That's generally the way I understood it as well. Anyone can become a Mr. Fantastic or Hulk under the right conditions, but mutants are mutants because of special trans-dimensional genes.
The distinction breaks down with genetically altered characters. There's no consistency as to which ones are considered mutants like Deadpool and which are considered superheroes.
In House of M, the silliness of the distinction is particularly on display. Spider-man was able to prove he was a mutant, and despite suspicions there was no evidence that he wasn't. The only thing that eventually proved he wasn't a mutant was his own journal detailing how he got his powers.
hehe... Well, in the MCU they have the option of making a list of people who are part alien. There's a LOT of Kree and Skrulls in the comics, and several individuals who are hybrids, like Ultragirl.
The distinction breaks down with genetically altered characters. There's no consistency as to which ones are considered mutants like Deadpool and which are considered superheroes.
In House of M, the silliness of the distinction is particularly on display. Spider-man was able to prove he was a mutant, and despite suspicions there was no evidence that he wasn't. The only thing that eventually proved he wasn't a mutant was his own journal detailing how he got his powers.
I was always of the understanding that "mutant" referred to a birth/genetic condition, and that "mutate" referred to an altered human, like Spiderman and Hulk.
With Agents of SHIELD, I think they'll soon be crawling with mutates, or at least the mutate of the week. If you've ever played City of Heroes, then consider the mutant origin to be reserved for Sony. All other origins: natural (ex: Black Widow & Hawkeye), technological (ex: Iron Man), science, aka "mutate" (ex: Hulk & Capt. America), and magic (ex: Thor), are the property of Marvel/Disney. And you'll note I just named all the movie Avengers.
The challenge to that is Spiderman, and apparently soon the Fantastic Four. Both of those are science/mutate in origin, but are being developed by Sony. And then we have the other exceptions: mutants Quicksilver and Scarlett Witch, who've ended up being shared. So its not a pure split.
I'm kinda curious exactly what will happen next myself. Who/what will show up next?
I'm hoping for Amora, but we'll see.
I don't think Skye is one of the Infinity gems. I think her origin is a bit less.... cosmic. I'm not saying she's an alien but.... she's probably an alien.
I wonder if it's relevant that Chloe Bennet(the actress who plays Skye) is half-Chinese(her birth name is Chloe Wang, and she's released at least one song in Chinese as Wang Keying), and speaks Mandarin(Chinese)?
I don't think Skye is one of the Infinity gems. I think her origin is a bit less.... cosmic. I'm not saying she's an alien but.... she's probably an alien.
I wonder if it's relevant that Chloe Bennet(the actress who plays Skye) is half-Chinese(her birth name is Chloe Wang, and she's released at least one song in Chinese as Wang Keying), and speaks Mandarin(Chinese)?
IMHO, Cloe's ancestry is likely not why she was chosen to play the role. It appears that Agents of SHIELD's makeup department de-emphasizes her Asian heritage in favor of her Caucasian heritage to fulfill the needs of the role.
The only thing I can say with reasonable certainty is that Skye is not a mutant. What puzzles me, unless bad writing, is that Simmons has been pouring over Skye's blood and DNA now. You'd think she'd have seen alien DNA. For that matter, you'd think she'd have seen scientifically altered DNA (beyond the blue alien infusion). So unless poor writing, or some crazy plot twist where Simmons cannot possibly realize what she's seeing, there's something else. I've wondered if perhaps its something like Skye can be a conduit for the Phoenix force. There's no Jean Grey in the MCU, but perhaps there's something like Jean Grey and the Phoenix force. I'm also guessing whatever is special about her at least partially manifests as her elite computer hacking ability.
Maybe... but... they did hint that there IS some important difference between Skye and Coulson that made them react to that drug differently. In Skye's case there were few, if any side effects, other than the side effect of spasming a bit which only lasted a minute or so.
That being said.... has Simmons seen alien DNA before? Would she recognize it if she saw it?
But yeah, I also think that Skye's hacking is a super-power and not a skill.
That being said.... has Simmons seen alien DNA before? Would she recognize it if she saw it?
I think it reasonable to assume that Simmons would at least have seen SHEILD reports on Chitauri autopsies following the invasion. So, yes, likely one species at least. As to any other, well, it might be like the old comment about bank tellers: to find the fake money, only expose the tellers to the real currency. They'll then know something is off when the fake stuff comes around. The same could be said with DNA. Simmons knows human DNA very well, so anything different, though not understood, would be spotted.
I'm drifting away from my original theory that Skye is Karolina Dean (aka Lucy in the Sky) because of the Tahiti reveal, but making her the Earth-199999 Ms. Marvel/Captain Marvel... Just doesn't sit well with me.
I knew nothing of the character of Lucy in the Sky, but after reading up there are quite a few parallels. What about T.A.H.I.T.I. negated the idea for you? Skye doesn't wear a bracelet or other constantly-worn jewelry does she? There are differences, too. The most obvious one being that Lucy is TRIBBLE and, according to the info I read, has stated she has no attraction to men. That doesn't seem to be the case with Skye.
What's to say that the DNA of a Kree-Human hybrid would be that different? I mean.... races similar enough to reproduce would likely have DNA that's at least somewhat similar, right?
What's to say that the DNA of a Kree-Human hybrid would be that different? I mean.... races similar enough to reproduce would likely have DNA that's at least somewhat similar, right?
Assuming comic book genetics even remotely resemble comic book radiation, I'd say all bets are off.
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
Assuming comic book genetics even remotely resemble comic book radiation, I'd say all bets are off.
Lol, totally. I seem to remember that Skrulls were said in at least one story to be able to change their shape so thoroughly that scanning their DNA didn't show the difference. um... yeah....
The most obvious one being that Lucy is TRIBBLE and, according to the info I read, has stated she has no attraction to men. That doesn't seem to be the case with Skye.
As far as I know Deathlock and Fury weren't black (well ultimate's but...), Thor had a silly helmet, and Coulson didn't exist. Changing things to keep us guessing isn't new for the MCU.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
As far as I know Deathlock and Fury weren't black (well ultimate's but...), Thor had a silly helmet, and Coulson didn't exist. Changing things to keep us guessing isn't new for the MCU.
I think Coulson was recently intoduced in the comics. And most of MCU is heavily based on Ultimate universe. In fact, the entire idea of Fury in Ultimates was to have Sam Jackson play him in movies.
And now in the main 616 continuity, there's Nick Fury, Jr. who's, you guessed it, Samuel Jackson.
I admit I've always been a bit puzzled at changing Nick Fury's race outright. Sure Sam Jackson is very cool, I'll definitely grant that. But I always thought it would have been more interesting in Ultimates, to have white Sgt. Fury of WWII Howling Commando fame, be the grandfather of black Nick Fury (II?) of modern day SHIELD.
I admit I've always been a bit puzzled at changing Nick Fury's race outright. Sure Sam Jackson is very cool, I'll definitely grant that. But I always thought it would have been more interesting in Ultimates, to have white Sgt. Fury of WWII Howling Commando fame, be the grandfather of black Nick Fury (II?) of modern day SHIELD.
Well, the Ultimate version is arguably not much of a "change," since the whole point was to do a fresh take on established characters.
In the regular continuity, they've basically done what you suggested. Old, white Nick Fury is still around, with young, Black Nick Fury, Jr. recently surfacing.
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
In the regular continuity, they've basically done what you suggested. Old, white Nick Fury is still around, with young, Black Nick Fury, Jr. recently surfacing.
cool. :cool: Do both have the life-extension formula?
For those of you who stayed for the post credit sneak peaks in Captain America: The Winter Soldier, how excited were you about the "twins"?
How do you think they might tie in the mutant storyline, not to mention their dad?
~CaptainSmirk
Welcome to the party, CaptainSmirk!
No need for the spoiler warning, that was the point of the thread!
I would describe myself as somewhat wary of what they're doing with the twins.
The way I understand it, Fox has a lock on anything and everything mutant-related in films, which would mean that A) the MCU can't use mutants in their films, and therefore the twins will have to have a different explanation for their powers (or no explanation at all), and Magneto is definitely a no-go.
Even weirder, Bryan Singer's new X-Men movie contains its own version of Quicksilver, played by a different actor!
Aside from the mutant issue, it looks like they're simplifying Wanda's powers to a more basic "telekinesis," rather than probability-altering chaos magic. This...might be for the best, actually.
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
Or just energy. Hurling oddly shaped energy blobs and firing energy beams isn't out there for what Wanda's done in the comics. Sure her powers are usually described differently, but she CAN do that stuff too.
As for rights issues.... I don't know enough to comment on that directly.... but I suspect that the rights are handled categorically, and I don't think the agreements actually name all of the characters associated.
As for rights issues.... I don't know enough to comment on that directly.... but I suspect that the rights are handled categorically, and I don't think the agreements actually name all of the characters associated.
The way I understand it (I'm certainly no expert and am just basing it on what I've read on various comics news sites), characters are handled categorically, but there are certain IP elements which are covered as well.
Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch fit into both the "mutants/X-Men" and "Avengers" categories, so they are going to be in both movies. But their status as "mutants" is the sole domain of Fox, so Disney can't include those elements of their backstory.
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
right. Likely the twins will be given a science origin. Yet another pair of experiments by Hydra.
I'm...cautiously optimistic. I always like speedsters, and comic book Quicksilver was always edgier in personality that the various men to wear the Flash mantle. At least, that's how I remember it. I always thought that made him rather interesting.
Wanda on the other hand, fits into a category I don't like: "phenomenal cosmic power, itty bitty living space". Basically, characters that are so powerful that the stories often feel sloppy, and not interesting anymore. If they reign that in to a limited version of her comic book abilities, then I'm interested again.
No Magneto, likely no Polaris. However, I've not heard if Magda, their mother was a mutant, so if she was not, then it may be possible to have her in the story.
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
I liked the show from the beginning, but it certainly is getting even better. I'm not surprised by this, as any continuity heavy series needs to build itself up gradually, introduce us to the characters, tell us why they matter, develop the storyline, and so forth.
This week's episode answered quite a few of the lingering questions we were discussing:
Garrett was definitely the Clairvoyant, and it looks like he was acting alone in that particular role.
Ward has been a sleeper HYDRA agent the entire time, and this isn't some kind of double-agent scenario.
Koenig tells Coulson that Nick Fury is still alive (thankfully, it would have been pointless to convince those who have seen the movie otherwise).
S.H.I.E.L.D. as an organization is D.E.A.D.
Lingering questions:
Ward admitted to becoming at least somewhat attached to the team, and Skye in particular, during his time with them. How much of a role will that attachment play in whatever happens next? He seems too far gone to rehabilitate, but maybe it will be just enough to cause him to hesitate if and when the time to use deadly force comes.
Has the Girl in the Flower Dress really been won over by Garrett, or might she switch sides?
Most importantly, now that the team's in Canada, will Alpha Flight bail them out? Department H got name-dropped in The Winter Solder...:rolleyes:
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
Comments
In House of M, the silliness of the distinction is particularly on display. Spider-man was able to prove he was a mutant, and despite suspicions there was no evidence that he wasn't. The only thing that eventually proved he wasn't a mutant was his own journal detailing how he got his powers.
My character Tsin'xing
I was always of the understanding that "mutant" referred to a birth/genetic condition, and that "mutate" referred to an altered human, like Spiderman and Hulk.
With Agents of SHIELD, I think they'll soon be crawling with mutates, or at least the mutate of the week. If you've ever played City of Heroes, then consider the mutant origin to be reserved for Sony. All other origins: natural (ex: Black Widow & Hawkeye), technological (ex: Iron Man), science, aka "mutate" (ex: Hulk & Capt. America), and magic (ex: Thor), are the property of Marvel/Disney. And you'll note I just named all the movie Avengers.
The challenge to that is Spiderman, and apparently soon the Fantastic Four. Both of those are science/mutate in origin, but are being developed by Sony. And then we have the other exceptions: mutants Quicksilver and Scarlett Witch, who've ended up being shared. So its not a pure split.
I'm hoping for Amora, but we'll see.
I don't think Skye is one of the Infinity gems. I think her origin is a bit less.... cosmic. I'm not saying she's an alien but.... she's probably an alien.
I wonder if it's relevant that Chloe Bennet(the actress who plays Skye) is half-Chinese(her birth name is Chloe Wang, and she's released at least one song in Chinese as Wang Keying), and speaks Mandarin(Chinese)?
My character Tsin'xing
Likely, given that her sis Lorelei is already in the story.
IMHO, Cloe's ancestry is likely not why she was chosen to play the role. It appears that Agents of SHIELD's makeup department de-emphasizes her Asian heritage in favor of her Caucasian heritage to fulfill the needs of the role.
The only thing I can say with reasonable certainty is that Skye is not a mutant. What puzzles me, unless bad writing, is that Simmons has been pouring over Skye's blood and DNA now. You'd think she'd have seen alien DNA. For that matter, you'd think she'd have seen scientifically altered DNA (beyond the blue alien infusion). So unless poor writing, or some crazy plot twist where Simmons cannot possibly realize what she's seeing, there's something else. I've wondered if perhaps its something like Skye can be a conduit for the Phoenix force. There's no Jean Grey in the MCU, but perhaps there's something like Jean Grey and the Phoenix force. I'm also guessing whatever is special about her at least partially manifests as her elite computer hacking ability.
That being said.... has Simmons seen alien DNA before? Would she recognize it if she saw it?
But yeah, I also think that Skye's hacking is a super-power and not a skill.
My character Tsin'xing
I think it reasonable to assume that Simmons would at least have seen SHEILD reports on Chitauri autopsies following the invasion. So, yes, likely one species at least. As to any other, well, it might be like the old comment about bank tellers: to find the fake money, only expose the tellers to the real currency. They'll then know something is off when the fake stuff comes around. The same could be said with DNA. Simmons knows human DNA very well, so anything different, though not understood, would be spotted.
I knew nothing of the character of Lucy in the Sky, but after reading up there are quite a few parallels. What about T.A.H.I.T.I. negated the idea for you? Skye doesn't wear a bracelet or other constantly-worn jewelry does she? There are differences, too. The most obvious one being that Lucy is TRIBBLE and, according to the info I read, has stated she has no attraction to men. That doesn't seem to be the case with Skye.
My character Tsin'xing
Assuming comic book genetics even remotely resemble comic book radiation, I'd say all bets are off.
My character Tsin'xing
As far as I know Deathlock and Fury weren't black (well ultimate's but...), Thor had a silly helmet, and Coulson didn't exist. Changing things to keep us guessing isn't new for the MCU.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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I think Coulson was recently intoduced in the comics. And most of MCU is heavily based on Ultimate universe. In fact, the entire idea of Fury in Ultimates was to have Sam Jackson play him in movies.
I admit I've always been a bit puzzled at changing Nick Fury's race outright. Sure Sam Jackson is very cool, I'll definitely grant that. But I always thought it would have been more interesting in Ultimates, to have white Sgt. Fury of WWII Howling Commando fame, be the grandfather of black Nick Fury (II?) of modern day SHIELD.
Well, the Ultimate version is arguably not much of a "change," since the whole point was to do a fresh take on established characters.
In the regular continuity, they've basically done what you suggested. Old, white Nick Fury is still around, with young, Black Nick Fury, Jr. recently surfacing.
cool. :cool: Do both have the life-extension formula?
My character Tsin'xing
For those of you who stayed for the post credit sneak peaks in Captain America: The Winter Soldier, how excited were you about the "twins"?
How do you think they might tie in the mutant storyline, not to mention their dad?
~CaptainSmirk
Welcome to the party, CaptainSmirk!
No need for the spoiler warning, that was the point of the thread!
I would describe myself as somewhat wary of what they're doing with the twins.
The way I understand it, Fox has a lock on anything and everything mutant-related in films, which would mean that A) the MCU can't use mutants in their films, and therefore the twins will have to have a different explanation for their powers (or no explanation at all), and
Even weirder, Bryan Singer's new X-Men movie contains its own version of Quicksilver, played by a different actor!
Aside from the mutant issue, it looks like they're simplifying Wanda's powers to a more basic "telekinesis," rather than probability-altering chaos magic. This...might be for the best, actually.
As for rights issues.... I don't know enough to comment on that directly.... but I suspect that the rights are handled categorically, and I don't think the agreements actually name all of the characters associated.
My character Tsin'xing
The way I understand it (I'm certainly no expert and am just basing it on what I've read on various comics news sites), characters are handled categorically, but there are certain IP elements which are covered as well.
Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch fit into both the "mutants/X-Men" and "Avengers" categories, so they are going to be in both movies. But their status as "mutants" is the sole domain of Fox, so Disney can't include those elements of their backstory.
I'm...cautiously optimistic. I always like speedsters, and comic book Quicksilver was always edgier in personality that the various men to wear the Flash mantle. At least, that's how I remember it. I always thought that made him rather interesting.
Wanda on the other hand, fits into a category I don't like: "phenomenal cosmic power, itty bitty living space". Basically, characters that are so powerful that the stories often feel sloppy, and not interesting anymore. If they reign that in to a limited version of her comic book abilities, then I'm interested again.
No Magneto, likely no Polaris. However, I've not heard if Magda, their mother was a mutant, so if she was not, then it may be possible to have her in the story.
Garrett was definitely the Clairvoyant, and it looks like he was acting alone in that particular role.
Ward has been a sleeper HYDRA agent the entire time, and this isn't some kind of double-agent scenario.
Koenig tells Coulson that Nick Fury is still alive (thankfully, it would have been pointless to convince those who have seen the movie otherwise).
S.H.I.E.L.D. as an organization is D.E.A.D.
Lingering questions:
Ward admitted to becoming at least somewhat attached to the team, and Skye in particular, during his time with them. How much of a role will that attachment play in whatever happens next? He seems too far gone to rehabilitate, but maybe it will be just enough to cause him to hesitate if and when the time to use deadly force comes.
Has the Girl in the Flower Dress really been won over by Garrett, or might she switch sides?
Most importantly, now that the team's in Canada, will Alpha Flight bail them out? Department H got name-dropped in The Winter Solder...:rolleyes:
Only since the Battle of New York! That's not so long!
...kind of makes you wonder what he was like before...
My character Tsin'xing
Dude, that's TWO whole friggin' YEARS!