Cryptic for five years has encouraged us to chase sets. It's not surprising there are a lot of players who like to play dress up with their ship for reasons other than leaderboard rights.
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I've gone over the more common DPS builds. They are depressingly similar, and leave no room for making an interesting looking or otherwise varied kind of ship to play.
There's definitely some truth to that, for sure. Some sets you just have to get, especially if they're the make-or-break sets for your weapon or ship type. That said, there's some play room.
I'd been using a set shield on my ships until I finally cracked, 'cause I hated the look of it. Went back to the Romulan shield, of which I have no other set pieces to match with it. But I upgraded the shield, so I made it work regardless.
Also, there is no way I'm giving up the hilariously awesome Aelahl unique console. The 'Singularity Bomb' is way too much fun, and I find it useful on a build that otherwise doesn't have a Grav Well equivalent.
I also hid a torp in my foreward slots (please don't hate me :P), because I feel that a ship is just... missing something without a torp launcher. But I specifically chose the Delta torp that contributes to the Isokinetic Cannon set.
At last parse, I hit 16.3K. And I still have some upgrades to finish on a few guns that I recently swapped in. Think I had a couple new Mk XIIs on that run.
So for me, it's a balance. I hope to hit 20K once I've upgraded all my gear, but that's about it for me. Any more DPS-centric adjustments to my build, and yeah I would feel I'd lose some of the individuality on my ship. But that's the key - I'm expecting to hit 20K while still maintaining a level of uniqueness to my build, because I've taken to building the ship around those quirks. I have a good enough understanding of the game mechanics to maximize other aspects of my build, while allowing for some "OMG THIS IS AWESOME" moments.
The dps channels are basically what kept me playing after DR hit. Pugging was impossible and my fleet is not very active.
There are some issues, like wait for pets(wfp), and in my opinion people getting a bit too frustrated with that. However if you can get into the 30k channel it's almost a guarantee of a successful and fun run. Not to mention tactics discussion in chat before a run. I have learned a lot running with these guys. A lot of what I learned I tried to pass on to my fleet too, and I know others in the channel do the same.
I don't get the comments being made about the "Elitism" or the "Do X DPS or get kicked out"
Last Queue I ran with a team from the 10k DPS channel, I messed up big league, got wiped out and generally had a pretty bad run, so I ended up doing no more than 8k DPS...
I wasn't yelled at, I wasn't treated like an inferior player, I wasn't booted out of the channel or anything of the sort. I explained what I did, and the response was simple "No worries, we all mess up sometimes".
The claims of elitism simply aren't true from my experiences of the 10k DPS channel. As long as you understand the game, and can recognise your strengths and weaknesses, no one minds.
This has been my experience too. I'm a member of 10 and 30k, there's no elitism I can see. If someone is told to GTFO it's because they're spamming and/or trolling the channel. Most runs I see are 10k, with mixed teams often forming.
The main complaint I see is about the WFP rule. And probably the most balanced debate about plasma doping went on there for weeks. The channels seem to get a bad rap from people who have never been a member.
I think it's best then I come up with a build that isn't going to change in a hurry (so upgrade my 12's to 14's) before trying out. Even if I do over 10K now I might as well bring the best with what I've got.
The biggest challenge is probably building up the interest to play .
It's not like in the channels everyone just does ISA over and over. There's all sorts of runs of all sorts of things.... even ground!
Sometimes there's even people in 50/75K doing 'low dps alt runs' just for fun. When they gave away the free Rhode Island a few weeks back, a bunch of us played with them for a while, just for fun.
As long as people put into the chat what they're actually doing, then it's fine.
Same goes for bringing a Recluse or sci debuff boat.
The point is, it's about community and communication. Something you almost never ever get in a pug
OK. Now, for why dpsers are despised. And yes, it is warranted. You make the game less fun. Than it already is. You make players using any other setup feel useless. You constantly blow through queues in half the time its supposed to take to complete, with 2 or 3 players being unable to do much in comparison. Those players who like to try new things are actually being punished for it because of dps jockeys.
OK. Now, for why dpsers are despised. And yes, it is warranted. You make the game less fun. Than it already is. You make players using any other setup feel useless. You constantly blow through queues in half the time its supposed to take to complete, with 2 or 3 players being unable to do much in comparison. Those players who like to try new things are actually being punished for it because of dps jockeys.
Not sure how or why considering all you have to do is queue for a Pug and then most of your anti 'DPS jockey' woes will be solved. Are there times where those in DPS channels join pugs? Of course. I guess your actual problem is people being better than you at the content provided and designed by cryptic. I get it though, you want to do something different in the game and that's great, but don't blame the people who have accepted what cryptic has done and is continuing to do to this game and adapted accordingly.
Public queues are essentially dead. Even at peak traffic hours. I mostly work from home so I can jump in and out as the mood strikes.
Cryptic and the forums seem to agree - the private channels are well trafficked.
Only private channels seem to matter now.
Ah gotcha, and I agree. Waiting for things like Gorn Minefield (Daily) and such can be brutal. I do however think the popularity of private channels is more of a reaction to what cryptic is doing than anything else.
OK. Now, for why dpsers are despised. And yes, it is warranted. You make the game less fun. Than it already is. You make players using any other setup feel useless. You constantly blow through queues in half the time its supposed to take to complete, with 2 or 3 players being unable to do much in comparison. Those players who like to try new things are actually being punished for it because of dps jockeys.
I kinda addressed this in a previous post, but I suppose this is kind of a connected issue.
Players who are in your face and verbally violent over DPS results are not part of the DPS Channels. They are kicked for that kind of stuff. What you're finding are players who are not representative of the community. They are one-off's who get their kicks by showcasing how much 'better' they are than others.
You can be a high-DPS player and be a nasty idiot, but you can't be a DPS Community member and be a nasty idiot.
All I can suggest is, if you're "trying new things" either stick to Normal-level queues until you feel the 'new thing' is strong enough for Advanced, or try it alongside fleetmates. I use a sub-optimal build as I detailed a couple posts before yours, and I'll never be top-dawg with that - but I can still crank out respectable numbers, and don't play above my level.
There is room for unique and fun builds. No one will take that away from you. What you will find on occasion, however, are griefers and trolls in pugs. Such is the life of an MMO. But again, that's the benefit of playing with friends, fleetmates, or the DPS Channels - no griefers.
I am not flying with dps channel premades, but my fleet is my dps premade. If you have a premade you know you will not fail. You know even if you do a mistake, you will win.
But on the other side thats the reason I am sometimes bored by such runs and have to pug. When I encounter those players with underwhelming dps, those starting to shoot generators on the wrong side of the gate or those not being able to shoot a few probes, I feel as my presence can change the tide. Its a bit like being the kirk, saving the mission objective and maybe even helping some players who dont know enough about the game mechanics so far.
I dont want to expose somebody, I dont post dps numbers, I dont comment on dps at all. Most times I (and fleet mates) even try to calm down a bit if somebody is at the risk of getting an afk penalty. But if somebody is interested to know more about builds, I do always help him.
Dps channels separate the player base a bit, but I understand everybody not willed to fly with pugs. I am just reading in those channels as there are sometimes interesting discussions about gameplay mechanics, but I usually dont fly with them.
Public queues are essentially dead. Even at peak traffic hours. I mostly work from home so I can jump in and out as the mood strikes.
Cryptic and the forums seem to agree - the private channels are well trafficked.
Only private channels seem to matter now.
Frankly, that's the fault of the obstinate who refuse to actually play the game as the game demands.
Those people lower the chance of success in a PUG, and then nobody wants to join a PUG because the chance of success is low. So the public queues become empty - cleared out due to unqualified individuals causing failures.
It's the same reason the PESTF channel slowly emptied of good players. It used to be full of people who knew what they were doing, and I'd never seen a run fail. Then bad players in denial of their incompetence joined, firmly believe that everybody else sucked and they just needed a better team. They dragged down the quality of the average PESTF group - and in turn the higher end players went and created a channel where admittance was based on performance, not simply knowing how to join a channel.
The other being DPS is somewhat ironic, you need a certain measure of DPS and I totally agree DPS is needed for the most part but it almost feels as though that's the sole requirement. But what puts me off is this notion I must perform this much DPS and if I don't I'm out. What if I'm a science that does half the required DPS but doubles the DPS of everyone on the team or keep them alive? What if I do 9.5K as opposed to 10K perhaps for the unlucky reason my torpedo hit a fraction after the NPC blew up?
Not to bang on about it but I first beat NWS with something like 4-5k DPS. I know that there have been players out there since that have set a certain level of DPS like 10K so even though I've beaten the event with less DPS I would otherwise be denied because I don't do the required DPS.
DPS is the only measurable metric. There is one thing that hasn't been really mentioned in this thread, so I'll take it upon myself to submit number 9:
9: You make friends with great competent, friendly players.
And let me explain that. I pushed a tank into dps-75k. Even while I was in 50k, I was getting recognition for my ability to pull aggro. Once I hit 75k, not that it was some magic number, or anything like that, but between conversations with people, and runs with them (of things that didn't solely consist of ISA, I might add) I made friends with a good number of high-dps players. And sometimes, I'll pug queues, jump on them in fleet chat, or get PM'd by one person, and be on cooldown on that guy when I'm asked if I want in for a queue. Now, the kind of guys you meet in 75k or 50k really don't need a 5th teammate killing everything to win the queue, or even speedrun it. I've had to, a lot of times, say "I'm on cooldown, can I bring my fed alt?" They know my fed alt's record is ~20k (I'm basically only flying that guy upon request, he still has all his MK XII gear, and so it's not too bad, imo). But that doesn't really matter, because it does the same thing at it's core as my current Romulan main - he can rip aggro off of about anyone he flies with. In a run where one friend set a record, I did less than 1/6th of their dps, and still had over 4 times the number of shots in than them.
So join the channels, be a nice, friendly person. And you'll meet like minded friends who appreciate what you do as more than a number. I find my friends list, that I'd jump to for a queue, mostly consists of guys in the 60-100k range (with outliers both above and well below that range). I didn't seek out friends because they can do x dps, I seek them out because I respect what they bring to the queue (be it dps, healing, debuffing, science, pure wizardry, whatever) and what they bring to the group - friendly banter, conversation, information, and a sense of teamwork.
SCM - Crystal C. (S) - [00:12] DMG(DPS) - @jarvisandalfred: 8.63M(713.16K) - Fed Sci
#9 should be That it helps set personal goals and provides the tools needed to monitor your own person progress and growth.
The combat log reader that the channel uses allows us to tweak a build and quickly and easily see the results. A person may have what looks like great gear but with a few minor tweaks dps can be bumped quite a bit.
The 30k and 50k channels are just round numbers that are there to see if you can achieve them. It is something to work towards. If the only channel was 10k then once in there what would make you try to push your build further. Its not like the people in 50k don't exist in the 10k.
The attitude that a person has when trying when they approach these channels is what makes the difference. If they were to say that they were #TRIBBLE and the league table is the pecking order of you as a person then yes it would be elitist. But if you look at that table as a challenge then that a positive.
I have never seen anyone ever use that League table against anyone else and I have never see anyone promote themself with their rank number.
THe only bad thing I see about the dps channels is it takes away too many veteran players from the pugs
Making pugs just that more difficult to complete
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
THe only bad thing I see about the dps channels is it takes away too many veteran players from the pugs
Making pugs just that more difficult to complete
I disagree. Honestly, without PESTF and DPS channels, I'd have stopped pugs entirely. Especially since Geko killed them with DR. You cannot make the logical assumption that presence in one means absence in another. That's just not the case.
If you're a pretty good player, and you've got one friend who's a pretty good player, you should be able to reliably pull 3 PUGs through most Borg STFs save maybe IGA.
Given the trend of late to bash the DPS crowd for whatever unwarranted reasons, I've decided to start making a list of why the DPS channels have a positive influence on those who join. I encourage others to add to this list, and provide those sitting on the fence with their opinions to the DPS community our side of the story.
1. Actual community, not happen-stance of just being on the same map for a short amount of time.
2. Positive interaction, feedback, advice, teamwork...oh and people actually reading team chat in a multiplayer game.
3. No trolls. (Or immediate and permanent removal of those found to be trolls.)
4. Politeness. For example in a DPS channel match people work together, communicate, and share respect for the fact other human beings are aiding you in your grind/progression etc. Most of the time in pugs people can't even be bothered to 'gg' at the end. They claim rewards, beaming out from the map and away from other humans as fast as possible without so much as a thanks. All the while pretending they are solely responsible for completing whatever mission, and cursing the fact they have to wait for others to play. (Or worse, depending entirely on those around them to complete the mission.)
5. Help to better understand game mechanics. (courtesy of peterconnorfirst)
6. Provides a good build-testing environment. (courtesy of chipg7)
7. The DPS channels provide a reliable (game related) news service. (courtesy of fatman592)
8. High-quality farming. (courtesy of spaceeagle20)
9. ?
*As I see more insight added in replies I'll attempt to add them to the original list here
Going by the assumption that they are correct, which can be disputed, what would be the benefit of such a channel over a fleet?
But queued content is almost too easy as it is, why would i make it even more mind numbing by removing one of the last remaining random events (composition of the PUG).
Even if a DPS channel would offer benefits, they would not outweigh the downside.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
I think it's very, very important for good players to PUG, for a number of reasons.
First, it gives new players a chance to experience and emulate success. Without one or two aces on a team, it can become very easy for new players to get frustrated, develop bad habits, and to not earn the rewards that allow them to gear up.
Second, it stimulates the social growth of the game. When an experienced player meets cool PUG teammates, it creates an opportunity for dialog. Meeting a fledgling player with potential who wants to learn gives me a sense of validation and worth by helping them along and showing them how the game has been fun to me. Mentoring other players is immensely rewarding for both the mentor and the mentored, and there is no better way to begin that process than to PUG.
Third, it's a fun and dynamic challenge. STFs spawn the same enemies with the same powers in the same places over and over and over. Running STFs with full-pro teams all the time is exceedingly repetitive. PUGs are wildcards. You never know what additional challenges you'll be presented with in a PUG match, they keep things very fresh.
I encourage all of you experienced players to PUG often. Stand up, take charge. Show patience and poise. Lead by example. There's a lot more to being an ace starship Captain than just making smash.
THe only bad thing I see about the dps channels is it takes away too many veteran players from the pugs
Making pugs just that more difficult to complete
To be completely honest this mentality irritates me. Just because one group of players decides to work and increase their game-play abilities, it doesn't make them responsible for ensuring others who can't be bothered to do the same can still complete missions. Again the key point here is the "can't be bothered to do the same." Anyone who wants help will receive it in the DPS channels.
If you're a pretty good player, and you've got one friend who's a pretty good player, you should be able to reliably pull 3 PUGs through most Borg STFs save maybe IGA.
While this is true, mere completion at a mediocre level isn't the goal of the DPS channels. I believe that channel is called PESTF. Not trying to be insulting, just giving my opinion.
Sure, if I'm trying to parse my build or set a personal record, I'll probably preform a team. But if I want to enjoy a run of the mill STF, I'd usually rather pair up with a fleetie or two and grab a couple of PUGs.
Going by the assumption that they are correct, which can be disputed, what would be the benefit of such a channel over a fleet?
Not sure how the opinions of DPS channel members regarding their positive experiences in those channels can be disputed, unless of course you are inferring that opinions in themselves can somehow be wrong. As for having a fleet that can do the same, great, have at. These channels were never meant to be the end-all be-all for players to go. Just another option for everyone.
But queued content is almost too easy as it is, why would i make it even more mind numbing by removing one of the last remaining random events (composition of the PUG).
I don't play a game to derive entertainment from the ignorance of others. If that's how you enjoy playing, well, I'm not sure what to say while being peaceful about it.
Sounds a lot like "hey Joe, let's go pug and see what those idiots have in store for us. Afterwards we can have some jollies at their expense while patting each other on the back, you know, instead of pointing those less-skilled than us in the direction of knowledge and experience."
I think it's very, very important for good players to PUG, for a number of reasons.
First, it gives new players a chance to experience and emulate success. Without one or two aces on a team, it can become very easy for new players to get frustrated, develop bad habits, and to not earn the rewards that allow them to gear up.
Second, it stimulates the social growth of the game. When an experienced player meets cool PUG teammates, it creates an opportunity for dialog. Meeting a fledgling player with potential who wants to learn gives me a sense of validation and worth by helping them along and showing them how the game has been fun to me. Mentoring other players is immensely rewarding for both the mentor and the mentored, and there is no better way to begin that process than to PUG.
Third, it's a fun and dynamic challenge. STFs spawn the same enemies with the same powers in the same places over and over and over. Running STFs with full-pro teams all the time is exceedingly repetitive. PUGs are wildcards. You never know what additional challenges you'll be presented with in a PUG match, they keep things very fresh.
I encourage all of you experienced players to PUG often. Stand up, take charge. Show patience and poise. Lead by example. There's a lot more to being an ace starship Captain than just making smash.
To try and sum up a brief response, word of mouth and the forums is how people get into DPS-Public and such. DPS channel members are all over the place, doing random missions and running into people who ask questions. That's where they are pointed towards joining the channels themselves and gain access to all sorts of up to date knowledge and experience whenever they want.
Sure, if I'm trying to parse my build or set a personal record, I'll probably preform a team. But if I want to enjoy a run of the mill STF, I'd usually rather pair up with a fleetie or two and grab a couple of PUGs.
That is certainly your prerogative, I do the exact same thing from time to time. Heck I've even been doing normals lately just to see how much everything has changed in the last few years.
To try and sum up a brief response, word of mouth and the forums is how people get into DPS-Public and such. DPS channel members are all over the place, doing random missions and running into people who ask questions. That's where they are pointed towards joining the channels themselves and gain access to all sorts of up to date knowledge and experience whenever they want.
Not everyone comes into the game with the same mindset and with the same attitudes. You might think a casual player just can't be bothered to improve, but that might just be because they've made a few mistakes and have been bitched out by some of the harsher players out there. I'm sure we all know that online games are disproportionately filled with people who like to take out their own frustrations on others. Gaming communities aren't always a warm and cuddly place. This can be a real turnoff to casuals. It's something I can very much relate to.
For years, I was a casual player who kept to myself and avoided unnecessary contact with others. I just wanted to play the game and not deal with social outreach. It wasn't until one day I randomely PUGed and ended up with my current fleeties, who reached out to me with a friendly hand, and welcomed me into their community. From there, I learned to make friends in the game, to reach out to others, and to become a better player (and I don't just mean performance).
It wasn't that I couldn't be bothered to improve. I did want to learn. It was that I just needed someone to reach out to me. I needed to know that someone thought I could be a worthwhile assett to a community. It was one act of kindness and friendship in a random matchup that turned me from the typical PUG, to the 30k DPSer I am today.
I get it, I'm not everyone. But there are those in the game like me, and I want to try to be there for them now.
Not everyone comes into the game with the same mindset and with the same attitudes. You might think a casual player just can't be bothered to improve, but that might just be because they've made a few mistakes and have been bitched out by some of the harsher players out there. I'm sure we all know that online games are disproportionately filled with people who like to take out their own frustrations on others. Gaming communities aren't always a warm and cuddly place. This can be a real turnoff to casuals. It's something I can very much relate to.
The 'those who can't be bothered' is in reference to players out there who you try and help, and respond with the "F*#@ off, /ignore_player". Jesus, some people will curse at you for reminding them to set their weapon to stun at the beginning of UIE.
For years, I was a casual player who kept to myself and avoided unnecessary contact with others. I just wanted to play the game and not deal with social outreach. It wasn't until one day I randomely PUGed and ended up with my current fleeties, who reached out to me with a friendly hand, and welcomed me into their community. From there, I learned to make friends in the game, to reach out to others, and to become a better player (and I don't just mean performance).
It wasn't that I couldn't be bothered to improve. I did want to learn. It was that I just needed someone to reach out to me. I needed to know that someone thought I could be a worthwhile assett to a community. It was one act of kindness and friendship in a random matchup that turned me from the typical PUG, to the 30k DPSer I am today.
I get it, I'm not everyone. But there are those in the game like me, and I want to try to be there for them now.
I believe for now the DPS community does a good job of taking those who want to learn and improve and giving them the tools to do so. I don't think it should ever be up to the channels to go out there and spam everyone in every queue/zone in order to find every last player who might be interested. That would open up an entirely new can of worms, especially here on the forums with those who are already screaming for the channels to go away forever.
Comments
There's definitely some truth to that, for sure. Some sets you just have to get, especially if they're the make-or-break sets for your weapon or ship type. That said, there's some play room.
I'd been using a set shield on my ships until I finally cracked, 'cause I hated the look of it. Went back to the Romulan shield, of which I have no other set pieces to match with it. But I upgraded the shield, so I made it work regardless.
Also, there is no way I'm giving up the hilariously awesome Aelahl unique console. The 'Singularity Bomb' is way too much fun, and I find it useful on a build that otherwise doesn't have a Grav Well equivalent.
I also hid a torp in my foreward slots (please don't hate me :P), because I feel that a ship is just... missing something without a torp launcher. But I specifically chose the Delta torp that contributes to the Isokinetic Cannon set.
At last parse, I hit 16.3K. And I still have some upgrades to finish on a few guns that I recently swapped in. Think I had a couple new Mk XIIs on that run.
So for me, it's a balance. I hope to hit 20K once I've upgraded all my gear, but that's about it for me. Any more DPS-centric adjustments to my build, and yeah I would feel I'd lose some of the individuality on my ship. But that's the key - I'm expecting to hit 20K while still maintaining a level of uniqueness to my build, because I've taken to building the ship around those quirks. I have a good enough understanding of the game mechanics to maximize other aspects of my build, while allowing for some "OMG THIS IS AWESOME" moments.
There are some issues, like wait for pets(wfp), and in my opinion people getting a bit too frustrated with that. However if you can get into the 30k channel it's almost a guarantee of a successful and fun run. Not to mention tactics discussion in chat before a run. I have learned a lot running with these guys. A lot of what I learned I tried to pass on to my fleet too, and I know others in the channel do the same.
This has been my experience too. I'm a member of 10 and 30k, there's no elitism I can see. If someone is told to GTFO it's because they're spamming and/or trolling the channel. Most runs I see are 10k, with mixed teams often forming.
The main complaint I see is about the WFP rule. And probably the most balanced debate about plasma doping went on there for weeks. The channels seem to get a bad rap from people who have never been a member.
The biggest challenge is probably building up the interest to play
I have seen plenty of folks hit 25k+ on 30k runs and no one blinked.
I remember that! Lol you don't forget a thing like that. Everyone is nice in the DPS league that when someone starts trouble it's noticable.
"Go and have a wee, the second act gets considerably weirder." -Tim Minchin
Sometimes there's even people in 50/75K doing 'low dps alt runs' just for fun. When they gave away the free Rhode Island a few weeks back, a bunch of us played with them for a while, just for fun.
As long as people put into the chat what they're actually doing, then it's fine.
Same goes for bringing a Recluse or sci debuff boat.
The point is, it's about community and communication. Something you almost never ever get in a pug
Cryptic and the forums seem to agree - the private channels are well trafficked.
Only private channels seem to matter now.
Last time I pugged, I had a Tac/Escort doing 2.6k damage. My Photonic Fleet can do almost as much. That's pathetic.
Not sure how or why considering all you have to do is queue for a Pug and then most of your anti 'DPS jockey' woes will be solved. Are there times where those in DPS channels join pugs? Of course. I guess your actual problem is people being better than you at the content provided and designed by cryptic. I get it though, you want to do something different in the game and that's great, but don't blame the people who have accepted what cryptic has done and is continuing to do to this game and adapted accordingly.
Ah gotcha, and I agree. Waiting for things like Gorn Minefield (Daily) and such can be brutal. I do however think the popularity of private channels is more of a reaction to what cryptic is doing than anything else.
I kinda addressed this in a previous post, but I suppose this is kind of a connected issue.
Players who are in your face and verbally violent over DPS results are not part of the DPS Channels. They are kicked for that kind of stuff. What you're finding are players who are not representative of the community. They are one-off's who get their kicks by showcasing how much 'better' they are than others.
You can be a high-DPS player and be a nasty idiot, but you can't be a DPS Community member and be a nasty idiot.
All I can suggest is, if you're "trying new things" either stick to Normal-level queues until you feel the 'new thing' is strong enough for Advanced, or try it alongside fleetmates. I use a sub-optimal build as I detailed a couple posts before yours, and I'll never be top-dawg with that - but I can still crank out respectable numbers, and don't play above my level.
There is room for unique and fun builds. No one will take that away from you. What you will find on occasion, however, are griefers and trolls in pugs. Such is the life of an MMO. But again, that's the benefit of playing with friends, fleetmates, or the DPS Channels - no griefers.
Go troll elsewhere.
But on the other side thats the reason I am sometimes bored by such runs and have to pug. When I encounter those players with underwhelming dps, those starting to shoot generators on the wrong side of the gate or those not being able to shoot a few probes, I feel as my presence can change the tide. Its a bit like being the kirk, saving the mission objective and maybe even helping some players who dont know enough about the game mechanics so far.
I dont want to expose somebody, I dont post dps numbers, I dont comment on dps at all. Most times I (and fleet mates) even try to calm down a bit if somebody is at the risk of getting an afk penalty. But if somebody is interested to know more about builds, I do always help him.
Dps channels separate the player base a bit, but I understand everybody not willed to fly with pugs. I am just reading in those channels as there are sometimes interesting discussions about gameplay mechanics, but I usually dont fly with them.
Frankly, that's the fault of the obstinate who refuse to actually play the game as the game demands.
Those people lower the chance of success in a PUG, and then nobody wants to join a PUG because the chance of success is low. So the public queues become empty - cleared out due to unqualified individuals causing failures.
It's the same reason the PESTF channel slowly emptied of good players. It used to be full of people who knew what they were doing, and I'd never seen a run fail. Then bad players in denial of their incompetence joined, firmly believe that everybody else sucked and they just needed a better team. They dragged down the quality of the average PESTF group - and in turn the higher end players went and created a channel where admittance was based on performance, not simply knowing how to join a channel.
DPS is the only measurable metric. There is one thing that hasn't been really mentioned in this thread, so I'll take it upon myself to submit number 9:
9: You make friends with great competent, friendly players.
And let me explain that. I pushed a tank into dps-75k. Even while I was in 50k, I was getting recognition for my ability to pull aggro. Once I hit 75k, not that it was some magic number, or anything like that, but between conversations with people, and runs with them (of things that didn't solely consist of ISA, I might add) I made friends with a good number of high-dps players. And sometimes, I'll pug queues, jump on them in fleet chat, or get PM'd by one person, and be on cooldown on that guy when I'm asked if I want in for a queue. Now, the kind of guys you meet in 75k or 50k really don't need a 5th teammate killing everything to win the queue, or even speedrun it. I've had to, a lot of times, say "I'm on cooldown, can I bring my fed alt?" They know my fed alt's record is ~20k (I'm basically only flying that guy upon request, he still has all his MK XII gear, and so it's not too bad, imo). But that doesn't really matter, because it does the same thing at it's core as my current Romulan main - he can rip aggro off of about anyone he flies with. In a run where one friend set a record, I did less than 1/6th of their dps, and still had over 4 times the number of shots in than them.
So join the channels, be a nice, friendly person. And you'll meet like minded friends who appreciate what you do as more than a number. I find my friends list, that I'd jump to for a queue, mostly consists of guys in the 60-100k range (with outliers both above and well below that range). I didn't seek out friends because they can do x dps, I seek them out because I respect what they bring to the queue (be it dps, healing, debuffing, science, pure wizardry, whatever) and what they bring to the group - friendly banter, conversation, information, and a sense of teamwork.
SCM - Hive (S) - [02:31] DMG(DPS) - @jarvisandalfred: 30.62M(204.66K) - Fed Sci
Tacs are overrated.
Game's best wiki
Build questions? Look here!
The combat log reader that the channel uses allows us to tweak a build and quickly and easily see the results. A person may have what looks like great gear but with a few minor tweaks dps can be bumped quite a bit.
The 30k and 50k channels are just round numbers that are there to see if you can achieve them. It is something to work towards. If the only channel was 10k then once in there what would make you try to push your build further. Its not like the people in 50k don't exist in the 10k.
The attitude that a person has when trying when they approach these channels is what makes the difference. If they were to say that they were #TRIBBLE and the league table is the pecking order of you as a person then yes it would be elitist. But if you look at that table as a challenge then that a positive.
I have never seen anyone ever use that League table against anyone else and I have never see anyone promote themself with their rank number.
Making pugs just that more difficult to complete
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
I disagree. Honestly, without PESTF and DPS channels, I'd have stopped pugs entirely. Especially since Geko killed them with DR. You cannot make the logical assumption that presence in one means absence in another. That's just not the case.
Going by the assumption that they are correct, which can be disputed, what would be the benefit of such a channel over a fleet?
But queued content is almost too easy as it is, why would i make it even more mind numbing by removing one of the last remaining random events (composition of the PUG).
Even if a DPS channel would offer benefits, they would not outweigh the downside.
First, it gives new players a chance to experience and emulate success. Without one or two aces on a team, it can become very easy for new players to get frustrated, develop bad habits, and to not earn the rewards that allow them to gear up.
Second, it stimulates the social growth of the game. When an experienced player meets cool PUG teammates, it creates an opportunity for dialog. Meeting a fledgling player with potential who wants to learn gives me a sense of validation and worth by helping them along and showing them how the game has been fun to me. Mentoring other players is immensely rewarding for both the mentor and the mentored, and there is no better way to begin that process than to PUG.
Third, it's a fun and dynamic challenge. STFs spawn the same enemies with the same powers in the same places over and over and over. Running STFs with full-pro teams all the time is exceedingly repetitive. PUGs are wildcards. You never know what additional challenges you'll be presented with in a PUG match, they keep things very fresh.
I encourage all of you experienced players to PUG often. Stand up, take charge. Show patience and poise. Lead by example. There's a lot more to being an ace starship Captain than just making smash.
To be completely honest this mentality irritates me. Just because one group of players decides to work and increase their game-play abilities, it doesn't make them responsible for ensuring others who can't be bothered to do the same can still complete missions. Again the key point here is the "can't be bothered to do the same." Anyone who wants help will receive it in the DPS channels.
While this is true, mere completion at a mediocre level isn't the goal of the DPS channels. I believe that channel is called PESTF. Not trying to be insulting, just giving my opinion.
Not sure how the opinions of DPS channel members regarding their positive experiences in those channels can be disputed, unless of course you are inferring that opinions in themselves can somehow be wrong. As for having a fleet that can do the same, great, have at. These channels were never meant to be the end-all be-all for players to go. Just another option for everyone.
I don't play a game to derive entertainment from the ignorance of others. If that's how you enjoy playing, well, I'm not sure what to say while being peaceful about it.
Sounds a lot like "hey Joe, let's go pug and see what those idiots have in store for us. Afterwards we can have some jollies at their expense while patting each other on the back, you know, instead of pointing those less-skilled than us in the direction of knowledge and experience."
The downside being _________...?
To try and sum up a brief response, word of mouth and the forums is how people get into DPS-Public and such. DPS channel members are all over the place, doing random missions and running into people who ask questions. That's where they are pointed towards joining the channels themselves and gain access to all sorts of up to date knowledge and experience whenever they want.
That is certainly your prerogative, I do the exact same thing from time to time. Heck I've even been doing normals lately just to see how much everything has changed in the last few years.
Not everyone comes into the game with the same mindset and with the same attitudes. You might think a casual player just can't be bothered to improve, but that might just be because they've made a few mistakes and have been bitched out by some of the harsher players out there. I'm sure we all know that online games are disproportionately filled with people who like to take out their own frustrations on others. Gaming communities aren't always a warm and cuddly place. This can be a real turnoff to casuals. It's something I can very much relate to.
For years, I was a casual player who kept to myself and avoided unnecessary contact with others. I just wanted to play the game and not deal with social outreach. It wasn't until one day I randomely PUGed and ended up with my current fleeties, who reached out to me with a friendly hand, and welcomed me into their community. From there, I learned to make friends in the game, to reach out to others, and to become a better player (and I don't just mean performance).
It wasn't that I couldn't be bothered to improve. I did want to learn. It was that I just needed someone to reach out to me. I needed to know that someone thought I could be a worthwhile assett to a community. It was one act of kindness and friendship in a random matchup that turned me from the typical PUG, to the 30k DPSer I am today.
I get it, I'm not everyone. But there are those in the game like me, and I want to try to be there for them now.
The 'those who can't be bothered' is in reference to players out there who you try and help, and respond with the "F*#@ off, /ignore_player". Jesus, some people will curse at you for reminding them to set their weapon to stun at the beginning of UIE.
I believe for now the DPS community does a good job of taking those who want to learn and improve and giving them the tools to do so. I don't think it should ever be up to the channels to go out there and spam everyone in every queue/zone in order to find every last player who might be interested. That would open up an entirely new can of worms, especially here on the forums with those who are already screaming for the channels to go away forever.