"Jem'Hadar Attack Ship Pets now have a higher engine speed and turn rate.
Jem'Hadar Attack Ship Pets' Antiproton Sweep power now properly obey targeting arc restrictions.
All carrier pets will be more intelligent about favoring their forward firing arc, if they are fitted with cannons."
Maybe they are listening? Im trying to not get my hopes up.
maybe, maybe not, they still gotta take care of he fighters, and make the attack ship availible for all.
I'm going to copy my KDF Science main over to Tribble and see how the Hanger Bugs work, if we can get them withone needing the Bug ship over there.
It's bad enough that not all owners of the Dreadnought can get the Hanger Bugs that only work with the carrier without owning the Bug ship but the fact that they were released broken should upset the players who were able to get them beyond belief.
The hanger bugs should be 100% working and open to all players who own the only vessle that can launch them.
I'm going to copy my KDF Science main over to Tribble and see how the Hanger Bugs work, if we can get them withone needing the Bug ship over there.
It's bad enough that not all owners of the Dreadnought can get the Hanger Bugs that only work with the carrier without owning the Bug ship but the fact that they were released broken should upset the players who were able to get them beyond belief.
The hanger bugs should be 100% working and open to all players who own the only vessle that can launch them.
GOOD! now turn that speech towards the bug reports and we may finally get this insane debacle fixed.
"Jem'Hadar Attack Ship Pets now have a higher engine speed and turn rate.
Jem'Hadar Attack Ship Pets' Antiproton Sweep power now properly obey targeting arc restrictions.
All carrier pets will be more intelligent about favoring their forward firing arc, if they are fitted with cannons."
Maybe they are listening? Im trying to not get my hopes up.
Yay ! Cryptic can listen... when it suits them.
It would be extremely easy to remove the restriction on the Attack Ship so that ALL Jem Hadar Dreadnaught owners could buy them but it is clear Cryptic dont give a damn.
Personnally, wouldnt it have been a lot more intelligent to make the hanger available to people who either have the Bug Ship and the Dreadnaught OR the Jem Hadar Escort Carrier AND the Dreadnaught.
That said, since I own both Jem Hadar ships... shouldnt I get a hanger that launches Escort Carriers for my Dreadnaught ?
Thats kinda the message Cryptic is sending by rewarding owners of exclusive ships with rewards for other exclusive ships.
Additionally, once again the point must be made that these new pets have a laundry list of abilties which is clearly imbalanced compared to any of the existing items. Cryptic should either allow these ships to be bought by every Dreadnaught owner AND introduce and equivelent for NON-Dreadnaught owners.
I.E Defiants or Mirandas, better BOPs with an equal list of abilities.
I would happily take two Defiant NPCs than the multiple wings of Scop fighters that die as soon as a warp core explosion goes off.
It seems that you can not get the hanger bugs on tribble without owning the Bug ship there has well :eek:
How are we supposed to test them to if there are any problems with them or to see if we really like them or not with the requirement that we need to have the bug ship even on the test server?
Additionally, once again the point must be made that these new pets have a laundry list of abilties which is clearly imbalanced compared to any of the existing items. Cryptic should either allow these ships to be bought by every Dreadnaught owner AND introduce and equivelent for NON-Dreadnaught owners.
I.E Defiants or Mirandas, better BOPs with an equal list of abilities.
I would happily take two Defiant NPCs than the multiple wings of Scop fighters that die as soon as a warp core explosion goes off.
actually, the B'Rotlh Birds-of-Prey have 4 abilities, but have only 1 dual cannon, a turret and quantum. the attack ship has 3 abilites but has a beam added to it along with the cannons and turret with quantum.
Hanger Jem'Hadar Attack Ship:
Polaron Dual Cannon
Polaron Beam Array
Polaron Turret
Quantum Torpeodes
Cannon Rapid Fire II
Antiproton Sweep
Beam Array Overload I
chance to initiate Ramming Speed when below 50% Health
They have the Advanced BOP out gunned and have more tricks up their sleeve:
ABOP
Dual Disruptor Cannons
Disruptor Turret
Quantum Torpedoes
Cannon Rapid Fire II
Torpedo High Yield II (The Sickness when used by all 4 at once)
Battle Cloak (Near pointless because the AI never uses it)
We need a carrier command that takes advantage of the Battle Cloak
Hanger Jem'Hadar Attack Ship:
Polaron Dual Cannon
Polaron Beam Array
Polaron Turret
Quantum Torpeodes
Cannon Rapid Fire II
Antiproton Sweep
Beam Array Overload I
chance to initiate Ramming Speed when below 50% Health
They have the Advanced BOP out gunned and have more tricks up their sleeve:
ABOP
Dual Disruptor Cannons
Disruptor Turret
Quantum Torpedoes
Cannon Rapid Fire II
Torpedo High Yield II (The Sickness when used by all 4 at once)
Battle Cloak (Near pointless because the AI never uses it)
We need a carrier command that takes advantage of the Battle Cloak
I dunno...the HY3 alone is damn powerful, and when in recall mode, the battle cloak works well, once its down through intercept, those bugs are toast.
The BOP pets are at current better dps. While the bugs have an extra weapon keep in mind that BO on a beam array with no acc mods = miss 50% of the time. Even with Doff increase to Acc the BO misses pretty consistantly.
I still love my bugs cause they can take down stuff in ESTFs with minimal effort from me. Generators and probes especially. If they get in a ram, 12-17k dmg usually but it takes them forever to go for a ram run.
The BOPs HYT2 will drop nasty dmg regularly, thats 12 quantum torpedos at once. Id say once the AI is fixed they will be on par with one another but atm the BOPs hold a slight lead. The catfish frigates, bugs, and bop's will all be pretty even.
Bugs need to be available to anyone, the fighters need to be made better at current they are total trash, only thing they are good for is launching into a HYT to take a hit for you. Sadly a lot of pets arent worth it, if you cant get the bugs, get the ultra rare scorpion fighters, or one of the faction specific advanced fighters.
The caitian carrier needs a usable frigate, i suggest making the aquarius type destroyer pet for it/any fed carrier except the vesta/armatiage/jem escort. Give it a phaser turret, phaser dual cannon, quantum torpedo, phaser array, with CRF2 and HY2, with health between the bug-bop and more shields then the bugs, with less turnrate. Its on par with the rest of what is available.
the jem attaks ships lame like hell slow like carriers lower dps then ANY other pet and a buggy AI like hell they do what they want they never attak if you want it.....
so why this pointless crying threat is for what?
to get acess for free to a overpriced pice of S....:rolleyes:
better think about that!
to buy for a very big price the most useless pet in the game, that is a real frustration.;)
I tested the new AI on the test server, the good news is my initial tests showed that the fighters now actually attack their target instead of wondering around (YAY!). The bad news is that their dps is still extremely bad, which really bums me out. They really need to have at least one type of torpedo or make them put their weapon power to max in order for them to have comparable dps. I actually really love the look of the Jem'hadar fighters, I really wish they would make them usable instead of being eyecandy lol, (It's good ship art wasted).
The issue is that the Jem'hadar fighters have traded their 3rd weapon (which is usually a torpedo) for directed energy modulation. Unfortunately, 90% of a fighters DPS comes from its torpedo. In addition, directed energy modulation is a very poor ability as it doesn't add to weapon damage and does absolutely nothing if your target is unshielded. Directed energy modulation is only useful if you have a character build that is built around shield penetration and you have the necessary stat points invested to use it's full potential. Considering that hanger fighters neither get your stats or are customizable means that DEM is next to useless on a fighter.
The issue with the Jem'hadar fighter really has to do more with fact that hanger pets energy damage is too low (as a portion of their total dps). By consequence the only pets that are ever of any real dps value are the ones that use torpedoes and especially the ones that have torpedo enhancing abilities. Inversely, pets that have no torpedoes tend to be worthless .
Unfortunately, the Jem'hadar attack ship is still unavailable to us lower class peons on the test server . My biggest beef with the attack ship is that the Jem'hadar fighters are unusable and the cost of the attack ship is prohibitively expensive. Which means no Jem'hadar themed hanger for my dreadnought :mad:.
I tested the new AI on the test server, the good news is my initial tests showed that the fighters now actually attack their target instead of wondering around (YAY!). The bad news is that their dps is still extremely bad, which really bums me out. They really need to have at least one type of torpedo or make them put their weapon power to max in order for them to have comparable dps. I actually really love the look of the Jem'hadar fighters, I really wish they would make them usable instead of being eyecandy lol, (It's good ship art wasted).
The issue is that the Jem'hadar fighters have traded their 3rd weapon (which is usually a torpedo) for directed energy modulation. Unfortunately, 90% of a fighters DPS comes from its torpedo. In addition, directed energy modulation is a very poor ability as it doesn't add to weapon damage and does absolutely nothing if your target is unshielded. Directed energy modulation is only useful if you have a character build that is built around shield penetration and you have the necessary stat points invested to use it's full potential. Considering that hanger fighters neither get your stats or are customizable means that DEM is next to useless on a fighter.
The issue with the Jem'hadar fighter really has to do more with fact that hanger pets energy damage is too low (as a portion of their total dps). By consequence the only pets that are ever of any real dps value are the ones that use torpedoes and especially the ones that have torpedo enhancing abilities. Inversely, pets that have no torpedoes tend to be worthless .
Unfortunately, the Jem'hadar attack ship is still unavailable to us lower class peons on the test server . My biggest beef with the attack ship is that the Jem'hadar fighters are unusable and the cost of the attack ship is prohibitively expensive. Which means no Jem'hadar themed hanger for my dreadnought :mad:.
Agreed,
The Fighters are pretty worthless has they are and they really need Quantum Torps or ramming speed added to them to make them effective.
The big thing that I like about the Jem Hanger Bugs is their Ramming Speed and thats makes them extremely valuable in PVP where they can draw some attention away from the Carrier.
Your Get 50-50 odds that your Bugs will just ram into something for massive damage and you can have 4 out at the same time and can relpace them in has little has 30 seconds.
Dame shame that I'll never be able to use the Hanger Bugs with my Dreadnought
If Cryptic wanted to make some more money of of the Hanger Bugs they should have added them to the Lobi store for about 200 Lobi each instead of this lame you need a Bug to buy a Bug junk that they came up with.
I unpacked my Dread on Tribble for some testing and it seems ok but I feel my Recluse just out performs it.
The Hanger Bugs are the make or Break for the Dreadnought Carrier IMO.
The Dreadnought is pretty soft and really needs hanger support that can take a few hits and hold some argo.
The Price of the Recluse is on the rise on the Exchange while the Dreadnoughts is on the decline.
BTW all those raging at the JHAS owners, stop and think, did any of them ask for the JHAS pets to be unlockable only for them? I know i didnt. Everyone ive chatted with in my fleet on both KDF and FED side have agreed the pets need to be made useable by all jem carriers JHAS owner or not.
The fighter dmg even on advanced is pathetic, so much so that the innital impression of the dreadnought was "ick". Give the Jem fighters quantum torpedos, and get rid of DEM its useless atleast give them something useful even if its just extra hitpoints.
For now guys get the advanced KDF/Fed fighters and if possible the Elite Scorpions. If the devs cant see by now how messed up this is, prolly got blind folds on again.
At this point i can only hope they really change the fighters as they arent worth being called fighters they are more on par with type 8 shuttles...., and that they make the bug pets free to use by any dreadnought.
1)Why do the devs think that those who own the best ship in the game deserve another bonus?
2)Why do those who already own this ship think they need another advantage over those who don't?
3)Bug ships, in and of themselves, are already a bonus. Giving those who already own them another advantage is a serious balancing error.
4)Down the line can we expect bonuses for owners of other ships?
5)Or is such largesse only available to those who have the bugs?
6)Why do bug owners deserve an advantage, over and above owning the ship itself, over other players?
1)Because it's a dominion themed lockbox. It's not about a "deserved bonus" it's about a fun bonus for JHAS owners.
2)Because we already own a JHAS which is technically the best escort to own. Without JHAS hangar pets we might as well stay in our JHAS and not bother picking up a dreadnaught. This move by cryptic was perhaps also done to motivate JHAS owners to pick up a dread rather than not give it a second thought. BUT using that logic they should have given JHAS pet access to everyone so everyone is motivated to pick one up.
3)No it's just giving us a reason to use the dreadnaught over our JHAS if for no other reason than from time to time.
4)Why not? It's fun to get exclusive bonuses. Galor got it with it's beams. Now JHAS gets it indirectly via the dread.
5)No. See above;Galor
6)We don't deserve an advantage. Look. You guys got your dreadnaught. It's an incredible ship. It's a tactical carrier with a standard escort weapons and boff layout. The only thing it is missing is a lt commander BO slot. The klingons have always dominated Feds in this carrier field but now we have access to a tactical carrier and elite scorps, pets that don't suck TRIBBLE. Dread owners with JHAS have access to JHAS hangars. Look above for the reasons why.
You guys need to understand the words that I am typing and stop trying to make this out to be some biased JHAS decision that Cryptic came up with. It's not a "**** you for being cheap" notion. Now, I have no doubt that the only reason I have access to JHAS pets is because I would not have gotten the dread otherwise. For everyone else you have the option of making your dread great via elite scorpions. This means that the only reason you want access to JHAS pets is because they are dominion related and are the best dominion pets. I understand that. Maybe Cryptic will cave in and throw you a bone. But I would not get my hopes up to be on even terms with JHAS owners without owning a JHAS.
If this issue did not exist not a single one of you would be complaining. A JHAS hangar probably wouldn't even cross your brains to bring up as a suggestion. You'd be getting your elite scorpions and praising the dreadnaught for having teeth and being a fun change from escort duty despite the slower turn rate, and not terribly sacrificing much DPS for using it. You'd probably complain about the sucky purple fighters for 30k dil. I would.
My point is, just stop with the conclusions of bias and conspiracy theories against everyone who did not jump on the JHAS bandwagon and just peacefully ask for the damn hangar. Why do I need to be dragged into this like I'm the bad guy so you can get what you want? Cryptic is the one that wanted to do something nice and fun and probably self interest related for me as a JHAS owner. I didn't put a gun to their heads. I'm not why you're without a JHAS hangar. So why do I gotta be dragged into this like I'm the bad guy? i.e. like the JHAS is the bad guy? Just peacefully ask for the damn hangar, and explain why you should have access to it or straight up just ask for it, and leave me the JHAS owner, others like me, and the JHAS escort out of the equation.
As long as you peacefully protest their decision then I got no reason to come to this thread. As long as you are launching an assault on my kind so to speak in an effort to try to get what you want then I have a reason to come to this thread.
The issue is that the Jem'hadar fighters have traded their 3rd weapon (which is usually a torpedo) for directed energy modulation. Unfortunately, 90% of a fighters DPS comes from its torpedo. In addition, directed energy modulation is a very poor ability as it doesn't add to weapon damage and does absolutely nothing if your target is unshielded. Directed energy modulation is only useful if you have a character build that is built around shield penetration and you have the necessary stat points invested to use it's full potential. Considering that hanger fighters neither get your stats or are customizable means that DEM is next to useless on a fighter.
The issue with the Jem'hadar fighter really has to do more with fact that hanger pets energy damage is too low (as a portion of their total dps). By consequence the only pets that are ever of any real dps value are the ones that use torpedoes and especially the ones that have torpedo enhancing abilities. Inversely, pets that have no torpedoes tend to be worthless .
Now see this is useful and helpful feedback. Reading this makes me think, yeah they need to either improve the Jem fighters to not sucking hard or give everyone access to JHAS hangars and perhaps do some adjusting and maybe turn the blues into advanced, advanced into elite(for JHAS owners), and come up with another one for the regular blue version.
You'll have to forgive my desire to have a JHAS perk with the dread remain in tact in whatever form, because the death of said perk means the death of all possible future perks for owning something, I suspect, after this debacle here.
If they start the precedence of doing this "need to own a specific ship to get a hangar version of it" dealy I might be inclined to it, but ONLY if it is related to either C-Store ships, this way, sales would be higher and it gets a good venue to try and fix the carriers UI, and what I mean by FIX is simple.
1). Give us a markup or meter showing our deployed pets so we know when to launch more without having to look around us.
2). A special carrier interface, something in the form of an RTS system, where we have a large radar like system in place of our minimaps then being able to send fighters to different places like we do with our boffs, just instead of boffs we can send the fighters in the direction we want.
3). (pipe dream really but it might be cool) the ability to name the squadrons we put out, this would work well with option (2 and 1)
those are just off the top of my head, I may just move it to a new thread.
Well anyway, the precedence of the "need a ship to buy its hangar equivilent" is simply a dangerous thing, if not moderated and made sense of it can do some minor but visible damage to cryptics credibility in terms of product quality.
so far they managed to keep most of their mojo without having been turned into a PWE clone, and I applaud PWE for their new business stance.
so I really believe they should just make the hangar versions of the JHAS availible to all those with the dreadnought, but give the JHAS owners a big discount on the Lobi space and ground upgrades, and the minigun.
You'll have to forgive my desire to have a JHAS perk with the dread remain in tact in whatever form, because the death of said perk means the death of all possible future perks for owning something, I suspect, after this debacle here.
short-sightedness of the month award here! making actual hangar pets cost 400+ million EC is NOT THE WAY TO GO.
making it so that owning a bug ship makes them free of cost is.
that way u have a really nice perk, being a bug owner (as if that isn't enough perk in itself)
Now see this is useful and helpful feedback. Reading this makes me think, yeah they need to either improve the Jem fighters to not sucking hard or give everyone access to JHAS hangars and perhaps do some adjusting and maybe turn the blues into advanced, advanced into elite(for JHAS owners), and come up with another one for the regular blue version.
You'll have to forgive my desire to have a JHAS perk with the dread remain in tact in whatever form, because the death of said perk means the death of all possible future perks for owning something, I suspect, after this debacle here.
I guess you missed my earlier post in this topic that pretty much said give the owners of the Bug ship the option to craft Ultra Rare Versions of the Hanger Bugs but give everyone access to the Very Rare versions of the Hanger Bugs.
just out of curiosity:
How do you see the requirement of having to own the Lockbox Bug ship and the Dreadnought Carrier just to be able to buy hanger Bugs that can only be used with the Dreadnought Carrier has a perk to owning the Bug ship?
It seems to me to be a lot of hoop jumpping for an item that should have just been made available to the Dreadnought Carrier owners from the start seeing has they can only be used with the carrier and do nothing for the Bug ship itself.
This does not = Perk to the bug ship owners in the least, what it does = is a lot more lockbox keys sold if Bug owners do not already have the 800 Lobi or enough EC for the Dreadnought.
Another question:
The Bug ship has been available twice and I know the 1st time Lobi did not exists but were Lobi around the 2nd time?
short-sightedness of the month award here! making actual hangar pets cost 400+ million EC is NOT THE WAY TO GO.
making it so that owning a bug ship makes them free of cost is.
that way u have a really nice perk, being a bug owner (as if that isn't enough perk in itself)
I agree with this.
It would have been a nice perk to Bug owners if they were able to get the Hanger Bugs for Free while the players did not own the Bug ship would have to pay for them.
We all know why Cryptic did this, it was done just to build more demand for the Bug ship to be offered again has well has giving players that already have the Bug a reason to need Lobi for the Dread if their low on EC
The only reason the JHAS pets are even in the game so that JHAS owners don't fork over a ton of DPS just to fly another Jem Hadar ship. If you take that away from those JHAS pilots, you may as well refund their 800 lobi on a character of their choosing.
@errab, I do agree that it is a money thing as well, clearly. The JHAS will be offered again shortly and that makes the whole debate over pets moot.
You know Cryptic has Jumped the Proverbial Shark when they introduced Tractor Pulling to Star Trek Online!
The only reason the JHAS pets are even in the game so that JHAS owners don't fork over a ton of DPS just to fly another Jem Hadar ship. If you take that away from those JHAS pilots, you may as well refund their 800 lobi on a character of their choosing.
@errab, I do agree that it is a money thing as well, clearly. The JHAS will be offered again shortly and that makes the whole debate over pets moot.
no, no it doesnt make the whole debate moot, it in fact would not change all that much.
simply put the jem'hadar attack ship will be even rarer when they offer it again, it will not have the same probability chance as it did the second time. why is this? quite simply put they want to keep the rarity of said ship as rare as possible.
and the other point to this is simple, if they love the DPS of the JHAS and don't want to sacrifice it, then they wont even fly the dreadnought all that much, even with the JHAS-H it wouldn't be even close, they'd still be forking over a ton of DPS.
Im sorry but the, "Only reason the bug pets exsist is so people get out of their bug ships" thing is TRIBBLE. Lets say the bug pets didnt exsist, i would have then opened my carrier on a diff toon and played it any how.
Those who think that the JHAS is some uber ship that is so good youd never fly anything else must have a TRIBBLE loose. I have a bug ship and its not all i play, infact i much rather play with a Defiant or something else that actually belongs in starfleet, and guess what it does just fine.
1 tac console doesnt make massive differance guys. They put in the restriction for god knows what reason on the bug pets. There is NO good reason for locking out the pets to all the other carriers there just isnt.
If you feel so entitled that you believe that after getting a jem bug you should then get even further bonuses ontop of that you got an ultra rare ship, come on man really? Its a game. You want a "fair" perk, give Ultra rare version of them to the bug owners, and make the ultra rare version available for T5 science with all the other pets at the starbase, or 50 lobi per hanger.
All their restriction is doing is causing grief, something everyone could use less of.
It bothers me that so many bug owners transparently want to maintain the meaningless exclusivity of their little Mary Sue ship.
It bothers me that Cryptic apparently will not even consider account-wide unlocks to make these things even marginally sensible.
It bothers me that so much fuss and bother is being made over a ship that belongs to a minor enemy faction instead of having special ships for the Federation and KDF.
I find it strange that no Cryptic rep has chimmed in on this issue to defuse the rage a bit or to explain how they see needing own 2 ships to get an item that can only be used on one of the 2 needed ships is a perk of owning the 2nd needed ship that the item does nothing for
If this goes unchallenged it will just set a very bad precedent and in the future more demand manipulation of game items and unreasonable item requirements will just become the norm for STO.
This is not Normal requirement; granted, it would be different if the item in question was a new type of special console that could be used with both of the required ship but it's an item that can only be used with one of the two ships.
If I owned the Bug ship I would not see this has a perk for my Bug because it does nothing for the Bug itself.
Hey guys! has an added bonus to owning the most powerful Escort in the game we are giving you the opportunity to buy Hanger versions of your escort!
That's right Hanger versions of your powerful escort!
But wait there's more!
If you act now we'll let you buy a completely different ship that your new Hanger versions escorts can only be used with!
So let's Recap:
You get your Escort! (Which you most likely will never stop flying)
The Hanger Version of your Escort (for an additional Charge per unit and you'll want 2)
A different ship that your new Hanger Escorts can only be used with! (for a much bigger additional charge)
To Quote Elim Garak " I'd call that a Bargain" :rolleyes:
Pretty much this. It is too late to jump off the train now......
normaly I'd agree with you, and on the fact of it beinbg a $ issue, however it is an illogical buisness strategy and a very faulty one at best, in the very least it boosts sales for the jem hadar attack ship should it be presented soon again by a very very small margin. as the fact the JHDC is in the hands of well under 10% of the playerbase, this would only see a likely increase in sales of maybe 5.8%. so targeting the dreadnought owners is not even a good strategy for this.
at the best, they are testing the waters for future setups like the one we have now, which I can only think of being ok with if it only attributed to the C-Store ships. even then its not the best setup.
I'm still sticking with the "oh we don't have anymore time and the deadline is tomorrow, hmmm.....oh I got it, make it exlusive to only those who have one of the rarest and most expensive ships in game, and need to have the dreadnought to function, that way there would be less bug reports about it, not to mention its rarity can keep it in check," thought pattern
Comments
maybe, maybe not, they still gotta take care of he fighters, and make the attack ship availible for all.
It's bad enough that not all owners of the Dreadnought can get the Hanger Bugs that only work with the carrier without owning the Bug ship but the fact that they were released broken should upset the players who were able to get them beyond belief.
The hanger bugs should be 100% working and open to all players who own the only vessle that can launch them.
GOOD! now turn that speech towards the bug reports and we may finally get this insane debacle fixed.
Yay ! Cryptic can listen... when it suits them.
It would be extremely easy to remove the restriction on the Attack Ship so that ALL Jem Hadar Dreadnaught owners could buy them but it is clear Cryptic dont give a damn.
Personnally, wouldnt it have been a lot more intelligent to make the hanger available to people who either have the Bug Ship and the Dreadnaught OR the Jem Hadar Escort Carrier AND the Dreadnaught.
That said, since I own both Jem Hadar ships... shouldnt I get a hanger that launches Escort Carriers for my Dreadnaught ?
Thats kinda the message Cryptic is sending by rewarding owners of exclusive ships with rewards for other exclusive ships.
Additionally, once again the point must be made that these new pets have a laundry list of abilties which is clearly imbalanced compared to any of the existing items. Cryptic should either allow these ships to be bought by every Dreadnaught owner AND introduce and equivelent for NON-Dreadnaught owners.
I.E Defiants or Mirandas, better BOPs with an equal list of abilities.
I would happily take two Defiant NPCs than the multiple wings of Scop fighters that die as soon as a warp core explosion goes off.
How are we supposed to test them to if there are any problems with them or to see if we really like them or not with the requirement that we need to have the bug ship even on the test server?
actually, the B'Rotlh Birds-of-Prey have 4 abilities, but have only 1 dual cannon, a turret and quantum. the attack ship has 3 abilites but has a beam added to it along with the cannons and turret with quantum.
Hanger Jem'Hadar Attack Ship:
Polaron Dual Cannon
Polaron Beam Array
Polaron Turret
Quantum Torpeodes
Cannon Rapid Fire II
Antiproton Sweep
Beam Array Overload I
chance to initiate Ramming Speed when below 50% Health
They have the Advanced BOP out gunned and have more tricks up their sleeve:
ABOP
Dual Disruptor Cannons
Disruptor Turret
Quantum Torpedoes
Cannon Rapid Fire II
Torpedo High Yield II (The Sickness when used by all 4 at once)
Battle Cloak (Near pointless because the AI never uses it)
We need a carrier command that takes advantage of the Battle Cloak
I dunno...the HY3 alone is damn powerful, and when in recall mode, the battle cloak works well, once its down through intercept, those bugs are toast.
I still love my bugs cause they can take down stuff in ESTFs with minimal effort from me. Generators and probes especially. If they get in a ram, 12-17k dmg usually but it takes them forever to go for a ram run.
The BOPs HYT2 will drop nasty dmg regularly, thats 12 quantum torpedos at once. Id say once the AI is fixed they will be on par with one another but atm the BOPs hold a slight lead. The catfish frigates, bugs, and bop's will all be pretty even.
Bugs need to be available to anyone, the fighters need to be made better at current they are total trash, only thing they are good for is launching into a HYT to take a hit for you. Sadly a lot of pets arent worth it, if you cant get the bugs, get the ultra rare scorpion fighters, or one of the faction specific advanced fighters.
The caitian carrier needs a usable frigate, i suggest making the aquarius type destroyer pet for it/any fed carrier except the vesta/armatiage/jem escort. Give it a phaser turret, phaser dual cannon, quantum torpedo, phaser array, with CRF2 and HY2, with health between the bug-bop and more shields then the bugs, with less turnrate. Its on par with the rest of what is available.
The bug ship is widely considered one of the best, if not the best, ship in the game.
The Jemmie carrier has terrible pets out of the box.
However, there are better pets available but only to those who already have the best ship in the game on a specific character.
Why do the devs think that those who own the best ship in the game deserve another bonus?
Why do those who already own this ship think they need another advantage over those who don't?
Bug ships, in and of themselves, are already a bonus. Giving those who already own them another advantage is a serious balancing error.
Down the line can we expect bonuses for owners of other ships?
Or is such largesse only available to those who have the bugs?
Why do bug owners deserve an advantage, over and above owning the ship itself, over other players?
Quoted for truth
so why this pointless crying threat is for what?
to get acess for free to a overpriced pice of S....:rolleyes:
better think about that!
to buy for a very big price the most useless pet in the game, that is a real frustration.;)
The issue is that the Jem'hadar fighters have traded their 3rd weapon (which is usually a torpedo) for directed energy modulation. Unfortunately, 90% of a fighters DPS comes from its torpedo. In addition, directed energy modulation is a very poor ability as it doesn't add to weapon damage and does absolutely nothing if your target is unshielded. Directed energy modulation is only useful if you have a character build that is built around shield penetration and you have the necessary stat points invested to use it's full potential. Considering that hanger fighters neither get your stats or are customizable means that DEM is next to useless on a fighter.
The issue with the Jem'hadar fighter really has to do more with fact that hanger pets energy damage is too low (as a portion of their total dps). By consequence the only pets that are ever of any real dps value are the ones that use torpedoes and especially the ones that have torpedo enhancing abilities. Inversely, pets that have no torpedoes tend to be worthless
Unfortunately, the Jem'hadar attack ship is still unavailable to us lower class peons on the test server
Agreed,
The Fighters are pretty worthless has they are and they really need Quantum Torps or ramming speed added to them to make them effective.
The big thing that I like about the Jem Hanger Bugs is their Ramming Speed and thats makes them extremely valuable in PVP where they can draw some attention away from the Carrier.
Your Get 50-50 odds that your Bugs will just ram into something for massive damage and you can have 4 out at the same time and can relpace them in has little has 30 seconds.
Dame shame that I'll never be able to use the Hanger Bugs with my Dreadnought
If Cryptic wanted to make some more money of of the Hanger Bugs they should have added them to the Lobi store for about 200 Lobi each instead of this lame you need a Bug to buy a Bug junk that they came up with.
I unpacked my Dread on Tribble for some testing and it seems ok but I feel my Recluse just out performs it.
The Hanger Bugs are the make or Break for the Dreadnought Carrier IMO.
The Dreadnought is pretty soft and really needs hanger support that can take a few hits and hold some argo.
The Price of the Recluse is on the rise on the Exchange while the Dreadnoughts is on the decline.
The fighter dmg even on advanced is pathetic, so much so that the innital impression of the dreadnought was "ick". Give the Jem fighters quantum torpedos, and get rid of DEM its useless atleast give them something useful even if its just extra hitpoints.
For now guys get the advanced KDF/Fed fighters and if possible the Elite Scorpions. If the devs cant see by now how messed up this is, prolly got blind folds on again.
At this point i can only hope they really change the fighters as they arent worth being called fighters they are more on par with type 8 shuttles...., and that they make the bug pets free to use by any dreadnought.
1)Because it's a dominion themed lockbox. It's not about a "deserved bonus" it's about a fun bonus for JHAS owners.
2)Because we already own a JHAS which is technically the best escort to own. Without JHAS hangar pets we might as well stay in our JHAS and not bother picking up a dreadnaught. This move by cryptic was perhaps also done to motivate JHAS owners to pick up a dread rather than not give it a second thought. BUT using that logic they should have given JHAS pet access to everyone so everyone is motivated to pick one up.
3)No it's just giving us a reason to use the dreadnaught over our JHAS if for no other reason than from time to time.
4)Why not? It's fun to get exclusive bonuses. Galor got it with it's beams. Now JHAS gets it indirectly via the dread.
5)No. See above;Galor
6)We don't deserve an advantage. Look. You guys got your dreadnaught. It's an incredible ship. It's a tactical carrier with a standard escort weapons and boff layout. The only thing it is missing is a lt commander BO slot. The klingons have always dominated Feds in this carrier field but now we have access to a tactical carrier and elite scorps, pets that don't suck TRIBBLE. Dread owners with JHAS have access to JHAS hangars. Look above for the reasons why.
You guys need to understand the words that I am typing and stop trying to make this out to be some biased JHAS decision that Cryptic came up with. It's not a "**** you for being cheap" notion. Now, I have no doubt that the only reason I have access to JHAS pets is because I would not have gotten the dread otherwise. For everyone else you have the option of making your dread great via elite scorpions. This means that the only reason you want access to JHAS pets is because they are dominion related and are the best dominion pets. I understand that. Maybe Cryptic will cave in and throw you a bone. But I would not get my hopes up to be on even terms with JHAS owners without owning a JHAS.
If this issue did not exist not a single one of you would be complaining. A JHAS hangar probably wouldn't even cross your brains to bring up as a suggestion. You'd be getting your elite scorpions and praising the dreadnaught for having teeth and being a fun change from escort duty despite the slower turn rate, and not terribly sacrificing much DPS for using it. You'd probably complain about the sucky purple fighters for 30k dil. I would.
My point is, just stop with the conclusions of bias and conspiracy theories against everyone who did not jump on the JHAS bandwagon and just peacefully ask for the damn hangar. Why do I need to be dragged into this like I'm the bad guy so you can get what you want? Cryptic is the one that wanted to do something nice and fun and probably self interest related for me as a JHAS owner. I didn't put a gun to their heads. I'm not why you're without a JHAS hangar. So why do I gotta be dragged into this like I'm the bad guy? i.e. like the JHAS is the bad guy? Just peacefully ask for the damn hangar, and explain why you should have access to it or straight up just ask for it, and leave me the JHAS owner, others like me, and the JHAS escort out of the equation.
As long as you peacefully protest their decision then I got no reason to come to this thread. As long as you are launching an assault on my kind so to speak in an effort to try to get what you want then I have a reason to come to this thread.
Now see this is useful and helpful feedback. Reading this makes me think, yeah they need to either improve the Jem fighters to not sucking hard or give everyone access to JHAS hangars and perhaps do some adjusting and maybe turn the blues into advanced, advanced into elite(for JHAS owners), and come up with another one for the regular blue version.
You'll have to forgive my desire to have a JHAS perk with the dread remain in tact in whatever form, because the death of said perk means the death of all possible future perks for owning something, I suspect, after this debacle here.
1). Give us a markup or meter showing our deployed pets so we know when to launch more without having to look around us.
2). A special carrier interface, something in the form of an RTS system, where we have a large radar like system in place of our minimaps then being able to send fighters to different places like we do with our boffs, just instead of boffs we can send the fighters in the direction we want.
3). (pipe dream really but it might be cool) the ability to name the squadrons we put out, this would work well with option (2 and 1)
those are just off the top of my head, I may just move it to a new thread.
Well anyway, the precedence of the "need a ship to buy its hangar equivilent" is simply a dangerous thing, if not moderated and made sense of it can do some minor but visible damage to cryptics credibility in terms of product quality.
so far they managed to keep most of their mojo without having been turned into a PWE clone, and I applaud PWE for their new business stance.
so I really believe they should just make the hangar versions of the JHAS availible to all those with the dreadnought, but give the JHAS owners a big discount on the Lobi space and ground upgrades, and the minigun.
short-sightedness of the month award here! making actual hangar pets cost 400+ million EC is NOT THE WAY TO GO.
making it so that owning a bug ship makes them free of cost is.
that way u have a really nice perk, being a bug owner (as if that isn't enough perk in itself)
Sending a report because you think its unfair is not going to do any good but get you a warning from Cryptic for abusing the bug report.
I guess you missed my earlier post in this topic that pretty much said give the owners of the Bug ship the option to craft Ultra Rare Versions of the Hanger Bugs but give everyone access to the Very Rare versions of the Hanger Bugs.
just out of curiosity:
How do you see the requirement of having to own the Lockbox Bug ship and the Dreadnought Carrier just to be able to buy hanger Bugs that can only be used with the Dreadnought Carrier has a perk to owning the Bug ship?
It seems to me to be a lot of hoop jumpping for an item that should have just been made available to the Dreadnought Carrier owners from the start seeing has they can only be used with the carrier and do nothing for the Bug ship itself.
This does not = Perk to the bug ship owners in the least, what it does = is a lot more lockbox keys sold if Bug owners do not already have the 800 Lobi or enough EC for the Dreadnought.
Another question:
The Bug ship has been available twice and I know the 1st time Lobi did not exists but were Lobi around the 2nd time?
I agree with this.
It would have been a nice perk to Bug owners if they were able to get the Hanger Bugs for Free while the players did not own the Bug ship would have to pay for them.
We all know why Cryptic did this, it was done just to build more demand for the Bug ship to be offered again has well has giving players that already have the Bug a reason to need Lobi for the Dread if their low on EC
@errab, I do agree that it is a money thing as well, clearly. The JHAS will be offered again shortly and that makes the whole debate over pets moot.
no, no it doesnt make the whole debate moot, it in fact would not change all that much.
simply put the jem'hadar attack ship will be even rarer when they offer it again, it will not have the same probability chance as it did the second time. why is this? quite simply put they want to keep the rarity of said ship as rare as possible.
and the other point to this is simple, if they love the DPS of the JHAS and don't want to sacrifice it, then they wont even fly the dreadnought all that much, even with the JHAS-H it wouldn't be even close, they'd still be forking over a ton of DPS.
Those who think that the JHAS is some uber ship that is so good youd never fly anything else must have a TRIBBLE loose. I have a bug ship and its not all i play, infact i much rather play with a Defiant or something else that actually belongs in starfleet, and guess what it does just fine.
1 tac console doesnt make massive differance guys. They put in the restriction for god knows what reason on the bug pets. There is NO good reason for locking out the pets to all the other carriers there just isnt.
If you feel so entitled that you believe that after getting a jem bug you should then get even further bonuses ontop of that you got an ultra rare ship, come on man really? Its a game. You want a "fair" perk, give Ultra rare version of them to the bug owners, and make the ultra rare version available for T5 science with all the other pets at the starbase, or 50 lobi per hanger.
All their restriction is doing is causing grief, something everyone could use less of.
It bothers me that Cryptic apparently will not even consider account-wide unlocks to make these things even marginally sensible.
It bothers me that so much fuss and bother is being made over a ship that belongs to a minor enemy faction instead of having special ships for the Federation and KDF.
Not that it matters.
If this goes unchallenged it will just set a very bad precedent and in the future more demand manipulation of game items and unreasonable item requirements will just become the norm for STO.
This is not Normal requirement; granted, it would be different if the item in question was a new type of special console that could be used with both of the required ship but it's an item that can only be used with one of the two ships.
If I owned the Bug ship I would not see this has a perk for my Bug because it does nothing for the Bug itself.
Hey guys! has an added bonus to owning the most powerful Escort in the game we are giving you the opportunity to buy Hanger versions of your escort!
That's right Hanger versions of your powerful escort!
But wait there's more!
If you act now we'll let you buy a completely different ship that your new Hanger versions escorts can only be used with!
So let's Recap:
You get your Escort! (Which you most likely will never stop flying)
The Hanger Version of your Escort (for an additional Charge per unit and you'll want 2)
A different ship that your new Hanger Escorts can only be used with! (for a much bigger additional charge)
To Quote Elim Garak " I'd call that a Bargain" :rolleyes:
Pretty much this. It is too late to jump off the train now......
normaly I'd agree with you, and on the fact of it beinbg a $ issue, however it is an illogical buisness strategy and a very faulty one at best, in the very least it boosts sales for the jem hadar attack ship should it be presented soon again by a very very small margin. as the fact the JHDC is in the hands of well under 10% of the playerbase, this would only see a likely increase in sales of maybe 5.8%. so targeting the dreadnought owners is not even a good strategy for this.
at the best, they are testing the waters for future setups like the one we have now, which I can only think of being ok with if it only attributed to the C-Store ships. even then its not the best setup.
I'm still sticking with the "oh we don't have anymore time and the deadline is tomorrow, hmmm.....oh I got it, make it exlusive to only those who have one of the rarest and most expensive ships in game, and need to have the dreadnought to function, that way there would be less bug reports about it, not to mention its rarity can keep it in check," thought pattern