The Secret World requires you to have completed every dungeon on elite, and then you have to beat a nightmare level boss on your own in order to unlock nightmare mode dungeons.
The game needs to have some form of build in system to measure your effectiveness in team environments.
As the recent DPS Channel brouhaha showed, not all DPS is created equal. How many Recluses are in your PUG? How many attack patterns? Did someone bring a gravity well? Is someone there simply to pee in the prune juice? How will you know? All putting in an in-game meter does is bring even more DPS Drama(tm) to the PUG.
LOL, OP! What part of "PUG Lyfe" do you not understand?
/throw_Pug_Lyfe_GangSign
Yup. You want your instant win Advanced TF? There are plenty of channels for making your pre-made over that way. You PUG the higher level queues, you take your chances. Safety not guaranteed.
Or you can continue ranting over the random NPCS - excuse me, random fellow players - on the forums over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. I'm sure this time will fix the problem once and for all.
actually my family of fleets is trying to put together a PVE boot camp. We are talking to other fleets to organize it. It might help might not but we are going to try.
Good!:)
Don't forget also that the majority of fleet/channel players do missions like ~ ISA and queues like it and ignore others especially ground oriented, so the only way for you to do something you like, or need is to pug.
As the recent DPS Channel brouhaha showed, not all DPS is created equal. How many Recluses are in your PUG? How many attack patterns? Did someone bring a gravity well? Is someone there simply to pee in the prune juice? How will you know? All putting in an in-game meter does is bring even more DPS Drama(tm) to the PUG.
Yup. You want your instant win Advanced TF? There are plenty of channels for making your pre-made over that way. You PUG the higher level queues, you take your chances. Safety not guaranteed.
Or you can continue ranting over the random NPCS - excuse me, random fellow players - on the forums over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. I'm sure this time will fix the problem once and for all.
The DPS channel thing is disgusting. dumping everyone the drama...my whole fleet isn't going to work with them anymore. I was inching toward 30k...now im just going to play....it isn't worth it.
Granted I hadn't done STFs in the game. I would start on the "easy" level. Once I did it a few times per que. Then I would try harder as I got better. And as I got better gear along the way. This way I can pull my weight and won't be a hindrance.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
Its not just DPS, but paying attention. ISE/ISA has been around for over three years, there is more than enough cultural awareness on how to do the advanced/elite levels, but people still manage to pull a epic fail. Its probably the easiest one of the bunch as well. If people havent done it before at those levels, they should ask, but they dont, and whats worse is they keep repeating the errors, as is evident if you watch players in ISA/E when they rush to take out he second groups generator before anyone else gets there AND people posted to not do it after they did it on the first transformer.
If you dont know, ask. I f you make a mistake, learn from it.
Just a question... is there a difference between a skittle boat and a rainbow boat? Is it beams vs. cannons?
I know they both refer to usually-unplanned multi-energy builds.
No actual difference, it's simply a difference in nomenclature, depending on your cultural background I guess (some may not know what a "Skittle" is)
It's also less easy to tell these days. Once upon a time, you could tell exactly what base damage type someone was using, simply by the color of the beams/bullets.
Now however, with the plethora of Rep and Lockbox weapons available, you can have a "Rainbow" boat without sacrificing damage due to different base damage types. And in fact sometimes this is actually a better option, as having multiple additive procs can be an advantage.
[QUOTE=farmallm;24295741as I got better gear along the way. [/QUOTE]
thats part of the problem and why under equipped players are in the advanced to get more of the marks and elite marks. so they can get better gear. its a cart before the horse kinda thing going on. unlike the old way where you went in with nothing and worked for mk x gear. that would carry you to mk xi then that to mk xii
i still have a set of each for space and multiple sets of each for ground as i used to equip all my boffs in honor guard gear for ground. now that we dont need as many boffs i have some sets gather dust now.
I'm sorry and I don't disagree when someone can't kill things etc is a tad annoying.
BUT.
telling someone to stay out of a section on the game when there isn't a easy way to tell what your build is, is a tad rude at best.
to the casual player Dps isn't something they even consider let alone know how to tell what their Dps is without a 3rd party plug in.
matching ur energy weapon color up and proper consoles can hit 5k easy. matching up the type as far as cannons/beams to make best use of BFAW/BO/CSV/CRF even better. common sense.
as far as carrying 4 people, I even said im not capable of that. stated average dps for me is 20k range, with peak at just over 30k. im still chasing 30k average. at that, I need a decent team.
OP, I believe this has been community issue for quite a long time.
When you have quality players who can finish STFs grouping together to the point wherein PuGs are left, most of the time, low quality players. Which makes PuGgin unattractive for most of the quality players.
PuGggin is in a losing battle with population tug of war with the private channels. Add that to the time constraints that like minded players will have in PuG wherein likely players who want to play unpopular STF are not in the same timezone but sufficient to start that STF if only if they play and queue at the same time/STF. Besides the population doing event or new stuff rather than the STF.
What if, like the vast majority of people who play this game, they have no idea what their DPS is and probably little to no interest in finding out?
So, a player who struggles through normal level content when leveling gets to 50, and suddenly thinks they're at an 'advanced' level?
Fine, they have no idea what their DPS is. Maybe they should accept the realization that they struggle doing normal level content before turning it up.
That attitude, 'no interest in finding out' is precisely the problem. They shouldn't be encouraged and enabled to continue to think that way.
ive been pugging isa a lot and ive seen several ships in there under 5k dps. run em through STO gateway and they have straight atrocious builds. had a pathfinder today that was running one beam of each type and consoles for none of the above. horrid. 1k dps, that was it. perhaps they were popping grav wells, but the saving grace for the match was 3 20k dps players. player number 4 was a 5ker.
advanced isa's require certain important things. unfortunately there's an invisible clock that can be affected only so many times before it runs out and the mission fails....the time it takes the spheres to get from the gate to the transformer. each grav well extends this by 20 seconds proving they are popped in exact order. if there's three players with one paying attention this clock can be extended indefinitely.
so how to beat the clock without 2 or 3 grav wells? dps. I even tell players when im helping set up their ship...5k is minimum u should take into an advanced, and even then ull have some players cuss at you for low numbers, but at least 5k shows ur working on it, and ur not a complete mooch in the round.
the worst one was yesterday when a 4-5k player decided to try taking on transformers alone. the idiot got as far as calling in both cubes and running away. my 20k butt was stuck on probes because everyone else ignored this fact. and suddenly because of the 5ker's idiocy I was fighting cubes, spheres, and having to hold off probes. I did it, someone else finally came over and helped, and I was able to work on generators and transformers like I should've been from the very beginning.
I don't mind carrying a player or 2 but when their in the 1k-2k dps range, im annoyed at the very least because they shouldn't be there.
I'll admit I am a casual gamer, but I do know the DPS. Do I have a high one? Nope but trying. In all honesty sometimes It help if Vets would talk to a person or point them in the right direction on how to do their builds or what not. This in all honesty would help a person.
Another problem is on the rep system just to earn certain things, say Power cells, you can only do the advance or elites. I'm sure allot of the casual gamers are not aware of the changes that Cryptic has made over the last year, and this is something that an older player or hardcore gamer should help out with not bash, call names or use foul language.
I have tried to be polite and helpful in some PvE's but sometimes players don't pay attention to the chat or have it minimized so it doesn't distract them. Yes it is frustrating and I do see where you are coming from, but at least make an effort to message the player and help out or point them in the right direction.
What leads a player who does 1-2k DPS to believe that they are capable of contributing in an advanced difficulty mission?
Playing advanced or better on solo missions, posting videos about T1's going to endgame. Having all lock box ships, hell I can think of hundreds of reasons why......
DPS e-peen aside, experts are made everyday in this game...Yeah they are going to go Advanced.
Playing advanced or better on solo missions, posting videos about T1's going to endgame. Having all lock box ships, hell I can think of hundreds of reasons why......
DPS e-peen aside, experts are made everyday in this game...Yeah they are going to go Advanced.
Enjoy.
Cheers to that:D Everybody thinks they are an expert. So if you're one of those experts, why aren't you helping others out?
I have been playing the game since it first went to F2P and I don't even consider myself an expert. I'm still learning new things everyday
Im not sure if there is any form of DPS threshold a player requires to be able to fit into advanced. My threshold of tolerance has always been if he can hold a probe stream in KASA on his own, and hey thats not much.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I can deal with a new player learning how to play that is still learning how to gear up a ship, I can deal with the low dps player who unfortunately may not have had anybody in the game take them under their wing or a fleet that was helpful with build advise. The one thing I can't stand is the one player you get who complains everyone else stinks and they rock, then they TRIBBLE up the entire instance for everyone, or drop as soon as an optional is blown.
I would like to see the elite levels and such be an account unlock where you need to complete 50 runs of any combo of endgame missions first, just so new players learn how to not only play their build, but how missions work.
I also hate when players belittle a new player in an instance. I will offer advice to a new player in a tell either durring or after an instance, but I will start politely, Hey, I hope you don't mind me asking, whats your set up?
New players often like friendly tips, but who likes being told they are a lousy player? I honestly think that a lot more players would become better players if just offered friendly advice. I know there are millions of threads on builds, and trillions of walk thorough online, but at this point, they may be a little daunting. So please, everybody just be friendly to new players
I can deal with a new player learning how to play that is still learning how to gear up a ship, I can deal with the low dps player who unfortunately may not have had anybody in the game take them under their wing or a fleet that was helpful with build advise. The one thing I can't stand is the one player you get who complains everyone else stinks and they rock, then they TRIBBLE up the entire instance for everyone, or drop as soon as an optional is blown.
I would like to see the elite levels and such be an account unlock where you need to complete 50 runs of any combo of endgame missions first, just so new players learn how to not only play their build, but how missions work.
I also hate when players belittle a new player in an instance. I will offer advice to a new player in a tell either durring or after an instance, but I will start politely, Hey, I hope you don't mind me asking, whats your set up?
New players often like friendly tips, but who likes being told they are a lousy player? I honestly think that a lot more players would become better players if just offered friendly advice. I know there are millions of threads on builds, and trillions of walk thorough online, but at this point, they may be a little daunting. So please, everybody just be friendly to new players
Everything you said is true. I have been popping searches into Google every week and the ammount of information is daunting. Yes my main toon is a tatical and when i win a new ship, I like to know how to get a good build out of it, I'm still trying to get a good build for my Kobali ship. Cruiser not so bad, but being a tactical I like to know what i should concentrate on to at least be some what effective.
That's why a internal (in STO) DPS meter would be preferable. The game could automaticly assign people with roughly the same DPS to mission queues.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Best advice I'd give to you would be to pick 1 energy weapon type for starters, that makes sure that you can maximise that part of your set up quickly. Then depending on the ship class, play to its strengths, cruisers are all about sustained play with all the engineer powers, lots of hull and the ability to pack a lot of batteries and devices. Escorts are all about survival by being the last man standing, get as many of your weapons firing at once in the same direction and just overwhelm the opponent. Science ships are a lot less straight forward. some can do a lot of dps, others are insane crowd control ships. When I try out a new ship I normally go do a bunch of foundry loot drop missions first, just to work out the basic patterns and versatility of the powers slotted or abilities of the ship....kind of like going to a shooting range to learn how to shoot a weapon before you try hunting. then I will replay a few missions to see how it is in real combat, then when I've worked out the kinks, its on to some normal difficulty end game.
All that being said, I'm pretty patient. I have been playing since the second day the game went live on a lifetime sub, probably have 90% of the stuff in the c-store, and a few hundred mill in credits in my account bank, shared by 20 alts at some points. When I started a second free to play account to try it out on a f2p basis after somebody told me it was harder I realized just how spoiled I was with all the bells and whistles I had added to my account over the years. I get into moods where I play one class or toon for months at a time exclusively, then switch to another. I have some that are more roleplay characters, I also have one of each of the tv shows crews that I try to gear up as close to the shows as possible.
When I want to just go and play with the members of my fleet, I do have one of each class that is pretty much geared up to the max, but doing so for each one takes a lot of time or even more credits. There are some bits of gear that I consider must haves, and many of them are either mission rewards or rep system rewards.
Most importiant thing is have fun and work to build your character up to what you think is a good character, dps is great, but dps is half gear, half skill. Build the skills while you play to bulk up enough to buy/earn the gear.
That's why a internal (in STO) DPS meter would be preferable. The game could automaticly assign people with roughly the same DPS to mission queues.
I think that would kill queues further since it'll bring low DPS people together to the same queue. Unless of course you mean bringing players together so their total DPS meets the mission needs? If it's the latter then that would really be beneficial to queues.
I'm all for an in-game system to measure performance. To prevent players from talking other players down you should be able to set your stats display to private/public.
Taking min-max performance aside, it is difficult to gauge a player's performance on DPS alone. A CC ship can potentially allow some missions to succeed even when the DPS being put out is below what some would consider minimums for that mission. There are also debuffers that allow other players to get the needed DPS numbers while getting a lower amount of DPS for themselves (ex. Recluse Nannies).
Then again, once you know the game basics (build, positioning and skill management), it is very easy to hit 5-8k DPS consistently with minimal effort/money/dil/ec spent.
Comments
It's a feature that would be handy in every MMO.
As the recent DPS Channel brouhaha showed, not all DPS is created equal. How many Recluses are in your PUG? How many attack patterns? Did someone bring a gravity well? Is someone there simply to pee in the prune juice? How will you know? All putting in an in-game meter does is bring even more DPS Drama(tm) to the PUG.
Yup. You want your instant win Advanced TF? There are plenty of channels for making your pre-made over that way. You PUG the higher level queues, you take your chances. Safety not guaranteed.
Or you can continue ranting over the random NPCS - excuse me, random fellow players - on the forums over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. I'm sure this time will fix the problem once and for all.
The DPS channel thing is disgusting. dumping everyone the drama...my whole fleet isn't going to work with them anymore. I was inching toward 30k...now im just going to play....it isn't worth it.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
If you dont know, ask. I f you make a mistake, learn from it.
I know they both refer to usually-unplanned multi-energy builds.
No actual difference, it's simply a difference in nomenclature, depending on your cultural background I guess (some may not know what a "Skittle" is)
It's also less easy to tell these days. Once upon a time, you could tell exactly what base damage type someone was using, simply by the color of the beams/bullets.
Now however, with the plethora of Rep and Lockbox weapons available, you can have a "Rainbow" boat without sacrificing damage due to different base damage types. And in fact sometimes this is actually a better option, as having multiple additive procs can be an advantage.
yep another ;
"I'm superior to everyone and you should get on my level before joining any queues i like to play in" thread.
Join the Deltas today!
thats part of the problem and why under equipped players are in the advanced to get more of the marks and elite marks. so they can get better gear. its a cart before the horse kinda thing going on. unlike the old way where you went in with nothing and worked for mk x gear. that would carry you to mk xi then that to mk xii
i still have a set of each for space and multiple sets of each for ground as i used to equip all my boffs in honor guard gear for ground. now that we dont need as many boffs i have some sets gather dust now.
rainbow is beams of mixed flavors and skittles are cannons of mixed flavors.
but they both represent the same problem.
Inexperience and desire for faster gear.
More experienced players on less geared alts?
Experience and need for better gear.
matching ur energy weapon color up and proper consoles can hit 5k easy. matching up the type as far as cannons/beams to make best use of BFAW/BO/CSV/CRF even better. common sense.
as far as carrying 4 people, I even said im not capable of that. stated average dps for me is 20k range, with peak at just over 30k. im still chasing 30k average. at that, I need a decent team.
When you have quality players who can finish STFs grouping together to the point wherein PuGs are left, most of the time, low quality players. Which makes PuGgin unattractive for most of the quality players.
PuGggin is in a losing battle with population tug of war with the private channels. Add that to the time constraints that like minded players will have in PuG wherein likely players who want to play unpopular STF are not in the same timezone but sufficient to start that STF if only if they play and queue at the same time/STF. Besides the population doing event or new stuff rather than the STF.
What if, like the vast majority of people who play this game, they have no idea what their DPS is and probably little to no interest in finding out?
So, a player who struggles through normal level content when leveling gets to 50, and suddenly thinks they're at an 'advanced' level?
Fine, they have no idea what their DPS is. Maybe they should accept the realization that they struggle doing normal level content before turning it up.
That attitude, 'no interest in finding out' is precisely the problem. They shouldn't be encouraged and enabled to continue to think that way.
I'll admit I am a casual gamer, but I do know the DPS. Do I have a high one? Nope but trying. In all honesty sometimes It help if Vets would talk to a person or point them in the right direction on how to do their builds or what not. This in all honesty would help a person.
Another problem is on the rep system just to earn certain things, say Power cells, you can only do the advance or elites. I'm sure allot of the casual gamers are not aware of the changes that Cryptic has made over the last year, and this is something that an older player or hardcore gamer should help out with not bash, call names or use foul language.
I have tried to be polite and helpful in some PvE's but sometimes players don't pay attention to the chat or have it minimized so it doesn't distract them. Yes it is frustrating and I do see where you are coming from, but at least make an effort to message the player and help out or point them in the right direction.
Playing advanced or better on solo missions, posting videos about T1's going to endgame. Having all lock box ships, hell I can think of hundreds of reasons why......
DPS e-peen aside, experts are made everyday in this game...Yeah they are going to go Advanced.
Enjoy.
Cheers to that:D Everybody thinks they are an expert. So if you're one of those experts, why aren't you helping others out?
I have been playing the game since it first went to F2P and I don't even consider myself an expert. I'm still learning new things everyday
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I would like to see the elite levels and such be an account unlock where you need to complete 50 runs of any combo of endgame missions first, just so new players learn how to not only play their build, but how missions work.
I also hate when players belittle a new player in an instance. I will offer advice to a new player in a tell either durring or after an instance, but I will start politely, Hey, I hope you don't mind me asking, whats your set up?
New players often like friendly tips, but who likes being told they are a lousy player? I honestly think that a lot more players would become better players if just offered friendly advice. I know there are millions of threads on builds, and trillions of walk thorough online, but at this point, they may be a little daunting. So please, everybody just be friendly to new players
Everything you said is true. I have been popping searches into Google every week and the ammount of information is daunting. Yes my main toon is a tatical and when i win a new ship, I like to know how to get a good build out of it, I'm still trying to get a good build for my Kobali ship. Cruiser not so bad, but being a tactical I like to know what i should concentrate on to at least be some what effective.
I guess it's all serious business these days.
How I yearn for the day we can actually perma-ban players for incompetence.
http://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/10052253
Why are you not rejoicing?
All that being said, I'm pretty patient. I have been playing since the second day the game went live on a lifetime sub, probably have 90% of the stuff in the c-store, and a few hundred mill in credits in my account bank, shared by 20 alts at some points. When I started a second free to play account to try it out on a f2p basis after somebody told me it was harder I realized just how spoiled I was with all the bells and whistles I had added to my account over the years. I get into moods where I play one class or toon for months at a time exclusively, then switch to another. I have some that are more roleplay characters, I also have one of each of the tv shows crews that I try to gear up as close to the shows as possible.
When I want to just go and play with the members of my fleet, I do have one of each class that is pretty much geared up to the max, but doing so for each one takes a lot of time or even more credits. There are some bits of gear that I consider must haves, and many of them are either mission rewards or rep system rewards.
Most importiant thing is have fun and work to build your character up to what you think is a good character, dps is great, but dps is half gear, half skill. Build the skills while you play to bulk up enough to buy/earn the gear.
I think that would kill queues further since it'll bring low DPS people together to the same queue. Unless of course you mean bringing players together so their total DPS meets the mission needs? If it's the latter then that would really be beneficial to queues.
I'm all for an in-game system to measure performance. To prevent players from talking other players down you should be able to set your stats display to private/public.
Taking min-max performance aside, it is difficult to gauge a player's performance on DPS alone. A CC ship can potentially allow some missions to succeed even when the DPS being put out is below what some would consider minimums for that mission. There are also debuffers that allow other players to get the needed DPS numbers while getting a lower amount of DPS for themselves (ex. Recluse Nannies).
Then again, once you know the game basics (build, positioning and skill management), it is very easy to hit 5-8k DPS consistently with minimal effort/money/dil/ec spent.
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