. It is obvious the dev's are going to keep their bugged set, because they can't fix it even if they wanted to.
Nobody says you need to balance classes around eLoL set. Somebody wrote it is a stupid idea... well, you are stupid if you think this is what people want when they ask to nerf GWFs. If cryptics fix eLoL, then almost all DDs will have their damage reduced and damage gap between GWF and other classes will still be too big. I am not against nefing eLoL actually. I just think this is not a solution for the whole GWF situation since there are other things that make them too powerful. Fix the set if you want, but it won't improve balance as 80% of DD players already use it and it's quite easy to get. The idea to remove personal buffs from the set's damage was nice though... I think.
And why do you keep asking to fix Shocking Execution and Divine Protector then? Following your logic it would be more fair if cryptics nerf sigil of the devoted and flail snail because these allow TR and OP to use powerful dailies more often.
I could have suggested buffing other classes instead of nerfing GWF... but the endgame content is already too easy and more overpowered classes will make it even easier.
So what you are saying is that different classes should all be the same, but different?
Class balance has nothing to do with item level.
A CW should not be a tank. A GWF should not be a healer. etc, etc. Or to simplfiy... because one DPS can out DPS another DPS class with inferior item level, does not mean there is imbalance. It means they are doing what their class is supposed to do. The statement about lack of class balance based on item levels, would be suggesting that all classes do the same based on item level.
This may not be what you wanted to say... or maybe it is... but if it is... then what's the point of having different classes?
Here is how I see them:
Control Wizards have with High burst and sustained DPS, with moderate Control. Great Weapon Fighters have Critical sustained and burst DPS. Trickster Rouges have Critcal Evasion and moderate-to-high DPS. Paladins have Critical Heals, High-to-Critical-tankiness with low-to-moderate burst DPS. Guardian Fighters have Moderate Buffs/Debuffs and Moderate tankiness with moderate burst DPS. Hunter Rangers have High Control with Moderate-to-high DPS Devoted Clerics have High Heals to High Buffs/Debuffs Scourge Warlocks have High-to-critical Brokeness with Critical glitch damage
When you look at them for what they are... The way this set works makes sense.
Totally agree with you, I couldn't be any more clear than this.
Remember, if they decide to fix this set they can always allow for a temporary or one time 100% RP to another set. Alternately they could allow for a similar free transmute to any other set (to preserve the investment cost in the items themselves as well as the RP). If any complain about the cost or rp that would be nullified.
The only thing left one might complain about is specifically working a build (chants/feats/etc) around high crit to fully exploit the bonuses offered by lostmauth.
Comments
Class balance has nothing to do with item level.
A CW should not be a tank. A GWF should not be a healer. etc, etc.
Or to simplfiy... because one DPS can out DPS another DPS class with inferior item level, does not mean there is imbalance. It means they are doing what their class is supposed to do. The statement about lack of class balance based on item levels, would be suggesting that all classes do the same based on item level.
This may not be what you wanted to say... or maybe it is... but if it is... then what's the point of having different classes?
Here is how I see them:
Control Wizards have with High burst and sustained DPS, with moderate Control.
Great Weapon Fighters have Critical sustained and burst DPS.
Trickster Rouges have Critcal Evasion and moderate-to-high DPS.
Paladins have Critical Heals, High-to-Critical-tankiness with low-to-moderate burst DPS.
Guardian Fighters have Moderate Buffs/Debuffs and Moderate tankiness with moderate burst DPS.
Hunter Rangers have High Control with Moderate-to-high DPS
Devoted Clerics have High Heals to High Buffs/Debuffs
Scourge Warlocks have High-to-critical Brokeness with Critical glitch damage
When you look at them for what they are... The way this set works makes sense.
All about MMORPG games r... is CONSTANT PROGRESSION, endless grind (just new lvles added on top of old ones, sometimes covered with nice storyline, sometimes with reactive challenge system, sometimes not covered at all). If u play game for a year and u cant even get to newest content, coz "too hard", while others, with same experience, in time of ur failed attept can finish it 5 times (without exploits, i mean those true exploits like glitching boss to fail) U r the one who is doing horrible bad, its not they fault that u r stubborn in ur choices.
Problem is, MMORPG is all about farming, go kill 100 gobins for next lvl, go kill 200 goblins, maybe one will drop nice sword. Go kill that bigass boss, he will drop one weap for whole 30-man raid, do it 150 times, still no weap for u? oh look u have that weap on AH. If u have problem with this "non-healthy approach"... drop MMO.
So yes, we want progressing faster, we want to see results, thats the whole point of MMORPG
(Sin)cerely
Kain
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
2. MMOs are based on farming something:
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
It's not working correctly, you know this.
That means you like to play imbalanced stuff just to feel superior to people not able to afford it.
You farmed your stuff, so you can be proud now? No, you used leadership or any other cheap method to gain an amount of AD new players can only dream of. These times are over and no one deserves to get +25% damage sets anymore.
(I did not use curse words, disregarding someones achievements should be allowed, right?)
People do not complain about the set being grindy to get. The devs wanted to remove "big set boni" back in Mod 6. Lostmauth-Set is the complete opposite. Buffing the other sets isn't an option for the reason you mentioned. It would further trivialize the current content.
Heroes of Darkness
Retired since 02/15
My opinions are my own. Please do not judge my friends nor guild for my statements.
Well of Dragons happens to be one of the most effective places to grind AD atm. If you keep starting toons, and don't grind for them at all, they'll always be weak, especially with builds not properly tailored for damage. Grinding has always been a key principle for MMOs. If you don't like grinding, you're playing the wrong game, go play a single player RPG, same style of play without the grinding.
|| Axios Guild Leader || Neverwinter Trade Forum Moderator || Infernal Paragons ||
Check out my foundry, titled "Akro's Gone Wacko", featuring our ex-CM Akromatik!: NW-DL8J7BY5T
Erza Moonstalker | Lara Moonstalker | Julie Marvell | Erza Moonhunter | Annie Hellangel | Jenn Moonstalker
Thaumaturge's Time To Shine: A Complete Guide
God forbid there's something for 1/3 the price that lets newer players deal some damage in dungeons.
I hear the comments to improve the other sets, and yes that's likely needed. But it just further removes the stat only belts from ever being viable. But that is A LOT more work. It's easier just to scale this set down, as it's clearly performing beyond their expectations.
Yes, every player hates the nerf bat. But, sometimes it is the appropriate tool to use. But given the last livestream with the devs, and the comment "we don't want portions of the game to become unplayable" when discussing the paladin bubble, it's clear balance is NOT a main factor in their design. So I chalk this thread up to a pointless community outreach to placate people who want to be heard.
U cant balance class around one specific set/item...
brainzz...brainzzz,,,,brainzzzz... uhuho? no brainzzz? immm moving outzzz....
(Sin)cerely
Kain
For those complaining about how hard it was to obtain their Lostmauth set forget or have no idea that the shard of Valindra's crown is also hard to get.
To further the ridiculousness a GWF with half of my stat's does much more damage than I do. I would be fine with it if I could CC the way a "CONTROL" WIZARD should.
Now I find myself in a position that I'll have to change my set because the one I have is useless, along with 3 artifact to fix my stats. If I can't control properly I might as well go for a full out DPS configuration.
People complaining that the game will be to hard if they fix the set is hilarious, it's not meant to be easy, next off you guy's want the command /kill target and end attacking... why not.
It is obvious the dev's are going to keep their bugged set, because they can't fix it even if they wanted to.
And why do you keep asking to fix Shocking Execution and Divine Protector then? Following your logic it would be more fair if cryptics nerf sigil of the devoted and flail snail because these allow TR and OP to use powerful dailies more often.
I could have suggested buffing other classes instead of nerfing GWF... but the endgame content is already too easy and more overpowered classes will make it even easier.
The only thing left one might complain about is specifically working a build (chants/feats/etc) around high crit to fully exploit the bonuses offered by lostmauth.