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The point in Detached Warp Nacelles I hear you ask?
kayajay
Member Posts: 1,990 Arc User
Now, maybe I'm in the minority to not find Detached Warp Nacelles cool, or to believe the "science" behind them, but I personally believe that the whole point of Disco creating them, is to use more CGI.
I can't think of any other reason for pieces of a hull to be floating away from the rest of the ship, (especially the Janeway, with the saucer floating free) and you are not telling me that there's some sort of beam that could hit those gaps...Tachyon, Antithoron, Radion, Polaron, Antichroniton that could disrupt that weird matter and send the pieces flying off.
If I were the bad guy and saw that design, my entire purpose in an attack would be to do exactly that and you're not telling me that someone wouldn't succeed. It's a vulnerability, with a Producer Driven reason behind it.
In my humble opinion.
I can't think of any other reason for pieces of a hull to be floating away from the rest of the ship, (especially the Janeway, with the saucer floating free) and you are not telling me that there's some sort of beam that could hit those gaps...Tachyon, Antithoron, Radion, Polaron, Antichroniton that could disrupt that weird matter and send the pieces flying off.
If I were the bad guy and saw that design, my entire purpose in an attack would be to do exactly that and you're not telling me that someone wouldn't succeed. It's a vulnerability, with a Producer Driven reason behind it.
In my humble opinion.
Post edited by baddmoonrizin on
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Anyway, I agree with both posts. I do sincerely believe that most of what constitutes New Trek is completely producer driven. From dialogue, to characters, to effects...
However, I also think it's a way of showing a new technology, like Meimeitoo said...
Think about the TOS/TMP Enterprise and tell me you don't think the nacelle pylons wouldn't/shouldn't be a target for any enemy with brains...
If you're looking to the future though...that's how the Borg got things done. "Strangely generalized in design", with no specific anything. The key would have been to abandon traditional saucers and nacelles, built cubes or spheres and the interfaces to be without consoles whatsoever and driven by the mind.
I tell you...it's the Producers poking their oars in and then the fans left to scramble to justify why it works.
If it's some form of exotic matter or power that we don't know about which keeps the stuff together, who's to say that metal and duranium can do a better job? It's not like we can make detailed calculations about this stuff. A fully fact-based debate isn't really possible here.
To illustrate why: it's basically like saying that a phaser pistol is a dumb idea because 'obviously' lead bullets would do a better job than some sort of ray gun that can be sabotaged by destroying its power cell.
Tech in sci fi is rather speculative in nature, with some key components, technicalities and requirements specifically mentioned. You can't really say that such a technology wouldn't have any advantage just because it is dependent on that specific something - as that is true of anything you might come up with.
[3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
I mean think about it. In the 29th Century we have almost organic shaped ships that can jump through TIME. How do you show something more advanced than that? They decided that having detatched parts that still function as one complete unit was the way to go. And logically... it kinda makes sense as the next technological step. I think the only thing more advanced would be bioships, but that opens up a whole new can of worms.
Yeah, most likely. It may be a producer decision, but one that clearly has a narrative purpose.
It's not that much different from ST: Enterprise characters not having any artificial life forms amongst the crew, or the transporter being a new thing. You just need to show in your series that things have evolved.
[3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
I assumed that "on sticks", was because at the time, they COULDN'T be against the hull. Radiation or heat spillage etc, so they had to be away from the main hull. Otherwise, why would Zefram's nacelles have had to extend out, instead of just having one big engine at the back?
And absolutely go back to bullets! A TR-116 would handle the Borg and if Star Trek keeps using Star Wars-esque bolts (which I hate), instead of their creation of sustained beams (which I love and pine for), then at least that would be more interesting.
Instead of being a new thing, I just wish it hadn't been a thing at all. No transporter, no shuttle pods and just the ship landing whenever it needed to. Am I the only one to love seeing a ship land? They wanted to each week in TOS, but it was too expensive, to that's the reason they invented the transporter for the show.
Landing 400+ crew city-ships doesn't make much sense. That's what shuttles, fighters, gigs, runabouts and transporters are for. These are space navy, and space navy uses small craft for landing just like water navy doesn't beach the main craft.
For example in a Generations scenario they could all use their badges to quickly transport to the saucer section, then disengage whatever holds the ship together, and have a lot more time to get to a safe distance than the crew of the Enterprise D had. Depending on how it's setup they might even be able to move the nacelles over to the saucer while they escape, further minimizing the damage.
In a universe of sentient AI, it would be the greatest honor to fight a battle in a ship that wasn't just a fighting platform. Just one vehicle entity that was the summation of a family or brotherhood would be a formidable opponent.
It is always easier to be critical of things we are unable to comprehend at the time of observation. One's chosen perspective of existence can be unconsciously restrictive. Star Trek has always been about "what if things were" or "how could things be"...better - in a world with strong desires to remain the same. One's imagination can serve to change their perspective and the world, but it can also be one's prison.
I don't know... USS Melchiott can be a fierce fighter... and makes awesome cinnamon rolls.
They probably could, but the issue of Dilithium would come up. I mean they have Slipstream capability as well, but again resources.
Its not enough to be able to DO something. They also have to visually look different. Otherwise... why design anything more than the basic NX class? If all the tech is super advanced on the inside... then why bother designing new ships in the first place?
Again its probably to make it visually distinct and advanced compared to what we've already seen from the 29th Century.
That is probably whatever method Voyager tried to use that did it. The Voth Transwarp Drives don't have that problem. Its possible that 32nd Century Starfleet made something similar to that to achieve Transwarp speeds.
Yet we break the Warp 10 barrier on a regular basis in game, and it is classified as Transwarp. Honestly the way I see Warp speeds is that anything below 10 is like Subsonic and anything above 10 is Supersonic. No different than breaking the Sound Barrier. Its just faster.
And yet as pointed out, we do it all the time - and I dunno about you, but none of my captains have turned into lizards. Well, one is a lizard, but he's a Gorn, that doesn't count.
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The point remains though. Voth Transwarp seems to function differently from Borg Transwarp. And if we go back to Star Trek 3, the Excelsior was supposed to be able to outpace the Enterprise. So its possible that anything Warp 10 and above is considered Transwarp velocities. Again, just like how its possible to break the Sound Barrier today.
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That's a good point. Because based on everything we know, there still needs to be EPS Conduits feeding power to the nacelles. Which means that in the 32nd Century they must have figured out how to transfer power remotely from the warp core, or developed some other system.
Except in Threshold, they used the term Transwarp, and used it multiple times so it clearly wasn't a production mistake.
that was every single instance the word transwarp was mentioned - clearly the Voyager scriptwriter for that episode considered warp and transwarp the same thing when they did it.
So what does this tell us? Well, it personally tells me that either A: The scriptwriter had absolutely no idea what they were doing (And given how the entire episode turned out, I'm going for this being the more likely option.) B: 'Transwarp' is just a catch-all term in-universe for any method of travel faster than the currently established warp scale, even if one of those faster methods is still technically plain warp.
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The verbal description that was in the writers bible takes it into the twilight zone a bit by stating that not only CAN you be anywhere else in the universe at warp ten, but for that instant you ARE EVERYWHERE in the universe simultaneously when you hit warp ten.
Transwarp is much slower than warp ten, so is slipstream and everything else shown in the various series except maybe Q's teleport. The fact that it is so much faster than warp 9.975 and it all fits within the last 0.025 warp factor number is just the way the scale compresses at the top end. 9.976 is over 283 times faster than 9.975 and 9.977 is over 301 times faster and the difference just keeps getting bigger on a sharp upward curve as you keep going.
Actually, they are not as much of a weakness as you might think. The only thing in those struts is a Jefferies tube like you see Scotty climbing up in occasionally and some pipes and conduits, the rest is all structural and armor. Jefferies himself said in interviews and whatnot that it would be harder to cut through those struts than slice off a section of the saucer. And it makes sense, think of a WWII tank battle, how likely is it that enemy fire would blow a hole in the tank's main gun barrel compared to blowing a hole in the turret the gun is mounted in?