I am just... devestated, reading the reactions to that episode, considering we are still in a forum largely dedicated to Star Trek. And that, well... *points at signature*
It's kind of unfortunate, isn't it? That a universe devoted to diversity and learning about other points of view and cultures and ways of life... has fans that are so afraid of anything of the sort.
Or was it flamebaiting of Trek to include the first inter-racial kiss on television?
Now clowns, that's another story. They scare the crap out of me.
We fight them too. Entire armies spilling out of Volkswagens.
We do our best to fight them off, but they keep sending them in.
I liked the episode; and am happy to see we're getting more episodic content with interesting characters as well as characters from the TV series.
I have to say I wish they hadn't killed off the Khaless character (but as he was a clone I guess Koloth could clone him again.) :eek::D;)
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
I have to say I am deeply disappointed in some of the responses with regard to the female Klingons here, but I can say one thing:
I play this game every day with my children. EVERY. DAY.
One is 10. One is 14. In no way shape or form have they in any way been damaged by exposure to those "horrible" Klesbians. In my honest opinion, most of those screaming "think of the children" and claiming that it is some kind of mature content probably don't have kids.
The only people who get worked up over something like that are people with prejudices deeply ingrained in them. No one is forcing YOU to be TRIBBLE by being TRIBBLE. No one is forcing YOU to have homosexual relationships just because they are. And the reality is, people of all sexual orientations exist and have exactly the same rights as you do, especially in the Star Trek universe.
During the mission, the situation evoked little more than a double take on all of our parts. It wasn't shocking and it didn't require us to stop and have an extended discussion of the facts of life. There were definitely flaws in the writing of the mission (although I did enjoy it) but the casual reference to the same-sex couple was, in my opinion, just right. Nothing forced or overly politically correct, just a matter-of-fact "this is how they are" which is exactly where anything to do with sexual orientation should be, in STO or in the real world.
I am just... devestated, reading the reactions to that episode, considering we are still in a forum largely dedicated to Star Trek. And that, well... *points at signature*
I have noticed over the years here a small minority who ignore the Trek philosophy so that they can keep on enjoying a space fantasy experience. There is a powerful cognitive disssonance inherent to that so it is crucial to keep one's eyes closed tight. Perhaps the Kirk lothario is a draw, but Kirk also espoused many very positive ideas as well and was often disgusted by intolerance and bigotry.
When we get to TNG it's got to be a painful nightmare inducing horrorshow. TNG may not have had an openly TRIBBLE character, but there probably has been no more 'politically correct' show ever aired. They were absolutely fanatical in their stand against inequality and intolerance.
And, frankly, TNG is the show of my youth. It is my formative show. Whenever I needed to get away from current society I went there for a better one. And still do.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Althought I know we have seen all types of couples in Star Trek, I am trying to remember if we've actually seen/ met a legitimate heterosexual couple in STO content. I don't remeber to be sure. Maybe if we haven't, that might be why some people see it as "shoved in thier face". Have we even seen/met a mixed species coue in STO? Obviously, we have seen the products of those couples, but I don't think we've actually seen/met couples.
The Orion female bartender in Night of the Comet caring for her presumably-human boyfriend/whatever after the bar fight comes to mind. There are also references to heterosexual couplehood by one member or another with Tom Paris in Delta Flight and way back in Duties of Command on the KDF side, where you go to the deceased First Officer's Par'Mach'kai, Ch'gren, to tell him how she died, and probably a few others who mention a spouse. There's also the implied relationship of not-Worf and not-Jadzia, seen arguing on the pier structure on Risa during the night
Yes. People, especially children, deal with violent themes differently from how they deal with sexual ones. It doesn't matter if that's cultural or biological or if you think it's fair. It's just true.
The fact that this discussion even exists is sufficient to prove the material is inappropriate for this venue. It's a mature theme that doesn't belong in material marketed for children. Again, it doesn't matter if you think that's fair or the way things should be; it's just true. We're not there yet.
It's only a mature theme to some because they reduce same-sex partners to just the act of having sex, which they don't seem to do with opposite-sex partners. My parents displayed much more physical affection in front of me than these people do (which is absolutely none) as a child, were they exposing me to mature themes? Should they have been arrested? The source material for this game is far more mature in its themes, and depictions of sexuality, and the worst of those episodes are considered TVPG here in the US. A shrinking number of us aren't there yet. They just happen to be the most vocal about it.
The purpose of this kind of response is not to educate--attempting to do so is a waste of everyone's time; they are not going to change their beliefs. The purpose is to reduce the bigot's overall harm to society by conditioning them to expect hostility and strong pushback whenever they behave offensively towards others and ought to know better. They need to be made to understand that actions have consequences, and that while they are free to believe whatever they like, they will be isolated and shunned if they cannot learn to refrain from behaving offensively in public.
In no way will I allow something that goes against these forums, or one of the most important things Star Trek can teach us. We can grow as human beings, else we wouldn't have progressed to the point where we are.
I am not allowing any more naming and shaming in this thread. Bannings are going to happen.
Just finished the mission too and yeah, this is a good one.
- I like the design and atmosphere, especially the lack of mini-map. Really drives home the point you are behind enemy lines, up to your eyeballs, and better move quick to accomplish your mission.
- So far I like "House" Pegh. Gives the Klingons a bit more dimension and demonstrates they can show cunning as well as courage, something I myself have advocated more than once. I hope we see more of them.
- Though it does look like he may have had one too many a Rokeg Blood Pie, Kahless really shines in this one. I like how he acknowledges the reality of his situation, that he ultimately really is a figurehead ruler, known more by his reputation and lore than actual accomplishments. And in the end one gets the impression his undertaking the mission and his actions were his plan all along. Against an enemy as nebulous and obtuse as the Iconians, beings who have done everything they can to play up their agelessness, their power, their capacity for decimation, Kahless gave the alliance and the galaxy the victory it really needs at this point.
He proved that even gods can bleed.
I can see accounts and holovids of his battle being broadcast to every world, every colony, every ship in the Empire and beyond, and a million, billion beings crying out in one voice, in one united stand.
You do not come for us, oh mighty Iconians.
WE come for YOU. :mad:
Kudos to the Dev team all around and I can't wait to see what's next.
OH YES!
/10char
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
Thank you. I'm tired of the bigotry. Even if I don't agree with someone's lifestyle, there are far more serious problems with the world that need to be addressed.
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
I'm going to say that I am a little disappointed by the House Pegh storyline. I've only played it part way through so far, so I can't comment on everything. I may have more comments later.
SPOILERS FOLLOW!!!!
What should have been a moving story about the sacrifice one man makes to stand against evil and save others was turned into a politically correct/incorrect sideshow. I do not support that or agree with it.
I mean, you have freaking Kahless himself being killed by the Iconians and the Sword of Kahless lost in an Iconian base. It's a tragedy! Very dramatic storytelling! But it ends up being about a TRIBBLE couple in the forums.
I can admire devotion and affection for another person, regardless of gender. It doesn't have to be about sex. It didn't have to be about sex here, and would have played just as well without using the word 'mate'. It's a word with a very specific meaning in a specific biological context.
I feel that in their attempt to be politically correct, Cryptic not only invited controversy they also distracted and detracted from the story they were trying to tell. The death of Kahless at the hands of the Iconians.
I feel they also showed a lack of respect for the fact that the game is played by children as well as adults (rated T!) and this was an inappropriate subject to casually toss in.
I will say that it was at least not extremely overt and many children will miss it (as some of the adults did). But I feel parents have the right to be aware when things like this are brought up in a game context and not be blindsided by them. I am previewing the episode and have a chance to be a responsible parent to my teenage sons who play STO and have a discussion about it. If Cryptic wants to set this as a precedent and abuse my trust in their discretion, then I either need to preview every single episode before my sons get a chance to play it or I need to prevent them from playing at all. Either way, Cryptic, do you really want people preventing their kids from logging in at convenient times?
There was one other thing that bothered me about the story and it had nothing to do with the subject of mates. The fact that a character gets away with calling a Dahar Master a petaQ and I don't get to knock them on their butts or threaten to kill them for it like a good Klingon would have done, that was very unsatisfying.
All respectable points.
Being a parent myself, I want to know what is being served up in a games kids play are something that I can approve for them, and be able to instruct and discuss any controversies that are encountered. While I know the game has violence, that is an upfront and known product. I would hope that parents have already had a proper discussion with thier teenage children about same sex relationships, but the maturity level of some (male) ealry teenagers is still somewhat low and require more supervision and discussion. Teenage years can be rough, especially for a parent.
The one area especially this content could be frustrating is for the parent who lets thier sub-teen children play. I had a fleetie early in the game that let his 7 year old son play. I don't know of he would've wanted the in game content to be a starting point for the same sex relationship discussion, which also could lead into the other big conversation, sex itself. But the game is rated for teens, so parents should be seeing content before the child does anyways, so any parent should know better. But in the end, it should be the parents responsibilty to say yes or no to the child playing the game, if the game goes beyond what is acceptable to the parents decision of what they want their children to be exposed to, they should stop the children from playing.
Would I want my teenager to see the content in question? I dont think that I would have a problem for them to see it as our family situation would have had them to be confronted with it already. Would I want my 7 year old to see it? Probably not, unless we have already had those conversations.
My preference? I really wished they had no romantic relationships shown in game, straight, homsexual, bi-sexual or tri-sexuall. But thats how I personally like my sci-fi games.
That was an advantage of paid subs, if you dont want the kid playing, cancel he sub.
I especially agree on the Klingon "petaQ" incident. Theres a certain level of come-upins when a Klingon speaks dishonorably to a superior. There should be have been an option to physically or verbal rebuke for that.
You took a great thread and turned it into a warring political discussion. I'm perfectly happy for political discussions, but not ones with the volatility and disrespect I'm seeing. Hell, I'm even going through posts about TRIBBLE Germany! And for what? A difference for opinion displayed in what is very, very unfortunately a horrendous way (on both accounts even).
There is political necessity and the values that we find in our civil liberties. When we defend them, we are defending ourselves. But too often do we flat out go on the attack. Don't like the fact that you thought the TRIBBLE couple was placed in awkwardly to you? Say that. Are you happy that you saw a progressive inclusion of marganilized groups? Say that!
But don't flame each other for it. If you're unhappy with someone or something and cannot constructively express it, then take some to cool down before you post. This applies to both sides of the parties.
Now listen up.
If you are unhappy about the lesbians then you should explain why in a constructive manner. Be civil and be respectful. It's in the ToS. It's really not hard to do. If you find people are getting upset and arguing with you a lot, re-examine your posts.
If you are unhappy about others being unhappy about the lesbians, you can disagree but be civil and respectful. I'm bisexual myself, and even I'm appalled at the manner people here are treating those who disagree with the episode and/or LGBT folks. Do you think calling someone a bigot is going to suddenly make them decide :
"You know what? I'm going to rethink my stance on this considering you just publically called me that!"
God no! It furthers a divide and shuts down the conversation by creating an even greater rift between you. It awards you no points other than venting at their expense. It doesn't help make progressive momentum. It creates an 'Us' vs 'Them'. The only way to bridge that divide is with some god damn compassion.
Seriously. I'm going to unleash the hammer if this doesn't knock off. Please. Impress me and show civility and kindness to each other.
All hail the voice of reason.
And her ban hammer.
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
Well the common response to anyone that doesn't like something in the game applies: "Don't like it, don't play it." It's really as simple as that. To all those that are so offended, can I haz your stuffs? I think the Devs added a subtle and classy addition of IDIC in this episode.
Oh but the children, the CHILDREN!!! So 97% naked orions complete with a sexual trait, the summer orgy event, a male NPC watching a male NPC stripper, essentially having furries represented in game with Cataian/Faresians, Not to mention the mass slaughter of the Acamarians, Borg, Breen, Cardassian, Gorn, Federation species, Heralds, Kazon, Klingons, Malon, Nausicaans, Orions, Romulans, Remans, Tholians, and Vaaudwar just to name a few. My main toon has killed more people than every evil person that has ever existed during recorded history. All that is okay with some, but the briefest inclusion of a same sex couple sends you into Picard rage?
Lily Sloane: I'm sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt your little quest. Captain Ahab has to go hunt his whale!
Jean-Luc Picard: [offended] What?
Sloane: You do have books in the 24th-century?
Picard: This is not about homophobia!
Sloane: Liar!
Picard: [agitated] This is about saving the future of our precious children!
Sloane: Jean-Luc, they're just people in relationships!!!
Picard: NO! NOOOOOOOOO!!! [smashes a display case in anger; Both pause, shocked] I will not sacrifice the status quo. We've made too many compromises already, too many retreats. They invade our television, and we fall back. They start blogs and websites, and we fall back. Not again. The line must be drawn here! This far, no further! And I will make them pay for what they've done!
Sloane: [looking at the broken remains of the Enterprise-D model] You broke your little ship. [pause] See you around, Ahab.
Picard: [softly, to himself] "And he piled upon the whale's white hump the sum of all the rage and hate felt by his whole race. If his chest had been a cannon he would have shot his heart upon it."
Sloane: What?
Picard: Moby ****.
Sloane: Actually, I never read it.
Picard: Ahab spent years hunting the white whale that crippled him; but in the end, it destroyed him and his ship.
Sloane: I guess he didn't know when to quit.
The Orion female bartender in Night of the Comet caring for her presumably-human boyfriend/whatever after the bar fight comes to mind. There are also references to heterosexual couplehood by one member or another with Tom Paris in Delta Flight and way back in Duties of Command on the KDF side, where you go to the deceased First Officer's Par'Mach'kai, Ch'gren, to tell him how she died, and probably a few others who mention a spouse. There's also the implied relationship of not-Worf and not-Jadzia, seen arguing on the pier structure on Risa during the night
I invite you to show your work.
It's only a mature theme to some because they reduce same-sex partners to just the act of having sex, which they don't seem to do with opposite-sex partners. My parents displayed much more physical affection in front of me than these people do (which is absolutely none) as a child, were they exposing me to mature themes? Should they have been arrested? The source material for this game is far more mature in its themes, and depictions of sexuality, and the worst of those episodes are considered TVPG here in the US. A shrinking number of us aren't there yet. They just happen to be the most vocal about it.
I forgot about them. I guess the Orion and the officer on the station could have been in a relationship, I just took her as being an Orion and a bartendender schmoozing a probably big tipper. My whole thought was if some people didnt see a in game straight couple, they might have thought seeing a LGBT couple as the "first" might be pushing the subject to the forefront without representation and becomming sociopolitical.
As far as children developing differently versus sex and violence, it is true. Thats why violence is an easier subject to talk about to a child (andget the to comprehend) than sex is.
You alter the omegas to make it more stable, you plant the bombs... and don't set them off?
Could easily have been like shutting down the station in Step Between Stars. You set the bombs off and then have to get out before the whole base goes up.
The fact the demo charges were seemingly ignored makes all of House Pegh look like utter incompetents. Or is this a bug/incomplete?
I'll start this one of my klingon. I hope the FE gives the klingon immersion which the name suggests.
I intentionally did my run with a Klingon and fortunately chose the Tac liberated Borg with a backstory as being in KDF Fleet Special Action Group which made the mission feel right. I don't know how to make this story feel right with a Fed or Rom toon.
i refer to the this FE as THE HOUSE OF MEH ,
why , its missing alot as far as delveopment ,
while i have no issue with the TRIBBLE Klingon women , ive never seen or heard of this kind of relationship in Klingon culture before . while we have seen it in other aspects in Trek cultures .
but back to the meat and potatoes of the Featured episode . the use of a Super Cloak is interesting the range is absurd IMO ,
dialog , once again the dialog doesnt suit the other factions , my KDF toon would have not taken those remarks from the Klingon security officer , im a general show me the respect pf my rank or get back handed . only Feds would let such words slide , Roms would have some retort .
the failure to address the other factions in responses to such thinks while there is some text content that does give a faction reaction its not complete , almost like the after thought or something that was intended left out .
the level design of the BASE was like WTH , doesn't meet like any other "iconian" Facility we have seen .
in short this felt like a Beginner foundry mission with cut scenes rather than a FE. IMO
If we're saying the couple has to be onscreen at the same time in game then it might only be, as was said, not Worf and not Jadzia on Risa. Then recently Neelix and Dexa. Neelix and his wife may be the best onscreen depiction of a heterosexual couple in action together. Requiring the couple to be onscreen together seems arbitrary to me though. We are generally talking to people at work "in the office" so to speak.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
IMO Kahless' monologue when he had the Iconian down should be retooled a bit. No reason he can't be saying those things during the battle.
If there would ever be a species that can effortlessly carry on a perfectly articulated conversation while dismembering a foe it should be the Klingons.
This is my Risian Corvette. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
I roughly played it to enjoy it and then quickly logged out before I was reminded of how bad things got that forced me to pick up a less headache of a game.
I feel that in their attempt to be politically correct, Cryptic not only invited controversy they also distracted and detracted from the story they were trying to tell. The death of Kahless at the hands of the Iconians.
I feel they also showed a lack of respect for the fact that the game is played by children as well as adults (rated T!) and this was an inappropriate subject to casually toss in.
I will say that it was at least not extremely overt and many children will miss it (as some of the adults did). But I feel parents have the right to be aware when things like this are brought up in a game context and not be blindsided by them.
I think when Star Trek had already dealt with the complications of gender with relationships in numerous theme TNG, DS9, and ENT episodes the subject being merely referenced now in STO has no objectionable significance. Yes, there are people who might find the mention of a subject that they personally feel strongly about uncomfortable but if you broaden that to all subjects in life that one might find discomforting you have the overall subject of race, religion, education, crime, resource distribution (wealth, water, medical care, what have you), capital punishment, death (more broadly), self-determination, and innumerable others that I won't mention here just so this doesn't invite innumerable tangents.
I don't think that any special significance needs to be placed on making LGBT issues taboo where other potentially contentious social issues are free to be incorporated into the public consciousness particularly given that the question (outside of your own personal belief system which it shouldn't need telling is up to you) unlike so many of the others I've mentioned is strictly down to social conventions that are specific to this time and this society. Its a facet of cultural evolution. You can't make an objective case against it.
That said I don't think that this mission places ANY special importance on "unusual" (for a fictitious alien species several hundred years in the future) nature the relationship between these officers. Its just there. One line, one series of dialog. All of that is background. The narrative focus and fulcrum is Kahless. His appearance, his fight, his futile but still symbolic death. Its quite a leap to interpret from that a controversial social point being exploited or otherwise exaggerated for the sake of drama (unlike the TNG, DS9, and ENT episodes referenced at the top where relationships were the explicit focus) given that it simply did not factor apart form that iota of background.
The most I think you can say is that STO just maintained a broader view of within-species social relations, which is simply true to life (and something that STAR TREK has every right to engage with.)
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
in short this felt like a Beginner foundry mission with cut scenes rather than a FE. IMO
Beginner foundry missions created by blind 5 year olds would have been much better and more enjoyable than this craptastic offering.
More enemy ships patrolling at the start then when the outpost is on full alert and your bad a** "klingon" sneak force is running away leaving yellow trails behind them in space.
Stereotypes added for the sake of throwing them in there and to show just how intolerant both side of the aisle can be on the forums.
Dialog that just didn't fit the factions portrayed or interacted with.
SUPER ULTRA MEGA CLOAK!!!!!!!!! Yeah, couldn't have just given a temporary device, no had to make up something even J.J. would have fired a writer over.
Lazy use of a broken mini game in an attempt to add some action.
Critters melding with walls, lack of enemies (was there even a dozen?) in the base, and longer cutscenes than actual game play.
No ending just... there is a planet down there on high alert... um... hello... devs... did you forget something here???
Even the rewards are jacked up.
Specialization trait earned by players under 60 takes place of the next one earned at level up. So no bonus for you!
Maybe you should let the foundry guys do the next set of featured episodes. Just saying.
This game is supposed to be for all ages and anything sexual should be not have made it into the game.
But it wasn't sexual at all. They didn't kiss, they didn't hug, they didn't do anything suggestive.
It only came up once, in one sentence.
If they were to remove the one line that said "her mate" you wouldn't have even known any different. There was nothing outside that line that suggested they were a 'couple'
Her 'mate' was a little protective, but they could have just been best friends or something.
My biggest hope out of all this mess is that the Devs, writers and PWE do not back track on this groundbreaking addition to the game to do so would only pamper to the minority while excluding the group of people who for one praise this addition.
I do have a question though was the VO for Kahless the same as the one from TNG? sounds like it.
i refer to the this FE as THE HOUSE OF MEH ,
why , its missing alot as far as delveopment ,
while i have no issue with the TRIBBLE Klingon women , ive never seen or heard of this kind of relationship in Klingon culture before . while we have seen it in other aspects in Trek cultures
Most certainly. If had been a Human or a Romulan TRIBBLE/TRIBBLE couple, It wouldn't surprise me. For some reason, it doesnt feel like it would fall in place in a Klingon society. They dont seem as open to it.
Comments
It's kind of unfortunate, isn't it? That a universe devoted to diversity and learning about other points of view and cultures and ways of life... has fans that are so afraid of anything of the sort.
Or was it flamebaiting of Trek to include the first inter-racial kiss on television?
We fight them too. Entire armies spilling out of Volkswagens.
We do our best to fight them off, but they keep sending them in.
I have to say I wish they hadn't killed off the Khaless character (but as he was a clone I guess Koloth could clone him again.) :eek::D;)
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
I play this game every day with my children. EVERY. DAY.
One is 10. One is 14. In no way shape or form have they in any way been damaged by exposure to those "horrible" Klesbians. In my honest opinion, most of those screaming "think of the children" and claiming that it is some kind of mature content probably don't have kids.
The only people who get worked up over something like that are people with prejudices deeply ingrained in them. No one is forcing YOU to be TRIBBLE by being TRIBBLE. No one is forcing YOU to have homosexual relationships just because they are. And the reality is, people of all sexual orientations exist and have exactly the same rights as you do, especially in the Star Trek universe.
During the mission, the situation evoked little more than a double take on all of our parts. It wasn't shocking and it didn't require us to stop and have an extended discussion of the facts of life. There were definitely flaws in the writing of the mission (although I did enjoy it) but the casual reference to the same-sex couple was, in my opinion, just right. Nothing forced or overly politically correct, just a matter-of-fact "this is how they are" which is exactly where anything to do with sexual orientation should be, in STO or in the real world.
I have noticed over the years here a small minority who ignore the Trek philosophy so that they can keep on enjoying a space fantasy experience. There is a powerful cognitive disssonance inherent to that so it is crucial to keep one's eyes closed tight. Perhaps the Kirk lothario is a draw, but Kirk also espoused many very positive ideas as well and was often disgusted by intolerance and bigotry.
When we get to TNG it's got to be a painful nightmare inducing horrorshow. TNG may not have had an openly TRIBBLE character, but there probably has been no more 'politically correct' show ever aired. They were absolutely fanatical in their stand against inequality and intolerance.
And, frankly, TNG is the show of my youth. It is my formative show. Whenever I needed to get away from current society I went there for a better one. And still do.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
The Orion female bartender in Night of the Comet caring for her presumably-human boyfriend/whatever after the bar fight comes to mind. There are also references to heterosexual couplehood by one member or another with Tom Paris in Delta Flight and way back in Duties of Command on the KDF side, where you go to the deceased First Officer's Par'Mach'kai, Ch'gren, to tell him how she died, and probably a few others who mention a spouse. There's also the implied relationship of not-Worf and not-Jadzia, seen arguing on the pier structure on Risa during the night
I invite you to show your work.
It's only a mature theme to some because they reduce same-sex partners to just the act of having sex, which they don't seem to do with opposite-sex partners. My parents displayed much more physical affection in front of me than these people do (which is absolutely none) as a child, were they exposing me to mature themes? Should they have been arrested? The source material for this game is far more mature in its themes, and depictions of sexuality, and the worst of those episodes are considered TVPG here in the US. A shrinking number of us aren't there yet. They just happen to be the most vocal about it.
Here's the first link that comes up when you search for content ratings for Modern Family. That show is way more mature in its themes than an offhanded mention that this is a same-sex couple, and is tagged as appropriate for age 13, at the highest.
I am not allowing any more naming and shaming in this thread. Bannings are going to happen.
fair enough, im withdrawing from this but i also had more to state.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
OH YES!
/10char
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
I dare you to do better.
Thank you. I'm tired of the bigotry. Even if I don't agree with someone's lifestyle, there are far more serious problems with the world that need to be addressed.
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
I dare you to do better.
Eclipse Class Intel Cruiser U.S.S. Dioscuria NX-91121-A - Interactive Crew Roster
There's already been an official thread closed. Dunno if I should mention which one, it really went off the rails.
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
I dare you to do better.
All respectable points.
Being a parent myself, I want to know what is being served up in a games kids play are something that I can approve for them, and be able to instruct and discuss any controversies that are encountered. While I know the game has violence, that is an upfront and known product. I would hope that parents have already had a proper discussion with thier teenage children about same sex relationships, but the maturity level of some (male) ealry teenagers is still somewhat low and require more supervision and discussion. Teenage years can be rough, especially for a parent.
The one area especially this content could be frustrating is for the parent who lets thier sub-teen children play. I had a fleetie early in the game that let his 7 year old son play. I don't know of he would've wanted the in game content to be a starting point for the same sex relationship discussion, which also could lead into the other big conversation, sex itself. But the game is rated for teens, so parents should be seeing content before the child does anyways, so any parent should know better. But in the end, it should be the parents responsibilty to say yes or no to the child playing the game, if the game goes beyond what is acceptable to the parents decision of what they want their children to be exposed to, they should stop the children from playing.
Would I want my teenager to see the content in question? I dont think that I would have a problem for them to see it as our family situation would have had them to be confronted with it already. Would I want my 7 year old to see it? Probably not, unless we have already had those conversations.
My preference? I really wished they had no romantic relationships shown in game, straight, homsexual, bi-sexual or tri-sexuall. But thats how I personally like my sci-fi games.
That was an advantage of paid subs, if you dont want the kid playing, cancel he sub.
I especially agree on the Klingon "petaQ" incident. Theres a certain level of come-upins when a Klingon speaks dishonorably to a superior. There should be have been an option to physically or verbal rebuke for that.
All hail the voice of reason.
And her ban hammer.
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
I dare you to do better.
Oh but the children, the CHILDREN!!! So 97% naked orions complete with a sexual trait, the summer orgy event, a male NPC watching a male NPC stripper, essentially having furries represented in game with Cataian/Faresians, Not to mention the mass slaughter of the Acamarians, Borg, Breen, Cardassian, Gorn, Federation species, Heralds, Kazon, Klingons, Malon, Nausicaans, Orions, Romulans, Remans, Tholians, and Vaaudwar just to name a few. My main toon has killed more people than every evil person that has ever existed during recorded history. All that is okay with some, but the briefest inclusion of a same sex couple sends you into Picard rage?
Lily Sloane: I'm sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt your little quest. Captain Ahab has to go hunt his whale!
Jean-Luc Picard: [offended] What?
Sloane: You do have books in the 24th-century?
Picard: This is not about homophobia!
Sloane: Liar!
Picard: [agitated] This is about saving the future of our precious children!
Sloane: Jean-Luc, they're just people in relationships!!!
Picard: NO! NOOOOOOOOO!!! [smashes a display case in anger; Both pause, shocked] I will not sacrifice the status quo. We've made too many compromises already, too many retreats. They invade our television, and we fall back. They start blogs and websites, and we fall back. Not again. The line must be drawn here! This far, no further! And I will make them pay for what they've done!
Sloane: [looking at the broken remains of the Enterprise-D model] You broke your little ship. [pause] See you around, Ahab.
Picard: [softly, to himself] "And he piled upon the whale's white hump the sum of all the rage and hate felt by his whole race. If his chest had been a cannon he would have shot his heart upon it."
Sloane: What?
Picard: Moby ****.
Sloane: Actually, I never read it.
Picard: Ahab spent years hunting the white whale that crippled him; but in the end, it destroyed him and his ship.
Sloane: I guess he didn't know when to quit.
It's a game, get a grip.
I forgot about them. I guess the Orion and the officer on the station could have been in a relationship, I just took her as being an Orion and a bartendender schmoozing a probably big tipper. My whole thought was if some people didnt see a in game straight couple, they might have thought seeing a LGBT couple as the "first" might be pushing the subject to the forefront without representation and becomming sociopolitical.
As far as children developing differently versus sex and violence, it is true. Thats why violence is an easier subject to talk about to a child (andget the to comprehend) than sex is.
You alter the omegas to make it more stable, you plant the bombs... and don't set them off?
Could easily have been like shutting down the station in Step Between Stars. You set the bombs off and then have to get out before the whole base goes up.
The fact the demo charges were seemingly ignored makes all of House Pegh look like utter incompetents. Or is this a bug/incomplete?
I intentionally did my run with a Klingon and fortunately chose the Tac liberated Borg with a backstory as being in KDF Fleet Special Action Group which made the mission feel right. I don't know how to make this story feel right with a Fed or Rom toon.
i refer to the this FE as THE HOUSE OF MEH ,
why , its missing alot as far as delveopment ,
while i have no issue with the TRIBBLE Klingon women , ive never seen or heard of this kind of relationship in Klingon culture before . while we have seen it in other aspects in Trek cultures .
but back to the meat and potatoes of the Featured episode . the use of a Super Cloak is interesting the range is absurd IMO ,
dialog , once again the dialog doesnt suit the other factions , my KDF toon would have not taken those remarks from the Klingon security officer , im a general show me the respect pf my rank or get back handed . only Feds would let such words slide , Roms would have some retort .
the failure to address the other factions in responses to such thinks while there is some text content that does give a faction reaction its not complete , almost like the after thought or something that was intended left out .
the level design of the BASE was like WTH , doesn't meet like any other "iconian" Facility we have seen .
in short this felt like a Beginner foundry mission with cut scenes rather than a FE. IMO
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
PURE AND SIMPLE - -
It is JUST A GAME.
Just enjoy the story and MOVE ON
I loved the episode.
I however, DID NOT, dwell on anything political or otherwise.
It's just A STORY, and a great one at that
If there would ever be a species that can effortlessly carry on a perfectly articulated conversation while dismembering a foe it should be the Klingons.
I think when Star Trek had already dealt with the complications of gender with relationships in numerous theme TNG, DS9, and ENT episodes the subject being merely referenced now in STO has no objectionable significance. Yes, there are people who might find the mention of a subject that they personally feel strongly about uncomfortable but if you broaden that to all subjects in life that one might find discomforting you have the overall subject of race, religion, education, crime, resource distribution (wealth, water, medical care, what have you), capital punishment, death (more broadly), self-determination, and innumerable others that I won't mention here just so this doesn't invite innumerable tangents.
I don't think that any special significance needs to be placed on making LGBT issues taboo where other potentially contentious social issues are free to be incorporated into the public consciousness particularly given that the question (outside of your own personal belief system which it shouldn't need telling is up to you) unlike so many of the others I've mentioned is strictly down to social conventions that are specific to this time and this society. Its a facet of cultural evolution. You can't make an objective case against it.
That said I don't think that this mission places ANY special importance on "unusual" (for a fictitious alien species several hundred years in the future) nature the relationship between these officers. Its just there. One line, one series of dialog. All of that is background. The narrative focus and fulcrum is Kahless. His appearance, his fight, his futile but still symbolic death. Its quite a leap to interpret from that a controversial social point being exploited or otherwise exaggerated for the sake of drama (unlike the TNG, DS9, and ENT episodes referenced at the top where relationships were the explicit focus) given that it simply did not factor apart form that iota of background.
The most I think you can say is that STO just maintained a broader view of within-species social relations, which is simply true to life (and something that STAR TREK has every right to engage with.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Beginner foundry missions created by blind 5 year olds would have been much better and more enjoyable than this craptastic offering.
More enemy ships patrolling at the start then when the outpost is on full alert and your bad a** "klingon" sneak force is running away leaving yellow trails behind them in space.
Stereotypes added for the sake of throwing them in there and to show just how intolerant both side of the aisle can be on the forums.
Dialog that just didn't fit the factions portrayed or interacted with.
SUPER ULTRA MEGA CLOAK!!!!!!!!! Yeah, couldn't have just given a temporary device, no had to make up something even J.J. would have fired a writer over.
Lazy use of a broken mini game in an attempt to add some action.
Critters melding with walls, lack of enemies (was there even a dozen?) in the base, and longer cutscenes than actual game play.
No ending just... there is a planet down there on high alert... um... hello... devs... did you forget something here???
Even the rewards are jacked up.
Specialization trait earned by players under 60 takes place of the next one earned at level up. So no bonus for you!
Maybe you should let the foundry guys do the next set of featured episodes. Just saying.
But it wasn't sexual at all. They didn't kiss, they didn't hug, they didn't do anything suggestive.
It only came up once, in one sentence.
If they were to remove the one line that said "her mate" you wouldn't have even known any different. There was nothing outside that line that suggested they were a 'couple'
Her 'mate' was a little protective, but they could have just been best friends or something.
Also the game is rated T for 'Teen'
http://www.esrb.org/ratings/synopsis.jsp?Certificate=28315
Not all ages.
I do have a question though was the VO for Kahless the same as the one from TNG? sounds like it.
Most certainly. If had been a Human or a Romulan TRIBBLE/TRIBBLE couple, It wouldn't surprise me. For some reason, it doesnt feel like it would fall in place in a Klingon society. They dont seem as open to it.