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Fleet Miranda (Light Cruiser)
thunderhawk101
Member Posts: 227 Arc User
Okay, so anyways, I doubt I'm the first to propose this, but I genuinely have always liked the design of the Miranda Class starship. I also think it's a bit of a shame we don't have something more reflective of the current times with it in terms of capability. So, here's a proposed idea for a Fleet Variant. This is completely off of the top of my head btw so forgive any numbers please if they seem a little 'out there'. Also, if anyone has any 'better' (Read: More in line with existing ships) versions for this idea, feel free to post it, I welcome the ideas on this.
Fleet Light Cruiser Retrofit:
Hull; 35000
Crew; 200
Shield mod; 1.1
Fore Weapon Slots; 4
Aft Weapon Slots; 3
Device Slots; 3
Base Turn; 15
Inertia Rating: 50
Impulse Mod; 0.60
Bridge Officer Slots; Cmdr Tactical, Lt. Tactical, Lt. Cmdr Engineering, Ensign Engineering, Lt. Science, Ensign Universal.
Consoles: 4 Tactical, 3 Engineering, 3 Science.
+10 Weapons Power, +5 to all other power levels.
Can Load Dual/Dual Heavy Cannons.
Basically in a nutshell, the Light Cruiser was pretty much made to be a 'blend' of Science Vessel, Escort, and Cruiser just without the heightened power levels and extensive crew/hull of higher tier cruisers, and without the inbuilt Science Vessel effects, but allowing the normally 'escort only' ability to load both dual and dual heavy cannons. The 'Fleet Light Cruiser' reflects this in that it's really a 'master of none' type build which is shown by it having the hull ratings and turn rate of some of the 'heavier' Escorts almost, and while it is a little more oriented towards Tactical it's more 'balanced' and can effectively fulfill any role based on the player's preference. In essence the ship is designed to be a 'blend' of Escort and Cruiser while having not inconsiderable science abilities. Anyways, that's my idea, it's really just something I came up with while bull****ting around in my old Starter Miranda Class in some Deep Space Encounters. Tell me what you guys think and any feedback or 'tweaks' to this idea is more than welcome. Hopefully someone on the Dev. Team get's wind of this and we might just see it happen. As for costs, say it would take a T-1 shipyard or poss. T-2, 4 FSM's as always and say something like 15-20k Fleet Credit, in other words, pretty much what other 'fleet ships' cost.
Fleet Light Cruiser Retrofit:
Hull; 35000
Crew; 200
Shield mod; 1.1
Fore Weapon Slots; 4
Aft Weapon Slots; 3
Device Slots; 3
Base Turn; 15
Inertia Rating: 50
Impulse Mod; 0.60
Bridge Officer Slots; Cmdr Tactical, Lt. Tactical, Lt. Cmdr Engineering, Ensign Engineering, Lt. Science, Ensign Universal.
Consoles: 4 Tactical, 3 Engineering, 3 Science.
+10 Weapons Power, +5 to all other power levels.
Can Load Dual/Dual Heavy Cannons.
Basically in a nutshell, the Light Cruiser was pretty much made to be a 'blend' of Science Vessel, Escort, and Cruiser just without the heightened power levels and extensive crew/hull of higher tier cruisers, and without the inbuilt Science Vessel effects, but allowing the normally 'escort only' ability to load both dual and dual heavy cannons. The 'Fleet Light Cruiser' reflects this in that it's really a 'master of none' type build which is shown by it having the hull ratings and turn rate of some of the 'heavier' Escorts almost, and while it is a little more oriented towards Tactical it's more 'balanced' and can effectively fulfill any role based on the player's preference. In essence the ship is designed to be a 'blend' of Escort and Cruiser while having not inconsiderable science abilities. Anyways, that's my idea, it's really just something I came up with while bull****ting around in my old Starter Miranda Class in some Deep Space Encounters. Tell me what you guys think and any feedback or 'tweaks' to this idea is more than welcome. Hopefully someone on the Dev. Team get's wind of this and we might just see it happen. As for costs, say it would take a T-1 shipyard or poss. T-2, 4 FSM's as always and say something like 15-20k Fleet Credit, in other words, pretty much what other 'fleet ships' cost.
I enjoy this kind of thread. It's like farting in the air to fight the wind. It's poetic, childish and completely useless.
Post edited by thunderhawk101 on
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Comments
Well it looks fairly well thought out, I pulled up a couple of ships to look up some base stats so I could place the base hull and I think 37250 would be more cruisery, I can see why you opted for 4/3 weapons however this harms broadsiding, I would as such go for 4/4 weapon slots (as per the Breen ship) and drop the slightly ambitious turn rate to 11 or 12 (more in line with the KDF battlecruisers rather than escorts), I would also have a 1.0 shield mod to reflect it's "light cruiser"-ness (though that is just me).
An impulse mod of 0.6 is going to outpace almost everything out there, the Excelsior only has 0.15 and the FPE has 0.2 so I'd probably place the Miranda at 0.16 maybe 0.175 I do agree with the inertia rating though
The comsole layout is spot on for the boff layout but you only have 20 bonus power to play with rather than the 25 you've used, I would lose the aux power bonus (one can use an overcharged warp core to cover it), other than that I would probably buy it and with a Lt eng run one of those Aux2Batts you hate so much :P
Have you considered an Unconvential BOFF layout? 3 Lt Com (1 each) & a Uni Liutenant (11 powers, 1 less than standard) but it would suit the Jack of all Trades master of none motif. I think am Escort turn rate is too high 10 or 11 would be good.
I think 4/4 weapons makes sense. And I also think 9 Consoles, 3 of each would suit it's roll better. Or perhaps put the 10th console in Science or Engineering. In all honesty we don't want this thing becoming an escort. +5 to all Systems rather than the +10 to weapons, +5 to everything else.
Isn't the upgrade to the Miranda meant to be the Nebula? If the original looked like a reconfigured Connie and the Nebula looks like a Reconfigured Galaxy it makes sense right?
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Granted yeah, at the same time I was rather tired when I came up with this and also maybe a little bit drunk. The real reason I decided on three aft weapons was because being able to load DC's/DHC's it might have been a 'little too much' imo with the plan of having it turn more like an escort than anything. As for the BOFF layout, I admit, your idea with that would work better with the 'master of none' idea.
EDIT: Not only that but it would also be a bit 'different' and would be something we'd never seen before on a 'T-5' grade Starship.
I certainly have, mostly as an 'alternate' skin unique to the fleet version similar to how the old C-Store skins are now used for 'fleet' versions of most ships like the Imperial Class skin for the Assault Cruiser.
I feel the same way about the Galaxy, as far as the shows go we initially don't see many of them. The only time we see one in TNG other than the Enterprise it was destroyed (or it was an illusion, in both cases it was the USS Yamato which was described as the Enterprise's sister ship - implying that there weren't any other Galaxy-class ships around at that time other than perhaps the first flight prototype USS Galaxy). It would take DS9 to be the first to introduce us to other Galaxy-class ships, like the USS Odyssey and USS Venture (Voyager gave us USS Challenger, but that was an alternate timeline - I'm willing to include it though). But in TNG we saw Nebula-class ships more times than we saw Galaxy class ships! (USS Phoenix in 'The Wounded', USS Sutherland in 'Redemption part 2', and USS Faragut in Generations; I don't know if the USS Bellerphon is visible in the Wolf 359 graveyard scene, but it was there as we saw a Nebula-class ship participate in that battle in DS9's 'Emissary')
Anyway, I think the Nebula probably falls under the same kind of design role the Miranda fulfilled for the Constitution-class: a lighter version of a heavy cruiser like the Galaxy.
If you mean Connie -> Galaxy, Miranda -> Nebula, then yes, it is.
On that note, while I support anyone asking for older ships, I am pushing for the ToS Connie and the NX, so that all 6 "hero" ships of the various "eras" would be represented. TMP era already has the Excelsior in game, so trying to add the Miranda, also introduced in TMP, would be a bit redundant... What would the trick behind a T5 Miranda be, besides being a TMP-era "escort" to the Oberth in Sci and Excelsior Cruiser?
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
Honestly? No real reason behind the idea mostly because I doubt it'll happen. I really just kinda threw it together because I could. Well, that and time and again in game all people care about more and more is 'dps' I understand that and the reason why it's there. However, according to what we've seen, 99% of Starfleet designs and ships were not made exclusively for combat purpose. Rather, Starfleet vessels were, with the few dedicated role exceptions, designed to be the 'swiss army knife' in space. This was kinda to represent that, it's a ship that really 'excels' at no one task, but can more or less fill any role depending on how you 'build it'.
Sorry about the 'back to back' posts, but yeah, while that is true based on the canon established in the novels which cover 'Project Full Circle', and while I have looked at other canon Miranda variants and 'updates'. It really is kinda a moot point for us to discuss the 'skin' of the ship so to speak, arguably the whole subject is a moot point as well, but what I'm getting at is that if/when it get's done it doesn't matter what the 'skin' looks like or if they release the Merian as an entirely seperate ship altogether. At the same time while I respect the fact that the 'offical' classification so to speak for the Miranda and it's variants is 'Destroyer' type, I'm going off of what's already 'in game', and in game it's called the 'light cruiser'.
CBS vetoed the Original Series Constitution Class.
As for the others, do you have a reputable source, or is this just hearsay?
From stofsk...
Quote:
There was a Constitution Class vessel at Wolf 359. There was wreckage of such in the debris field (Star Trek III destruction sequence model was used). So, that would imply that there were a few still in service as of 2367.
The Miranda always struck me as a good "workhorse" design, good for a variety of tasks. That is part of what made it so common, from my point of view. Even a century after the first hull was laid down. You don't mess with success. Same goes for the Oberth and Excelsior classes.
Of course, this is from an in-universe POV. The real world reason is they used the older vessels in TNG due to production costs.
Your right it is Hearsay, but surely with people asking for this ship since day 1, they'd have done something right?
I take the veto to mean all the old outdated T1 vessels.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
I can understand that, at the same time, they might well have plans to do that eventually or something similar to it, but at the same time they also have a schedule at cryptic they have to meet with other projects, expansions, coding new missions for the next Featured Episode or something like that. So something like a T-5 version of the Miranda/Constitution would likely be on the 'back burner' until the dev team can get to the point where they have time to work on it a little bit at a time.
This might require some form of tangible evidence. Something official would be preferred.
I'd be all for T5 versions of light cruisers. If you refer to DS9, what everyone here is so fond of because "pewpew!", Mirandas had the same function in battle as the Defiant had (they formed a squad, performed worse but still same purpose). I'd like to see lighter ships at T5 maybe even sporting only 3/2 weapon slots but make up for it somehow. I oppose the idea of DHC however. Those pesky cannons have to vanish at least from Starfleet vessels, otherwise there is NO reason to use anything else and then we'd have the Star Wars game everyone here wants to play
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actually, the Centaur was seen only in DS9, but the design is late 23rd century.
It's an Excelsior kitbash, so you argue that it was the light cruiser version to the Excelsior class as the Miranda was to the Constitution.
The Centaur is not a "Miranda out of Excelsior parts".:)
While the DS9TM states this, it's utter rubbish. The drawing in tha book also only remotely match the Centaur as we saw her in the shows.The ship is a whole lot smaller than it would be if the Centuar were based on an Excelsior saucer.
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/articles/ds9tm.htm#centaur
"[...]Hutzel saw it, he wanted it for his Episode with the JH Bug. I added more detail at this point to make sure the scale looked like a smaller ship even tho' it was an Excelsior dish."
10k hull maybe to be correct with canon -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjQovy11vpk
So they actually would get 1-shot!
So how, exactly do you explain the In-game version of the Defiant Class, which is 'smaller' than the Miranda, Yet the 'fleet version' has 33k 'base' hull? Do tell?
Hull is amplified by Structural integrity fields, obviously the Defiant has a more intense field than other ships of it's size. Also it's not full of sci labs and frivolous stuff like other vessels.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Indeed, however the previous poster made no mention of this whatsoever. Granted the Defiant Class generally and likely does have, a stronger S.I.F. however, what's there to stop a tech upgrade to the existing S.I.F. Emitters on an older vessel to 'bring it up to snuff'?
Of course a bigger ship has more hull surface than a smaller ship, but the hull thickness and integrity is not proportionate to overall size.
In RL, new military ships, aircraft tanks etc. are usually designed in such a way that later upgrades with new and better equipment are possible.
This can take the form of empty spaces or slots that are bigger than the equipment that is at the time of introduction placed in them.
As a consecuence of an upgrde these slots are then occupied by this new equipment.
In some cases older units can be upgraded with this new tech and in some cases it's not possible.
In case of the Miranda I'd say after 150 years of service the ship has reached the end of its upgrade capability.
Even ships which are large and expensive to replace wouldn't be more than 20 years old, now I'm not denying a mothball fleet here. But at Tier 5 your a frickin Admiral your not going to be using the mothball fleet.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Defiant was designed to fight the borg threat... Iit has massive hull plating for fighting the borg. In Star Trek 8 you see it take massive damage from borg without blowing to pieces compared to the Miranda which got 1-2 shot by 1 jem dread ( And I think the borg cube hits way harder than a jem dread ). Miranda aint designed to fight the borg, hence its hull should not be even close to the defiant. Not even by a longshot.
The Saber class didn't replace anything. It fulfills the exact same role as the Defiant (fast attack gunship). They're comparable in size, speed, crew complement and armament.
Just like the Defiant, it fills a role that up until that point Starfleet had decided didn't need to be filled.
So it's all about the outer 'ablative armor' plating is what your argument is? Yet I can quite easily, in game, put that same Ablative Armor on any other ship regardless of tier because oh, it's a console item.
Back to back post again, sorry.
Perhaps, but at the same time I was always under the general impression that 'fleet ships' were not 'rebuilds' or 'gutting out and replacing components'. But rather a whole new vessel built to the design specs but including the latest and most advanced tech which either Starfleet/the KDF/Romulan Republic, has to offer.
An interesting concept but it doesn't make any sense, Starfleet unlike other star faring races build new ships that look different to old ships. So they wouldn't build a new ship for an outdated design.
When the new tech can't be put into the old hull, that hull is taken out of production.
A fleet ship is an older ship with retrofitted with better technology.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
The USA is still using military aircraft which where built more than 50 years ago.
You have also got to consider, design and materials, a stunt plane or single engine prop planes are basicly using the same 100 year old design just more refined, like the adaptation of the now military jets.
A fleet Miranda is a nice idea for a light maneuverable cruiser with a design similar to a nebula.