Start at 1:45:00 Jesse explains why it got removed.
It's very true this isn't the only jumping puzzle in the game. But it's orders of magnitude harder than any other. The main reason is that you need flawless completion. You need 3 people to successfully do 20+ jumps each. If that doesn't happen the puzzle fully resets. That thing in Dust to Dust is easier!
It's very true this isn't the only jumping puzzle in the game. But it's orders of magnitude harder than any other. The main reason is that you need flawless completion. You need 3 people to successfully do 20+ jumps each. If that doesn't happen the puzzle fully resets.
Wrong! Played another IGA with my fleet. One of my buddies messed up the jumping part. He was saved out of the acid and helped to conclude the map before it reseted. Easy peasy. It only resets if the team is too slow.
God, you should re-read what you wrote. How easy does one need a game to be? ... "orders of magnitude harder" ... players jumping.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
The mission says you beat it, and gives the reward for beating it, so yes it does.
No, it says the mission is over, and gives you a participation reward. Neither of those count as winning.
No, it literally says the mission is complete the same as always and gives you the reward for winning it the same as always., There is no separate "participation reward," nor any different lines saying anything about "participation rewards" or indeed anything else different at all.
No, it literally says the mission is complete the same as always and gives you the reward for winning it the same as always., There is no separate "participation reward," nor any different lines saying anything about "participation rewards" or indeed anything else different at all.
This is completely and utterly untrue.
If you fail to complete the objectives, primary or optional, in any TFO, the reward scaling goes down in relation to how many objectives you completed successfully. This is true in everything from Operation Riposte, where failing to capture any of the three stations, failing to save any of the Fed transports, and failing to capture any of the Klingon transports, will net you all of about 10 marks. Whereas had you done all of those things, you would have gotten 75, to Pahvo Dissension, to Crystaline Entity, which have similar reward scaling payouts based on doing optionals, or if you complete the primary objectives in the time allotted. Its been this way forever.
Optionals have their own optional rewards. The main mission reward you get, so the main mission you have won.
.
.
.
Like I said, we did finish it. To me it felt noticeably out of sync with the standards of all the other TFOs I've played so far in terms of scope and difficulty, both ground and space.
I gather that it puts me in a minority, but when I saw "Both Normal and Advanced versions of 'Infected: Manus' are no longer eligible for Random TFO inclusion" in the patch notes, I smiled. Oh, I smiled. It made me happy, because I would just as soon not repeat that experience any time soon, simply as punishment for hitting "random".
I agree. Unless you and your team really know what this TFO is all about it can be punishing. Punishing, not in terms of broken items but in time spent and frustration. It indeed does not scale well against other TFOs, at least in normal. There are other TFOs that fit into this category.
As an aside, I'm a relatively new player as well (been playing for a few months). The learning curve in this game is quite large as there are many facets to it. The list is long, but I have to say that most of the stuff I've learned how to do in this game was largely discovered by accident.
Optionals have their own optional rewards. The main mission reward you get, so the main mission you have won.
This is also incorrect.
Again, using something like Operation Riposte as an example. Operation Riposte has no optional objectives in it, it only has the main objectives, with the reward scaling based on how many of the main objectives you manage to complete in the time allotted. So no, you can easily fail to get the main mission reward in Operation Riposte, which is the max payout of 75 marks, for failing to complete the entirety of the main mission.
all the objectives are just optional basically without the optional label. you will finish the queue sucessfully and you will get your reward box at the end. in addition you will see the "mission completed" text. => you won the mission. maybe not perfectly and you missed a few things here and there but thats it.
if you fail/not win a queue you just get 10 marks for participation.
if you fail/not win a queue you just get 10 marks for participation.
Yeah and on randoms (advanced) you get at least another 70 marks for doing nothing. The state this game is in you get rewarded for doing nothing or nearly nothing. That said they took the one where you can actually fail or not finish it off the random list so people can enjoy the no-brainers. Next to follow would be Attack on Terok Nor and Kithomer Ground.
C-Store Inc. is still looking for active members on the fed side. If you don't have a fleet feel free to contact me in game @stegi.
0
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,696Community Moderator
I think people are forgetting one key thing here.
How many people actually COMMUNICATE in TFOs?
The old Borg TFOs either require you to be in communication in order to coordinate, or just flat out know what to do.
On top of that, yes the old Borg TFOs are the oldest in the game.
Cure has unmarked objectives, specifically scanning the bodies. It can be very easy to miss one of them in the rush to get through it.
Infected has hidden trigger lines for the assimilation of the crewmen. Unless you have some great gear, know what you're doing, or know where those trigger lines are, you're going to have problems.
They don't exactly prepare you for what you need to do in the TFOs. They ARE showing their age.
Do I want them totally removed? No. I actually kinda enjoyed Kitomer ground. Infected and Cure? Not so much honestly. Why? Kitomer is more doable with a pug group than Infected and Cure. Hell... I honestly don't want to run Infected without at least two fleetmates or friends who actually are in communication with me.
Could they be revamped to be a bit more clear on what to do? Yes.
Could they be revamped to be less brutal on people? Probably.
BTW... I actually solo'd Manus before we got TR-116 rifles. I found a spot where I could avoid being spotted by the drones, and had to shield tank Manus because the rest of the team had died. I was panicking, but when Manus went down I was like "holy TRIBBLE I lived".
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
Optionals have their own optional rewards. The main mission reward you get, so the main mission you have won.
This is also incorrect.
Again, using something like Operation Riposte as an example. Operation Riposte has no optional objectives in it, it only has the main objectives, with the reward scaling based on how many of the main objectives you manage to complete in the time allotted. So no, you can easily fail to get the main mission reward in Operation Riposte, which is the max payout of 75 marks, for failing to complete the entirety of the main mission.
I'll see your Operation Repost, and raise you a Starbase 1 defense. You can AFK that on elite even, while successfully watching the staff of the starbase putter away to safety, and have it be successful. Or Mirror Invasion(you just wait out the timer until the final dreadnought pops up, then hit spacebar and grease the ship). The Peril over Pahvo/Lukari satellite defense can be AFK'd after the first group. Hell, there's channels bloated with players that are designed to host AFK runs. And Pahvo Dysentery(the one with the crystals and the MU knuckleheads at the end).
There's a base of what rewards you get. The optionals tack onto that. But a successful run gives you the base amount. TFOs like these play themselves pretty much, because the optionals offer a pittance boost in reward, and you just have to wait out the clock. The endless waves don't offer much, since loot drops are wonky, there's no massive ship mastery gain.
.
.
.
Like I said, we did finish it. To me it felt noticeably out of sync with the standards of all the other TFOs I've played so far in terms of scope and difficulty, both ground and space.
I gather that it puts me in a minority, but when I saw "Both Normal and Advanced versions of 'Infected: Manus' are no longer eligible for Random TFO inclusion" in the patch notes, I smiled. Oh, I smiled. It made me happy, because I would just as soon not repeat that experience any time soon, simply as punishment for hitting "random".
I agree. Unless you and your team really know what this TFO is all about it can be punishing. Punishing, not in terms of broken items but in time spent and frustration. It indeed does not scale well against other TFOs, at least in normal. There are other TFOs that fit into this category.
As an aside, I'm a relatively new player as well (been playing for a few months). The learning curve in this game is quite large as there are many facets to it. The list is long, but I have to say that most of the stuff I've learned how to do in this game was largely discovered by accident.
To be fair, that's what I enjoyed about this game when I was new (years ago, when Vesta's were new and Picard was really retired ). There's a lot to discover and there are many things you can try out.
The good thing is that, once you've been around a bit longer, you can make the game as easy or as difficult as you want it to be.
I think people are forgetting one key thing here.
How many people actually COMMUNICATE in TFOs?
That's just it, though. When most people are used to playing "pew pew pew" and be done with it, or to just plain AFK for practically the entire queue... what's there to communicate about?
I'm not disagreeing with you. Quite the contrary, actually. Communication should always happen, especially on queues like Infected and I honestly say I can't blame you for wanting to run it with at least a couple of people that knows what they're doing and, quite possibly, are also communicating with you while running the queue. To be honest, I wouldn't either.
Now, as I said multiple times already: yes, the old Borg ground STFs needs to be tweaked (or even revamped, provided they do a good job on them, instead of just dumbing them down to stupidity) and there are bugs in some of them that needs to be fixed, starting with the objectives not being displayed properly.
Still, the solution to not being able to run something because you yourself (general "you", not you you @rattler2) are unwilling to learn how to do it can't be to scream "this needs to be removed!".
I agree that the hidden trigger lines should be explained/displayed in some way, so people are aware (or reminded) of them.
I can also agree that the jumping part can get tricky, especially the first few times you try it... But surely, that can't be game-breaking?
Not agreeing with someone doesn't give you the right to be an TRIBBLE.
Ci sono tre tipi di giocatori:
- quelli a cui non va mai bene niente... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che sono talmente imbesuiti da credere a qualunque cosa i dev dicano, perfino che la luna è fatta di formaggio... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che credono a quello a cui è giusto credere, sono d'accordo con quello con cui è giusto essere d'accordo e sono critici con quello che non va;
Ai giocatori dei primi due tipi, gratis in omaggio un bello specchio lucente su cui arrampicarsi. E una mazzata in testa per la loro poca intelligenza e compassione verso gli altri giocatori che non la pensano come loro.
Agli appartenenti al terzo tipo, invece, dico grazie. Anche se non sempre si riesce a mantenere la calma, siete quelli per cui vale la pena incazzarsi.
the answer will be most likely:
"it does not meet our standards for queues"
Jesse Heinig talked about that while watching Kael get the TRIBBLE kicked out of him by Borg. All you're gonna get is a repeat, possibly differently worded.
and we all know, the new way of doing queues is to literaly afk it all the time, so warp in, launch pets, tap out of the game and come back to get the reward ^^
starbase 1 - if you have enough defense and passive healing to counter multiple torpedo volleys, you literally CAN just launch pets and tab out, because even if some enemy ships spawn out of any pet's leash range...they'll eventually despawn anyway and the queue will move to the next stage, or complete if it's the last
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
It's very true this isn't the only jumping puzzle in the game. But it's orders of magnitude harder than any other. The main reason is that you need flawless completion. You need 3 people to successfully do 20+ jumps each. If that doesn't happen the puzzle fully resets.
Wrong! Played another IGA with my fleet. One of my buddies messed up the jumping part. He was saved out of the acid and helped to conclude the map before it reseted. Easy peasy. It only resets if the team is too slow.
Yeah... in theory you can do it in half the allotted time. But that's a flawless run. Also if you do managed to save someone, which, realistically is not easy, I've done it, that one guy on the stream demonstrated it. The problem here is that it slows it down a LOT. Because that means 2 players not advancing the mission when you need all five to work on stuff. Is it possible? obviously.
The question is not "can it be done?" In theory you can beat Battle of Korfez with a PUG. That doesn't mean it's equal in difficulty to other content. And that is the real question. "Is this too hard to expect a PUG to do it?"
God, you should re-read what you wrote. How easy does one need a game to be? ... "orders of magnitude harder" ... players jumping.
If there's a harder jumping puzzle in the game show it to me. I have never seen anything even close to as hard as this one.
How many players actually have the skill required to time 20 jumps in a row right? Also, as Kael demonstrated, you need to memorize which locations you can jump to/from. Gozer placed the boxes you're jumping to so you need a running jump at bare minimum. If you have +run speed that increases jump distance(but not height).
And that's assuming that it's actually just player skill at work. AS has been pointed out multiple times, it's not just player skill that determines if you succeed. Small amounts of normally barely noticeable lag will utterly wreck the jumping puzzle.
]If there's a harder jumping puzzle in the game show it to me. I have never seen anything even close to as hard as this one.
The Mission 'Dust to Dust' has a harder jumping puzzle by far. The 'jump puzzle' in IGA that you're talking about isn't even a jump puzzle.. it's a straight walk with an occasional jump. I just did this map today with Peter, and half the time I was literally walking from cube to cube to get across.. you don't even have to hit the jump button because the cubes are so close together.
Calling this a 'jump puzzle' is silly.. calling it difficult is absolutely absurd. You're grasping at straws trying to make this mission sound like it's some overwhelming challenge and it's ridiculous.
If you don't like the mission, cool man.. we get that. But please stop trying to make this mission sound like some overwhelming challenge.. it's frikkn' easy.
Yes, the Borg TFOs are old, outdated, and in need of a revamp/rebuild/overhaul. But they're not impossible. I've PUG'd every single one of these missions and finished them. Maybe we didn't get all of the optionals every time, but they were completed. There's only been a handful of times where one failed, but that was only due to leavers quitting the TFO and making them impossible to finish. I usually play Advanced TFOs. I RTFO'd into Manus last night with a PUG: we finished it. The night before, I RTFO'd into Hive with a PUG: we finished it. A week or so back, I RTFO'd into KIS with a PUG: we finished it. I guess I've been lucky that I haven't been in a single instance of these TFOs where they glitched or bugged out. So, from my perspective, they aren't broken. They're just old, out of date, and in need of being updated to the current standard. But they are far from impossible to complete.
When the Random System debuted Kael livestreamed and ended up in one of these TFOs, Cure Ground, I believe. The devs with him on the stream all remarked at how dated the TFO was and that it obviously needed an update. Yet, it wasn't removed from RTFOs. That Manus was removed immediately following this livestream, I do not believe is any coincidence, and that is disappointing.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator and Resident She-Wolf
Community Moderators are Unpaid Volunteers and NOT Employees of Gearbox/Cryptic
Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
cure ground WAS removed from random several months back, but that was because it literally couldn't be completed because there was a hill covering one of the transmitter things so it couldn't be interacted with - and no one answered my question earlier as to whether or not it was ever re-added once that bug was fixed
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Reminds me of the Acid Wing In the Lord of the Rings Online Orthanc Raid. The Boss in there at various intervals would flood the room with acid. When he did, you had to 'bunny hop' jump around so you never really touched the acid for more than a split second at a time. Sometimes the Developers come up with silly mechanics just to keep their Instances 'interesting'. And I use the word 'interesting' loosely.
As far as Borg TFOs go, I have never done any of the Ground ones or 'Cure Found'.
I've always had problems with Chat, and I do have one Tab specifically set up for Team. I usually have to type something in twice or three times for it to register in the Chat Window. Beyond that, my Laptop keyboard has some problems with keys in the Right Upper Quadrant (7 to the right, Y to the right, and J to the right), wherein I have to hit those keys hard or multiple times for them to register. Needless to say I avoid Chat.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Can you please pass up your chain to Cryptic. It would be nice to get an official statement regarding this section of the patch notes. The rumour mill is already at impulse and approaching warp speed. Normally i wouldnt request.
However, the fact of what occurred in the last livestream and all of the sudden this? It just makes it look like it was removed for another reason and maybe not the reason you might have. It also might in the minds of some STO players set a precedent if something else happens in another livestream. That might be relatively minor, but in the minds of some STO players they might start to worry.
Livestream do sometimes show bugs and it's good if Cryptic see this and action fixes. However, just the way everything has happened just might not make you guys at Cryptic look good.
I believe we got our answer during the livestream. Numerous gameplay and design issues were pointed out during the mission. And it was remarked that they don't want to promote content that doesn't meet their current standards. These two things in combination point to the reason behind its removal as not meeting the standards. Whether we'll get an official announcement on that remains to be seen, and I am not at liberty to discuss anything else. I would suggest someone maybe bring it up during the next livestream to try and get an official answer that way, or possibly even through Twitter.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator and Resident She-Wolf
Community Moderators are Unpaid Volunteers and NOT Employees of Gearbox/Cryptic
Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
I think people are forgetting one key thing here.
How many people actually COMMUNICATE in TFOs?
The old Borg TFOs either require you to be in communication in order to coordinate, or just flat out know what to do.
On top of that, yes the old Borg TFOs are the oldest in the game.
Cure has unmarked objectives, specifically scanning the bodies. It can be very easy to miss one of them in the rush to get through it.
Infected has hidden trigger lines for the assimilation of the crewmen. Unless you have some great gear, know what you're doing, or know where those trigger lines are, you're going to have problems.
They don't exactly prepare you for what you need to do in the TFOs. They ARE showing their age.
Do I want them totally removed? No. I actually kinda enjoyed Kitomer ground. Infected and Cure? Not so much honestly. Why? Kitomer is more doable with a pug group than Infected and Cure. Hell... I honestly don't want to run Infected without at least two fleetmates or friends who actually are in communication with me.
Could they be revamped to be a bit more clear on what to do? Yes.
Could they be revamped to be less brutal on people? Probably.
BTW... I actually solo'd Manus before we got TR-116 rifles. I found a spot where I could avoid being spotted by the drones, and had to shield tank Manus because the rest of the team had died. I was panicking, but when Manus went down I was like "holy TRIBBLE I lived".
The problem is that less brutal on people means dummied down for people. Bright and intelligent players do not like that. Enthusiastic and engaging players flat our hate that. A map could link a dissertation on how to complete it with a step by step guide and dumb players will not read it. It would not make it easier for them.
As for revamping the old maps I’m not at all optimistic. Granted, the past years the designer of ground maps did a much better job than for the spaces ones for some reason (I completely gave up hope after seeing the new patrols there) but still their job is leagues behind to what it was when better level/game designer worked for Cryptic years ago.
When new ground maps are released nowadays I’m always at ease as my expectations are very low to begin with. After running them I say to myself “Ok, why not. A new map at least and it’s better than nothing”.
But what kind of criticism is that please? Well at least a better one a revamped Borg ground would get because there it could easily mean “Oh, that was actually worse than nothing”.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
]If there's a harder jumping puzzle in the game show it to me. I have never seen anything even close to as hard as this one.
The Mission 'Dust to Dust' has a harder jumping puzzle by far.
You mean the one where you can just run into the pit repeatedly to trigger respawn points and not shoot a single target or jump even once? Oh also the Dust to Dust thing doesn't reset or have a timer for completion.
The 'jump puzzle' in IGA that you're talking about isn't even a jump puzzle.. it's a straight walk with an occasional jump. I just did this map today with Peter, and half the time I was literally walking from cube to cube to get across.. you don't even have to hit the jump button because the cubes are so close together.
pics or it didn't happen.
Calling this a 'jump puzzle' is silly.. calling it difficult is absolutely absurd. You're grasping at straws trying to make this mission sound like it's some overwhelming challenge and it's ridiculous.
If you don't like the mission, cool man.. we get that. But please stop trying to make this mission sound like some overwhelming challenge.. it's frikkn' easy.
Really? If this is easy give me an example of something hard. Gold Skull Sompek? Wait, no, that doesn't have jumping.
You are not asking for video proof of a successful IGA run here, are you?
Man I mean when Feli streams Sompek 1337 it’s a happening and all but if one is needed for a successful IGA we would loose all self-respect we have left in gaming.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
no, he's absolutely right - several cubes are positioned in such a way that you CAN walk across them...i remember that much from all the runs i used to do back before it became pointless to do so
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Not agreeing with someone doesn't give you the right to be an TRIBBLE.
Ci sono tre tipi di giocatori:
- quelli a cui non va mai bene niente... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che sono talmente imbesuiti da credere a qualunque cosa i dev dicano, perfino che la luna è fatta di formaggio... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che credono a quello a cui è giusto credere, sono d'accordo con quello con cui è giusto essere d'accordo e sono critici con quello che non va;
Ai giocatori dei primi due tipi, gratis in omaggio un bello specchio lucente su cui arrampicarsi. E una mazzata in testa per la loro poca intelligenza e compassione verso gli altri giocatori che non la pensano come loro.
Agli appartenenti al terzo tipo, invece, dico grazie. Anche se non sempre si riesce a mantenere la calma, siete quelli per cui vale la pena incazzarsi.
Comments
Start at 1:45:00 Jesse explains why it got removed.
It's very true this isn't the only jumping puzzle in the game. But it's orders of magnitude harder than any other. The main reason is that you need flawless completion. You need 3 people to successfully do 20+ jumps each. If that doesn't happen the puzzle fully resets. That thing in Dust to Dust is easier!
My character Tsin'xing
Wrong! Played another IGA with my fleet. One of my buddies messed up the jumping part. He was saved out of the acid and helped to conclude the map before it reseted. Easy peasy. It only resets if the team is too slow.
God, you should re-read what you wrote. How easy does one need a game to be? ... "orders of magnitude harder" ... players jumping.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I agree. Unless you and your team really know what this TFO is all about it can be punishing. Punishing, not in terms of broken items but in time spent and frustration. It indeed does not scale well against other TFOs, at least in normal. There are other TFOs that fit into this category.
As an aside, I'm a relatively new player as well (been playing for a few months). The learning curve in this game is quite large as there are many facets to it. The list is long, but I have to say that most of the stuff I've learned how to do in this game was largely discovered by accident.
all the objectives are just optional basically without the optional label. you will finish the queue sucessfully and you will get your reward box at the end. in addition you will see the "mission completed" text. => you won the mission. maybe not perfectly and you missed a few things here and there but thats it.
if you fail/not win a queue you just get 10 marks for participation.
ingame: @Felisean
Yeah and on randoms (advanced) you get at least another 70 marks for doing nothing. The state this game is in you get rewarded for doing nothing or nearly nothing. That said they took the one where you can actually fail or not finish it off the random list so people can enjoy the no-brainers. Next to follow would be Attack on Terok Nor and Kithomer Ground.
How many people actually COMMUNICATE in TFOs?
The old Borg TFOs either require you to be in communication in order to coordinate, or just flat out know what to do.
On top of that, yes the old Borg TFOs are the oldest in the game.
Cure has unmarked objectives, specifically scanning the bodies. It can be very easy to miss one of them in the rush to get through it.
Infected has hidden trigger lines for the assimilation of the crewmen. Unless you have some great gear, know what you're doing, or know where those trigger lines are, you're going to have problems.
They don't exactly prepare you for what you need to do in the TFOs. They ARE showing their age.
BTW... I actually solo'd Manus before we got TR-116 rifles. I found a spot where I could avoid being spotted by the drones, and had to shield tank Manus because the rest of the team had died. I was panicking, but when Manus went down I was like "holy TRIBBLE I lived".
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
I'll see your Operation Repost, and raise you a Starbase 1 defense. You can AFK that on elite even, while successfully watching the staff of the starbase putter away to safety, and have it be successful. Or Mirror Invasion(you just wait out the timer until the final dreadnought pops up, then hit spacebar and grease the ship). The Peril over Pahvo/Lukari satellite defense can be AFK'd after the first group. Hell, there's channels bloated with players that are designed to host AFK runs. And Pahvo Dysentery(the one with the crystals and the MU knuckleheads at the end).
There's a base of what rewards you get. The optionals tack onto that. But a successful run gives you the base amount. TFOs like these play themselves pretty much, because the optionals offer a pittance boost in reward, and you just have to wait out the clock. The endless waves don't offer much, since loot drops are wonky, there's no massive ship mastery gain.
To be fair, that's what I enjoyed about this game when I was new (years ago, when Vesta's were new and Picard was really retired
The good thing is that, once you've been around a bit longer, you can make the game as easy or as difficult as you want it to be.
That's just it, though. When most people are used to playing "pew pew pew" and be done with it, or to just plain AFK for practically the entire queue... what's there to communicate about?
I'm not disagreeing with you. Quite the contrary, actually. Communication should always happen, especially on queues like Infected and I honestly say I can't blame you for wanting to run it with at least a couple of people that knows what they're doing and, quite possibly, are also communicating with you while running the queue. To be honest, I wouldn't either.
Now, as I said multiple times already: yes, the old Borg ground STFs needs to be tweaked (or even revamped, provided they do a good job on them, instead of just dumbing them down to stupidity) and there are bugs in some of them that needs to be fixed, starting with the objectives not being displayed properly.
Still, the solution to not being able to run something because you yourself (general "you", not you you @rattler2) are unwilling to learn how to do it can't be to scream "this needs to be removed!".
I agree that the hidden trigger lines should be explained/displayed in some way, so people are aware (or reminded) of them.
I can also agree that the jumping part can get tricky, especially the first few times you try it... But surely, that can't be game-breaking?
Ci sono tre tipi di giocatori:
- quelli a cui non va mai bene niente... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che sono talmente imbesuiti da credere a qualunque cosa i dev dicano, perfino che la luna è fatta di formaggio... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che credono a quello a cui è giusto credere, sono d'accordo con quello con cui è giusto essere d'accordo e sono critici con quello che non va;
Ai giocatori dei primi due tipi, gratis in omaggio un bello specchio lucente su cui arrampicarsi. E una mazzata in testa per la loro poca intelligenza e compassione verso gli altri giocatori che non la pensano come loro.
Agli appartenenti al terzo tipo, invece, dico grazie. Anche se non sempre si riesce a mantenere la calma, siete quelli per cui vale la pena incazzarsi.
My character Tsin'xing
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
The question is not "can it be done?" In theory you can beat Battle of Korfez with a PUG. That doesn't mean it's equal in difficulty to other content. And that is the real question. "Is this too hard to expect a PUG to do it?" If there's a harder jumping puzzle in the game show it to me. I have never seen anything even close to as hard as this one.
How many players actually have the skill required to time 20 jumps in a row right? Also, as Kael demonstrated, you need to memorize which locations you can jump to/from. Gozer placed the boxes you're jumping to so you need a running jump at bare minimum. If you have +run speed that increases jump distance(but not height).
And that's assuming that it's actually just player skill at work. AS has been pointed out multiple times, it's not just player skill that determines if you succeed. Small amounts of normally barely noticeable lag will utterly wreck the jumping puzzle.
My character Tsin'xing
The Mission 'Dust to Dust' has a harder jumping puzzle by far. The 'jump puzzle' in IGA that you're talking about isn't even a jump puzzle.. it's a straight walk with an occasional jump. I just did this map today with Peter, and half the time I was literally walking from cube to cube to get across.. you don't even have to hit the jump button because the cubes are so close together.
Calling this a 'jump puzzle' is silly.. calling it difficult is absolutely absurd. You're grasping at straws trying to make this mission sound like it's some overwhelming challenge and it's ridiculous.
If you don't like the mission, cool man.. we get that. But please stop trying to make this mission sound like some overwhelming challenge.. it's frikkn' easy.
Yes, the Borg TFOs are old, outdated, and in need of a revamp/rebuild/overhaul. But they're not impossible. I've PUG'd every single one of these missions and finished them. Maybe we didn't get all of the optionals every time, but they were completed. There's only been a handful of times where one failed, but that was only due to leavers quitting the TFO and making them impossible to finish. I usually play Advanced TFOs. I RTFO'd into Manus last night with a PUG: we finished it. The night before, I RTFO'd into Hive with a PUG: we finished it. A week or so back, I RTFO'd into KIS with a PUG: we finished it. I guess I've been lucky that I haven't been in a single instance of these TFOs where they glitched or bugged out. So, from my perspective, they aren't broken.
They're just old, out of date, and in need of being updated to the current standard. But they are far from impossible to complete.
When the Random System debuted Kael livestreamed and ended up in one of these TFOs, Cure Ground, I believe. The devs with him on the stream all remarked at how dated the TFO was and that it obviously needed an update. Yet, it wasn't removed from RTFOs. That Manus was removed immediately following this livestream, I do not believe is any coincidence, and that is disappointing.
Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
Moderation Problems/Issues? Please contact the Community Manager
Terms of Service / Community Rules and Policies / FCT
Facebook / Twitter / Twitch
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
As far as Borg TFOs go, I have never done any of the Ground ones or 'Cure Found'.
I've always had problems with Chat, and I do have one Tab specifically set up for Team. I usually have to type something in twice or three times for it to register in the Chat Window. Beyond that, my Laptop keyboard has some problems with keys in the Right Upper Quadrant (7 to the right, Y to the right, and J to the right), wherein I have to hit those keys hard or multiple times for them to register. Needless to say I avoid Chat.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I believe we got our answer during the livestream. Numerous gameplay and design issues were pointed out during the mission. And it was remarked that they don't want to promote content that doesn't meet their current standards. These two things in combination point to the reason behind its removal as not meeting the standards. Whether we'll get an official announcement on that remains to be seen, and I am not at liberty to discuss anything else. I would suggest someone maybe bring it up during the next livestream to try and get an official answer that way, or possibly even through Twitter.
Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
Moderation Problems/Issues? Please contact the Community Manager
Terms of Service / Community Rules and Policies / FCT
Facebook / Twitter / Twitch
The problem is that less brutal on people means dummied down for people. Bright and intelligent players do not like that. Enthusiastic and engaging players flat our hate that. A map could link a dissertation on how to complete it with a step by step guide and dumb players will not read it. It would not make it easier for them.
As for revamping the old maps I’m not at all optimistic. Granted, the past years the designer of ground maps did a much better job than for the spaces ones for some reason (I completely gave up hope after seeing the new patrols there) but still their job is leagues behind to what it was when better level/game designer worked for Cryptic years ago.
When new ground maps are released nowadays I’m always at ease as my expectations are very low to begin with. After running them I say to myself “Ok, why not. A new map at least and it’s better than nothing”.
But what kind of criticism is that please? Well at least a better one a revamped Borg ground would get because there it could easily mean “Oh, that was actually worse than nothing”.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
My character Tsin'xing
Let us upgrade the Seleya Ceremonial Lirpa and Kri'stak Blade
You are not asking for video proof of a successful IGA run here, are you?
Man I mean when Feli streams Sompek 1337 it’s a happening and all but if one is needed for a successful IGA we would loose all self-respect we have left in gaming.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
My character Tsin'xing
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
My character Tsin'xing
Ci sono tre tipi di giocatori:
- quelli a cui non va mai bene niente... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che sono talmente imbesuiti da credere a qualunque cosa i dev dicano, perfino che la luna è fatta di formaggio... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che credono a quello a cui è giusto credere, sono d'accordo con quello con cui è giusto essere d'accordo e sono critici con quello che non va;
Ai giocatori dei primi due tipi, gratis in omaggio un bello specchio lucente su cui arrampicarsi. E una mazzata in testa per la loro poca intelligenza e compassione verso gli altri giocatori che non la pensano come loro.
Agli appartenenti al terzo tipo, invece, dico grazie. Anche se non sempre si riesce a mantenere la calma, siete quelli per cui vale la pena incazzarsi.