Again, another person rags on someone giving advice or asking for help. Make sure you know what you are talking about before you open your mouth. My GPU was going got 90-100 Celsius. Using his fix got it down to an average of 75-78. Riddle me that genius boy. Stop belittling everyones suggestion just because you are not having the problem Einstein.
you are correct make Shir you know what you are talking about be for you try and tell. people that do not know any thing about graphics card. that sto has a bug that .makes you card red line.
you will have then spread all acors the net that sto is melting video cards which is not the case. the newer card are made for maximum operating temperature is 105C . my bud works ofor msi . i seen his gx2 get to temps of 120c and 130c. . he xplaned to me that the cards were made to run this hot stock seating from msi. so if you over clocking your card. which there is no need to over clock an msi card. cause that are over cloaked form mis. the gx2 and her sister cards the 280 and so on get this hot be cause there is 2 gpu in such a confined space. if you are so worry ed bout temps just go to a water cooled system . and you do not have to worry about it. you will want to check with of ever made your card. msi ,bfg, and so on to see what they have set fore your cards max operating temperature is.
my MSI gx2 is set for 125c.when i play sto it will stay at 20c . but thats with a water cooled system
but its max load tep is set to run at 125c
My cpu AMD 6400 + with core temp was going 80 c the 2 core's .
My cpu aint that great no more still dont get how that game can stress my system like that i have no probs running crysis all max video setting .
I am shure it is the last patch that hase some thing to do with it .
its not sto at all or any patch just use a tool like ati tool and watch the 3d spinning cube a while this replicates sto
I can confirm in my case and hardware setup using the command /maxfps 60 (for example) works
works in the way of limiting the no. of FPS being drawn when no graphics are being drawn too
to all those who said you have a TRIBBLE piece of graphics card and not the software - EAT ME !
What is it you people don't understand? Setting that limit is not FIXING STO to run right and therefore not overheat your card. Using that command LIMITS THE SOFTWARE TO "DUMB IT DOWN" so it won't overheat your poorly heated card. You're not FIXING anything. You're scaling it back from what it normally is to compensate. Like an engine that can't handle a normal RPM, so you put a rev limiter on it. It's not the limiters fault the motor couldn't handle normal RPMs.
You're putting the buggy before the horse. Anyway, I'm tired of people who think they know what they're talking about and, in reality, have such a twisted view that they might as well be calling the sky pink and honestly believing it.
I truly pitty you. To live in such ignorance and wallow in it day after day is such a waste of a mind. I'm done wasting my time on you noobs.
The only thing I have turned off in the game are shadows everything else is set to max and looking at my card heat its running at about 65-70 C
so I dont know if this is effecting newer cards, something to do with the coding or maybe something with the game code and nvidia drivers.
I use a program called EVGA precision I dont know if this works with all Nvidia cards.
but idle its running about about 41C core clock is set at 650mhz I played another online game can't remember what it was but the game used to crash out and reset my pc 2-5-20 mins into the game.
This may sound stupid but when I dropped my cards core clock to 550mhz the game was stable and never crashed.
If someone wanted to give this program a go and alter some of there card settings see if it makes a difference and report back I would try it myself but I dont have any problems at the moment getting the game to run and run stable.
OMFG!
You lowered performance and have no idea why it could have made it more stable! You have no idea why older cards are having less problems. Newer cards are faster.. faster means more heat... more heat + insufficient cooling = instability.
Christ, were some of you people dropped as an infant? It's commonsense.
Strangeness! I was having constant crashes on ground missions, unless I turned on half resolution, or underclocked my GPU to litterally half it's normal clock speed. I took it out, made sure it was clean, checked all the other fans, was all good. Then I tried moving it one step down from my CPU, and right against my PhysX card. I figured it wouldn't be any better, but might as well try. It helped. Then, with some log information from GPU-z, I noticed that my memory temperature was the one getting the highest, so rather than lower the clock speed on the GPU, I lowered it on the video memory by about 10%. Problem solved.
Here's where I think we might be having a problem with STO that other games don't have: Memory bandwidth. With all the special post-processing effects it has, most of which use a lot of buffer accesses, it's possible that the heat issues are coming from the memory getting exerted more heavily than other games. Some are big on GPU power, others on memory pixel-pushing, and if I recall, most of these effects are very pixel-pushing intensive. For example, using lower screen resolutions, but cranking up your special effects, polygons and textures will work well on a powerful GPU with a low bandwidth memory bus, but not well on a slower GPU, with a larger bus. High resolution and high anti-aliasing requires a huge memory bandwidth, and cards with big ones can handle it better. Something about texture/polygon fill rates vs. pixel fill rates. I'm sure one of you experts out there can verify this, but it seems to fit.
Strangeness! I was having constant crashes on ground missions, unless I turned on half resolution, or underclocked my GPU to litterally half it's normal clock speed. I took it out, made sure it was clean, checked all the other fans, was all good. Then I tried moving it one step down from my CPU, and right against my PhysX card. I figured it wouldn't be any better, but might as well try. It helped. Then, with some log information from GPU-z, I noticed that my memory temperature was the one getting the highest, so rather than lower the clock speed on the GPU, I lowered it on the video memory by about 10%. Problem solved.
Here's where I think we might be having a problem with STO that other games don't have: Memory bandwidth. With all the special post-processing effects it has, most of which use a lot of buffer accesses, it's possible that the heat issues are coming from the memory getting exerted more heavily than other games. Some are big on GPU power, others on memory pixel-pushing, and if I recall, most of these effects are very pixel-pushing intensive. For example, using lower screen resolutions, but cranking up your special effects, polygons and textures will work well on a powerful GPU with a low bandwidth memory bus, but not well on a slower GPU, with a larger bus. High resolution and high anti-aliasing requires a huge memory bandwidth, and cards with big ones can handle it better. Something about texture/polygon fill rates vs. pixel fill rates. I'm sure one of you experts out there can verify this, but it seems to fit.
The problem with this post is that most people will start to read it and their eyes will glaze over and get that "deer in the headlight" look and none of it will make sense so they will just go back to blaming STO.
All techno-babble aside... the short story is.. People are overheating!
The overheating issue is somthing to do with the game engine really hitting the GPU hard for no apparent reason.. my card runs at 85 to 90 playing this game yet with crysis and other similar games it runs at 75 to 80 max.
So the question is why does this game hit the GPU so hard when the graphics are not all that hot.
Turning off post processing solves it for me but others have to do different things.
My case is not dusty at all the cooling works fine on more graphic intensive games so it all points to somthing up with this game.
Now with the last weeks mid week patch they had actually fixed the issue, i could run everything maxed out and my card would happily sit at 78 and not really move from that. With this weekends patch they have reverted the fix and now my temps are gonig sky high again so off went post processing effects and its fine.
So to all the people screaming saying its the persons fault because they dont air condition their pc please stop..
The overheating issue is somthing to do with the game engine really hitting the GPU hard for no apparent reason.. my card runs at 85 to 90 playing this game yet with crysis and other similar games it runs at 75 to 80 max.
So the question is why does this game hit the GPU so hard when the graphics are not all that hot.
Turning off post processing solves it for me but others have to do different things.
My case is not dusty at all the cooling works fine on more graphic intensive games so it all points to somthing up with this game.
Now with the last weeks mid week patch they had actually fixed the issue, i could run everything maxed out and my card would happily sit at 78 and not really move from that. With this weekends patch they have reverted the fix and now my temps are gonig sky high again so off went post processing effects and its fine.
So to all the people screaming saying its the persons fault because they dont air condition their pc please stop..
no parent reson really?
people what the bling bling in space. so the game is going to pull as much power as it can out of thos cards for the bling bling
all new cards are made to run hot 80c is not hot for the newer cards . thos who have old cards yes thats hot and may not want to run the game at the highest settings.
For those that can't understand why they can play some "graphics intensive" games with no problem but this one causes overheating, here's the deal:
A computer has a lot of different components: CPU, GPU, memory, etc... Each of those components may have a lot of subcomponents. (e.g. GPU has geometry shaders, vertex shaders, pixel shaders, memory, maybe a physics coprocessor, etc...).
When you run a particular game at its highest framerate, it is very unlikely that it will run all of those components at their highest load. In fact, many may not be used at all. Instead, you will drive ONE (sub)component at 100%, and the others will be bottlenecked by that one component and just run as fast as needed to keep the pipeline fed.
Which component is the bottleneck, and how hard the other components have to run, is going to vary from game to game. Maybe a game does a lot of CPU computations every frame, and the GPU doesn't get used much at all. Maybe you have a lot of small triangles with simple shading, so the vertex shader gets used a lot but the pixel shaders don't. Or maybe you have big triangles with lots of textures and glowie effects, so the vertex shaders don't get used a lot but the pixel shaders do.
Whichever is the case, assuming the driver writers know what they're doing, the unused/less used components are going to draw only a fraction of their max power levels, and therefore run at a fraction of their max temperature.
But sometimes, you're going to find a game that uses a lot of these components, and does so in a way that they're pretty load balanced. So its got one component running at 100%, and a bunch of other components running near 100%. And *boom* suddenly the PC that ran fine with all those other games that didn't push every component hard starts overheating.
It's not the game developers fault for using every bit of power available on your system. Its your fault for not cooling it right.
Yea I will request for a refund on this game, after playing the beta and almost burning my comp, and no I don't believe a comp should be at 100% for a long period of time. It';s like saying I should take my 5.0 Mustang and be in redline RPM for a long period of time, it will mess up the car. The game is a failure your programmers failed on correcting this. And I have a comp that can play this well, and I JUST build it and with performace fans and my CPU is at 60C and my GPU is at 110C, yea eff that.
Sorry guy's I'm not buying this issue. I have written programs for DirectX for almost 6 years now and I have never seen DX software that was capable of causing hardware damage. In fact I can think of several games, Flight Sim X for example, and applications, RenderMonkey comes to mind, that use as much if not more card power then STO for far longer periods of time. I also reject the notion that hardware be it a GPU, CPU, or hard drive was not designed to run near 100%. You don't think guys developing shaders don't run their graphics cards near 100% all day long? What about database servers or developers (although I would argue this is poor system design from a server prospective)? I think this issue comes down to a couple of things:
Hardware installation & cleaning: If you installed the card yourself are you sure it was done properly? Is hot air coming off of a different fan right on to your GPU? Do you have adequate cooling? When was the last time you cleaned your power supply and inside of your case?
Graphics Settings: Are you overclocking your system a bit too much? Do you have your graphics set beyond what your system can handle? Maybe your system just isn't designed to handle running STO set to max. Do you have the latest graphics card drivers? Maybe the drivers you have came with a bug.
Bottom line: I have been running STO on my laptop(8600m) now for almost a week including almost 10 hours straight yesterday without any heating issues. I don't have my graphics set to max but they are set to pretty darn good:-) Personally, I wouldn't mess with the FPS because you have no idea how that might effect code that Cryptic has written that is FPS dependent. If you are having problems tone down the graphics settings. You might also try upgrading drivers because its possible that the graphics drivers are bugged.
Yea I will request for a refund on this game, after playing the beta and almost burning my comp, and no I don't believe a comp should be at 100% for a long period of time. It';s like saying I should take my 5.0 Mustang and be in redline RPM for a long period of time, it will mess up the car. The game is a failure your programmers failed on correcting this. And I have a comp that can play this well, and I JUST build it and with performace fans and my CPU is at 60C and my GPU is at 110C, yea eff that.
:rolleyes: You know, STO isn't even in release yet. It's still beta. The last series of patches did a good number of optimizations for GPU load. Do you make all of your gaming purchases/subscriptions based mostly on beta?
As for 100% GPU usage, you are correct. You don't want to be at 100% perpetually because there's no need to with some system tweaking and upgrades. For STO, I have no problems with GPU usage with my vertical sync enabled. But I do have a more expensive video card. If yours is struggling to make 60+ FPS average, then turn down your graphic settings. If they're all the way down and your video card is still struggling, then you obviously didn't head the minimum requirements or the community's advice all over the forums ever since closed beta.
But your comparison to redlining an internal combustion engine with peaking a processor at 100% is a fallacy (apples and oranges). GPUs, CPUs, and other processors are just fine being peaked at 100% for extended periods of time provided you have adequate cooling. Companies running servers do this all of the time for years before a serious failure. However, if not adequately cooled, your processor(s) are going to overheat. That's your fault, not Cryptic's.
Yea I will request for a refund on this game, after playing the beta and almost burning my comp, and no I don't believe a comp should be at 100% for a long period of time. It';s like saying I should take my 5.0 Mustang and be in redline RPM for a long period of time, it will mess up the car. The game is a failure your programmers failed on correcting this. And I have a comp that can play this well, and I JUST build it and with performace fans and my CPU is at 60C and my GPU is at 110C, yea eff that.
Thats what servers and developer computers do all day long, work near 100% for 16+ hours a day. Most computers only have 3 or 4 moving parts (hard drive and fans) whereas your Mustang has thousands. Futhermore, computers ARE designed to work at 100% your Mustang is not.
Why don't you give us more information about your setup so we can see if we can solve your problem.
Thats what servers and developer computers do all day long, work near 100% for 16+ hours a day. Most computers only have 3 or 4 moving parts (hard drive and fans) whereas your Mustang has thousands. Futhermore, computers ARE designed to work at 100% your Mustang is not.
Why don't you give us more information about your setup so we can see if we can solve your problem.
Ok ill play, I have a 8800GTS that has a Zalman fan on it, and a 5200+ duel core 2.2 GHZ CPU with also a Zalman fan on it, I use 10 brand new fans, pointing the right way it should. And I don't play the game on max settings. But when I do play STO, my software shoot warnings at me telling me "DANGER WILL ROBINSON DANGER!!!!" And i imminently shut down STO
A game can NEVER, EVER kill your card. I have no idea where this idea is comming from that if you type /showfps in the game and it says 0, your card is in danger.
NO GAME - EVER can kill a card.
TWO things and TWO things ONLY will kill a card:
1a)Improper cooling (due to clogged fans and heat syncs) or bad fans. This also includes improper case cooling
1b) 95% of the cards on the market will SHUT OFF before the memory or GPU gets to the point of being damaged. Although repeated use at high temps will shorten the life of the card
2) You don't plug it in properly and turn on the computer and blow it out or somehow hold it wrong and static fries it.
There are many other moronic ways to kill a card, but no game, no software can kill it (short of software deliberately overwriting the card's bios/nvram)
all limiting the fps in the game does is put a limit on the load the game puts on your card, and this can help some cards that are not properly cooled.
But whomever started the thing that if the game says 000 fps you are in trouble is dead wrong. Mine shows 0.000 and fraps shows over 145fps at MAX game settings in 2560x1600 and I'm running 2 Nvidia 295s for Quad SLI
A game can NEVER, EVER kill your card. I have no idea where this idea is comming from that if you type /showfps in the game and it says 0, your card is in danger.
NO GAME - EVER can kill a card.
TWO things and TWO things ONLY will kill a card:
1a)Improper cooling (due to clogged fans and heat syncs) or bad fans. This also includes improper case cooling
1b) 95% of the cards on the market will SHUT OFF before the memory or GPU gets to the point of being damaged. Although repeated use at high temps will shorten the life of the card
2) You don't plug it in properly and turn on the computer and blow it out or somehow hold it wrong and static fries it.
There are many other moronic ways to kill a card, but no game, no software can kill it (short of software deliberately overwriting the card's bios/nvram)
all limiting the fps in the game does is put a limit on the load the game puts on your card, and this can help some cards that are not properly cooled.
But whomever started the thing that if the game says 000 fps you are in trouble is dead wrong. Mine shows 0.000 and fraps shows over 145fps at MAX game settings in 2560x1600 and I'm running 2 Nvidia 295s for Quad SLI
You know you can't tell these guys anything. They're experts and there's no way it's their machine. The're perfect and STO is at fault. If this is how these people act toward something they don't understand in a simple game, I would hate to see how they are in real life.
Yea I will request for a refund on this game, after playing the beta and almost burning my comp, and no I don't believe a comp should be at 100% for a long period of time. It';s like saying I should take my 5.0 Mustang and be in redline RPM for a long period of time, it will mess up the car. The game is a failure your programmers failed on correcting this. And I have a comp that can play this well, and I JUST build it and with performace fans and my CPU is at 60C and my GPU is at 110C, yea eff that.
you are so dead wrong. ANY comp out there should and is made for the CPU and GPU to run at MAX 100% load 24/7/365. If a system can't it is because 1) the owner has not taken proper care of the machine by regularly cleaning the fans, heat syncs, and air pathways, 2) the machine was flawed in it's design
This isn't like a car LOL.
If you just built a machine YOURSELF and your CPU is 60c and GPU at 100c, you did one CRAPPY job building that rig, or you bought some CRAPPY parts.
I can run my system at 100% everything, and nothing ever even gets CLOSE to dangerous - especially with this game. CPU never over 50c and GPUs between 40-60c
If I were you I would rebuild my machine, making sure you put proper paste between the cpu and the heat sync, and if you are OCing your system, then don't OC it. Or OC it with bigger and better fans or possibly water cool it.
But any system that is not OCed, and kept in proper order will NEVER, EVER overheat from this game.
You know you can't tell these guys anything. They're experts and there's no way it's their machine. The're perfect and STO is at fault. If this is how these people act toward something they don't understand in a simple game, I would hate to see how they are in real life.
Yep. I'm a computer engineer. I started out as a tech, then network engineer.. then worked for companies designing chips, cards, and mobos.
Like a said, it's NEVER EVER a software's fault for burning out ANYTHING in your system. Even one of those torture test benchmarks.
It's always a few things:
Owner error in not maintaining their machine
Owner building a maching thinking they know what they are doing, built it wrong or use cheap/faulty parts
Namebrand machine that is improperly built
Lastly, just plain faulty HW
you are so dead wrong. ANY comp out there should and is made for the CPU and GPU to run at MAX 100% load 24/7/365. If a system can't it is because 1) the owner has not taken proper care of the machine by regularly cleaning the fans, heat syncs, and air pathways, 2) the machine was flawed in it's design
This isn't like a car LOL.
If you just built a machine YOURSELF and your CPU is 60c and GPU at 100c, you did one CRAPPY job building that rig, or you bought some CRAPPY parts.
I can run my system at 100% everything, and nothing ever even gets CLOSE to dangerous - especially with this game. CPU never over 50c and GPUs between 40-60c
If I were you I would rebuild my machine, making sure you put proper paste between the cpu and the heat sync, and if you are OCing your system, then don't OC it. Or OC it with bigger and better fans or possibly water cool it.
But any system that is not OCed, and kept in proper order will NEVER, EVER overheat from this game.
I used the car as a metaphor,sorry people can't understand that, and I use only the good parts, if you read what I posted above you will see that, and sorry I may not be as rich as you and get the water cooling system, or the tri athlon mega dominating your face CPU, and the Apocalypse your face GPU with the Supermans breath cooling system hooked to that, but I know for a fact my system is well put together, with the proper precision and research I can spend.
Yep. I'm a computer engineer. I started out as a tech, then network engineer.. then worked for companies designing chips, cards, and mobos.
Like a said, it's NEVER EVER a software's fault for burning out ANYTHING in your system. Even one of those torture test benchmarks.
It's always a few things:
Owner error in not maintaining their machine
Owner building a maching thinking they know what they are doing, built it wrong or use cheap/faulty parts
Namebrand machine that is improperly built
Lastly, just plain faulty HW
Agreed. I have 20 years working with MS based machines and am currently an NA. I put all my case fans on idle, and set my GPU fan to auto. After 10 minutes of running Furmark, I had reached a mean of 84C and 60% fan duty cycle.
Then, leaving the case fans on idle, I manually set the GPU fan to 100% duty cycle (leaving Furmark still running) and within minutes it dropped to an even 65C.
Running STO with all airflow maxed, windowed mode, all settings cranked, I run at 54C.
30C cooler than running Furmark with airflow MINIMIZED. By taking trend readings in steps I am able to prove that airflow directly affects the temperatures.
That right there goes to show that some of you guys have no clue what you're doing. Just because you figured out how to take the access panel off and remove an old video card and replace it with a new one doesn't mean you "know computers". It means you can perform a monkey simple task of module replacement. Impressive.
but I know for a fact my system is well put together, with the proper precision and research I can spend.
You can say it all you want till you're blue in the face, but the facts that present themselves are to the contrary if you're overheating. You can tell me all day long that the sky is green but I know better. Just because you say it doesn't mean it's so. Especially with evidence against you.
People don't seem to understand some basic facts about the operation of computers here, so let me put this real simply.
Software uses computational cycles on the computer when executed. If the software is intensive, it takes more computational cycles to be executed; all computer parts have a computational limit. The is nothing a piece of software can do, just be being run, that can physically overload hardware. Software is not a physical object, it is a logical construct, and doesn't physically exist, therefore it cannot physically alter hardware in any way just by being executed (in other words, anything short of overclocking the hardware, which STO obviously doesn't do). The most software can do is run your hardware at the aforementioned computational limit, putting your hardware at "full load"; there is no magical means by which one piece of programming can harm a computer whilst others do not, as all that differs from the hardware perspective is the size of the program in memory, and the number of computational cycles needed for execution. I hope this point has been sufficiently stated and reiterated.
So, with that in mind, here's a breakdown of what you can and can't blame Cryptic for:
You can blame Cryptic for software that puts hardware under a heavy load, insofar as you can blame them for making a high-end, system-intensive game (which should have been the understanding upon purchase).
You cannot blame Cryptic if your hardware is incapable of taking said heavy load. Yes, under certain circumstances, STO can computationally max out hardware, which most games do not, but hardware is designed to run in such a state for prolonged periods. CPUs and GPUs are designed to run at 100% load if the component is good, well maintained, and not subject to imprudent levels of overclocking; as such STO does nothing that a given piece of hardware is not designed to do.
To reiterate yet again, software can do nothing but consume computational cycles, and that, in itself, cannot harm hardware no matter how much it maxes that hardware out, because in a proper setting, hardware is designed for such function. In fact, there would be no point in making a processor which couldn't operate at its computational capacity (even though half the Netburst chips couldn't, but I digress), because then you wouldn't be getting the advertised level of performance for said hardware.
I used the car as a metaphor,sorry people can't understand that, and I use only the good parts, if you read what I posted above you will see that, and sorry I may not be as rich as you and get the water cooling system, or the tri athlon mega dominating your face CPU, and the Apocalypse your face GPU with the Supermans breath cooling system hooked to that, but I know for a fact my system is well put together, with the proper precision and research I can spend.
You don't have to spend a bundle to build a well-cooled system. You don't need watercooling, and you don't need the high-end components either. But you do need quality components with either reference or better coolers (no video cards with el-cheapo coolers or passive coolers if you plan to game on them).
And if you want to run the game at high graphics settings then you need to shell out for high-mid to top-end gaming video cards.
As for taking your word for a "well put together" PC... If it was overheating with STO (even the buggy beta client), then it's still inadequate cooling for your PC, no matter what you say. It may run cooler for games that are more polished or don't have high PC requirements like STO. This is because your other games are probably not peaking your GPU, CPU, etc.
You cannot blame Cryptic if your hardware is incapable of taking said heavy load. Yes, under certain circumstances, STO can computationally max out hardware, which most games do not, but hardware is designed to run in such a state for prolonged periods. CPUs and GPUs are designed to run at 100% load if the component is good, well maintained, and not subject to imprudent levels of overclocking; as such STO does nothing that a given piece of hardware is not designed to do.
Ok ill play, I have a 8800GTS that has a Zalman fan on it, and a 5200+ duel core 2.2 GHZ CPU with also a Zalman fan on it, I use 10 brand new fans, pointing the right way it should. And I don't play the game on max settings. But when I do play STO, my software shoot warnings at me telling me "DANGER WILL ROBINSON DANGER!!!!" And i imminently shut down STO
What drivers, monitoring software, OS, and DirectX build? Also does it spike in a particular area of the game? Have you tried fine tuning the graphics options to see if its a particular option like post processing for example that is causing the heat up?
EDIT: I reread your original post and I noticed you mentioned a CPU heat spike. This seems really really odd because the game is definately GPU bound for me even on the aforementioned laptop that only has a T7700 Core 2. Unless I'm in heavy combat or loading I'm not really getting strong CPU usage compared to Flight Sim or SQL Server for example. What antivirus are you using and does the problem seem worse after patching?
Yep. I think the real problem here is that some of you want to play STO but you don't want to have to build or purchase a system that can handle it. That's not STO's problem and you're in denial. If you wanna play, you gotta pay.
Just because you bought something 2 years ago, doesn't mean that it's capable of handling a front-line software without issues. Over the life of a component there are many factors that help determine the overall life of it and many of those things are directly affected by YOU the consumer/builder.
I don't care why you think you're overheating and it doesn't matter anyway. If you are, then you are. Plain and simple. It needs to be fixed. Because you think you know what you're doing doesn't mean you didn't miss something. It's completely presumptuous and arrogant to then say you know all and people with real world experience and training are ignorant. Instead of trying to bold face tell us you're a god of IT, why don't you instead ask for help. Show us some pictures of your tower, where you keep it, the inside of it, the specs on the fans and their CFM and RPM.
People like me come here to led our personal and professional experience to others who don't have that. All we get for that is people calling us noobs and trying to suggest that WE'RE the ones that don't know what we're talking about. This forum is mostly here for peer to peer support. Not just for Devs. Devs don't have time to address every single persons issues and that's why we come here to help. If you keep acting like this, then maybe those who can help will decide not to and then what? Where are you going to get help for your problem then?
EDIT: I have no problem helping people here for free. Otherwise, outside of here, I charge by the hour.
My GTX 285 sits at 77 degrees in an anomoly cluster in Sector Space...I don't overclock, my case is completely dust free, I have three 80mm fans and a 120 mm fan creating an upward airflow through the grill on the top of my case...the game is a resource ***** Cryptic just admit it and fix it.
My GTX 285 sits at 77 degrees in an anomoly cluster in Sector Space...I don't overclock, my case is completely dust free, I have three 80mm fans and a 120 mm fan creating an upward airflow through the grill on the top of my case...the game is a resource ***** Cryptic just admit it and fix it.
No one is denying that STO is a resource hog, and while it does need addressing, it is not Cryptic's fault if your computer is not capable or running intensive software. That said, you do realize 77C is a perfectly acceptable temp for a GPU, right?
My GTX 285 sits at 77 degrees in an anomoly cluster in Sector Space...I don't overclock, my case is completely dust free, I have three 80mm fans and a 120 mm fan creating an upward airflow through the grill on the top of my case...the game is a resource ***** Cryptic just admit it and fix it.
OMG a GTX 285 and you're complaining about 77C? LOL. Cryptic can't fix your lack of knowledge.
My GTX 285 sits at 77 degrees in an anomoly cluster in Sector Space...I don't overclock, my case is completely dust free, I have three 80mm fans and a 120 mm fan creating an upward airflow through the grill on the top of my case...the game is a resource ***** Cryptic just admit it and fix it.
oo yes devs . admit you have dune an outstanding job on this game.i love games that put my rig to work.
use that qwade cor power. and both gpu.
they have made an excellent piece of soft wear. 77 deagers is not hot . that is just perfect tep for that card
Comments
you are correct make Shir you know what you are talking about be for you try and tell. people that do not know any thing about graphics card. that sto has a bug that .makes you card red line.
you will have then spread all acors the net that sto is melting video cards which is not the case. the newer card are made for maximum operating temperature is 105C . my bud works ofor msi . i seen his gx2 get to temps of 120c and 130c. . he xplaned to me that the cards were made to run this hot stock seating from msi. so if you over clocking your card. which there is no need to over clock an msi card. cause that are over cloaked form mis. the gx2 and her sister cards the 280 and so on get this hot be cause there is 2 gpu in such a confined space. if you are so worry ed bout temps just go to a water cooled system . and you do not have to worry about it. you will want to check with of ever made your card. msi ,bfg, and so on to see what they have set fore your cards max operating temperature is.
my MSI gx2 is set for 125c.when i play sto it will stay at 20c . but thats with a water cooled system
but its max load tep is set to run at 125c
its not sto at all or any patch just use a tool like ati tool and watch the 3d spinning cube a while this replicates sto
What is it you people don't understand? Setting that limit is not FIXING STO to run right and therefore not overheat your card. Using that command LIMITS THE SOFTWARE TO "DUMB IT DOWN" so it won't overheat your poorly heated card. You're not FIXING anything. You're scaling it back from what it normally is to compensate. Like an engine that can't handle a normal RPM, so you put a rev limiter on it. It's not the limiters fault the motor couldn't handle normal RPMs.
You're putting the buggy before the horse. Anyway, I'm tired of people who think they know what they're talking about and, in reality, have such a twisted view that they might as well be calling the sky pink and honestly believing it.
I truly pitty you. To live in such ignorance and wallow in it day after day is such a waste of a mind. I'm done wasting my time on you noobs.
OMFG!
You lowered performance and have no idea why it could have made it more stable! You have no idea why older cards are having less problems. Newer cards are faster.. faster means more heat... more heat + insufficient cooling = instability.
Christ, were some of you people dropped as an infant? It's commonsense.
Here's where I think we might be having a problem with STO that other games don't have: Memory bandwidth. With all the special post-processing effects it has, most of which use a lot of buffer accesses, it's possible that the heat issues are coming from the memory getting exerted more heavily than other games. Some are big on GPU power, others on memory pixel-pushing, and if I recall, most of these effects are very pixel-pushing intensive. For example, using lower screen resolutions, but cranking up your special effects, polygons and textures will work well on a powerful GPU with a low bandwidth memory bus, but not well on a slower GPU, with a larger bus. High resolution and high anti-aliasing requires a huge memory bandwidth, and cards with big ones can handle it better. Something about texture/polygon fill rates vs. pixel fill rates. I'm sure one of you experts out there can verify this, but it seems to fit.
The problem with this post is that most people will start to read it and their eyes will glaze over and get that "deer in the headlight" look and none of it will make sense so they will just go back to blaming STO.
All techno-babble aside... the short story is.. People are overheating!
So the question is why does this game hit the GPU so hard when the graphics are not all that hot.
Turning off post processing solves it for me but others have to do different things.
My case is not dusty at all the cooling works fine on more graphic intensive games so it all points to somthing up with this game.
Now with the last weeks mid week patch they had actually fixed the issue, i could run everything maxed out and my card would happily sit at 78 and not really move from that. With this weekends patch they have reverted the fix and now my temps are gonig sky high again so off went post processing effects and its fine.
So to all the people screaming saying its the persons fault because they dont air condition their pc please stop..
You sir. got it right.
people what the bling bling in space. so the game is going to pull as much power as it can out of thos cards for the bling bling
all new cards are made to run hot 80c is not hot for the newer cards . thos who have old cards yes thats hot and may not want to run the game at the highest settings.
A computer has a lot of different components: CPU, GPU, memory, etc... Each of those components may have a lot of subcomponents. (e.g. GPU has geometry shaders, vertex shaders, pixel shaders, memory, maybe a physics coprocessor, etc...).
When you run a particular game at its highest framerate, it is very unlikely that it will run all of those components at their highest load. In fact, many may not be used at all. Instead, you will drive ONE (sub)component at 100%, and the others will be bottlenecked by that one component and just run as fast as needed to keep the pipeline fed.
Which component is the bottleneck, and how hard the other components have to run, is going to vary from game to game. Maybe a game does a lot of CPU computations every frame, and the GPU doesn't get used much at all. Maybe you have a lot of small triangles with simple shading, so the vertex shader gets used a lot but the pixel shaders don't. Or maybe you have big triangles with lots of textures and glowie effects, so the vertex shaders don't get used a lot but the pixel shaders do.
Whichever is the case, assuming the driver writers know what they're doing, the unused/less used components are going to draw only a fraction of their max power levels, and therefore run at a fraction of their max temperature.
But sometimes, you're going to find a game that uses a lot of these components, and does so in a way that they're pretty load balanced. So its got one component running at 100%, and a bunch of other components running near 100%. And *boom* suddenly the PC that ran fine with all those other games that didn't push every component hard starts overheating.
It's not the game developers fault for using every bit of power available on your system. Its your fault for not cooling it right.
Hardware installation & cleaning: If you installed the card yourself are you sure it was done properly? Is hot air coming off of a different fan right on to your GPU? Do you have adequate cooling? When was the last time you cleaned your power supply and inside of your case?
Graphics Settings: Are you overclocking your system a bit too much? Do you have your graphics set beyond what your system can handle? Maybe your system just isn't designed to handle running STO set to max. Do you have the latest graphics card drivers? Maybe the drivers you have came with a bug.
Bottom line: I have been running STO on my laptop(8600m) now for almost a week including almost 10 hours straight yesterday without any heating issues. I don't have my graphics set to max but they are set to pretty darn good:-) Personally, I wouldn't mess with the FPS because you have no idea how that might effect code that Cryptic has written that is FPS dependent. If you are having problems tone down the graphics settings. You might also try upgrading drivers because its possible that the graphics drivers are bugged.
I would also challenge anyone who thinks that I'm wrong on this to post over on Microsoft's DirectX developer forums http://forums.xna.com/forums/ or Nvidia developer forums http://developer.nvidia.com/forums/index.php asking about the potential for software to cause hardware damage.
:rolleyes: You know, STO isn't even in release yet. It's still beta. The last series of patches did a good number of optimizations for GPU load. Do you make all of your gaming purchases/subscriptions based mostly on beta?
As for 100% GPU usage, you are correct. You don't want to be at 100% perpetually because there's no need to with some system tweaking and upgrades. For STO, I have no problems with GPU usage with my vertical sync enabled. But I do have a more expensive video card. If yours is struggling to make 60+ FPS average, then turn down your graphic settings. If they're all the way down and your video card is still struggling, then you obviously didn't head the minimum requirements or the community's advice all over the forums ever since closed beta.
But your comparison to redlining an internal combustion engine with peaking a processor at 100% is a fallacy (apples and oranges). GPUs, CPUs, and other processors are just fine being peaked at 100% for extended periods of time provided you have adequate cooling. Companies running servers do this all of the time for years before a serious failure. However, if not adequately cooled, your processor(s) are going to overheat. That's your fault, not Cryptic's.
Thats what servers and developer computers do all day long, work near 100% for 16+ hours a day. Most computers only have 3 or 4 moving parts (hard drive and fans) whereas your Mustang has thousands. Futhermore, computers ARE designed to work at 100% your Mustang is not.
Why don't you give us more information about your setup so we can see if we can solve your problem.
Ok ill play, I have a 8800GTS that has a Zalman fan on it, and a 5200+ duel core 2.2 GHZ CPU with also a Zalman fan on it, I use 10 brand new fans, pointing the right way it should. And I don't play the game on max settings. But when I do play STO, my software shoot warnings at me telling me "DANGER WILL ROBINSON DANGER!!!!" And i imminently shut down STO
A game can NEVER, EVER kill your card. I have no idea where this idea is comming from that if you type /showfps in the game and it says 0, your card is in danger.
NO GAME - EVER can kill a card.
TWO things and TWO things ONLY will kill a card:
1a)Improper cooling (due to clogged fans and heat syncs) or bad fans. This also includes improper case cooling
1b) 95% of the cards on the market will SHUT OFF before the memory or GPU gets to the point of being damaged. Although repeated use at high temps will shorten the life of the card
2) You don't plug it in properly and turn on the computer and blow it out or somehow hold it wrong and static fries it.
There are many other moronic ways to kill a card, but no game, no software can kill it (short of software deliberately overwriting the card's bios/nvram)
all limiting the fps in the game does is put a limit on the load the game puts on your card, and this can help some cards that are not properly cooled.
But whomever started the thing that if the game says 000 fps you are in trouble is dead wrong. Mine shows 0.000 and fraps shows over 145fps at MAX game settings in 2560x1600 and I'm running 2 Nvidia 295s for Quad SLI
You know you can't tell these guys anything. They're experts and there's no way it's their machine. The're perfect and STO is at fault. If this is how these people act toward something they don't understand in a simple game, I would hate to see how they are in real life.
you are so dead wrong. ANY comp out there should and is made for the CPU and GPU to run at MAX 100% load 24/7/365. If a system can't it is because 1) the owner has not taken proper care of the machine by regularly cleaning the fans, heat syncs, and air pathways, 2) the machine was flawed in it's design
This isn't like a car LOL.
If you just built a machine YOURSELF and your CPU is 60c and GPU at 100c, you did one CRAPPY job building that rig, or you bought some CRAPPY parts.
I can run my system at 100% everything, and nothing ever even gets CLOSE to dangerous - especially with this game. CPU never over 50c and GPUs between 40-60c
If I were you I would rebuild my machine, making sure you put proper paste between the cpu and the heat sync, and if you are OCing your system, then don't OC it. Or OC it with bigger and better fans or possibly water cool it.
But any system that is not OCed, and kept in proper order will NEVER, EVER overheat from this game.
Yep. I'm a computer engineer. I started out as a tech, then network engineer.. then worked for companies designing chips, cards, and mobos.
Like a said, it's NEVER EVER a software's fault for burning out ANYTHING in your system. Even one of those torture test benchmarks.
It's always a few things:
Owner error in not maintaining their machine
Owner building a maching thinking they know what they are doing, built it wrong or use cheap/faulty parts
Namebrand machine that is improperly built
Lastly, just plain faulty HW
I used the car as a metaphor,sorry people can't understand that, and I use only the good parts, if you read what I posted above you will see that, and sorry I may not be as rich as you and get the water cooling system, or the tri athlon mega dominating your face CPU, and the Apocalypse your face GPU with the Supermans breath cooling system hooked to that, but I know for a fact my system is well put together, with the proper precision and research I can spend.
Agreed. I have 20 years working with MS based machines and am currently an NA. I put all my case fans on idle, and set my GPU fan to auto. After 10 minutes of running Furmark, I had reached a mean of 84C and 60% fan duty cycle.
Then, leaving the case fans on idle, I manually set the GPU fan to 100% duty cycle (leaving Furmark still running) and within minutes it dropped to an even 65C.
Running STO with all airflow maxed, windowed mode, all settings cranked, I run at 54C.
30C cooler than running Furmark with airflow MINIMIZED. By taking trend readings in steps I am able to prove that airflow directly affects the temperatures.
That right there goes to show that some of you guys have no clue what you're doing. Just because you figured out how to take the access panel off and remove an old video card and replace it with a new one doesn't mean you "know computers". It means you can perform a monkey simple task of module replacement. Impressive.
You can say it all you want till you're blue in the face, but the facts that present themselves are to the contrary if you're overheating. You can tell me all day long that the sky is green but I know better. Just because you say it doesn't mean it's so. Especially with evidence against you.
Software uses computational cycles on the computer when executed. If the software is intensive, it takes more computational cycles to be executed; all computer parts have a computational limit. The is nothing a piece of software can do, just be being run, that can physically overload hardware. Software is not a physical object, it is a logical construct, and doesn't physically exist, therefore it cannot physically alter hardware in any way just by being executed (in other words, anything short of overclocking the hardware, which STO obviously doesn't do). The most software can do is run your hardware at the aforementioned computational limit, putting your hardware at "full load"; there is no magical means by which one piece of programming can harm a computer whilst others do not, as all that differs from the hardware perspective is the size of the program in memory, and the number of computational cycles needed for execution. I hope this point has been sufficiently stated and reiterated.
So, with that in mind, here's a breakdown of what you can and can't blame Cryptic for:
You can blame Cryptic for software that puts hardware under a heavy load, insofar as you can blame them for making a high-end, system-intensive game (which should have been the understanding upon purchase).
You cannot blame Cryptic if your hardware is incapable of taking said heavy load. Yes, under certain circumstances, STO can computationally max out hardware, which most games do not, but hardware is designed to run in such a state for prolonged periods. CPUs and GPUs are designed to run at 100% load if the component is good, well maintained, and not subject to imprudent levels of overclocking; as such STO does nothing that a given piece of hardware is not designed to do.
To reiterate yet again, software can do nothing but consume computational cycles, and that, in itself, cannot harm hardware no matter how much it maxes that hardware out, because in a proper setting, hardware is designed for such function. In fact, there would be no point in making a processor which couldn't operate at its computational capacity (even though half the Netburst chips couldn't, but I digress), because then you wouldn't be getting the advertised level of performance for said hardware.
You don't have to spend a bundle to build a well-cooled system. You don't need watercooling, and you don't need the high-end components either. But you do need quality components with either reference or better coolers (no video cards with el-cheapo coolers or passive coolers if you plan to game on them).
And if you want to run the game at high graphics settings then you need to shell out for high-mid to top-end gaming video cards.
As for taking your word for a "well put together" PC... If it was overheating with STO (even the buggy beta client), then it's still inadequate cooling for your PC, no matter what you say. It may run cooler for games that are more polished or don't have high PC requirements like STO. This is because your other games are probably not peaking your GPU, CPU, etc.
QFT.
What drivers, monitoring software, OS, and DirectX build? Also does it spike in a particular area of the game? Have you tried fine tuning the graphics options to see if its a particular option like post processing for example that is causing the heat up?
EDIT: I reread your original post and I noticed you mentioned a CPU heat spike. This seems really really odd because the game is definately GPU bound for me even on the aforementioned laptop that only has a T7700 Core 2. Unless I'm in heavy combat or loading I'm not really getting strong CPU usage compared to Flight Sim or SQL Server for example. What antivirus are you using and does the problem seem worse after patching?
Just because you bought something 2 years ago, doesn't mean that it's capable of handling a front-line software without issues. Over the life of a component there are many factors that help determine the overall life of it and many of those things are directly affected by YOU the consumer/builder.
I don't care why you think you're overheating and it doesn't matter anyway. If you are, then you are. Plain and simple. It needs to be fixed. Because you think you know what you're doing doesn't mean you didn't miss something. It's completely presumptuous and arrogant to then say you know all and people with real world experience and training are ignorant. Instead of trying to bold face tell us you're a god of IT, why don't you instead ask for help. Show us some pictures of your tower, where you keep it, the inside of it, the specs on the fans and their CFM and RPM.
People like me come here to led our personal and professional experience to others who don't have that. All we get for that is people calling us noobs and trying to suggest that WE'RE the ones that don't know what we're talking about. This forum is mostly here for peer to peer support. Not just for Devs. Devs don't have time to address every single persons issues and that's why we come here to help. If you keep acting like this, then maybe those who can help will decide not to and then what? Where are you going to get help for your problem then?
EDIT: I have no problem helping people here for free. Otherwise, outside of here, I charge by the hour.
No one is denying that STO is a resource hog, and while it does need addressing, it is not Cryptic's fault if your computer is not capable or running intensive software. That said, you do realize 77C is a perfectly acceptable temp for a GPU, right?
OMG a GTX 285 and you're complaining about 77C? LOL. Cryptic can't fix your lack of knowledge.
oo yes devs . admit you have dune an outstanding job on this game.i love games that put my rig to work.
use that qwade cor power. and both gpu.
they have made an excellent piece of soft wear. 77 deagers is not hot . that is just perfect tep for that card