AFAIK the early levels are a pretty straight forward, no choices, you just get skills, BUT that changes and at higher levels things branch. I think it starts around 30-ish.
Also I think at level 11, I started getting points to put into choosing between several passive stat bonuses.
Yeah but it's not the same as the classi DnD Skills & Feats system that I love I was shocked when I leved up and couldn't put points into dodge x)
It is kind of hard to not think that this is D&D when it has Mimics and Gelatinous Cubes. Although I encountered less than 5 Mimics from levels 1-30 and 1 Gelatinous Cube at level 29. IMO D&D is more about the lore, monsters, etc rather than gameplay. DS9, Voyager, and TOS are all Star Trek even though they have completely different styles. It is the same with Neverwinter Online and D&D.
It annoys me after I ditched it after the .5 update back in 3rd I apparently still care about this.
D&D started from Chainmail, Chainmail was a miniatures wargame that is why D&D was always so combat heavy since its origin is from a wargame.
D&D was also about killing things and take their stuff, it was very dungeon crawling as first modules attest and eventually Gary group seasons lead what became Greyhawk that was still pretty much kill things and take their stuff.
Sure they were splits, DragonLance became the 2nd campaign world, then come Forgotten Realms ... now this would be long, boring and I would stop when in 3rd since I stop following it ... well most of it but the thing is the entire system revolved around combat because thats the part were it originated from and the part that needed to work, we just need to look at alignment to see how rules about roleplaying would leads us.
D&D back in 3rd was still very much about combat but added a skill system, this very much were non-combat was added to the game for all classes, sure there was something like that back in 2nd AD&D (noweapon proficiency) but as a optional rule.
Now "lore" taken time to build, GreyHawk didnt just started as lore usually account to "why are killing then and taking their stuff" as a reason why you were murdering women and children in their houses and then loot their corpses, it also taken a hell lot of time too.
But anyway ... I am sure were this is going to take place or should I say when because 4th Edition did one thing that was.
Forgotten Realms is not Eberron enough, now it is.
This is very much why I am NOT ever playing Neverwinter Nights or ANYTHING D&D that is done under Hasbro regime.
I refused to play 4ed onwards, I hate it. Spell Plague was a joke and the change to the systems to dumb it down was a joke, just like when Warhammer 40k went from the 2nd Edition to 3rd Edition. :mad:
This is exactly how hugely successful F2P's like DDO work you pay for stuff of substance, I.e. access to entire zones, quest chains and epic raids...
If you paywall content, most of your players will never see that content. Cryptic prefers to have EVERYBODY see the content, and let the content drive sales of other items. Otherwise, they'd be spending the majority of their effort on things that most people would never see.
DDO isn't any more successful than STO. Both strategies are good strategies; Cryptic's means more people get to play all the content.
Former moderator of these forums. Lifetime sub since before launch. Been here since before public betas. Foundry author of "Franklin Drake Must Die".
If you paywall content, most of your players will never see that content. Cryptic prefers to have EVERYBODY see the content, and let the content drive sales of other items. Otherwise, they'd be spending the majority of their effort on things that most people would never see.
DDO isn't any more successful than STO. Both strategies are good strategies; Cryptic's means more people get to play all the content.
When STO reaches it's 8th year and has the level of content DDO has without out paying for a single area / quest pack then maybe we can discuss it.
For me I'd rather pay $15 dollars for Gianthold which has almost as much content as STO's entire end game than pay $50 dollars for a ship I'll use for 4 weeks.
By your logic no one will ever use the ships Cryptic designs because they are pay-walled and pay-walled much much worse than massive amount of content you get in one DDO zone.
The truth is it has nothing to do with what Cryptic prefers but what Cryptic a capable of doing. They cannot create the volume and complexity of content Turbine can for DDO so they don't even have the option of looking at selling zones as content, for example New Romulus with it's 5 rep tied missions and pretty much nothing else than tagging animals is about 1/10th of the content in DDO's Gianthold zone which is I think a Level 14 zone.
Cryptic simply don't have the ability to generate that kind of quality content in great volume so they instead they open up what content they have to everyone and have to rely on Lockboxes and ship sales as their main source of income.
There is a reason why no one raves about Cryptics content, I think if you ask anyone on here what they think about the content in this game most would say it's not exactly the most titillating. Thats not say it isn't fun in parts, but for example STF's are only fun for me because I love teaming up, but the PVE challenge there is hardly the same grabbing a team and doing Eyes of Stone on Elite (and that isn't even an End-Game mission.. it's only level 15-16).
The game is what it is, and some people like the way it is, others not and others again don't really care either way, but trying to argue that it is as successful as DDO which frankly was the game that showed F2P was actually profitable I think is not possible.
Drakron mde a good point. The thing about DnD that is truely unique is the backstory. The rest of it borrows from far too many generic fantasy tropes to be unique.
Drakron mde a good point. The thing about DnD that is truely unique is the backstory. The rest of it borrows from far too many generic fantasy tropes to be unique.
Well, I guess that all depends on the campaign setting, the whole Steampunk feel and associated tropes in DDO (Eberron) is markedly different to the High Fantasy feel of FR pre Spell Plague.
This is exactly how hugely successful F2P's like DDO work you pay for stuff of substance, I.e. access to entire zones, quest chains and epic raids...
They are amazing, for example Gianthold and the 4 Part Crypt series are mind blowingly good. And the value for money aspect is great Gianthold is almost as much content as the entire STO endgame alone and it only cost $15 dollars about half the price of Baldurs Gate when it came out.
I have to say, I would never play it if that was what they sold to us. I prefer buying vanity items than game content. Every MMO I've played which has gone down that line, I've stopped playing. I like F2P games where they are actually F2P and paid content is an extra but not required. As do most people.
Join date is wrong, I've actually been around since STO Beta.
True alters don't have a "main". Account wide unlocks for all unique event rewards!!
I have to say, I would never play it if that was what they sold to us. I prefer buying vanity items than game content. Every MMO I've played which has gone down that line, I've stopped playing. I like F2P games where they are actually F2P and paid content is an extra but not required. As do most people.
I prefer games that focus on real content as their payment model because it means that they actually have a reason to produce actual content and not just vanity items and lock boxes which is all we seem to get with Cryptic at the moment.
DDO is actually free to play and you can earn points in game to unlock adventure packs. As it is I haven't even completed the Free 2 Play stuff in DDO yet because even after 3 years of playing it all 4 of my characters are only Level 17
However just like this game good luck with getting anything cool quickly... you won't it will take you a lot of grinding.
When you say "As do most people" there are 2 Million Gamers who play DDO who disagree. In addition you forget that it still has a subscriber model that for like $9 a month gives every adventure pack available.
Honestly I kind of regretted getting LTS for this game after Season 7, I can't say I say the same with DDO.
I agree with you though on one thing if Cryptic tried to sell me Feature Episodes that are of the current quality and depth I'd be going elsewhere.
Will the squeeze, that is going on in STO atm, be nerfed when Neverwinter will be launched and suddenly fade out of server existence ?
This will allow the dev team to actually get back to STO and make it to be an actual star trek oriented game, not just a huge sink designed to squeeze money for the useless Neverwinter.
"To seek out new life..."
"Star Trek Philosophy of Respect and Protect All Lifeforms"
Will the squeeze, that is going on in STO atm, be nerfed when Neverwinter will be launched and suddenly fade out of server existence ?
This will allow the dev team to actually get back to STO and make it to be an actual star trek oriented game, not just a huge sink designed to squeeze money for the useless Neverwinter.
"To seek out new life..."
"Star Trek Philosophy of Respect and Protect All Lifeforms"
The only thing that should affect STO after NW goes live, is all those profits from STO which are obviously being spent on NW to get that up an running, should in fact be put back into STO.
I'd have to disagree with the current love hate feelings toward current the current f2p model. I have a credit card, yet I can't punch in the numbers and buy a ship, or a character or anything.
What is with the idea that you have to buy some intermediary currency? Silly imo.
Also, I would pay for additional content, like SWTOR is selling their HUT cartel planet expansion. Because it simply is another part of the game that if you don't buy it, you don't have to play it, you can still play the core game. Then what happens? You get tired of the core game, break out the credit card, and buy more content. Access to New Romulus, a new ship. f2p is meant for those that don't have time to grind a hardcore game MMO that takes your life and a little bit of your money. Most of use would rather spend a little less life and pay a bit more money to move along in a game.
So sell me content, $10 for a Dominion Dreadnaught carrier - I'm there, because I like most gamers, do not have time to TRIBBLE with keys and boxes and zen and dilithium, etc. Just take my money and let me play. I grind the character, you give me the toys for more money. Works for most of us, but they have yet to put it in to practice.
All the previous games I have played, most people including me just laugh at the intermediary currency and slight of hand exchange tricks, and never buy a thing - too complicated, too much time, etc.
Warmest Regards,
Covenant of the Phoenix - Fed | Covenant of the Phoenix - KDF www.cotp.info
What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the will to find out, which is the exact opposite. Bertrand Russell
The only thing that should affect STO after NW goes live, is all those profits from STO which are obviously being spent on NW to get that up an running, should in fact be put back into STO.
As has been said many times now by several devs, the STO dev team is the largest it's been since launch, currently; and they're working on an update so large they're not calling it Season 8 anymore because it's much bigger than a typical Season.
Keep in mind that much of the work done on Neverwinter is going to provide things that will get incorporated into STO (and CO, even) in the next big codebase merge. Recall Tacofangs' awesome "all you ever needed to know about code merges you learned from Tacofangs" graphic:
As has been said many times now by several devs, the STO dev team is the largest it's been since launch, currently; and they're working on an update so large they're not calling it Season 8 anymore because it's much bigger than a typical Season.
Keep in mind that much of the work done on Neverwinter is going to provide things that will get incorporated into STO (and CO, even) in the next big codebase merge. Recall Tacofangs' awesome "all you ever needed to know about code merges you learned from Tacofangs" graphic:
Here's an idea for a new lifetime perk. A working game that doesn't make you feel like you've been playing a closed beta for three years! Whoa... mindblowing!
As has been said many times now by several devs, the STO dev team is the largest it's been since launch, currently; and they're working on an update so large they're not calling it Season 8 anymore because it's much bigger than a typical Season.
Keep in mind that much of the work done on Neverwinter is going to provide things that will get incorporated into STO (and CO, even) in the next big codebase merge. Recall Tacofangs' awesome "all you ever needed to know about code merges you learned from Tacofangs" graphic:
As has been said many times now by several devs, the STO dev team is the largest it's been since launch, currently; and they're working on an update so large they're not calling it Season 8 anymore because it's much bigger than a typical Season.
You do know over time, if you keep paying a sub, you'll have eventually exceeded the amount of a lifetimer sub?
18 months of gold is equal to lifer sub i think.
Money sink vs 1 big payment and freedom from subs?
Which would you pick?
Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad
You do know over time, if you keep paying a sub, you'll have eventually exceeded the amount of a lifetimer sub?
18 months of gold is equal to lifer sub i think.
Money sink vs 1 big payment and freedom from subs?
Which would you pick?
Yep.. got mine at launch... now I get paid 500 zen every month to play the game
Made my monies worth on the LTS before the game even went F2P.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Comments
Yeah but it's not the same as the classi DnD Skills & Feats system that I love I was shocked when I leved up and couldn't put points into dodge x)
#2311#2700#2316#2500
My character Tsin'xing
I refused to play 4ed onwards, I hate it. Spell Plague was a joke and the change to the systems to dumb it down was a joke, just like when Warhammer 40k went from the 2nd Edition to 3rd Edition. :mad:
#2311#2700#2316#2500
If you paywall content, most of your players will never see that content. Cryptic prefers to have EVERYBODY see the content, and let the content drive sales of other items. Otherwise, they'd be spending the majority of their effort on things that most people would never see.
DDO isn't any more successful than STO. Both strategies are good strategies; Cryptic's means more people get to play all the content.
When STO reaches it's 8th year and has the level of content DDO has without out paying for a single area / quest pack then maybe we can discuss it.
For me I'd rather pay $15 dollars for Gianthold which has almost as much content as STO's entire end game than pay $50 dollars for a ship I'll use for 4 weeks.
By your logic no one will ever use the ships Cryptic designs because they are pay-walled and pay-walled much much worse than massive amount of content you get in one DDO zone.
The truth is it has nothing to do with what Cryptic prefers but what Cryptic a capable of doing. They cannot create the volume and complexity of content Turbine can for DDO so they don't even have the option of looking at selling zones as content, for example New Romulus with it's 5 rep tied missions and pretty much nothing else than tagging animals is about 1/10th of the content in DDO's Gianthold zone which is I think a Level 14 zone.
Cryptic simply don't have the ability to generate that kind of quality content in great volume so they instead they open up what content they have to everyone and have to rely on Lockboxes and ship sales as their main source of income.
There is a reason why no one raves about Cryptics content, I think if you ask anyone on here what they think about the content in this game most would say it's not exactly the most titillating. Thats not say it isn't fun in parts, but for example STF's are only fun for me because I love teaming up, but the PVE challenge there is hardly the same grabbing a team and doing Eyes of Stone on Elite (and that isn't even an End-Game mission.. it's only level 15-16).
The game is what it is, and some people like the way it is, others not and others again don't really care either way, but trying to argue that it is as successful as DDO which frankly was the game that showed F2P was actually profitable I think is not possible.
#2311#2700#2316#2500
My character Tsin'xing
Well, I guess that all depends on the campaign setting, the whole Steampunk feel and associated tropes in DDO (Eberron) is markedly different to the High Fantasy feel of FR pre Spell Plague.
#2311#2700#2316#2500
I have to say, I would never play it if that was what they sold to us. I prefer buying vanity items than game content. Every MMO I've played which has gone down that line, I've stopped playing. I like F2P games where they are actually F2P and paid content is an extra but not required. As do most people.
I prefer games that focus on real content as their payment model because it means that they actually have a reason to produce actual content and not just vanity items and lock boxes which is all we seem to get with Cryptic at the moment.
DDO is actually free to play and you can earn points in game to unlock adventure packs. As it is I haven't even completed the Free 2 Play stuff in DDO yet because even after 3 years of playing it all 4 of my characters are only Level 17
However just like this game good luck with getting anything cool quickly... you won't it will take you a lot of grinding.
When you say "As do most people" there are 2 Million Gamers who play DDO who disagree. In addition you forget that it still has a subscriber model that for like $9 a month gives every adventure pack available.
Honestly I kind of regretted getting LTS for this game after Season 7, I can't say I say the same with DDO.
I agree with you though on one thing if Cryptic tried to sell me Feature Episodes that are of the current quality and depth I'd be going elsewhere.
#2311#2700#2316#2500
This will allow the dev team to actually get back to STO and make it to be an actual star trek oriented game, not just a huge sink designed to squeeze money for the useless Neverwinter.
"To seek out new life..."
"Star Trek Philosophy of Respect and Protect All Lifeforms"
Accolade complete: Beast Master | Defeat 1000 Beasts
m
Separate dev teams
The only thing that should affect STO after NW goes live, is all those profits from STO which are obviously being spent on NW to get that up an running, should in fact be put back into STO.
What is with the idea that you have to buy some intermediary currency? Silly imo.
Also, I would pay for additional content, like SWTOR is selling their HUT cartel planet expansion. Because it simply is another part of the game that if you don't buy it, you don't have to play it, you can still play the core game. Then what happens? You get tired of the core game, break out the credit card, and buy more content. Access to New Romulus, a new ship. f2p is meant for those that don't have time to grind a hardcore game MMO that takes your life and a little bit of your money. Most of use would rather spend a little less life and pay a bit more money to move along in a game.
So sell me content, $10 for a Dominion Dreadnaught carrier - I'm there, because I like most gamers, do not have time to TRIBBLE with keys and boxes and zen and dilithium, etc. Just take my money and let me play. I grind the character, you give me the toys for more money. Works for most of us, but they have yet to put it in to practice.
All the previous games I have played, most people including me just laugh at the intermediary currency and slight of hand exchange tricks, and never buy a thing - too complicated, too much time, etc.
Warmest Regards,
What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the will to find out, which is the exact opposite. Bertrand Russell
My character Tsin'xing
As has been said many times now by several devs, the STO dev team is the largest it's been since launch, currently; and they're working on an update so large they're not calling it Season 8 anymore because it's much bigger than a typical Season.
Keep in mind that much of the work done on Neverwinter is going to provide things that will get incorporated into STO (and CO, even) in the next big codebase merge. Recall Tacofangs' awesome "all you ever needed to know about code merges you learned from Tacofangs" graphic:
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8109/8470443397_93a77be460_o.jpg
Um, thanks for that. I know all that though, been here since launch
It is what they do that defines them. Still waiting or that massive team to fix the many many legacy bugs.
I'll reserve judgement when season [Redacted] is released, however.
As per previous updates, I have now learned to not get my hopes up and expect the worst from Cryptic.
Can we call the coder mergers "mustaching" since Taco's artwork looks like a handlebar mustache? :P
So STO 2.0 :P:D:eek:
***Disenchanted***
Real Join Date: Monday, 17 May 2010
I spend a minimum of $200 a month in Zen.... you?
18 months of gold is equal to lifer sub i think.
Money sink vs 1 big payment and freedom from subs?
Which would you pick?
Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad
Yep.. got mine at launch... now I get paid 500 zen every month to play the game
Made my monies worth on the LTS before the game even went F2P.
I'm in!
And this too!
(Kinda like when Blizzard eXpanded Diablo 2 to make what the players usually called D2X)
Or is that too much of an inside joke?
My character Tsin'xing
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
My guild has a strong presence in every beta weekend. We had 26 people last time, it'll be more this time. There were a ton of people last time.
i have a question.
I am a Lifetimer and there was a Winter Beta Weekend from the 8-10 March.
So here is the Question
Where was my Key ? Or even the notification that i can access that BETA ?
now the next BETA weekend is comming up and i still have nothing.
Very very sad.
TOR has double xp weekend vs NWN beta weekend.
I'll be with the Force.
I am not touching another Cryptic game ever again. They didn't just burn some bridges, they packed them with dynamite and blew them sky high.
"There is no problem in the universe that can't be solved with a bribe, a paid assassin, or an overpowered fighter." - Chubain from Jumpgate Evolution