Lol yea it's 52 week high was over 26/s and now it's below 19/s.
Funny how the stock price fell drastically to 15/s after DR was released too.
Lulz only looking at 1 week.
The stock is artificially high at the moment due to speculation about a possible share buyback. It was hovering around the $15 mark before that. It'll sink through the floor if this buyback plan is rejected.
Lol yea it's 52 week high was over 26/s and now it's below 19/s.
Funny how the stock price fell drastically after DR was released too.
Lulz only looking at 1 week.
True but we have no real information other than steam logins that everyone really seems to hate to gauge things. PWE is the best reflection we can look at in monetary terms for an idea on how healthy things are. Overall, it was a flatline for the most part for 2014 that slightly tipped downward.
EDIT: PWD changed to PWE... LOL Big difference here as they are different companies.
You, um, are aware that PWE is a multinational corporation that operates a wide variety of games in a number of countries, and STO isn't even a major part of all that, right? That Cryptic only develops three of the many, many games they offer?
Yes a 27% decline after Delta Rising is nothing. Sure.
PWE had positive cash flows before they acquired Cryptic.
Remember the tech bubble in 2000?? That was bc valuations were based on website visits. Then analysts asked well how many of the people visiting these sites are buying? NASDAQ went from 5000 down to 1000 was the result. Who cares if you visit the site and don't spend ANY money?
Can't go by log ins at all.
So what's dragging them down now?
Without the rumors of a stock buyout, that 27% would still be there or slightly worse as since I have been watching this morning, it's still slowly going down.
The stock is artificially high at the moment due to speculation about a possible share buyback. It was hovering around the $15 mark before that. It'll sink through the floor if this buyback plan is rejected.
This. notice how suddenly it rises from the bottom overnight when whatever his name is announce he might buy the shares.
But before the announcement, the shares are incredibly low. I don't know if it's related to DR, and somehow, I don't think it is, because the vast majority of shareholders (if not all of them) haven't played STO at all, and doesn't know (nor give a s***) about the ingame situation.
You, um, are aware that PWE is a multinational corporation that operates a wide variety of games in a number of countries, and STO isn't even a major part of all that, right? That Cryptic only develops three of the many, many games they offer?
Find me Cryptic only information and I will use Cryptic only information. As I stated above, the steam logins are frowned upon. What else information do you have? PWE the mothership. They don't release their numbers for STO as far as I know. They tell you what they want you to hear and that is that it's growing. They offer no more proof to us than this offers a definitive breakdown of Cryptic itself and STO specifically.
Find me Cryptic only information and I will use Cryptic only information. As I stated above, the steam logins are frowned upon. What else information do you have? PWE the mothership. They don't release their numbers for STO as far as I know. They tell you what they want you to hear and that is that it's growing. They offer no more proof to us than this offers a definitive breakdown of Cryptic itself and STO specifically.
For some people, everything is frowned upon. Even if Cryptic decided to released the official numbers, they would still find a way to say they are not accurate.
Unless they are showing the game is healthy and growing, in this case everything is fine to prove it. Even to say that their friendlist is in agreement.
For some people, everything is frowned upon. Even if Cryptic decided to released the official numbers, they would still find a way to say they are not accurate.
Unless they are showing the game is healthy and growing, in this case everything is fine to prove it. Even to say that their friendlist is in agreement.
Exactly. It's a reporting error. The hidden metrics say so.
What, you want people to keep doing things they hate to do, just so they can complain about it? Seems awfully mean to me...
I say I want people to stay in the game.
You jump on it and take it negatively.
Take a long hard look at yourself - are you sure you actually LIKE this game? It seems to inspire some sort of pathological compulsion within you to comment on everything in a negative way.
Eh, I hope its true. For the most part I like STO and I enjoy playing it. Most of it. Its a shame they've botched up parts of it but I'd rather play than see the whole game disappear.
What it comes down to is this... spin. Maybe some of us would like the truth once in a while. If it's not going well, it's not going well. We still play the game. We want to keep playing the game. We want it to get better. We want it to grow. Some of us feel what is being said is very removed from what is being felt and seen. That doesn't mean we are praying for doom or trying to bring about doom. Maybe it means we want to believe it but we simply can't and we are expressing it.
Eh, I hope its true. For the most part I like STO and I enjoy playing it. Most of it. Its a shame they've botched up parts of it but I'd rather play than see the whole game disappear.
We still play the game. We want to keep playing the game. We want it to get better. We want it to grow. Some of us feel what is being said is very removed from what is being felt and seen. That doesn't mean we are praying for doom or trying to bring about doom. Maybe it means we want to believe it but we simply can't and we are expressing it.
I agree with both of you. If I hated the game I wouldn't be here.
What it comes down to is this... spin. Maybe some of us would like the truth once in a while. If it's not going well, it's not going well. We still play the game. We want to keep playing the game. We want it to get better. We want it to grow. Some of us feel what is being said is very removed from what is being felt and seen. That doesn't mean we are praying for doom or trying to bring about doom. Maybe it means we want to believe it but we simply can't and we are expressing it.
If you hate a game enough that absolutely nothing the developers can say can be taken as truth for you, then maybe you should just stop playing entirely.
Or at the very worst, stop listening to anything they say entirely and stop posting on the forums.
Using misinformation to try to 'prove' your points is just silly.
Take a long hard look at yourself - are you sure you actually LIKE this game? It seems to inspire some sort of pathological compulsion within you to comment on everything in a negative way.
Step outside and smell some flowers.
Me, negative? I thought I was supposed to be the Leader of the Cryptic Defense Force! (Oh, wait, that's Orangeitis this week, isn't it?)
I think you might have your polarities reversed...
I just want people to have fun. A lot of us are having fun playing STO - I see folks out there all the time. If someone isn't having fun playing STO, perhaps they should consider doing something else for a while, something they actually do enjoy.
Why do you want to force people to keep doing something they dislike? Are you simply sadistic, or is there something more complex going on?
If you hate a game enough that absolutely nothing the developers can say can be taken as truth for you, then maybe you should just stop playing entirely.
Or at the very worst, stop listening to anything they say entirely and stop posting on the forums.
Using misinformation to try to 'prove' your points is just silly.
What misinformation? That the stock of the mothership took a nose dive? That the nose dive pulled up when someone offered to buy them out?
Until you show me information other than this, this is the information I have to measure their words against what I see and feel. I also said elsewhere and even in what you quotes that I want to see it grow. Does that reflect hatred for the game? That they don't tell the truth =/= hatred. Using that logical leap is even sillier.
Okay, I'm now convinced that you are a paid shill for the forums. I have yet to read one single post you have ever made that hasn't made me want to punch my fist through the monitor because you're always being the official apologist for them, no matter how atrocious and incompetent they are.
So you can't offer a more intelligent response than a personal attack? Not that I expected better, but come on.
What misinformation? That the stock of the mothership took a nose dive? That the nose dive pulled up when someone offered to buy them out?
Using that information to represent the success/failure/growth/recession of Delta Rising. You are intelligent enough to know none of that supports (or to be fair, detracts) your point you are trying to make. To use it anyway because it sounds good is not how data works.
Until you show me information other than this, this is the information I have to measure their words against what I see and feel.
Feelings are not data. Feelings are emotions.
I also said elsewhere and even in what you quotes that I want to see it grow. Does that reflect hatred for the game? That they don't tell the truth =/= hatred. Using that analogy is even sillier.
It reflects you are using your emotions and what you want to see be true. Using information that is out context is blatant misinformation. What you want is information that they simply will not give. And because they will not you are using misinformation to support points in the face of logic and reality.
"Misinformation is a kind of information, though!" is not a valid point to make. Not for STO, not for anything ever.
For me, this debate would not exist if they released metrics numbers and meta data. I know people will hate me for this, but if Blizzard can release numbers on thier subscription numbers, there is nothing but desire stoppping Cryptic/PWE from realeasing population numbers. They don't have to be exact. WOW numbers have never been down to texact numbers (from the reports I have read) but they can show how many hundreds of thousands unique id's have logged on to the game from a month to month basis. Hell even in 3 or 6 month basis. That would show us what they mean by "healthy" "popular" and how they can justify saying things like "Best expansion ever and the players love it." And it would do nothing but help their cause.
It's all this hiding of stats and metrics and such that really bothers me. WOW can release those numbers, good and bad. They can even break down how many people tried a certain peice of content and how many have completed it. STO data should be there already. They say they look at metrics and base decisions on it. It would be good for the player base to see these numbers. So that all of us can reach an understanding without these inferances, guesses and petty snipes at each other, both Devs and Players alike.
Information is always the key to bring to groups together in understanding. And when one groups holds all the information and doesn't share, that's when you historically get dissent and agressive behavior. While Cryptic may be free from fear of being subjected to a rebellion, they are not free from hostile actions (mostly verbal or written) from it's playerbase. They have the power and ability to change all of that, if they so choose.
I like the game in general. there are parts of the game I wish had been done better. And there are parts of the game that are just outright unplayable for me in my limited playtime. I now don't play the parts I like, because no one else is playing it, and I don't play the parts I don't like because they don't give a way for casual solo player to play. And that leaves me verry little left to do. And I do it. And move on to another game that allows me to play at my level. And I keep hoping for a change in STO to allow me to devote more time to it, that I really would like to do.
For me, this debate would not exist if they released metrics numbers and meta data. I know people will hate me for this, but if Blizzard can release numbers on thier subscription numbers, there is nothing but desire stoppping Cryptic/PWE from realeasing population numbers. They don't have to be exact. WOW numbers have never been down to texact numbers (from the reports I have read) but they can show how many hundreds of thousands unique id's have logged on to the game from a month to month basis. Hell even in 3 or 6 month basis. That would show us what they mean by "healthy" "popular" and how they can justify saying things like "Best expansion ever and the players love it." And it would do nothing but help their cause.
It's all this hiding of stats and metrics and such that really bothers me. WOW can release those numbers, good and bad. They can even break down how many people tried a certain peice of content and how many have completed it. STO data should be there already. They say they look at metrics and base decisions on it. It would be good for the player base to see these numbers. So that all of us can reach an understanding without these inferances, guesses and petty snipes at each other, both Devs and Players alike.
Information is always the key to bring to groups together in understanding. And when one groups holds all the information and doesn't share, that's when you historically get dissent and agressive behavior. While Cryptic may be free from fear of being subjected to a rebellion, they are not free from hostile actions (mostly verbal or written) from it's playerbase. They have the power and ability to change all of that, if they so choose.
I like the game in general. there are parts of the game I wish had been done better. And there are parts of the game that are just outright unplayable for me in my limited playtime. I now don't play the parts I like, because no one else is playing it, and I don't play the parts I don't like because they don't give a way for casual solo player to play. And that leaves me verry little left to do. And I do it. And move on to another game that allows me to play at my level. And I keep hoping for a change in STO to allow me to devote more time to it, that I really would like to do.
Using that information to represent the success/failure/growth/recession of Delta Rising. You are intelligent enough to know none of that supports (or to be fair, detracts) your point you are trying to make. To use it anyway because it sounds good is not how data works.
Feelings are not data. Feelings are emotions.
It reflects you are using your emotions and what you want to see be true. Using information out out context is blatant misinformation. What you want is information that they simply will not give. And because they will not you are using misinformation to support points in the face of logic and reality.
I must have missed something here... Was Delta Rising, the best expansion ever and the fuzzy warm feelings of love it inspires, growing or was STO growing?
Feelings that when I log in, nothing much is happening. I join a queue and I can definitely feel time ticking by without it popping. "Feeling" might have been the wrong word... it does ring as emotional and not sensing a disturbance in the force. I see data. I see 0 people in a queue. I can relate that to "feeling" that I am not going to be doing that event today during the time I can play.
Yes, STO operates in a vacuum. They are in no way affiliated with the success or lack thereof of the parent company that owns them. Problems currently happening here in no way whatsoever affected anything in that chart. They gave me information, lots of it. "Delta Rising is the best expansion ever and players love it" and "STO is not only healthy but is growing." I look at steam logins and it says otherwise but steam logins are not allowed. They only show steam users although we are not allowed to see anything non-steam tracked. I look at stock prices and they are not allowed. They show the value of all the holdings, not just the STO department of Cryptic.
I sincerely apologize for not understanding there is more to a picture than a single pixel but that I am only allowed to look at that single pixel because the RGB value of that pixel only is all that matters.
I must have missed something here... Was Delta Rising, the best expansion ever and the fuzzy warm feelings of love it inspires, growing or was STO growing?
One, both, or neither.
Feelings that when I log in, nothing much is happening. I join a queue and I can definitely feel time ticking by without it popping. "Feeling" might have been the wrong word... it does ring as emotional and not sensing a disturbance in the force.
Anecdotal evidence, personal experiece.
I see data. I see 0 people in a queue. I can relate that to "feeling" that I am not going to be doing that event today during the time I can play.
A valid point (in terms of queues), but irrelevant to the point you are trying to make. Like the stock market.
Yes, STO operates in a vacuum. They are in no way affiliated with the success or lack thereof of the parent company that owns them. Problems currently happening here in no way whatsoever affected anything in that chart.
It does, but it is one asset PWE owns out of countless others. To suggest that correlation equals causation is also misinformation.
They gave me information, lots of it. "Delta Rising is the best expansion ever and players love it" and "STO is not only healthy but is growing."
It is the only information you have to go by. Whether we like it or not, that is what they are saying. Without access to their information, we are in a position where we must either take them at their word or simply assume they are lying. In which case, why are we still playing? Why are we still posting on the forums in relation to what they say? We've already made up our minds, haven't we?
Nothing they say is true at all. So why bother?
I look at steam logins and it says otherwise but steam logins are not allowed. They only show steam users although we are not allowed to see anything non-steam tracked. I look at stock prices and they are not allowed. They show the value of all the holdings, not just the STO department of Cryptic.
You are correct. That information neither supports nor detracts from the success/failure of Delta Rising, STO, growth, recession, player retention, or whether styrofoam cups at Cryptic hold more coffee than ceramic coffee mugs.
It sounds good in your head. So, you run with it. You run with it despite any educated person being able to plainly see it does not support your points. You know for a fact it doesn't. But if you use unrelated information that is loosely associated with what you are trying to 'prove', then that's 'good enough' to the truth for you.
On the flipside, it's like saying "Well, they say the game is healthy and growing, therefore it's true!", but the difference is one of these parties is an authority on the subject and has access to the data. The other is putting on a tin foil hat and saying it's a conspiracy.
The experts in this matter are Cryptic. So either you believe them or you don't. What they say or don't say does not matter to you. The only time you will believe them is if they say something that supports your emotional state. If they don't, then they are simply hiding information from you.
I sincerely apologize for not understanding there is more to a picture than a single pixel but that I am only allowed to look at that single pixel because the RGB value of that pixel only is all that matters.
You're allowed to make your points. I'm allowed to point out how they're flawed. This is how forum dialogue works. If I point out something false, I expect people to correct me. It is the only way we are able to progress and get anywhere.
What misinformation? That the stock of the mothership took a nose dive? That the nose dive pulled up when someone offered to buy them out?
Until you show me information other than this, this is the information I have to measure their words against what I see and feel. I also said elsewhere and even in what you quotes that I want to see it grow. Does that reflect hatred for the game? That they don't tell the truth =/= hatred. Using that logical leap is even sillier.
Saying it was a "nose dive" is melodramatic to the point of being a distortion of the truth.
Comments
http://www.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:PWRD
All the proof you need on health. This is all it's really about in the end. Look at the past year. You can see exactly how 2014 was.
The stock is artificially high at the moment due to speculation about a possible share buyback. It was hovering around the $15 mark before that. It'll sink through the floor if this buyback plan is rejected.
Free Tibet!
True but we have no real information other than steam logins that everyone really seems to hate to gauge things. PWE is the best reflection we can look at in monetary terms for an idea on how healthy things are. Overall, it was a flatline for the most part for 2014 that slightly tipped downward.
EDIT: PWD changed to PWE... LOL Big difference here as they are different companies.
ADDITION: I know nothing about investing and I can see that. LOL
I personally hope that nobody takes your advice.
Free Tibet!
You, um, are aware that PWE is a multinational corporation that operates a wide variety of games in a number of countries, and STO isn't even a major part of all that, right? That Cryptic only develops three of the many, many games they offer?
Without the rumors of a stock buyout, that 27% would still be there or slightly worse as since I have been watching this morning, it's still slowly going down.
But before the announcement, the shares are incredibly low. I don't know if it's related to DR, and somehow, I don't think it is, because the vast majority of shareholders (if not all of them) haven't played STO at all, and doesn't know (nor give a s***) about the ingame situation.
Find me Cryptic only information and I will use Cryptic only information. As I stated above, the steam logins are frowned upon. What else information do you have? PWE the mothership. They don't release their numbers for STO as far as I know. They tell you what they want you to hear and that is that it's growing. They offer no more proof to us than this offers a definitive breakdown of Cryptic itself and STO specifically.
Unless they are showing the game is healthy and growing, in this case everything is fine to prove it. Even to say that their friendlist is in agreement.
Exactly. It's a reporting error.
I say I want people to stay in the game.
You jump on it and take it negatively.
Take a long hard look at yourself - are you sure you actually LIKE this game? It seems to inspire some sort of pathological compulsion within you to comment on everything in a negative way.
Step outside and smell some flowers.
Free Tibet!
I agree with both of you. If I hated the game I wouldn't be here.
Free Tibet!
If you hate a game enough that absolutely nothing the developers can say can be taken as truth for you, then maybe you should just stop playing entirely.
Or at the very worst, stop listening to anything they say entirely and stop posting on the forums.
Using misinformation to try to 'prove' your points is just silly.
I think you might have your polarities reversed...
I just want people to have fun. A lot of us are having fun playing STO - I see folks out there all the time. If someone isn't having fun playing STO, perhaps they should consider doing something else for a while, something they actually do enjoy.
Why do you want to force people to keep doing something they dislike? Are you simply sadistic, or is there something more complex going on?
What misinformation? That the stock of the mothership took a nose dive? That the nose dive pulled up when someone offered to buy them out?
Until you show me information other than this, this is the information I have to measure their words against what I see and feel. I also said elsewhere and even in what you quotes that I want to see it grow. Does that reflect hatred for the game? That they don't tell the truth =/= hatred. Using that logical leap is even sillier.
Please copy and paste any post I have ever made where I suggest forcing people to play the game if they hate it.
Free Tibet!
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
Using that information to represent the success/failure/growth/recession of Delta Rising. You are intelligent enough to know none of that supports (or to be fair, detracts) your point you are trying to make. To use it anyway because it sounds good is not how data works.
Feelings are not data. Feelings are emotions.
It reflects you are using your emotions and what you want to see be true. Using information that is out context is blatant misinformation. What you want is information that they simply will not give. And because they will not you are using misinformation to support points in the face of logic and reality.
"Misinformation is a kind of information, though!" is not a valid point to make. Not for STO, not for anything ever.
It's all this hiding of stats and metrics and such that really bothers me. WOW can release those numbers, good and bad. They can even break down how many people tried a certain peice of content and how many have completed it. STO data should be there already. They say they look at metrics and base decisions on it. It would be good for the player base to see these numbers. So that all of us can reach an understanding without these inferances, guesses and petty snipes at each other, both Devs and Players alike.
Information is always the key to bring to groups together in understanding. And when one groups holds all the information and doesn't share, that's when you historically get dissent and agressive behavior. While Cryptic may be free from fear of being subjected to a rebellion, they are not free from hostile actions (mostly verbal or written) from it's playerbase. They have the power and ability to change all of that, if they so choose.
I like the game in general. there are parts of the game I wish had been done better. And there are parts of the game that are just outright unplayable for me in my limited playtime. I now don't play the parts I like, because no one else is playing it, and I don't play the parts I don't like because they don't give a way for casual solo player to play. And that leaves me verry little left to do. And I do it. And move on to another game that allows me to play at my level. And I keep hoping for a change in STO to allow me to devote more time to it, that I really would like to do.
KDF: Dahar Master Kan (Borg Klingon Tactical)::Dahar Master Torc (Alien Science)::Dahar Master Sisteric (Gorn Engineer)
RR-Fed: Citizen Sirroc (Romulan Science)::Fleet Admiral Grell (Alien Engineer)
RR-KDF: Fleet Admiral Zemo (Reman Tactical)::Fleet Admiral Xinatek (Reman Science)::Fleet Admiral Bel (Alien Engineer)
TOS-Fed: Fleet Admiral Katem (Andorian Tactical)::Lieutenant Commander Straad (Vulcan Engineer)
Dom-Fed: Dan'Tar (Jem'Hadar Science)
Dom-KDF: Kamtana'Solan (Jem'Hadar Science)
CoHost of Tribbles in Ecstasy (Zombee)
Delta Hiding sounds like a good title.
I must have missed something here... Was Delta Rising, the best expansion ever and the fuzzy warm feelings of love it inspires, growing or was STO growing?
Feelings that when I log in, nothing much is happening. I join a queue and I can definitely feel time ticking by without it popping. "Feeling" might have been the wrong word... it does ring as emotional and not sensing a disturbance in the force. I see data. I see 0 people in a queue. I can relate that to "feeling" that I am not going to be doing that event today during the time I can play.
Yes, STO operates in a vacuum. They are in no way affiliated with the success or lack thereof of the parent company that owns them. Problems currently happening here in no way whatsoever affected anything in that chart. They gave me information, lots of it. "Delta Rising is the best expansion ever and players love it" and "STO is not only healthy but is growing." I look at steam logins and it says otherwise but steam logins are not allowed. They only show steam users although we are not allowed to see anything non-steam tracked. I look at stock prices and they are not allowed. They show the value of all the holdings, not just the STO department of Cryptic.
I sincerely apologize for not understanding there is more to a picture than a single pixel but that I am only allowed to look at that single pixel because the RGB value of that pixel only is all that matters.
KDF: Dahar Master Kan (Borg Klingon Tactical)::Dahar Master Torc (Alien Science)::Dahar Master Sisteric (Gorn Engineer)
RR-Fed: Citizen Sirroc (Romulan Science)::Fleet Admiral Grell (Alien Engineer)
RR-KDF: Fleet Admiral Zemo (Reman Tactical)::Fleet Admiral Xinatek (Reman Science)::Fleet Admiral Bel (Alien Engineer)
TOS-Fed: Fleet Admiral Katem (Andorian Tactical)::Lieutenant Commander Straad (Vulcan Engineer)
Dom-Fed: Dan'Tar (Jem'Hadar Science)
Dom-KDF: Kamtana'Solan (Jem'Hadar Science)
CoHost of Tribbles in Ecstasy (Zombee)
One, both, or neither.
Anecdotal evidence, personal experiece.
A valid point (in terms of queues), but irrelevant to the point you are trying to make. Like the stock market.
It does, but it is one asset PWE owns out of countless others. To suggest that correlation equals causation is also misinformation.
It is the only information you have to go by. Whether we like it or not, that is what they are saying. Without access to their information, we are in a position where we must either take them at their word or simply assume they are lying. In which case, why are we still playing? Why are we still posting on the forums in relation to what they say? We've already made up our minds, haven't we?
Nothing they say is true at all. So why bother?
You are correct. That information neither supports nor detracts from the success/failure of Delta Rising, STO, growth, recession, player retention, or whether styrofoam cups at Cryptic hold more coffee than ceramic coffee mugs.
It sounds good in your head. So, you run with it. You run with it despite any educated person being able to plainly see it does not support your points. You know for a fact it doesn't. But if you use unrelated information that is loosely associated with what you are trying to 'prove', then that's 'good enough' to the truth for you.
On the flipside, it's like saying "Well, they say the game is healthy and growing, therefore it's true!", but the difference is one of these parties is an authority on the subject and has access to the data. The other is putting on a tin foil hat and saying it's a conspiracy.
The experts in this matter are Cryptic. So either you believe them or you don't. What they say or don't say does not matter to you. The only time you will believe them is if they say something that supports your emotional state. If they don't, then they are simply hiding information from you.
You're allowed to make your points. I'm allowed to point out how they're flawed. This is how forum dialogue works. If I point out something false, I expect people to correct me. It is the only way we are able to progress and get anywhere.
Just click on "all" to see how big the recent shift really is. Yeah the graph looks way different depending on what time scale you use.
for those who are curious, the low point for PW's stock history is late 2011, and the high is late 2009.
My character Tsin'xing