I noticed that without the Refining Stones the Catalyst Enchantments added to Refinement Window are Consumed.
This is horrible and a simple mistake will wipe them out. Every new player will loose his Enchantments in the Catalyst area because no Refining stone was not there. Make it so that without it just says missing component or some similar message.
Genus Draco Fad and the Muster@Jintortle
ID: NW-DD5FLOBTJ Cult of the Dragon Foundry Contest - Please participate and vote for your favourite - 26/6/2014 contest rating begins.
Sir Camps A Lot. Mr SlingShot Boom. XX Phantasmagorical. Jinn Dragonfeast.
SlingShot Boom Jr. Jocan Traders. Little Lord Forgatty, Dwarf Mean and introducing Necro Torquemada (The Warlock)
I noticed that without the Refining Stones the Catalyst Enchantments added to Refinement Window are Consumed.
This is horrible and a simple mistake will wipe them out. Every new player will loose his Enchantments in the Catalyst area because no Refining stone was not there. Make it so that without it just says missing component or some similar message.
+1 for that. Happened to me several times in the old system as well to sometime fuse without having a ward in the slot and lost the enchants. Please add a check box so we can check or uncheck if we want warning messages or not!
Feedback: General - slotting/unslotting Just a little bit of feedback based on my experiences whilst playing the new Hunter class.
I'm finding the slotting/unslotting process to be quite high on micromanagment, this is only because gear is getting replaced frequently whilst leveling. I'm also slotting what I have in my inventory rather than targeted increases to certain attributes, so I don't always remember what I've slotted where. This isn't really sepcific to this new version, it's just that with the AD cost I never bothered unslotting enchants in the past.
I have a few UI suggestions as a result (please let me know if something similar already exists):
1. When you mouse over a piece of equipment it would be useful to be able to see how much RP the enchant has and the total amount needed for the next level, similar to what you get when you mouse over an enchantment in your inventory, e.g. 0/180 for rank 3 --> 4.
2. It may be useful if the white square on an item that shows it has an enchantment slotted was colour coded to the type of enchantment, e.g red, silver, blue, yellow. You can already tell by mousing over, this is just a slightly quicker visual option.
I had a third but I've forgotten it overnight, I'll add it later if I remember what it was.
Bug: Refined some Normal Soulforged only with matching shards. After 24 shards it should be upgradeable with 0 rp to next rank. But sometimes it didnt need 24 shards like 5 shards would give rp for 5.5 shards. Sometimes they had 2160 rp plus to next rank after 24 shards. Which cant be when every matching shard gives 4320. Somehow the bonusses seem to be calculated twice or somewhat. I used the button to fill out all slots on a stack of 20 soulforge shards and the bug is repeatable but doesnt happen always.
Personally, although it is well done, it's still a bit on the costly side. Yes, it makes sense to take longer, and or cost more as the item ranks increase, but 102k exp for item to get to next level when others of same rank are required, and they only grant around 1500 exp to it per piece, is very costly.
Example Lesser Tene to Normal Tene = 102k exp/RP Rank 6 Silvery = 2160 to total cost, that's 47.22 Rank 6 Silvery to get a Lesser to the point of being up-gradable, then you still need 2 Greater Mark of Potency, and another Lesser of the same exact type as Catalysts. Current values (which will go up when this goes live) so you are looking at 47.22 R6 Sil @ roughly 125k avg, = 5,90,2500 and an additional Lesser at avg 150k = 6,052,500 total, not including the cost of another 2 Greater Mark of Potency, plus an "Optional" Coalescent Ward = 150k. So not including any additional A.D cost, or the potential cost of GMoP, you are still looking at a grand total of around 6,202,500 A.D for an item which on the market/A.H is currently going for an average of 540k / 540,000, effectively increasing cost by almost 11.5x
In the end, if this goes live as is, it is going to force many or the lazier, and less moral players to re-install, or install, farming BOTs, which is going to add more destruction to the already weak, and terribly unstable player economy (what economy there is).
Some things are meant to remain lost.
0
Options
khimera906Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 898Arc User
Personally, although it is well done, it's still a bit on the costly side. Yes, it makes sense to take longer, and or cost more as the item ranks increase, but 102k exp for item to get to next level when others of same rank are required, and they only grant around 1500 exp to it per piece, is very costly.
Example Lesser Tene to Normal Tene = 102k exp/RP Rank 6 Silvery = 2160 to total cost, that's 47.22 Rank 6 Silvery to get a Lesser to the point of being up-gradable, then you still need 2 Greater Mark of Potency, and another Lesser of the same exact type as Catalysts. Current values (which will go up when this goes live) so you are looking at 47.22 R6 Sil @ roughly 125k avg, = 5,90,2500 and an additional Lesser at avg 150k = 6,052,500 total, not including the cost of another 2 Greater Mark of Potency, plus an "Optional" Coalescent Ward = 150k. So not including any additional A.D cost, or the potential cost of GMoP, you are still looking at a grand total of around 6,202,500 A.D for an item which on the market/A.H is currently going for an average of 540k / 540,000, effectively increasing cost by almost 11.5x
In the end, if this goes live as is, it is going to force many or the lazier, and less moral players to re-install, or install, farming BOTs, which is going to add more destruction to the already weak, and terribly unstable player economy (what economy there is).
It over all requires less Enchantments. Plus think of all the failed fusions from R4 to R5 and from R5 to R6. Just think of all the Enchantments you wasted in those failed fusions.
I hate dancing with Lady Luck. She always steps on my toes.
0
Options
ironzerg79Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,942Arc User
Personally, although it is well done, it's still a bit on the costly side. Yes, it makes sense to take longer, and or cost more as the item ranks increase, but 102k exp for item to get to next level when others of same rank are required, and they only grant around 1500 exp to it per piece, is very costly.
Yes, people already did the math, and it's cheaper. The higher level enchants are MUCH cheaper than in the current system. I have no idea why you would use Rank 6 Silvery enchants to "feed" a Lesser Tene enchant.
Other enchantment shards will add 2480 at a cost of about 1500-1800 AD each. Using that method, it subtracts an ASTOUNDING ~5.85 million AD from your equation, resulting in a cost of ~350,000 AD, or ~190,000 AD less than the current market price.
Adding "too much" XP to rank 9 enchantments makes the resulting rank 10 enchantment to not stack (like it would be a rank <9 with some xp on it). Tested for radiants
Thanx for removing AD cost, nicely done!!! I read in this foroum a lot about adding Marks of potency and flawless sapphires to drop from trash in epic its a great idea so ppl can stop running pass the content of an epic dungeon so sick and tired of exploits! Also would be nice if we could buy some marks of potency with Dragon seals or PvP coins they stack a lot in end game Generally worried about the drop rate of these pls dont make it to rare. Also good idea to roll for it in dungeon proff nodes so ppl wont fight for who will open 1. I tried the new system in the preview shard shards still ask for AD to fuse. Is it a bug or you just did it for enchants and runes?
Nice to know that you listen to players!! Thank you!
Pretty much this. It can be set up as currency and that way you just refine everything you get, it goes into the pool and you can upgrade whichever enchants with exactly the right amount. Would be way more simple than current.
with the current refinement system, you get a bonus for using a matching enchant. there wouldn't be a way to grant the extra bonus points if you were converting enchants into points first and then assigning points to an item to upgrade... so that would mean that all enchants would be worth a single value and an upgrade would require more of them.
with the current refinement system, you get a bonus for using a matching enchant. there wouldn't be a way to grant the extra bonus points if you were converting enchants into points first and then assigning points to an item to upgrade... so that would mean that all enchants would be worth a single value and an upgrade would require more of them.
Agreed this would eliminate the part. However it makes the whole process more simple. Also keeps bags space down. All the enchantments would take on a more even value on the AH as well. On the preview it is getting really annoying with enchants with different RP values in them.
"we all love this game and want it to thrive"
0
Options
khimera906Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 898Arc User
edited November 2013
Adding the option to buy lower quality Catalysts (white,green and maybe blue) for Seals would be really nice, especially since the lower level Seals a pretty much useless.
I hate dancing with Lady Luck. She always steps on my toes.
Agreed this would eliminate the part. However it makes the whole process more simple. Also keeps bags space down. All the enchantments would take on a more even value on the AH as well. On the preview it is getting really annoying with enchants with different RP values in them.
i doubt people would be excited about losing bonus RP for the sole purpose of being able to "simplify" the system by feeding all enchants into a "bank" of sorts. honestly it's just trading one function for the other. between feeding less enchants to refine slotted/stored enchants and feeding more enchants into storage so i can later feed RP into slotted/stored enchants... i'll take the former.
Personally, although it is well done, it's still a bit on the costly side. Yes, it makes sense to take longer, and or cost more as the item ranks increase, but 102k exp for item to get to next level when others of same rank are required, and they only grant around 1500 exp to it per piece, is very costly.
Example Lesser Tene to Normal Tene = 102k exp/RP Rank 6 Silvery = 2160 to total cost, that's 47.22 Rank 6 Silvery to get a Lesser to the point of being up-gradable, then you still need 2 Greater Mark of Potency, and another Lesser of the same exact type as Catalysts. Current values (which will go up when this goes live) so you are looking at 47.22 R6 Sil @ roughly 125k avg, = 5,90,2500 and an additional Lesser at avg 150k = 6,052,500 total, not including the cost of another 2 Greater Mark of Potency, plus an "Optional" Coalescent Ward = 150k. So not including any additional A.D cost, or the potential cost of GMoP, you are still looking at a grand total of around 6,202,500 A.D for an item which on the market/A.H is currently going for an average of 540k / 540,000, effectively increasing cost by almost 11.5x
...
So make me some math:
For 5k AD you get a shard with 2160 RP.
That's about 1 non-matching R6.
Or 2 Shards vs. 1 matching R6.
Currently you need(with 100% success) for 1 R10: 4 R9, 16 R8, 64 R7, 256 R6, 1024 R5, 4096 R4, 16384 R3, 65536 R2 or 262144 R1.
That's in RP value:
RP-value of the old fusing in the new:
155520 R9
207360 R8
276480 R7
552960 R6
552960 R5
552960 R4
737280 R3
983040 R2
1310720R1
?-->R10
Total RP:
311040 R9
414720 R8
449280 R7
462240 R6
465480 R5
466290 R4
466470 R3
466530 R2
If you use R6 and lesser, you got the RP. With matching you can use R7 and lesser for the old value. Higher as 6/7 as fusing material don't let you go higher with only 4.
The maximum was enchantment should cost for using it as RP-giver are: 90k R9, 30k R8, 10k R7 and 5k R6. 1250 R5, 313 R4, 105 R3, 34 R2 and 12 R1 each Enchantment. You can double this numbers if it's a matching enchantment(or even you use these for artifacts leveling).
Fusing enchantment are worth it if matching as: R1-->R2 (+10) R2-->R3 (+30) R3-->R4 (+90) R4-->R5 (+270) R5-->R6 (+1080). Fusing R6 and higher don't worth it due Rp-cost.
Next the needed steps to fusing it:
R9-->10 both 1 step
R8-->R9 (1 vs. 4!)2||5
R7-->R8 (1 vs. 4!)3||21
R6-->R7 (1 vs. 4!)4||85
R5-->R6 (1 vs. 4!)5||341
R4-->R5 (1 vs. 4!)6||1365
R3-->R4 (1 vs. 4!)7||5461(not needed if you only use R4 as fusing output).
So we reduce a 1365 failure chances to 6! So if we use CW as lack for R5-->6 we need only 5 from there. 5*120k = 600k. +5k+8R4(oder 4). Dann R6-->7 +30k
R7-->R8 +80k
R8-->R9 +240k
R9-->R10+720k
Total: 1,64M(1,04M) for a R10 enchantment. We need to subtract the overflow CW for the old system. And we need to kill the used Enchantment. That's alone the cost if we use the shardway(5k for key for at the end a shard in chest). Don't to count, that we find enchantment in skill-nodes. If any question about these arise, then write exactly what is confusing/needed to answer.
And lazy people get better enchantment earlier, but the working much faster!
0
Options
ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
i doubt people would be excited about losing bonus RP for the sole purpose of being able to "simplify" the system by feeding all enchants into a "bank" of sorts. honestly it's just trading one function for the other. between feeding less enchants to refine slotted/stored enchants and feeding more enchants into storage so i can later feed RP into slotted/stored enchants... i'll take the former.
i doubt people would be excited about losing bonus RP for the sole purpose of being able to "simplify" the system by feeding all enchants into a "bank" of sorts. honestly it's just trading one function for the other. between feeding less enchants to refine slotted/stored enchants and feeding more enchants into storage so i can later feed RP into slotted/stored enchants... i'll take the former.
Well thats true. However we are only "losing" bonus RP if you look at how it is set up now. They could always bank the RP and lower the overall RP costs of enchants. Making all enchants give equal RP values. All I know is on preview now alot of space is taken up with enchants with different variations of RP's refined in them. Anything to keep is simple I am for.
Well thats true. However we are only "losing" bonus RP if you look at how it is set up now. They could always bank the RP and lower the overall RP costs of enchants. Making all enchants give equal RP values. All I know is on preview now alot of space is taken up with enchants with different variations of RP's refined in them. Anything to keep is simple I am for.
Before this system i filled over 60 inventory slots with enchantment. With new i only have 20. Feeding the enchantment in the gear = less used slots. 1 instead of 4 different staple = 3 less used slots. And there go on for several enchantment(especially the 'useless' shards like feytouched, terror, elvan or runes like training and eldritch). So if you don't focus on a few, then you maybe got several used slots, but it's your fail then. Especially if you don't have the needed RP to fuse them all up. The new system is in so many ways a win for us. Yes it create a new filled 'RPenchant', but if you don't go from the point as veteran players are at the change, but at new player, then this disadvantage not exist. The needed catalyst are a new currency in this system, but the can farmed - better as the needed RP itself! At Tuesday we will see how difficult it is to get the greater mark of Potency.
Feedback: Failure? Not sure if this is a bug, but when you fail there is no system notification or otherwise that you have failed, the only sign you failed is the catalyst gets consumed. A clearer indication of failure (and success) would be great.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Before this system i filled over 60 inventory slots with enchantment. With new i only have 20. Feeding the enchantment in the gear = less used slots. 1 instead of 4 different staple = 3 less used slots. And there go on for several enchantment(especially the 'useless' shards like feytouched, terror, elvan or runes like training and eldritch). So if you don't focus on a few, then you maybe got several used slots, but it's your fail then. Especially if you don't have the needed RP to fuse them all up. The new system is in so many ways a win for us. Yes it create a new filled 'RPenchant', but if you don't go from the point as veteran players are at the change, but at new player, then this disadvantage not exist. The needed catalyst are a new currency in this system, but the can farmed - better as the needed RP itself! At Tuesday we will see how difficult it is to get the greater mark of Potency.
Ah yeah I wasn't trying to recommend the old system at all. The new one is overall cheaper and uses less space. Was just bringing up an issue I was having with the new system and suggestion on what would make it better for me. Seems alot of people are confused by the new system and was trying to find ways to make it easier to understand.
Seems alot of people are confused by the new system and was trying to find ways to make it easier to understand.
I am still confused and don't like it, it is just too complicated. Before it was totally clear --> shards, combine and make higher versions. To avoid failing add wards. Now you have to "level" different enchants, need lots of different catalyst AND still need wards to finish. And that is not even enough, you still need to combine same kind of enchants. Like another Lesser enchant as catalyst item.
Overall much too complicated. Someone wanted to win a Nobel prize by designing this obviously.
If I would have done it I would have made only shards drop, even the normal enchants. Like "Shard of Azure enchantment". You would have then put magical items into them to level them up. For upgrading levels I would have brought white, green, blue and purple catalysts like white for 1, 2 (or lesser), then green for 3 and 4 (normal), blue for 5 and 6 (greater) and purple for 7, 8, 9, 10 (perfect). Blue and purple would only drop in T2s. No more wards needed. Just one catalyst for levelling, maybe even some time sink like 10 hours fusing process at higher ranks. The magical items would drop regularly, different values from low ones from normal mobs to high valued items from bosses. That would be it.
i see - perfect Sapphire - u can buy in vendor ,but in ah i see some assets like -white pearl- that gives 100 refine points so where can u find this thing? /thanxs
0
Options
dardoveMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited November 2013
Refining stones come from the places as crafting mats. Skill nodes, chests, etc.
Also, there is an entire section of the forum dedicated to discussion of the preview server. A topic like this would be better served there rather than here.
Bug: Refinement System: Tried looking through the threads for this and didn't see it, so I apologize if it's been mentioned before - I lost Preservation Wards on all upgrade attempts, successful or not.
Does anyone know if the catalysts drop form chests from Leadership tasks? Would be cool if they did.
Nope, if you look at the description of the Catalysts from the Wondrous Bazaar on Preview Shard you can see where you each type of Catalysts can be found. I would like Catalysts to drop from Leadership chests, lower quality ones at least.
I haven't played too much on the Preview, as I want everything to feel fresh when it goes on the Live Shard, but I couldn't find a single Catalyst.
I hate dancing with Lady Luck. She always steps on my toes.
I Was trying to upgrade a normal vorpal enchantment into a greater vorpal with all the neccesary ingredients (had fed the necessary RP to unlock the upgrade, greater mark of potency, normal vorpal as catalyst and a coal ward) and the system was asking for 75k ad for the upgrade, werent the ad fees removed?
Bug: Refinement System: Tried looking through the threads for this and didn't see it, so I apologize if it's been mentioned before - I lost Preservation Wards on all upgrade attempts, successful or not.
You are supposed to lose them , losing them prevents you losing catalysts.
I Was trying to upgrade a normal vorpal enchantment into a greater vorpal with all the neccesary ingredients (had fed the necessary RP to unlock the upgrade, greater mark of potency, normal vorpal as catalyst and a coal ward) and the system was asking for 75k ad for the upgrade, werent the ad fees removed?
They made a mistake and didn't remove the fee , it should happen in tomorrows patch .
You are supposed to lose them , losing them prevents you losing catalysts.
According to the Preservation Ward description, you should not lose them on SUCCESSFUL upgrades. I was losing them on successful as well as failed attempts (i.e. ALL)
- Gold to remove enchants
- Using different types of enchants to level
- Leveling enchant while slotted
However the addition of catalysts just seems to over complicate the whole system.
In an early post a Dev talked about the old system being too frustrating so people weren't using it. This seems to make the problem worse. Now you rank up an enchant, get to the rank up point. Then realize you need another enchant the same level (for 8,9, and 10's) plus catalysts. So now you start ranking up another enchant which needs different catalysts, etc.
Seems like the system could be made much simpler by removing catalysts altogether and make a failed upgrade cost you X% (25%???) of your current RP's. So you just keep adding RP to your slotted enchant, you hit the upgrade point, you succeed it upgrades, you fail it goes back to 75% (or whatever). This would be a much simpler system to use.
Frankly, the reason I stopped bothering with enchants was because I had rank 7's in every slot and rank 8's didn't give enough of a bonus to make them worth the cost. This is due to the cost in enchants being exponential but the increase in stats nearly linear. Couple this with diminishing returns and you have little reason to bother. Under the current system you are looking at several million AD to gain a single percent of damage. Maybe consider increasing the benefit of 8,9, and 10's? To bring their cost/benefit ratio to a point where more will think it's worth it.
Comments
This is horrible and a simple mistake will wipe them out. Every new player will loose his Enchantments in the Catalyst area because no Refining stone was not there. Make it so that without it just says missing component or some similar message.
ID: NW-DD5FLOBTJ Cult of the Dragon Foundry Contest - Please participate and vote for your favourite - 26/6/2014 contest rating begins.
Sir Camps A Lot. Mr SlingShot Boom. XX Phantasmagorical. Jinn Dragonfeast.
SlingShot Boom Jr. Jocan Traders. Little Lord Forgatty, Dwarf Mean and introducing Necro Torquemada (The Warlock)
+1 for that. Happened to me several times in the old system as well to sometime fuse without having a ward in the slot and lost the enchants. Please add a check box so we can check or uncheck if we want warning messages or not!
Just a little bit of feedback based on my experiences whilst playing the new Hunter class.
I'm finding the slotting/unslotting process to be quite high on micromanagment, this is only because gear is getting replaced frequently whilst leveling. I'm also slotting what I have in my inventory rather than targeted increases to certain attributes, so I don't always remember what I've slotted where. This isn't really sepcific to this new version, it's just that with the AD cost I never bothered unslotting enchants in the past.
I have a few UI suggestions as a result (please let me know if something similar already exists):
1. When you mouse over a piece of equipment it would be useful to be able to see how much RP the enchant has and the total amount needed for the next level, similar to what you get when you mouse over an enchantment in your inventory, e.g. 0/180 for rank 3 --> 4.
2. It may be useful if the white square on an item that shows it has an enchantment slotted was colour coded to the type of enchantment, e.g red, silver, blue, yellow. You can already tell by mousing over, this is just a slightly quicker visual option.
I had a third but I've forgotten it overnight, I'll add it later if I remember what it was.
Refined some Normal Soulforged only with matching shards. After 24 shards it should be upgradeable with 0 rp to next rank. But sometimes it didnt need 24 shards like 5 shards would give rp for 5.5 shards. Sometimes they had 2160 rp plus to next rank after 24 shards. Which cant be when every matching shard gives 4320. Somehow the bonusses seem to be calculated twice or somewhat. I used the button to fill out all slots on a stack of 20 soulforge shards and the bug is repeatable but doesnt happen always.
Example Lesser Tene to Normal Tene = 102k exp/RP Rank 6 Silvery = 2160 to total cost, that's 47.22 Rank 6 Silvery to get a Lesser to the point of being up-gradable, then you still need 2 Greater Mark of Potency, and another Lesser of the same exact type as Catalysts. Current values (which will go up when this goes live) so you are looking at 47.22 R6 Sil @ roughly 125k avg, = 5,90,2500 and an additional Lesser at avg 150k = 6,052,500 total, not including the cost of another 2 Greater Mark of Potency, plus an "Optional" Coalescent Ward = 150k. So not including any additional A.D cost, or the potential cost of GMoP, you are still looking at a grand total of around 6,202,500 A.D for an item which on the market/A.H is currently going for an average of 540k / 540,000, effectively increasing cost by almost 11.5x
In the end, if this goes live as is, it is going to force many or the lazier, and less moral players to re-install, or install, farming BOTs, which is going to add more destruction to the already weak, and terribly unstable player economy (what economy there is).
Yes, people already did the math, and it's cheaper. The higher level enchants are MUCH cheaper than in the current system. I have no idea why you would use Rank 6 Silvery enchants to "feed" a Lesser Tene enchant.
Other enchantment shards will add 2480 at a cost of about 1500-1800 AD each. Using that method, it subtracts an ASTOUNDING ~5.85 million AD from your equation, resulting in a cost of ~350,000 AD, or ~190,000 AD less than the current market price.
Adding "too much" XP to rank 9 enchantments makes the resulting rank 10 enchantment to not stack (like it would be a rank <9 with some xp on it). Tested for radiants
Nice to know that you listen to players!! Thank you!
STOP THE EXPLOITS!!!!
with the current refinement system, you get a bonus for using a matching enchant. there wouldn't be a way to grant the extra bonus points if you were converting enchants into points first and then assigning points to an item to upgrade... so that would mean that all enchants would be worth a single value and an upgrade would require more of them.
Agreed this would eliminate the part. However it makes the whole process more simple. Also keeps bags space down. All the enchantments would take on a more even value on the AH as well. On the preview it is getting really annoying with enchants with different RP values in them.
i doubt people would be excited about losing bonus RP for the sole purpose of being able to "simplify" the system by feeding all enchants into a "bank" of sorts. honestly it's just trading one function for the other. between feeding less enchants to refine slotted/stored enchants and feeding more enchants into storage so i can later feed RP into slotted/stored enchants... i'll take the former.
So make me some math:
For 5k AD you get a shard with 2160 RP.
That's about 1 non-matching R6.
Or 2 Shards vs. 1 matching R6.
R1 - 5 -
R2 20 15 1MMoP
R3 60 45 2MMoP
R4 180 135 1LMoP
R5 810 540 2LMoP
R6 3240 2160 1MoP
R7 12960 4320 2MoP
R8 34560 12960
R9 103680 38880
R10 311040 -
Currently you need(with 100% success) for 1 R10: 4 R9, 16 R8, 64 R7, 256 R6, 1024 R5, 4096 R4, 16384 R3, 65536 R2 or 262144 R1.
That's in RP value:
RP-value of the old fusing in the new:
155520 R9
207360 R8
276480 R7
552960 R6
552960 R5
552960 R4
737280 R3
983040 R2
1310720R1
?-->R10
Total RP:
311040 R9
414720 R8
449280 R7
462240 R6
465480 R5
466290 R4
466470 R3
466530 R2
If you use R6 and lesser, you got the RP. With matching you can use R7 and lesser for the old value. Higher as 6/7 as fusing material don't let you go higher with only 4.
The maximum was enchantment should cost for using it as RP-giver are: 90k R9, 30k R8, 10k R7 and 5k R6. 1250 R5, 313 R4, 105 R3, 34 R2 and 12 R1 each Enchantment. You can double this numbers if it's a matching enchantment(or even you use these for artifacts leveling).
Fusing enchantment are worth it if matching as: R1-->R2 (+10) R2-->R3 (+30) R3-->R4 (+90) R4-->R5 (+270) R5-->R6 (+1080). Fusing R6 and higher don't worth it due Rp-cost.
Next the needed steps to fusing it:
R9-->10 both 1 step
R8-->R9 (1 vs. 4!)2||5
R7-->R8 (1 vs. 4!)3||21
R6-->R7 (1 vs. 4!)4||85
R5-->R6 (1 vs. 4!)5||341
R4-->R5 (1 vs. 4!)6||1365
R3-->R4 (1 vs. 4!)7||5461(not needed if you only use R4 as fusing output).
So we reduce a 1365 failure chances to 6! So if we use CW as lack for R5-->6 we need only 5 from there. 5*120k = 600k. +5k+8R4(oder 4). Dann R6-->7 +30k
R7-->R8 +80k
R8-->R9 +240k
R9-->R10+720k
Total: 1,64M(1,04M) for a R10 enchantment. We need to subtract the overflow CW for the old system. And we need to kill the used Enchantment. That's alone the cost if we use the shardway(5k for key for at the end a shard in chest). Don't to count, that we find enchantment in skill-nodes. If any question about these arise, then write exactly what is confusing/needed to answer.
And lazy people get better enchantment earlier, but the working much faster!
I have to say I agree here.
Well thats true. However we are only "losing" bonus RP if you look at how it is set up now. They could always bank the RP and lower the overall RP costs of enchants. Making all enchants give equal RP values. All I know is on preview now alot of space is taken up with enchants with different variations of RP's refined in them. Anything to keep is simple I am for.
Before this system i filled over 60 inventory slots with enchantment. With new i only have 20. Feeding the enchantment in the gear = less used slots. 1 instead of 4 different staple = 3 less used slots. And there go on for several enchantment(especially the 'useless' shards like feytouched, terror, elvan or runes like training and eldritch). So if you don't focus on a few, then you maybe got several used slots, but it's your fail then. Especially if you don't have the needed RP to fuse them all up. The new system is in so many ways a win for us. Yes it create a new filled 'RPenchant', but if you don't go from the point as veteran players are at the change, but at new player, then this disadvantage not exist. The needed catalyst are a new currency in this system, but the can farmed - better as the needed RP itself! At Tuesday we will see how difficult it is to get the greater mark of Potency.
Not sure if this is a bug, but when you fail there is no system notification or otherwise that you have failed, the only sign you failed is the catalyst gets consumed. A clearer indication of failure (and success) would be great.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Ah yeah I wasn't trying to recommend the old system at all. The new one is overall cheaper and uses less space. Was just bringing up an issue I was having with the new system and suggestion on what would make it better for me. Seems alot of people are confused by the new system and was trying to find ways to make it easier to understand.
I am still confused and don't like it, it is just too complicated. Before it was totally clear --> shards, combine and make higher versions. To avoid failing add wards. Now you have to "level" different enchants, need lots of different catalyst AND still need wards to finish. And that is not even enough, you still need to combine same kind of enchants. Like another Lesser enchant as catalyst item.
Overall much too complicated. Someone wanted to win a Nobel prize by designing this obviously.
If I would have done it I would have made only shards drop, even the normal enchants. Like "Shard of Azure enchantment". You would have then put magical items into them to level them up. For upgrading levels I would have brought white, green, blue and purple catalysts like white for 1, 2 (or lesser), then green for 3 and 4 (normal), blue for 5 and 6 (greater) and purple for 7, 8, 9, 10 (perfect). Blue and purple would only drop in T2s. No more wards needed. Just one catalyst for levelling, maybe even some time sink like 10 hours fusing process at higher ranks. The magical items would drop regularly, different values from low ones from normal mobs to high valued items from bosses. That would be it.
Also, there is an entire section of the forum dedicated to discussion of the preview server. A topic like this would be better served there rather than here.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/forumdisplay.php?1182-NeverwinterPreview-Shard
Tried looking through the threads for this and didn't see it, so I apologize if it's been mentioned before - I lost Preservation Wards on all upgrade attempts, successful or not.
Rar'rizton Kenana, Level 60 Drow Elf Trickster Rogue
Syrus Greycloak, Level 30 Moon Elf Control Wizard
Lucan Huntinghawk, Level 17 Moon Elf Hunter Ranger
Sacred Silver Blades (www.sacredkeep.com)
I haven't played too much on the Preview, as I want everything to feel fresh when it goes on the Live Shard, but I couldn't find a single Catalyst.
I Was trying to upgrade a normal vorpal enchantment into a greater vorpal with all the neccesary ingredients (had fed the necessary RP to unlock the upgrade, greater mark of potency, normal vorpal as catalyst and a coal ward) and the system was asking for 75k ad for the upgrade, werent the ad fees removed?
You are supposed to lose them , losing them prevents you losing catalysts.
They made a mistake and didn't remove the fee , it should happen in tomorrows patch .
According to the Preservation Ward description, you should not lose them on SUCCESSFUL upgrades. I was losing them on successful as well as failed attempts (i.e. ALL)
Rar'rizton Kenana, Level 60 Drow Elf Trickster Rogue
Syrus Greycloak, Level 30 Moon Elf Control Wizard
Lucan Huntinghawk, Level 17 Moon Elf Hunter Ranger
Sacred Silver Blades (www.sacredkeep.com)
There are some nice changes:
- Gold to remove enchants
- Using different types of enchants to level
- Leveling enchant while slotted
However the addition of catalysts just seems to over complicate the whole system.
In an early post a Dev talked about the old system being too frustrating so people weren't using it. This seems to make the problem worse. Now you rank up an enchant, get to the rank up point. Then realize you need another enchant the same level (for 8,9, and 10's) plus catalysts. So now you start ranking up another enchant which needs different catalysts, etc.
Seems like the system could be made much simpler by removing catalysts altogether and make a failed upgrade cost you X% (25%???) of your current RP's. So you just keep adding RP to your slotted enchant, you hit the upgrade point, you succeed it upgrades, you fail it goes back to 75% (or whatever). This would be a much simpler system to use.
Frankly, the reason I stopped bothering with enchants was because I had rank 7's in every slot and rank 8's didn't give enough of a bonus to make them worth the cost. This is due to the cost in enchants being exponential but the increase in stats nearly linear. Couple this with diminishing returns and you have little reason to bother. Under the current system you are looking at several million AD to gain a single percent of damage. Maybe consider increasing the benefit of 8,9, and 10's? To bring their cost/benefit ratio to a point where more will think it's worth it.